1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 26 Feb 2004	Volume 2004 : Issue 112       Contents:< Re: %LICENSE-F-NOLICENSE despite manual register/enable/load Basic BACKUP Question  RE: Basic BACKUP Question  Re: Basic BACKUP Question  Re: Basic BACKUP Question  Re: Basic BACKUP Question  Re: Basic BACKUP Question  Re: Basic BACKUP Question  Re: Basic BACKUP Question  Re: Basic BACKUP Question  Re: Basic BACKUP Question  Compaq Computer Alliance1 Credit bureau communications software on OpenVMS?  Re: DCL help- Re: Educating HP employees on the nettiquette - Re: Educating HP employees on the nettiquette - Re: Educating HP employees on the nettiquette  HSOF for HSZ50??? : Re: It is almost certain now, INTEL will have 64bit x86 !!: Re: It is almost certain now, INTEL will have 64bit x86 !!: RE: It is almost certain now, INTEL will have 64bit x86 !!: Re: It is almost certain now, INTEL will have 64bit x86 !!/ JF: USA will self-exterminate within 100 years!  Re: Leap year.! Load balancing in Open VMS V7.3-1 % Re: Load balancing in Open VMS V7.3-1 ! Re: MAIL: How to delete folders ? . MONTAGAR.COM and WHITEICE.COM seem to be down.2 Re: MONTAGAR.COM and WHITEICE.COM seem to be down.2 Re: MONTAGAR.COM and WHITEICE.COM seem to be down. ODBC drivers for MSSQL' Re: Passing a socket to another process / Re: printing characters with codes > 127 in DCL C Re: Problem with installing Security MUP on a VMS 7.3-1 workstation C Re: Problem with installing Security MUP on a VMS 7.3-1 workstation C Re: Problem with installing Security MUP on a VMS 7.3-1 workstation C Re: Problem with installing Security MUP on a VMS 7.3-1 workstation ! Re: Sneak preview - SHOW FASTPATH ! Re: Sneak preview - SHOW FASTPATH ' Re: Strange SOR$ errors - advice sought ' Re: Strange SOR$ errors - advice sought ' Re: Strange SOR$ errors - advice sought @ Re: VMS upgrade changed program behavior, what could cause this?@ Re: VMS upgrade changed program behavior, what could cause this?  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:30:32 +0000 ) From: Antonio Carlini <arcarlini@iee.org> E Subject: Re: %LICENSE-F-NOLICENSE despite manual register/enable/load , Message-ID: <Bs8%b.20680$ft.677@newsfe1-win>   Didier Morandi wrote: K > 4. when I rebooted, after DECnet conf (I know, there was no need), I had  * > no licenses active for VMS, DECnet etc..  8 How did you notice? SHOW LICENCE? Product usage failure?  M > So, fine, I did enable and load OPENVMS-HOBBYIST and DVNETEND and rebooted.   C The docs claim that licences are enabled by default at registration ? (although this is something that I do so rarely that I can only  assume that's correct).   B Are you sure you LOADed the correct licence? If you have more than@ one DVNETEND in the database, for example, are you sure that you loaded the correct one?   8 Repeat what you did but this time, before rebooting, use5 LICENSE LIST/FULL DVNETEND and make sure that the one & you want is actually "Status: Active".   The reboot and check again.    Antonio    --   --------------- - Antonio Carlini             arcarlini@iee.org    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:46:28 GMT ' From: Rick Dyson <rick-dyson@uiowa.edu>  Subject: Basic BACKUP Question1 Message-ID: <Htnr1I.Lro@sysadm.physics.uiowa.edu>   < $ Backup/Image/Ignore=Interlock DKA100: MKA400:blah.bck/Save  O What happens to files on DKA100 that are marked NOBACKUP for the above command?   / If it matters: VAX/OpenVMS and BACKUP are v6.2.   M My log files report the file is not backed up because it was marked NOBACKUP.   N %BACKUP-I-NOBACKUP, DKA100:[STUFF.OLD]JUNK.DAT;1 data not copied, file marked  NOBACKUP  H But a recent restore of the saveset to another disk (where I expected toJ have lost the files) showed they were actually on the backup saveset, much to my surprise!   M I really don't want the files dumped to tape, as they don't matter.  In fact, K sometimes this is a VMS disk with page, swap & dump files that I don't want  to them wasting tape!   L What am I missing?  Does "/Image" ignore the NOBACKUP flag BUT still reports that it honors it?   Thanks,  Rick   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:10:30 -0500 * From: Kenneth.Robinson@VerizonWireless.com" Subject: RE: Basic BACKUP QuestionR Message-ID: <61CE0AD83F4ED2119DE600805FBBCA6DE4626E@hqbedbh2.uswin.ad.vzwcorp.com>  = >$ Backup/Image/Ignore=Interlock DKA100: MKA400:blah.bck/Save  > G >What happens to files on DKA100 that are marked NOBACKUP for the above  command? > 0 >If it matters: VAX/OpenVMS and BACKUP are v6.2. > D >My log files report the file is not backed up because it was marked	 NOBACKUP.  > G >%BACKUP-I-NOBACKUP, DKA100:[STUFF.OLD]JUNK.DAT;1 data not copied, file  marked  	 >NOBACKUP   / It did what the message said "Data not copied".   G The header is backed up so you can recreate the file with it's original I size, owner, etc., but the data is not backed up. You are not wasting any D tape, unless you count the small amount needed to backup the header.   Ken Robinson   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:14:32 -0500  From: norm.raphael@metso.com" Subject: Re: Basic BACKUP QuestionQ Message-ID: <OF1E0983A3.FD46173B-ON85256E45.007475A6-85256E45.00749747@metso.com>   J I am not an expert, but as I understand it, the file header information is) copied/restored, but the data (blocks) in K the file are not preserved.  Hence no time is or blocks are consumed.  This % is primarily for things like the page K or swap files which want to exist on the restore, but the data within which  is meaningless on restore.  F news@sysadm.physics.uiowa.edu (News Administrator) wrote on 02/25/2004 03:46:28 PM:  > > $ Backup/Image/Ignore=Interlock DKA100: MKA400:blah.bck/Save > B > What happens to files on DKA100 that are marked NOBACKUP for the > above command? > 1 > If it matters: VAX/OpenVMS and BACKUP are v6.2.  > E > My log files report the file is not backed up because it was marked 	 NOBACKUP.  > H > %BACKUP-I-NOBACKUP, DKA100:[STUFF.OLD]JUNK.DAT;1 data not copied, file marked
 > NOBACKUP > J > But a recent restore of the saveset to another disk (where I expected toG > have lost the files) showed they were actually on the backup saveset,  much > to my surprise!  > I > I really don't want the files dumped to tape, as they don't matter.  In  fact, H > sometimes this is a VMS disk with page, swap & dump files that I don't want > to them wasting tape!  > F > What am I missing?  Does "/Image" ignore the NOBACKUP flag BUT still reports  > that it honors it? > 	 > Thanks,  > Rick >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:13:22 -0700 + From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com> " Subject: Re: Basic BACKUP Question' Message-ID: <403D0FF2.9090406@MMaz.com>    Rick Dyson wrote:   > > $ Backup/Image/Ignore=Interlock DKA100: MKA400:blah.bck/Save > I > What happens to files on DKA100 that are marked NOBACKUP for the above  
 > command? > 1 > If it matters: VAX/OpenVMS and BACKUP are v6.2.  > F > My log files report the file is not backed up because it was marked  > NOBACKUP.  > I > %BACKUP-I-NOBACKUP, DKA100:[STUFF.OLD]JUNK.DAT;1 data not copied, file   > marked NOBACKUP  > J > But a recent restore of the saveset to another disk (where I expected toH > have lost the files) showed they were actually on the backup saveset,  > much > to my surprise!  > A The file headers are backed up, but not the contents so when you  " restored the file, it was empty...   Barry    --    > Barry Treahy, Jr                       E-mail: Treahy@MMaz.com> Midwest Microwave                          Phone: 480/314-1320> Vice President & CIO                         FAX: 480/661-7028                            ------------------------------    Date: 25 Feb 2004 15:17:59 -0600 From: briggs@encompasserve.org" Subject: Re: Basic BACKUP Question3 Message-ID: <HWy4ONKagWmi@eisner.encompasserve.org>   [ In article <Htnr1I.Lro@sysadm.physics.uiowa.edu>, Rick Dyson <rick-dyson@uiowa.edu> writes: > > $ Backup/Image/Ignore=Interlock DKA100: MKA400:blah.bck/Save > Q > What happens to files on DKA100 that are marked NOBACKUP for the above command?  > 1 > If it matters: VAX/OpenVMS and BACKUP are v6.2.  > O > My log files report the file is not backed up because it was marked NOBACKUP.  > P > %BACKUP-I-NOBACKUP, DKA100:[STUFF.OLD]JUNK.DAT;1 data not copied, file marked 
 > NOBACKUP > J > But a recent restore of the saveset to another disk (where I expected toL > have lost the files) showed they were actually on the backup saveset, much > to my surprise!  > O > I really don't want the files dumped to tape, as they don't matter.  In fact, M > sometimes this is a VMS disk with page, swap & dump files that I don't want  > to them wasting tape!  > N > What am I missing?  Does "/Image" ignore the NOBACKUP flag BUT still reports > that it honors it?  H What is copied to tape is a placeholder only.  The file name, attributes' and size.  The file data is not copied.   H This is intended to support page, swap and dump files where you want theB files to be re-created with the restore, but you don't give a hoot about the file contents.   	John Briggs   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 21:32:38 GMT ' From: Rick Dyson <rick-dyson@uiowa.edu> " Subject: Re: Basic BACKUP Question1 Message-ID: <Htnt6G.6pn@sysadm.physics.uiowa.edu>    But note what I reported!!!!  ; THE DATA WAS BACKED UP AND DID GET RESTORED TO A NEW DISK!	   H I too thought that the files would be lost (except for DIR entries), butG I had to walk away from the owner eating my words about the files would # be empty.  They had all their data!   * Does /Image negate the action of NoBackup?  ; I just did a simple test, not even complicated by "/Image":    $ Dir /Full FILE.DAT0 FILE.DAT;1  	              File ID:  (5407,20,0)- Size:           97/99         Owner:    [x,y] " Created:   11-DEC-1990 23:09:15.99& Revised:   21-JUN-1997 10:47:11.29 (4) Expires:   <None specified> " Backup:     3-JAN-2003 15:55:19.56 Effective: <None specified>  Recording: <None specified>  File organization:  Sequential Shelved state:      OnlineJ File attributes:    Allocation: 99, Extend: 0, Global buffer count: 0, No  version limit, Backups disabled H Record format:      Variable length, maximum 255 bytes, longest 29 bytes4 Record attributes:  Carriage return carriage control RMS attributes:     None Journaling enabled: None= File protection:    System:RWED, Owner:RWED, Group:RE, World:  Access Cntrl List:  None   Total of 1 file, 97/99 blocks.  ) $ Backup FILE.DAT Sys$Login:Test.bck/Save S %BACKUP-I-NOBACKUP, DISK$VAXVMS:[X]FILE.DAT;1 data not copied, file marked NOBACKUP  $ Set Default Sys$Login  $ Backup /Log Test.bck/Save []6 %BACKUP-S-CREATED, created DISK$HOME:[DYSON]FILE.DAT;1 $ Dump FILE.DAT   
 ... stuff ...   $ How come I still got some stuff?  :)   Regards, rick  + Kenneth.Robinson@VerizonWireless.com wrote:   > >>$ Backup/Image/Ignore=Interlock DKA100: MKA400:blah.bck/Save >>H >>What happens to files on DKA100 that are marked NOBACKUP for the above > 
 > command? > 1 >>If it matters: VAX/OpenVMS and BACKUP are v6.2.  >>E >>My log files report the file is not backed up because it was marked  >  > NOBACKUP.  > H >>%BACKUP-I-NOBACKUP, DKA100:[STUFF.OLD]JUNK.DAT;1 data not copied, file > 	 > marked   > 
 >>NOBACKUP >  > 1 > It did what the message said "Data not copied".  > I > The header is backed up so you can recreate the file with it's original K > size, owner, etc., but the data is not backed up. You are not wasting any F > tape, unless you count the small amount needed to backup the header. >  > Ken Robinson   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:54:24 -0500  From: norm.raphael@metso.com" Subject: Re: Basic BACKUP QuestionQ Message-ID: <OF980BB4AD.5B646D5D-ON85256E45.007833E5-85256E45.00783D85@metso.com>   H The stuff you dump is not the original data.  You agreed that you did no7 longer wanted that when you set the NOBACKUP attribute.   F news@sysadm.physics.uiowa.edu (News Administrator) wrote on 02/25/2004 04:32:38 PM:   > But note what I reported!!!! > < > THE DATA WAS BACKED UP AND DID GET RESTORED TO A NEW DISK! > J > I too thought that the files would be lost (except for DIR entries), butI > I had to walk away from the owner eating my words about the files would % > be empty.  They had all their data!  > , > Does /Image negate the action of NoBackup? > = > I just did a simple test, not even complicated by "/Image":  >  > $ Dir /Full FILE.DAT4 > FILE.DAT;1                   File ID:  (5407,20,0)/ > Size:           97/99         Owner:    [x,y] $ > Created:   11-DEC-1990 23:09:15.99( > Revised:   21-JUN-1997 10:47:11.29 (4) > Expires:   <None specified> $ > Backup:     3-JAN-2003 15:55:19.56 > Effective: <None specified>  > Recording: <None specified>   > File organization:  Sequential > Shelved state:      OnlineK > File attributes:    Allocation: 99, Extend: 0, Global buffer count: 0, No   ! > version limit, Backups disabled J > Record format:      Variable length, maximum 255 bytes, longest 29 bytes6 > Record attributes:  Carriage return carriage control > RMS attributes:     None > Journaling enabled: None? > File protection:    System:RWED, Owner:RWED, Group:RE, World:  > Access Cntrl List:  None >   > Total of 1 file, 97/99 blocks. > + > $ Backup FILE.DAT Sys$Login:Test.bck/Save E > %BACKUP-I-NOBACKUP, DISK$VAXVMS:[X]FILE.DAT;1 data not copied, file  > marked NOBACKUP  > $ Set Default Sys$Login   > $ Backup /Log Test.bck/Save []8 > %BACKUP-S-CREATED, created DISK$HOME:[DYSON]FILE.DAT;1 > $ Dump FILE.DAT  >  > ... stuff ...  > & > How come I still got some stuff?  :) > 
 > Regards, > rick > - > Kenneth.Robinson@VerizonWireless.com wrote:  > @ > >>$ Backup/Image/Ignore=Interlock DKA100: MKA400:blah.bck/Save > >>J > >>What happens to files on DKA100 that are marked NOBACKUP for the above > >  > > command? > > 3 > >>If it matters: VAX/OpenVMS and BACKUP are v6.2.  > >>G > >>My log files report the file is not backed up because it was marked  > > 
 > > NOBACKUP.  > > J > >>%BACKUP-I-NOBACKUP, DKA100:[STUFF.OLD]JUNK.DAT;1 data not copied, file > > 
 > > marked > >  > >>NOBACKUP > >  > > 3 > > It did what the message said "Data not copied".  > > K > > The header is backed up so you can recreate the file with it's original I > > size, owner, etc., but the data is not backed up. You are not wasting  any H > > tape, unless you count the small amount needed to backup the header. > >  > > Ken Robinson >    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 16:30:07 -0600 ( From: brandon@dalsemi.com (John Brandon)" Subject: Re: Basic BACKUP Question1 Message-ID: <04022516300789@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>   L > I am not an expert, but as I understand it, the file header information is+ > copied/restored, but the data (blocks) in M > the file are not preserved.  Hence no time is or blocks are consumed.  This ' > is primarily for things like the page M > or swap files which want to exist on the restore, but the data within which  > is meaningless on restore.   Expert enough.  K The same also applies when you do an /EXCLU=*.DIR - the paceholders for the ( directory structure is also put to tape.       J*o*h*n B*r*a*n*d*o*n  VMS Systems Administrator * firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 23:19:49 +0000 - From: John Laird <nospam@laird-towers.org.uk> " Subject: Re: Basic BACKUP Question8 Message-ID: <b9bq30p8laqjp7j2ugjl8unrq5i0bp43am@4ax.com>  J On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:46:28 GMT, Rick Dyson <rick-dyson@uiowa.edu> wrote:  N >My log files report the file is not backed up because it was marked NOBACKUP. > O >%BACKUP-I-NOBACKUP, DKA100:[STUFF.OLD]JUNK.DAT;1 data not copied, file marked  	 >NOBACKUP   1 No it didn't, it told you the data wasn't copied.  $ help/mess nobackup  9 NOBACKUP,  'string' data not copied, file marked NOBACKUP   &   Facility:     BACKUP, Backup Utility  I   Explanation:  A save operation was performed on a file marked NOBACKUP. F                 Therefore, only the file header was saved; no data was,                 transferred to the save set.     --  3 Press ENTER once to quit or twice to save changes.     Mail john rather than nospam...    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 17:30:11 -0600 ( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com>" Subject: Re: Basic BACKUP Question/ Message-ID: <00A2DF4D.7C4B6887.7@tachysoft.com>    >X-Newsgroups: comp.os.vms* >From: Rick Dyson <rick-dyson=40uiowa.edu># >Subject: Re: Basic BACKUP Question  > % >But note what I reported=21=21=21=21  > A >THE DATA WAS BACKED UP AND DID GET RESTORED TO A NEW DISK=21	=09  > I >I too thought that the files would be lost (except for DIR entries), but H >I had to walk away from the owner eating my words about the files would& >be empty.  They had all their data=21 > + >Does /Image negate the action of NoBackup?  > @ >I just did a simple test, not even complicated by =22/Image=22: >  >=24 Dir /Full FILE.DAT 1 >FILE.DAT;1  	              File ID:  (5407,20,0) 2 >Size:           97/99         Owner:    =5Bx,y=5D# >Created:   11-DEC-1990 23:09:15.99 ' >Revised:   21-JUN-1997 10:47:11.29 (4)  >Expires:   <None specified># >Backup:     3-JAN-2003 15:55:19.56  >Effective: <None specified> >Recording: <None specified> >File organization:  Sequential  >Shelved state:      Online K >File attributes:    Allocation: 99, Extend: 0, Global buffer count: 0, No=   =20  >version limit, Backups disabledI >Record format:      Variable length, maximum 255 bytes, longest 29 bytes 5 >Record attributes:  Carriage return carriage control  >RMS attributes:     None  >Journaling enabled: None > >File protection:    System:RWED, Owner:RWED, Group:RE, World: >Access Cntrl List:  None  >  >Total of 1 file, 97/99 blocks.  > . >=24 Backup FILE.DAT Sys=24Login:Test.bck/SaveL >%BACKUP-I-NOBACKUP, DISK=24VAXVMS:=5BX=5DFILE.DAT;1 data not copied, file = marked NOBACKUP  >=24 Set Default Sys=24Login% >=24 Backup /Log Test.bck/Save =5B=5D = >%BACKUP-S-CREATED, created DISK=24HOME:=5BDYSON=5DFILE.DAT;1  >=24 Dump FILE.DAT >  >... stuff ... > % >How come I still got some stuff?  :)  >       6 But you really didn't.  At least not the *same* stuff.    L As others have noted, even though a file of the same size was created, the = diskL blocks do not contain the same data as before.  They actually contain randomH garbage, whatever was in those particular disk blocks at the time of theJ restore.  Which is of course okay for page files and other files typically marked nobackup.    L Observe the following procedure, which backs up a nobackup file, restores i= t,! and then examines the *contents*.        =24=21 =24=21* =24 create smalldisk:=5Bstuff=5Dtrash.file line 1 line 2 line 3 line 4 line 5 line 63 =24 set file/noback smalldisk:=5Bstuff=5Dtrash.file + =24 dir/ful smalldisk:=5Bstuff=5Dtrash.file    Directory SMALLDISK:=5BSTUFF=5D   A TRASH.FILE;1                  File ID:  (60,5,0)              =20 4 Size:            1/4          Owner:    =5BSYSTEM=5D# Created:    25-FEB-2004 17:27:37.12 ' Revised:    25-FEB-2004 17:27:37.34 (2)  Expires:    <None specified>  Backup:     <No backup recorded> Effective:  <None specified> Recording:  <None specified> Accessed:   <None specified> Attributes: <None specified> Modified:   <None specified>
 Linkcount:  1  File organization:  Sequential Shelved state:      Online =20  Caching attribute:  WritethroughL File attributes:    Allocation: 4, Extend: 0, Global buffer count: 0, No ve= rsion limit, Backups disabled E Record format:      Variable length, maximum 0 bytes, longest 6 bytes 4 Record attributes:  Carriage return carriage control RMS attributes:     None Journaling enabled: None= File protection:    System:RWED, Owner:RWED, Group:RE, World:  Access Cntrl List:  None Client attributes:  None   Total of 1 file, 1/4 blocks.
 =24=21 =20 =24=21 with nobackup
 =24=21 =20C =24 backup/log smalldisk:=5Bstuff=5Dtrash.file just_header.bak/save L %BACKUP-I-NOBACKUP, SMALLDISK:=5BSTUFF=5DTRASH.FILE;1 data not copied, file=  marked NOBACKUPE %BACKUP-S-HEADCOPIED, copied SMALLDISK:=5BSTUFF=5DTRASH.FILE;1 header 
 =24=21 =20H =24=21 override the nobackup; this backs up the same file the normal way
 =24=21 =20L =24 backup/log/ign=3Dnoback smalldisk:=5Bstuff=5Dtrash.file full_file.bak/s= ave : %BACKUP-S-COPIED, copied SMALLDISK:=5BSTUFF=5DTRASH.FILE;1
 =24=21 =20
 =24=21 =20L =24=21 restore the file that was backed up with nobackup (just the header) = and =20 * =24=21 call it (gasp=21) trash.just_header
 =24=21 =20
 =24=21 =20< =24 backup/log  just_header.bak/save =5B=5Dtrash.just_headerL %BACKUP-S-CREATED, created LAUREL=24DKB300:=5BSCRATCH_AREA=5DTRASH.JUST_HEA= DER;1 
 =24=21 =20L =24=21 restore the file that was backed up with nobackup ignored and call i= t =20  =24=21 full_file
 =24=21 =208 =24 backup/log  full_file.bak/save =5B=5Dtrash.full_fileL %BACKUP-S-CREATED, created LAUREL=24DKB300:=5BSCRATCH_AREA=5DTRASH.FULL_FIL= E;1 
 =24=21 =20
 =24=21 =20L =24=21 dump the just_header file; it will contain absolute garbage.  The re= store L =24=21 did not actually place anything in the disk blocks, just allocated t= he =20L =24=21 space.  The disks blocks contain whatever random trash was already i= n them" =24=21 at the time of the restore.
 =24=21 =20 =24 dump trash.just_header =0C L Dump of file LAUREL=24DKB300:=5BSCRATCH_AREA=5DTRASH.JUST_HEADER;1 on 25-FE= B-2004 17:27:38.539 File ID (13041,18,0)   End of file block 1 / Allocated 18   3 Virtual block number 1 (00000001), 512 (0200) bytes   L  B7F4A051 E39DF82B A677A052 EFA6484B 949865EF 6DD2B79F E84EEC77 7F661496 ..== f.w=ECN=E8.=B7=D2m=EFe..KH=A6=EFR.w=A6+=F8.=E3Q.=F4=B7 000000 J  37CCEEB8 E04EFCF5 B021B277 E1D2D503 BF1F6E5B 0850D6FE F3783813 BF276C5E =L =5El'=BF.8x=F3=FE=D6P.=5Bn.=BF.=D5=D2=E1w=B2=21=B0=F5=FCN=E0=B8=EE=CC7 0000= 20J  3DBB5CC8 E638BAF8 F0C76E2D E84AF78C 95935781 DF9CE211 CBA16B3F 8F5C77E1 =I =E1w=5C.?k=A1=CB.=E2.=DF.W...=F7J=E8-n=C7=F0=F8=BA8=E6=C8=5C=BB=3D 000040 J  EBAE66D2 AD9F167A D3FA0B6F 46BB8FA5 4E8FD338 D1FAE7B7 6AAB0F0C 66863AE3 =E =E3:.f..=ABj=B7=E7=FA=D18=D3.N=A5.=BBFo.=FA=D3z..=AD=D2f=AE=EB 000060 K  EC935695 79B1349D B621BF47 567997B2 EBD513AB 6340D6B3 7CBC4A9D AF55D74F O= F =D7U=AF.J=BC=7C=B3=D6=40c=AB.=D5=EB=B2.yVG=BF=21=B6.4=B1y.V.=EC 000080K  43816531 69DD94C0 B6194C06 8660E6B4 ED94CE5C 8EA575B6 A92F0244 CBE8C097 .= D =C0=E8=CBD./=A9=B6u=A5.=5C=CE.=ED=B4=E6=60..L.=B6=C0.=DDi1e.C 0000A0J  64B15749 84D4CF6E CF5BF754 ACCDD75C F1350A73 2EEDBF09 015AD5CC A673B4C8 =K =C8=B4s=A6=CC=D5Z..=BF=ED.s.5=F1=5C=D7=CD=ACT=F7=5B=CFn=CF=D4.IW=B1d 0000C0 J  B9C47864 B49C790B 3B538F0C AB5A6700 4F0C1B7C 20591AF2 9CE4C966 1B17DCAA =; =AA=DC..f=C9=E4.=F2.Y =7C..O.gZ=AB..S;.y.=B4dx=C4=B9 0000E0 J  5A7F614E 20251872 6B9C8328 0C3986F1 7398061C 8B628703 9B9FE9E9 218B59D2 =1 =D2Y.=21=E9=E9....b....s=F1.9.(..kr.% Na.Z 000100 J  39956DDA 535ACAA9 FCD8C655 AD89EA16 9593E826 010F2944 61576473 28DDEFB7 =? =B7=EF=DD(sdWaD)..&=E8...=EA.=ADU=C6=D8=FC=A9=CAZS=DAm.9 000120 L  46FEA922 12F9AB49 0B695138 B5093008 0D04A50C 023CDC58 2E0B12DC B5E142FF .B=; =E1=B5=DC...X=DC<..=A5...0.=B58Qi.I=AB=F9.=22=A9=FEF 000140 K  30B2C881 859544D5 EBEDCC38 1BF6CE1B C4399F15 DFAF4E58 9E481E6D 8639C79C .= > =C79.m.H.XN=AF=DF..9=C4.=CE=F6.8=CC=ED=EB=D5D...=C8=B20 000160J  D3807903 6AD42298 3A070C2C 9DA9F77D 79699134 37D785DA 352F7361 601E6560 =; =60e.=60as/5=DA.=D774.iy=7D=F7=A9.,..:.=22=D4j.y.=D3 000180 J  02E01E7A EFAF4ADA BEFAF52E 9605D3BA 586B637D 7BDD044C CD6774B0 D6E6177B =I =7B.=E6=D6=B0tg=CDL.=DD=7B=7DckX=BA=D3...=F5=FA=BE=DAJ=AF=EFz.=E0. 0001A0 L  98546858 060E5EB8 7EF37CF9 5B770E07 7CFAF6F5 10270072 CA11F6F6 00E79D32 2.=C =E7.=F6=F6.=CAr.'.=F5=F6=FA=7C..w=5B=F9=7C=F3=7E=B8=5E..XhT. 0001C0 J  5A36BDBE 7D0D8D90 9C0EF9F2 A3F0F209 88DB0767 117BEB04 C75A9C82 62B6C5E0 =E =E0=C5=B6b..Z=C7.=EB=7B.g.=DB..=F2=F0=A3=F2=F9.....=7D=BE=BD6Z 0001E0 
 =24=21 =20I =24=21 dump full_file; the contents will match those of the original file 
 =24=21 =20 =24 dump trash.full_file =0C L Dump of file LAUREL=24DKB300:=5BSCRATCH_AREA=5DTRASH.FULL_FILE;1 on 25-FEB-= 2004 17:27:38.579 File ID (13042,31,0)   End of file block 1 / Allocated 18   3 Virtual block number 1 (00000001), 512 (0200) bytes   L  3420656E 696C0006 3320656E 696C0006 3220656E 696C0006 3120656E 696C0006 ..=% line 1..line 2..line 3..line 4 000000 L  00000000 00000000 00000000 0000FFFF 3620656E 696C0006 3520656E 696C0006 ..=% line 5..line 6................ 000020 L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 000040L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 000060L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 000080L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 0000A0L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 0000C0L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 0000E0L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 000100L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 000120L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 000140L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 000160L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 000180L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 0001A0L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 0001C0L  00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 00000000 ..=$ ............................. 0001E0 =24 dump/rec trash.full_file =0C L Dump of file LAUREL=24DKB300:=5BSCRATCH_AREA=5DTRASH.FULL_FILE;1 on 25-FEB-= 2004 17:27:38.619 File ID (13042,31,0)   End of file block 1 / Allocated 18   ? Record number 1 (00000001), 6 (0006) bytes, RFA(0001,0000,0000)   L                                                            3120 656E696C li=% ne 1.......................... 000000   ? Record number 2 (00000002), 6 (0006) bytes, RFA(0001,0000,0008)   L                                                            3220 656E696C li=% ne 2.......................... 000000   ? Record number 3 (00000003), 6 (0006) bytes, RFA(0001,0000,0010)   L                                                            3320 656E696C li=% ne 3.......................... 000000   ? Record number 4 (00000004), 6 (0006) bytes, RFA(0001,0000,0018)   L                                                            3420 656E696C li=% ne 4.......................... 000000   ? Record number 5 (00000005), 6 (0006) bytes, RFA(0001,0000,0020)   L                                                            3520 656E696C li=% ne 5.......................... 000000   ? Record number 6 (00000006), 6 (0006) bytes, RFA(0001,0000,0028)   L                                                            3620 656E696C li=% ne 6.......................... 000000 8 =24 diff trash.full_file smalldisk:=5Bstuff=5Dtrash.file& Number of difference sections found: 0% Number of difference records found: 0   $ DIFFERENCES /IGNORE=3D()/MERGED=3D1-8     LAUREL=24DKB300:=5BSCRATCH_AREA=5DTRASH.FULL_FILE;1-%     SMALLDISK:=5BSTUFF=5DTRASH.FILE;1 
 =24=21 =20) =24 del smalldisk:=5Bstuff=5Dtrash.file;* F %DELETE-I-FILDEL, SMALLDISK:=5BSTUFF=5DTRASH.FILE;1 deleted (4 blocks) =24 del trash.*;* L %DELETE-I-FILDEL, LAUREL=24DKB300:=5BSCRATCH_AREA=5DTRASH.FULL_FILE;1 delet= ed (18 blocks)L %DELETE-I-FILDEL, LAUREL=24DKB300:=5BSCRATCH_AREA=5DTRASH.JUST_HEADER;1 del= eted (18 blocks), %DELETE-I-TOTAL, 2 files deleted (36 blocks)L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3DL Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738   wayne=40tachysof= t.com > http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html   =20L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3DF Jed Clampett, checking into hotel: =22This place got a cement pond?=220 	Ellie May: =22And do yuh let critters in it?=22   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Feb 2004 17:07:32 -0800. From: fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso)! Subject: Compaq Computer Alliance < Message-ID: <f30679fb.0402251707.5df4ec8@posting.google.com>  2 Checking the Montagar and Cognos sites, they still+ having the Compaq Computer Alliance banner. ? Does it changed with the HP merge ? Does HP have a new program? : Because these companies are marketing an old dead company.   Regards    FC   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Feb 2004 16:00:25 -0800& From: jordan@ccs4vms.com (Rich Jordan): Subject: Credit bureau communications software on OpenVMS?= Message-ID: <cc5619f2.0402251600.50c90afd@posting.google.com>   C Here's a longshot.  Does anyone have software for OpenVMS Alpha for E communicating with credit bureaus over the internet?  We're currently A using a mongrel system that uses a dialup peecee with appropriate D software and file sharing from the OpenVMS system that actually runs@ the business.  The PC polls for incoming requests, dials out andC submits them, gets the answers back and passes the data back to VMS F and/or prints it.  The bureaus are rumbling about discontinuing dialupA and using only internet access, and since we would have to change B configs anyway, it'd be nice to centralize everything on the Alpha& instead of on some peecee application.  E The bureaus provide information for setting up communications, and we C may try to roll our own, but if there's something already out there E (which a cursory google search didn't turn up) I'd love to know about B it.  We're already looking at using cURL and/or its libraries as a basis.  E Barring that, if there's any open source code that would be usable as E an example that would also be nice to know.  Also no luck locating it 2 so far but I haven't tried all the magic keywords.   Thanks!  Rich Jordan    ------------------------------    Date: 25 Feb 2004 16:18:37 -0800. From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman) Subject: Re: DCL help = Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0402251618.7b16cd76@posting.google.com>   n Terry Aardema <taardema@nrcan.gc.ca> wrote in message news:<Xns949A5E05F1176taardemanrcangcca@132.156.36.9>... [...] 4 > From a "HELP BACKUP_COMMAND /BACKUP" on VMS 7.3-1: > H >     "When you use /BACKUP with /BEFORE, files with a BACKUP date priorG >      to the specified date or time are selected. Files with no BACKUP G >      date (that is, /RECORD was not specified when the file was saved $ >      or copied) are also selected. > G >      When you use /BACKUP with /SINCE, files with a BACKUP date equal F >      to or later than the specified date or time are selected. FilesG >      with no BACKUP date (that is, /RECORD was not specified when the 3 >      file was saved or copied) are not selected."  >  > C > So a BACKUP/SINCE/BACKUP won't catch files without a BACKUP date  G > recorded, but BACKUP/BEFORE/BACKUP will (at least according to HELP).  > J > Testing with a newly CREATEd file (and therefore one with no BACKUP date> > recorded) shows that the HELP is correct at least as far as # > BACKUP/SINCE/BACKUP is concerned.  > K > However, I just tried a BACKUP/SINCE=BACKUP (note the /SINCE=BACKUP vice  I > /SINCE/BACKUP) on the same file I had just created; the BACKUP command  I > was quite happy to backup this file and I was able to extract the file  G > from the resultant saveset and verify that it was identical with the   > original.   E BACKUP /SINCE=BACKUP is the same as BACKUP /MODIFIED/SINCE=BACKUP, so 7 I would expect files without a backup date to be saved.   F You should try BACKUP /BACKUP/SINCE=BACKUP and tell us what that does.F On my 6.1 system it saves all files (quick single directory test). Not of much use!   Disclaimer: JMHO Alan E. FeldmanP   >  > Syntax matters.K >  > Terry Aardemai > Systems and Network ManagerAK > Natural Resources Canada/Canadian Forest Service/Northern Forestry Centrea > #include <disclaimer.h>a   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 00:34:59 GMTe" From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG6 Subject: Re: Educating HP employees on the nettiquette0 Message-ID: <00A2DF5E.EBFE1540@SendSpamHere.ORG>  V In article <403D1D6C.1A2D08D1@istop.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> writes:K >OK, sorry to be blunt, but it seems that any HP employees in the VMS groupcM >need some education on nettiquette. I have , and continue to be surprised toiK >see people who appear to be fairly well experienced and fairly senior make > >such mistakes when it comes to using the internet for emails. >.K >Would it be possible to sensitize all VMS-related employees to follow some " >simple rules when sending emails:  5 Not when upper mgt forces them ti use Willywarez, JF.G    K >4-Why is it so difficult for people to configure their mail clients NOT totL >send HTML ? There are some that insisi on sending 2 copies, one in text andK >the other in HTML, but becasue of the multipart nature, even the enxt gets  >somewhat encoded.  G WHY IS IT SO DIFFICULT TO CONFIGURE EMAIL CLIENTS TO SEND TEXT AS TEXT.-3 I can't stand quoted-printable shit in my emailbox.M    J While we're on it, send me a link to a document/image/file/kit/etc. DO NOT
 ATTACH IT! --B http://www.legacy-2000.com  for the *best* OpenVMS system securityC                             solutions that others only claim to be.e --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COMh             5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?" e   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 23:38:57 -0500-* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>6 Subject: Re: Educating HP employees on the nettiquette) Message-ID: <403D783D.65C05097@istop.com>I  ! VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:s7 > Not when upper mgt forces them ti use Willywarez, JF.-  J But surely one can configure even billyware to abide by internet standardsI ???? I know it can be done. How come VMS engineers aren't smart enough to O disable all the billyware options to make their emails internet compliant ?????n  M I am now einstein and I know not to include the whole contents of a post. And M if I was confronted with a mail client which automatically included the wholehM contents, I would consciously delete all unnecessary stuff and post below it.uG (and then go to the preferences and find a way to disable all the nastya microsoft add-ons).a    G There is however an easy way to convince someone of the dangers of HTMLsJ emails: send an html email that contains a <img src= to some porn web siteN with a truly disgusting image. When the recipient opens the oemail, he'll haveL no choice but to view this thing. And no virus scanning will have complained5 because the html itself didn't contain any bad stuff.,  H Then, if they don't catch the dangers, you send HTML emails that contain> javascript and then you up the ante and send nasty java stuff.   ------------------------------   Date: 26 Feb 2004 05:50:23 GMT From: healyzh@aracnet.com 6 Subject: Re: Educating HP employees on the nettiquette, Message-ID: <c1k1ev010ud@enews2.newsguy.com>  4 Alan Frisbie <Usenet01REMOVE@flying-disk.com> wrote:F > on VMS systems.   It's not that they don't know what they are doing,C > they actively don't *want* to change.   They claim that there are H > only one or two people using VMS mail, so we are not worth the effort.1 > It's our fault that we are not running Windows.k  J <sigh> Idiots!  One of the main uses of my VMS system is email.  I use theB tty VMS Mail client daily, and the DECwindows client occasionally.  F There is no way in H*** I'm doing email on Windows if I don't have to.E Unfortuantly at work I'm forced to use Outlook occasionally, and onlyr? because people insist on sending Word attachments and the like.-   			Zane-   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:05:16 GMTn' From: Rick Dyson <rick-dyson@uiowa.edu>u Subject: HSOF for HSZ50???1 Message-ID: <HtnB8u.ML0@sysadm.physics.uiowa.edu>z  F I have been told that one can no longer order the HSOF firmware PCMCIAG card for HSZ50 controllers from HP.  The last release that I know about H is v5.7Z-3.  Does anyone know how I could obtain a pair of copies?  I'veI been told that if a friend had one it would be OK to get it from them. :)A  H Any 'friends' out there that know how to duplicate a PCMCIA card?  I canH provide several blank 2 MB cards (old versions of HSZ40, HSG80 and such)< for anyone with the software and the ability to make a copy.  @ Please feel free to contact me if you can help or have any other suggestions.   Thanks, 
 Rick Dyson   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:32:58 +0100s From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl>C Subject: Re: It is almost certain now, INTEL will have 64bit x86 !!t2 Message-ID: <c1iqnu$omu$1@news1.tilbu1.nb.home.nl>  ( Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: > Dirk Munk wrote: > + >> Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote:t >> >>> Robert Klute wrote:m >>> J >>>> On Tue, 24 Feb 2004 13:19:36 +0000, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy3 >>>> <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> wrote:p >>>>L >>>> I didn't say that 32bit systems haven't been popular.  In the 1 - 4 wayA >>>> space they dominate the market, showing that a most businesssG >>>> applications can be solved cost effectively with such systems.  I P >>>> merelykK >>>> said that the limited address space puts a cap on how many  processors 1 >>>> can be effectively used in a single system.   >>>  >>>n >>>  >>>fB >>> But since this point is demonstrably untrue it seems pointless >>> to have made it. >>>dE >>> Solaris 2.6 is a 32bit OS that does not stop it making use of the0? >>> 64 CPU's in a Sun E10000, Dynix was a 32bit OS that did not 9 >>> stop it using the 64 CPU's in the Sequent NUMA-Q box.w >> >> >>F >> The good old PDP 11/70 had 22 bit of memory/address space. However I >> RSX11M applications can only address 16 bits. You can run many 16 bit pJ >> applications in that 22 bit address space. (RSX11M+ is the predecessor F >> of VMS, the PDP11 is the predecessor of the VAX. Both can still be D >> bought). More then 30 years ago Digital demonstrated that it was ! >> possible to do these 'tricks'.o >> >> >>> G >>> 3.75 GB for a single process may be a problem for some applications2G >>> it is not for most. As an example the majority of Oracle apps apart I >>> from the DBMS are 32bit because they don't benefit from having 64bit   >>> support. >>>eJ >>> The apparent need for all applications and all systems to be 64bit wasI >>> a marketing campaign of Digitals, it was mostly rubbish. As the basis I >>> of a Digital marketing campaign it had to be dubious though obviouslylC >>> from this conversation some of the rubbish seems to have stuck.O >> >> >>G >> Now you're talking rubbish. Digital had the vision that disk access eF >> speed would become a big problem for fast database access. So they ; >> said let's move large parts of the database into memory.  >>E > Which could only apparently be accomplished by having 64bit support  > in the OS. > D > Sadly at the time the only Digital platform that supported largishE > amounts of memory was the 8400 and at the time you only got largish B > amounts of memory >8GB by trading CPU's and I/O slots for memoryE > resulting in a system that lacked CPU and I/O capacity thus provingXB > that caching a DBMS in memory was a good thing (at least for theD > config you ended up with because it had negligable I/O bandwidth). > 5 > In other words the claims were in practice rubbish.O > F >>  From every day experience I know that most programmers and system J >> managers haven't got a clue about disk access. Disks have become about J >> 4 times faster the last 25 years (random IO), cpu's 1000(?), 10,000(?) H >> times faster. Memory is about a 100 times cheaper. And now the disks J >> are doubling in size about every year, and customers still want to buy G >> storage based on the size they need, not on the IO they need, since  I >> they haven't got a clue about IO either. And try to tell these people  ; >> that they have to stuff their system full of memory.....I >>C >> And there we are wondering why that beautifull new system is so kG >> sloooow. Sun systems have the same problem I can assure you. By the  J >> way, I studied the specs of the new SUN 4900 yesterday, and was amazed I >> by the poor IO subsystem. 16 PCI slots, mnay of them 33 MHZ. No PCI-X e >> slots on 133 or 100 MHz.  >> > 0 > You appear to have looked in the wrong place !  ' You're right, this was the wrong place:a  ; http://www.sun.com/servers/midrange/sunfire_e4900/specs.xml    And these are the IO specs:  	h 16 PCI slots (4 at 66-MHz and 12 at 33-MHz)  0 I'm happy to say that they are at least 64 bits.     > ? > Counting the number of PCI slots and the speed of those slotsh@ > is the last place to look on a SMP server to discover what its > I/O bandwidth might be.k > ? > Just as a hint, the PCI busses are driven by PCI bridges frome> > the main backplane thats the place to look and if you do you> > will find that in reality the Sun's are rather fast compared+ > with what is actually on offer elsewhere.l  N You're absolutely right. And that is why we can never find those specs on the K SUN web pages I presume ?? There is no information about the number of PCI  C busses (not bridges) of any SUN system I've been looking at so far.e  P Just compare the IO subsystem of an Alphaserver ES47 or ES80 with this. Or read P the quickspecs of these systems and compare the wealth of technical information ; there with SUN's poor excuses for technical specifications.1   > 	 > Regards: > Andrew Harrison  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:59:16 -0500<* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>C Subject: Re: It is almost certain now, INTEL will have 64bit x86 !! ) Message-ID: <403CFE94.3ECA39BD@istop.com>s   "Barry Treahy, Jr." wrote:H > If MS wanted to be there, they would have had better support for IA-64L > long ago, they haven't because the performance wasn't where it belonged...  M Microsost isn't after performance, it is after volume. That is why windows on,M Mips Power and Alpha were canned, even though they all outperformed the 8086.pN And MS isn't interested in IA64 because there will not be the necessary volumeI to justify continued development for that platform which will bring MS nopE much, if anything, more than what the 64 bit 8086 brings for Windows.E   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:21:43 -0500f' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>sC Subject: RE: It is almost certain now, INTEL will have 64bit x86 !!KR Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB279160@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----6 > From: JF Mezei [mailto:jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com]=20! > Sent: February 25, 2004 2:59 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com E > Subject: Re: It is almost certain now, INTEL will have 64bit x86 !!F >=20 > "Barry Treahy, Jr." wrote:; > > If MS wanted to be there, they would have had better=20  > support for IA-64=20B > > long ago, they haven't because the performance wasn't where=20 > it belonged... >=20@ > Microsost isn't after performance, it is after volume. That=20= > is why windows on Mips Power and Alpha were canned, even=20a( > though they all outperformed the 8086.B > And MS isn't interested in IA64 because there will not be the=20? > necessary volume to justify continued development for that=20iA > platform which will bring MS no much, if anything, more than=200* > what the 64 bit 8086 brings for Windows. >=20   JF -   Re:=20@ > Microsost isn't after performance, it is after volume. That=205 > is why windows on Mips Power and Alpha were canned,w  F Small nit - Lets not re-write history... Microsoft only dropped Power,F MIPS and Alpha HW platforms *after* the appropriate vendors themselvesH dropped Windows as a platform. Obviously, if the vendor does not plan to3 support the platform, then neither could Microsoft.g   Regardsb  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660m Fax: 613-591-4477o Email: kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcomd. (remove the DOT's and AT for email address)=20   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 02:13:39 GMT(# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> C Subject: Re: It is almost certain now, INTEL will have 64bit x86 !!eG Message-ID: <nDc%b.3914$Yf.934@twister01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>p   JF Mezei wrote:: > "Barry Treahy, Jr." wrote:C >> If MS wanted to be there, they would have had better support foruG >> IA-64 long ago, they haven't because the performance wasn't where it9 >> belonged... > D > Microsost isn't after performance, it is after volume. That is whyC > windows on Mips Power and Alpha were canned, even though they alleF > outperformed the 8086. And MS isn't interested in IA64 because thereG > will not be the necessary volume to justify continued development fornC > that platform which will bring MS no much, if anything, more thanf* > what the 64 bit 8086 brings for Windows.    / BillG is just following in Wrigley's footsteps:I  J If you have a 100 million customers it doesn't matter if you loose 10,000.E If you have 50,000 customers and you 10,000 of them then you're dead.,  I The modern MBA equivalent is encapsulated in a book by a Harvard b-school A prof, Michael Porter, in a book he wrote in the mid-80's entitledkH "Competitive Strategy". It's well worth reading, as is a book by MichaelH Treacy ( a former classmate of mine), entitled "The Discipline of Market	 Leaders".D  K Maybe I'll buy carly(tm) and Bob Blatz a copy of each - they both could usei some education.e   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 23:20:03 +0100 (CET)u% From: Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com>A8 Subject: JF: USA will self-exterminate within 100 years!8 Message-ID: <40cde7a595a1b5b0432a498120d38d29@dizum.com>  . nobody <nobody@nobody.org> (JF Mezei) trolled:  M >If Bush wants to prevent two of the same from marrying, does this mean that:  > " >	-two republicans could not marry >	-two whites could not marryt. >	-two people of same religion could not marry >nN >Would this invalidate all current marriages ? Think of the number of children- >who would automatically become illigetimate.a > O >Imagine the scandal if Bush's own wedding to Laura Bush were invalidated twicecM >(both are white, both are republicans). The US president's children would be K >illegitimate and he'd be living in sin with an unmarried lady IN THE WHITE N >HOUSE... imagine the scandal. Star would have a field day writing his report. >nL >This also poses the most important question: what if a man and women marry,B >but days after the wedding, the man surgically becomes a female ? >aO >And what about men who are half females ? (everything female through hormones, N >but the final operation in the crotch not done) ? Could they marry a man or a >woman ? >uI >In the end, Bush will outlaw all weddings, and also outlaw having babiesnK >unless people are married. The USA will self-exterminate itself within 100e >years  -                ==============================p*                 FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS  -                                         Aboutj  0                                  J F   M E Z E I.                 ==============================   1.  Who is JF Mezei?  G Jean-Francois Mezei is the worst netkook and megatroll to have ever hitIJ rec.travel.air and various other usenet newsgroups.  He is also one of the) longest running trolls in usenet history.a  " 2.  How long has he been trolling?   For well over a decade.a   3.  Where does he live?B   Montreal, Quebec, Canada   Jean-Francois Mezei  86 Harwood Gate  Beaconsfield, QC H9W3A3m (514) 695-8259  * 4.  What makes him such a malicious troll?  H His trolling is constant, repetitious, relentless.  Once he invades yourO newsgroup he will stay for decades, troll around the clock, day in and day out,lO every day of the year, for years and years on end.  He does not listen to pleaseI to stop, he does not listen to anything anyone tells him, he does not payRO attention when the misinformation/disinformation he posts is corrected, he justNM goes right on trolling year in, year out like a little child holding his earseG closed while yelling "I can't hear you, I can't hear anything you say!"    5.  What does he troll about?E  P His favorite subjects are USA-bashing and anything to do with sex.  He hates theK USA and Americans and will hijack any thread and turn it into a USA-bashingrC fest.  If he can't do that then he'll just start making lewd posts.   $ 6.  What does he hate about the USA?  P Everything!  He is part of a larger group of Canadian trolls who have a visceralP hatred of the USA, motivated by envy mostly.  The USA is a happier, better, moreJ successful version of their country and they can't stand it.  Some of JF'sN favorite troll bait is "the Bush regime", "the Bush-Rumsfeld-Wolfowitz axis ofJ evil", "Americans are brainwashed", "Cars are evil", "SUVs are evil", "all Americans are stupid" etc.  # 7.  What about his sexual trolling?e  P Ah, that is JF at his trolling best.  No sexual topic is too bizarre.  Among hisI favorites are child sexuality, masturbation, women's genitalia, sex toys,aM circumcision, the sex lives of Americans (of course) ... the list is endless.    8.  Circumcision???   P Yes, JF trolled the circumcision newsgroups for years.  He still likes to insertF circumcision into his trolling every now and then.  Apparently, JF wasP traumatized as a child because his parents, poor Hungarian immigrants to Canada,O left him uncircumcised when he was born, as is the custom in most of the world.aN Growing up in Canada where male infant circumcision was prevalent at the time,O he was psychologically scarred (so he claims).  As soon as he could he arrangedID to get himself snipped, and then joined the brigades of circumcisionN proselytizers in the newsgroups advocating the joys of a free willy.  His mainO argument is how much better he was able to masturbate after getting circumcisedsM without that "pesky foreskin" getting in the way of his enjoyment, and he has,> made it his mission in life to spread the circumcision gospel.  H 9.  What's his interest in child sexuality?  That sounds kind of freaky.  N Well, everything having to do with Mezei *is* freaky.  Among the subjects dearO to his heart are the genitals of little boys and girls, especially little boy's J foreskins (and how tight they are) and little girls' hymens.  He is also aK tireless activist and advocate that children should be taught to masturbate/H early on so that they don't grow up "sexually repressed like Americans".  L He also counsels all parents of boys that they constantly check their littleM boys' penises and foreskins frequently to ensure a good fit, proper movement, O and that they be able to masturbate with no problems.  Utopia for JF would be a > world full of parents manipulating their little boys' penises.  M 10.  Ewww!  This guy is sounding more and more disgusting by the minute!  Are  you sure about all this stuff?  P Yes, you can check the google archives for yourself.  There's over a decade full of Mezei trolling in there.i  M 11.  How can I find all that out, doesn't he change aliases all the time like  all trolls do?  K Of course!  See the appendix below for a list of many of his known trolling  aliases.  G 12.  So where does this guy get so much time to troll, doesn't he work?r  O Ha ha ha!  JF hasn't worked a day in his life!  He's an adult baby, a grown man O who still lives at home with mommy and sleeps all day and trolls the newsgroupskM all night.  In his free time when he isn't trolling he likes to ride his biketG down to Dorval Airport and race the planes down the runway in his bike.S  9 13.  That seems strange, is he mentally ill or something?   M Bingo!  JF is a boy in a grown man's body.  Psychologically he never got past0G the age of 13 and got stuck in a world of bathroom humor (i.e. "pull myyH finger!") and locker room antics that he has never been able to outgrow.  L 14.  Speaking of locker rooms, I heard he has a sexual fetish about them, is
 that true?  M Yes!  JF goes to the gym not to work out but to watch men in the locker room.eN He loves to post about the male sexual organs he has seen in locker rooms overP the years, especially his unnatural obsession with foreskins.  He stalks the menO in locker rooms trying to measure how much foreskin they have, or how little is1N left if they have been circumcised.  He gets extremely excited when he spots a case of phimosis.f  O 15.  Oh my Gawd, this guy is nuts!  He should be locked up in an insane asylum!C  M Yep, JF is certifiably insane.  He lives in a black helicopter / tin foil hat2N world where others are out to get him.  The key to understanding JF is that heL sees himself as a VICTIM.  To JF the world is out to get him, especially the) USA.  Victimhood is what JF is all about.s  O What seems to have sent him over the edge was when the Canadian rail system was1J "killed", in his words.  He used to be a major train nut, spotting trains,N writing down their numbers and chasing them down at the train yard like a goodM freak.  Then he turned his attention to aviation.  Major events that made him P fall head first deep into the abyss were the bankruptcy of Canadian Airlines andO their subsequent takeover by Air Canada (whom he sees as evil).  So paranoid is=M he that when an Air Canada plane crashed he claimed that Air Canada employees O went lurking about in the night with buckets of white paint to cover up the AirFD Canada markings.  He saw that as symbolic of a cover up of the crash1 investigation.  He has never recovered from this.B  6 16.  Where else does he hang out, I want to avoid him!  O His main haunt on usenet is comp.os.vms, a newsgroup dedicated to some ancient,fJ arcane, obsolete piece of vax crapware that nobody has taken seriously forM decades.  JF hangs out there with other misfits and social dropouts who shareCJ his psychological traumas, crying for the good old vax days of yore.  It's really pathetic!  ! 17.  Where else does he hang out?7  I can.internet.highspeed, alt.cellular.fido, and a few other geeky computer6G groups.  For a while after the Shuttle Columbia disaster he invaded the N sci.space groups, sci.space.shuttle in particular, and trolled it relentlesslyP with the anti-American, conspiracy theory crap he's so famous for.  But they ranN him off that group and he had to go crawling back to comp.os.vms with his tail% between his legs, licking his wounds.1  P 18.  It sounds like comp.os.vms is the only group he respects and doesn't troll.  O Pretty much.  For a megatroll like JF it's impossible not to troll, so he slips=P in troll bait every now and then, but by and large he respects comp.os.vms, and,L more importantly, he tries to hide his trolling activities from them so they* won't find out what a major netkook he is.  P 19.  Wow, sounds like he should be exposed so they will know what kind of psycho he is!  O Exactly.  Feel free to post all his trolls to comp.os.vms.  And while you're at6I it post them to can.internet.highspeed and alt.cellular.fido too.  And to O alt.usenet.kooks, a group for the likes of JF, and news.admin.net-abuse.usenet.E  4 20.  What else can I do?  Is there an abuse address?  H Yes, you should send complaints along with copies of his troll posts to:   abuse@sympatico.ca abuse@bellglobal.com abuse@istop.com=  P And feel free to distribute this FAQ freely.  Post it to newsgroups, email it toP people, you may host it at your own website, send it to newspapers and magazinesI that do Internet articles or anything to do with Montreal or Canada, etc.h     *** APPENDIX ***  P List of some of the many trolling aliases used by Mezei over the years.  This isK only a partial list, he has so many it's impossible to compile a full list.d   jfmezei@istop.coml jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com  jfmezei@videotron.ca jfmezei@vl.videotron.ca6 nospam.jfmezei@videotron.ca6 "jfmezei"@videotron.ca[nospam]   nobody <nobody@nobody.com> nobody <nobody@nobody.net> nobody <nobody@nobody.org> nobody <nobody@nobody.info>9 nobody <nobody@nobody.int> nobody <nobody@nothing.nil>0 nobody <nobody@null.dev> muklak <muklak@eskimo.net> Sheep skin <sheep@station.au>.# snowy squirrel <squirrel@nest.tree>0) Conspiracy Theory <conspiracy@theory.org>0& Lou Raccoon <L.Raccoon@wilderness.org>$ Flapping Labias <flabia@anatomy.org>% Throbbing vulva <t.vulva@anatomy.org>0 Twin Gonads <two@gonads.com>% Loose Scrotum <l.scrotum@anatomy.org>0" Raised Organ <R.Organ@anatomy.org>$ Popped Cherry <P.Cherry@anatomy.org>- Monica Lewinski <billclinton@westchester.com>0' Deep Fried Foreskin <dff@mcdonalds.com>0" Aroma of Smegma <aroma@chanel.org> Wet fart <w.Fart@smell.org>0' Pubic dandruff <P.dandruff@anatomy.org>0( Voluptuous Nipple <V.nipple@anatomy.org>& Inserted Finger <I.Finger@anatomy.org> Pubic Nair <shaved@anatomy.org>0' Flatulent Meatus <F.Meatus@anatomy.org>.% Lihk Mhygroin <L.MyGroin@anatomy.org>0 Pre Khum <P.Khum@anatomy.org>0! Phi Mosis <Phi.Mosis@anatomy.org>.# Bal Anatis <Bal.Anatis@anatomy.org>   Fren Ullum <F.Ullum@anatomy.org>$ Ivanna Getlaid <I.Getlaid@onani.org>& Ivanna Wankalot <I.Wankalot@onani.org>$ Ivanna Umpalot <Humpalot@drevil.com>* Wan Tnoneofit <W.Tnoneofit@weirdnames.org> Wan Itbad <W.Itbad@inneed.org>! Wan Towank <W.ToWank@anatomy.org>0 Wan Tolik <w.tolik@anatomy.org>.$ Testos Terone <t.terone@anatomy.org>! Upper Gonad <U.Gonad@anatomy.org>0! Right Gonad <R.Gonad@anatomy.org>0  Left Gonad <L.Gonad@anatomy.org>$ Tyson's Glands <Tyson.G@anatomy.org> Nose Hair <n.hair@anatomy.org>% Coronal Sulcus <C.Sulcus@anatomy.org>.% Corpus Cavernus <manhood@anatomy.org>0$ Armpit moisture <armpit@anatomy.org> Onani Room <onani@hotels.com>.& Arnie's Banana <weiner@terminator.com>( Raised eyebrows <r.eyebrows@anatomy.org>% Vas Deferens <V.deferens@anatomy.org>I% Naked Canuck <N.canuck@naturists.org>e& Arni's socks <Smelly.Socks@arnold.org>* Notable Exception <N.exception@untied.com>& Unpopped Cherry <U.Cherry@anatomy.org>' Tatooed Ovaries <T.Ovaries@anatomy.org> ' Pierced eyelid <p.eyelid@piercings.org>1( Limp Tomato <limp.tomato@vegetables.org>, Eggplant Earrings <e.earrings@piercings.org>. Banana Underpants <B.Underpants@hillfiger.org> Naval Lint <navel@lint.mil>3' Ingrown Toenail <i.toenail@anatomy.org>.% Empty Stomach <E.Stomach@anatomy.org>0$ Full Stomach <f.stomach@anatomy.org>" Smelly Cat <S.Cat@friends.nbc.com>& Torn Ligament <T.Ligament@anatomy.org># Art Tistic <A.Tistic@modern.museum>.( Furry Raccoon <F.Raccoon@wilderness.org>% Wet Racoon <W.Racoon@wildnerness.org> " Mad Racoon <M.Racoon@wildlife.org>% Lazy Racoon <L.Racoon@wilderness.org>=& Eaten Racoon <E.Raccoon@mcdonalds.com>' Happy Raccoon <H.Racoon@wilderness.org>b) Sleeping Racoon <S.Racoon@wilderness.org> ' Hungry Racoon <H.Racoon@wilderness.org> " Horny Raccoon <H.Racoon@fauna.org>( Smart Raccoon <S.Raccoon@wilderness.org>, George W Raccoon <GW.Raccoon@wilderness.org>+ Ronald McRaccoon <r.raccoon@wilderness.org> * Thirsty Raccoon <T.Raccoon@wilderness.org>( Johnny Raccoon <J.Racoon@wilderness.org>' Oshi Santo <O.Santo@nx01.starfleet.org>r* Oishi Chinko <O.Chinko@nx01.starfleet.org> T.Yellow <T.Yellow@nowhere.com>s Q <queue@continuum.net>  Borg Queen <1of1@borg.org>* Ronald Wilkerson <wilkersonr@sympatico.ca>) John Balterman <j.balterman@sympatico.ca>F  ; *DISTRIBUTE FREELY* *DISTRIBUTE FREELY* *DISTRIBUTE FREELY*    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 15:05:37 -0500 2 From: "Stanley F. Quayle" <squayle@insight.rr.com> Subject: Re: Leap year.L/ Message-ID: <403CB9C1.21582.36968BF4@localhost>   , On 25 Feb 2004 at 18:36, Leigh Bowden wrote:F > Are there any issues with the 2004 leap year. I've not heard of any.  A Check comp.risks about mid-March.  There are always several each D year.  Not on VMS, of course...=  
 --Stan Quayle= Quayle Consulting Inc.  
 ----------C Stanley F. Quayle, P.E. N8SQ  +1 614-868-1363  Fax: +1 614 868-1671=1 8572 North Spring Ct. NW, Pickerington, OH  43147e= Preferred address:  stan@stanq.com       http://www.stanq.comw   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Feb 2004 12:33:37 -0800E From: kirk.reindl@osioutsourcing.com (kirk.reindl@osioutsourcing.com)3* Subject: Load balancing in Open VMS V7.3-1< Message-ID: <e5bea15d.0402251233.bfb1405@posting.google.com>   Hello:  A I have a some general questions on how OpenVMS 7.3-1 handles loadi
 balancing.D I understand that VMS spreads the disks across fibre controllers andD that the load balancing is not dynamic as far as work load.  IE, theE disks get assigned to a card/channel at boot, and remain there unless:7 a failure happens or someone manually changes the path.7  E Currently I have a server that has all but one of its' disks assigned C to one controller. In my case PGA0.  I don't know why all the disksnF are going to PGA0.  I can see my PGB0 card at the OS level without any	 problems.a   This is what I'd like to know:  E 1.  Where does VMS make the config to "set" any disks to a particular:E channel?  I checked "mount_disks.com" but there are no set commands. u? When I do a show dev d /mount and look at the mounted disks, it5F appears to me that VMS is taking the first half of disks and assigningC on one channel and assigning the other half on another channel. (In > other words it doesn't appear to be assigning in a alternating fashion)  C 2.  If I manually attempt to assign a disk to a channel, let's say:V: set dev $1$dga355:/switch/path=pgb0        will I cause anF interruption/outage to that disk? I'm new to VMS and a little nervous.  C 3.  Can you give any explaination on why VMS wouldn't have balancedmE the disk on my last boot?  I'm looking for ways to investigate this. i  Can you direct me to a boot log?  ) Thanks for your comments and suggestions.h  - Below is some output that shows my situation:c   OSIJX2> show dev /multid> Device                  Device           Error         Current=  Name                   Status           Count  Paths    pathi6 $1$DGA16:     (OSIJX2)  Online               0   3/ 3  PGB0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A5A6 $1$DGA17:     (OSIJX2)  Online               0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA351:    (OSIJX2)  ShadowSetMember      0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA353:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA355:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA357:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA360:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA362:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA365:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA366:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA373:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA377:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA381:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA383:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA385:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA387:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A456 $1$DGA388:    (OSIJX2)  Mounted              0   3/ 3  PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A45 OSIJX2>K     OSIJX2> show dev fg0 /full  D Device FGA0:, device type KGPSA Fibre Channel, is online, shareable, errorU     logging is enabled.   F     Error count                    0    Operations completed                  0F     Owner process                 ""    Owner UIC                      [SYSTEM]=     Owner process ID        00000000    Dev Prot             P S:RWPL,O:RWPL,G,WuF     Reference count                0    Default buffer size                   0F     Current preferred CPU Id       2    Fastpath                              1#     Current Interrupt CPU Id      2/;     FC Port Name 1000-0000-C924-571D    FC Node Name       c 2000-0000-C924-571D   D Device FGB0:, device type KGPSA Fibre Channel, is online, shareable, errorm     logging is enabled.   F     Error count                    0    Operations completed                  0F     Owner process                 ""    Owner UIC                      [SYSTEM]=     Owner process ID        00000000    Dev Prot             h S:RWPL,O:RWPL,G,WaF     Reference count                0    Default buffer size                   0F     Current preferred CPU Id       0    Fastpath                              1#     Current Interrupt CPU Id      0g;     FC Port Name 1000-0000-C92A-68AF    FC Node Name       D 2000-0000-C92A-68AFo   OSIJX2>i OSIJX2> show dev dga16 /full  > Disk $1$DGA16: (OSIJX2), device type EMC SYMMETRIX, is online,
 file-orientedu?     device, shareable, device has multiple I/O paths, served to  cluster via MSCP%     Server, error logging is enabled.l  F     Error count                    0    Operations completed               2292F     Owner process                 ""    Owner UIC                      [SYSTEM];     Owner process ID        00000000    Dev Prot           h S:RWPL,O:RWPL,G:R,WhF     Reference count                0    Default buffer size                 512;     WWID   01000010:6006-0480-0001-8370-0521-4754-4B30-3130iE     Host name               "OSIJX2"    Host type, avail  AlphaServera	 ES40, yesmE     Alternate host name     "OSIJX1"    Alt. type, avail  AlphaServerO	 ES40, yesT$     Allocation class               1  $   I/O paths to device              37   Path PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A45 (OSIJX2), primary path.aF     Error count                    0    Operations completed                  07   Path PGB0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A5A (OSIJX2), current path. F     Error count                    0    Operations completed               2292   Path MSCP (OSIJX1).MF     Error count                    0    Operations completed                  0   OSIJX2>k  OSIJX2> show dev $1$DGA353 /full  ? Disk $1$DGA353: (OSIJX2), device type EMC SYMMETRIX, is online,M mounted, file-E     oriented device, shareable, device has multiple I/O paths, servede
 to cluster.     via MSCP Server, error logging is enabled.  F     Error count                    0    Operations completed           60653750F     Owner process                 ""    Owner UIC                      [SYSTEM];     Owner process ID        00000000    Dev Prot           u S:RWPL,O:RWPL,G:R,WhF     Reference count              107    Default buffer size                 512F     Current preferred CPU Id       2    Fastpath                              1;     WWID   01000010:6006-0480-0001-8370-0521-4441-5431-3631lF     Total blocks            35354880    Sectors per track                    64F     Total cylinders            36828    Tracks per cylinder                  15E     Host name               "OSIJX2"    Host type, avail  AlphaServer 	 ES40, yes E     Alternate host name     "OSIJX1"    Alt. type, avail  AlphaServerp	 ES40, yese$     Allocation class               1  F     Volume label               "TEL"    Relative volume number                0F     Cluster size                  18    Transaction count                   107F     Free blocks             25869996    Maximum files allowed            935694F     Extend quantity                5    Mount count                           2<     Mount status              System    Cache name           "_DSA100:XQPCACHE"F     Extent cache size             64    Maximum blocks in extent cache  2586999F     File ID cache size            64    Blocks in extent cache          1244538F     Quota cache size               0    Maximum buffers in FCP cache       42403     Volume owner UIC        [TELS,*]    Vol Prot     S:RWCD,O:RWCD,G:RWCD,W:RWCDi  B   Volume Status:  ODS-2, subject to mount verification, write-back cachingr       enabled.#   Volume is also mounted on OSIJX1.s  $   I/O paths to device              3E   Path PGA0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A45 (OSIJX2), primary path, current path. F     Error count                    0    Operations completed           60653750)   Path PGB0.5006-0482-BCC3-0A5A (OSIJX2).oF     Error count                    0    Operations completed                  0   Path MSCP (OSIJX1).-F     Error count                    0    Operations completed                  0   OSIJX2>u   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 23:14:25 GMTy/ From: brooks@cuebid.zko.dec.nospam (Rob Brooks) . Subject: Re: Load balancing in Open VMS V7.3-1- Message-ID: <RLIaaEcS3thE@cuebid.zko.dec.com>   G kirk.reindl@osioutsourcing.com (kirk.reindl@osioutsourcing.com) writes:  > C > I have a some general questions on how OpenVMS 7.3-1 handles loadt > balancing.F > I understand that VMS spreads the disks across fibre controllers andF > that the load balancing is not dynamic as far as work load.  IE, theG > disks get assigned to a card/channel at boot, and remain there unless 9 > a failure happens or someone manually changes the path.y  C 	Mostly correct, although we do make a __very lightweight__ attempt-E to spread the current paths of all the multipath devices at the point@C when the device is being configured, which is usually at boot time.t  G > 1.  Where does VMS make the config to "set" any disks to a particulariG > channel?  I checked "mount_disks.com" but there are no set commands. S   	That is your job :-)   A > When I do a show dev d /mount and look at the mounted disks, it H > appears to me that VMS is taking the first half of disks and assigningE > on one channel and assigning the other half on another channel. (Int@ > other words it doesn't appear to be assigning in a alternating
 > fashion)  E 	The following is a very brief description at the lightweight attemptwO at path balancing to which I alluded above.  When a device is being configured,tO we take a look at the count of devices whose paths are current on the available.J paths for the device in question.  We *try* to set the current path of theJ device in question to the path that has the fewest "current paths" on thatJ path.  We only switch the path if no I/O has gone to this device (which isD usually the case, since device configuration takes place long beforeA users have access to the system).  Due to point in the code path 2L where multipath devices are configured, we can't actually switch to the pathG that is currently being configured.  So, for a device is non-multipath,eF but is about to add a second path (and therefore, is about to become aM multipath device), we cannot switch to this 2nd path.  However, in your case,tJ you have a 3rd path (the MSCP served path), so at the time of the additionF of the 3rd path to your multipath devices, we would consider switchingJ the current path to the 2nd local path for that device).  Oh yeah, we onlyH consider local paths for this path balancing, since the performance of a1 local path is far, far better than a served path.   F Anyway, all the above can be defeated if the SYSGEN parameter MPDEV_D1D (undocumented, unsupported) has mask value of 2.  You can check this from DCL . . .  t% ! If it is not set, you'll see this  >1 $ write sys$output f$getsyi( "mpdev_d1" ) .and. 2t 0a ! If it's set, you'll see this1 $ write sys$output f$getsyi( "mpdev_d1" ) .and. 2d 2   H Unless someone has done something odd, it is likely that MPDEV_D1 is at  the default value of 0. 7                                                        lB It's not clear to me why your disks aren't being spread across the two available local paths.  E > 2.  If I manually attempt to assign a disk to a channel, let's say:a< > set dev $1$dga355:/switch/path=pgb0        will I cause anH > interruption/outage to that disk? I'm new to VMS and a little nervous.  @ 	The disk will go in and out of mount verification very quickly.E This will have an effect on the I/O throughput, but only for a coupledF of seconds.  Unless you are running an amazingly high I/O load, it is 0 not likely that any disturbance will be noticed.  E > 3.  Can you give any explaination on why VMS wouldn't have balancedgG > the disk on my last boot?  I'm looking for ways to investigate this. t" > Can you direct me to a boot log?  @ 	There is nothing output when we do make our lightweight attempt at path balancing.  F Please feel free to ask more questions; I was rather involved with theA development of the path balancing scheme, which was introduced onn OpenVMS Alpha V7.3-1.e   -- t  M Rob Brooks    VMS Engineering -- I/O Exec Group     brooks!cuebid.zko.dec.comh   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:55:16 -0500   From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>* Subject: Re: MAIL: How to delete folders ?6 Message-ID: <1040225184935.34750B-100000@Ives.egh.com>  $ On Wed, 25 Feb 2004, JF Mezei wrote:  6 > I spent time cleaning up my mailbox.  (VAX VMS 7.2 ) > O > Something about MAIL would make my X-server crash. And even though I may haveoH > pressed the "DELETE" key for say 20 messages (and each of those markedP > "deleted"), after the crash, when I would get back in, those message were backG > in, no sign of deletion. I had to close the mail drawer and empty the-K > wastebasket at regular intervals to ensure my work of deleting individulat; > emails was actually getting done (before the next crash).e > L > However, I ended up with 2 empty folders. One in lowercase letters, one in > uppercase letters. > K > In the decwindows interface, I could  delete the folder, it would tell meeO > there was 0 messages in them and ask me to confirm. The folder would disapearrL > from the MAIL drawer. Then, I close the drawer and re-open it, and low and* > behold, the delete folder reappears !!!! > J > So I went in character cell MAIL. The HELP there says that when the lastM > message is deleted from a folder, the folder is deleted. Yet  even though I 9 > have 2 empty folders, they remain, even in DIR/FOLDERS.  > N > Worse, I moved a message to one of those, and then deleted the message (fromP > the CC version of MAIL), hoping that MAIL , upon seing it was the last messageN > in the folder, would invoke the magic that erases a folder. Unfortunatly, my1 > hopes were dashed. The folders are still there.r > N > So, how does one go about deleting a folder in either DECW or CC versions of > MAIL ?  K You can't!  (Or at least, I never found a way.)  I had a similar situation,JE probably as a result of Pine bombing, or maybe a system crash while IoH was in MAIL, and had two folders with no messages that wouldn't go away.  C In addition to what you tried, I tried converting the MAIL file andm, compressing it, but that didn't help either.  C I ended up writing a little DEC BASIC program to delete the recordsnF (after I found them with DUMP or ANA/RMS/INTERACTIVE, I don't remember which.)c    . 	open '[.mail]mail.mai' for input as file 1, & 		organization indexed &# 		variable, recordtype any, map foor   	map (foo) string rec$ = 2048-   get_folder:- 	input "folder"; KV$ 	if kv$ = "" then0 	 exit program 1 	end ifr   loop:p 	when error in 	  Get #1, key #1 EQ KV$ 	  R% = recounta 	 uset 	  if err = 155 then 	    r% = 09 	   else
 	    r% = -1%@	 	  end ife	 	end whenr   	if r% = 0 theni 	 goto get_folder  	end ifF   	if r% = -1% theni' 	  print "unexpected error "; ert$(err)2 	  exit program 44 	end ifV   	print left(rec$, r%)c 	input "Delete"; D$e 	If d$ = "Y" thenl 	 delete #1x 	end if=
 	goto loop   	end         --   John Santost Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Feb 2004 11:47:34 -0800. From: al5vf03p02@sneakemail.com (William Webb)7 Subject: MONTAGAR.COM and WHITEICE.COM seem to be down.0= Message-ID: <d5ce4b06.0402251147.79f9fef7@posting.google.com>a  M I was about to send David an email but realized where his email address goes.a   :^)r  4 Anybody down there in Texas who can give him a ring?   TIAe     WWWebb1 first initial last name at email dot usps dot gov  ========================! William W. Webb- EMS Operations,   OpenVMS Systems Support % USPS DSSC Annex - 4730 Hargrove Road a( Raleigh, NC 27616-2874 919.325.7500x4186 * * * -o   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Feb 2004 17:04:24 -0800. From: fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso); Subject: Re: MONTAGAR.COM and WHITEICE.COM seem to be down.v= Message-ID: <f30679fb.0402251704.61c1365c@posting.google.com>s  s al5vf03p02@sneakemail.com (William Webb) wrote in message news:<d5ce4b06.0402251147.79f9fef7@posting.google.com>...rO > I was about to send David an email but realized where his email address goes.T >  > :^)v > 6 > Anybody down there in Texas who can give him a ring?  > I dont have anything against Montagar, but why not concentrate0 all the Hobbyst distribution under OpenVMS.org ?   Regards    FC       > TIAe >  >  > WWWebb3 > first initial last name at email dot usps dot gova > ========================# > William W. Webb- EMS Operations, : > OpenVMS Systems Support ' > USPS DSSC Annex - 4730 Hargrove Road u* > Raleigh, NC 27616-2874 919.325.7500x4186	 > * * * -c   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 02:59:00 GMTc+ From: "Bill Johnson" <res0xcil@verizon.net> ; Subject: Re: MONTAGAR.COM and WHITEICE.COM seem to be down. 6 Message-ID: <Uhd%b.7770$921.4243@nwrddc02.gnilink.net>  K I just checked it and montagar is working fine now as of this posting 21:00n CST on 25-feb-2004.r        ; "Fabio Cardoso" <fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br> wrote in message 7 news:f30679fb.0402251704.61c1365c@posting.google.com... ; > al5vf03p02@sneakemail.com (William Webb) wrote in messager9 news:<d5ce4b06.0402251147.79f9fef7@posting.google.com>...0K > > I was about to send David an email but realized where his email addressl goes.e > >u > > :^)a > > 8 > > Anybody down there in Texas who can give him a ring? >o@ > I dont have anything against Montagar, but why not concentrate2 > all the Hobbyst distribution under OpenVMS.org ? > 	 > Regardsf >n > FC >l >" >  > > TIAe > >a > > 
 > > WWWebb5 > > first initial last name at email dot usps dot gov  > > ========================$ > > William W. Webb- EMS Operations, > > OpenVMS Systems Support0( > > USPS DSSC Annex - 4730 Hargrove Road, > > Raleigh, NC 27616-2874 919.325.7500x4186 > > * * * -a   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Feb 2004 21:28:03 -0800) From: joseph_lamb@yahoo.com (Joseph Lamb)M Subject: ODBC drivers for MSSQLt< Message-ID: <912b238d.0402252128.f88bc82@posting.google.com>  A Is there a way to have a VMS box run a PERL script that queries ar WIN2k MSSQL server?s  / Can someone please point me to the information?i   Joseph   ------------------------------   Date: 25 Feb 2004 19:17:43 GMT1 From: JONESD@er6.eng.ohio-state.edu (David Jones)a0 Subject: Re: Passing a socket to another process: Message-ID: <c1iscn$sgp$1@charm.magnus.acs.ohio-state.edu>  1 In message <uC5%b.1087$In7.441@news.cpqcorp.net>, *   Greg Zymbaluk <greg@no.spam.com> writes:G >Now I'd like for Child to be able to send() and recv() on that socket,yD >but that's where I'm stuck. I tried using the channel number in theF >calls to send() and recv() but that doesn't work. I'm guessing that IH >need to create a new socket that uses that channel that I've created to5 >the network device, but I don't know how to do that.l  @ Use the function socket_fd() to make the socket file descriptor:  &    int fd = socket_fd ( vms_channel );      < David L. Jones               |      Phone:    (614) 292-6929- Ohio State University        |      Internet:iL 140 W. 19th St. Rm. 231a     |               jonesd@er6s1.eng.ohio-state.edu: Columbus, OH 43210           |               vman+@osu.edu  1 Disclaimer: I'm looking for marbles all day long.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:59:50 -0500h< From: "Peter Weaver" <WeaverConsultingServices@sympatico.ca>8 Subject: Re: printing characters with codes > 127 in DCL: Message-ID: <c1irb8$1jpai6$1@ID-141708.news.uni-berlin.de>  / Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote:h< > In article <c1ifhs$1ij0ia$1@ID-141708.news.uni-berlin.de>, "Peter9 > Weaver" <WeaverConsultingServices@sympatico.ca> writes:H >o# >> Do you have any VT510 terminals?5 > = > I have one, but it requires a different keyboard connector,r which I  > don't have at the moment.l  > http://www.cs.utk.edu/~shuford/terminal/bfe/index.html has the= BitFontEdit utility and a sample Russian alphabet that shoulda work on a VT320.   --   Peter Weaver Weaver Consulting Services Inc.  Canadian VAR for CHARON-VAXn www.weaverconsulting.cao   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:50:03 +0000 (UTC)e6 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)L Subject: Re: Problem with installing Security MUP on a VMS 7.3-1 workstation0 Message-ID: <newscache$oilnth$a1m$1@news.sil.at>  b In article <00A2DF56.CE01CB00.10@leva.leeds.ac.uk>, Ted Allwood <support@leva.leeds.ac.uk> writes:> >$ product install vms731_sys-v0400 /source=DKA400:[alphav731]' >%PCSI-E-S_INVNAM, invalid product nameeN >%PCSIUI-E-ABORT, operation terminated due to an unrecoverable error condition  ) This is wrong. Remove the version number.nO I always wondered why PCSI doesn't let one enter the explicit version number...h   >Try again with...8 >$ product install vms731_sys /source=DKA400:[alphav731]Q >%PCSI-E-PDFERR, error in processing product description file DKA400:[ALPHAV731]Du% >EC-AXPVMS-VMS731_SYS-V0400--4.PCSI;1cQ >   16       execute pre_undo "@pcsi$source:[sysupd]preundo.com" interactive uses  > [SYSUPD]PREUNDO.COM ;s- >%PCSI-E-PDFUDK, undefined keyword \pre_undo\l> >%PCSI-E-PROCTERM, processing terminated due to previous error# >%PCSI-E-S_OPFAIL, operation failedwN >%PCSIUI-E-ABORT, operation terminated due to an unrecoverable error condition >.) >Has anyone seem similar or could advise?n  N I've seen various errors with PCSI and some were caused by corrupt PCSI files.M DCX has (unlike UNZIP) the behaviour of unpacking incomplete downloaded files F into corrupt PCSI files without giving notice. Start with checking the# download process again (eg. MD5)...    -- b Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGERs% Network and OpenVMS system specialistw E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:03:48 -0500e From: norm.raphael@metso.comL Subject: Re: Problem with installing Security MUP on a VMS 7.3-1 workstationQ Message-ID: <OF83E1B43D.8AACBB7C-ON85256E45.006778C4-85256E45.0068AD1D@metso.com>s  A I show a later version.  Do you have all the PCSI ECO's in place?a   ===a  I OpenVMS V7.3-1  on node NODEA 25-FEB-2004 13:49:49.38  Uptime  4 03:45:44t  ELMX_SYSTEM->produc show utility: POLYCENTER Software Installation utility version: V7.3-3005     Product Configuration File (PCF) support level: 1o3     Product Description File (PDF) support level: 8 ,     Product Text File (PTF) support level: 2 ===t  G Ted Allwood <support@leva.leeds.ac.uk> wrote on 02/25/2004 01:36:54 PM:o  . > Can anyone offer some advice on this, please >a, > I'm attempting to install the security MUP% >    ECO NUMBER:     VMS731_SYS-V0400n >s > on an Alpha workstationh >c > $ Show sys/noproc E > OpenVMS V7.3-1  on node KIAXP1  25-FEB-2004 17:16:54.41  Uptime  88o 01:32:54 >  > $ product show utility< > POLYCENTER Software Installation utility version: V7.3-2007 >     Product Configuration File (PCF) support level: 1.5 >     Product Description File (PDF) support level: 7u. >     Product Text File (PTF) support level: 2 > ; > from CD: OVMSALPMUP3 (October 2003) on local drive DKA400. >h' > The installation guide on the CD saysn@ >     PRODUCT INSTALL VMS731_SYS-V0400 /SOURCE=[location of Kit] >l > So... ? > $ product install vms731_sys-v0400 /source=DKA400:[alphav731]l( > %PCSI-E-S_INVNAM, invalid product nameE > %PCSIUI-E-ABORT, operation terminated due to an unrecoverable errord	 conditiono >r > Try again with...n9 > $ product install vms731_sys /source=DKA400:[alphav731]aF > %PCSI-E-PDFERR, error in processing product description file DKA400: > [ALPHAV731]D& > EC-AXPVMS-VMS731_SYS-V0400--4.PCSI;1A >    16       execute pre_undo "@pcsi$source:[sysupd]preundo.com"c > interactive uses >  [SYSUPD]PREUNDO.COM ;. > %PCSI-E-PDFUDK, undefined keyword \pre_undo\? > %PCSI-E-PROCTERM, processing terminated due to previous erroro$ > %PCSI-E-S_OPFAIL, operation failedE > %PCSIUI-E-ABORT, operation terminated due to an unrecoverable error"	 conditionr >o* > Has anyone seem similar or could advise? >. > 	 > Thanks,n > Tedc >  > --G > Support@leva.leeds.ac.uk                                Tel:  0113 34e 32167e- > www.mech-eng.leeds.ac.uk/support/index.htmlcI > School of Mechanical Engineering,  University of Leeds,  Leeds  LS2 9JTc   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 14:10:19 -0500s From: norm.raphael@metso.comL Subject: Re: Problem with installing Security MUP on a VMS 7.3-1 workstationQ Message-ID: <OF83E1B43D.8AACBB7C-ON85256E45.006778C4-85256E45.006945DB@metso.com>    To add to my ealier message...  J Notice that there is a higher version of this ECO than you are installing.  K I use this command to specificy the version number (and generate a recoveryt set).e  < $ PROD INSTALL VMS731_SYS/PROD=DEC/BASE=AXPVMS/VER=V5.0/SAVE  A I show a later version.  Do you have all the PCSI ECO's in place?e   ===   I OpenVMS V7.3-1  on node NODEA 25-FEB-2004 13:49:49.38  Uptime  4 03:45:44e  ELMX_SYSTEM->produc show utility: POLYCENTER Software Installation utility version: V7.3-3005     Product Configuration File (PCF) support level: 1d3     Product Description File (PDF) support level: 8a,     Product Text File (PTF) support level: 2 ===r  G Ted Allwood <support@leva.leeds.ac.uk> wrote on 02/25/2004 01:36:54 PM:p  . > Can anyone offer some advice on this, please >e, > I'm attempting to install the security MUP% >    ECO NUMBER:     VMS731_SYS-V0400p >e > on an Alpha workstationr >n > $ Show sys/noproclE > OpenVMS V7.3-1  on node KIAXP1  25-FEB-2004 17:16:54.41  Uptime  88i 01:32:54 >r > $ product show utility< > POLYCENTER Software Installation utility version: V7.3-2007 >     Product Configuration File (PCF) support level: 1t5 >     Product Description File (PDF) support level: 7o. >     Product Text File (PTF) support level: 2 > ; > from CD: OVMSALPMUP3 (October 2003) on local drive DKA400s >o' > The installation guide on the CD sayst@ >     PRODUCT INSTALL VMS731_SYS-V0400 /SOURCE=[location of Kit] >u > So...n? > $ product install vms731_sys-v0400 /source=DKA400:[alphav731]7( > %PCSI-E-S_INVNAM, invalid product nameE > %PCSIUI-E-ABORT, operation terminated due to an unrecoverable errorr	 conditiona >i > Try again with...C9 > $ product install vms731_sys /source=DKA400:[alphav731]cF > %PCSI-E-PDFERR, error in processing product description file DKA400: > [ALPHAV731]D& > EC-AXPVMS-VMS731_SYS-V0400--4.PCSI;1A >    16       execute pre_undo "@pcsi$source:[sysupd]preundo.com"s > interactive uses >  [SYSUPD]PREUNDO.COM ;. > %PCSI-E-PDFUDK, undefined keyword \pre_undo\? > %PCSI-E-PROCTERM, processing terminated due to previous error $ > %PCSI-E-S_OPFAIL, operation failedE > %PCSIUI-E-ABORT, operation terminated due to an unrecoverable errora	 condition  >p* > Has anyone seem similar or could advise? >i >t	 > Thanks,t > Ted  >i > --G > Support@leva.leeds.ac.uk                                Tel:  0113 34w 32167s- > www.mech-eng.leeds.ac.uk/support/index.htmlaI > School of Mechanical Engineering,  University of Leeds,  Leeds  LS2 9JTo   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 13:40:54 -0600d( From: David Harrold <DHarrold@wi.rr.com>L Subject: Re: Problem with installing Security MUP on a VMS 7.3-1 workstation8 Message-ID: <6fup30p5ljn7ieiiohpl6569eflibmevd1@4ax.com>  M On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 18:50:03 +0000 (UTC), peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN'p LANGSTOEGER) wrote:l  c >In article <00A2DF56.CE01CB00.10@leva.leeds.ac.uk>, Ted Allwood <support@leva.leeds.ac.uk> writes:l? >>$ product install vms731_sys-v0400 /source=DKA400:[alphav731]e( >>%PCSI-E-S_INVNAM, invalid product nameO >>%PCSIUI-E-ABORT, operation terminated due to an unrecoverable error condition  >t* >This is wrong. Remove the version number.P >I always wondered why PCSI doesn't let one enter the explicit version number... >   
 It does...? $ PROD INSTALL VMS731_SYS/VERSION=4.0/SOURCE=DKA400:[ALPHAV731]e  K Also, I thought there was a problem with V4.0 of the VMS731_SYS ECO and youz= should look at not installing it and installing V5.0 instead.<     Hope that helps,   Dave Harrold    N ..............................................................................N David Harrold                              E-Mail: David.Harrold at aurora.orgJ Lead Software Systems Engineer              Phone:          (414) 647-6204J                                             Pager:          (414) 941-4634J Aurora Health Care                            Fax:          (414) 647-4999 3031 W. Montana Street Milwaukee, WI 53215m   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 26 Feb 2004 00:28:14 GMTr& From: jlsue <jefflsxxxz@sbcglobal.net>* Subject: Re: Sneak preview - SHOW FASTPATH8 Message-ID: <aefq30tlusrn7v1i8dc17vkds4u46svv9a@4ax.com>  / On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:48:27 +0200, "Guy Peleg"d% <guy.peleg@remove_this_hp.com> wrote:V   >l1 >                                IPL31> show fastrB >                                Fast Path preferred CPUs on IPL31 >[...]  K When I first read this, I didn't immediately realize that "IPL31>" was your  normal DCL command prompt.  ;-)a   Anyway, this looks way cool.   --- jlsl0 The preceding message was personal opinion only.6 I do not speak in any authorized capacity for anyone,  and certainly not my employer.- (get rid of the xxxz in my address to e-mail)    ------------------------------    Date: 25 Feb 2004 21:27:39 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)t* Subject: Re: Sneak preview - SHOW FASTPATH3 Message-ID: <VajU8ZqSFfxz@eisner.encompasserve.org>t  a In article <aefq30tlusrn7v1i8dc17vkds4u46svv9a@4ax.com>, jlsue <jefflsxxxz@sbcglobal.net> writes:o1 > On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 12:48:27 +0200, "Guy Peleg"u' > <guy.peleg@remove_this_hp.com> wrote:  >  >>2 >>                                IPL31> show fastC >>                                Fast Path preferred CPUs on IPL31. >>[...]  > M > When I first read this, I didn't immediately realize that "IPL31>" was yours! > normal DCL command prompt.  ;-)a  ' How about when he got to IPL32> ?   :-)o   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 19:18:06 +0000 (UTC)r, From: lewis@mazda.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis)0 Subject: Re: Strange SOR$ errors - advice sought. Message-ID: <c1isde$t6p$1@newslocal.mitre.org>   chris@townleyc.demon.co.uk (Chris Townley) writes in article <93b50805.0402251036.5c53d5cb@posting.google.com> dated 25 Feb 2004 10:36:36 -0800:C >I have an issue with SOR routines in a DEC Basic program, run as ao: >detached process using SYS$CREPRC. This is BASIC V1.3-000D >compiled/linked under OpenVMS V6.2 (Alpha). Images being run on the> >same version. High performance sort is not in use. I have now( >recreated on a standalone test machine. > F >There are many large data structures, so the working set is high, but/ >as far as I can see there are no quota issues.u >yF >After initialising 4 record sorts, and putting 5000 or 6000 in two of< >them (records sizes are 6 and 61) LIB$RELEASE_REC returns a >SORT-E-OPENOUT error.F >It is made more difficult as I cannot recreate running interactively, >nor in debug. > C >I have played with the obvious quotas and WSEXTENT, as well as thea" >number of work files to no avail. >0 >Any pointers anybody ?w  & For further investigation I'd suggest:  I 1.  Run with the EXQUOTA privilege to determine for sure it's not a quotac. issue.  It could be FILLM (open file limit).    K 2.  Look at your job and process logical name tables.  Is SOR$ depending on-H a logical name to determine where to put the work files or output file? L Detached processes have no job table at all, and unless you use LOGINOUT.EXEL as a front-end, no CLI to run SYLOGIN.COM or LOGIN.COM, so any logical namesF created there will not exist.  Try deassigning as much as you can fromA LNM$JOB and LNM$PROCESS, and see if it still works interactively.   0 --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.org> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Feb 2004 17:16:00 -0800# From: dooleys@snowy.net.au (dooley)f0 Subject: Re: Strange SOR$ errors - advice sought< Message-ID: <1ca82fc6.0402251716.813fe26@posting.google.com>  u chris@townleyc.demon.co.uk (Chris Townley) wrote in message news:<93b50805.0402251036.5c53d5cb@posting.google.com>... D > I have an issue with SOR routines in a DEC Basic program, run as a; > detached process using SYS$CREPRC. This is BASIC V1.3-000SE > compiled/linked under OpenVMS V6.2 (Alpha). Images being run on thek? > same version. High performance sort is not in use. I have nown) > recreated on a standalone test machine.e > G > There are many large data structures, so the working set is high, butp0 > as far as I can see there are no quota issues. > G > After initialising 4 record sorts, and putting 5000 or 6000 in two ofn= > them (records sizes are 6 and 61) LIB$RELEASE_REC returns a  > SORT-E-OPENOUT error. G > It is made more difficult as I cannot recreate running interactively,l > nor in debug.. > D > I have played with the obvious quotas and WSEXTENT, as well as the# > number of work files to no avail.  >  > Any pointers anybody ?9 I have a vague recollection of having to increase PLFLQUO,! for some users doing large sorts.i/ Does this process have any sortwork(n) defined?c= Otherwise the default location for work files is sys$scratch.t Phil   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Feb 2004 17:17:50 -08000 From: chris@townleyc.demon.co.uk (Chris Townley)0 Subject: Re: Strange SOR$ errors - advice sought= Message-ID: <93b50805.0402251717.13378c90@posting.google.com>'  b lewis@mazda.mitre.org (Keith A. Lewis) wrote in message news:<c1isde$t6p$1@newslocal.mitre.org>...   <snip>   > ( > For further investigation I'd suggest: > K > 1.  Run with the EXQUOTA privilege to determine for sure it's not a quotaa0 > issue.  It could be FILLM (open file limit).    A It is definately not fillm - I have been monitoring the process - 4 limit 200, used about 35 - from memory, at home now.  D I always thought EXQUOTA only applied to disk quotas - we have these	 disabled.    > M > 2.  Look at your job and process logical name tables.  Is SOR$ depending on J > a logical name to determine where to put the work files or output file? N > Detached processes have no job table at all, and unless you use LOGINOUT.EXEN > as a front-end, no CLI to run SYLOGIN.COM or LOGIN.COM, so any logical namesH > created there will not exist.  Try deassigning as much as you can fromC > LNM$JOB and LNM$PROCESS, and see if it still works interactively.6 > D I cant see any relevant logicals. We do have SCRATCH and SYS$SCRATCH@ logicals at a group level, which point to local directories withE plenty of space, and no priv issues. A colleague seems to think it is ? a quota issue, but I cant fir the lijke of me what it could be. B According to my monitoring, there is no problem with fillm, diolm,D biolm, bytlm, pagflquo or working set. I suppose it could be working& set related, but I cant quite see how.   -- 5 Chris2   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:55:54 +0000 (UTC)2* From: bleau@umtof.umd.edu (Lawrence Bleau)I Subject: Re: VMS upgrade changed program behavior, what could cause this?o0 Message-ID: <c1j24q$k4k$1@grapevine.wam.umd.edu>  q In article <j8ayatq4DzI$@eisner.encompasserve.org>, koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:e [snip problem statement] >0, >   Two things can happen to influence this: >d? >   1) Are you sure that the digit changing is within the range D >      capability of single precision?  (i.e. by 3rd to you mean 3rdL >      _significant_ digit from the left?)  If not, then it is psuedo-randomB >      data which might be influenced by a wide variety of things.  K I think that the digit that is different is always the last digit.  While IPF can't swear to this, I recall visually inspecting the differences, andH they were all very small, which to my mind would mean the last displayed digit.  F >   2) When you upgrade the OS you replace the Fortran RTL.  If you do@ >      anything which references the Fortran RTL, including trigG >      functions, exponents, and (most likely) Fortran I/O, you get therJ >      last version that you installed, in this case the one which shipped >      with the OS.   H This is a great idea, and one that I hit on overnight, too.  The programF does not reference any trig, etc., functions, though; the results thatK differ are calculated solely with + and / operations, then displayed with ae formatted write.  F >   You do not have to rebuild the program to get the latest RTL sinceF >   it's loaded at runtime (therefor Run Time Library), not at compile >   or link time.0  I Yes, I realize that now.  (Very subtle, and I realize it's a feature, but2I the scientists here don't care too much about simple numerical algorithmsXK suddenly giving different answers!  They'd prefer not having that feature.)p  I >   The most likely explanation is a Fortran RTL change in the formatting A >   routines.  The version which shipped with the new OS may have K >   improvements, or it may have replaced an improved version which shipped J >   with the Fortran compiler (the RTL does ship with VMS, but updates may >   ship with the compiler).  I That's a thought.  I could have upgraded the Fortran compiler in the long H past, but before HOUR_AVERAGE was linked, and this recent version of VMSH could have reverted formatting behavior to the one that existed prior to the current compiler version.X  F To test this, I copied HOUR_AVERAGE.EXE to another system that is alsoJ running V7.2 of Fortran but is still running VMS 7.1-2.  This way it wouldI use the RTL on the older system.  I also copied over the input data file. K When I ran HOUR_AVERAGE, it produced results identical to the Dec 18 run onI the original system.  F Does this clinch it?  Did VMS whack my old RTL on the head and give me something "improved"?I  G >   The VMS and Fortran Release Notes for what you have should describe F >   any improvements to the Fortran RTL, so looking at those will help5 >   you decide which one you really want to run with.   G I read those notes copiously before I upgraded to 7.3-1.  I saw nothinghG about Fortran RTLs being replaced and why.  Can anyone find anything on F that, or recall anything along those lines?  Since I upgraded from VMSD 7.1-2, it could be inthe 7.2, 7.2-x, or 7.3 release notes as well, I imagine.  D To assist in this, can you give me the name of the RTL that would beI responsible for formatting output strings?  The four files I located thatfE might have something to do with this, with their creation dates, are:a  7 DEC$FORRTL.EXE;1                18-JUL-2002 19:48:46.57:7 FOR$DEC$FORRTL.EXE;1            20-APR-1999 16:39:16.18s7 FORRTL2_TV.EXE;1                18-JUL-2002 19:53:00.88 7 FORRTL_D56_TV.EXE;1             18-JUL-2002 19:48:31.25r  G I also just looked at the file SYS$HELP:FORRTL.RELEASE_NOTES, and foundt this:a  5         1.6 Changes and Problems Corrected in V7.0-1:  ...IF               o  List-directed & G format now correctly format rounded0                  values during output conversion  < Does this mean values rounded (as with NINT) before writing?G Or the rounding that naturally occurs when using, say, F and G formats?   H And why didn't I find anything about it in the VMS 7.3-1 release notes?  That's what really bugs me.   I Anyway, I think the next step from here is to restore the older RTL file, D once I learn which one I should restore, or all of them.  That won'tG completely solve the problem, though, because after this the boss would I never trust another VMS or Fortran upgrade, not without a good reason why8" the behavior was changed.  Thanks.   Lawrence Bleau University of Maryland" Physics Dept., Space Physics Group 301-405-6223 bleau@umtof.umd.eduC   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2004 23:16:16 +0000 - From: John Laird <nospam@laird-towers.org.uk>iI Subject: Re: VMS upgrade changed program behavior, what could cause this?P8 Message-ID: <miaq309io3pun7u8g41u3rto2td1guirlk@4ax.com>  G On Wed, 25 Feb 2004 20:55:54 +0000 (UTC), bleau@umtof.umd.edu (Lawrence 
 Bleau) wrote:a  H >I also just looked at the file SYS$HELP:FORRTL.RELEASE_NOTES, and found >this: >o6 >        1.6 Changes and Problems Corrected in V7.0-1: >...G >              o  List-directed & G format now correctly format rounded 1 >                 values during output conversion  >e= >Does this mean values rounded (as with NINT) before writing?oH >Or the rounding that naturally occurs when using, say, F and G formats?  L Only a few binary values can be expressed exactly when formatted for output.K Most will need to be rounded.  It sounds like there was a bug in one of then9 format options (my guess would be list-directed, or "*").a  I >And why didn't I find anything about it in the VMS 7.3-1 release notes? a >That's what really bugs me.  L Language support and o/s versions are loosely connected.  One expects to getI up-to-date rtls with new VMS releases.  However, it is not clear how muchy documentation you might expect.d  J >Anyway, I think the next step from here is to restore the older RTL file,E >once I learn which one I should restore, or all of them.  That won'twH >completely solve the problem, though, because after this the boss wouldJ >never trust another VMS or Fortran upgrade, not without a good reason why# >the behavior was changed.  Thanks.a  - Your boss would prefer bugs not to be fixed ?o  H [I am gently poking fun.  But more seriously, you should not place greatB faith in the last decimal point.  It is perfectly conceivable thatL differences will appear using identical input on different platforms, or theE compiler may optimise your code differently between releases yieldingiL different answers, or if you re-ordered your input data that might change itJ too.  If you need significance in the 6th or 7th digit, then you shouldn't5 be using 4-byte floats.  Switch to double precision.]a   --  4 I bought some batteries, but they weren't included.    Mail john rather than nospam...h   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2004.112 ************************