1 INFO-VAX	Tue, 02 Mar 2004	Volume 2004 : Issue 122       Contents:. Re: An honest question from a VMS guy about JF4 Re: COMputable image linker map program counter help- Re: Educating HP employees on the nettiquette  Re: EVA disk storage Re: EVA disk storage RE: Interex's Cnet  Ad Re: Interex's Cnet  Ad Re: Interex's Cnet  Ad Market for Alphastation 500/266 # Re: Market for Alphastation 500/266 ! Re: MUMPS/DSM/M for OpenVMS Alpha  Re: OpenVMS Feelings Re: Probably a dumb question PWS 433au disk problems. RE: PWS 433au disk problems.( Re: Strange SOR$ errors - solution found+ Re: VMS Hobbyist License program abolished? + Re: VMS Hobbyist License program abolished? ; Re: VMS Standalone Backup bootable tape image for emulator? ; Re: VMS Standalone Backup bootable tape image for emulator? ; Re: VMS Standalone Backup bootable tape image for emulator? . Re: WARNING: Your messages are being cancelled Re: Zip/update Issue Re: Zip/update Issue Re: Zip/update Issue Re: Zip/update Issue Re: Zip/update Issue& [OT]: Here's a good one for Leo Demers  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 2 Mar 2004 13:58:07 +1100  From: HUMBUG <humbug@bit.bucket>7 Subject: Re: An honest question from a VMS guy about JF , Message-ID: <vq9dh1-jpi.ln1@deep.bit.bucket>  E On Mon, 01 Mar 2004 16:33:59 GMT, John N. <JNixon@cfl.rr.com> Wrote : M > What is all this garbage about JF Mezei and how can it go on so long?  This D > makes me think I am reading a PC newsgroup instead of a VMS group.  F Just filter any posts coming from dizum.com, ddeo.es and alias.net and; you'll only see posts from people responding to the trolls.      --     Humbug   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Mar 2004 13:46:57 -0800 , From: JimStrehlow@data911.com (Jim Strehlow)= Subject: Re: COMputable image linker map program counter help = Message-ID: <4b6ec350.0403011346.2624ac75@posting.google.com>   E > We did a $SHOW PROCESS/CONTINUOUS to get several PC address values. . > The PC ranges from 006F7510 through 00ADA638 > 5 We try to have a separate batch DCL command procedure  (a "batch watchdog process"); that acts as a watchdog over the troublesome other process.   > How can we capture $SHOW PROCESS/CONTINUOUS or program counter( information in a batch watchdog process?@ F$GETJPI does not appear to display program counter information.> We tried to submit a watchdog procedure that attempted to do a $SHOW PROCESS/CONTINUOUS? for ten seconds that we then attempt to DELETE /ENTRY= '$entry' 9 but the SHOW PROCESS/CONTINUOUS command yields the error: A %RMS-F-DEV, error in device name or inappropriate device type for 	 operation    Thanks for the previous help.   ' Jim Strehlow, Data911, Alameda, CA, USA A "The boss reminded us that we only have a week left to finish our * project, so we ought to be half done now." "You have not even started.") "Yeah, but I work better under pressure." ( "Actually you work only under pressure."D "That way the work time is more miserable; but there is less of it."A  variation of a Calvin and Hobbes cartoon by Bill Watterson, 1995    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 15:49:11 -0500 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>6 Subject: Re: Educating HP employees on the nettiquette) Message-ID: <4043A1C1.7E387034@istop.com>    Paul Sture wrote: J > Unfortunately it was sold as if it would increase product quality, whichI > is the reason many companies and govt. bodies came to insist they would % > only deal with certified suppliers.   J By reducing the number of widgets that you ship with defects, you increaseN overall/average product quality. (but it doesn't increase the quality of those$ products which don't have a defect).  M But there is also the issue that you are likely to find faults in the process K while doing the 9000 paperwork and by fixing those faults, you may increase  yield (fewer defects rejected).   K Of course, in most cases, the additional 9000 paperwork and burden probably O costs more than the savings from the slightly better quality and fewer rejects.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:14:59 -0500* From: "Marty O'Connor" <moconnor@dvfs.com> Subject: Re: EVA disk storage : Message-ID: <c2094b$1m0neh$1@ID-118202.news.uni-berlin.de>  . "John N." <JNixon@cfl.rr.com> wrote in message7 news:gzJ0c.175357$Po1.158822@twister.tampabay.rr.com... I : I have received some conflicting information from two different vendors  : regarding the EVA3000. : M : One of the vendors said that there is an EVA 3000 configuration that can be E : mounted in a standard cabinet, along with a couple of ES4X systems.  : G : The other vendor said all EVA storage arrays must be in a special EVA 0 : cabinet, as the bus is built into the cabinet. : 0 : Which vendor should receive my purchase order? :  : a The bus built into the cabinet is an EVA management bus not a data bus. I have an EVA5000 and I'm 3 fairly certain that the 3000 is basically the same.    Marty    ------------------------------   Date: 1 Mar 2004 21:17:40 -0600 + From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)  Subject: Re: EVA disk storage 3 Message-ID: <vE7sg75Too9y@eisner.encompasserve.org>    In article <2VR0c.3066$yJ7.924824681@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com>, Michael Austin <maustin@no-more-spam.firstdbasource.com> writes:   > K > Does any one have/use the XP or the Generic HDS Thunder/Lightning series  G > boxes. What is your experience with the technology, support, pricing   > etc... >   & 	Another thing, come to think of it...  : http://h18006.www1.hp.com/storage/casestudies/factset.html  J "The HP StorageWorks Enterprise Virtual Array 5000 system outperformed theD Hitachi modular array in all of the critical areas in the HP OpenVMSO environment, including the price-performance category," Young reports. "We also L noticed a substantial performance increase compared to our previous SCSI-and CI-based storage environment."  < 	I'd presume that was the Thunder but you'd probably want to 	contact FactSet to confirm.   				Rob    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 15:39:03 -05000 From: "Brian Tillman" <Tillman@sparkingwire.com> Subject: RE: Interex's Cnet  Ad . Message-ID: <01299A13.C22236@sparkingwire.com>   JF Mezei wrote:   ; > And now that Compaq has been burried deeper than Digital,  > shouldn't the user? > group return to its real name and end this encompass/whatever G > nightmare ? Because Interex is the "real" user group for HP, there is  > absolutely no reason7 > for DECUS to pretend it is anything more that a group ! > representing Digital customers.   I I have no idea where you get this idea JF, but you couldn't be more wrong  (so what else is new?)  = > It was absolute stupidity (whether forced by Compaq or not)  > to kill the unique> > and well known worldwide DECUS branding, especially since it > was not replaced, > by a consistent branding across the world.  L No one "killed" it.  You're living in a world of your own imaginings, seeing comspiracies everywhere.  G > Ifd Carly and Stallard really wanted to show they meant their virtual < > commitment to VMS, they would tell the varous ex-DUCS user > groups around the = > world to return to the DECUS branding, and she would remove  > the stupid "open" > > from VMS. That would show that HP has taken ownership of VMS > and will start to : > fix and repair all the damage done in the past 14 years.  B That boat sailed long ago.  You're obviously stranded on the dock. --  
 Brian Tillman    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:08:27 -0500* From: "Marty O'Connor" <moconnor@dvfs.com> Subject: Re: Interex's Cnet  Ad : Message-ID: <c208o4$1oc8np$1@ID-118202.news.uni-berlin.de>  5 "Bill Gunshannon" <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote in message 4 news:c1verg$1n88ig$1@ID-135708.news.uni-berlin.de...? : In article <d5ce4b06.0402291840.526841a9@posting.google.com>, 2 : al5vf03p02@sneakemail.com (William Webb) writes: : > ; : > WWWebb, who still carries his DECUS card in his wallet.  : / : What, you mean I'm not the only one!!!!   :-)  :  : bill : ! For sure you're not the only one.    Marty    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 21:42:09 -0500 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> Subject: Re: Interex's Cnet  Ad ) Message-ID: <4043F47F.28F86D38@istop.com>    Brian Tillman wrote:D > That boat sailed long ago.  You're obviously stranded on the dock.  L Yep, and look at where what is left of DECUS under of variety of names. I am% glad I didn't board the sinking ship.   M At the time of the Compaq merger, various DECUS chapters were asked by Compaq H to broaden their horizons and include all Compaq products. After all, ifL Compaq was to keep supporting a user group, that user group should representO Compaq's real products, not some legacy leftovers from the Digital indigestion.   G In some chapters, that was also pressure to merge the Tandem user group  chapters (ITUG).  G In the past, a DECUS Canada member was recognized by a DECUS USA member J because of the shared logo and branding. But how many in the USA know that% DECUS Canada is now known as CANACU ? M Heck, I don't even know if what is left of DECUS Canada has its own new logo.   N I will repeat again: now that we are under HP which intends to keep Interex asN the "premier" user group for HP's core products, there is no need for the userN groups formerly known as DECUS around the world to pretend to be any more thanG a group that brings together users who have an interest in products and 6 services which have a Digital Equipment Corp heritage.  M What is needed is to refloat the DECUS ship sunk by Compaq and bring back its 7 original flag and put it back on its original heading.    N You have to learn that a user group cannot be everything to everyone. You needM to focus and remained focused.  You can have a bit of icing on the cake (such L as sprinkling of unix and Windows), but your core needs to remain focused on? something which no other group does: Digital heritage products.    ------------------------------   Date: 1 Mar 2004 18:18:48 -0800 , From: mcbill20@hotmail.com (Bill McLaughlin)( Subject: Market for Alphastation 500/266= Message-ID: <e9cbc4f2.0403011818.6255918a@posting.google.com>   F Hello all. I am retiring an Alphastation 500/266. My electric bill has@ been steadily rising so I am going to try and get by on a singleC machine rather than a cluster. I was planning on selling it on Ebay D but to be honest, I have no idea what to price it at and I am afraidF that if I do a "no reserve" auction, I may find that it sells for $20.7 Does anyone here have any suggestions? Here's the info:    - AS500/266 P/N PB540-A9 - 256MB  - 2GB SCSI disk (x2) - SCSI CDROMB - graphics adapter (the "standard" one, works with VMS; don't know model offhand) - VMS base license - VMS additional 4 user license  - VMS full cluster license  B I also have an older condist from 1995 or so and possibly one from 1999. % Any suggestions would be appreciated.    Thanks.  Bill McLaughlin    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 23:10:04 -0500 3 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <rgilbert88@comcast.net> , Subject: Re: Market for Alphastation 500/2660 Message-ID: <Z-2dnVy1KYSTlNndRVn-iQ@comcast.com>  A Your hardware should bring $300-$400 on e-Bay.  The licenses, if  @ legitimately transferable, are worth a great deal more than the I hardware.    You could try searching "Complete items" to see if anything  A similar has sold in the last 90 days and, if so, what it brought.   F I'd offer to buy it myself but my wife would want to know if I REALLY   needed four Alphas. . . . <sigh>     Bill McLaughlin wrote:  G >Hello all. I am retiring an Alphastation 500/266. My electric bill has A >been steadily rising so I am going to try and get by on a single D >machine rather than a cluster. I was planning on selling it on EbayE >but to be honest, I have no idea what to price it at and I am afraid G >that if I do a "no reserve" auction, I may find that it sells for $20. 8 >Does anyone here have any suggestions? Here's the info: >  >- AS500/266 P/N PB540-A9  >- 256MB >- 2GB SCSI disk (x2) 
 >- SCSI CDROM C >- graphics adapter (the "standard" one, works with VMS; don't know  >model offhand)  >- VMS base license   >- VMS additional 4 user license >- VMS full cluster license  > C >I also have an older condist from 1995 or so and possibly one from  >1999.& >Any suggestions would be appreciated. >  >Thanks. >Bill McLaughlin >    >    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 18:04:18 -0600 @ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>* Subject: Re: MUMPS/DSM/M for OpenVMS Alpha6 Message-ID: <4043CF82.DD59DD9C@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>   Wesley Dunnahoo wrote: > E > I am setting up OpenVMS on my PWS 600au under the hobbyist license. H > I've been approached about some programming opportunities for OpenVMS.I > They require MUMPS experience that I don't have (yet).  I'm looking for F > a version of MUMPS, DSM (Digital Standard Mumps) or M (whatever it'sH > called now) that I can load on hobbyist system in order to learn MUMPSI > programming/database.  I've found several good looking web sites on the C > language and on learning it.  I found some versions available for H > various UNIX/Linux platforms but have no idea about where to get a VMSI > version.  I found mention of InterSystems buying DSM from Digital in or 0 > around 1990 but their site doesn't mention it. > L > Does anyone know if a VMS Alpha version exists and how much it would cost?  C Unless its REALLY Digital Standard MUMPS (DSM) or an existing MUMPS . application on InterSystems MUMPS, be advised:  E InterSystems renamed "MUMPS" and now calls it Cache' (say "cash AY"). G The language is now very BASIC-like in appearance, although the current * Cache' still supports existing MUMPS code.  D Also, existing documentation on the MUMPS langauge is becoming a bitF rare. One of my vendors holds it almost a trade-secret. If you do findH something coherent and understandable, please post the URL (or book name( and publisher) here. I'd like to see it.   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 02:42:15 -0000 , From: rdd@rhiannon.rddavis.org (R. D. Davis) Subject: Re: OpenVMS Feelings 0 Message-ID: <1047t47jqfv8m20@corp.supernews.com>  = In article <857e9e41.0402161326.7ce87bb6@posting.google.com>, 4 	susan_skonetski@hotmail.com (Sue Skonetski) writes: > Folks, > D > We are working every day to try and get VMS mentioned where we canG > within HP and fix web sites when we find them.  However when articles    Thanks. :-)   C > are writted by the press we (VMS group) can not affect that.  Its A > funny sort of like "of course you think your baby is beautiful" 0 > attitude.  Thats where the newsgroup can help.  E Of course, just discussing VMS in this newsgroup isn't the answer, it @ needs to be discussed positively in other newsgroups as well, on mailing lists, web sites, etc.  @ Thanks for continuing support for the OpenVMS hobbyist licensingF program; that's one step in the right direction.  Now, if you can justB get more college aged users interested in it; perhaps sponsor someF activities and parties for campus computer groups with OpenVMS printed$ on napkins, give-away T-shirts, etc.  D Now, if only DEC would port SRC Modula-3 to VMS, that would make VMSB all the more useful.  True, not many people are using it, and likeF VMS, it's under-recognized.  However, the combination of the two wouldA create one great system environment, and just think, if you could A allow assembler instructions in the Modula-3 code, e.g., assembly D instructions bracketed by ASM and END (the old Fitted Software Tools; Modula-2 compiler for MS-DOS allowed that; it was great!).    B Also, have you considered marketing some Alpha systems to home andB small business users?  Such users would find the systems easier toB maintain than Linux/FreeBSD systems, at least as reliable, and far> more reliable than Micro$oft products.  Bundle them with a webE browser, PPP software, emacs, a word processor (yes, I know, bletch), D LaTex, (for those who know better than to use word processors), thenE toss in PostgreSQL---I understand that someone alomost had it working F on a VAX running VMS, and perhaps some UNIX-like utilities, and you'llB have an unbeatable system.  HP already has some consumer and smallA business sales channels for its PC equipment, which it can use to  market systems running VMS.   # Two lines of VMS you could work on:   E - VMS under a VAX emulator on Linux (or FreeBSD for more reliability)   G - VMS on Alpha, or a new VAX, for the most reliability and simplicity.    $ Just my two cents worth.  Good luck!   C > Dave, yes I know its HP managment we are talking about and we are B > doing our best to educate them.  But lets face it they listen to > customers more carefully.    ...some customers.   --  N Copyright (C) 2003 R. D. Davis The difference between humans & other animals: M All Rights Reserved | My VAX | an unnatural belief that we're above Nature &  O www.rddavis.org | runs VMS & | her other creatures, using dogma to justify such I 410-744-4900 | doesn't crash!| beliefs and to justify much human cruelty.    ------------------------------   Date: 1 Mar 2004 18:10:25 -0800 1 From: susan_skonetski@hotmail.com (Sue Skonetski) % Subject: Re: Probably a dumb question = Message-ID: <857e9e41.0403011810.7c0a369b@posting.google.com>     Thank you all for your comments.   sue       a brandon@dalsemi.com (John Brandon) wrote in message news:<04022008374854@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>... > > In article <857e9e41.0402200449.52f22cb@posting.google.com>,5 > susan_skonetski@hotmail.com (Sue Skonetski) writes:  > G > > Can somone explain to me why there keeps being really horrible mail J > > about JF in a newsgroup like this one (computer related)? I guess I do1 > > not understand the objective of such garbage.  >  > Garbage is correct.  >  >  >  >  > J*o*h*n B*r*a*n*d*o*n  > VMS Systems Administrator , > firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 00:05:56 +0100 9 From: Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com> ! Subject: PWS 433au disk problems. ' Message-ID: <4043C1D3.F8D4647A@aaa.com>    Hi all PWS-lovers !   ; I have some troubles with my rather new (for me) PWS 433au.   : I have one SCSI card (standard ISP 1040 type) with nothing6 connected internaly and one BA356 box with a couple of- 9Gb disks (mostly RZ1CB-CS and one RZ1CF-CF).   ; Now, with a single disk (DKA0) in the BA356, I can boot VMS  (7.3-1).  4 If I mount more disks in the box, I get all sorts of2 troubles. >>>SHO DEV looks OK sometimes, sometimes4 I get devices like DKA200, DKA201, DKA202, sometimes it just re-inits itself.  4 If I boot VMS with only DKA0 in the box, I can later9 push in the rest of the disks, run MC SYSMAN IO AUTO, and 5 they are all playing. After re-run of rellevent parts - of the systartup, everything works just fine.   < But if I now run a SHUTDOWN, I can't reboot anymore (without  pulling out all disks but DKA0).  C I have changed the SCSI cable from 3m to 2m (BN21K-03 to BN21K-02). ? I have also replaced the "personality module", the one with one A connector in the front and one on the inside with another (same).   F I have checked the whole box for any bent pins in the disk connectors. The same with all cables.   : As far as I understand you don not *have* to have anything= connected on the internal conectors on the SCSI card, right ?   6 What about the connectors under the fans on the back ?6 There is one connector (terminator ?) connected at the= connector at the "bottom" (SCSI cable comes in at the "top"). A And there is one empty connector near the top. Note, we are still ( at the back of the BA356 under the fans.   Any thoughts ?   Best Regards Jan-Erik Sderholm.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 18:33:11 -0800# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> % Subject: RE: PWS 433au disk problems. 9 Message-ID: <IPEGKJECKHGHJKIDHKKMAEKBCHAA.tom@kednos.com>   ; You might try throwing the switch on the BA356 interface to  put it into the upper range    -----Original Message------ From: Jan-Erik Sderholm [mailto:aaa@aaa.com] $ Sent: Monday, March 01, 2004 3:06 PM To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ! Subject: PWS 433au disk problems.      Hi all PWS-lovers !   ; I have some troubles with my rather new (for me) PWS 433au.   : I have one SCSI card (standard ISP 1040 type) with nothing6 connected internaly and one BA356 box with a couple of- 9Gb disks (mostly RZ1CB-CS and one RZ1CF-CF).   ; Now, with a single disk (DKA0) in the BA356, I can boot VMS  (7.3-1).  4 If I mount more disks in the box, I get all sorts of2 troubles. >>>SHO DEV looks OK sometimes, sometimes4 I get devices like DKA200, DKA201, DKA202, sometimes it just re-inits itself.  4 If I boot VMS with only DKA0 in the box, I can later9 push in the rest of the disks, run MC SYSMAN IO AUTO, and 5 they are all playing. After re-run of rellevent parts - of the systartup, everything works just fine.   < But if I now run a SHUTDOWN, I can't reboot anymore (without  pulling out all disks but DKA0).  C I have changed the SCSI cable from 3m to 2m (BN21K-03 to BN21K-02). ? I have also replaced the "personality module", the one with one A connector in the front and one on the inside with another (same).   F I have checked the whole box for any bent pins in the disk connectors. The same with all cables.   : As far as I understand you don not *have* to have anything= connected on the internal conectors on the SCSI card, right ?   6 What about the connectors under the fans on the back ?6 There is one connector (terminator ?) connected at the= connector at the "bottom" (SCSI cable comes in at the "top"). A And there is one empty connector near the top. Note, we are still ( at the back of the BA356 under the fans.   Any thoughts ?   Best Regards Jan-Erik Sderholm.    ------------------------------   Date: 1 Mar 2004 16:06:43 -0800 0 From: chris@townleyc.demon.co.uk (Chris Townley)1 Subject: Re: Strange SOR$ errors - solution found < Message-ID: <93b50805.0403011606.21a791c@posting.google.com>  M mckinneyj@cpva.saic.com wrote in message news:<g5CqYWbbOabn@cpva.saic.com>... ? > In article <93b50805.0402261758.457bd05a@posting.google.com>, 5 >  chris@townleyc.demon.co.uk (Chris Townley) writes: Q > > mckinneyj@cpva.saic.com wrote in message news:<AFDpBicHotQ9@cpva.saic.com>... B > >> In article <93b50805.0402251036.5c53d5cb@posting.google.com>,8 > >>  chris@townleyc.demon.co.uk (Chris Townley) writes:I > >> > I have an issue with SOR routines in a DEC Basic program, run as a @ > >> > detached process using SYS$CREPRC. This is BASIC V1.3-000J > >> > compiled/linked under OpenVMS V6.2 (Alpha). Images being run on theD > >> > same version. High performance sort is not in use. I have now. > >> > recreated on a standalone test machine. > >> >  L > >> > There are many large data structures, so the working set is high, but5 > >> > as far as I can see there are no quota issues.  > >> >  L > >> > After initialising 4 record sorts, and putting 5000 or 6000 in two ofB > >> > them (records sizes are 6 and 61) LIB$RELEASE_REC returns a > >> > SORT-E-OPENOUT error.L > >> > It is made more difficult as I cannot recreate running interactively, > >> > nor in debug. > >> >  I > >> > I have played with the obvious quotas and WSEXTENT, as well as the ( > >> > number of work files to no avail. > >> >   > >> > Any pointers anybody ?  > >>  > > >> Insure that PQL_DPGFLQUOTA is greater than PQL_DWSEXTENT. > >  > > F > > that is interesting - the manual suggests reducing working set for > > high performance sort.H > > WSEXTENT is, as you suggest, picked up from PQL_MWSEXTENT, currentlyI > > 66000 whereas PGFLQUO is set from $CREPRC at 50000 (PQL min is lower) I > > However I tried dropping PQL_MWSEXTENT et al to 10000 (which I saw it I > > pick up) but this had no effect, neither in the error, nor the number @ > > of records it had written into the two sorts when it failed. > > I > > Still cant see the logic behind the OPENOUT error, unless it is to do H > > with workfiles. Lost access to the test machine today, so I will tryE > > setting some specific logicals for these where I can track them - - > > problem is it only takes a few seconds...  > > G > > Unless anyone with VMS internals knowledge can point me to what the  > > error means. > >  > > --  	 > > Chris  > G > Another guess... do you have $creprc run LOGINOUT? If not, then SORT  F > won't be able to open any work files as the logical name SYS$SCRATCHF > is undefined - unless you're defining it elsewhere. Logicals such asD > SYS$LOGIN and SYS$SCRATCH are defined by LOGINOUT. SORT opens workE > file in SYS$SCRATCH. If this is your problem you can either define  F > SYS$SCRATCH in some shared logical table or define it to on the fly 6 > in either the process or job table within your code.     Thanks to all who replied.  D As I thought, it wasnt quota related at all, but a misinterpretation# of parameters to the SOR$ routines.   F I should point out I hadnt written the routine - just trying to fix it* (thats my story, and I am sticking to it!)  @ There was a slightly incorrect definition of SOR$BEGIN_SORT, andE various optional parameters were omitted, rather than using 0% as the  manual suggests.  C As a result the context was being lost, and the call in error was I C believe effectively sending a record to a completed sort, hence the > confusing OPENOUT error. Anyway, I used the library defintion,D corrected the parameters, recompiled and tested over the weekend and today, and all looks hunky.    --   Chris    ------------------------------   Date: 1 Mar 2004 11:27:24 -0800 - From: wisniewski@vmsone.com (John Wisniewski) 4 Subject: Re: VMS Hobbyist License program abolished?= Message-ID: <2eaceefa.0403011127.239f35c4@posting.google.com>   ' Leave you guys alone for 10 minutes....     D Come listen to me and I'll tell you a tale.  A tale of maltiding andD woe, a tale of comp.os.vms, a tale for all it's denizens and foes...    ? I'm an HP Solutions Architect, I play one on TV and at national A events, I have a company badge, I get paid every two weeks (or is C bi-weekly now?) and my pension benefit page tells me that I've just ' past 18 years with DEC, Compaq, eh, HP.   F Madi the HP licensing Representative worked for DEC, Compaq and Now is an HP ; licensing representative with 20+ years with all companies.   C Now those who know me know of my few skills and talents and while I  claim toE know many things about computers, I have very little understanding of  how C any of the companies I've worked for do licensing on any given day.   C That's why I depend on people like Madi to give the latest BUSINESS ) INFORMATION for customers when I need to:    Buy licenses Transfer licenses # Correctly Licensing Cluster members E Convert the values of Older Licenses to Current Licenses in contracts  Upgrade Licenses< Explain the process for any of the above BUSINESS PRACTICES.  D Now does my not understanding Software Licensing make me any less of an HP D consultant?  I couldn't tell you prices, how to license a cluster or whatD the current upgrade path is for a VAX 11/750.  Those tasks have been	 delegated D to a trained license specialist for BUSINESS LICENSING who does that	 every day B for a living,  which leaves me free to focus on other "Technology"
 things for
 my customers.    With that Said --   @ Alan -- Madi's explanation of the process to transfer COMMERICAL BUSINESSB         LICENSES  for OpenVMS have been the same policy since I've beenB         working on 11/780s.   And if I remember correctly you need yourE         local geo's Sales Manager's Approval for any OpenVMS license  7         transfer before you can even begin the process.   C         There has never been an incentive for DEC/CPQ/HP to do this  type of A         transfer for DEC/CPQ/HP and the responsibility is on your 
 shoulders (or E         your used hardware Vendor's) to make this happen, if you want 	 to obtain 8         a Commercial license transfer for your system.    B         Licensablity has been one of main reasons for the the wide price >         differences between used hardware vendors for the same	 hardware.   B         In point of fact -- This has NOTHING AT ALL to do with the OpenVMS 6         Hobbyist Program's License GRANT to Hobbyists.     comp.os.vms denizens --   E         The HP OpenVMS License Grant is not a BUSINESS LICENSE it is  E         a License Grant for personal use on any personal VAX or Alpha F         The Hobbyist would like to use.  The OpenVMS Hobbyist License D         Grant requires no HW pedigree, statement of ownership, proofC         the system came from a legitimate transaction, the OpenVMS  F         Hobbyist gets a License Grant to run OpenVMS on their personalF         system.  (like the time Pat and I pulled 5 'personal' VAX 4000 105s3         from a dumpster but that's another story;-)   B         (History was that many PDPs went to the Scrap yard because
 there was not F         a way to transfer licenses at all unless the Hobbyist bought a brand E         new License from DEC.  VAXes were about to go the same way to 	 the scrap B         yard before Pat Jankowiak asked DEC to create the Hobbyist	 Program.)   F         To turn a machine into a Hobbyist System all you have to do isC         obtain the OpenVMS Hobbyist Paks, and load them.  Along the  way D         you've agreed to the OpenVMS Hobbyist Terms for your system:E         No commercial  use of this system.  Violate the Ts&Cs of the  4         contract and you're doing something illegal.         $         It's that black and white.    B         Call HP business licensing consultants when you need help 3         with a commerical licensing transaction.      F         Call David Cathey, or Myself when you have questions about theA         OpenVMS Hobbyist Program.  Our authority for the program  D         comes from Mark Gorham OpenVMS Vice President.  If you have F         nice things to say about the program send them to Mark, if youD         have problems getting your PAKs write David or me, or better yet,B         use the webpage and our staff of surly, tired, overworked, angry C         OpenVMS volunteers will promptly answer your E-mail with as  littleD         vitriol as is humanly possible for cranky middleaged OpenVMS guys.   D         Expect HP Business Consultants to know the details about the FREEF         OpenVMS Hobbyist Program and HP may want to begin charging forF         OpenVMS Hobbyist Licenses so that all the Business ConsultantsF         can be "Properly" trained to understand and help you with your          OpenVMS Hobbyist issues.  C         Or You can expect a division of labor and let us volunteers  keepD         the OpenVMS Hobbyist program working because we love OpenVMS4         (as much as we love being tired and surly;-)  D         And who would you rather talk to anyways? Crufty old OpenVMS guysF         or Business License Specialists?  When you think about it, I'm sure%         you'll make the right choice.   D         There no X-file conspiracy here, no master plan to eliminate the D         OpenVMS Hobbyist Program only a simple division of expertise and          a mistake.  F         Hear me now and believe me later, I'll figure out how to write thisE         up for the OpenVMS Hobbyist FAQ but until then I'll leave you  with a!         phrase from Steve Hoffman                                 "RTFAQ"   .         http://openvmshobbyist.org (.net,.com)           John Wisniewski 5         "Why Yes, I do work for HP out of my garage."          john.wisniewski@hp.com         http://vmsone.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 20:31:09 -0800 3 From: Alan Frisbie <Usenet01REMOVE@Flying-Disk.com> 4 Subject: Re: VMS Hobbyist License program abolished?. Message-ID: <40440E0D.4040003@Flying-Disk.com>   John,   9 Please keep in mind that I did not direct *ANY* questions 9 concerning the hobbyist license to Madi.   The topic only 8 came up after I inquired about transferring the original5 VMS license that I believed the system was sold with.   < After she basically shot me down, I said that since this was> not for commercial use anyway, I would simply use the hobbyist< license.   That is when she sent me the quote in my original posting.  A > Madi the HP licensing Representative worked for DEC, Compaq andU@  > Now is an HP licensing representative with 20+ years with all
  > companies.o  > After 20 years of working with VMS licensing, she still hasn't heard of the hobbyist program?  9 Wait until you see some of her other statements about VMS = licensing.   I'm giving her boss time to research them beforei: I post them here.   Lets just say that they are at extreme< variance with what VMS customers have been told for the last; fifteen years.   They may be "right", but they are not whata we were told at DECUS!  > I'm sure glad I saved the audio tapes of those DECUS sessions!   Alan   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 18:12:54 -0600e@ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>D Subject: Re: VMS Standalone Backup bootable tape image for emulator?6 Message-ID: <4043D186.ED2FC469@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>   "Robert G. Schaffrath" wrote:e > L > After many years out of the VMS business, I decided to try out the OpenVMSM > Hobbyist program.  I have applied for Associate Membership in Encompass and E > I managed to dig up a 7+ year old image backup of an old VMS V5.5-28M > VAXStation 4000 system disk that I had put in storage around the same time.eN > Luckily it was stored very well as I have been able to extract the tape dataM > as a raw tape image that the SIMH emulator should be able to use.  However,cM > I do not have a bootable standalone backup that I could use to recreate the J > disk through the emulator.  Other than purchasing the 7.3 CDROM, which IE > plan to do, is there a SIMH compatible version of standalone backup J > available for download somewhere?  I would love to try and get the 5.5-2I > system back online again.  Otherwise I would probably create just a 7.3aK > system disk and then restore the 5.5-2 backup to a second disk.  I am not-H > sure what the learning curve is between V5.5-2 and V7.3.  I missed the > entire V6.x series.a  C Hhmmm... Well of you have a CD drive will work with the VAXstation:8  G Now, I've never worked with SIMH or Charon-VAX, but this should work ont1 any platform - even a REAL VAX (what a concept!):d  < On the running system, build Stand-alone on the system disk.  G For SIMH or Charon-VAX, burn the system disk image to CD (note: Easy CD)F Creator may not be the best choice for that; try Gear or Nero or ...).  ) Boot from the CD, root E (B/R5=E0000000).e  G Then, you can do an image backup of the CD to the VAXstation's disk andeD have your existing OpenVMS-VAX system now running on the VAXstation.   -- I David J. Dachtera  dba DJE SystemsI http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 00:38:23 GMT 4 From: "Roert G. Schaffrath" <rschaffrath@yahoo.com>D Subject: Re: VMS Standalone Backup bootable tape image for emulator?% Message-ID: <4043D782.47BA@yahoo.com>0   David J. Dachtera wrote: >  > "Robert G. Schaffrath" wrote:  > > N > > After many years out of the VMS business, I decided to try out the OpenVMSO > > Hobbyist program.  I have applied for Associate Membership in Encompass andaG > > I managed to dig up a 7+ year old image backup of an old VMS V5.5-2nO > > VAXStation 4000 system disk that I had put in storage around the same time.eP > > Luckily it was stored very well as I have been able to extract the tape dataO > > as a raw tape image that the SIMH emulator should be able to use.  However,rO > > I do not have a bootable standalone backup that I could use to recreate the3L > > disk through the emulator.  Other than purchasing the 7.3 CDROM, which IG > > plan to do, is there a SIMH compatible version of standalone backuprL > > available for download somewhere?  I would love to try and get the 5.5-2K > > system back online again.  Otherwise I would probably create just a 7.3oM > > system disk and then restore the 5.5-2 backup to a second disk.  I am not-J > > sure what the learning curve is between V5.5-2 and V7.3.  I missed the > > entire V6.x series.3 > E > Hhmmm... Well of you have a CD drive will work with the VAXstation:  > I > Now, I've never worked with SIMH or Charon-VAX, but this should work on33 > any platform - even a REAL VAX (what a concept!):  > > > On the running system, build Stand-alone on the system disk. > I > For SIMH or Charon-VAX, burn the system disk image to CD (note: Easy CDAH > Creator may not be the best choice for that; try Gear or Nero or ...). > + > Boot from the CD, root E (B/R5=E0000000).o > I > Then, you can do an image backup of the CD to the VAXstation's disk andsF > have your existing OpenVMS-VAX system now running on the VAXstation. >  > -- > David J. Dachtera  > dba DJE SystemsY > http://www.djesys.com/ > * > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:! > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/s  A Sorry for the confusion.  I guess I misphrased the sentence.  ThewD VAXStation 4000, including the system disk, is long gone.  The imageD backup tape was put away in storage for seven years.  It is the onlyC thing remaining of that old system.  All I have now is the SIMH VAXeE emulator.  However, I do not have a bootable standalone backup that IrG can use with it in order to be able to restore from the tape image.  InfE fact, the only thing I have been able to boot against the emulator iseC BSD Unix but after playing with that for a few minutes I decided toe stick with Linux ;-)   Robert   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 20:51:29 -0500e2 From: "Stanley F. Quayle" <squayle@insight.rr.com>D Subject: Re: VMS Standalone Backup bootable tape image for emulator?. Message-ID: <4043A251.1752.141CD472@localhost>  4 On 2 Mar 2004 at 0:38, Ro=DFert G. Schaffrath wrote:@ > > > get the 5.5-2 system back online again.  Otherwise I wouldG > > > probably create just a 7.3 system disk and then restore the 5.5-2s > > > backup to a second disk.  D That, in general, won't boot.  In somewhere in the 7 series (7.1?), F the behavior of BACKUP changed.  Your disk will restore, but only VMS  7.x will be able to read it.  4 To get a bootable restore, you need to do TWO steps:   $ INIT DKA<target>: <label>i. $ BACKUP/IMAGE/NOINIT  MKA<tape>  DKA<target>:  C The reason is that BACKUP initializes the disk, unless you specify cB /NOINIT.  Beginning in 7.x, a different default cluster factor is E used by BACKUP.  The INIT command, however, uses the VMS 5.5 cluster r factor by default.  A As for standalone backup, any VMS installation disk will boot to >C standalone backup.  However, be sure to do the INIT from a working  D VMS system, since standalone backup doesn't allow you to do an INIT.  C Enjoy!  And if you want to buy a copy of CHARON-VAX for commercial aC purposes, don't forget your local reseller -- me!  [Shameless Plug > (tm) Alert].
 --Stan Quaylee Quayle Consulting Inc.  
 ----------C Stanley F. Quayle, P.E. N8SQ  +1 614-868-1363  Fax: +1 614 868-1671 1 8572 North Spring Ct. NW, Pickerington, OH  43147E= Preferred address:  stan@stanq.com       http://www.stanq.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 29 Feb 2004 21:57:28 -0500e From: Warren May <nosp@m.com>l7 Subject: Re: WARNING: Your messages are being cancelled 7 Message-ID: <uEx0c.373$JZ6.74025@news20.bellglobal.com>>   Warning wrote:N > If you participate in any of the dozens of newsgroups that JF Mezei infects,$ > your messages are being cancelled. > Q > He forges the names and e-mail addressess of newsgroup participants and cancelsT > their messages., > P > This is against the Terms of Service of his and all ISPs.  It also constitutes2 > identity theft and is illegal in many countries. >   # Fuck off, you useless sack of shit.h   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Mar 2004 13:10:56 -0800,, From: JimStrehlow@data911.com (Jim Strehlow) Subject: Re: Zip/update Issuei= Message-ID: <4b6ec350.0403011310.71641a09@posting.google.com>o  @ Using the following version of ZIP on many OpenVMS AlphaServers: $zip -ho  Copyright (C) 1990-1999 Info-ZIP Zip 2.3 (November 29th 1999).    ZIP "-V"; maintains OpenVMS attributes in the resultant zip file; but  ZIP 9 builds a Micro$oft Windows readable/extractable zip file.   @ I frequently use the above commands ... the first one for zip toC another OpenVMS destination ... the second for zip to Windows which D maintains the last modified date and not the date the files were FTP copied to Windows.  ' Jim Strehlow, Data911, Alameda, CA, USAsA "The boss reminded us that we only have a week left to finish our * project, so we ought to be half done now." "You have not even started.") "Yeah, but I work better under pressure."c( "Actually you work only under pressure."D "That way the work time is more miserable; but there is less of it."A  variation of a Calvin and Hobbes cartoon by Bill Watterson, 1995m   ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 1 Mar 2004 16:18:36 -0500 From: norm.raphael@metso.com Subject: Re: Zip/update IssuesQ Message-ID: <OFDE5C8480.6C582A97-ON85256E4A.0074E371-85256E4A.0074F66F@metso.com>f  , He wants a Self-Extracting [SE] ".exe" file.  G JimStrehlow@data911.com (Jim Strehlow) wrote on 03/01/2004 04:10:56 PM:l  B > Using the following version of ZIP on many OpenVMS AlphaServers:	 > $zip -he" > Copyright (C) 1990-1999 Info-ZIP > Zip 2.3 (November 29th 1999).o >A
 > ZIP "-V"= > maintains OpenVMS attributes in the resultant zip file; buta > ZIPe; > builds a Micro$oft Windows readable/extractable zip file.  >iB > I frequently use the above commands ... the first one for zip toE > another OpenVMS destination ... the second for zip to Windows whichHF > maintains the last modified date and not the date the files were FTP > copied to Windows. > ) > Jim Strehlow, Data911, Alameda, CA, USA C > "The boss reminded us that we only have a week left to finish ourg, > project, so we ought to be half done now." > "You have not even started."+ > "Yeah, but I work better under pressure."n* > "Actually you work only under pressure."F > "That way the work time is more miserable; but there is less of it."C >  variation of a Calvin and Hobbes cartoon by Bill Watterson, 1995o   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 17:45:37 -0600a@ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net> Subject: Re: Zip/update Issueh6 Message-ID: <4043CB21.2F364091@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>   Martin Vorlaender wrote: >  > David J. Dachtera wrote: > ...d" > > Dunno if VMS zip will do that. >  > It doesn't have to. My test:# > - Uploaded a Win ZIP file to VMS.p( > - Uploaded a Win32 UNZIPSFX.EXE to VMS+ > - $ COPY UNZIPSFX.EXE+zipfile zipfile.EXEn# > - Downloaded zipfile.EXE to WinNTc > - Executed zipfile.EXE  @ Did you get any messages about prepended stuff being unexpected?  D Dunno if VMS ZIP will fix offsets when the SE stub is not the VMS SE4 stub. That will get rid of the message, if it works.  ( > > Dunno where to get the WhineBloze SE > > stub for freeware ZIP. > + > I just put it (from Info-ZIP v5.40) up one3 > ftp://ftp.pdv-systeme.de/unzipsfx-win32.exe (92k)7   Thanx!   -- h David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systemsc http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 01 Mar 2004 23:36:54 GMTa& From: Don Sykes <paladin@mydomain.com> Subject: Re: Zip/update IssueC< Message-ID: <qOP0c.4685$DK3.3782@newssvr27.news.prodigy.com>   David J. Dachtera wrote:   > Martin Vorlaender wrote: >  >>David J. Dachtera wrote: >>...r >>! >>>Dunno if VMS zip will do that.p >> >>It doesn't have to. My test:# >>- Uploaded a Win ZIP file to VMS.g( >>- Uploaded a Win32 UNZIPSFX.EXE to VMS+ >>- $ COPY UNZIPSFX.EXE+zipfile zipfile.EXE # >>- Downloaded zipfile.EXE to WinNTC >>- Executed zipfile.EXE >  > C > Did you get any messages about prepended stuff being unexpected? t   Yes. I got : $ zip "-f" express.exe AEX.KEY@ DKA100:[AEX.TTEST]EXPRESS.EXE;1: found a preamble of 31357 bytes freshening: AEX.KEY (stored 0%)      > F > Dunno if VMS ZIP will fix offsets when the SE stub is not the VMS SE6 > stub. That will get rid of the message, if it works. >  > ' >>>Dunno where to get the WhineBloze SE  >>>stub for freeware ZIP.n >>+ >>I just put it (from Info-ZIP v5.40) up on-3 >>ftp://ftp.pdv-systeme.de/unzipsfx-win32.exe (92k)U >  >  > Thanx! >      --     Have VMS, Will Traveln Wire paladin, San Francisco    (paladinATalphaseDOTcom)   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 05:54:00 GMTs& From: Don Sykes <paladin@mydomain.com> Subject: Re: Zip/update Issue < Message-ID: <YjV0c.4776$Nx7.1298@newssvr27.news.prodigy.com>   David J. Dachtera wrote:   > Don Sykes wrote: >  >>Don Sykes wrote: >> >>B >>>I have a Self-extracting zip file I use to distribute software.9 >>>It is created on an NT4.0 and copied to my VMS server.sJ >>>I'd like to update one file in this file dynamically, on my VMS server;@ >>>but when I do and download it back to my NT and run it, I getC >>>"zip file is damaged, truncated or has been changed since it wast >>>created..."K >>>Note: this file works fine in its original form. I can download to my PC  >>>& install - no problem.I >>>Also I can update a regular zip file on VMS & download and install, noH >>>problem. C >>>I've tried several variations of: zip/update myFile.zip new.fileSH >>>but to no avail. Can any of you wise people help? Maybe David the Zip
 >>>Master? >>>s >>>TIA >>>  >>>Don >>>a >>J >>I notice now, that after doing a zip/update overriding the license file, >>the file goes from:HG >>     Organization: SEQ   RecordFormat: STMLF     RecordAttributes: CRe+ >>     MaxRecordSize: 0    LongestRecord: 0a >>TOD >>     Organization: SEQ   RecordFormat: FIX       RecordAttributes:- >>     MaxRecordSize: 512  LongestRecord: 512r >>3 >>And if I try to convert/fdl=... the file becomes:nG >>     Organization: SEQ   RecordFormat: STMLF     RecordAttributes: CRt- >>     MaxRecordSize: 0    LongestRecord: 512o >>J >>THEN, when I download it back to my NT box it looks like an exe, insteadG >>of a zip file. That is the file icon changes from a zip to a command,r' >>even tho the file ext is always .exe.eH >>But if I try to execute this version, I get "is not a valid Windows NT >>application" >>J >>At this point, I'm not sure if I'm getting closer, or farther away, from >>the solution ;))?a >  > ! > I don't like that STMLF/0 bit.  A That's what I thought, but it works. Only the version that shows   LongestRecord: 512 fails...e  + > Looks like a bad transfer mode (ASCII, in ? > which case the file is irrecoverably corrupted). It should beo/ > transferred as binary resulting in FIXED-512.  >  > I'd try this:r > , >  1. Verify that transfer to VMS is binary.  F All the SEzip files and standard zip files are created on the NT then H zipped together and then ftp'd (as bin) to VMS. Then I just do an unzip H on VMS. Remember, all these files work fine on NT (or other fine M$ OS) G after they're downloaded from VMS. It's only after I do an update to a o SEzip that I have the problem.   > J >  2. Before attempting the update, verify that the file is FIXED-512. UseE > SET FILE/ATTR=(RFM=FIX,LRL=512), but only if necessary. If it isn'te; > FIXED-512, troubleshoot your transfer method until it is.n  3 After the unzip on VMS all the SEzip files show as:fE      Organization: SEQ   RecordFormat: STMLF     RecordAttributes: CRs)      MaxRecordSize: 0    LongestRecord: 0s  G and as I said I can download them back to my NT at this point and they o
 work fine.   > I >  3. Do the update; re-extract and compare to verify that the update waso
 > successful.2 > $ >  4. Transfer back to NT as binary. > ; >  5. Try extract on NT to verify that SE is working still.g >      -- ?   Have VMS, Will Travel0 Wire paladin, San Franciscon   (paladinATalphaseDOTcom)   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 02 Mar 2004 01:41:02 GMTM# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> / Subject: [OT]: Here's a good one for Leo DemersiE Message-ID: <OCR0c.36323$sl.212@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   G It's not related to VMS, but I thought Leo & his group would get a good  laugh.  5 http://computing.astate.edu/win2k/XP%20Encryption.htm   : **Beware Incompatible Windows XP Data Encryption Standards   By Roberta Bragg    ) "Must have more secure data," he mumbled.a  9 "Must use stronger encryption algorithms," she countered.'  K "Hey!" They both said at once. "Let's use the new data encryption standard,tI AES."  And so, ever responsive to customer demands, Microsoft implemented J the Advanced Encryption Standard (AES) as the default encryption algorithmG for Windows XP, post-SP1 and for the soon-to-be-released Windows Serverb 2003. Super?  Super. But...d  L It's as if for everything good that Microsoft does, a little rain must fall.G Maybe, before releasing SP1 for XP, no one thought to try to open an XPmK SP1-encrypted file from a Windows 2000 computer. Maybe they did; maybe theyrG discovered the problem, but just didn't think users would encounter it.   I Before you get caught in this encryption Bermuda triangle, be warned: YouaK cannot open an AES-encrypted file using Win2K or a pre-SP1 XP Pro computer.-K It won't work. Win2K uses DESX to encrypt files, and isn't capable of using7K AES. But that's not the only problem. A more serious side effect can occur.mG Microsoft warns (in Knowledge Base article *329741*) that attempting toM. decrypt the file may also result in data loss.  H Note: XP, pre-SP1, defaulted to DESX. That could be changed to 3DES, butK required a configuration change. Attempting to decrypt 3DES-encrypted fileso@ with Win2K similarly can't be done. XP can decrypt 3DES and DESXE EFS-encrypted files, but Win2K can only decrypt DESX-encrypted files.   L If you're thinking that no user would go to the trouble of copying encryptedI files from XP to Win2K or vice versa just to open them, think again. JustcK think of scenarios where roaming profiles are used, or XP SP1 systems crash5G and must be re-built. Encrypted copies of files may be moved to the newNL computer or an alternative one. Encryption keys for the user are then importK ed, or will be present if the user has a roaming profile. If the encryption"G strength is incompatible -- if Win2K or XP pre-SP1 is used -- you can'th( decrypt the files and you may lose data.  L If I haven't impressed this upon you enough, listen up: YOU MUST NOT attemptL to open XP SP1 (AES)-encrypted files from a Win2K computer or from a pre-SP1H XP computer! If you can't trust users to obey this rule, you may want toL consider either disabling EFS or removing XP's ability to use AES by settingJ XP's encryption algorithm to one compatible with all the systems you might8 use. To do the latter, add the following registry value:  F Warning: Do not change this value if there are encrypted files on thisJ machine. To do so might cause data loss. Before setting the value, decryptH all EFS-encrypted files. After the value is set, restart the machine and? encrypt the files. Backups, would, of course, be best practice.e     Value: AlgorithmID Data type: REG_DWORD Radix: Hexadecimal) Value data:  set to one of the following:d 3DES: 0x6603 -- XP and later# DESX: 0x6604 -- XP and Windows 2000-# AES_256: 0x6610 -- XP SP1 and later9   The value should be located at:.C HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows NT\CurrentVersion\EFSu  D While I personally don't want to be the one responsible for removingL stronger encryption as an option from your arsenal of security tools, I hopeK you'll take this issue seriously and seek a resolution in your environment.n  K If you've already experienced data loss from this conundrum, please contactuK Microsoft. Ask if they can modify the decryption algorithm that will simplyeK give you an "access denied" message instead of potential data loss. You canuL also give me a holler. I probably can't help undo the damage, but maybe justK talking about your loss and Microsoft's response will make you feel better.   * As ever, I remain your Security Therapist.    L -- Roberta Bragg, MCSE, CISSP and contributing editor for MCP Magazine, runsG her company, Have Computer Will Travel Inc., out of a notebook carrying-H case. She's a frequent speaker and trainer for MCP Magazine's TechMentorK conference and seminar series. She's an independent consultant specializing-- in security, operating systems and databases.d  K Her newest book is the CISSP Training Guide (Que Publishing). You can reach8+ her at roberta.bragg@unmungthis-mcpmag.com.i   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2004.122 ************************  