1 INFO-VAX	Fri, 05 Mar 2004	Volume 2004 : Issue 128       Contents:P Re: 2-node LAVC cluster with quorum disk - network disappears - which node CLUEX+ Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape? + Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape? + Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape? + Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape? + Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape? 9 Re: CDs in Canada ( was Re: Support of USB Memory stick ) ; Re: Destroying CDR media (Was: Support of USB Memory stick) * Re: DS10, VMS 7.3 DECNet & TCPIP troubles.* Re: DS10, VMS 7.3 DECNet & TCPIP troubles.* Re: DS10, VMS 7.3 DECNet & TCPIP troubles.- Re: Educating HP employees on the nettiquette  Re: EVA disk storage Re: ftp login problems  Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS  Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS  Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS  Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS  Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS  RE: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS  Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS  Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS  Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS  Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS Re: Intel releases 64bit Xeon  Re: Intel releases 64bit Xeon  Re: Intel releases 64bit Xeon  Re: Intel releases 64bit Xeon  Re: Is NAS 150 layered or SIP? Re: It's all about perception!! ! Libary/CDD Question for Vax-Basic  Re: OpenVMS Feelings Re: OpenVMS FeelingsC OpenVMS virus proof while other disks get zapped by latest viruses! G Re: OpenVMS virus proof while other disks get zapped by latest viruses! G Re: OpenVMS virus proof while other disks get zapped by latest viruses! & Re: Pathworks-32 and Windaube XPrience& Re: Pathworks-32 and Windaube XPrience5 Question on VMS 7.3-2 Sysgen parameter SHADOW_SITE_ID  Re: Recursive COPY Re: Recursive COPY% SDALINKMISM  after OpenVMS UPDATE 3.0  Re: SSH login problem -- Bug?  Re: Sun On The Run?  Re: Sun On The Run?  Re: Sun On The Run?  Re: Support of USB Memory stick  Re: Support of USB Memory stick  Re: Support of USB Memory stick  Re: Support of USB Memory stick 2 The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy?- Re: Uninterruptable Power Supplies for Alphas  Re: VOL Shadow an mounted drive  Re: VOL Shadow an mounted drive 2 Re: Why does smtp mail between local systems fail?3 Re: [GAME] you've been appointed VMS Mkt Mgr, so... 3 RE: [GAME] you've been appointed VMS Mkt Mgr, so... 3 Re: [GAME] you've been appointed VMS Mkt Mgr, so...  [TCPIP V5.4] More rants  Re: [TCPIP V5.4] More rants   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  * Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:23:52 +0000 (UTC)7 From: moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) Y Subject: Re: 2-node LAVC cluster with quorum disk - network disappears - which node CLUEX ( Message-ID: <c28a9o$92h$1@pcls4.std.com>  9 jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net (Daryl Jones) writes:    >Dear Michael Moroney:  C >As it is stated in the VAXcluster Principle, that each sub-cluster C >formation has a calculated FIGURE OF MERIT and from this value the ? >CONNECTION MANAGER picks the optimal cluster and the other are D >discarded. In your case described below, each subcluster would have= >the same value and qualify for being optimal. Therefore, the E >subcluster is chosen at random, however, the subcluster that contain : >the system that first notice the problem would be chosen.  G >You have claimed in the this and preceding posts that the highest CSID E >is chosen. However, from above information given from the VAXcluster E >Principle book, I can't find any reason why one CSID, Cluster System + >ID, have any priority over any other CSID.   D >Can you give me a reference for your claim. I am very interested in+ >learning more about what you are claiming.   B I based my answer on the following code segment (from CNXMAN.MAR):   ; ! ; Each node has removed the other 4 ; Neither node has quorum: R & r & (NOT Q) & (NOT q) ;   @         CMPW    CNCT$W_VOTES(R2), -    ; Compare available votes                  CLUB$W_VOTES(R3)G         BGTRU   70$                    ; Other has more votes, we crash A         BLSSU   40$                    ; This node has more votes K         CMPW    CNCT$W_NODES(R2), -    ; Compare number of nodes in cluster                   CLUB$W_NODES(R3)D         BGTRU   70$                    ; Other has more nodes, crash         BLSSU   40$          PUSHR   #^M<R1,R2,R3> @         MOVL    G^SCS$AR_LOCALSB,R1    ; Get address of local SB<         MOVL    CSB$L_SB(R5),R2        ; Remote System Block<         CMPC3   #SB$S_SYSTEMID, -      ; Compare system ID's9                 SB$B_SYSTEMID(R1),-    ;  local system ID ;                 SB$B_SYSTEMID(R2)      ;   remote system ID          POPR    #^M<R1,R2,R3>          BGTRU   70$  ...  ; ' ; Get here when node must leave cluster  ; 1 70$:    BUG_CHECK CLUEXIT,FATAL   ; Leave cluster  ...   E but now it appears this is probably to resolve a different situation.     I I looked at the code that checks all possible clusters & figures of merit F for each and it is messy.  It's not strictly 'random' if two potentialH clusters have equal figures of merit (the first one found wins) but it's6 not easy to figure out the order clusters are checked.   --   -Mike    ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:03:02 -0500* From: "Marty O'Connor" <moconnor@dvfs.com>4 Subject: Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape?: Message-ID: <c27uh7$1qklmj$1@ID-118202.news.uni-berlin.de>  D "Daryl Jones" <jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message6 news:8a646952.0403041047.66ba2e3@posting.google.com... : Dear John Santos:  : G : The issue is not that it may pertain to 9 track tapes only. The issue C : raised was that is or was a problem with tape backup and restores B : using block size greater than 32256 and nobody had a solution or= : understanding of the problem. That by itself is worry some.  : F : What you are sugggesting is the problem doesn't exist because of theD : hardware performance is much better. On small sites where multipleF : savesets can be stored on one tape. I'll buy in to it. However, whatH : about multi-volume savesets with a large block size? I don't know manyH : System Managers or DBAs using VMS and Backup that had to rebuild theirF : site from tape except for maybe the WTC?  Maybe the problem isn't or' : wasn't cause by Multi-volume saveset?  :   a I just checked our backups and we use a block size of 65024. Twice a year we rebuild out complete ` environment VMS and Windows for a disaster recovery drill. We write about 6 to 10 disk images tod either DLT or SDLT tapes and have never had a problem doing the image restores. We are also at leastc once a week restoring selected files from the backups for file recovery. It has been about 12 years > since I used 9 track tapes so I can't do a comparison to them.   Marty    ------------------------------   Date: 3 Mar 2004 14:17:45 -0800 7 From: jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net (Daryl Jones) 4 Subject: Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape?= Message-ID: <8a646952.0403031417.7ebabfd7@posting.google.com>    Dear Paul Sture:  B This has been reported to me from the 1990s to 1998 (VMS 5.5-2h toA 7.0?)where my last discussion took place. These are restores from C BACKUP savesets by BACKUP and not by COPY. The single extraction of D files may be successful, however, the full restoration appears to beF the problem when multiple tapes are used. With the DLT Tape systems, aD whole disk can be backup on one tape and therfore, this may not be aE problem? The problem appears when the backup saveset starts on volume ? one and continues to volume 2. Again, this is my understanding.    Regards, Daryl Jones     b Paul Sture <nospam@sture.homeip.net> wrote in message news:<4045DC75.51D08A20@sture.homeip.net>... > Daryl Jones wrote: > >  > > Dear David J. Dachtera:  > > J > > I have been told by more than a couple System Manager that the maximumH > > backup block size should be the same as the default backup blocksizeG > > when you are backing up from disk to disk which is 32256. Any block H > > size other greater than 32256 will cause the backup restore to fail.D > > Thus makeing the backup useless. This isn't theory because thoseJ > > System Managers actually tested the backup and restores with different > > blocksize for proof. > >  > : > I've never seen that. What version of VMS and ECO level? > H > What is true is that using COPY to move the tape contents to disk willC > fail, since RMS cannot cope with record sizes greater than 32256.  > G > Using BACKUP to extract files from savesets on tape _mounted foreign_ % > with a blocksize > 32256 does work.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 23:53:05 GMT 8 From: "Tom Simpson" <thomas.simpson1@nospam.comcast.net>4 Subject: Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape?. Message-ID: <xjP1c.41090$ko6.355664@attbi_s02>  C Thanks for the clarification.  That number seemed way bigger than I & expected...that's why I questioned it.  H I was trying to point out a possible origin for the old system manager'sL aversion to larger block sizes.  I doubt it has anything to do with problems on newer drives...  J One other (obvious) thing that was not pointed out here is that if you areI writing small save sets (smaller than your selected block size), the tape E has to write the whole block, so space and time may be wasted in that 2 situation.  On image backups, that's not an issue.  J I normally use the 32K block size to avoid problems when I copy save sets.H I have had many problems recovering data from multi-volume 9-track tapesL (using VMS 7.2-1), but never DLT tapes.  So far, I don't have a multi-volume0 SDLT backup, so I can't speak to that situation.   Regards, Tom   - "John Santos" <JOHN@egh.com> wrote in message 0 news:1040303234647.15727A-100000@Ives.egh.com...( > On Thu, 4 Mar 2004, Tom Simpson wrote: > J > > One factor (especially with older tape drives and lower bit densities) thatI > > could be a problem is the physical length of tape it takes to write a  large K > > block of data.  Last time I checked, the standard distance from the EOT L > > marker to the physical end-of-tape is roughly 15-20 feet.  If 20 feet is not F > > enough space to fit a data block, then the backup could fail.  The typical L > > symptom would be the tape runs off the end of the reel (on 9 track tapes for 
 > > example).    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Mar 2004 16:30:16 -0800 7 From: jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net (Daryl Jones) 4 Subject: Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape?= Message-ID: <8a646952.0403041630.3bb916f9@posting.google.com>    Dear Marty O'Connor:  8 I thank you and David J Dachtera for your information onC backup/restore using large block sizes with single and multi-volume  backups.   Regards, Daryl Jones   l "Marty O'Connor" <moconnor@dvfs.com> wrote in message news:<c27uh7$1qklmj$1@ID-118202.news.uni-berlin.de>...F > "Daryl Jones" <jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message8 > news:8a646952.0403041047.66ba2e3@posting.google.com... > : Dear John Santos:  > : I > : The issue is not that it may pertain to 9 track tapes only. The issue E > : raised was that is or was a problem with tape backup and restores D > : using block size greater than 32256 and nobody had a solution or? > : understanding of the problem. That by itself is worry some.  > : H > : What you are sugggesting is the problem doesn't exist because of theF > : hardware performance is much better. On small sites where multipleH > : savesets can be stored on one tape. I'll buy in to it. However, whatJ > : about multi-volume savesets with a large block size? I don't know manyJ > : System Managers or DBAs using VMS and Backup that had to rebuild theirH > : site from tape except for maybe the WTC?  Maybe the problem isn't or) > : wasn't cause by Multi-volume saveset?  > :  > c > I just checked our backups and we use a block size of 65024. Twice a year we rebuild out complete b > environment VMS and Windows for a disaster recovery drill. We write about 6 to 10 disk images tof > either DLT or SDLT tapes and have never had a problem doing the image restores. We are also at leaste > once a week restoring selected files from the backups for file recovery. It has been about 12 years @ > since I used 9 track tapes so I can't do a comparison to them. >  > Marty    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 23:56:53 -0500  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>4 Subject: Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape?6 Message-ID: <1040303234647.15727A-100000@Ives.egh.com>  & On Thu, 4 Mar 2004, Tom Simpson wrote:  M > One factor (especially with older tape drives and lower bit densities) that M > could be a problem is the physical length of tape it takes to write a large I > block of data.  Last time I checked, the standard distance from the EOT N > marker to the physical end-of-tape is roughly 15-20 feet.  If 20 feet is notL > enough space to fit a data block, then the backup could fail.  The typicalN > symptom would be the tape runs off the end of the reel (on 9 track tapes for > example).  > L > The way a tape drive works (at least the way they used to work...I'm goingM > way back here...) is that they attempt to finish writing the block they are J > currently on, even if it is past the EOT marker.  If there is not enough= > physical tape left to complete the block, the party's over.  > H > With the MUCH higher bit densities of today's tape drives, I think theJ > likelihood of that happening is very small, if it could happen at all...I > This is, of course, speculation on my part triggered by first-hand (and I > out-of-date) tape drive technology knowledge...  Even at 6250BPI, a 64K 2 > block of data would take a lot of tape to write.M > That would be roughly ((64000blocks * 512 bytes per block) / 6250 bpi) / 12  > = 436 ft. ??  D A 64K block contains 64000 (or 65536 bytes, if "K" means 1024).  YouD are multiplying by 512 unnecessarily.  So on a 6250bpi tape, this isA 10.24 inches.  Should easily fit before the physical end-of-tape. A (It also requires a tape mark, some EOV labels, and a couple more C tape marks.  IIRC, 9-track tape marks are 1/2 inch, irrespective of 	 density.)   E At 800bpi, the record is 80 inches, (6'8"), so this is getting really  iffy.   B In either case, if there is a bad spot on the tape, the drive willC space forward looking for good tape and with records this long, you ? could be in "reel" trouble :-)  Everyone should have the fun of D reloading a 9-track tape from the end by hand, at some time in their life!   > But this thread was about SDLT, not 9-track, and 32256 is only? relevent to disk save-sets, not tape save-sets, so we're really  getting off-track here.      > 
 > Regards, > Tom  > F > "Daryl Jones" <jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message8 > news:8a646952.0403022253.69a3161@posting.google.com... > > Dear David J. Dachtera:  > > J > > I have been told by more than a couple System Manager that the maximumH > > backup block size should be the same as the default backup blocksizeG > > when you are backing up from disk to disk which is 32256. Any block H > > size other greater than 32256 will cause the backup restore to fail.D > > Thus makeing the backup useless. This isn't theory because thoseJ > > System Managers actually tested the backup and restores with different > > blocksize for proof. > > B > > Could you further explain to me or provide a reference on your* > > recommendation that you have provided. > >  > > Thanks,  > > Daryl Jones  > >  > > G > > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net> wrote in < > message news:<40453492.27B758CE@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>... > > > Hal Kuff wrote:  > > > > H > > > >     In search of best blocksize for SDLT tape at 110GB.... using	 > MSL5026 K > > > > tape library over 1gb Fibre Channel to OpenVMS ES40 type systems on  > 1gb C > > > > Fibre Channel...... Have not seen the 50-60% improvement in  > performance we, > > > > expected over DLT8000/DLTIV Tape.... > > > > M > > > >    Can anyone reccomend an init, mount, and backup command that works  > for  > > > > your site... > > > J > > > Before you go digging that deep, check that your NSRs are configuredN > > > correctly. Make sure that the SCSI cards are in the high-numbered slots,N > > > not the low. That will approximately double your throughput if they were > > > wrong before.  > > > K > > > Otherwise, the usual rules still apply: us ethe largest blocksize you K > > > can live with: 65024 if you don't need to read the savesets with RMS,   > > > less than 32767 if you do. >  >  >  >    --   John Santos  Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 22:27:43 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> B Subject: Re: CDs in Canada ( was Re: Support of USB Memory stick )J Message-ID: <zZs1c.83024$ah.21443@twister01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   Malcolm Dunnett wrote: > In articleE >     <Kcs1c.82707$ah.62100@twister01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, ' > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes:  >  >>F >> Some moronic jusridictions (Canada) charge a levy on every blank CDC >> because the music industry managed to get a bunch of bureaucrats C >> convinced that most CD's are being used to rip off the recording F >> artists. So the levy is charged on each CD, irrespective of the use
 >> of the CD.  >>F >    I always wondered about that. If the cost of my blank CD includesG > a royalty being paid to the artists then does that give me free reign  > to copy music onto them? > > >    Is the levy actually in effect now? How much is the levy? > E >    I can still buy 20 packs of CD-Rs ( with jewel cases ) for under B > $20CDN, so I take it the levy isn't all that high if it's there.       Disclaimer: > I don't know for certain that the following paragraph is true:  L Canadians are legally allowed to copy music for personal use. In exchange, aI small fee is added to the price of recordable CDs to compensate musicians I and music publishing companies. Similar "royalties" are collected in more C than 40 countries, including the United States under the Audio Home  Recording Act of 1992.    * This is what was enacted in December 2003:  / http://www.cb-cda.gc.ca/news/c20032004nr-e.html    "....   E Today's decision freezes all existing private copying levies at their H current levels. As a result, the current levies of 29 on audio cassetteK tapes of 40 minutes or longer (no levy applies to tapes of shorter length), H 21 on CD-Rs and CD-RWs and 77 on CD-R Audio, CD-RW Audio and MiniDiscs, will remain in effect until the end of 2004.  E The Board also sets for the first time a levy on non-removable memory K permanently embedded in digital audio recorders (such as MP3 players) at $2 J for each recorder with a memory capacity of up to 1 Gigabyte (Gb), $15 forJ each recorder with memory capacity of more than 1 Gb and up to 10 Gbs, andE $25 for each recorder with memory capacity of more than 10 GBs......"       D The "music industry tax" alone on CD's in Canada is more per CD thanJ Americans pay for a CD even after adjusting for the difference in currency values.   L I can buy a 100 pack of CD's from Staples or CompUSA on sale for $2.99 afterL rebate. The music industry tax in Canada for the same 100 CD's is $21.00 CADJ or about $15 USD, and then there's the cost of the CD's themselves, makingL the 'normal' cost of 100 non-branded CD's about $39-49, with brand name cd's being more expensive than that.   H And to add insult to injury, they charge sales taxes on top of the music industry tax!!!       K But so far the courts have basically told the RIAA to get stuffed when they H want to go after Canadians the same way they've gone after Americans forF downloading music. I guess all you have to do is have a stack of blankJ royalty paid CD's in your house to prove 'intent' that you were just going( to burn them onto cd's for personal use.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 16:11:20 -0600 / From: Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com> D Subject: Re: Destroying CDR media (Was: Support of USB Memory stick)3 Message-ID: <4047A988.9D7B5D43@applied-synergy.com>    Alex Daniels wrote:  > l > Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com> wrote in message news:<40464CF9.66638A33@applied-synergy.com>... > > Nic Clews wrote: > > N > > > Yes. [In a certain case] the current proposal is a tape solution to moveM > > > relatively (less than 100 meg) small amounts of data from one system to J > > > another. CDR was investigated, but due to the nature of the data add1 > > > complications to destroying the used media.  > > 5 > > I thought that was what microwave ovens were for.  > > C > > And the associated light show is an entertaining bonus.  <grin>  > E > The light show is most entertaining, although one ex-girlfriend did F > seem to have her objections me using her microwave for this purpose. > D > As for it being an effective means of erasing the data, I'm not soE > sure.. the CD is thin bit of metal foil attached to a polycarbonate C > disc. The microwave munches up the foil into lots of tiny pieces.  > H > I would imagine one could with enough time and effort, take these tinyH > bits and with the right equipment read a small amount of data off each? > one. Depends how important truly erasing the data is I guess.     A Well, that's true of any destruction method.  Some people put CDs D through shredders.  You could still put the pieces back together and read some data.   H I suspect that if you converted the CD to plasma someone would point outD that you could always reassemble the original molecules and read the
 data.  <grin>   H You need to balance the time and cost of reconstructing the data againstB the value of the data.  All the various methods have their places.  G ----------------------------------------------------------------------- $ Chris Scheers, Applied Synergy, Inc.  C Voice: 817-237-3360            Internet: chris@applied-synergy.com     Fax: 817-237-3074    ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 22:14:32 +0100, From: "Hans Vlems" <hvlems.dotweg@zonnet.nl>3 Subject: Re: DS10, VMS 7.3 DECNet & TCPIP troubles. : Message-ID: <c28678$1q9s0t$1@ID-143435.news.uni-berlin.de>  4 "Neil Cherry" <njc@wolfgang.uucp> schreef in bericht( news:slrnc4f39b.bmu.njc@wolfgang.uucp...H > First I know nothing of VMS but was lucky enough to be able to installD > VMS on a VS3100. I have DECNet running on there very nicely and myD > Cisco router sees it just fine (no TCP/IP on the 3100). Now on theG > DS10 I have 2 ethernets and I just need 1 running. If I do a show net  > I get: >  > $ sh network > H > Product:  DECNET        Node:  ALPHA                Address(es):  2.10I > Product:  TCP/IP        Node:  <TCPIP host/node name not yet available>  Address(es):  0.0.0.0  > E > I tried to use @net$configure.com to change the decnet addresses to ? > 3.10 but it still remains 2.10. I've also configure TCP/IP to B > 192.168.0.100 but it still doesn't work). Also I think DECnet isB > configured to run over TCP/IP (I don't want it over TCP/IP). Any6 > pointers? I'm currently read the documentation CD's. >  > Thanks >  > --  F > Linux Home Automation         Neil Cherry        ncherry@comcast.net= > http://home.comcast.net/~ncherry/               (Text only) ? > http://linuxha.sourceforge.net/                 (SourceForge) : > http://hcs.sourceforge.net/                     (HCS II)  A Changing the DECnet address, assuming you've got DECnet phase IV:   K 1) comment out the line in SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM that start DECnet (STARTNET or 
 NET$SERVICES)  2) change the scssystemid:  $ mc sysgenH SYSGEN> set scssystemid 3082           ! 1024*area + node -> 1024*3 + 10 SYSGEN> write current  ^Z	 3) reboot  4) @sys$manager:netconfig   6 If you have phase V then step 4 becomes @net$configure  0 If you want a clean configuration of TCPIP then:  ' 1) shutdown TCPIP, e.g. in TCPIP$CONFIG , 2) del sys$system:tcpip*.dat;    !   5 files 3) @sys$manager:tcpip$config   Hans   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 12:58:43 -0800 & From: Tom Crabtree <tccrab@sunset.net>3 Subject: Re: DS10, VMS 7.3 DECNet & TCPIP troubles. + Message-ID: <c2851n0vvk@enews1.newsguy.com>    > $ sh network > H > Product:  DECNET        Node:  ALPHA                Address(es):  2.10_ > Product:  TCP/IP        Node:  <TCPIP host/node name not yet available> Address(es):  0.0.0.0  > E > I tried to use @net$configure.com to change the decnet addresses to ? > 3.10 but it still remains 2.10. I've also configure TCP/IP to B > 192.168.0.100 but it still doesn't work). Also I think DECnet isB > configured to run over TCP/IP (I don't want it over TCP/IP). Any6 > pointers? I'm currently read the documentation CD's.  G First of all, by using net$config you are only changing the address of  G the TCPIP networking.  What you need to change is the node name in the  ! DECnet portion of the networking. = You first need need to see what node names are already there:     >NCP (return) NCP> SHO KNO NODES (return)  (will give a list) To add a host name type:+ NCP> SET HOST ALPHA ADDRESS 3.10 NODE ALPHA + NCP> DEF HOST ALPHA ADDRESS 3.10 NODE ALPHA B ( you must SET the node in volatile memory and DEFINE the node in  permanent memory) 3 If for some reason you need to remove a HOST, type: & NCP> SET NOHOST (enter node name here)  " DECnet does not need TCPIP to run.  
 Good luck!   TomC   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 13:18:38 -0800 & From: Tom Crabtree <tccrab@sunset.net>3 Subject: Re: DS10, VMS 7.3 DECNet & TCPIP troubles. , Message-ID: <c28672019b4@enews2.newsguy.com>   >  >NCP (return) > NCP> SHO KNO NODES (return)  > (will give a list) > To add a host name type:- > NCP> SET HOST ALPHA ADDRESS 3.10 NODE ALPHA - > NCP> DEF HOST ALPHA ADDRESS 3.10 NODE ALPHA  Oops! + NCP> SET HOST ALPHA ADDRESS 3.10 NAME ALPHA + NCP> DEF HOST ALPHA ADDRESS 3.10 NAME ALPHA    TomCD > ( you must SET the node in volatile memory and DEFINE the node in  > permanent memory) 5 > If for some reason you need to remove a HOST, type: ( > NCP> SET NOHOST (enter node name here) > $ > DECnet does not need TCPIP to run. >  > Good luck! >  > TomC >    ------------------------------   Date: 3 Mar 2004 11:58:28 -0800 - From: phillip_thayer@hotmail.com (PhilThayer) 6 Subject: Re: Educating HP employees on the nettiquette= Message-ID: <5ee1d1b7.0403031158.7372b786@posting.google.com>   v koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote in message news:<P5LkeAAyX8ZP@eisner.encompasserve.org>...o > In article <5ee1d1b7.0403021453.7f10a8c9@posting.google.com>, phillip_thayer@hotmail.com (PhilThayer) writes:  > > 9 > > Possibly.  But is a consistent error on all releases?  > ; >    I don't get into emacs anywhere near enough to know.     F Me either.  the point though was the with standards you may get errorsA in a product, but they will be much more consistent and easier to  locate and fix.    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 00:43:42 GMT > From: Michael Austin <maustin@no-more-spam.firstdbasource.com> Subject: Re: EVA disk storage B Message-ID: <23Q1c.3569$lP1.1220868226@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com>   Rob Young wrote:   > In article <c22d81$if5$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>, Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> writes: >  >>Rob Young wrote: >  >  >>> A >>>	Grab the report.  Maybe you know someone with Gartner access, I >>>	a more powerful Enterprise Architect or somesuch.  Laughs aside, the  0 >>>	answer is based on 4-8 TBytes RAID5 configs. >>>  >>5 >>I am note sure what you have to laugh at Rob unless , >>laughing is a way of diminishing the pain. >  >  > A > 	I guess the humor is that you speculated about the contents of > > 	the report, my retort is "grab it" but you may have to findA > 	a "powerful Enterprise Architect".  The humor is me projecting C > 	you as a "less powerful Enterprise Architect."  Maybe visions of ? > 	Wizards and Elves come to mind at this point - maybe not.  I @ > 	realize American <-> British humor doesn't map well at times. >  > 	Does that help? >  > : >>However comparing a 9970 with 4-8 TB of storage with EVA; >>seems somewhat peverse. The 9970 has a total raw capacity . >>of 18.8 TB and a 32 GB cache with a total of6 >>48 FC channel host interfaces and 16 disk interfaces >>with options for ESCON etc.  >> >  > H > 	Comparing them can be quite important.  The 9970 - being monolithic -@ > 	contains a large amount of cache (can).  Whlie limited as farG > 	as size,  (18.8 TB versus EVA's 35 TBytes) it does as you point out  B > 	support mainframes.  The whole point of large caches.  That andA > 	a profit center -  a point a VAR made to me (actually sells a  > > 	monolithic box).  Regarding connectivity and other options,G > 	. . . I'd bet we could put together two EVA 5000s with nice amounts   > 	of storage that would:  >  > 4 > 			1)  Create realistic scenarios (configurations)3 > 				that the 9970 can't match EVA in performance   > 				' > 			2)  Come in cheaper or same price   > 						(not certain here - $ > 						but worth a shot , might be  > 						close.  Could force the ! > 						9970 to be quoted with 32   > 						GByte cache and tilt the > 						playing field  B-} >  >  > 			3)  More storage  >  > % > 			4)  NSPOF  (the 9970 is one box)  >  > @ > 	Now maybe there is a business case lurking.  Perhaps they areB > 	up against backup windows.  But the original inquiry also asked2 > 	about price, hence my two cents on that metric. >  >  > < >>It would appear that this is the classic Apples vs Oranges >>fruit comparison.  >> >  > E > 	No.  If you are going to compare cost of implementation (and being G > 	familiar with the poster's environment - elicited my response), the  ? > 	9970 makes little business sense.  The Gartner piece is very I > 	instrumental to help guard against the "monolithic up-sell".  In fact, 2 > 	it can be -part- of a very effective roadblock. >  > 8 >>The EVA 5000 seems much closer to the Thunder 9570 etc9 >>than the 9970/9980. Which is probably why HP resell the ( >>Lightning as the xp1024 and the xp128. >  > C > 	The Lightning gives HP the capability of being a true Enterprise C > 	storage solutions provider for shops with mainframes.  There are E > 	other advantages, but they may be corner cases or tough to justify @ > 	(unless of course you are Merrill Lynch and have 250 TByte ofD > 	EMC, 100 TByte of Hitachi - but their budgets are "different" and7 > 	I'm sure they have a number of mainframes up there.)  > 	 > 				Rob  >     G I don't know where you are getting the 18TB number from, but since the  H XP1024 is essentially the "big" Lighting, it has a cacity of 1024x146GB D is more like 150TB -- and looking to add the 309GB drive capability.  I So, back to my original question.  Does the Lightning truely work -- and  " perform well in the OpenVMS space.  I Quite frankly, I tend to take Gartner with a a grain of salt - more like   a salt block...    Michael Austin   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 22:39:56 -05009 From: "John Gemignani, Jr." <jgemignanino@adelphiano.net>  Subject: Re: ftp login problems 1 Message-ID: <KI2dnamx5qyNONvdRVn-ig@adelphia.com>   5 "Ugo Pollio" <ugo.pollio@oracle.com> wrote in message ' news:L8_0c.4$4E5.135@news.oracle.com... 	 > Hi all,  > J > I have some problems trying to login with a java ftp client on a OpenVms ftp G > server. I think, I trapped the error. It seems that my client doesn't  "read"K > correctly the server response, once given the username. So, when it gives G > the user passord, it sends also the last part of the preceding server  > response. @ > Here what it happens from a logging and debugging ftp session: >  > USER <username>  > sendServer start > sendServer done  > readServerResponse start > Now past inner while loop  > 331 Username <username>  > readServerResponse done  > PASS <userpassword>  > sendServer start > sendServer done  > readServerResponse start > Now past inner while loop  > ^L^E requires a Password > readServerResponse done   > java.lang.NullPointerException > null > MSG=Error: Wrong Password  >  > , > Did anyone experienced the same behaviour?  > Any help would be appreciated. >  > Bye, Ugo Pollio  >   1 A couple of things to know about the protocol ...    The response is actually:   + 331 Username <username> requires a password   G For some reason your client seems to have broken the response up.  EachX command and responseI that is exchanged is terminated by an NVT newline sequence (see the RFC).i It is possible to receivehH multiple line responses as well.  The final line is indicated by a space  after the 3 digit response code.5 Otherwise you will see '-' characters in there, like:B  + 331-Username <username> requires a passwordc 331 Enter your password nowe  K Also be sure that you send your commands with the NVT terminator at the endC of the line.   -Johno   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 14:25:53 -0500 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>) Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMSt) Message-ID: <404782BE.3341F693@istop.com>V   Rob Young wrote:L >         Nice try.  I'd like to see him discontinue RDB.  A number of thoseI >         customers would migrate to a product *other* than Oracle.  ThatS< >         isn't smart business.  Larry is smarter than that.  L The same applies to VMS. At the time Compaq seriously looked at killing VMS,M the argument that saved VMS' life was that Compaq wouldn't keep VMS customerss? (losing support/service revenus, as well as wintel crap sales).s  N However, the conclusion is that your have a vendor who wants to get rid of theJ product, but hasn't yet found a way to do this profitably. (or accountantsK haven't been able to find a spin that can be presented to shareholders as aa wise move).t  C And as the customer base slowly erodes, the time appoaches when thee? accountants will be able to find a spin justifying killing VMS.d  K Under Compaq, there was serious competition from HP, Sun and IBM. But underaJ HP, there is only serious competition from IBM and Sun. So the accountantsJ probably are using a significantly greater customer retention factor sinceM customers have one less competitor they can go to, which makes it much easier ( to find a positive spin on retiring VMS.    N The prohlem with HP is that it has copied the Compaq "plan of record" which isL so distrustful, and HP even added to the distrust by cancelling EV79. HP hasL done nothing to distance itself from Compaq's wish to get rid of VMS. So oneN MUST assume that HP has adopted the same wish, and when you look at Stallard's) famous memo, that was very evident there.p   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Mar 2004 14:43:11 -0800M7 From: jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net (Daryl Jones) ) Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMSP= Message-ID: <8a646952.0403031443.55d2cf98@posting.google.com>-   Dear Dr. Dweeb:-  E GTECH did use Sybase on VMS. However, currently, I believe GTECH useslF Sybase on UNIX now. GTECH still uses VMS as you can see from their job opportunities.   Regards, Daryl Jonesw  U "Dr. Dweeb" <dr@dweeb.com> wrote in message news:<c24lr6$14op$1@news.cybercity.dk>.... > Fabio Cardoso wrote:A > > The GTECH company from USA is involved in some fraudulent andt8 > > corrupt actions in the brazilian Lotteries controled > > by the State.E > >nC > > Checking it I discovered this company in HP sites as an OpenVMS  > > partner. > > : > > http://h71000.www7.hp.com/solutions/finance/gtech.html > >aI > > The same company is involved with some strange facts when George BushsE > > was the Texas Governor.  He cancelled all the other lotteries andsF > > gave them to GTECH. The president of GTEC Ben Barnes helped George# > > Bush to leave the Vietnam war !t > >g > > Regardsi > >s > > FC > K > IIRC this company is the largest lottery systems software provider in thefI > world with a 50%+ market share world wide.  A great many of the lotterynM > systems providers use OpenVMS usually with Rdb for the back office systems.s >  > Dr. Dweeb    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 00:58:54 GMTc# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> ) Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMSeI Message-ID: <ibv1c.127391$Qg7.25884@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>V   Daryl Jones wrote: > Dear Dr. Dweeb:  > G > GTECH did use Sybase on VMS. However, currently, I believe GTECH useshH > Sybase on UNIX now. GTECH still uses VMS as you can see from their job > opportunities.    I Just another case of a former db partner of VMS no longer supporting VMS.eC And over time, the lottery customers using VMS will defect as well.   L I expect that someday in the not too far distant future, carly(tm) will giveK Larry a sly nod and wink and Oracle and Rdb on VMS will be no more as well. ) How do you spell 'kiss of death for VMS'?m  L But I guess doing some VMS advertising and marketing never entered the mindsL of those 'invent'ive marketing folks at HP. They've been busy inventing ways to kill VMS.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 22:48:49 GMTR# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>o) Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMSCJ Message-ID: <lnO1c.138139$Qg7.117979@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   Rob Young wrote: > In articleC > <UIH1c.76728$sl.7900@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, "Johng! > Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes:m >> Rob Young wrote:t >'B >> If Ellison thought for a moment that it would be better for hisE >> shareholders (he being one of the larger ones) that Rdb disappear,rF >> then that's what will happen - customer migrations and costs to the >> customer be damned. >-D > Nice try.  I'd like to see him discontinue RDB.  A number of thoseA > customers would migrate to a product *other* than Oracle.  That14 > isn't smart business.  Larry is smarter than that. >.    K Remind me again how many Peoplesoft customers don't want Orcale to buy thatgG company. How many of them will look to other vendors? Don't forget thatrJ Oracle's plan of record there is to kill the Peoplesoft product lineup and0 migrate all those customers to the Oracle suite.  I Once Larry gets something into his bonnet he is not easily dissuaded. Godo* help VMS if he decides Rdb's number is up.   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Mar 2004 17:21:57 -0600 4 From: kuhrt@nospammy.encompasserve.org (Marty Kuhrt)) Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS 3 Message-ID: <jXuz5MA7X8y7@eisner.encompasserve.org>u   > P > Back in the mid nineties, they used SYBASE (back when there *was* a sybase forQ > vms).  While lotteries are their main gag, I did some contract work for them on J > a non-lottery project (the Texas Lone Star Card, which was an electronic > benefits transfer system). >  > Wayne   E Barra used to do most of their computing using SAS and Sybase on VMS.mB Sybase dropped VMS support, and all computing moved to Sun and NT.B I used to have to drive past Sybase HQ during my commute.  I would4 always have something choice to say as I drove past.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 18:19:55 -0500' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>d) Subject: RE: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMSoR Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB279540@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message------ > From: John Smith [mailto:a@nonymous.com]=20  > Sent: March 4, 2004 5:49 PMp > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com3+ > Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMSP >=20 > Rob Young wrote: > > In articleH > > <UIH1c.76728$sl.7900@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, "John=20# > > Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes:K > >> Rob Young wrote:n > > G > >> If Ellison thought for a moment that it would be better for his=20 J > >> shareholders (he being one of the larger ones) that Rdb disappear,=20> > >> then that's what will happen - customer migrations and=20 > costs to the=20  > >> customer be damned. > >lI > > Nice try.  I'd like to see him discontinue RDB.  A number of those=20vA > > customers would migrate to a product *other* than Oracle. =20  > That isn't=20<0 > > smart business.  Larry is smarter than that. > >5 >=20 >=20= > Remind me again how many Peoplesoft customers don't want=20J> > Orcale to buy that company. How many of them will look to=20= > other vendors? Don't forget that Oracle's plan of record=20 ? > there is to kill the Peoplesoft product lineup and migrate=20g* > all those customers to the Oracle suite. >=20? > Once Larry gets something into his bonnet he is not easily=20o; > dissuaded. God help VMS if he decides Rdb's number is up.y >=20   John,   F As mentioned previously, Oracle's public statement is to *not* to killH the PeopleSoft products, but rather integrate them into Oracle offerings@ - and they use Oracle Rdb as an example where they have acquiredE technology and continued to enhance them - NOT kill them as you implyrB with your "Oracles plan of record is to migrate them to the Oracle suite" statement.t  
 Reference:: http://www.oracle.com/peoplesoft/index.html?customers.htmlH "We know how to do this. When Oracle acquired Rdb from Digital EquipmentH Corporation in 1994, we promised to focus on quality and stability whileH enhancing features based on customer demand. Nine years and thousands ofC satisfied customers later, we're doing exactly that. In fact, we've B developed more than 50 percent of the code base and sponsor annual customer forums worldwide."    Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultantk HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660t Fax: 613-591-4477r Email: kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcoms. (remove the DOT's and AT for email address)=20   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Mar 2004 16:24:52 -0800i7 From: jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net (Daryl Jones)d) Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMSn= Message-ID: <8a646952.0403041624.67271536@posting.google.com>b   Dear John Smith:  F When Sybase made the decision to go to fewer platforms to support, VMSA was going to be one of them. However, Sybase was in such terriblepF financial problems with red ink. They had to go for the platforms thatB had growth potential to dig their way out of red ink to black. The! problem wasn't VMS but Sybase!!!!6   Regards, Daryl Jones.  r "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message news:<bZG1c.76279$sl.56240@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>... > Daryl Jones wrote: > > Dear John Smith: > >hB > > Sybase drop of VMS support had more to do with their financialI > > problems than it had to with VMS. I believe Sybase used to support 18 6 > > platforms then drop down to 4 UNIX flavors and NT. >  >  > Daryl, > M > Do you think for a moment that Sybase would have dropped support for VMS ifyA > the VMS market were vibrant and growing for them? Not a chance.p > L > What VMS didn't have going for it then is exactly the same it doesn't haveL > going for it now - an indifferent owner that wouldn't advertise/market VMSK > into markets it knew it could sell into and owners that sees PeeCee's and6L > Microsoft products as their salvation even if they lose money selling that > combination.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 04:37:42 -0000a! From: Z  <zarlenga@conan.ids.net>d) Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMSn0 Message-ID: <104dckmjci9ajd1@corp.supernews.com>   Dr. Dweeb <dr@dweeb.com> wrote: K : IIRC this company is the largest lottery systems software provider in thesI : world with a 50%+ market share world wide.  A great many of the lottery M : systems providers use OpenVMS usually with Rdb for the back office systems.   B Gtech's VMS systems are legacy only and have been since ~2000 whenD they moved to Tru64 and then AIX.  As legacy systems are retired andB replaced with new technology, the market will be predominantly AIX and other flavors of Unix.  > Since ~1995, the back end databases have been Sybase, not Rdb.   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Mar 2004 23:49:24 -0800e7 From: jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net (Daryl Jones) ) Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMSa= Message-ID: <8a646952.0403032349.74f2c910@posting.google.com>A   Dear John Smith:  > Sybase drop of VMS support had more to do with their financialE problems than it had to with VMS. I believe Sybase used to support 18s2 platforms then drop down to 4 UNIX flavors and NT.   Regards, Daryl Jones5      t "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message news:<ibv1c.127391$Qg7.25884@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>... > Daryl Jones wrote: > > Dear Dr. Dweeb:p > >dI > > GTECH did use Sybase on VMS. However, currently, I believe GTECH uses J > > Sybase on UNIX now. GTECH still uses VMS as you can see from their job > > opportunities. >  > K > Just another case of a former db partner of VMS no longer supporting VMS. E > And over time, the lottery customers using VMS will defect as well.0 > N > I expect that someday in the not too far distant future, carly(tm) will giveM > Larry a sly nod and wink and Oracle and Rdb on VMS will be no more as well.0+ > How do you spell 'kiss of death for VMS'?i > N > But I guess doing some VMS advertising and marketing never entered the mindsN > of those 'invent'ive marketing folks at HP. They've been busy inventing ways > to kill VMS.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 09:58:12 +0100  From: "Dr. Dweeb" <dr@dweeb.com>) Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS , Message-ID: <c26r2u$r1s$1@news.cybercity.dk>   John Smith wrote:p > Daryl Jones wrote: >> Dear Dr. Dweeb: >>H >> GTECH did use Sybase on VMS. However, currently, I believe GTECH usesE >> Sybase on UNIX now. GTECH still uses VMS as you can see from theirt >> job opportunities.o >t > F > Just another case of a former db partner of VMS no longer supportingD > VMS. And over time, the lottery customers using VMS will defect as > well.  >hD > I expect that someday in the not too far distant future, carly(tm)F > will give Larry a sly nod and wink and Oracle and Rdb on VMS will be< > no more as well. How do you spell 'kiss of death for VMS'? >-  E Rumour has it that Larry has been close to doing this previously, but5 circumstances prevented it.   K Rdb is clearly an important piece of software for VMS, as it is the core of J the OM software, Several lottery systems, Manufacturing software etc. etc.C that still sells on VMS.  Were Rdb to be canned and these 3rd party2G applications became available on another OS, one of the few applicationi) based reasons to buy VMS would disappear.I  G The problem of course is that Rdb has lost most of the small and mediumsK sized customers and continues to exist because it is simply too good at the8B big high availability TP systems game.  That is a best a temporaryH advantage, and the forced move for that these customers to Itanic may be3 when they decide that enough is enough and move on.r  K (Does anyone know anything about the port of Rdb to Itanium? I heard it wasn WIP, but no timelines.)   K If you want to see how much market mindset OracleRdb has, check out the job C availability for Rdb experience - it is so close to zero that it issJ invisible.  In fact a number of the reasonably well known Rdb experts haveK given up moved on to SQL Server, OracleXi and anything that runs on Unix inr
 recent years.   J I guess Rdb is to Oracle like VMS is to HP.  Just a cow to be milked untilF it dies.  The parallels are interesting in fact.  Superior quality andK functionality, super engineering team, no marketing/advertising, no mindsetaI within the Oracle organisation etc. etc.  VMS and Rdb are like two stones6I dropped in the Mariannas trench engaged in a very long race to the bottomr and total obscurity.    Enough ranting, work to be done.  
 Dr. Dweeb.  D > But I guess doing some VMS advertising and marketing never enteredD > the minds of those 'invent'ive marketing folks at HP. They've been" > busy inventing ways to kill VMS.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 01:07:57 -0500 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>& Subject: Re: Intel releases 64bit Xeon) Message-ID: <4046C790.253C5463@istop.com>B   Bill Todd wrote:L > > Note that the 370 architecture doesn't have a bright future since IBM is= > > porting MVS over to POWER. (or has that been cancelled ?)  > 2 > Nobody's talking about the 370 architecture, JF.  N Isn't that what the p390 systems are ?????  I realise that since the 370s, IBMF has managed to go to 31 bit adressing (from 24), but isn't it the same. assembler instructions with a few additions ??   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 00:54:24 -0500* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>& Subject: Re: Intel releases 64bit Xeon2 Message-ID: <OJWdnTIIWZLxWdvdRVn-iQ@metrocast.net>  7 "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> wrote in messagep# news:404697ED.F3B97447@istop.com...t > Bill Todd wrote:K > > The p690 system architecture (including the on-chip support for off-MCMgE > > accesses) seems to me likely to scale much more linearly than thed	 Superdomet > > architecture.  >sJ > Note that the 370 architecture doesn't have a bright future since IBM is; > porting MVS over to POWER. (or has that been cancelled ?)-  0 Nobody's talking about the 370 architecture, JF.   - bill   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 01:09:16 -0500* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>& Subject: Re: Intel releases 64bit Xeon2 Message-ID: <lPednbpUWaJ1WtvdRVn-uw@metrocast.net>  7 "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com> wrote in messageg# news:4046C790.253C5463@istop.com...s > Bill Todd wrote:K > > > Note that the 370 architecture doesn't have a bright future since IBM> is? > > > porting MVS over to POWER. (or has that been cancelled ?)> > >i4 > > Nobody's talking about the 370 architecture, JF. >nL > Isn't that what the p390 systems are ?????  I realise that since the 370s, IBMhH > has managed to go to 31 bit adressing (from 24), but isn't it the same0 > assembler instructions with a few additions ??  K No, the p-Series systems are POWERx systems, running Unix.  I don't know ifeK there ever was a 'p390' (though of course there was, and I assume still is,  an S/390 mainframe).   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 03:03:22 -0500 * From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>& Subject: Re: Intel releases 64bit Xeon) Message-ID: <4046E295.A415777F@istop.com>c   Dan Foster wrote:lK > The zSeries systems are based on a 64 bit architecture that is a supersetmJ > of ESA/390. Perhaps this is the port you were thinking of? If so, it was > completed a while ago.  E Nop. i distinctly remember reading an announcement (and this was even L discussed here a few years ago) that IBM intended to move MVS  over to POWER9 based systems in order to focus on a single architecture.i   > VMS is nearly as good... t  L Nowhere near. The move from VAX to Alpha, which coincided with the move fromL VAX C to DECC required a lot or work, and Digital failed with its VEST whichM should have been included with every system instead of being sold separately.oD Apple had the best platform migration with the automatically invokedF translator that could mix modules compiled for 68k as well as powerpc.  L But I agree that in terms of system services, VMS has been excellent through
 the years.L And what is most impressive is that today's VMS versions still run on my allO mighty Microvax II. with only 16 meg of memory (but one heck of a page file :-)m    K > So getting back to this thread... I honestly don't think that IBM's goingoJ > to suddenly drop older architectures because it would be a major selling > point for their competitors,  H With Power being much younger than the 360, it isn't stuck with very oldM baggage. Power will be IBM's fastest chip. It will become increasingly harderDM for IBM to sell 390 architecture systems when Power system will increasinmglye become more and more powerful.  L I couldn't immediatly find an IBM statement about migration of MVS to Power,& but I did find this post in comp.arch:  5 "Nick Maclaren" <nmm1@cus.cam.ac.uk> wrote in messagey <...>  > E > I was at a presentation when an IBM veep stated explicitly that IBMhE > intended to move all of its systems, including OS/400, CMS and MVS,eC > to POWER within a few years.  Interestingly, he convinced more oft, > the technical people than I was expecting. >pE > Given a relatively clean ABI, such as is typical for Unix, it couldo( > certainly be done.  Given the MVS ABI? >  >e
 > Regards, > Nick Maclaren0    5 > Also: http://www-1.ibm.com/servers/eserver/zseries/j  I You'll find that IBM is touting its "mainframe charter" where it promises N continued innovation for mainframes.  No commitment to continue to develop the 360 architecture forever.y  K I have no idea what sort of timescale would be involved, but I suspect this N would be a 10 year project at least. Note that much of the MVS middleware suchI as DB2, CICS etc has already been ported to other platforms and operatingaG systems, so creating a version for MVS on Power shouldn't be difficult.h  N And just like Alpha has a Macro compiler, it should be very easy to provide an  IBM Assembler compiler on Power.   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Mar 2004 13:59:58 -0800 & From: jordan@ccs4vms.com (Rich Jordan)' Subject: Re: Is NAS 150 layered or SIP? = Message-ID: <cc5619f2.0403041359.69dc419a@posting.google.com>h  s fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso) wrote in message news:<f30679fb.0403030217.68218e26@posting.google.com>...C  B > I dont understand why OpenVMS still having this licensing model.@ > Other OSes like Solaris dont have it anymore. For me is wasteB > of time and resources to mantain this model based in NAS, etc... >  > 	 > Regardsh >  > FC  B I wish they didn't.  The inability to transfer the NAS license (orC individual EIP licenses) with an Alpha has cost us numerous upgradeyC sales opportunities.  The system being replaced could _easily_ haveoF found a new home at a site upgrading from even older equipment, makingD it a lot easier to offer better pricing to both the original and the? new owner, except that the cost of replacing the needed NAS/EIP > licenses _always_ blew the deal.  Try to explain why that usedD DS10/466 they can pick up for a really nice price needs to have manyC times that price in new license purchases (or upgrades of their old- box licenses)...  D But then we're not supposed to be selling VMS systems any more since@ we can't do $1,000,000 per year in hardware sales to stay in the> program, so I guess I shouldn't care about crapulent licensing schemes.   Rich JordanH CCSl   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 21:26:55 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>t( Subject: Re: It's all about perception!!J Message-ID: <z4s1c.82704$ah.79761@twister01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   Bill Gunshannon wrote:5 > In article <xdXARG+w6tI1@eisner.encompasserve.org>,s? > koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:l@ >> In article <c24m0g$1a50@newton.cc.rl.ac.uk>, "Richard Brodie" >> <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk> writes: >>>tD >>> "Bob Koehler" <koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org> wrote in9 >>> message news:y2my+Psb9Ms4@eisner.encompasserve.org...  >>> F >>>>    Too bad that's technically inacurate.  Nothing in VAX hardwareD >>>>    prevents the exectution of a NOEXE PSECT, it's just a linker >>>>    hint. Alpha, too.g >>> 6 >>> and write for an access mode implies read too, no? >>F >>    Yep.  Only NOWRT is realy enforced by VAX hardware, and the four* >>    levels at which access is controled. >> >PE > It's too bad everybody latched onto the wrong point of the article.tF > Many (Most?) of the people who read things like The Risks Digest areG > not programmers or computer engineers and a mistaken technical detaile4 > about a dead architecture is really not important. >sE > What was important was the comment "the late VAX/VMS". You know itseD > not "the late" and I know its not "the late" , but how many peopleB > are going to see that who do not know and will take it as gospelB > because they are unlikely to see anything anywhere to refute it?= > I don't know if it still is, but The Risk Digest used to be0D > distributed throughout the halls of Congress (in printed form) andD > while I doubt many members of the House or Senate read it, I wouldC > bet their staff, who actually write the position papers they take F > credit for, read it. The negative advertising is out there, where is > the positive?     J Who needs positive VMS advertising when you can get a full color poster ofD carly(tm) on the slopes at Davos wearing a sassy Bogner outfit?  ;-)  L HP has zero interest in promoting OpenVMS. As far as they are concerned it'sI already on the embalming table and they are injecting formalin at one endE' while bleeding it out at the other end.d   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Mar 2004 15:21:30 -0800a2 From: vibroplex@mindspring.com (Derek Cohn/WB0TUA)* Subject: Libary/CDD Question for Vax-Basic= Message-ID: <d7d0c297.0403041521.38ad17f5@posting.google.com>e  
 Dear Friends,C  @ You guys have been very helpful in the past and I'd like to poseA another question.  Currently, I have a data file with a structure/F defined in a CDD.  I have a text library entry that points to the dataE in the CDD.  In my VAX Basic code, I use a %include statement for thehB text library and the structure in the CDD is brought in at compile time just fine.n  E My question is about using a parallel data structure identical to theaC entry in the CDD.  I need to create another file that must have theeD identical structure to the first file.  I thought the best way to doF this was to try to use the same CDD entry for both (so I wouldn't haveC to maintain two entries to keep them synchronized).  My bright ideay didn't work (compile errors).    Here's the record in the CDD:T   DMU> lis edidb_record             EDIDB_RECORD;1 <CDD$RECORD> DMU>                            @ Here are the two library objects pointing to the same CDD entry:  1  %INCLUDE %FROM %CDD "FILES.EDIDB_RECORD"        :1  MAP ( EDIDB.MAP ) EDIDB_RECORD    EDIDB         D1  MAP ( EDIDB.MAP ) STRING EDIDB_T_RECORD =  512  r1                                                  l1  %INCLUDE %FROM %CDD "FILES.EDIDB_RECORD"        L1  MAP ( AEDIDB.MAP ) AEDIDB_RECORD          AEDIDB 1  MAP ( AEDIDB.MAP ) STRING AEDIDB_T_RECORD =  512H  ( Here are examples of the compile errors:  C %BASIC-E-CDDDUPREC, (1) record EDIDB_RECORD from CDD/Repository hast duplicate name  F %BASIC-E-CDDAMBFLD, (1) ambiguous field name EDIDB_RECORD::T_PONO from CDD/Repository  C Can anyone suggest how I can use the single CDD entry to define two C identical structures in my program?  I'm a novice with both the CDD-< and the Library utility so any detailed explanation would be gratefully accepted!   Thanks,y  
 Derek Cohn   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Mar 2004 19:24:30 GMTb( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: OpenVMS Feelingsp: Message-ID: <c27vpe$1pduvb$1@ID-135708.news.uni-berlin.de>  = In article <5ee1d1b7.0403040830.6b80d591@posting.google.com>,.0 	phillip_thayer@hotmail.com (PhilThayer) writes: >> mB >> What exactly is a "backend machine" in an academic environment? >>   > A > That would be spmething like an RDBMS server, Web server, Email  > Server, etc...  2 You ignored the "in an academic environment".  :-)' That is what the discussion was about. e   >  >> cD >> You seem to think we are unique.  VMS lost most of the edu marketD >> long ago.  Sadly, even with the efforts of many people here thereH >> seems little real interest in getting it back.  Every day the chances >> get slimmer.c >> $ > F > I did not work in Universities on the "Academic" side.  I was on theD > Administrative support side and that is where the VMS was used theD > most.  What I did see was one university that assigned one projectB > from the administrative side of the house to a 4th year class toE > complete each year (A complete functional project, not some made upuH > project.)  That was experience on VMS for the students.  Maybe if moreD > of that was done then VMS would get more exposure to the students.  C Lots of problems with this.  Security.  You can't let students havehF any access to administrative machines.  Experience.  How can a studentA who has never seen VMS be expected to develop software on or moresD importantly, for it? And I can't even begin to imagine the legal and< liability problems having students do real work might cause.  C Of course, it is all irrelevant.  If VMS doesn't find it's way back A into the education stream before long there will be no one in the A purchasing chain to recommend or approve it's purchase.  And that>+ was the subject of the original discussion.r   bill   -- >J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   m   ------------------------------   Date: 03 Mar 2004 21:18:27 GMT& From: jealousxmp@aol.com (jealous xmp) Subject: Re: OpenVMS Feelings.: Message-ID: <20040303161827.25804.00000799@mb-m01.aol.com>  E >LAB PC's will probably always remain on Windows until a market share  >is obtained by another OS.t  N Our school used Mac and Sun heavily for workstations (10 years ago though).  IO didn't even see windows in a lab until 2nd year.  I'd imagine many liberal artsnJ schools use windows heavily today, I wonder what the tech schools use (forH workstations / desktops)?  Linux would certainly be the right price, andI possibly Solaris on edu discounts.  Both Sparc and PPC hardware is pricey	9 though, so Windows / x86, linux / x86 wins on that point.t  K With the Tru64 / VMS hobbyist license, that's an opportunity for students.  J Assuming they can afford the Alpha hardware.  Sparc / Solaris is certainlyI another possibility, but one loses the license as soon as school is over.a   Michaell   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Mar 2004 17:20:52 -0800 ( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)L Subject: OpenVMS virus proof while other disks get zapped by latest viruses!= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0403031720.341f83d3@posting.google.com>   : I don't know if anyone has noticed, but a lot of companies6 are getting creamed by the latest round of viruses ...7 My boss has 4 friends from other companies who have alll9 lost servers ... but our "unhackable" virus proof OpenVMSf7 servers just keep humming along 24X7 ... isn't it greats to be on OpenVMS?  :)e   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Mar 2004 16:02:03 -0800h( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)P Subject: Re: OpenVMS virus proof while other disks get zapped by latest viruses!= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0403041602.187275ef@posting.google.com>o  b "rob kas" <rob@paychoice.com.noSPAM> wrote in message news:<104eebok3ks8jd4@corp.supernews.com>... > Bobh > & > What do you run on your VMS systems? >  >                       Rob"   everything!    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Mar 2004 20:59:06 -0800o. From: dieter.rossbach@gmx.de (dieter rossbach)P Subject: Re: OpenVMS virus proof while other disks get zapped by latest viruses!= Message-ID: <e1d40caf.0403042059.67460168@posting.google.com>   b "rob kas" <rob@paychoice.com.noSPAM> wrote in message news:<104eebok3ks8jd4@corp.supernews.com>... > Bobd > & > What do you run on your VMS systems? >  >                       Robe  6 Everything from Webserver, Email-SMTP- und Pop-Server,D Database-Server, PC-Fileserver to JAVA-based Level2 plant automation	 software.:   Dieter   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 21:06:48 +0100p" From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>/ Subject: Re: Pathworks-32 and Windaube XPrience<3 Message-ID: <40463b05$0$2474$626a14ce@news.free.fr>4   Hans ?   D.   Didier Morandi wrote: J > Who succeeded to have PCSA and XP work together fine? Mainly the DECnet  > stuff. > 	 > Thanks.n >  > D. >    -- r2 VAXUS - Your new helpful friend in the DEC Family!2 EHQ: 19 chemin de la Butte, 31400 Toulouse, France/       Phone: +336 7983 6418 Fax: +335 6154 1928s$                 http://www.vaxus.org   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 21:58:59 +0100e" From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com>/ Subject: Re: Pathworks-32 and Windaube XPriencee3 Message-ID: <40464741$0$2460$626a14ce@news.free.fr>r   Hans Vlems wrote:e  K > Not sure whether you mean me Didier, but I run DECnet and Pathworks underrN > Windows98. Mainly because I was under the impression that DECnet and WindowsG > 2000 don't go together. IIRC W2k (and thus its cousin WX) use the MACnK > address for all kinds of purposes, like licensing. DECnet changes the MACsM > address: it reflects the DECnet address. Move the DECnet address to another K > PC and you'd be able to move the licenses without Microsoft being able toyG > check the platform change. No way Bill Gee would approve that, right?rJ > Seriously, if I could download a recent version of Pathworks (I have 7.1" > only) then I'd check it for you.  
 T'was you.H I have 7.1 too and the relnotes sez "no XP". I mean they do not say "XP Q supported", and "it don't work no more"... well, it does not work at all: "Local dN network is unreachable" trying to DECnet copy files. I know, I can do FTP but  this is another issue.  C As there are only five "tools" available in the Windows Start Menu:m   DECnet file transfer Event logger Password assistant uninstaller- and Information Shelf-  5 I do not see how I could make that network reachable.z Maybe by RTFM? :-)s   D.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 23:13:50 GMT1& From: Lee Mah <lytmah@telusplanet.net>> Subject: Question on VMS 7.3-2 Sysgen parameter SHADOW_SITE_ID, Message-ID: <OKO1c.39645$n17.38680@clgrps13>  5 Has anyone tried setting this parameter to a non-zero # value to improve read performance?.n   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:05:46 -0500* From: "Marty O'Connor" <moconnor@dvfs.com> Subject: Re: Recursive COPYk: Message-ID: <c27umb$1q75ot$1@ID-118202.news.uni-berlin.de>  H "Bob Koehler" <koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org> wrote in message- news:j3EwDko1hNZ0@eisner.encompasserve.org...s  " :    backup [a.b...]*.*;* [d.b...] :. :    oru :n :    create/directory [d.b]   :    copy [a.b...]*.*;* [d.b...] :hE :  BACKUP will make all the directories in the tree, including [d.b].hH :  COPY won't make [d.b], but will make all the subdirectories of [d.b].G :  IIRC different rules for updating the creation or modification dates, :  of the new copies may apply.r  ] Another advantage to BACKUP is that it does not change the modify date but it will change theaH ownership to the process executing the backup unless you use /owner=orig   Martye   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 19:30:15 -0500n3 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <rgilbert88@comcast.net>  Subject: Re: Recursive COPYh0 Message-ID: <ut2dndUoxZ2XV9rdRVn-hQ@comcast.com>  
 How about:  7 $ BACKUP /LOG  SOURCE_DISK:[SOURCE_DIRECTORY...]*.*;*  C DEST_DISK:[DEST_DIRECTORY] -        /BY_OWNER=ORIGINALH   Michael D. Ober wrote:  L >Does anyone have a DCL script that takes a source and destination directoryJ >and recursively copies the source to the destination.  Similar to the DOS% >XCOPY /S or the Unix cp -r commands.r >J >Thanks, >Mike. >G >H >  t >e   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Mar 2004 11:20:27 -0800g. From: fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso). Subject: SDALINKMISM  after OpenVMS UPDATE 3.0< Message-ID: <f30679fb.0403041120.e4f1f7c@posting.google.com>  T I am receiving this message after applying the patch : DEC AXPVMS VMS73_UPDATE V3.0    But ....    E  SDALINKMISM,  link time of SYS$BASE_IMAGE built into SDA$SHARE ('dd- :        mmm-yy hh:mm') does not match link time of image in#        'target' ('dd-mmm-yy hh:mm')i  )   Facility:     SDA, System Dump Analyzer   K   Explanation:  The copy of the SDA$SHARE image you are using was not built D         for the version of SYS$BASE_IMAGE.EXE that was used when the)         system being analyzed was booted.d  @         This message is only a warning. SDA continues unless the/         mismatch causes an unrecoverable error.   I   User Action:  Be sure to use the SDA$SHARE image that was built for thehE         OpenVMS version used in the system or dump you are analyzing.I      0 My products list. I know its just  a Warning !      C88601_SYSTEM> prod show hist%P ----------------------------------- ----------- ----------- --------------------I PRODUCT                             KIT TYPE    OPERATION   DATE AND TIME P ----------------------------------- ----------- ----------- --------------------P DEC AXPVMS TCPIP_ECO V5.1-154       Patch       Install     02-MAR-2004 14:25:04P DEC AXPVMS COBRTL V2.7-641B         Full LP     Install     02-MAR-2004 14:22:24P DEC AXPVMS VMS73_UPDATE V3.0        Patch       Install     02-MAR-2004 12:11:19P DEC AXPVMS VMS73_PCSI V1.0          Patch       Install     02-MAR-2004 12:08:29P DEC AXPVMS DECNET_PHASE_IV V7.3     Full LP     Install     01-MAR-2004 10:37:36P DEC AXPVMS DWMOTIF V1.2-6           Full LP     Install     01-MAR-2004 10:37:36P DEC AXPVMS OPENVMS V7.3             Platform    Install     01-MAR-2004 10:37:36P DEC AXPVMS TCPIP V5.1-15            Full LP     Install     01-MAR-2004 10:37:36P DEC AXPVMS VMS V7.3                 Oper System Install     01-MAR-2004 10:37:36P ----------------------------------- ----------- ----------- --------------------   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 02:05:11 GMT-L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr")& Subject: Re: SSH login problem -- Bug?6 Message-ID: <00A2E59B.B2D3A200@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  d In article <4047D23F.8020106@Flying-Disk.com>, Alan Frisbie <Usenet01REMOVE@Flying-Disk.com> writes: >w3 >This told me that SSH is working and attempting to<: >validate my password on the correct account, but failing. >o: >As an experiment, I tried using SSH to the SYSTEM account >on the VMS box.   It worked!e >r: >The critical difference in the SYSUAF records for the two
 >accounts is:m >aB >Username: SYSTEM                           Owner:  SYSTEM MANAGER >kE >Expiration:            (none)    Pwdminimum:  8   Login Fails:     0r? >Pwdlifetime:           (none)    Pwdchange:  31-DEC-2003 16:21e > @ >Username: FRISBIE                          Owner:  Alan FrisbieE >Expiration:            (none)    Pwdminimum:  6   Login Fails:     0t? >Pwdlifetime:           (none)    Pwdchange:      (pre-expired)  >r? >Even though the pre-expired status does not prevent logins via A >telnet, set host, or via a directly-connected terminal, SSH doesn >not allow it. >e? >Is this a bug in SSH, or a bug in all the other login methods?e >s  J I don't know about the TCPIP$SSH, since we use Multinet here.  On MultinetI you can set a logical to control whether it will allow logging in with a t pre-expired password.s  F I think there's no globally-useful right answer to this behavior; SSH O (unlike Telnet, DECnet (without setting up a DECnet object), etcetera, but liketM RSH) allows your remote session to specify commands on the command line whichr# should be executed on the SSH host.w  4 (Was that incoherent?  I mean, remotely, you can do   " ssh frisbie@mysystem.tld "DIR *.*"  K Handy when scripting stuff on other platforms; same stuff is used for scp.) K Scripts will break if the SSH server tries to log you in and then pauses torA require you to change your password before executing the command.d  O So I don't think this is a bug in either SSH or in everything that goes through0I LOGINOUT.EXE.  I think this is a combination of features which leads to an surprising result.   -- Alan3 -- 9O ===============================================================================g0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056RM  Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA   94025 O ===============================================================================<   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 14:59:38 -0500* From: "rob kas" <rob@paychoice.com.noSPAM> Subject: Re: Sun On The Run?0 Message-ID: <104f2l5lobhfpe3@corp.supernews.com>  . "CJT" <abujlehc@prodigy.net> wrote in message $ news:40476AB1.1050604@prodigy.net... > Bob Ceculski wrote:m >. > <snip>D >> OpenVMS will not be going anywhere for a long time ... businessesA >> that want low TCO and security and uptime depend on it ... and2C >> look at the latest virus rampage wiping out server after server,.D >> but not VMS servers ... we will be on VMS as long as it is aroundB >> because not even a free garbage linux server can offer what VMS >> can, and TCO proves it ...t >r > That sounds a lot like Wang. >                   And Data General    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 21:55:01 GMT.4 From: "Roert G. Schaffrath" <rschaffrath@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: Sun On The Run?% Message-ID: <4047A5B4.3728@yahoo.com>b   rob kas wrote: > / > "CJT" <abujlehc@prodigy.net> wrote in messages& > news:40476AB1.1050604@prodigy.net... > > Bob Ceculski wrote:  > >r
 > > <snip>F > >> OpenVMS will not be going anywhere for a long time ... businessesC > >> that want low TCO and security and uptime depend on it ... andmE > >> look at the latest virus rampage wiping out server after server, F > >> but not VMS servers ... we will be on VMS as long as it is aroundD > >> because not even a free garbage linux server can offer what VMS > >> can, and TCO proves it ...e > >o  > > That sounds a lot like Wang. > >  > ! >                And Data Generaln   ...and Prime !  @ BTW, I did like the DG MV series - AOS/VS was an interesting OS.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 15:33:33 +1100r' From: nospam <x@wedontwantyourspam.com>  Subject: Re: Sun On The Run?5 Message-ID: <BC6CFCCD.252A1%x@wedontwantyourspam.com>e  I in article 8a646952.0403031500.7cf9b7f@posting.google.com, Daryl Jones atT> jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net wrote on 04/03/2004 10:00:   > Linux  > Sun On The Run? $ > Daniel Lyons, 03.03.04, 9:52 AM ET ..C > company in New York, is ripping out hundreds of Sun servers in 16rE > locations and replacing them with inexpensive servers running Intelg0 > processors and Linux, a free operating system. >  > For more of this article:r > P > http://www.forbes.com/technology/2004/03/03/cz_dl_0303linux.html?partner=newsc > om  K That's a loss for SUN but that same pressure is against VMS also, and everypJ other UNIX that costs money. When you can get you OS for free and price isL your decider. Then Intel x86 boxes can be the cheapest solution. Having saidK that people use that to convince them selves that's the way too go and then.J start spending similar money because they don't buy "put together yourselfK clones" and buy SAN storage and SDLT or other tape solutions and everythinghJ else you really need in a production bet you business solution. It ends up costing about the same.   K  Box sellers like HP and SUN make way too much margin on things like memorysH and controllers but they also provide some degree of certainty. I know IJ sound like I'm contradicting myself and a little confused but then I thinkK that's how the market is around this stuff, a lot of double think going on.d  t  L  Since Linux and other free UNIX like OS's went multi-CPU the world changed.L  Microsoft feels the biggest threat since they don't sell hardware they sell and expensive OS.b  tJ   I don't see anything about VMS, or happening in the world to reverse theL stakes for VMS. It took too much damage in the last 6-10years too much bloodG has move off and nothings is replacing that. The next generations of IT@J people are either Microsoft kiddies or UNIX kiddies. Its not time yet, butJ its coming, VMS will be dead. Its really a race to see which will go first
 SUN or VMS ;)t   > - > As you can see, the article is from FORBES.b   And you point is ?   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 21:35:38 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>X( Subject: Re: Support of USB Memory stickJ Message-ID: <Kcs1c.82707$ah.62100@twister01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   Dan O'Reilly wrote: , > At 09:07 AM 3/3/2004, Michael Unger wrote:3 >> On 2004-03-03 11:21, "Christoph Gartmann" wrote:  >>	 >>> [...]9 >>>0D >>> These sticks are the real replacement of the former floppy disk.C >>> Every platform supports it, the file format is simple, usage it9F >>> simple. Tell me what is better for the purpose of exchanging data. >>	 >> CD-RW?r >o > ..a network...?n >l* > Remember, we're not talking PC's here...    7 Some machines are not on networks for security reasons.N  G I'll grant you that CD-R may be cheap and relatively pervasive, but thesI price of USB sticks are plummeting. Capacities of 2Gb are now hitting thel market in USB 2.0.    K Some moronic jusridictions (Canada) charge a levy on every blank CD becauseHL the music industry managed to get a bunch of bureaucrats convinced that mostL CD's are being used to rip off the recording artists. So the levy is charged. on each CD, irrespective of the use of the CD.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 22:38:51 GMT , From: Forrest Kenney <Forrest.Kenney@hp.com>( Subject: Re: Support of USB Memory stick& Message-ID: <40465D82.97A94BD4@hp.com>  D 1) So far all we have are it would be nice not a business case.  We E    need to know how may systems sales hinge on having this.  That is gD    what we need to make a business case.  Having said that a subset B    of USB mass storage is on the to do list.  We have no plans to !    support QIC tapes or floppies.a  E 2) I gave an unsupported mass storage driver to Steve Hoffman to put jD    on the Freeware site back in November of 2003.  So you might bug 3    him to get it up if it is not already out there.r  E 3) Even with the driver you will need V7.3-2 to have all the USB bug r>    fixes needed for the mass storage driver.  You still might D    have problems. I recently tried a PEN drive with an embedded hub D    that tripped over a bug in our HUB code.  That change is only in     a release stream.  C 4) Forget about using USB on the built in USB hardware in the DS10.eB    The current versions of the firmware disable the controller so C    the O.S. does not see it.  If you have older fimware there is a oB    problem with plugging/unplugging devices.  We have no plans to     ever address that problem.l  @ 5) File systems and pen drives.  The devices have whatever file A    system you choose to format them with.  I have formatted them  3    for files and the reformatted them for FAT-16.  a  ? 6) I have not tried PCDISK but I would not assume that it will t*    work with the USB mass storage devices.     Forrest Kenney OpenVMS Development  USB midnight driver writer   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Mar 2004 22:52:49 -0600 - From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)e( Subject: Re: Support of USB Memory stick3 Message-ID: <g35KKwJ19hDh@eisner.encompasserve.org>   j In article <6.0.0.22.2.20040303194249.01f9d208@raptor.psccos.com>, Dan O'Reilly <dano@process.com> writes:   <top posting corrected>t  2 > At 06:16 PM 3/3/2004, healyzh@aracnet.com wrote:. >>Lord Isildur <isildur@andrew.cmu.edu> wrote: >> >> > how about a network?i >>6 >>There are lots of systems that can't be on networks.   <top posting corrected>   I > In my experience, a system that can't be on a network wouldn't DREAM oflN > allowing you to take a pocketable media out of the office to another system.. > Just my experience, with some work in DOD...  F Transfer via removeable media can pass through the hands of a securityE officer for whatever vetting they want to pursue.  One simple ruleseteD needed in some environments is to enforce that data transfer is only in one direction./  D (True security geeks will accept the premise that the timing channelH introduced by periodic return of "emptys" through the security officer'sG bulk eraser can be demonstrated to have sufficiently low bandwidth. :-)o   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 00:32:19 -0500d* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>( Subject: Re: Support of USB Memory stick) Message-ID: <4046BF38.F22BB9A7@istop.com>.   Dan O'Reilly wrote:-I > In my experience, a system that can't be on a network wouldn't DREAM ofeN > allowing you to take a pocketable media out of the office to another system.. > Just my experience, with some work in DOD...  L Not quite. I have on multiple occasions had Digital dial into my home systemN to deliver a patch destined for a "closed" customer, and the next day, I wouldI bring a TK50 drive to install the patch on the customer systems which was?N equipped with TK70s. It could read my stuff, but I couldn't write to my tapes.  M Heck, once they delivered to my home system a required patch for the IBM side K of the DECNET/SNA  file transfer software. I then loaded it via TK50 to themK customer's VMS system where it was copied to 9 track tape then moved to then IBM system.     L In the end, trust in the system manager is very important. And yes, you needN to have a minimal amount of paperwork to at least log the fact that a tape wasL brought in by a certain individual, but there is no way that in an IBM shop,5 you could have someone verify the contents of a TK50.y   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Mar 2004 16:47:56 -0800r. From: fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso); Subject: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy?d= Message-ID: <f30679fb.0403041647.28a64584@posting.google.com>i   THE DARKNESS IS FALLING ...-    ) http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=14521r    + Sending a message to Intel about the Itanic:    4 By INQUIRER staff: quinta-feira 04 maro 2004, 17:21  E  RUMOURS - and they remain just that as we write this  suggest HP isiF thinking about making big changes to its IA-64 (Itanium) line up, withC May Day expected to be the day when it's all change at the company. ? One rumour has it that HP could even EOL the IA-64, which woulde? certainly drop a bombshell on planet Intel - and which we thinkJ somewhat unlikely.  C HP has a complicated set of roadmaps which place the Itanium at the 1 centre of its future for large scale enterprises.b  C But we understand that HP is more than a little upset at Intel over 9 its recent announcement of 64-32 bit Xeons and Prescotts..  A How HP would square the end of the line of the IA-64 to its largea> corporate and federal customers remains unclear. It has made aF commitment to migrate OpenVMS to the IPF platform, and there's no word# of change from that division of HP..  D But we're watching closely to see just what it intends to do towards! the end of April and early May. e   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Mar 2004 18:14:28 -0800a( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)6 Subject: Re: Uninterruptable Power Supplies for Alphas= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0403041814.5968d95a@posting.google.com>e  j tadamsmar@yahoo.com (Tom Adams) wrote in message news:<ea44f5a1.0402270927.132a695b@posting.google.com>...
 > We have: >  > 2 AlphaStations 400 4/233c > 1 AlphaServer  800 5/333 > 1 DS10 466 >  > And we are getting:  > 1 DS10 600 > H > And, our management decided to drop hardware maintenance a while back. > H > I want to propose to my management that we get UPSes for all of these. > J > We don't need UPS for uptime, since all these system control other stuffJ > that goes down when the power fails.  But I think UPSes would reduce ourN > hardware repair and replacement costs, and would reduced the likelihood that< > a system would become flakey and start failing during use. > D > Is this justified?  Do you know of any info that would justify it? > K > Are there power conditioning solutions that are less expensive than UPSes  > that I should consider?y  = you can buy a belkin ups for $79 to $139 depending on desiredt< battery length, and that one ups will support an alphaserver: 800 or alpha station plus a decserver and vt and one other< device (tape or cd) comfortably ... yes ups keeps systems up: during sags and protects from surges, but we lost an alpha< to a surge thru a cable modem connection, so surges can come: from other sources so ups is not a %100 thing, but it sure	 helps ...    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 13:56:45 -0600p( From: brandon@dalsemi.com (John Brandon)( Subject: Re: VOL Shadow an mounted drive1 Message-ID: <04030413564511@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>t   norm.raphael@metso.com writes:P > > I was wondering if it is possible to volume shadow (software) a mounted diskG > > drive without having to dismount and then mount it as a shadow set.  > Q > No, but it is possible to mount the disk as a single-member shadowset and then  O > add the other volume later.  It is also not supported to dismount one member  J > of a shadowset and expect the dismounted member to retain integrety to a
 > certainty.    
 As I thought.a   > >  > > For example: > >  > > $ SHOW DEV DGA1000 > > E > > Device                  Device           Error    Volume           > > Free  Trans Mnt D > >  Name                   Status           Count     Label         > > Blocks Count CntC > > $1$DGA1000:   (MYNODE)  Mounted              0  XXX00          r > > 8001945     4  2 > >  > > $ SHOW DEV DGA1001 > > E > > Device                  Device           Error    Volume         n > > Free  Trans Mnt D > >  Name                   Status           Count     Label         > > Blocks Count CntC > > $1$DGA1001:   (MYNODE)  Mounted              0  XXX01          r > > 8001945     4  2 > >  > > A > > $ MOUNT DSA1: /SHADOW=($1$DGA1000:,$1$DGA1001:) YYY00 /SYSTEM. > > C > You have a slight problem here as your disk label does not match  D > either volume.  Also, you will destroy the existing data, if any, ? > on the volume added into the shadowset.  There is a /CONFIRM iE > qualifier to give you a second chance.  You really should read the r > shadowing manual.   0 My slight problem is I want SnapShot backup!  ;)  K Yes, I realize that this is not the correct syntax, was in a hurry to get ar4 thought online.  That said, thanks for the feedback.    M > I am thinking about doing this because I want to do some snapshot (sort of)r	 > backup.l > TIAl  L One thought (suggested to me directly) was to use the HSG80 mirroring.  This+ can be done however it is not the cleanest.b  M I remember back a year or two that VMS had a snap-shot backup solution.  Then @ it was retracted.  What was up with that?  Why did they yank it?    F Anyone have any other thoughts on how to do a snap-shot backup in VMS?      > Yes I am aware of DRM however it is at $35K a pop - no thanks!           J*o*h*n B*r*a*n*d*o*n' VMS Systems Administratorn* firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Mar 2004 13:35:39 -0800s* From: denny.rich@swagelok.com (Denny Rich)( Subject: Re: VOL Shadow an mounted drive< Message-ID: <d28306e.0403041335.2bf89eec@posting.google.com>   John,   9 No, you cannot convert a mounted disk into a shadow disk.e  ? Yes, you will have to FIRST dismount the physical disks.  Then,tD carefully and surely backup one of these disks because its data willF be destroyed. Lets say you want to mount $1$DGA1000 (label=XXX00), and will copy dga1001 to tape:   1. dismount $1$dga1000 w   2. backup to tape $1$dga1001  8 3. $ mount/system dsa1000:/shadow=$1$dga1000 XXX00 XXX00  F 4. when the backup to tape is finished, you can add in the other disk:8    $ mount/system dsa1000:/shadow=$1$dga1001 XXX00 XXX00  F 5. $ mount/cluster dsa1000:/shadow=($1$dga1000,$1$dga1001) XXX00 XXX00<    will then make everything visible to all clustered nodes.  D IIRC, step 3 is required the **first** time DSA1000 is ever mounted.. AFter that, you can use the command in step 5.  E Also, I mount all my disks as shadow sets, even the single ones. ThistF way, If I ever want to move the app and data to a different spindle, IE just add in the new spindle, then take out the old spindle, then editi? my "system_mount" procedure so it all works at the next reboot.t   regards,   dennye    a brandon@dalsemi.com (John Brandon) wrote in message news:<04030318132800@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>...aN > I was wondering if it is possible to volume shadow (software) a mounted diskE > drive without having to dismount and then mount it as a shadow set.  >  > For example: >  > $ SHOW DEV DGA1000 > R > Device                  Device           Error    Volume         Free  Trans MntR >  Name                   Status           Count     Label        Blocks Count CntQ > $1$DGA1000:   (MYNODE)  Mounted              0  XXX00          8001945     4  2f >  > $ SHOW DEV DGA1001 > R > Device                  Device           Error    Volume         Free  Trans MntR >  Name                   Status           Count     Label        Blocks Count CntQ > $1$DGA1001:   (MYNODE)  Mounted              0  XXX01          8001945     4  2u >  > ? > $ MOUNT DSA1: /SHADOW=($1$DGA1000:,$1$DGA1001:) YYY00 /SYSTEMr >  >  > O > I have not had the oppurtunity to test this yet, however I am assuming that I G > can not do this - that I have to dismount the physical devices first.- > M > I am thinking about doing this because I want to do some snapshot (sort of)0	 > backup.c > TIAr >  >  > J*o*h*n B*r*a*n*d*o*ns > VMS Systems Administrator3, > firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com   ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 3 Mar 2004 23:40:39 +0000 (UTC)6 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER); Subject: Re: Why does smtp mail between local systems fail?t1 Message-ID: <newscache$rlx0uh$6zz1$1@news.sil.at>e  ] In article <4045DA3A.43A98523@sture.homeip.net>, Paul Sture <nospam@sture.homeip.net> writes:e >Lawrence Bleau wrote:( >> RBLs: bl.spamcop.net, dnsbl.sorbs.net >cH >I'm using the following RBLs here (don't ask how I decided on these, it >was a long time ago): >a; >RBLs: rbl.maps.vix.com, dul.maps.vix.com, relays.orbs.org,  >mr-out.imrss.orgu  O MAPS.VIX.COM is dead since years (was MAIL-ABUSE.ORG later, but isn't free now) ! RELAYS.ORBS.ORG is also dead now.y  
 You might trym       CBL.ABUSEAT.ORGs     LIST.DSBL.ORGC     MULTIHOP.DSBL.ORGr     MR-OUT.IMRSS.ORG     COMBINED.NJABL.ORG     DNSBL.NJABL.ORG      DYNABLOCK.NJABL.ORGe     RELAYS.ORDB.ORGp     DIALUP.ORDB.ORGD     BLACKHOLES.ORDB.ORGO     BL.SPAMCOP.NET     SBL.SPAMHAUS.ORG     SBL-XBL.SPAMHAUS.ORG     XBL.SPAMHAUS.ORG     L1.SPEWS.DNSBL.SORBS.NET     L2.SPEWS.DNSBL.SORBS.NET  : See also the other concept of Domain-Based Blacklist-ZonesC (versus IP-Address-Based Blacklist-Zones) like DSN.RFC-IGNORANT.ORG   which is not yet there in TCPIP.   -- G Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialist: E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 03 Mar 2004 23:03:54 GMTo4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>< Subject: Re: [GAME] you've been appointed VMS Mkt Mgr, so...0 Message-ID: <4046635E.7F455069@blueyonder.co.uk>   Didier Morandi wrote:n >  > Thomas Dzubin wrote: > K > > (I originally wrote this response SEVEN YEARS AGO...use www.deja.com toaI > > find my original Usenet response ...please substitute "HP" for "DEC"): > >VL > > Subject:      Re: Why can't Digital market? (Was Re: DEC vs Sun & PPro?)8 > > From:         Thomas Dzubin <no.email.for@me.please> > > Date:         1997/02/044 > > Message-ID:   <5d8589$2vs@fountain.mindlink.net>A > > Newsgroups:   comp.os.vms,alt.folklore.computers,comp.sys.decb > ../..n > * > You're giving me an idea (yes, again...) > R > Maybe we could set up a virtual VMS Marketing Community (isn't it already here?)P > and start "selling" VMS to Customers worldwide. Then, when the PO is ready forQ > signature, we go to HP and ask how much they will pay us for that new Customer.e >  > Waddya think?l  J How do you expect to be taken seriously by the potential customers without positive actions from HP?i  E What response do you expect from potential customers when you turn uppH and start trying to tell them their existing systems are crap and should& be replaced by an OS born in the 80's?  t@ sorry, all the good intentions and superior technology wont helpD unless the business climate changes. Maybe if a few CEOs ae punished? by their shareholders for incompetant IT policies. However, theMC "if it dont work then reboot if it still don't work then reinstall"tE philosophy is deeply ingrained in the industry for over a decade now.t   regards,and hoping I am wrong.   >  > D.   --   tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 17:23:38 -0500' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>i< Subject: RE: [GAME] you've been appointed VMS Mkt Mgr, so...R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB27953B@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----@ > From: Tim Llewellyn [mailto:tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk]=20 > Sent: March 3, 2004 6:04 PMa > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comc> > Subject: Re: [GAME] you've been appointed VMS Mkt Mgr, so... >=20 >=20 >=20	 [snip ..]m >=20B > What response do you expect from potential customers when you=20A > turn up and start trying to tell them their existing systems=20n< > are crap and should be replaced by an OS born in the 80's? > =20-@ > sorry, all the good intentions and superior technology wont=20B > help unless the business climate changes. Maybe if a few CEOs=209 > ae punished by their shareholders for incompetant IT=20'> > policies. However, the "if it dont work then reboot if it=20" > still don't work then reinstall"G > philosophy is deeply ingrained in the industry for over a decade now.I >=20  > regards,and hoping I am wrong. > --  > tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk >=20     Tim,   Re: OS shot from the 80's ..  F Well, I am certainly not saying OpenVMS corp level marketing could notF improve, but since the UNIX OS architecture (which Solaris, AIX, HPUX,H Linux and free whatevers are based on) is older than OpenVMS by at leastE 8 years, that has not stopped these older UNIX's from making headway.n  % [what the hay, it's a slow afternoon]e   :-)f   Regardsp  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultantc HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660s Fax: 613-591-4477o Email: kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcome. (remove the DOT's and AT for email address)=20   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 23:10:09 GMTc4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>< Subject: Re: [GAME] you've been appointed VMS Mkt Mgr, so...0 Message-ID: <4047B486.6A819142@blueyonder.co.uk>   "Main, Kerry" wrote:   > >  >  > Tim, >  > Re: OS shot from the 80's .. > H > Well, I am certainly not saying OpenVMS corp level marketing could notH > improve, but since the UNIX OS architecture (which Solaris, AIX, HPUX,J > Linux and free whatevers are based on) is older than OpenVMS by at leastG > 8 years, that has not stopped these older UNIX's from making headway.o > ' > [what the hay, it's a slow afternoon]p >   C Yeah, that gets my goat also, however the point is VMS is PERCEIVED.B to be old, on the way out if not already dead, and not a "bet your7 career" type option. The reasons why such perception issA not technically accurate have been stated here many times before,?= by yourself as well as others.  However, to stand a chance of-C actually proving this to those with the power to mandate a platformrB change to VMS in organizations that could gain from VMS, one wouldD need access to information about their business and current and past> IT strategies that I doubt it would be easy to get access too.@ The only way I see to change this would be for HP itself to send@ out a very strong and public message to those with the power. ItE would be be very difficult to do this without going head-to-head withS; the alternatives, which are also in some cases HP products.b  > Oh, and that's before we even start talking apps availability.> Get the apps there, up the cluster membership limit so you can; deploy cluster satellites like XP desktops in w2k domains, n: get VMS running on some type of commodity desktop hardware1 with licensing priced as a terminal not a server,o= and the switch to VMS might even be cheaper than the manpowera@ needed to upgrade from NT4 to XP -) (guess what I've been doing 
 recently).    N and OK, I should have said "born in the 70's" or "had its heyday in the 80's".! I hope my point was clear anyway.    regards1 -- 2 tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk   ------------------------------  * Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 10:37:50 +0000 (UTC)6 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)  Subject: [TCPIP V5.4] More rants1 Message-ID: <newscache$y0s1uh$yp32$1@news.sil.at>r  6 I thought I let you know of a few more observations...  D 1) SSH (server) doesn't honor SYS$ANNOUNCE and SYS$WELCOME logicals.; (TCPware does it ;-) Why ? Couldn't be security, could it ?0  D 2) The Scalable Kernel (defining logical TCPIP$STARTUP_CPU_IMAGES asH "PERF=ALL" in startup) rants about 'not being a valid version of TCPIP'.     SDA> TCPIPA   %TCPIP-I-LINKDATE, PWIPDRIVER linked on  9-OCT-2003 18:18:43.66CE   %TCPIP-I-LINKDATE, TCPIP$TNDRIVER linked on 18-SEP-2003 21:59:03.64yE   %TCPIP-I-LINKDATE, TCPIP$BGDRIVER linked on 18-SEP-2003 21:58:54.17tK   %TCPIP-I-LINKDATE, TCPIP$PROXY_SERVICES linked on 18-SEP-2003 22:00:28.991N   %TCPIP-I-LINKDATE, TCPIP$INTERNET_SERVICES linked on 18-SEP-2003 21:58:55.84B   %TCPIP-I-VERSION, TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS Version 50323456.0S   -TCPIP-W-JUSTINCASE, In case you're curious, this is NOT a valid version of TCPIP ;   -TCPIP-W-DISCLAIMER, You are proceeding at your own risk!i>   %TCPIP-W-NOREAD, unable to access location 00000000.22B3B127A   %TCPIP-I-LASTSTART, Driver last started 17-NOV-1858 00:00:00.44s0   -TCPIP-I-STARTCOUNT, Driver was started 1 timeC   -TCPIP-I-PREVSTART, Previously started at 23-FEB-2004 09:11:14.89y>   %TCPIP-W-NOREAD, unable to access location 00000000.22B3B2238   %TCPIP-I-TRACEINFO, Trace information is not available9   %TCPIP-E-NONFSSVCS, NFS Services execlet is not present   6 Is the scalable kernel now official ? I thought it is.   3) TCPIP HELP SYSCONFIG tells B "The subsystem-name argument is required for all flags except -s."O where in fact it doesn't require the subsystem-name argument with "-m" as well.r   4) SDA> READ/EXEC rants about   K   %SDA-I-READSYM, 476 symbols read from SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]PWIPDRIVER.STB;1e   %SDA-W-LINKTIMEMISM, link time of SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]PWIPDRIVER.STB;1 (15-FEB-1996 19:45) does not match link time of image in system ( 9-OCT-2003 18:18).  G It looks like an old file SYS$SHARE:PWIPDRIVER.STB (19-FEB-1996) wasn'tbM deleted (valid/current one is SYS$SYSTEM:TCPIP$PWIDRIVER.STB from 9-OCT-2003)cJ or provided at will. And deleting it gives the old well known error again:  ?   %SDA-W-OPENIN, error opening SDA$READ_DIR:PWIPDRIVER as inputm   -RMS-W-FNF, file not found  G So, TCPIP$PWIPDRIVER.EXE still doesn't find its current symboltablefilehG because it looks for a PWIPDRIVER (instead of a TCPIP$PWIPDRIVER) - andeE doesn't include SYS$SYSTEM as well - like before. Workaround is still-  =   $ COPY SYS$SYSTEM:TCPIP$PWIPDRIVER.STB SYS$COMMON:[SYS$LDR]   I How about including SYS$SYSTEM in SDA$READ_DIR searchlist logical as well I -or- not providing the .STB file in SYS$SYSTEM but in the place where the/4 corresponding .EXE files are (SYS$LOADABLE_IMAGES) ?   So, enough for today ;-) -- Y Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialistC E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  * Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:12:00 +0000 (UTC)6 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)$ Subject: Re: [TCPIP V5.4] More rants0 Message-ID: <newscache$thw2uh$w1k$1@news.sil.at>  p In article <fBP1c.87307$Wa.11589@news-server.bigpond.net.au>, "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com> writes:G >> 1) SSH (server) doesn't honor SYS$ANNOUNCE and SYS$WELCOME logicals.P> >> (TCPware does it ;-) Why ? Couldn't be security, could it ? >>   So, this keeps unanswered.K But maybe the hint did start something in the background for the future ;-)    >>3) TCPIP HELP SYSCONFIG tells D >>"The subsystem-name argument is required for all flags except -s."K >>where in fact it doesn't require the subsystem-name argument with "-m" as_ >well. >h7 >Thanks for the feedback Peter.  I'll pass these along.o >dM >Robert addressed 2) and 4).  I can't add any more than our kernel-master has  >already stated ;)  K As always, many thanks to you (and your team). It is very motivating to get H (very often) more positive feedback here than with paid support calls...   -- a Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialist  E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2004.128 ************************