1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 03 Jun 2004	Volume 2004 : Issue 307       Contents: backup of empty directories!  Re: backup of empty directories!  Re: backup of empty directories!  Re: backup of empty directories! Basestar Classic4 british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem"8 Re: british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem"8 Re: british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem"8 Re: british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem"8 Re: british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem"8 Re: british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem"8 Re: british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem" Re: Cluster disk mount problem Re: Cluster disk mount problem Re: datatrieve= Re: DCL enhancement - REQUEST/REPLY - how to capture a value. = Re: DCL enhancement - REQUEST/REPLY - how to capture a value.  Re: FOCUS help7 Re: HP developer resources for porting from unix to VMS 7 Re: HP developer resources for porting from unix to VMS # Re: Is my Itanic showing....at all? I Re: Is VAX/VMS V1.0/V2.0 available for download in SIMH .TAP format ? ? ? H Re: Is VAX/VMS V1.0/V2.0 available for download in SIMH .TAP format ? ?? Re: Machine language?  Not adding up? Re: Not adding up?, Quadrics adds lower-end supercomputer switch< Searching for VAX 66XX Console Commands and hardware manuals- Re: Solaris command output in a VMS symbol...  Re: Storing system files in CMS  Re: Storing system files in CMS  Re: T4 and friends  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------   Date: 3 Jun 2004 05:19:38 -0700 ! From: domen.setar@izum.si (domen) % Subject: backup of empty directories! = Message-ID: <d83d686b.0406030419.142e8f54@posting.google.com>   
 Hi admins!  F I want to make a backup of a directory tree with all files in it, whatD is not a problem. But I want to exclude all empty directories in the tree. How to do that? Any idea?   
 Thank you!   Domen etar    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 09:31:38 -0500 ( From: brandon@dalsemi.com (John Brandon)) Subject: Re: backup of empty directories! 1 Message-ID: <04060309313890@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>    domen.setar@izum.si writes:  > Hi admins!H > I want to make a backup of a directory tree with all files in it, whatF > is not a problem. But I want to exclude all empty directories in the! > tree. How to do that? Any idea?  > Thank you! > Domen    $ BACKUP /EXCLU=(*.DIR) ...   I However BACKUP will back them up anyway... I hear it is a feature of VMS.     ; Have you tried to set the directory structures to NOBACKUP?    $ SET FILE /NOBACKUP *.DIR   $ BACKUP ...  8 I have not done this but would be curious if it works...       J*o*h*n B*r*a*n*d*o*n  VMS Systems Administrator * firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 07:56:06 -0700 + From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com> ) Subject: Re: backup of empty directories! % Message-ID: <40BF3C06.20408@MMaz.com>    John Brandon wrote:    >domen.setar@izum.si writes: >    >  >>Hi admins!H >>I want to make a backup of a directory tree with all files in it, whatF >>is not a problem. But I want to exclude all empty directories in the! >>tree. How to do that? Any idea?  >>Thank you! >>Domen  >>     >> >  >$ BACKUP /EXCLU=(*.DIR) ... > J >However BACKUP will back them up anyway... I hear it is a feature of VMS. >  > < >Have you tried to set the directory structures to NOBACKUP? >  >$ SET FILE /NOBACKUP *.DIR 
 >$ BACKUP ...  > 9 >I have not done this but would be curious if it works...  >  >    > F I would really test that closely because on the surface, I would fear F that the NOBACKUP would do what it normal did, backup the file header E but not the contents leaving your directory structure and legitimate   file contents in limbo...    Barry    >  >J*o*h*n B*r*a*n*d*o*n >VMS Systems Administrator+ >firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com  >  >  >    >    --    > Barry Treahy, Jr                       E-mail: Treahy@MMaz.com> Midwest Microwave                          Phone: 480/314-1320> Vice President & CIO                         FAX: 480/661-7028                            ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 17:00:36 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) ) Subject: Re: backup of empty directories! 1 Message-ID: <UOIvc.2879$le2.466@news.cpqcorp.net>   a In article <d83d686b.0406030419.142e8f54@posting.google.com>, domen.setar@izum.si (domen) writes: G :I want to make a backup of a directory tree with all files in it, what E :is not a problem. But I want to exclude all empty directories in the   :tree. How to do that? Any idea?     Some background, please?  E   OpenVMS BACKUP does not provide such a mechanism, short of entering D   a selection parameter list or a selection qualifier that omits theE   empty directories based on filename or creation date or an explicit    /EXCLUDE list or...   E   I would perform the BACKUP, then delete the directories.  Or rename E   the empty directories, perform a BACKUP/EXCLUDE=*.EMPTY, and rename D   them back.  Or perform the backup, and use /FILES_SELECTED to omitE   the empty directories during the restoration.  Or as was mentioned, G   mark the empty directories /NOBACKUP or with a specific (eg: ancient) #   date (and use /SINCE, obviously).   C   I can imagine that any implementation of BACKUP/SELECT would be a @   moderately-sized engineering undertaking, both in terms of the!   implementation and the testing.   E   If there is a requirement for the implementation of a /SELECT-style C   qualifier akin to that of DIRECTORY, then you'll want to get into D   direct contact with the support center.  (This is the first time I1   can recall such a BACKUP/SELECT request, FWIW.)     N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 07:37:12 -0700# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>  Subject: Basestar Classic 9 Message-ID: <NDEMLKKEBOIFBMJLCECIKELODFAA.tom@kednos.com>   = Anyone out there using Basestar Classic or aware of companies " that are on OpenVMS 7.3 and later? --- & Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.: Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).? Version: 6.0.680 / Virus Database: 442 - Release Date: 5/9/2004    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 13:04:21 +0200 " From: labadie <labadie_g@decus.fr>= Subject: british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem" 2 Message-ID: <c9n130$u82$1@news-reader4.wanadoo.fr>   Hello   I I heared this morning at the radio that all british airports were closed   because of a computer problem.  I If somebody has more information than "a technical problem has occured",   I will be happy to read it :-)  G Is it an operating system problem, a problem with an important program   used, something else ?   Regards    Gerard   ------------------------------  * Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 11:57:07 +0000 (UTC) From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.ukA Subject: Re: british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem" ) Message-ID: <c9n3mj$ds7$1@news.mdx.ac.uk>   W In article <c9n130$u82$1@news-reader4.wanadoo.fr>, labadie <labadie_g@decus.fr> writes:  >Hello > J >I heared this morning at the radio that all british airports were closed  >because of a computer problem.  > J >If somebody has more information than "a technical problem has occured",  >I will be happy to read it :-)  > H >Is it an operating system problem, a problem with an important program  >used, something else ?  >  According to the BBC    J "Nat's Flight Data Processing System failed at around 0600BST for an hour,' after overnight testing of an upgrade."   N No details though of exactly what was being upgraded - hardware, application , OS ?   See   ) http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3772663.stm     
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University     >Regards >  >Gerard    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 14:14:46 +0200 " From: labadie <labadie_g@decus.fr>A Subject: Re: british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem" 2 Message-ID: <c9n572$70m$1@news-reader3.wanadoo.fr>  " david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk a crit : >  > According to the BBC   > L > "Nat's Flight Data Processing System failed at around 0600BST for an hour,) > after overnight testing of an upgrade."  > P > No details though of exactly what was being upgraded - hardware, application , > OS ? >  > See  > + > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3772663.stm  >    Thanks !   on your link, I read --------F Tory leader Michael Howard described the air traffic problems as "yet , another example of government incompetence".  A But Transport Secretary Alistair Darling pointed to "decades" of  D underinvestment in transport by successive governments and insisted : Britain's system compared favourably with other countries. --------C while I do not know Michael Howard or Alistair Darling, I am a bit  
 surprised :-)    Regards    Gerard   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 15:05:31 +0200 * From: Paul Sture <nospam@sture.homeip.net>A Subject: Re: british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem" * Message-ID: <2i8m0tFkc589U1@uni-berlin.de>   labadie wrote:$ > david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk a crit : >  >> >> According to the BBC H >> "Nat's Flight Data Processing System failed at around 0600BST for an  >> hour,* >> after overnight testing of an upgrade." >>D >> No details though of exactly what was being upgraded - hardware,  >> application , >> OS ?  >> >> See >>, >> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3772663.stm >> > 
 > Thanks ! >  > on your link, I read
 > --------H > Tory leader Michael Howard described the air traffic problems as "yet . > another example of government incompetence". > C > But Transport Secretary Alistair Darling pointed to "decades" of  F > underinvestment in transport by successive governments and insisted < > Britain's system compared favourably with other countries.
 > --------E > while I do not know Michael Howard or Alistair Darling, I am a bit   > surprised :-)  >   F It's just politicians bashing each other. Howard is the leader of the C Tories, the opposition party; Darling is blaming the previous Tory  G government, which had a stretch of 18 years, presumably the reason for   the quotes around "decades" :-)    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 15:15:23 +0200 * From: Paul Sture <nospam@sture.homeip.net>A Subject: Re: british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem" * Message-ID: <2i8mjcFkd74tU1@uni-berlin.de>   david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote: Y > In article <c9n130$u82$1@news-reader4.wanadoo.fr>, labadie <labadie_g@decus.fr> writes:  >  >>Hello  >>K >>I heared this morning at the radio that all british airports were closed    >>because of a computer problem. >>K >>If somebody has more information than "a technical problem has occured",    >>I will be happy to read it :-) >>I >>Is it an operating system problem, a problem with an important program   >>used, something else ? >> >  > According to the BBC   > L > "Nat's Flight Data Processing System failed at around 0600BST for an hour,) > after overnight testing of an upgrade."  > P > No details though of exactly what was being upgraded - hardware, application , > OS ? >  > See  > + > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3772663.stm  >   G "The West Drayton control centre is now fully operational and National  H Air Traffic Services says it is investigating the cause of the problem."  : Is the replacement system at Swanwick not operational yet?  ) http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2589247.stm   ! dated Thursday, 19 December, 2002   I "Swanwick opened in January at the cost of 623m, to replace a centre in   West Drayton, near Heathrow.  G It was supposed to enable controllers to look after more planes - thus    in effect expanding UK airspace.  D But according to Computer Weekly editor Karl Schneider that has not 
 happened."  E And it looks as though it still has not replaced West Drayton over 2   years after it opened.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 14:57:46 +0100 * From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@[127.0.0.1]>A Subject: Re: british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem" ' Message-ID: <c9nase$9vn$1@lore.csc.com>    labadie wrote: >  > on your link, I read
 > --------G > Tory leader Michael Howard described the air traffic problems as "yet . > another example of government incompetence". > B > But Transport Secretary Alistair Darling pointed to "decades" ofE > underinvestment in transport by successive governments and insisted < > Britain's system compared favourably with other countries.
 > --------D > while I do not know Michael Howard or Alistair Darling, I am a bit > surprised :-)   C You also need to bear in mind that local and European elections are ? taking place in the next few days, and more or less anything is H opposition bashing fodder. It's a fact of life virtually on par with our) favourite operating system's reliability.    --  ? Regards, Nic Clews a.k.a. Mr. CP Charges, CSC Computer Sciences  nclews at csc dot com    ------------------------------  * Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 14:40:52 +0000 (UTC) From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.ukA Subject: Re: british airports "freezed" due to "computer problem" ) Message-ID: <c9nd9k$h2p$1@news.mdx.ac.uk>   W In article <c9n572$70m$1@news-reader3.wanadoo.fr>, labadie <labadie_g@decus.fr> writes: # >david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk a crit :  >>   >> According to the BBC  >>  M >> "Nat's Flight Data Processing System failed at around 0600BST for an hour, * >> after overnight testing of an upgrade." >>  Q >> No details though of exactly what was being upgraded - hardware, application ,  >> OS ?  >>   >> See >>  , >> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/3772663.stm >>   > 	 >Thanks !  >  >on your link, I read 	 >-------- G >Tory leader Michael Howard described the air traffic problems as "yet  - >another example of government incompetence".  > B >But Transport Secretary Alistair Darling pointed to "decades" of E >underinvestment in transport by successive governments and insisted  ; >Britain's system compared favourably with other countries. 	 >-------- D >while I do not know Michael Howard or Alistair Darling, I am a bit  >surprised :-) >   I We have Local elections, London Mayoral elections and European elections  E coming up hence the parties will attempt to use anything as political  ammunition.   L Michael Howard was a senior member of the government under Margaret Thatcher who came to power in 1979.P The Tories were then in power for 18 years until Tony Blair's labour victory in  1997.   M During their time in office the Tories oversaw a great deal of privitisation  H including that of the railways which has turned out to have been a major	 disaster. G However the part privitisation of NATS (National air traffic Services)  - was carried out by the labour administration.   J The problems today seem to have been with the old computer systems at West9 Drayton rather than the new computer systems at Swanwick. M The new systems at Swanwick were massively delayed - they were originally due C for delivery in 1996 - and have suffered from a number of problems.     
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University     >Regards >  >Gerard    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 05:31:55 +0800 , From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>' Subject: Re: Cluster disk mount problem - Message-ID: <87d64hwss4.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   + Alfred Falk <falk@arc.REMOVE.ab.ca> writes:   F > Everything seems okay now, but still the rebuild time I was seeing -5 > measured in HOURS - suggests something wrong to me.   > That sugests your network is having, or had, problems. Time to	 check it.    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 15:06:19 GMT ) From: Alfred Falk <falk@arc.REMOVE.ab.ca> ' Subject: Re: Cluster disk mount problem 9 Message-ID: <Xns94FD5CB1F5EF6falkarcabca@198.161.157.145>   0 Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> wrote in % news:87d64hwss4.fsf@prep.synonet.com:   - > Alfred Falk <falk@arc.REMOVE.ab.ca> writes:  > G >> Everything seems okay now, but still the rebuild time I was seeing - 6 >> measured in HOURS - suggests something wrong to me. > @ > That sugests your network is having, or had, problems. Time to > check it.   B What would we be looking for?  (Network manager thinks it's okay.)   --  @ ----------------------------------------------------------------A   A L B E R T A         Alfred Falk               falk@arc.ab.ca  @ R E S E A R C H         Information Systems Dept   (780)450-5185+   C O U N C I L         250 Karl Clark Road 1                         Edmonton, Alberta, Canada  http://www.arc.ab.ca/   T6N 1E4   http://www.arc.ab.ca/staff/falk/   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 11:34:17 +0200 * From: Paul Sture <nospam@sture.homeip.net> Subject: Re: datatrieve * Message-ID: <2i89kqFk33hbU1@uni-berlin.de>   Michael Unger wrote:* > On 2004-05-30 21:33, "Paul Sture" wrote: >  >  >>[...]  >>I >>Oh, LOL Jan-Erik. Not only was it heavily overlayed in RSX, but, well,  B >>this is the best description I have come across about it on VMS. >>C >>=================================================================  >>7 >>             A Day in the Life of the Image Activator  >>; >>         as recounted to Stanley Rabinowitz on 7-Jan-1985  >> >>[...]  >  >   > It's available on the web too: > T > <http://h50146.www5.hp.com/products/software/oe/openvms/fanclub/lite/imageact.txt> >   E And before anyone else tries to see what else is there, going up the  G tree to http://h50146.www5.hp.com/products/software/oe/openvms/fanclub/ ) it's all in what I assume to be Japanese.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 11:15:39 +0200 * From: Paul Sture <nospam@sture.homeip.net>F Subject: Re: DCL enhancement - REQUEST/REPLY - how to capture a value.* Message-ID: <2i88htFk45gpU1@uni-berlin.de>   David J Dachtera wrote:  > Hoff Hoffman wrote:  > k >>In article <d28306e.0406021208.7d6883e8@posting.google.com>, denny.rich@swagelok.com (Denny Rich) writes: J >>:...issuing requests to the tape operator, and in some cases, solicitingE >>:a reply value.  In particular, when SLS wants to know if it should H >>:"redo" a backup that has already run today, it offers "REDO, SKIP, or  >>:QUIT" as some of the options. >>C >>  BACKUP has offered similar operator-provided input capabilities  >>  for eons, as well. >  > G > True, but REQUEST/REPLY=SYMBOL=symbol_name seems to be yet another of 4 > those oh-so-useful features that Digital forgot... >  > I >>:This is an emminently useful tool, but I can't find any way to do this  >>:that is documented. >>F >>  From DCL, there is no mechanism for this -- REQUEST/REPLY does notF >>  serve up the response via a DCL symbol, for instance.  From withinG >>  an application, this mechanism is fully documented, see the $sndopr - >>  system service documentation for details.  >  > E > I seem to recall playing with that at one time some years ago using G > output redirection, possibly using SPAWN/OUTPUT to enforce my will on  > the recalcitrant system. > C > That would use services which are entirely supported, even if the  > operation itself is not. >  > G >>:If there is not now a way to do this, and if a DCL wizard found some A >>:free time on his/her hands, it would be a great thing to have.  >>I >>  Consider coding up a trivial application image that calls $sndopr and F >>  lib$set_symbol, and a few other services.  You have what you want,) >>  and using only documented interfaces.  >  > 8 > Here's what VERB had to say about the REQUEST command: >  > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ vers ) > Alpha V7.2-2   (AlphaStation 200 4/233) ! > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ verb request  > define verb REQUEST  >    image REQUEST  >    parameter P1, prompt="Text" >    qualifier REPLY >    qualifier TO  >       value (required,list)  >  > I suppose you could try to:  >  > $ DEFINE REQUEST SLS$REQUEST > $ REQUEST/REPLY "Yes?" > H > ...and see what happens. I don't have access to the SLS images here at& > home, so I can't hack that just now. > H > Actually I'm guessing that SLS$REQUEST may have been written speciallyI > to allow the output stream to be a mailbox so the results could be read @ > from another process as input to another SLS program. Dunno... > 2 > PIPE is kinda broken in V7.2-2, but this worked: > E > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ pipe req/reply "yes?" | (read sys$pipe p9 ; read  > sys$pipe p9 ) > ; write sys$output p9 ; show symbol p9)  > %OPCOM-S-OPREPLY,  > NO@ > 21:58:54.46, request 4 was completed by operator _DJAS01$OPA0: > I >   P9 = "%OPCOM-S-OPREPLY, ..NO..21:58:54.46, request 4 was completed by 
 > operator >  _DJAS01$OPA0:." > C > Note that the seemingly three line output is returned in a single / > string. The response could be isolated using:  >  > $ cr[0,8]=13 > $ lf[0,8]=10W > $ pipe req/reply "yes?" | (read sys$pipe p9 ; read sys$pipe p9 ; define/job resp &p9) = > $ resp = F$elem( 0, cr, f$elem( 1, lf, f$trnlnm( resp ) ) )  > " Correction - last line should read  = $ resp = F$elem( 0, cr, f$elem( 1, lf, f$trnlnm( "resp" ) ) ) 8                                                   ^    ^   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 10:36:09 +0100 * From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@[127.0.0.1]>F Subject: Re: DCL enhancement - REQUEST/REPLY - how to capture a value.' Message-ID: <c9mrhs$4vm$1@lore.csc.com>    Denny Rich wrote:  > D > OVMS Alpha, V7.3-1: I have observed the SLS backup manager (V2.9F)H > issuing requests to the tape operator, and in some cases, soliciting aB > reply value.  In particular, when SLS wants to know if it shouldG > "redo" a backup that has already run today, it offers "REDO, SKIP, or  > QUIT" as some of the options.   D OK. I've read Hoff's and David's replies but when I had a "misspent" youth...  H Long ago, I used to write the mother of all DCL procedures, well several of them.  H One in particular, I too wished to "converse" via a REQUEST/REPLY to theF operator, and get the value back to the DCL procedure (which of course- is running in BATCH) to control program flow.   D Now, of course you could do all the $SNDOPR hoity toity stuff, but ID still maintain, when you've got DCL, apart from speed, you'd have toF come up with a damn good argument to write a program in anything else.+ <Ducks while donning flameproof underwear>.   H If you reassign SYS$OUTPUT and SYS$INPUT, you can "capture" the OPERATOR> response to requests to a file, which, when satisfied, you can  interrogate from your batch job.  D Here follows some DCL, use at your own risk, no warranty implied, ifG there is a virus in this I'll show my a**e on the car park and pose for C photos, if you find it useful you may use it free of charge but you E cannot resell it for another other purpose (unless you give me a huge ( cut), may explode if put in a bonfire...     <--CUT HERE--> $ 	 $DEFAULT:  $ TYPE="INCREMENTAL", $ DISK=F$EXTRACT(1,5,F$LOGICAL("DISK$USER"))C $ request_message = "Default INCREMENTAL backup of ''DISK' - Please  confirm" $ keyword_list = "YES,NO,QUIT" $ keyword_list = ""  $ keyword_check = "FALSE"  $ expected_reply_1 = "YES" $ expected_reply_2 = "NO"  $ expected_reply_3 = "QUIT"  $  $  $! $!J $!************************************************************************J $!************************************************************************H $!*                                                                      *  $ write sys$output f$time() H $!*                                                                      * H $!* m a k i n g   O P E R A T O R   r e q u e s t . . .                  * H $!*                                                                      *  $ write sys$output request_text H $!*                                                                      * J $!************************************************************************J $!************************************************************************ $! $request_operator:C $!                    message sent in               REQUEST_MESSAGE > $!                    returned message in           REPLY_TEXT? $!                    returned keyword in           REPLY_GIVEN D $!                    one expected reply in         EXPECTED_REPLY_1D $!                    second expected reply in      EXPECTED_REPLY_2D $!                    third expected reply in       EXPECTED_REPLY_3@ $!                    valid response list in        KEYWORD_LISTA $!                    display keywords boolean in   KEYWORD_CHECK  $! $! $! $ / $ if .not. keyword_check then goto make_request G $ if keyword_list .eqs. "" then keyword_list = "''expected_reply_1'," +  - G                                                "''expected_reply_2'," +  - D                                                "''expected_reply_3'" $ A $ request/noreply "Valid operator responses are: ''KEYWORD_LIST'"  $  $  $make_request:* $ set message/facility/severity/ident/text! $ define sys$output sysoutput.txt $ $ request/reply "''request_message'" $ deassign sys$output  $  $  $read_operator:  $ open/read reply sysoutput.txt  $  $read_reply: $ reply_text = ""   $ read/error=endofmsg reply textC $ if f$locate("OPCOM-S-OPREPLY",text) .eq. f$length(text) then goto 
 read_reply$ $ reply_text = f$edit(text,"UPCASE")* $ write sys$output "Reply text is ''text'" $  $ 
 $endofmsg:
 $ close reply ' $ delete/noconfirm/nolog sysoutput.txt; - $ if reply_text .eqs. "" then goto reply_null  $ reply_given = " G $ if f$locate(expected_reply_1,reply_text) .nes. f$length(reply_text) - & 			then reply_given = expected_reply_1 $ G $ if f$locate(expected_reply_2,reply_text) .nes. f$length(reply_text) - 9      .and. reply_given .nes. "" then goto reply_ambiguous G $ if f$locate(expected_reply_2,reply_text) .nes. f$length(reply_text) - & 			then reply_given = expected_reply_2 $ G $ if f$locate(expected_reply_3,reply_text) .nes. f$length(reply_text) - 9      .and. reply_given .nes. "" then goto reply_ambiguous G $ if f$locate(expected_reply_3,reply_text) .nes. f$length(reply_text) - & 			then reply_given = expected_reply_30 $ if reply_given .nes. "" then goto request_done $  $ keyword_check = "TRUE"< $ request/noreply "Required keyword not specified in reply." $ goto request_operator  $  $reply_ambiguous:  $ keyword_check = "TRUE"F $ request/noreply "Reply contained more than one keyword - respecify." $ goto request_operator  $  $reply_null: $ keyword_check = "TRUE"7 $ request/noreply "Reply requires keyword - respecify."  $ goto request_operator  $  $  $request_done: $! $!J $!************************************************************************J $!************************************************************************H $!*                                                                      *  $ write sys$output f$time() H $!*                                                                      * H $!* c o m p l e t e d   O P E R A T O R   r e q u e s t . . .            * H $!*                                                                      *  $ write sys$output reply_text H $!*                                                                      * J $!************************************************************************J $!************************************************************************ $! $! <--CUT HERE-->  H Well no prizes for guessing what I used to use it for. Oh, I reckon it'sE good from VMS 4 and above. Also tested on IA64 Industry Standard VMS. H You could optionally use a /TO to identify an operator class. Objects in1 mirrors may appear uglier than they actually are.    --  ? Regards, Nic Clews a.k.a. Mr. CP Charges, CSC Computer Sciences  nclews at csc dot com    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 05:39:53 +0800 , From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> Subject: Re: FOCUS help - Message-ID: <878yf5wseu.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   * brandon@dalsemi.com (John Brandon) writes:  B > 2) You can specify temporary work directories when running FOCUSA > *.FEX scripts.  This allows you to keep the area clean and keep 8 > multiple FOCUS jobs from stepping on each others toes.   Does defining SYS$SCRATCH work?    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 15:52:01 +0200 0 From: Keith Cayemberg <keith.cayemberg@arcor.de>@ Subject: Re: HP developer resources for porting from unix to VMSB Message-ID: <40bf2d01$0$26357$9b4e6d93@newsread4.arcor-online.net>   Main, Kerry wrote: >>-----Original Message-----+ >>From: John Smith [mailto:a@nonymous.com]   >>Sent: June 2, 2004 7:28 PM >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com B >>Subject: Re: HP developer resources for porting from unix to VMS >> >> > 
 > [snip..] >  >  >> >>Thanks Kerry/Brad. >>+ >>I appreciate the resources and the offer.  >>G >>The ISV we are discussing this with is a document management/workflow ? >>vendor, of which there are few VMS solutions available. They   >>have something> >>in the order of 6,000 major enterprise installs (or so they  >>say), plus lots < >>of smaller businesses. We like the idea that they support  >>Weblogic as it at 8 >>least gets us part way to a desirable solution on VMS. >> >> >>? >>Another interesting potential solution we've been looking at   >>possibly taking : >>a stab at porting ourselves is at http://www.dspace.org/ >>H >>Notice that HP had more than a helping hand in this but apparently didA >>absolutely zero, nada, nil, nichts about making it OpenVMS-able  >>out-of-the-box.. >> >> >  > 0 > John - re: document mgmt solutions on OpenVMS. > 7 > Here is older email from Keith Cayemberg that I kept:  >  > +++  > J > Here is a list of commercial Document Management Systems known to run on >  > OpenVMS... >  > Datalogics - DL Pager % > http://www.datalogics.com/pager.asp  >  > Redwood - OutRun, > http://www.redwood.com/products/outrun.htm >  > Sec 1.01 - Paradocs , > http://www.sec101.ch/deutsch/paradocs.html2 > http://h71000.www7.hp.com/partners/sec/index.htm > / > Swiftbase International > Document Management : > http://www.swiftbase.com/applications2/document_mgr.html > < > TIM -- Enterprise Content-Management- und Redaktionssystem > http://www.fct.de/ > ( > Touch Technologies, Inc. - DECdocument( > http://www.ttinet.com/decdocument.html > - > VTX - SP6405PF.PDF (application/pdf Object) 4 > http://h18000.www1.hp.com/info/SP6405/SP6405PF.PDF > 	 > Cheers!  >  > Keith Cayemberg # > IBM Business Services - Hannover    , I now have a few more to add to this list...  - Circle Software Group B.V. - Document Manager - Versions 2.3 and 2.4 shipping for OpenVMS 7.3 3 http://www.circlesoftware.nl/dm/DocumentManager.asp   5 Document Sciences - Autograph (in review for OpenVMS) 4 http://www.docscience.com/technologies/autograph.asp  CompuSet (in review for OpenVMS)3 http://www.docscience.com/technologies/compuset.asp & Print Emitters (in review for OpenVMS)3 http://www.docscience.com/technologies/compuset.asp < Visual CompuSet Professional Edition (in review for OpenVMS)0 http://www.docscience.com/technologies/vcpro.asp    B DolphinSearch - DolphinSearch KnowledgeBox (in review for OpenvMS) http://www.dolphinsearch.com/   $ Down To Earth Business Software - DS http://www.datvsn.com/dsv7.htm  1 ELCA - Easyfile - Document and Archive Management # Version 7.4.0 available for OpenVMS E http://www.elca.ch/Solutions/Technology_Frameworks/Easyfile/index.php   # Global Informatica S.r.l. - Voyager + http://www.globalinformatica.com/index.htmlO  H Mobius Management Systems, Inc. - ViewDirect TCM (in review for OpenVMS) http://www.mobius.com/mobiuscorpsite/default.asp?Form=PageLayout&Action=Retrieve&ParentTagID={8AA2C5A2-66FE-40F0-B1AD-C9CFA101991B}&LanguageID={092D603E-1164-4BCA-9397-4A0EF2484D86}&GroupID={9D922248-68E2-4F3B-8C17-20B5AF46377D}  D Open Text Corporation - Livelink Collections Server (formerly BASIS)A Version 9.1 shipping for OpenVMS, Version 10 scheduled for (2Q04) ( http://www.opentext.com/basis/index.html  C Optio Software, Inc. - Optio e.ComIntegrate (in review for OpenVMS)eI http://www.optiosoftware.com/solutions/enterprise/ecomintegrate/index.aspuQ http://www.optiosoftware.com/downloads/Literature/e.ComEngine%20White%20Paper.pdfE  # TietoEnator Media Systems AB - TRIP / Information Archive and Development Environmentu* 3.4-6 (Shipping), 3.5-0 (1Q04), 4.0 (2Q04). http://www.tieto.se/tems/tems_maintenance.html   Note:pB Specialized Document or Content Management Solutions for specific I industries such as publishing, healthcare, engineering, EDI or financial fI services would likely be listed under their respective topics within the fB indices I use to construct my solution lists. There might also be G suitable solutions for you under other topics such as Word Processors, C DTP, Groupware and Workflow SW.a     Cheers!i Keith Cayembergi. IBM Business Services GmbH - Hannover, Germany$ http://www-5.ibm.com/services/de/bs/   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 18:33:33 +0200-0 From: Keith Cayemberg <keith.cayemberg@arcor.de>@ Subject: Re: HP developer resources for porting from unix to VMSB Message-ID: <40bf52dd$0$13308$9b4e6d93@newsread2.arcor-online.net>   John Smith wrote:nN > We are having discussions with an ISV whose application runs on Weblogic webN > server (which runs on VMS). Trouble is, the ISV also has a required piece of  > code that does not run on VMS. > M > Since the ISV is not about to let us look 'under the kimono' at their code,3M > all I can hope to do is point them to all official and unofficial resourcesyK > to help an application developer see the light and learn how to port thate > piece of code to OpenVMS.m > I > HP web links, pointers to documents, SPEC 1173, XPG/4 branding, current E > initiative vis-a-vis unix portability, etc... would be appreciated.  >  > Sue, Kerry???? >  > Thanks  2 I've found the following organisations which offer" "Migration to OpenVMS Services"...   ArrAy Incorporated - USA. http://www.arrayinc.com/hpplatformservices.htm  
 EG&H - USA http://www.egh.com/  EG&H Software Development + http://www.egh.com/SoftwareDevelopment.htmlu   Hot Toaster - USAo http://www.hottoaster.com/   Pennington - Services - USAa" http://www.pennington.com/svcs.htm  / Migration Specialties International, Inc. - USAa* http://home.earthlink.net/~msi1/cnvs3x.htm   Yezerski Roper - Services - UK, http://www.yrl.co.uk/~yr/services/index.html   Cheers!-   Keith Cayemberg@9 An American in the Monegasque Kingdom of Lower Saxony ;-)w   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 08:09:35 +0200e From: Dirk Munk <munk@home.nl>, Subject: Re: Is my Itanic showing....at all?2 Message-ID: <c9mfb6$27r$1@news4.tilbu1.nb.home.nl>   Barry Treahy, Jr. wrote: > Bob Ceculski wrote:B > 2 >> "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message + >> news:<U92dnaFADoTYrSDdRVn-jg@igs.net>...M >>   >>A >>> http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/05/28/itanium_opteron_q104/  >>>TJ >>> ....The latest server data from Gartner shows that only 6,281 Itanium 	 >>> boxesiL >>> and 31,184 Opteron boxes were shipped in the first quarter of this year.F >>> Together, Itanium and Opteron servers accounted for 37,000 of the  >>> 1.6m units >>> moved in the period.I >>> Just how bad is the state of the pubescent Itanic? Think of thriving o >>> acne( >>> with an outside chance of cleansing. >>>s	 >>> .....t >>>    >> >>> >> just wait until the alpha teams work kicks in, then I think5 >> you will see a drastic change in those numbers ...z >>   >>I > I didn't know that the Alpha team had been acquired by AMD, smart move &
 > for AMD ;-)   P  From what I've heard, former Alpha engineers have been aquired by AMD. I think O it happened before the Alphacide. I see a great similarity between the general nK setup of the Opteron and the EV7. Integrated memory controllers, very fast 6? interprocessor communication lines for multi cpu systems.......p   >  > Barryo >    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 09:00:53 -0700r+ From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com> R Subject: Re: Is VAX/VMS V1.0/V2.0 available for download in SIMH .TAP format ? ? ?' Message-ID: <40BF4B35.8020501@MMaz.com>    Alan Frisbie wrote:    > healyzh@aracnet.com wrote: > 6 >> David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> wrote: >>J >> > I think SIMH emulates a VAX model that the early version would likely >> > not support.  >>, >> > Be interesting to try, though I s'pose. >>. >> Good point!  It emulates a KA650 I believe. >m > E > I find it very interesting to trace the evolution of VAX processors.F > versus the evolution of PDP-11 processors.   With PDP-11 processors,B > I can boot and run the very earliest paper tape (or even key-in)I > code on the very latest processors, assuming the presence of compatible G > I/O devices.   For example, I can run RSX-11C (yes, C) paper tape O/SCF > on my PDP-11/73.   A stand-alone paper tape program that I wrote forG > the PDP-11/20 will also run on the same system.   I can even boot andeD > run an RSX-11M v2.0 RK05 pack.   All of this software predates the# > hardware by several (many) years.n >oJ > This contrasts with VMS and the VAX.   VMS will not run on any processorD > that did not exist at the time that particular version of VMS was  > released.-I > This makes life very difficult for computer historians and researchers.lJ > If SIMH or other emulator could be enhanced to emulate early Massbus and< > Unibus VAX systems, it would make life much easier for us. > C > I am curious about what happened within DEC that caused these two  > divergent practices.  E My 'guess' is major OS enhancements became too complex vs. the ROI.  @I With all of the changes that VMS went through, with network, clustering, KF locking, amp, then smp, to carry the baggage of hardware that was not G only incredibly expensive to acquire and maintain, but also no doubt a iF performance hindrance to new technologies, it probably wasn't a tough H decision to leave it behind because, and correct me if I'm wrong, but I D don't *ever* remember VMS being sold as an OS to run on any and all I hardware, it was an OS whose apps could and should run on and version of  B VMS; remember slogan VMS is VMS regardless of whether it ran on a D 11/780, MV II, 8250, 4000/100, etc... When Alpha's came along, that G certainly would have had to bring the ax to any ancient EOL'd hardware  @ because it would be impossible to justify massbus support on an ; Alpha...  Now with Itanic, Itanic is bring the ax to VMS...g     Barryb   -- p  > Barry Treahy, Jr                       E-mail: Treahy@MMaz.com> Midwest Microwave                          Phone: 480/314-1320> Vice President & CIO                         FAX: 480/661-7028                        o   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 08:31:00 -0700x3 From: Alan Frisbie <Usenet01REMOVE@Flying-Disk.com>aQ Subject: Re: Is VAX/VMS V1.0/V2.0 available for download in SIMH .TAP format ? ??a. Message-ID: <40BF4434.8090109@Flying-Disk.com>   healyzh@aracnet.com wrote:5 > David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> wrote:e > I > > I think SIMH emulates a VAX model that the early version would likely  > > not support. > + > > Be interesting to try, though I s'pose.e > - > Good point!  It emulates a KA650 I believe.   C I find it very interesting to trace the evolution of VAX processorsuD versus the evolution of PDP-11 processors.   With PDP-11 processors,@ I can boot and run the very earliest paper tape (or even key-in)G code on the very latest processors, assuming the presence of compatiblenE I/O devices.   For example, I can run RSX-11C (yes, C) paper tape O/SrD on my PDP-11/73.   A stand-alone paper tape program that I wrote forE the PDP-11/20 will also run on the same system.   I can even boot andoB run an RSX-11M v2.0 RK05 pack.   All of this software predates the! hardware by several (many) years.@  H This contrasts with VMS and the VAX.   VMS will not run on any processorK that did not exist at the time that particular version of VMS was released.iG This makes life very difficult for computer historians and researchers. H If SIMH or other emulator could be enhanced to emulate early Massbus and: Unibus VAX systems, it would make life much easier for us.  A I am curious about what happened within DEC that caused these twoa divergent practices.   Alan   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 08:27:47 GMTl0 From: glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> Subject: Re: Machine language?) Message-ID: <7iBvc.11003$sI.14@attbi_s52>t   Jack Peacock wrote:w   (snip)  N > As for being the first level of software, not quite.  If the CPU doesn't useE > hard-wired instruction decoding then the machine language itself is-N > interpreted by the microcode loaded at IPL or built into the processor.  TheL > IBM 370 was a classic microprogram design; the 8" floppy was invented as a > way to load the microcode.  ; That would be IMPL not IPL.   IPL is loading of S/370 code.k   -- glen    ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 07:52:50 -0700* From: "Jack Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com> Subject: Not adding up?g2 Message-ID: <8ImdncfsSKbepiLdRVn-uw@mpowercom.net>  0 > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message( news:<U92dnaFADoTYrSDdRVn-jg@igs.net>...A > > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/05/28/itanium_opteron_q104/u > >kI > > ....The latest server data from Gartner shows that only 6,281 Itaniumc boxesmL > > and 31,184 Opteron boxes were shipped in the first quarter of this year. >eH The numbers for Itanium don't seem to be adding up.  I thought Intel hadL shipped 100,000+ Itanium CPUs last year?  What are the year on year shippingL numbers?  Are all those 6281 boxes last quarter fitted with at least 4 CPUs?   Jack Peacock   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 3 Jun 2004 12:08:48 -0400# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>o Subject: Re: Not adding up?n, Message-ID: <oI-dnRLX6vqS0CLdRVn_iw@igs.net>  5 "Jack Peacock" <peacock@simconv.com> wrote in message , news:8ImdncfsSKbepiLdRVn-uw@mpowercom.net...2 > > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message* > news:<U92dnaFADoTYrSDdRVn-jg@igs.net>...C > > > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/05/28/itanium_opteron_q104/  > > >"K > > > ....The latest server data from Gartner shows that only 6,281 Itaniumh > boxes.H > > > and 31,184 Opteron boxes were shipped in the first quarter of this year._ > >uJ > The numbers for Itanium don't seem to be adding up.  I thought Intel hadE > shipped 100,000+ Itanium CPUs last year?  What are the year on year> shippingH > numbers?  Are all those 6281 boxes last quarter fitted with at least 4 CPUs?     E I think most of those cpu's were shipped....to a land-fill site.  ;-)t   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Jun 2004 04:42:46 -0700n. From: fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso)5 Subject: Quadrics adds lower-end supercomputer switche< Message-ID: <f30679fb.0406030342.979440e@posting.google.com>  ? Anyone using this technology with OpenVMS systems /clustering ??9 The news mention Itanic systems in a specific lab in USA.t    f http://news.com.com/Quadrics+adds+lower-end+supercomputer+switch/2100-7337_3-5224930.html?tag=nefd.top     Regardst   FC   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 09:29:25 -0700p+ From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com>uE Subject: Searching for VAX 66XX Console Commands and hardware manualsd% Message-ID: <40BF51E5.80300@MMaz.com>p  G Does anyone know of, or have possession of, the console commands for a lI VAX 6610 series of systems?  Preferably in PDF, would be awesome, and if rG you have the hardware guides for the system in electronic form to toss  ( in, that would be greatly appreciated...    
 Best regards,e     Barry    --    > Barry Treahy, Jr                       E-mail: Treahy@MMaz.com> Midwest Microwave                          Phone: 480/314-1320> Vice President & CIO                         FAX: 480/661-7028                            ------------------------------   Date: 3 Jun 2004 08:48:48 -0700n% From: whohe@whoever.com (DL Phillips)l6 Subject: Re: Solaris command output in a VMS symbol...; Message-ID: <af0dc2ea.0406030748.8def72@posting.google.com>   t Michael Austin <maustin@firstdbasource.com> wrote in message news:<Vervc.3989$NZ.2610@newssvr22.news.prodigy.com>... > labadie wrote:I > >> You might need to create a command procedure and define a symbol to  D > >> execute it...  although I am not sure I would leave a username D > >> password in a command proc so I would do something like this... > >> > >> $!!begin sunfire.comiH > >> $!!   To prevent someone from looking at your buffer and/or lookingJ > >> $!!   over your shoulder, we will not echo the password to the screenL > >> $!!   Just keep in mind, a good sniffer will be able to extract this... > >> $set term/noechoa+ > >> $inquire/nopunct pw "Enter password: "- > >  > > # > > inquire is not a good idea IMHO # > > read/prompt has many advantagesc > >  > > Regardso > > 
 > > Gerard > 5 > true, but for simple stuff inquire does the job....a >  > M.    ! Unless you need to preserve case.a   Doug   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Jun 2004 01:09:29 -0700 . From: martinkirby12@yahoo.co.uk (Martin Kirby)( Subject: Re: Storing system files in CMS< Message-ID: <224291b.0406030009.6ee9d224@posting.google.com>  h Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote in message news:<lggoKE0zOPYy@eisner.encompasserve.org>...j > In article <7041fc41.0406020021.79689f78@posting.google.com>, pulley_p@hotmail.com (Phil Pulley) writes:z > > koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote in message news:<+sYzVvCiIvc8@eisner.encompasserve.org>...l > >> In article <7041fc41.0406010707.cfe30ee@posting.google.com>, pulley_p@hotmail.com (Phil Pulley) writes: >  e& > >> > ...but it doesn't seem to work. > >> nK > >>    What error do you get?  When we had someone who insisted in storing-J > >>    a non-text file in CMS, we quite often got page file quota errors.J > >>    It can take a lot of memory to manupulate non-text files with CMS. >  eI > >   %CMS-F-BUG, there is something wrong with CMS or something it calls > > >   -CMS-F-SYSFAIL, LIB$GET_VM system service request failed( > >   -LIB-F-BADLOADR, bad block address > I > The previous guess about inadequate virtual address space seems likely.n  A About CMS 3.9 the memory allocation in CMS was improved to reducehC fragmentation problems which alleviated some memory problems. AbouthC CMS 4.2 I think some of the error messages for memory problems weree	 improved.t  D There is an issue in CMS that when it fetches a file it tries to mapF the whole element file into memory, including all the generations, andC it allows a generous, and pointless, room for expansion. This meansoE that for a given page file quota you can find yourself able to save ay file but later not restore it.  E I know the engineer who looks after CMS discussed improving this. I'm * not sure of the status of any such change.  B Bottom line is that, if you have many generations of a binary fileF then, the element file can get very large and your page file quota can go through the roof.   Martin Kirby   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Jun 2004 01:12:45 -0700r. From: martinkirby12@yahoo.co.uk (Martin Kirby)( Subject: Re: Storing system files in CMS< Message-ID: <224291b.0406030012.48075aad@posting.google.com>  r soccer13player@yahoo.com (Nom de Plume) wrote in message news:<f401eb7f.0406021333.26557e14@posting.google.com>...> > Does CMS support complete UNIX style naming conventions yet?  C It has full support for ODS-5 style element names. It does not have & support for case sensitive file names.  s > H > One really great thing I would like added to CMS is the replacement ofC > __GENERATION__ within a file like I have available from sccs/rcs.  >   F Not sure what this means. CMS V4.2 (I think) added the ability to do a? REPLACE/INSERT which inserts the new generation into class(es).a   Martin Kirby   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 03 Jun 2004 13:06:34 GMTa1 From: Michael Austin <maustin@firstdbasource.com>o Subject: Re: T4 and friends41 Message-ID: <40BF2259.8040905@firstdbasource.com>@   David J Dachtera wrote:  > Michael Austin wrote:k <bunch of stuff snipped>  I > If you *MUST* use GUI-based solutions, you *MUST* provide for RPCs thatmH > can be trigered from a batch job on the VMS side (RSHELL?) so that the: > product will run entirely automated, including printing. > H > Again, I don't have hours a day, everyday to point-and-click my way to< > performance reports that would be more valuable automated.   Neither do I....   > F > Anyone out there who DOES have that kind of time *EVERY* *DAY*, feelI > free to say, "You're wrong DJ" - or be prepared to share your solutionsl" > with the VMS community at-large.  D You're wrong DJ.. :) :) well... you do have *some* good points... I H don't know about everyoneelse, but I try to never print anything needed D once or twice that I can have a computer put on a screen - and then F everyone can see it for themselves without having to walk down to the C wall of graphs (I have seen some of these...)  No, I am not a tree wH hugger, but let's face it, if we automated every print job, most of the I graphs would end up in a shredder or landfill or possibly recycled.  And =G for what?  To walk by and pick it up off the printer, look at -- maybe eI analyze it and toss it?  I look at the graphs I want to look at and only  G when I need to look at them.  Some of the T4 stuff guys like me and JF  H are working on will give us the ability to make a few clicks and have a H trended graph show up on the screen - not just yesterday.  If I need to  print it. click and it's done.  G I can tell you lots of stories about full boxes of printed reports and tG graphs being tossed and how the reports were still generated, but only ,G viewed with a browser.. (and that was on a VAX running 5.5-1H1 and one  E of the original CERN web servers...) Or how the same principles were  H used to make it easier for one company to search and view only portions F of 43,000 reports they received every month.  Can you imagine in both ? cases, how much they save by not having to print the reports???>  ? Being able to trend T4 is just around the corner... developing iF replacements for stuff that should have never been sold off -- and is C now 3x the cost -- is in progress, but time-consuming.  Hey, we're   working on it :)  H BTW... Can you imagine the number of graphs I would have to review in a 7 data center of 200+ Alpha servers -- not just a few....    Michael Austin
 T4 Expert. 816-373-8572 816-728-3080 Mobiler           >  > D.J.D.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2004.307 ************************