1 INFO-VAX	Wed, 23 Jun 2004	Volume 2004 : Issue 347       Contents:G Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch  job? P Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch  job?  job?jobF Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch job?F Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch job?F Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch job?F Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch job?F Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch job?F Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch job?! Re: CAPTURE PID OF PARENT SUBMIT? ! Re: CAPTURE PID OF PARENT SUBMIT?  DEC CIT  Re: DEC CIT  Re: DEC Datatrieve Re: DEC Datatrieve DEC Datatrieve help  Re: DEC Datatrieve help  Re: delete directory recursive Re: DS20 from Tru64 to VMS Re: DS20 from Tru64 to VMS@ Re: Is OpenVMS 'Adaptive' according to HP, or just an Albatross?1 Re: Job openings at Dell in Texas - not VMS - ??? 1 Re: Job openings at Dell in Texas - not VMS - ???  Re: Marillion Comeback MicroVax II for sale -- cheap!+ Re: More LAT questions on LAT$SYSTARTUP.COM  Re: Mozilla 1.7  Re: Mozilla 1.7  Re: Mozilla 1.7  Re: Mozilla 1.7  Re: Mozilla 1.7  Re: Mozilla 1.7  Re: Mozilla 1.7  Re: OT: Sun / Sparc  FUD Re: OT: Sun / Sparc  FUD Re: OT: Sun / Sparc  FUD Re: OT: Sun / Sparc  FUD Re: OT: Sun / Sparc  FUD PLUG: txt2pdf 7.4 3 program a serial port to UPS to detect power outage : Re: RSA Secure ID  or other hardware token authentication?' Re: slap in the face again... thanks HP ' Re: slap in the face again... thanks HP ' Re: slap in the face again... thanks HP ' Re: slap in the face again... thanks HP ' Re: slap in the face again... thanks HP ' Re: slap in the face again... thanks HP  Re: SSH protocol in VMS 5.5-2  UDP broadcast sockets & Re: VMS Gets Short Shrift at HP World.& Re: VMS Gets Short Shrift at HP World.  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 11:24:32 +0300 4 From: Mike Rechtman <michael.rechtman.nospam@hp.com>P Subject: Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch  job?& Message-ID: <40D9686F.106BC573@hp.com>   Z wrote: >  > David J Dachtera wrote: B > >>Isn't $SYNCHRONIZE supposed to set $STATUS to the $STATUS fromE > >>the batch job?  See below ...  why am I getting the error message E > >>for exit status 124 (not 123) and why is $STATUS being OR-ed with  > >>%x10000000 ? > >> > >>$ type 15sec.com > >>$ wait 00:00:15  > >>$ exit 123 > >> > >>$ submit 15sec.com? > >>Job 15SEC (queue SYS$BATCH, entry 607) started on SYS$BATCH  > >> > >>$ sync/entry=6074 > >>Job 15SEC (queue SYS$BATCH, entry 607) completed0 > >>%SYSTEM-I-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted > >> > >>$ write sys$output $STATUS > >>%X1000007B > >  > >  > > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ a = 123 > > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ sh sym a 3 > >   A = 123   Hex = 0000007B  Octal = 00000000173  > >  > > Get the idea?  > ; > I'm not sure what you're getting at ... yes, I understand . > that 7Bh is 123.  But that's not my problem. >  > I have 2 problems: >  > 1.: > The batch jobs exits with 123 but the $STATUS after SYNC; > returns isn't 123.  It's 123 OR-ed with %x10000000.  This ; > is not what I expected.  And that contradicts the OpenVMS  > DCL Dictionary, N-Z: >  >  From DCL II-490:  > ...  > Description: > ... < > The completion status form the SYCNHRONIZE command is that< > same as the completion status of the last command executed
 > in the job.  >  > 2.: > I'm getting an error message for status 124 or maybe 1229 > (DEVNOTMOUNT) even though I exit with 123.  Why is that  > hapenning?   OpenVMS V6.2 :  $write sys$output f$message(123), %SYSTEM-I-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted   --  E --------------------------------------------------------------------- E Usual disclaimer: All opinions are mine alone, perhaps not even that. ? Mike Rechtman                            *rechtman@tzora.co.il* F Kibbutz Tzor'a.                          Voice (home): 972-2-9908337  B   "20% of a job takes 80% of the time, the rest takes another 80%"E ---------------------------------------------------------------------  -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----  Version: 3.1: GCM/CS d(-)pu s:+>:- a++ C++ U-- L-- W++ N++ K? w--- V+++$6 PS+ PE-- t 5? X- tv-- b+ DI+ D-- G e++ h--- r+++ y+++@ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 03:24:29 -0700  From: Z <z@no.spam> Y Subject: Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch  job?  job?job 0 Message-ID: <10dimhgo17dic21@corp.supernews.com>   Mike Rechtman wrote: >>1.: >>The batch jobs exits with 123 but the $STATUS after SYNC; >>returns isn't 123.  It's 123 OR-ed with %x10000000.  This ; >>is not what I expected.  And that contradicts the OpenVMS  >>DCL Dictionary, N-Z: >> >> From DCL II-490:  >>...  >>Description: >>... ; >>The completion status from the SYCNHRONIZE command is the < >>same as the completion status of the last command executed
 >>in the job.  >> >>2.: >>I'm getting an error message for status 124 or maybe 1229 >>(DEVNOTMOUNT) even though I exit with 123.  Why is that  >>hapenning? >  >  > OpenVMS V6.2 :" > $write sys$output f$message(123). > %SYSTEM-I-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted  ; I'll be darned.  I assumed all odd $STATUSes were not error  messages.  D'Oh!  , Thank you.  I just have the 1. problem left.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 12:35:31 +0100 - From: John Laird <nospam@laird-towers.org.uk> O Subject: Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch job? 8 Message-ID: <ssmid0lf1thpcajcu0t9j8nkbp1p0e277s@4ax.com>  8 On Tue, 22 Jun 2004 19:58:47 -0700, Z <z@no.spam> wrote:   >I have 2 problems:  >  >1. 9 >The batch jobs exits with 123 but the $STATUS after SYNC : >returns isn't 123.  It's 123 OR-ed with %x10000000.  This: >is not what I expected.  And that contradicts the OpenVMS >DCL Dictionary, N-Z:  >  > From DCL II-490: >...
 >Description:  >...; >The completion status form the SYCNHRONIZE command is that ; >same as the completion status of the last command executed  >in the job. >  >  >2. 9 >I'm getting an error message for status 124 or maybe 122 8 >(DEVNOTMOUNT) even though I exit with 123.  Why is that >hapenning?   K Perhaps the documentation is not explaining things very well, but it is not E as incorrect as you perhaps perceive.  The status value is made up of J several bit-fields.  The lowest 3 bits are the severity.  Any one "status"K can thus have up to 8 different levels.  They include values that translate G to -I-, -W-, -S-, -E-, -F- as seen in typical messages.  Odd values are F "true", even values "false".  There are then bit-fields for the actualL message number itself, the facility within which that message is meaningful,J and finally (in the highest bits), 4 bits that control message output.  InG this last nibble, the low bit suppresses output when set (it's the only I defined bit in fact).  Thus, any values that start with 1 (in hex) do not I display.  You can see this from your SYNCHRONIZE examples.  It is open to J debate whether this is a good thing or not, but at least it means you willH only get an error message when you have entered an erroneous SYNCHRONIZEL command.  Suppose you misspelt it - you will get %DCL-W-IVVERB, unrecognizedK command verb, etc.  How could you distinguish this case from your batch job E itself dying due to a misspelt command, if they both yielded the same  message on-screen ?   L In general, to properly handle status values within DCL, you should mask offI the low 3 bits and the high 4 bits, or use F$MESSAGE to extract the field G you are interested in.  (In fact, the help for F$MESSAGE has an example  involving SYNCHRONIZE !)   --  + Thank you for not breathing while I smoke.     Mail john rather than nospam...    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 05:22:11 -0700. From: martinkirby12@yahoo.co.uk (Martin Kirby)O Subject: Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch job? < Message-ID: <224291b.0406230422.28b7bf74@posting.google.com>   Z> I have 2 problems:  >  > 1.: > The batch jobs exits with 123 but the $STATUS after SYNC; > returns isn't 123.  It's 123 OR-ed with %x10000000.  This  > is not what I expected.    >   @ Somewhat unexpected. The bit is set by the function that outputsC a message to indicate that it has already been output and shouldn't G be output again. Sounds like either the documentation is wrong or there 	 is a bug.    >  > 2.: > I'm getting an error message for status 124 or maybe 1229 > (DEVNOTMOUNT) even though I exit with 123.  Why is that  > hapenning?  * That is the informational message for 123:   $ wri sys$output f$message(123) , %SYSTEM-I-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted  6 The bottom three bits of a status are the severity so:   $ wri sys$output f$message(120) , %SYSTEM-W-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted $ wri sys$output f$message(121) , %SYSTEM-S-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted $ wri sys$output f$message(122) , %SYSTEM-E-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted $ wri sys$output f$message(123) , %SYSTEM-I-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted $ wri sys$output f$message(124) , %SYSTEM-F-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted   Martin Kirby   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 06:54:08 -0700. From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman)O Subject: Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch job? < Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0406230554.65116f3@posting.google.com>  K Z <z@no.spam> wrote in message news:<10dhsdtf8o8qsa7@corp.supernews.com>...  > David J Dachtera wrote: B > >>Isn't $SYNCHRONIZE supposed to set $STATUS to the $STATUS fromE > >>the batch job?  See below ...  why am I getting the error message E > >>for exit status 124 (not 123) and why is $STATUS being OR-ed with  > >>%x10000000 ? > >> > >>$ type 15sec.com > >>$ wait 00:00:15  > >>$ exit 123 > >> > >>$ submit 15sec.com? > >>Job 15SEC (queue SYS$BATCH, entry 607) started on SYS$BATCH  > >> > >>$ sync/entry=6074 > >>Job 15SEC (queue SYS$BATCH, entry 607) completed0 > >>%SYSTEM-I-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted > >> > >>$ write sys$output $STATUS > >>%X1000007B > >  > >  > > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ a = 123 > > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ sh sym a 3 > >   A = 123   Hex = 0000007B  Octal = 00000000173  > >  > > Get the idea?  > ; > I'm not sure what you're getting at ... yes, I understand . > that 7Bh is 123.  But that's not my problem. >  >  > I have 2 problems: >  > 1.: > The batch jobs exits with 123 but the $STATUS after SYNC; > returns isn't 123.  It's 123 OR-ed with %x10000000.  This ; > is not what I expected.  And that contradicts the OpenVMS  > DCL Dictionary, N-Z: >  >  From DCL II-490:  > ...  > Description: > ... < > The completion status form the SYCNHRONIZE command is that< > same as the completion status of the last command executed
 > in the job.   B But for practical purposes it *is* the same. You can .and. it with2 %0fffffff if you want to get rid of the leading 1.  D But why is this a problem? The leading 1 is just the inhibit-display? bit, which is documented somewhere in the VMS Doc Set, though I A usually look up the status code breakdown in Hoff and Paul's book ' "Writing Real Programs in DCL" (p. 92).    > 2.: > I'm getting an error message for status 124 or maybe 1229 > (DEVNOTMOUNT) even though I exit with 123.  Why is that  > hapenning?  # I don't see your point here. But...   # $ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT F$MESSAGE("122") , %SYSTEM-E-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted# $ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT F$MESSAGE("123") , %SYSTEM-I-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted# $ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT F$MESSAGE("124") , %SYSTEM-F-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted  E And up above it looks like you are indeed getting 123 (though I doubt E any command will actually give status 123 -- you'd get 124 instead if 2 you try to dismount a device that is not mounted).   ------------------------------   Date: 23 Jun 04 07:29:47 PST From: mckinneyj@cpva.saic.com O Subject: Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch job? ( Message-ID: <+4K1pGujsEBv@cpva.saic.com>  F In article <10dhnv9td54v249@corp.supernews.com>, Z <z@no.spam> writes:@ > Isn't $SYNCHRONIZE supposed to set $STATUS to the $STATUS fromC > the batch job?  See below ...  why am I getting the error message C > for exit status 124 (not 123) and why is $STATUS being OR-ed with  > %x10000000 ? >  >  >  > $ type 15sec.com > $ wait 00:00:15  > $ exit 123 >  > $ submit 15sec.com= > Job 15SEC (queue SYS$BATCH, entry 607) started on SYS$BATCH  >  > $ sync/entry=6072 > Job 15SEC (queue SYS$BATCH, entry 607) completed. > %SYSTEM-I-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted >  > $ write sys$output $STATUS > %X1000007B  D Differing $SEVERITYs for the same event to be used at the discretion9 of the programmer - note the -F-, -E-, -I-, and -S- below   " A$ $ write sys$output f$mess(124) , %SYSTEM-F-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted! A$ $ write sys$output f$mess(123) , %SYSTEM-I-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted! A$ $ write sys$output f$mess(122) , %SYSTEM-E-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted! A$ $ write sys$output f$mess(121) , %SYSTEM-S-DEVNOTMOUNT, device is not mounted  I I suspect the inhibit bit is being set since the status is not indicative H of the result of an event that occurs in the job where it is being set -C this will prevent the associated error message from being displayed ' should the SYNC be followed by an EXIT.    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 10:05:08 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) O Subject: Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch job? 3 Message-ID: <Qs$1QLWGXVrj@eisner.encompasserve.org>   m In article <224291b.0406230422.28b7bf74@posting.google.com>, martinkirby12@yahoo.co.uk (Martin Kirby) writes:  > Z> I have 2 problems:  >>   >> 1. ; >> The batch jobs exits with 123 but the $STATUS after SYNC < >> returns isn't 123.  It's 123 OR-ed with %x10000000.  This >> is not what I expected.   >>   > B > Somewhat unexpected. The bit is set by the function that outputsE > a message to indicate that it has already been output and shouldn't I > be output again. Sounds like either the documentation is wrong or there  > is a bug.   8 It _was_ output - to SYS$OUTPUT of the detached process.9 Checking in the accounting file should find that bit set.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 18:20:37 +0100 - From: John Laird <nospam@laird-towers.org.uk> O Subject: Re: $SYNCHRONIZE ... why isn't $STATUS the $STATUS from the batch job? 8 Message-ID: <6iejd0hdjfb5vlkddu14svjgdci0udjj4b@4ax.com>  F On 23 Jun 2004 10:05:08 -0600, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote:  n >In article <224291b.0406230422.28b7bf74@posting.google.com>, martinkirby12@yahoo.co.uk (Martin Kirby) writes: >> Z> I have 2 problems: >>>  >>> 1.< >>> The batch jobs exits with 123 but the $STATUS after SYNC= >>> returns isn't 123.  It's 123 OR-ed with %x10000000.  This  >>> is not what I expected.    >>> C >> Somewhat unexpected. The bit is set by the function that outputs F >> a message to indicate that it has already been output and shouldn'tJ >> be output again. Sounds like either the documentation is wrong or there >> is a bug. > 9 >It _was_ output - to SYS$OUTPUT of the detached process. : >Checking in the accounting file should find that bit set.  A It is clear that, having collected the final status (from the job H controller, I guess, as the command invokes QUEMAN.EXE), the SYNCHRONIZEJ code then deliberately sets that bit so that when *it* exits with the sameJ status value, no message is displayed, but the user can proceed to examine $status.  I There is no other way of distinguishing messages from the command itself, H and messages from the process that the command is targetting, otherwise.L Although one might argue for an additional qualifier on SYNCHRONIZE to forceL it to exit with exactly the same status on demand (some users might think itC "nice" to see how the batch job exited, and I can see their point).    --  < Hello this is 911, If you're reporting a murder, press 1...    Mail john rather than nospam...    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 08:14:08 -0500 ( From: brandon@dalsemi.com (John Brandon)* Subject: Re: CAPTURE PID OF PARENT SUBMIT?1 Message-ID: <04062308140862@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>   
 D.J.D. wrote: J > I suppose there should be a way to setup an Audit event on a SUBMIT (ACEG > on a specific queue's ACL?) and filter the audit info later on. Seems  > the long way around though.  > 2 > What's the root problem you are trying to solve? >  > D.J.D.    M I currently track all batch jobs using LGI_CALLOUTS.  This information is put O into a database for trending and analysis.  Yes, I could use ACCOUNTING however H the method I have put into place is far more efficient for this purpose.  ( Why the need to identify parent submits?  K Lets take one of our batch jobs as an example.  This batch job is an Hourly L Shift batch job - we will call this the parent batch job.  This job executesO every hour on the hour.  During execution this parent batch job submits from 30 9 to 80 batch jobs.  We will call these sibling batch jobs.   M The need exists for us to track the start of the parent and the completion of & the parent and the sibling batch jobs.  N Going back to the LGI_CALLOUTS and the tracking mechanism in place.  If it wasN possible to (easily) identify the parent I could assign a group identification7 to the siblings thus being able to trace back the jobs.              J*o*h*n B*r*a*n*d*o*n  VMS Systems Administrator * firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 08:22:17 -0500 ( From: brandon@dalsemi.com (John Brandon)* Subject: Re: CAPTURE PID OF PARENT SUBMIT?1 Message-ID: <04062308221746@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>    John Vottero writes:  G > The SUBMIT command returns the entry number in the DCL symbol $ENTRY.  > L > Use F$GETQUI("DISPLAY_ENTRY", "JOB_PID", $ENTRY) to get the PID of the job > you submitted. > H > Remember that there can be a delay between the submit and when the job* > starts.  (There could even be a reboot).  O This is NOT the information I want.  I want the sibling batch job to report the ? parent batch job PID.  The $GETQUI, $GETJPI, and $ENTRY do not.   ! > And now for the shameless plug: @ > Whatever it is you're doing might be easier if you used JAMS!! > http://www.mvpsi.com  O Easier if I use JAMS?  I installed a tracking mechanism a whole lot easier than K installing JAMS and it was free.  Please note the word FREE - my management  likes that.   M Yes it is a shameless plug - and no, using JAMS will not allow us the ability 3 to do it easier without changing our code - harder.          J*o*h*n B*r*a*n*d*o*n  VMS Systems Administrator * firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 12:10:25 -0400 7 From: "Donald A. Dzikot" <ddzikot@oakknollsoftware.com>  Subject: DEC CIT0 Message-ID: <10djamtr5pdul34@corp.supernews.com>  L I have a customer running the old DEC CIT Vesion 3 on a VAX VMS V5.5 machineI from way-back-when. This has been running fine for years but recently has L started to generate CIT$_LINKRESET errors.  I think the CIT product was soldL off to Dialogic years ago but am not sure. Anyhow...is anyone or does anyoneK happen to know anyone from this product group who might be able to help?  I B think the most basic info that would help is an enumeration of theK conditions that would cause the CIT server to report this message.  Thanks.   = -------------------------------------------------------------  Donald A. Dzikot Oak Knoll Software" Technology Convergence Specialists
 PO Box 539 Upton, MA 01568  P: 508-529-0008  F: 508-861-0732  ddzikot@oakknollsoftware.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 16:30:34 GMT 4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk> Subject: Re: DEC CIT0 Message-ID: <40D9AD09.A1450280@blueyonder.co.uk>   "Donald A. Dzikot" wrote:  > N > I have a customer running the old DEC CIT Vesion 3 on a VAX VMS V5.5 machineK > from way-back-when. This has been running fine for years but recently has N > started to generate CIT$_LINKRESET errors.  I think the CIT product was soldN > off to Dialogic years ago but am not sure. Anyhow...is anyone or does anyoneM > happen to know anyone from this product group who might be able to help?  I D > think the most basic info that would help is an enumeration of theM > conditions that would cause the CIT server to report this message.  Thanks.  >   % Did something change on your network?    regards,   --   tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 09:29:42 +0200 2 From: Karl Rohwedder <emil.mustermann@t-online.de> Subject: Re: DEC Datatrieve ) Message-ID: <cbbbgt$8jk8@doiweb4.b2x.vwg>    Johnny Hosp wrote:H > I am new to VMS and DTR. I am trying to change the default dictionary,G > when I do a "SHOW DICTIONARY" I am at the defualt of _CDD$TOP. How do C > I list the dictionaries available? Is there a command to list all  > dictionaries below this?	 > Thanks,  > JH  / Try HELP, e.g. HELP COMMANDS_STATEMENTS_CLAUSES   N SHOW DICTIONARIES shows availabe dicts, DEFINE DICTIONARY changes the default.   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 09:42:07 -0700, From: JimStrehlow@data911.com (Jim Strehlow) Subject: Re: DEC Datatrieve = Message-ID: <4b6ec350.0406230842.5b2085e9@posting.google.com>   E For later questions regarding Datatrieve, it helps to know if you are > on a VAX or AlphaServer and what version of Datatrieve you are running.  ' $WRITE SYS$OUTPUT F$GETSYI("ARCH_NAME")  Alpha      $datatrieve  DEC DATATRIEVE V7.2  Digital Query and Report System  Type HELP for help    Hope we can help you more later.  A Jim Strehlow, OpenVMS Systems and Database Administrator, Data911  Alameda, CA, USA   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 05:47:54 -0700# From: cbell@qch.on.ca (Johnny Hosp)  Subject: DEC Datatrieve help< Message-ID: <e2db8f9b.0406230447.7a28f86@posting.google.com>  B I hope you can help with a different issue I am encountering using@ DTR? I did manage to change the dictionary and list the domains.E However when I try to ready a domain, I receive an error. For example D when I list domains, one of the domains I require data from is namedF EMP_ACCESS_V026, but when using the ready command, I get the following error:  & DTR> ready EMP_ACCESS_V026 shared read/ Error using RMS file "FPP_DAT:EMP_ACCESS.DAT".  A %RMS-F-DEV, error in device name or inappropriate device type for 	 operation   ? In fact I receive the same error when I try to ready any of the ) domains under the dictionary I am set to.    Thanks,    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 10:17:10 -0400 ( From: "Hein" <hein.nomail@hp.nomail.com>  Subject: Re: DEC Datatrieve help, Message-ID: <40d992e5$1@usenet01.boi.hp.com>  0 "Johnny Hosp" <cbell@qch.on.ca> wrote in message( > DTR> ready EMP_ACCESS_V026 shared read0 > Error using RMS file "FPP_DAT:EMP_ACCESS.DAT".C > %RMS-F-DEV, error in device name or inappropriate device type for 	 operation   > You are missing a valid logical name definition for "FPP_DAT:"0 Do you know where the file EMP_ACCESS.DAT lives?D You gotta find it (DIR [*...]EMP_ACCESS.DAT accross all data disks?)/ Let's say the answer is "disk1:[topdir.subdir]" < Now $DEFINE FPP_DAT disk1:[topdir.subdir] and try DTR again.) Aoptionall add /JOB or maybe even /SYSTEM ? You may need that above define in you LOGIN.COM  or if it needs J to be visible by every process all the time in SYLOGICAL.COM (or some such file executed at boot time)    Enjoy, Hein.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 08:34:23 -0500 6 From: "Craig A. Berry" <craigberry@mac.com.spamfooler>' Subject: Re: delete directory recursive E Message-ID: <craigberry-B51ADD.08342323062004@chi.news.speakeasy.net>   + In article <40D8E394.AEB203C0@comcast.net>, 4  David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> wrote:   > "Craig A. Berry" wrote:  > > J > > Making no claim about what various sites will or won't allow, I merelyE > > point out that sites with Perl installed have yet another option:  > > C > > $ perl -e "use File::Path; rmtree(\@ARGV,1,0);" dev:[dir] file1  > > dev:[dir2]
 > > [snip] > ! >  1. Perl does not ship with VMS   F Well, it's not part of a default installation, which is a pity.  It's H on one or more of the CDs that ship with the quarterly distribution and D it's readily available from the vendor's web site, which these days / must be considered one variant of "ships with."    >  2. Perl is "freeware"  8 No, it's open source, and is distributed with a license:  6 http://www.perldoc.com/perl5.8.4/pod/perlartistic.html  E A lot of commercial software has warranty disclaimers that leave you  E even higher and drier should you manage to do yourself harm with the  	 software.   5 >  3. Perl is not "supported" any more/less than DFU.   D If you use the HP version of Perl and have a support contract, then G yes, it is formally supported.  OVMS Engineering has been known to fix  3 bugs that customers have tripped over and reported.   B All versions of Perl are supported by volunteers on a best effort E basis.  How good the support is depends on a lot of things, like how  D busy the volunteers are, but it's often pretty good, if I do say so  myself.   G There are companies that specialize in Perl support.  How many are VMS  B savvy or willing to become so I don't know, but the option exists.  7 Since Perl is open source, you can support it yourself.   > So that's four support mechanisms available for Perl that are F unavailable for DFU.  Having said that, the one time I reported a bug G in DFU, the author had a new version in my mailbox in a day or two.  I  H wonder how much worse the support would be if it were formal instead of 	 informal.     ! > So, the OP likely can't use it.   G That may well be true, and I made pretty clear in my first post that I  @ was not trying to address arbitrarily restrictive site policies.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 11:28:56 +0200 3 From: Michael Unger <spam.to.unger@spamgourmet.com> # Subject: Re: DS20 from Tru64 to VMS + Message-ID: <2jt171F14uhhdU1@uni-berlin.de>   & On 2004-06-23 05:07, "JF Mezei" wrote:   > [...]  > M > Also, not sure if I saw this, but starting at what version of VMS would the  > DS20 be supported ?   G According to the QuickSpecs (28-Feb-2000 edition, Page 2) that would be  V7.1-2.    Michael    --  ; Real names enhance the probability of getting real answers. 5 My e-mail account at DECUS Munich is no longer valid.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 09:43:00 GMT 5 From: rdeininger@mindspringdot.com (Robert Deininger) # Subject: Re: DS20 from Tru64 to VMS L Message-ID: <rdeininger-2306040548010001@user-105n861.dialup.mindspring.com>  I In article <a2f904a978968004d3eacf91af10b9ea@news.teranews.com>, JF Mezei % <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote:    >Robert Deininger wrote:M >> One simple way to make drives disappear is to have a SCSI ID conflict.  Or C >> a bad cable.  Have you done all the standard SCSI bus debugging?  > N >I believe that in the original post, the writer stated that the system workedJ >fine with TRu64, and it is only when he tried to load VMS that it stopped working. > N >Assuming the above paragraph is correct, wouldn't the only possible answer beI >a problem with VMS drivers not being compatible with whatever device was ( >loaded whereas the Tru64 drivers were ?  D I think there are lots of possible answers.  If the OS switch didn't3 include any HW reconfiguring, that's a useful clue.     N >Could it be a problem with the hardware not having the ROM software needed toO >boot VMS (or would a DS20 have all pre-requisite ROM based console software to  >boot VMS ?)  J I don't think there were ever DS20s that couldn't support VMS.  There wereG SCSI adapters that were OS-specific.  Maybe in VMS the adapter works on G the boot device "by accident", but won't work with any other disk.  But % I've never heard of that in practice.   L >Also, not sure if I saw this, but starting at what version of VMS would the >DS20 be supported ?  H Dunno off the top of my head.  Probably 7.1 or thereabouts.  I think the1 FAQ has a pointer to minimum version information.   F Recent VMS versions are much less picky about disk characteristics.  IC remember a time when the SCSI driver wouldn't work with many SCSI-3 , drives.  A later version fixed that problem.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 09:38:04 +0100 O From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> I Subject: Re: Is OpenVMS 'Adaptive' according to HP, or just an Albatross? 0 Message-ID: <cbbfhc$893$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   Keith Parris wrote: Y > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message news:<jKudnZL2GbSIa03dRVn-ig@igs.net>...  > L >>I wonder how many times OpenVMS is mentioned and discussed extensively and" >>favorably at this conference.... >  > F > Despite having the name "HP Software Forum", the focus at this forumE > is on HP OpenView and the software that interoperates with OpenView F > (one example of which is the OpenView Operations Agent for OpenVMS), > not software in general. > F > OpenVMS has many favorable characteristics that allow one to build aG > readily adaptive enterprise today, as many here can attest. (And Dave @ > Holt did a presentation at the joint ENSA@work/HP-Interex EMEA@ > conference in Munich last month entitled "OpenVMS delivers the > Adaptive Enterprise now.") >   F You may be correct in your assertion that OpenVMS has technology would make it easier to virtualise.   B However what you have entirely failed to point out is that HP haveF not chosen to exploit this with any of the Utility management software8 thats at the basis of their Adaptive Enterprise program.  D The HP Utility Controller, the interface that provisions virtualisedD network, storage and server resources in the Adaptive Enterprise hasE no support for OpenVMS, it does however support Solaris, HP-UX, Linux B and Windows (not suprising since the base technology is from Sun).  E Given this any talk of OpenVMS in relation to HP's Adaptive Enterpise C program is largely BS and at best represents a services opportunity  for HP.    regards  Andrew Harrison E > There are significant technical challenges being worked on today in D > the AE world to try to make Windows, Linux, etc. easier to manage,G > continuously available, secure, and able to readily scale up and down G > with changing workload demands. These are very hard problems to solve  > for platforms other than VMS.  > G > Consider software installation: The shared system disk concept in VMS ? > allows one to avoid having to install an operating system and H > applications once for each and every server -- you can simply boot anyE > number of servers from a system disk which already has the required G > set of applications installed. And one can easily shift a server from H > one cluster to another as workload shifts, by simply rebooting it from > a different system disk. > = > Also consider data sharing: Because of the crude clustering < > capabilities on other platforms, there is only a subset ofH > applications which can readily scale up or down by addition or removalG > of nodes, and those are ones which deal basically with read-only data E > and don't have shared read/write data. (About the only exception to D > this is Oracle RAC, and we know where that technology comes from.)G > OpenVMS clusters allow full read/write access to data from any number " > of servers sharing the workload. > " > I loved this article from Cnet: . > http://news.com.com/2102-1071_3-5070877.html > --- # > The futility of utility computing  > By Jon Oltsik  > H > Back in the 1980s, the folks at Digital Equipment had a problem. WhileA > their VAX systems were selling like hotcakes, the systems still 9 > couldn't deliver the kind of scale found on mainframes.  > F > Digital, which had no plans to build big iron, set out to find a wayF > to use existing equipment to increase capacity--a search that led toB > the development of the VAX cluster and the concept of horizontal
 > scaling. > G > Rather than roll in bigger and bigger boxes, Digital discovered a way E > to balance compute loads across multiple machines. What's more, the E > systems behaved as a single system image so IT administrators could E > manage the cluster as a distinct entity. This masked the underlying A > complexity, lowered cost, and simplified day-to-day activities.  > B > This history review provides a good analog for today's computingC > utility vision. HP, IBM,  Microsoft and Sun Microsystems all have H > major initiatives underway to ease complexity with their own computingH > utilities. (It is ironic that these same companies contributed greatlyF > toward building this complexity, but that's another story.) The factF > is that in spite of good intentions and armies of engineers, none ofB > them will achieve anywhere near the success of the venerable VAX
 > cluster. > ...    ------------------------------   Date: 23 Jun 2004 06:03:54 GMT2 From: "Dave Weatherall" <djw-nothere@nospam.nohow>: Subject: Re: Job openings at Dell in Texas - not VMS - ???? Message-ID: <DTiotGxQ0bj6-pn2-hWXDi3dxI5XJ@dave2_os2.home.ours>   D On Tue, 22 Jun 2004 13:33:57 UTC, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy . <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> wrote:   <Snip>  C > But I am not sure how selling more AMD64 systems is going to help 5 > HP's long term strategy of making Itanium a sucess.  > > > The more "commodity" 64bit platforms that are installed that2 > arn't Itanium to more pressure Itanium is under. > F > It may be a benefit to HP's PSG but it isn't to their ESG so perhaps > HP need to make a choice !  F Very true. I do STR having some reasoning there too but, after a week ! that's too subtle even for me :-)    --   Cheers - Dave.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 08:00:24 GMT - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> : Subject: Re: Job openings at Dell in Texas - not VMS - ???@ Message-ID: <86c803d5afc902ab5f766cf6eb8cf66b@news.teranews.com>  E > > But I am not sure how selling more AMD64 systems is going to help 7 > > HP's long term strategy of making Itanium a sucess.     I The wintel division has a different mentality. They are not bound by IA64 E commitments. Their goals is to be seen by the press as providing what F customers want, and be seen by the press as providing state of the artN computers. If AMD64 is what is trendy this week, then the wintel division will want to be seen providing it.   K This is very different from the enterprise division which does not have the M freedom to operate due to all those commitments with Intel, as well as having 9 to thread carefuly so as to not anger the god of redmond.   M The HP wintel division's hands were untied years ago when Intel admitted that K IA64 wouldn't make it to desktops (which is industry speak for not becoming F industry standard running wintel servers and desktops). The enterprise! division's hands are still tied.    N Once Intel starts to spew out its 64 bit 8086, I suspect that HP will start toM talk seriously to Intel about adding whatever is missing from the 8086 to run I the serious OS like HP-UX, VMS and Tandem/NSK, allowing Intel to start to  phase out IA64.   J In the end, the competition will be  "enterprise" features in 64 bit 8086s from Intel versus AMD.   ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 16:10:18 +0000 (UTC) , From: Mikko Putkonen <miputkon@paju.oulu.fi> Subject: Re: Marillion Comeback ) Message-ID: <cbca1a$p2$1@ousrvr3.oulu.fi>   + Paul Sture <nospam@sture.homeip.net> wrote:  > VAXman- wrote: > > K > > If you like Marillion and other progressive rock, try out Auralmoon.com L > > internet radio.  You might even hear my DECtalk speak if you listen long > > enough.  > >   E > I honestly don't know whether I like Marillion or not, as I've not  I > really heard them much, but I do like what I see and hear on Auralmoon  	 > so far.   # > Thanks very much for the pointer.   D Thanks from here too, albeit late ones.  I've now been listening to F that radio quite frequently for a few weeks, and have definitely foundA several artists and works probably worth taking a closer look at.      -Mikko Putkonen    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 07:42:24 -0700+ From: randy.hancock@mnp.com (Randy Hancock) ' Subject: MicroVax II for sale -- cheap! = Message-ID: <fdc0ddb1.0406230642.22926808@posting.google.com>   E Have a functioning MicroVax II with VT420 terminal and LA50 printer.  F $75 or offer.  Would like to NOT have to deal with shipping the beast,@ so hopefully there is someone in SE Michigan that is interested.  F Really hate to roll it to the curb when it still works, but just don't( have the space/time/initiative anymore!!   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 10:46:51 -0500 % From: Neil Cherry <njc@wolfgang.uucp> 4 Subject: Re: More LAT questions on LAT$SYSTARTUP.COM. Message-ID: <slrncdj9aa.iot.njc@wolfgang.uucp>  < On Tue, 22 Jun 2004 14:44:09 -0700, Barry Treahy, Jr. wrote: > Neil Cherry wrote: > F >>I'm doing some more poking around and I'd like to understand some ofA >>the stuff I'm reading in the LAT startup file better. I see the  >>following 2 line:  >>& >>$ LCP CREATE PORT LTA1: /APPLICATION2 >>$ LCP SET PORT LTA1: /NODE=server_1 /port=port_1 >>H >>The machine I'm editing this on is VAX (wow, original thinking ;-) andG >>the other device is a DEC Server called server_1. Does this mean that E >>I now can connect to port_1 of server? Does this get advertised via : >>LAT advertisements? Does this mean anything else? Thanks >>   >>I > Yes, the DECserver advertises the ports available so that from the VAX  K > you can establish this application port.  These names are arbitrary, and  M > can be changed.  You can also connect to the DECserver using NCP by typing:  >  > NCP CONNECT NODE SERVER_1  > G > which will connect as a console to the DECserver, allowing you to do  D > configuration there, but you must know the access password.  Just L > remember you use CTRL-D to instruct NCP to disconnect when you are done...  B what's the command for ncp on VMS 7.3 on an Alpha. I forget and my notes are not well organized.   , BTW. Thanks to everyone for the information.  B What I'm trying to do is to figure out what lat services are being= advertised so I can make sure they work across and IP network D (translating LAT to TCP to LAT). VMS still confuses me a bit but I'm
 learning.    --  D Linux Home Automation         Neil Cherry        ncherry@comcast.net; http://home.comcast.net/~ncherry/               (Text only) = http://linuxha.sourceforge.net/                 (SourceForge) 8 http://hcs.sourceforge.net/                     (HCS II)   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 11:19:06 +0300 4 From: Mike Rechtman <michael.rechtman.nospam@hp.com> Subject: Re: Mozilla 1.7& Message-ID: <40D9672A.7F581DE2@hp.com>   Mark Daniel wrote: > I > Thanks to VMS Engineering for making Mozilla 1.7 available so promptly.  > ) >    http://www.mozilla.org/releases/#1.7  > H > +--------------------------------------------------------------------+G >   Mark Daniel                         http://wasd.vsm.com.au/adelaide H >   mailto:Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au (Mark.Daniel@dsto.defence.gov.au)= >   A pox on the houses of all SPAMers.  Make that two poxes. H > +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ Thanks for the release,  BUT  (from the release notes:) H Important: Mozilla for OpenVMS requires that local files be in Stream_LF record format. FilesG of other record formats are not supported and the results of attempting  to use any such file is  undefined.    ! been caught by this with SWS V2.0  --  E --------------------------------------------------------------------- E Usual disclaimer: All opinions are mine alone, perhaps not even that. ? Mike Rechtman                            *rechtman@tzora.co.il* F Kibbutz Tzor'a.                          Voice (home): 972-2-9908337  B   "20% of a job takes 80% of the time, the rest takes another 80%"E ---------------------------------------------------------------------  -----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----  Version: 3.1: GCM/CS d(-)pu s:+>:- a++ C++ U-- L-- W++ N++ K? w--- V+++$6 PS+ PE-- t 5? X- tv-- b+ DI+ D-- G e++ h--- r+++ y+++@ ------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 08:40:58 GMT L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr") Subject: Re: Mozilla 1.76 Message-ID: <00A33C4B.98B4BD0C@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  ] In article <40D9672A.7F581DE2@hp.com>, Mike Rechtman <michael.rechtman.nospam@hp.com> writes:  >Mark Daniel wrote:  >>  J >> Thanks to VMS Engineering for making Mozilla 1.7 available so promptly. >>  * >>    http://www.mozilla.org/releases/#1.7 >>  I >> +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ H >>   Mark Daniel                         http://wasd.vsm.com.au/adelaideI >>   mailto:Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au (Mark.Daniel@dsto.defence.gov.au) > >>   A pox on the houses of all SPAMers.  Make that two poxes.I >> +--------------------------------------------------------------------+  >Thanks for the release, >BUT >(from the release notes:)I >Important: Mozilla for OpenVMS requires that local files be in Stream_LF  >record format. Files H >of other record formats are not supported and the results of attempting >to use any such file is >undefined.  > " >been caught by this with SWS V2.0  K Okay, but how much do you use Mozilla to look at local files?  (I basically K don't at all, so this wouldn't be a problem for me; I can also always throw K them in a userdir (served by CSWS 1.x) and look at them as non-local files.    -- Alan  --  O =============================================================================== 0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056 M  Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA   94025 O ===============================================================================    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 11:56:03 +0100K From: pmoreau@ath.cena.fr (Patrick MOREAU, CENA Athis, Tel: 01.69.57.68.40)  Subject: Re: Mozilla 1.7! Message-ID: <qnfSvl5sLD3D@sinead>   0 In article <40d8a382$1@duster.adelaide.on.net>, , Mark Daniel <mark.daniel@vsm.com.au> writes:I > Thanks to VMS Engineering for making Mozilla 1.7 available so promptly.  > ) >    http://www.mozilla.org/releases/#1.7  > H > +--------------------------------------------------------------------+G >   Mark Daniel                         http://wasd.vsm.com.au/adelaide H >   mailto:Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au (Mark.Daniel@dsto.defence.gov.au)= >   A pox on the houses of all SPAMers.  Make that two poxes. H > +--------------------------------------------------------------------+  G Many thanks, a very nice surprise in a rainy June morning. I'll test it ! tomorrow on my new DS20E at work.    Patrick  --O =============================================================================== N pmoreau@ath.cena.fr  (CENA)      ______      ___   _          (Patrick MOREAU)4 moreau_p@decus.fr (DECUS)       / /   /     / /|  /|J CENA/Athis-Mons FRANCE         / /___/     / / | / |   __   __   __   __  N BP 205                        / /         / /  |/  |  |  | |__| |__  |__| |  |N 94542 ORLY AEROGARE CEDEX    / /   ::    / /       |  |__| | \  |__  |  | |__|N http://www.ath.cena.fr/~pmoreau/            http://www.multimania.com/pmoreau/O ===============================================================================    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 06:17:01 -0400 ' From: Colin Blake <colin@theblakes.com>  Subject: Re: Mozilla 1.71 Message-ID: <EMKdncisG7E8xUTdRVn-jw@adelphia.com>    Mike Rechtman wrote:   >Thanks for the release, >BUT >(from the release notes:)I >Important: Mozilla for OpenVMS requires that local files be in Stream_LF  >record format. Files H >of other record formats are not supported and the results of attempting >to use any such file is >undefined.  > 6 Mozilla has always had this restriction. It isn't new.  G And yes, before anyone says anything, the release notes still say 1.5.  ) They are in the process of being updated.    Colin.   ------------------------------   Date: 23 Jun 2004 10:11:36 GMT< From: gartmann@non.immunbio.mpg.de.sens (Christoph Gartmann) Subject: Re: Mozilla 1.70 Message-ID: <cbbl0o$nrg$1@n.ruf.uni-freiburg.de>   Mark Daniel wrote: > I > Thanks to VMS Engineering for making Mozilla 1.7 available so promptly.  > ) >    http://www.mozilla.org/releases/#1.7  >   K Be careful: I had to restore my bookmarks from backup. The bookmarks of the N "default" user have been preserved. The ones from my account have disappeared.   Regards,    Christoph Gartmann    --  E  Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452   ImmunbiologieI  Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de   D-79011  Freiburg, Germany 9                http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 07:39:18 -0700& From: jordan@ccs4vms.com (Rich Jordan) Subject: Re: Mozilla 1.7< Message-ID: <cc5619f2.0406230639.549115f@posting.google.com>  ` Colin Blake <colin@theblakes.com> wrote in message news:<EMKdncisG7E8xUTdRVn-jw@adelphia.com>... > I > And yes, before anyone says anything, the release notes still say 1.5.  + > They are in the process of being updated.  >  > Colin.   Colin,F      thanks for the update.  I'm looking forward to seeing the updatedB notes.  And thanks to all responsible for this very quick release!   Rich Jordan  CCS    ------------------------------  + Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 17:41:52 +0000 (UTC)  From: david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk Subject: Re: Mozilla 1.7) Message-ID: <cbcfd0$d4p$1@news.mdx.ac.uk>   ] In article <40D9672A.7F581DE2@hp.com>, Mike Rechtman <michael.rechtman.nospam@hp.com> writes:  >Mark Daniel wrote:  >>  J >> Thanks to VMS Engineering for making Mozilla 1.7 available so promptly. >>  * >>    http://www.mozilla.org/releases/#1.7 >>  I >> +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ H >>   Mark Daniel                         http://wasd.vsm.com.au/adelaideI >>   mailto:Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au (Mark.Daniel@dsto.defence.gov.au) > >>   A pox on the houses of all SPAMers.  Make that two poxes.I >> +--------------------------------------------------------------------+  >Thanks for the release, >BUT >(from the release notes:)I >Important: Mozilla for OpenVMS requires that local files be in Stream_LF  >record format. Files H >of other record formats are not supported and the results of attempting >to use any such file is >undefined.  >  Oh no not again.O I suppose it's not as bad as with SWS 2.0 since it will only affect viewing of   local files.  H Viewing non stream-lf text files certainly works with previous versions.  
 David Webb VMS and Unix team leader CCSS Middlesex University    " >been caught by this with SWS V2.0 >-- F >---------------------------------------------------------------------F >Usual disclaimer: All opinions are mine alone, perhaps not even that.@ >Mike Rechtman                            *rechtman@tzora.co.il*G >Kibbutz Tzor'a.                          Voice (home): 972-2-9908337   C >  "20% of a job takes 80% of the time, the rest takes another 80%" F >---------------------------------------------------------------------  >-----BEGIN GEEK CODE BLOCK-----
 >Version: 3.1 ; >GCM/CS d(-)pu s:+>:- a++ C++ U-- L-- W++ N++ K? w--- V+++$ 7 >PS+ PE-- t 5? X- tv-- b+ DI+ D-- G e++ h--- r+++ y+++@   >------END GEEK CODE BLOCK------   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 09:10:01 +0100 O From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> ! Subject: Re: OT: Sun / Sparc  FUD 0 Message-ID: <cbbdsp$7ot$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   Rob Young wrote:r > In article <d5abdc5c04db282b037f56ec73425413@news.teranews.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes: > \ >>>http://news.com.com/Fujitsu+revs+faster+server+chip/2100-1006_3-5242884.html?tag=nefd.top >>H >>Fujitsu unveils new SPARC chip at 1.89GHz with 3MB on-chip cache. 90nmP >>process. Will appear on servers later this year, sold by both Sun and Fujitsu.L >>Sun continues to have some Sparcs built by Texas Instruments (making Sparc? >>available from multiple sources, something IA64 can't claim).  >>K >>Seems to me that such news kill any/all FUD that some have been spreading 5 >>about the lack of future of the Sparc architecture.  >  > I > 	A year ago, there were 88 SPARC machines on the SuperComputer Top 500. 9 > 	Today there are 3.  SPARC has slid off to irrelevance.  > 	 > 				Rob  > C Ohh my gosh, do you really think that the top 500 list is a measure " of the server industry as a whole.  A Lets apply this Youngian logic and see where it gets us shall we.   = NEC and Cray Supercomputers plus a liberal dose of exotic MPP ? shared nothing clusters deployed in every datacenter worldwide.   ; Of thats BS but then Youngian Logic isn't up to much is it.    regards  Andrew Harrison    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 05:17:03 -0700' From: icerq4a@spray.se (David Svensson) ! Subject: Re: OT: Sun / Sparc  FUD = Message-ID: <734da31c.0406230417.41b09b21@posting.google.com>   u JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote in message news:<b695cacb9b15dde5e343e06de7161a9e@news.teranews.com>...  > N > Sparc is getting faster wity the new Fujitsu chip. So next year, it may have3 > some new supercomputers and increase in rankings.   E Sparc is not a player in HPC as it used to be and Sun is not actively E promoting it as such either anymore. It is _far_ more likely that Sun F and Fujitsu will get more x86 based systems on the list in the future.C Linux is not actively developed for Sparc and it does not look like B Sun and Fujitsu are willing to begin to seriously develop and sellE Linux for Sparc. The majority of new sales of supercomputers/clusters 
 use Linux.   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 06:37:33 -07001 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris) ! Subject: Re: OT: Sun / Sparc  FUD = Message-ID: <cf15391e.0406230537.43b22dc3@posting.google.com>   u JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote in message news:<b695cacb9b15dde5e343e06de7161a9e@news.teranews.com>... I > Compare this to VMS which has been in a long decline for over a decade.   B VMS over the past decade has had periods of decline interrupted byE periods of growth. The last trough was right after 9/11; VMS has been A growing since then -- quite strongly in recent quarters (and at a . average rate well above the industry average).   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 09:50:03 -0400 # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> ! Subject: Re: OT: Sun / Sparc  FUD , Message-ID: <dtWdnXPBY_AQF0TdRVn-jw@igs.net>  > "Keith Parris" <keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com> wrote in message7 news:cf15391e.0406230537.43b22dc3@posting.google.com... : > JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote in message< news:<b695cacb9b15dde5e343e06de7161a9e@news.teranews.com>...K > > Compare this to VMS which has been in a long decline for over a decade.  > D > VMS over the past decade has had periods of decline interrupted byG > periods of growth. The last trough was right after 9/11; VMS has been C > growing since then -- quite strongly in recent quarters (and at a 0 > average rate well above the industry average).    J On the basis of number of replacement systems sold to *existing* VMS usersE trading out of older hardware, or on the basis of the number of *new* I customers who have thrown out Solaris, HP-UX, Windows etc.... in favor of  OpenVMS?  < There is a BIG difference in the *quality* of those numbers.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 11:24:53 -0400 # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> ! Subject: Re: OT: Sun / Sparc  FUD , Message-ID: <ovCdnQyZ3vpaPUTdRVn-vA@igs.net>   Keith Parris wrote: : > JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote in message> > news:<b695cacb9b15dde5e343e06de7161a9e@news.teranews.com>...B >> Compare this to VMS which has been in a long decline for over a
 >> decade. > D > VMS over the past decade has had periods of decline interrupted byG > periods of growth. The last trough was right after 9/11; VMS has been C > growing since then -- quite strongly in recent quarters (and at a 0 > average rate well above the industry average).    3 http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1759,1611285,00.asp   # Use of Linux Grows in Public Sector   
 June 14, 2004  By  Peter Galli   K Public-sector deployments of Linux are continuing to grow at the expense of  Unix and Windows.   D The latest Linux win is the Administrative Office of the U.S. CourtsF (AOUSC), in Washington, which provides administrative support, programB management and policy development services to U.S. federal courts.  I The administrative office is migrating applications from Solaris to Linux L using Hewlett-Packard Co.'s ProLiant servers that are running Red Hat Inc.'sF Enterprise Linux Advanced Server and HP's StorageWorks tape libraries.  B In a deal to be announced this week, BakBone Software Inc., of SanG Diego-which offers Linux support and certification of its NetVault data G management software on Red Hat Linux and ProLiant servers-was awarded a K contract through outsourcer The Titan Corp. to provide software and support 
 to the AOUSC.   F The contract is part of the seven-year, $17 million server integrationL contract Titan signed with the AOUSC in December. The AOUSC will also deployJ IBM's Informix database software and BakBone's VaultDR (disaster recovery)C application to multiple remote sites, with 700 to 1,000 such server / deployments expected over the next three years.   E Government customers such as the U.S. Air Force's Electronics Systems L Command have welcomed the adoption of industry-driven standards, which allowG the Department of Defense to stay up-to-date with commercial technology H innovations using the self-governance model of the Linux community, saidL Matt Mleziva, program director of the defense information infrastructure for the Air Force, in Washington.   I Red Hat is also seeing interest in other areas of the public sector, said * officials from the Raleigh, N.C., company.  J Red Hat reported 87,000 units of Enterprise Linux sold last quarter, whichJ was about double the number sold in the previous quarter. The company alsoJ recently made its Security Enhanced Linux available as part of Fedora CoreH 2, Test 2, which officials said is the most significant milestone in its' security road map for Enterprise Linux.   J Some customers, such as John Lewis, security systems engineer for the cityG of Charlottesville, Va., are deploying Red Hat solutions because of the B *perception* that they are more secure than proprietary solutions.  L "Prior to my arrival, the department and the city of Charlottesville was 100L percent Microsoft," Lewis said. "Since then, we began a campaign to increaseE security, save money and address the needs of management. We chose to  standardize on Red Hat."     ----  G So where are the security wizards of OpenVMS with respect to the last 3 D paragraphs of this article? Or perhaps more correctly, where are the- marketing people for OpenVMS? MIA, of course.   L Secure Linux ain't free, and if memory serves me correctly it is in the sameK ballpark cost as OpenVMS for similar security capabilities and perhaps even D more costly. So where's the sales push for OpenVMS to these securityC 'concious' customers? Where are the ads that tout OpenVMS security?    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 06:10:50 -0700) From: mail@sanface.com (SANFACE Software)  Subject: PLUG: txt2pdf 7.4= Message-ID: <8c682947.0406230510.26ec22fa@posting.google.com>   / We would like to announce txt2pdf 7.4 version.  # http://www.sanface.com/txt2pdf.html E txt2pdf is shareware; it is a very flexible and powerful Perl5 script B that converts text files to PDF format files, so you can use it in> every operating systems supported by Perl5, including OpenVMS.( Remember to read "txt2pdf on OpenVMS" at# http://www.sanface.com/openvms.html ; It's simple to design background like invoices, orders etc. ) Here nice examples made using txt2pdf PRO - http://www.sanface.com/pdf/Purchase_Order.pdf ) http://www.sanface.com/pdf/oldinvoice.pdf $ http://www.sanface.com/pdf/hfmus.pdf) http://www.sanface.com/pdf/heraldbill.pdf @ If you prefer we also distribute executables for Windows, Linux,@ Solaris, AIX, HP-UX, and Mac OS X. Inside the Windows version is Visual txt2pdf, a VB GUI.    What's new in this version  D With Japanese, Korean and Chinese (traditional and simplified) fonts@ we have set that every ascii chars is just half of an Asian char7 (Japanese, Korean, traditional and simplified Chinese). ) This allows to convert this Japanese text ( http://www.sanface.com/text/japanese.txt
 into this pdf ) http://www.sanface.com/pdf/japanese.pdf ! D If you need a different set, contact us and explain us your problem, we'll solve your problem!    Test txt2pdf 7.4! 6 You can find it at http://www.sanface.com/txt2pdf.html   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 09:56:28 -0700, From: JimStrehlow@data911.com (Jim Strehlow)< Subject: program a serial port to UPS to detect power outage= Message-ID: <4b6ec350.0406230856.39843bae@posting.google.com>   E Is there a "template" for writing an OpenVMS DCL process to monitor a F serial port to an UPS (uninterruptible power supply) to detect a power8 loss to an OpenVMS AlphaServer and prepare for shutdown?  C I would prefer a simple DCL solution (sample code); but it may be a  VAX Basic or VAX C program.   , Is there an "industry standard" white paper?  ; I am interested in the "general theory" that people use for  determining:  A - send OpenVMS mail and REPLY/ALL/BELL when power outage is first  detected'   (what other suggested actions to do?)   ' - how long do you wait before shutdown? B   Do you wait five or ten minutes before committing to a shutdown?B   With a "rated" twenty minute UPS, do I wait ten minutes to allow time for7   power to be restored before committing to a shutdown?   E - do others (you) use @SYS$SYSTEM:SHUTDOWN with the POWER OFF option?     
 Thank you.  @ Jim Strehlow, OpenVMS Systems Manager, Data911, Alameda, CA, USA   ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 05:57:07 -0700( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)C Subject: Re: RSA Secure ID  or other hardware token authentication? = Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0406230457.20c7241e@posting.google.com>   ] Mark Berryman <Mark.Berryman@Mvb.Saic.Com> wrote in message news:<40d855e0@cpns1.saic.com>...  > Hal Kuff wrote: O > > Anyone out there using Secure ID or another vendor's key FOB hardeare token # > > type authentication on OpenVMS?  > >  > > J > Yes, I use SecurID tokens to log into my VMS systems.  Support for this  > is built into Multinet.  >  > Mark Berryman   2 and also TCPware ... the fastest IP stack for VMS!   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 09:13:23 +0100 O From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> 0 Subject: Re: slap in the face again... thanks HP0 Message-ID: <cbbe33$7ot$2@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   Bob Ceculski wrote: Z > VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote in message news:<00A33BCA.6247AC22@SendSpamHere.ORG>... > 9 >>Still, there's no reason for making it WEENDOZE only.    >>--  D >>http://www.legacy-2000.com  for the *best* OpenVMS system securityE >>                            solutions that others only claim to be.  >  >  > B > why not windoze only ... it is fine as a client, but that is it!  8 I though that the whole problem with Windows was that it6 isn't fine as a client unless you like patching a lot,< crashing a lot and being hit by regular security violations.   Regards  Andrew Harrison    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 10:15:46 +0100 * From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@[127.0.0.1]>0 Subject: Re: slap in the face again... thanks HP' Message-ID: <cbbhoi$a1l$1@lore.csc.com>    Bob Ceculski wrote:  > Z > VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote in message news:<00A33BCA.6247AC22@SendSpamHere.ORG>... > > 9 > > Still, there's no reason for making it WEENDOZE only.  > > --F > > http://www.legacy-2000.com  for the *best* OpenVMS system securityG > >                             solutions that others only claim to be.  > B > why not windoze only ... it is fine as a client, but that is it!   Bob,   One size does not fit all.    You can't just "dis" a platform.  # So where is the DVD player for VMS?   ' Where is the digital audio I/O for VMS?    Webcam for VMS?    Scanner for VMS?  B It is a case of inter operating, so I use the VMS box to serve theC webcams and bulk process scans, but I work a lot with digital audio " using discrete A/D D/A converters.  @ I'm not taking a potshot, you just need to realise that even VMSF professionals have to use other commodity platforms. I believe the GNVF project will get us there, but we're not there yet, possibly never mayH be perfoectly, because some things require a compromise that could neverF really work with VMS, because the operating systems (and I'll use thatF term loosely in a certain case) are at opposite poles, and the fact itE is possible to override the 'operating system' makes that application  work!    --  ? Regards, Nic Clews a.k.a. Mr. CP Charges, CSC Computer Sciences  nclews at csc dot com    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 07:23:45 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) 0 Subject: Re: slap in the face again... thanks HP3 Message-ID: <5JbkyjdJfWQo@eisner.encompasserve.org>   T In article <cbbhoi$a1l$1@lore.csc.com>, Nic Clews <sendspamhere@[127.0.0.1]> writes: > Bob Ceculski wrote:  >>  [ >> VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote in message news:<00A33BCA.6247AC22@SendSpamHere.ORG>...  >> >: >> > Still, there's no reason for making it WEENDOZE only. >> > -- G >> > http://www.legacy-2000.com  for the *best* OpenVMS system security H >> >                             solutions that others only claim to be. >>  C >> why not windoze only ... it is fine as a client, but that is it!  >  > Bob, >  > One size does not fit all. > " > You can't just "dis" a platform. > % > So where is the DVD player for VMS?  > ) > Where is the digital audio I/O for VMS?  >  > Webcam for VMS?  >  > Scanner for VMS?  N Third party vendors want to know -- where is the market to buy such software ?  G Seriously, if someone has a major need for which they would _pay_money_  they should discuss it here.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 14:27:59 +0100 * From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@[127.0.0.1]>0 Subject: Re: slap in the face again... thanks HP' Message-ID: <cbc0hh$emq$1@lore.csc.com>    Larry Kilgallen wrote: > V > In article <cbbhoi$a1l$1@lore.csc.com>, Nic Clews <sendspamhere@[127.0.0.1]> writes: > >  > > One size does not fit all. > >  > > ' > > So where is the DVD player for VMS?  > > + > > Where is the digital audio I/O for VMS?  > >  > > Webcam for VMS?  > >  > > Scanner for VMS? > P > Third party vendors want to know -- where is the market to buy such software ? > I > Seriously, if someone has a major need for which they would _pay_money_  > they should discuss it here.  E Larry you make a valid point and worthy of discussion. So if you look G closely at (say) the digital audio side, I'm taking an analogue source, A using a discrete A to D converter to produce my raw digital audio G signal, which I then want to manipulate, filter, edit, cut into tracks, G among other tasks. Mission critical it isn't, the only uptime I require F is during the real time capture and the processing before it's writtenG to the target media. Pay costs, no because there are freeware and cheap G ware tools for the platform I'm using and it's tolerant of the hardware C I've installed to perform the task, which may or may not make a VMS - system unstable if it were installed in such.   F But that is the point overall. A film of 2 hours duration for playbackF needs less than 10% availability in a 24 hour period. It is a tool. ItH has a cost effective breakpoint that the enterprise capable systems (andE I also mean others besides VMS) cannot approach. The expectation that F you can do _everything_ _natively_ on VMS is, these days, unrealistic.   --  ? Regards, Nic Clews a.k.a. Mr. CP Charges, CSC Computer Sciences  nclews at csc dot com    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 07:58:33 -0700 + From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com> 0 Subject: Re: slap in the face again... thanks HP' Message-ID: <40D99A99.3010403@MMaz.com>    Larry Kilgallen wrote:  U >In article <cbbhoi$a1l$1@lore.csc.com>, Nic Clews <sendspamhere@[127.0.0.1]> writes:  >    >  >>Bob Ceculski wrote:  >>     >>[ >>>VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote in message news:<00A33BCA.6247AC22@SendSpamHere.ORG>... 	 >>>        >>> 9 >>>>Still, there's no reason for making it WEENDOZE only.  >>>>--F >>>>http://www.legacy-2000.com  for the *best* OpenVMS system securityG >>>>                            solutions that others only claim to be.  >>>>         >>>>C >>>why not windoze only ... it is fine as a client, but that is it! 	 >>>        >>>  >>Bob, >> >>One size does not fit all. >>" >>You can't just "dis" a platform. >>% >>So where is the DVD player for VMS?  >>) >>Where is the digital audio I/O for VMS?  >> >>Webcam for VMS?  >> >>Scanner for VMS? >>     >> > O >Third party vendors want to know -- where is the market to buy such software ?  > H >Seriously, if someone has a major need for which they would _pay_money_ >they should discuss it here.  >    > @ Perhaps you should exchange the location of the word 'major' to:  2 'has a need to which they would _pay_major_money_'  I because that is exactly what you are suggesting, to move apps that don't  G exist, and the ROI for porting to VMS running on VAX, Alpha, or Itanic  F cannot be cost justified either because the volume doesn't exist (for F the developer) or the resources are too demanding and intense for the  cost (for the user).  G VMS is not a one-size fits all solution, never has (VWS and DECwindows  G proved that), never will be (Linux is the only OS that traceable, year  I by year growth outside of statistical error) and it is those who believe  F otherwise that probably only have one tool in their tool box at home, C probably just a hammer...  I have been using VMS for 25 years now,  @ Ultrix, DEC Unix/Tru64 for 'bout 10, and Linux for about 8 with I DOS/Windows/OS/2 smeared in there for about fifteen and I haven't always  I enjoyed the non-VMS work, but it is work!  This isn't meant to be a shot  B at anyone, but the OS religious wars are over, yes Windows sucks, G Un*x/Linux still exists and is growing, but I honestly have to believe  H that the VMS people that have had problems finding work is because they - have refused to diversify their skill sets...    Barry    --    > Barry Treahy, Jr                       E-mail: Treahy@MMaz.com> Midwest Microwave                          Phone: 480/314-1320> Vice President & CIO                         FAX: 480/661-7028                            ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 11:24:22 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) 0 Subject: Re: slap in the face again... thanks HP3 Message-ID: <UGy3DC7Uoggz@eisner.encompasserve.org>   U In article <40D99A99.3010403@MMaz.com>, "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com> writes:  > Larry Kilgallen wrote:  P >>Third party vendors want to know -- where is the market to buy such software ? >>I >>Seriously, if someone has a major need for which they would _pay_money_  >>they should discuss it here. >>   >>B > Perhaps you should exchange the location of the word 'major' to: > 4 > 'has a need to which they would _pay_major_money_' > K > because that is exactly what you are suggesting, to move apps that don't  I > exist, and the ROI for porting to VMS running on VAX, Alpha, or Itanic  H > cannot be cost justified either because the volume doesn't exist (for H > the developer) or the resources are too demanding and intense for the  > cost (for the user).  ? Not every implementation involves porting, and it _can_ be more % expensive than starting from scratch.   A I am involved in porting what I would call a major application to B VMS and half of the work involves commenting out hand-written code+ for which there is a VMS facility in place.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 11:02:54 +0100 * From: Nic Clews <sendspamhere@[127.0.0.1]>& Subject: Re: SSH protocol in VMS 5.5-2' Message-ID: <cbbkh0$av6$1@lore.csc.com>    Shiva MahaDeva wrote:  > / > Is there any free SSH protocol to VMS 5.5-2 ? 1 > I'd like connect to Solaris box from VMS box...    Ah.    [No offence intended here].   E So we're running this steam powered traction engine, and we'd like to  race it on an F1 track...   G So we have this MS-DOS 286 based application, and we'd like to run Java  on it...  A We have a 78 rpm gramophone, and we'd like to listen to SACD's...   A We have a [Acorn] BBC model B on ECONET we'd like to connect to a  gigabit ethernet...    We could go on.   E Speaking seriously, something that may have escaped your attention is F that VMS is generally upwardly compatible, try a VAX/VMS (if you must)D 7.3, unless your application coders were insistent on breaking every> rule in the documentation set, you'll find it should all work.  : When IT investment is made, you need to consider the wholeG infrastructure, running the latest bells and whistles means your legacy D (read as "systems that work without constant fiddling or attention") system also need investment.   I hope this helps.  G Would you like ketchup with your dinosaur burger? Don't worry about the + cost, it was built into that of the burger.  --  ? Regards, Nic Clews a.k.a. Mr. CP Charges, CSC Computer Sciences  nclews at csc dot com    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 23 Jun 2004 10:15:19 +0100 , From: "Ian Dean" <Ian.d.dean@baesystems.com> Subject: UDP broadcast sockets3 Message-ID: <40d948df$1_1@baen1673807.greenlnk.net>    Hi, L     I have an obscure problem that someone may have come across before. I amI trying to use a UDP socket in broadcast mode, but it blocks after a short & time, preventing data from being sent.E   I have even tried sending data to a specific node as opposed to the - overall network but this had the same effect. L   In order to cope with blocking, I set the socket to NON-blocking, but thisH just returns the error "would have blocked" (I cannot remember the exactL message). Although the program no longer blocked output, no further data was sent. J   If this is a bit wordy (and I know some people like to see code), I will  try to provide a potted version. Thanks in advance    Ian    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 09:57:21 -07001 From: keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com (Keith Parris) / Subject: Re: VMS Gets Short Shrift at HP World. = Message-ID: <cf15391e.0406230857.1abf5e40@posting.google.com>   X VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote in message news:<00A338D7.F0D8E589@SendSpamHere.ORG>...9 > Where are the operating system software accreditations?   ? CSA (Certified System Administrator) and CSE (Certified Systems B Engineer) are both "operating system certifications" (they're even listed under that heading atF http://h10017.www1.hp.com/certification/americas/certifications.html).B Operating system options for CSA accreditation include "HP OpenVMSC v7", "HP Tru64 UNIX v5", and "HP-UX v11", and for CSE, those same 3  plus "HP NonStop Kernel".    ------------------------------    Date: 23 Jun 2004 12:40:15 -06004 From: kuhrt@nospammy.encompasserve.org (Marty Kuhrt)/ Subject: Re: VMS Gets Short Shrift at HP World. 3 Message-ID: <zD0$vbh$bHen@eisner.encompasserve.org>   U In article <40CFBF62.4060806@MMaz.com>, "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com> writes:  > John Vottero wrote:  > . >><VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG> wrote in message, >>news:00A3362F.0990A3D5@SendSpamHere.ORG... >>   >>> >>>In article <40CEC627.1090803@MMaz.com>, "Barry Treahy, Jr." >>>      >>>  >><Treahy@MMaz.com> writes:  >>   >> >>>>David J Dachtera wrote:  >>>>
 >>>>       >>>>H >>>>>Well, looks like hp is continuing its VMS-cide efforts even with HPI >>>>>World (the current incarnation of "DECUS"). I looked at the complete J >>>>>session catalog in its current form (to see if any of my ten sessionsK >>>>>were scheduled - none were found) and was surprised at how few OpenVMS  >>>>>sessions there are. >>>>> L >>>>>I just took a fast count. I show 319 sessions, of which only 20 mentionK >>>>>VMS (using SEARCH on OpenVMS on text copied from the web page). I make  >>>>>that as 6.2% of the total.  >>>>> # >>>>>Pretty sorry state of affairs.  >>>>> 6 >>>>>It seems VMS is getting the short end once again. >>>>> J >>>>>..unless VMS and VMS-related services make up only 6.2% of hp's total >>>>>profits (doubtful)... >>>>>  >>>>>  >>>>> 
 >>>>>          >>>>> K >>>>Well, when you have Sue at HP pitching Dell jobs on the Encompass list,  >>>>what does that tell you...
 >>>>       >>>>! >>>Don't take cheap shots at Sue!  >>> F >>>If David wants a symposium with OpenVMS content, he just missed it.E >>>Abandon the symposium formerly known as DECUS and head off instead 3 >>>to the OpenVMS Bootcamps Sue has been arranging.  >>> E >>>DECUS started taking a downward spiral in the proverbial porcelain E >>>thone a long time ago.  The introduction of the "trade show" seems E >>>to be the defining moment for the first few dynes being applied to D >>>the flush mechanism's lever.  Under Compaq, the renaming of DECUSE >>>and symposium helped to increase the effort applied to that lever. D >>>Incorporating the world of the PeeCee weenies really sent many ofD >>>the traditional DECUS types scrambling to push down that lever as# >>>hard and repeatedly as possible.  >>> F >>>HP World is a trade show with a couple of symposium-like character-E >>>istics.  I wouldn't be too concerned with lack of VMS content.  It D >>>is like being concerned with whether or not the water in the bowlE >>>is blue or clear in conjunction with the other nasty bits that are  >>>floating inside it. >>>  >>>      >>>  >>N >>I whole heartedly agree!!  The bootcamp has the look and feel of symposia ofL >>the 80s.  Great technical content, more VMS engineers than you can shake aK >>cat at and just the right mix of trade show: 1 night, 3 hours, free beer!  >>   >>K > And might as well be on the moon for us on the West Coast.  At least the  G > old DECUS Symposia, and yes I attended both coasts faithfully in the  7 > 80's and early 90's, alternated, ergo, 'both coasts.'   C I'm a left coaster, and I didn't have a problem.  SWA had a cheap,  ( one-stop, flight from OAK to MHT.  YMMV.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2004.347 ************************