1 INFO-VAX	Wed, 29 Dec 2004	Volume 2004 : Issue 722       Contents:' Re: 497 million euro fine for Microsoft ' Re: 497 million euro fine for Microsoft ' Re: 497 million euro fine for Microsoft ' Re: 497 million euro fine for Microsoft P Re: Has anyone heard if any of our customers have been hurt by the tidal  wave iP Re: Has anyone heard if any of our customers have been hurt by the tidal  wave iP Has anyone heard if any of our customers have been hurt by the tidal wave in theP Re: Has anyone heard if any of our customers have been hurt by the tidal wave in$ Re: Merry Christmas & Happy New Year Re: Need UNIX clarification * Re: Older StorageWorks Parts Not Available* Re: Older StorageWorks Parts Not Available* Re: Older StorageWorks Parts Not Available* Re: Older StorageWorks Parts Not Available* Re: Older StorageWorks Parts Not Available* Re: Older StorageWorks Parts Not Available8 Re: OT:  anybody know the details on the COMAIR debacle? Rdb in Datamation  Re: Time to revive Emerald? " Re: TruCluster/AdvFS open-sourced? Re: WHOIS 1.6 updated  Re: WHOIS 1.6 updated P Re: [SPAM] - Re: 497 million euro fine for Microsoft - Bayesian F ilter detected  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 19:40:02 +0100 , From: "Dr. Dweeb" <5msg0h202@sneakemail.com>0 Subject: Re: 497 million euro fine for Microsoft- Message-ID: <cqs9a1$2n5e$1@news.cybercity.dk>    Karsten Nyblad wrote:  > Stanley F. Quayle wrote:C >>> [...] read Clayton M. Christensen:  "The Innovator's  Dilemma." A >>> [...] when new products using disruptive technologies enter a E >>> market and the new product does not meet the main customer groups E >>> needs, has a low gross margin and the potential market is little. G >>> When the new product becomes better, it pushes the old products out  >>> of the market. >> >>H >> Linux is not a "disruptive technology" -- it's mostly Unix, which hasD >> been around forever (in computer terms).  I do see it pushing out- >> other Unixes, but that's not "disruptive".  > E > Linux is produced in a novel way and it is marketed in a novel way. ( > That makes is a disruptive technology. > H >> Let's make STABILITY the new "disruptive technology".  Let's not sellE >> the 20+ year track record -- that's old news no one wants to hear.  >>G >> Sell stability as if it's NEW, and people will begin to take notice. F >> If not now, when their Winboxes crash.  And that's just a matter of
 >> time... > H > Most PHBes do not care about stability.  They should, because the lackH > of stability on Windows is costing their organizations $$$$$, but theyH > don't, and I think, we cannot make them change their mind.  I was onceC > told to implement a system were high availability was required on  > Windows 3.5.1.  J Hell, some PHBs cannot get it right even when they have the technology.  AG nameless company managed to have 2 catastrophic hardware crashes of the G server running their financial and materials management systems in very K short order.  VMS systems I point out.  Why was this ?  Because the PHB (a) F does not understand server systems or what reliability is (being an MSH weenie) (b) got rid of VMS people - except one who spent about 2 hours aK week on the system keeping it afloat (c) did not implement the technology - F ie. no shadowing (even though the license was in place), no AIJ on theD databases (even though it just requires turning on, (d) acquired andJ allocated several people to run around like maniacs trying to keep 400 PCsI in some sort of running state and negelected totally the server systems - J increasing the size of his empire.  Cost of failures ?  Who knows.  AffectH on PHB ? Promoted of course!  PHBs have PHBs as bosses and the higher upL they are, the more likely they are to see crash-reboot as a reasonable state of affairs.   H The customer IT world is now run by morons - as an unemployed VMS personG with no prospects, I am somewhat glad not to have to deal with them any $ more.  I am too old for the stress !  	 Dr. Dweeb    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 20:15:21 +0100 + From: Karsten Nyblad <nospam@nospam.nospam> 0 Subject: Re: 497 million euro fine for Microsoft- Message-ID: <cqsbev$2pr4$1@news.cybercity.dk>    Tom Linden wrote: 5 > On Tue, 28 Dec 2004 07:43:37 +0100, Karsten Nyblad    > <nospam@nospam.nospam>  wrote: > G >> If you ask Christensen why Digital lost, he will not tell the story  E >> told  by the VMS fans in c.o.v.  He would tell you the story of a  G >> company  having trouble competing on price with companies like Sun,  H >> Apollo and  later on with PC companies.  He would claim that Digital F >> never learned  to be lean and mean enough to competitive.  He will J >> tell you about small  companies that started growing at the same time, ( >> Digital was the Wall  Street darling.H >>   Digital had better products at higher prices, but the competitors  @ >> products were good enough to meet the needs om the customers. >  > M > IBM does not seem to fit the model.  They do not compete on price.  Remeber I > when they thought they were getting into the copier business, Xerox had H > essentially three models, of increasing sophistication.  What IBM did 	 > was  to J > offer likewise three models, each offering better performance than the   > Xerox G > counterpart.  Digital's problem and the legacy perhaps carries on is  
 > that  itH > regarded itself as a hardware company, not as a purveyor of solutions.  G IBM has also had to adjust their business model.  In the old days they  F could sell mainframes at the price they asked for.  Now the mainframe E market is a fraction of what it was, and like VMS it is not growing.  I IBM has had to change into a service organization.  IBM has had troubles  I making money on PCs for years and has had to sell its desktop and laptop  I business.  Before that it had to sell its printer business.  IBM has not  H been hit as hard as Digital, because z/series servers have always had a D larger market and thus IBM has more customers to share the costs of C IBM's R&D.  Besides, IBM has a reputation for always helping their  B customers when they get in trouble and continue to help until the G customers until they are out of trouble.  That reputation worth $$$$$,  A but it is also expensive to maintain.  HP seems to have problems  H understanding what it takes to sell big servers.  At least they seem to  act like a PC company.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 14:25:23 -0800 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> 0 Subject: Re: 497 million euro fine for Microsoft( Message-ID: <opsjqoklwuzgicya@hyrrokkin>  K On Tue, 28 Dec 2004 20:15:21 +0100, Karsten Nyblad <nospam@nospam.nospam>    wrote:   > Tom Linden wrote: 7 >> On Tue, 28 Dec 2004 07:43:37 +0100, Karsten Nyblad   ! >> <nospam@nospam.nospam>  wrote:  >>I >>> If you ask Christensen why Digital lost, he will not tell the story   G >>> told  by the VMS fans in c.o.v.  He would tell you the story of a   I >>> company  having trouble competing on price with companies like Sun,   J >>> Apollo and  later on with PC companies.  He would claim that Digital  H >>> never learned  to be lean and mean enough to competitive.  He will  L >>> tell you about small  companies that started growing at the same time,  ) >>> Digital was the Wall  Street darling. J >>>   Digital had better products at higher prices, but the competitors   A >>> products were good enough to meet the needs om the customers. J >>   IBM does not seem to fit the model.  They do not compete on price.   
 >> RemeberJ >> when they thought they were getting into the copier business, Xerox hadJ >> essentially three models, of increasing sophistication.  What IBM did  
 >> was  toL >> offer likewise three models, each offering better performance than the    >> XeroxI >> counterpart.  Digital's problem and the legacy perhaps carries on is    >> that  it I >> regarded itself as a hardware company, not as a purveyor of solutions.  > J > IBM has also had to adjust their business model.  In the old days they  I > could sell mainframes at the price they asked for.  Now the mainframe   L > market is a fraction of what it was, and like VMS it is not growing. IBM  H > has had to change into a service organization.  IBM has had troubles  L > making money on PCs for years and has had to sell its desktop and laptop  L > business.  Before that it had to sell its printer business.  IBM has not  K > been hit as hard as Digital, because z/series servers have always had a   G > larger market and thus IBM has more customers to share the costs of   F > IBM's R&D.  Besides, IBM has a reputation for always helping their  E > customers when they get in trouble and continue to help until the   J > customers until they are out of trouble.  That reputation worth $$$$$,  D > but it is also expensive to maintain.  HP seems to have problems  K > understanding what it takes to sell big servers.  At least they seem to    > act like a PC company.K I don't disagree with your comments, but I believe the mainframe business    isK bigger than it ever has been,  It may not be as large a precentage of their  overall buainess.      --  C Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2004 00:05:12 +0100 , From: "Dr. Dweeb" <5msg0h202@sneakemail.com>0 Subject: Re: 497 million euro fine for Microsoft, Message-ID: <cqsori$7tc$1@news.cybercity.dk>   Karsten Nyblad wrote:  > Tom Linden wrote: 5 >> On Tue, 28 Dec 2004 07:43:37 +0100, Karsten Nyblad ! >> <nospam@nospam.nospam>  wrote:  >>G >>> If you ask Christensen why Digital lost, he will not tell the story E >>> told  by the VMS fans in c.o.v.  He would tell you the story of a G >>> company  having trouble competing on price with companies like Sun, H >>> Apollo and  later on with PC companies.  He would claim that DigitalF >>> never learned  to be lean and mean enough to competitive.  He willD >>> tell you about small  companies that started growing at the same/ >>> time, Digital was the Wall  Street darling. G >>>   Digital had better products at higher prices, but the competitors A >>> products were good enough to meet the needs om the customers.  >> >>E >> IBM does not seem to fit the model.  They do not compete on price. > >> Remeber when they thought they were getting into the copier> >> business, Xerox had essentially three models, of increasing  >> sophistication.  What IBM did
 >> was  toE >> offer likewise three models, each offering better performance than  >> the XeroxG >> counterpart.  Digital's problem and the legacy perhaps carries on is  >> that  it > >> regarded itself as a hardware company, not as a purveyor of
 >> solutions.  > H > IBM has also had to adjust their business model.  In the old days theyG > could sell mainframes at the price they asked for.  Now the mainframe & > market is a fraction of what it was,  J Would you care to tell us EXACTLY which metric you are using.  I think youJ are in fact mistaken to believe that the mainframe world has diminished inI any way (maybe margins, but I doubt it).  The applications requiring what J IBM mainframes and z/OS (MVS or whatever it is called these days) have notK become less nor gone away - they have become more demanding and likely more 
 plentiful.  J I cannot be bothered to go find the figures, but your statement is typicalK of people without too much experience in that part of the IT world, and who E think that the pervasiveness of the PC and Unix servers has meant the + extinction of the mainfram.  It aint so ...   	 Dr. Dweeb   ! > and like VMS it is not growing. A > IBM has had to change into a service organization.  IBM has had @ > troubles making money on PCs for years and has had to sell itsF > desktop and laptop business.  Before that it had to sell its printerF > business.  IBM has not been hit as hard as Digital, because z/series? > servers have always had a larger market and thus IBM has more @ > customers to share the costs of IBM's R&D.  Besides, IBM has a@ > reputation for always helping their customers when they get inE > trouble and continue to help until the customers until they are out G > of trouble.  That reputation worth $$$$$, but it is also expensive to E > maintain.  HP seems to have problems understanding what it takes to A > sell big servers.  At least they seem to act like a PC company.    ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2004 02:50:04 +0000 (UTC) % From: Dan Foster <usenet@evilphb.org> Y Subject: Re: Has anyone heard if any of our customers have been hurt by the tidal  wave i 6 Message-ID: <slrnct46ut.gd7.usenet@gaia.roc2.gblx.net>  q In article <1104283953.f538f9b3b4c792e7de5d373b59ef6b46@teranews>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote: $ > susan_skonetski@hotmail.com wrote: >>  I >> I just keep worrying every time I look at the news.  If anyone has any + >> information can they please let me know.  > P > Sue, it will take quite some time to find out. The wave videos we've seen wereO > taken from areas where the tsunami wasn't very bad. BBC went to another beach O > resort yesterday and their report was not only of total devastation, but also O > quite gruesome. It takes time to declare someone dead when you have no body.   > K > If I may make a suggestion though, if VMS engineering and ambassadors and L > maybe even customers could all make contributions to the international redN > cross or Unicef, and then you could issue a press release explaining how theM > VMS folks have donated to Unicef/Red-Cross and inviting everyone else to do " > the same to help people in need. > G > It would show some leadership and be a good example of good corporate @ > citizenship. And it would put the VMS name out into the media.  I That's an interesting idea, but this tragedy transcends a PR opportunity.   C I'd prefer people whom contributes, does so as fellow human beings, ! regardless of job or nationality.   H There is a big difference between a commercial marketing opportunity andE a human tragedy. The magnitude is honestly overwhelming. Not just the @ death count, but also the issues facing the survivors right now.  > If anybody would like to know how to help, one place would be:  E http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/asiapcf/12/27/quake.aidsites/index.html   D They have links to about 30 relief organizations' web sites; all hasB SSL-protected web links for a donation. Can do through credit card0 online or through a cheque/check in postal mail.  F They can really use money because it's easier to transport and to alsoF use its greater buying power in regional supplies which the locals can use better.   @ A Canadian friend just told me about this site, which has a moreF powerful human feeling to it, because it includes reports not filtered@ through the media, from people actually there and on the ground:    http://tsunamihelp.blogspot.com/  F (Of course, it also includes some links to Canadian charities that areH helping out... and it also tells exactly what the survivors really needs3 so badly. Some interesting things mentioned there.)    -Dan   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2004 02:58:03 GMT 6 From: "Kenneth Farmer" <kfarmer@NOSPAM.spyderbyte.com>Y Subject: Re: Has anyone heard if any of our customers have been hurt by the tidal  wave i 9 Message-ID: <%2pAd.105$uc.57789@twister.southeast.rr.com>   I I've got a Paypal account and a button setup ready to go on OpenVMS.org.  F Anyone want me to go with it?  I'll let someone monitor the donations.  M I have the button up on several sites but haven't gotten a dime in donations  / for the sites so the income won't be mixed.  :)   , Of course, someone might have a better plan.   Ken    OpenVMS.org % _____________________________________  Kenneth R. Farmer <>< % SpyderByte: http://www.SpyderByte.com       ; "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote in message  < news:1104283953.f538f9b3b4c792e7de5d373b59ef6b46@teranews...$ > susan_skonetski@hotmail.com wrote: >>I >> I just keep worrying every time I look at the news.  If anyone has any + >> information can they please let me know.  > L > Sue, it will take quite some time to find out. The wave videos we've seen  > wereJ > taken from areas where the tsunami wasn't very bad. BBC went to another  > beach K > resort yesterday and their report was not only of total devastation, but   > alsoI > quite gruesome. It takes time to declare someone dead when you have no   > body.  > K > If I may make a suggestion though, if VMS engineering and ambassadors and L > maybe even customers could all make contributions to the international redK > cross or Unicef, and then you could issue a press release explaining how   > the K > VMS folks have donated to Unicef/Red-Cross and inviting everyone else to   > do" > the same to help people in need. > G > It would show some leadership and be a good example of good corporate A > citizenship. And it would put the VMS name out into the media.     ------------------------------    Date: 28 Dec 2004 15:35:43 -0800! From: susan_skonetski@hotmail.com Y Subject: Has anyone heard if any of our customers have been hurt by the tidal wave in the B Message-ID: <1104276943.900820.93840@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>  F I just keep worrying every time I look at the news.  If anyone has any( information can they please let me know.   Thanks,  Sue    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 20:42:30 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> Y Subject: Re: Has anyone heard if any of our customers have been hurt by the tidal wave in B Message-ID: <1104283953.f538f9b3b4c792e7de5d373b59ef6b46@teranews>  " susan_skonetski@hotmail.com wrote: > H > I just keep worrying every time I look at the news.  If anyone has any* > information can they please let me know.  N Sue, it will take quite some time to find out. The wave videos we've seen wereM taken from areas where the tsunami wasn't very bad. BBC went to another beach M resort yesterday and their report was not only of total devastation, but also M quite gruesome. It takes time to declare someone dead when you have no body.    I If I may make a suggestion though, if VMS engineering and ambassadors and J maybe even customers could all make contributions to the international redL cross or Unicef, and then you could issue a press release explaining how theK VMS folks have donated to Unicef/Red-Cross and inviting everyone else to do   the same to help people in need.  E It would show some leadership and be a good example of good corporate > citizenship. And it would put the VMS name out into the media.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 13:48:37 -0500 < From: "Peter Weaver" <WeaverConsultingServices@sympatico.ca>- Subject: Re: Merry Christmas & Happy New Year , Message-ID: <33do46F3umgf5U1@individual.net>   JF Mezei wrote:  >...= > I found a good old ascii art file from the old decus tapes: ; > It is the choo-choo train moving under the christmas tree  >...  ? A belated Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year to everyone too.   , JF, if you want some more of these check outG http://www.vt100.net/animation/.  Here is a little .COM that I wrote to  display one of the animations; $! $! RANDOM_XMAS.COM $! 15-DEC-89 Peter Weaver  $!A $! Types out a "Random" (based on time really) Christmas Message.  $! $ ON CONTROL_Y THEN GOTO DONE  $ ON ERROR THEN GOTO DONE  $!A $! Check for Users that we don't want to bother with the messages  $!: $ USER_NAME := "''F$EDIT(F$GETJPI("","USERNAME"),"TRIM")'" $!: $!!! IF "''USER_NAME'" .EQS. "AUTO_PRICING" THEN GOTO DONE1 $!!! IF "''USER_NAME'" .EQS. "FRI" THEN GOTO DONE  $!5 $!!! IF "''USER_NAME'" .EQS. "IN1RUN" THEN GOTO DO_IT 3 $!! IF "''USER_NAME'" .EQS. "31710" THEN GOTO DO_IT  $!2 $! Only allow OPS and MIS users to see the message $!$ $!! GROUP := "''F$GETJPI("","GRP")'"G $!! IF "''GROUP'" .NES. "24" .AND. "''GROUP'" .NES. "40" THEN GOTO DONE  $!; $ TERMINAL = "''F$GETJPI("","TERMINAL")'" - "_" - "_" - ":"  $!& $! Check if on a DATAPAC Port or OPA0. $!= $!! IF "''F$EXTRACT(0,2,TERMINAL)'" .EQS. "NV" THEN GOTO DONE . $ IF "''TERMINAL'" .EQS. "OPA0" THEN GOTO DONE $! $DO_IT:  $!2 $ FILE_LOCATION := "''F$ENVIRONMENT("PROCEDURE")'", $ HUNDREDTHS := "''F$CVTIME(,,"HUNDREDTH")'"* $ TENTHS := "''F$EXTRACT(1,1,HUNDREDTHS)'" $!< $! Since we have so few REGIS Terminals, lets make sure they) $! get the REGIS display 60% of the time.  $!E $ IF "''F$GETDVI("TT:","TT_REGIS")'" .AND. "''HUNDREDTHS'" .LTS. "60"  THEN -    GOTO DO_REGIS $! $ FILE_NAME := "XMAS''TENTHS'"? $ FULL_FILE_NAME := "''F$PARSE(FILE_NAME,".TXT;",FILE_LOCATION)  $ TYPE/NOPAGE 'FULL_FILE_NAME  $ GOTO DONE  $!
 $DO_REGIS: $!! $ IF "''TENTHS'" .LTS. "5" THEN - 3    TYPE/NOPAGE 'F$PARSE("ANGEL.SIX;",FILE_LOCATION) ! $ IF "''TENTHS'" .GES. "5" THEN - 7    TYPE/NOPAGE 'F$PARSE("XMAS_MESS.SIX;",FILE_LOCATION)  $! $DONE: $! $ ESC[0,8] = 27 $ $ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT "''ESC'C''ESC'(B"       --   Peter Weaver Weaver Consulting Services Inc.  Canadian VAR for CHARON-VAX  www.weaverconsulting.ca    ------------------------------    Date: 28 Dec 2004 14:21:42 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) $ Subject: Re: Need UNIX clarification3 Message-ID: <9vD8S0sQe1v9@eisner.encompasserve.org>   N In article <opsjp7ax0rzgicya@hyrrokkin>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes:I > On Tue, 28 Dec 2004 10:44:27 -0500, Neil Rieck <n.rieck@sympatico.ca>    > wrote: >  >> * * * * *I >> So here's my question. Is it true that most flavors of UNIX are single ( >> threaded? Is LINUX? Is HP-UX? Is AIX?I >> I was lead to believe that Tru64 was multi-threaded and this was one   	 >> reason H >> why HP couldn't move AdvFs and TruCluster support from Tru64 into HP. > K > No, most have supported posix threads for 10 years,  whether applications $ > exploit them is a different issue.  D I feel this has to mean something other than Posix threads, since heC is talking about one process getting  in the way of other processes 8 and solving it by moving one process to another machine.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 12:48:44 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>3 Subject: Re: Older StorageWorks Parts Not Available + Message-ID: <41D1AA8B.FA980050@comcast.net>    Robert Deininger wrote:  > [snip] > J > It sounds to me like HP is experimenting with a "cost-reduced" mechanismK > for spare parts stocking and delivery.  They are not the first company to L > outsource this work, but they may be doing it worse than most.  And HP mayI > be the deafest large company in business today, so the people in charge L > won't notice the problem until is has started to cost them $$$.  Once that, > happens, they'll start to fix the problem.  G Just like children: get away with as much nonsense as you can until you D push Mom and Dad over the line. Then, find a way to keep pushing theH limits such that they don't find out until all they can do is punish you1 and risk being charged with criminal child abuse.   H Congrats to the biz schools! You've done your job extraordinarily well!   3 > I believe UPS stocks whatever spares HP provides,   H ...which doesn't say much. The stat.'s so far: six DOAs before I finally0 found a good one. Stopped looking at that point.  H I'm gonna get with the boss and A/P and see if we can find a way to billF that back to HP. (My time, time on our gear to test, plus a *GENEROUS*: markup - think "Nieman Marcus" (read: "needless markup").)   > and ships according to > HP's instructions.    = ...in which case the instructions are garbage: you don't send D replacement parts for life-critical systems on a 5-7 day junket, you courier them or overnight them.   7 > That's been the case for some time.  UPS is certainly I > capable of shipping stuff quickly, if they have it in stock, so there's / > nothing wrong with this idea on the surface.    E Rather like taking hostages, dumping toxic waste into water sheds and < aquifers, and other short-sighted, self-serving efforts, eh?   > I guess someone(s) at HP hasH > recently botched the inventory planning for a number of popular parts.  F "A number" would likely translate to "the bulk of HP's OpenVMS-related inventory".   C > That probably has little or nothing to do with the outsourcing of G > warehousing, packing, and shipping to UPS.  Moke likely, some fool(s) F > thought they could save a lot of money by reducing inventory levels.  B ...or letting the customer do the testing to find the still-usable stuff.  D > This is hardly equivalent to getting out of the hardware business.  C As JF might say, "au contraire". Screwing one's customers (the only G thing at which HP seems to excel) is hardly conducive to either growing & or maintaining a business or a market.   >  Lots D > of hardware work happening all the time in HP.  But, if UPS startsK > designing HP's servers, you might want to watch out for chunks of falling  > sky.  ? ...or burning in truck depots, or being "the ball" in a game of $ volley-package at a truck depot, ...   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 12:05:10 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 3 Subject: Re: Older StorageWorks Parts Not Available B Message-ID: <1104263540.8e0f9c47cccd30f86ebde2ab50a96330@teranews>   Robert Deininger wrote: J > I believe UPS stocks whatever spares HP provides, and ships according to9 > HP's instructions.  That's been the case for some time.   1 Does this apply to USA only or to north america ?   I I got burned enough times by UPS shipping from USA to Canada that I avoid + dealing with businesses that ship UPS only.   F What HP won't see are the exhorbitant "customs brokerage" invoices theG recipient gets a week or two after delivery which you are forced to pay L because you signed to accept the package,m even though at that time, you hadK no idea that it went through PBB customs brokers who will send you a random M invoice where you cannot even check the amount before you accept the package. C (Once got billed $50 for a box of chocolates sent to me as a gift).   K I did have a surprise though when I ordered from Tiger Direct in canada. It M was actually shipped from the USA via UPS.  UPS said there would be brokerage I charges. TigerDirect promised there woudln't be any. I got TigerDirect to J promise to pay the BPP random bill should I get one, and that was the onlyM reason I accepted the package when it arrived. Surprisingly, there was no PBB N invoice later on. Turns out that because I had purchased it in Canada and paidL the taxes on it already AND TigerDirect was smart enough to do the paperworkL to indicate so, the package bypassed the PBB highway robbers since there was no money to collect.  L So if HP uses UPS to ship to Canada, one must ascertain if they do it right,I or if they ignore the fact that there is a border and result in customers B getting ripped off by some customs brokerage highway robbery firm.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 21:01:38 -0500 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> 3 Subject: Re: Older StorageWorks Parts Not Available , Message-ID: <41D21002.9040206@tsoft-inc.com>   David J Dachtera wrote:   J > ...which doesn't say much. The stat.'s so far: six DOAs before I finally2 > found a good one. Stopped looking at that point. > J > I'm gonna get with the boss and A/P and see if we can find a way to billH > that back to HP. (My time, time on our gear to test, plus a *GENEROUS*< > markup - think "Nieman Marcus" (read: "needless markup").)  P Now you're getting to the issue.  If you have a service CONTRACT that specifies Q a certain response time, then what you should be doing is reading the fine print  M of the CONTRACT, and if HP has violated that CONTRACT, resort to the actions   available to you.   8 Bitching about it here will not help your response time.   Dave   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 21:20:20 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 3 Subject: Re: Older StorageWorks Parts Not Available B Message-ID: <1104286221.db28ecc6b3898da951cf1ec3531025d8@teranews>   Dave Froble wrote:N > of the CONTRACT, and if HP has violated that CONTRACT, resort to the actions > available to you.  > : > Bitching about it here will not help your response time.  K Sharing experiences does help though. If someone else already had a similar K experience he can relay to Mr Dachtera and others what his experience was , D this allowing others to better focus their official complaint to HP.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2004 03:11:21 GMT 5 From: rdeininger@mindspringdot.com (Robert Deininger) 3 Subject: Re: Older StorageWorks Parts Not Available L Message-ID: <rdeininger-2812042211190001@user-105n8pa.dialup.mindspring.com>  N In article <41D1AA8B.FA980050@comcast.net>, djesysno@spam.earthlink.net wrote:   >Robert Deininger wrote:	 >> [snip]    ...   I >I'm gonna get with the boss and A/P and see if we can find a way to bill G >that back to HP. (My time, time on our gear to test, plus a *GENEROUS* ; >markup - think "Nieman Marcus" (read: "needless markup").)    Good ideas.    >  >> and ships according to  >> HP's instructions.  > > >...in which case the instructions are garbage: you don't sendE >replacement parts for life-critical systems on a 5-7 day junket, you   >courier them or overnight them.   Yes, I agree with you.  8 >> That's been the case for some time.  UPS is certainlyJ >> capable of shipping stuff quickly, if they have it in stock, so there's0 >> nothing wrong with this idea on the surface.  > F >Rather like taking hostages, dumping toxic waste into water sheds and= >aquifers, and other short-sighted, self-serving efforts, eh?   D Doesn't seem similar to any of those things to me.  Why not throw in( something about kicking puppies as well?  J I was just saying that hiring UPS to do the shipping might be a good idea,J since UPS is almost certainly better at it than HP is.  The fact that they2 outsourced is not the cause of the shoddy service.  = I'm not saying the service you describe is at all acceptible.      >> I guess someone(s) at HP has I >> recently botched the inventory planning for a number of popular parts.  > G >"A number" would likely translate to "the bulk of HP's OpenVMS-related  >inventory".  I I can't agree or disagree with that, based on what I've heard.  Anecdotes C are notoriously unreliable for understanding the scope of a complex  problem.  D >> That probably has little or nothing to do with the outsourcing ofH >> warehousing, packing, and shipping to UPS.  Moke likely, some fool(s)G >> thought they could save a lot of money by reducing inventory levels.  > C >...or letting the customer do the testing to find the still-usable  >stuff.  > E >> This is hardly equivalent to getting out of the hardware business.  > D >As JF might say, "au contraire". Screwing one's customers (the onlyH >thing at which HP seems to excel) is hardly conducive to either growing' >or maintaining a business or a market.   C When you are using JF to bolster your argument, your credibility is F wearing pretty thin.  The sky is ALWAYS falling for JF, and I guess heH wants the rest of us to feel guilty because none of it has landed on us.  G If you really think the ONLY thing HP is good at is screwing customers, I why do you stick around?  Since VMS comes from HP, I guess that sucks too I in your view.  And GS1280s suck, and all the new Itanium servers, and the G printers, and everything else.  None of the folks making these products ( excel?   Or was that JF-style hyperbole?  < If you keep insulting everyone at HP (except the ones in theH customer-screwing department), you might not get too much help in fixingH your spare parts problem.  But maybe lobbing insults in public makes you feel better.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 29 Dec 2004 03:13:13 GMT 5 From: rdeininger@mindspringdot.com (Robert Deininger) 3 Subject: Re: Older StorageWorks Parts Not Available L Message-ID: <rdeininger-2812042213130001@user-105n8pa.dialup.mindspring.com>  E In article <1104263540.8e0f9c47cccd30f86ebde2ab50a96330@teranews>, JF + Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote:    >Robert Deininger wrote:K >> I believe UPS stocks whatever spares HP provides, and ships according ton: >> HP's instructions.  That's been the case for some time. > 2 >Does this apply to USA only or to north america ?  G No idea.  I've never dealt with Canadian shipping, in either direction,v3 and I haven't heard anything through the grapevine.d   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 21:56:24 -0500a- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>eA Subject: Re: OT:  anybody know the details on the COMAIR debacle?vB Message-ID: <1104288382.6e9d2e990dea42d28bed4e8344228b0b@teranews>   a few more tidbits:f  ) The software had been in use since 1986. aB The number 32,0000 was repeated again. (32,000 changes per month).  2 Software was supposed to be changed within months.  P Software came from SBS international, which is now owned by Boeing (since 2001).   http://www.sbsint.com   M No real mention of an OS. However some screen shots of Windows based clients.e   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 18:38:21 -0500a# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>A Subject: Rdb in Datamation, Message-ID: <yaSdnaXDdYb1c0zcRVn-hg@igs.net>  ; http://itmanagement.earthweb.com/datbus/article.php/3452301-   A decent article.,  D Too bad it's out during the holidays - it would have received betterC exposure if they could have published the article in a week or two.s   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 14:41:03 -0500l< From: "Peter Weaver" <WeaverConsultingServices@sympatico.ca>$ Subject: Re: Time to revive Emerald?, Message-ID: <33dr6iF3ut0nvU1@individual.net>   David J Dachtera wrote:o > Peter Weaver wrote:m >> >> Dave Froble wrote:e >>> David J Dachtera wrote:n >>> ...eH >>>> What happens when your Charon-VAX process GPF's or experiences some4 >>>> other fault? Your "VAX" disappears, doesn't it? >>>>F >>>> Other than the odd spurious reset, I've never seen that on either4 >>>> VAX or Alpha (the real thing, not an emulator). >>>g >>> # >>> Have you seen it on Charon VAX?u >>> ...  >>G >> I have never seen CHARON-VAX disappear due to a Windows GPF or BSOD.  >tH > Then, let's look at that question from another angle: has the platform@ > under your Charon-VAX ever experienced a BSOD while Charon was
 > running?   No.w  F > First guess time, I'd say no. WhineBloze is deceptively stable whileA > doing very little. Many is the time I've walked up to my wife'saD > comupter (W/95-OSR2) happily running the 3D-pipes screen saver forE > literally weeks on end (she's not a big computer user), touched the ! > mouse and had it lock up tight.o  > Right. When you have CHARON-VAX on a PC the PC is there to runH CHARON-VAX. It is not there to be a web browser, it is not there to readH mail, it only runs CHARON-VAX. When the PC is only running CHARON-VAX on) top of Windows XP then it is very stable.A  F > Charon-VAX on WhineBloze is o.k. for non-critical uses, IMO, but forB > mission critical implementation, it needs to evolve into its own? > operating environment - no underlying o.s. to cause problems.e  B Wrong, but nothing I say here would ever convince you that you areA wrong. You have never tried CHARON-VAX on Windows in a productioneF environment, other people have, the people who have tried it know that/ CHARON-VAX works great for their critical uses.g   -- t Peter Weaver Weaver Consulting Services Inc.  Canadian VAR for CHARON-VAXt www.weaverconsulting.ca    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 14:23:43 -0500 ) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> + Subject: Re: TruCluster/AdvFS open-sourced? : Message-ID: <9piAd.23022$Tn1.816241@news20.bellglobal.com>  6 "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in message 7 news:u8SdnZAD5rEXmEzcRVn-gw@metrocastcablevision.com...  > Bob Koehler wrote: >oJ >>    DEC and Compaq have already proved that Tru64 (digital UNIX, OSF/1) D >> doesn't sell.  It may be no fault of Tru64, and totally the faultF >>    of bad marketing, but the record is there.  That failure was why8 >>    Curly started talking to Carly in the first place. >aM > My, the revisionists haven't even yet given up.  Time to set them straight m > again, I guess.7 >lL > While Tru64 had not achieved the market penetration of Solaris, HP-UX, or L > AIX, with annual system revenues of about $3 billion it had reached about M > 1/3 their size before the plug was pulled - not exactly chicken feed.  And tI > it was closing the remaining gap briskly (reaching a 30% annual growth d > rate at the end of Y2K). >cJ > So suggesting that Tru64 "just didn't sell" is even more ludicrous than H > suggesting the same thing about VMS - logic right on par with that of / > highly successful CEOs like Curly and GQ Bob.t >. > - bill  K I was unaware of this and it's shocking. It is just another example of the >K foolishness behind modern merger mania. Get out the knife and cut blindly. iH Oops. We cut to far and now the patient will never be healthy again. Oh & well, time to jump to another company.  
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,t Ontario, Canada.8 http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Dec 2004 12:40:37 -0800 From: stlee@epenguin.zzn.com Subject: Re: WHOIS 1.6 updatedB Message-ID: <1104266437.365944.33850@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>   JF stop whining.  G You FUD hp trying to promote your whois then when caught refuse to stopdF the FUD and whine that people are being horrible to you. The FAQ about you being a victim is spot on.  G With your whois, by doing a whois on the domain my.space in  TLD .spaceeB that is registered in inclusive namespace roots, it shows that theE .space whois server is not in your whois list of TLD whois servers toi query.  6 With TCPIP services whois putting in the whois server.   NODE03> show symbol whois  WHOIS == "$TCPIP$WHOIS.EXE"s, NODE03> whois -h name.space.xs2.net my.space  ' Result obtained from server: swhois.neti     MY.SPACE (results from NS1000)a   Administative Contact: JV102h
 John Van Nest  Resonate Music and Film, Inc.  7510 W. Sunset Blvd., #1080s Hollywood, CA 90046a USAl TEL: (818)567-2700 FAX: (626)355-8149 E-Mail: jvn@resonate.tch   Technical Contact: JV102i
 John Van Nesto Resonate Music and Film, Inc.t 7510 W. Sunset Blvd., #1080p Hollywood, CA 90046H USAm TEL: (818)567-2700 FAX: (626)355-8149 E-Mail: jvn@resonate.tcv    & Record updated on: 11-05-2000 10:05:23& Record created on: 11-05-2000 10:05:23   Nameservers:* NS.AUTONO.NET                  209.48.2.11, NS10.AUTONO.NET                206.86.247.30  F Your whois using the same lookup doesnt know anymore than hp whois, it" stills needs the whois servername.   NODE03> run whoisn _Enter host name: my.space3 No whois server could be found to resolve: my.space : Try http://www.iana.org to locate the autority for the tld2 and specify it with the /SERVER or /HOST qualifier   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 16:28:45 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>  Subject: Re: WHOIS 1.6 updated, Message-ID: <41D1CFFD.A8BD94FF@teksavvy.com>   stlee@epenguin.zzn.com wrote:l8 > With TCPIP services whois putting in the whois server.. > NODE03> whois -h name.space.xs2.net my.space     And with my whois:  & whois/host=name.space.xs2.net my.space or( whois/server=name.space.xs2.net my.space   will yield the same results.  * So what was the point of your complaint ?   L When you use unofficial TLDs, don't expect to see them included. If you wantN your unapproved TLD to be included in many whois clients, talk to the folks atI www.geektools.com to have them include your tld and whois server in theirnN comprehensive list. But then again, this is pointless since you won't be using my software.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 28 Dec 2004 21:50:24 -0500>' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>lY Subject: Re: [SPAM] - Re: 497 million euro fine for Microsoft - Bayesian F ilter detected , Message-ID: <41D21B70.3010300@tsoft-inc.com>   Michael Clark wrote:   >>-----Original Message-----0 >>From: Dave Froble [mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com]+ >>Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 2004 11:48 AM  >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComdF >>Subject: [SPAM] - Re: 497 million euro fine for Microsoft - Bayesian >>Filter detected spam >> >> >>JF Mezei wrote:y >> >> >>? >>>On the desktop, there are quite a few pilot projects around B >>>  >>(inclusing a huget >>G >>>one at AT&T) and if a couple fo those pan out with some very visibels= >>>corporation switching from windows desktops to either mac M >>>m >>or linux, it will be >>= >>>a big blow to Microsoft because all of a sudden, the very a >>>l >>reasons that brought >>? >>>so many companies to microsoft ("be compatible") will force m >>>n >>many companies tor >>; >>>switch to Linux/MAC to be compatible with their trading e >>>a >>partners. If the ball  >>3 >>>gets rolling, it could start to move quite fast.v >>>  >>> >>That square ball will not roll as long as MS Office retains  >>it's users.  The b> >>issue will be compatibility, but it's compatibility with MS  >>Office that will  @ >>define what users do.  It really isn't about the OS, it's all  >>about the  >>applications.a >>6 >>As an example, AT&T may be successful with internal  >>documents, but when the vast 0@ >>majority of people they do business with cannot use documents  >>from AT&T, there i? >>will be disruption.  I doubt that AT&T will be able to force i >>all it's trading lH >>partners to convert to Linux.  It will be AT&T that will be disrupted. >> > H > You can get around most of these things.  AbiWord opens MS format wordJ > documents and will save in MS format.  OpenOffice does the same for wordK > and excel.  I often work with Micro$haft formatted documents in a FreeBSDt  > enviroment without any issues.  N That seems to support my position.  I'm saying that windows/msoffice is still K used, even though a Unix product will do the job.  I still haven't heard a lJ reason why AbiWord (or whatever) on Linux will do any better at replacing + Microsoft than AbiWord on FreeBSD has done.i   Dave   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2004.722 ************************