1 INFO-VAX	Sat, 06 Mar 2004	Volume 2004 : Issue 130       Contents: Re: ADMIN SHOW CONNECTIONS ???( ANN: GETCMD V4.0 (for OpenVMS IA64, too)$ ANN: HGFTP V3.1-2 - Security upgrade# Re: ARG_GTR_32_BITS from sys$getuai # Re: ARG_GTR_32_BITS from sys$getuai + Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape? + Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape?  Re: Charon Vax VUPs  Re: Charon Vax VUPs ; Re: Destroying CDR media (Was: Support of USB Memory stick)  Re: EVA disk storage  Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS  Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS/ Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS and Peoplesoft ( Re: How to Ping Between OpenVMS and Unix( Re: How to Ping Between OpenVMS and Unix+ Re: Intel Article in Business Week Magazine  IPC$ and Advanced Server, ????: Re: It is almost certain now, INTEL will have 64bit x86 !!% Re: Libary/CDD Question for Vax-Basic # Re: Not meaning to feed Andrew..... # Re: Not meaning to feed Andrew..... G Re: OpenVMS virus proof while other disks get zapped by latest viruses! G Re: OpenVMS virus proof while other disks get zapped by latest viruses! G Re: OpenVMS virus proof while other disks get zapped by latest viruses! 9 Re: Question on VMS 7.3-2 Sysgen parameter SHADOW_SITE_ID 9 Re: Question on VMS 7.3-2 Sysgen parameter SHADOW_SITE_ID  Re: Recursive COPY SIMH and TK50/TK70 tapes?  SSH login problem -- Bug?  Re: SSH login problem -- Bug?  Re: SSH login problem -- Bug?  Re: SSH login problem -- Bug?  Re: Sun On The Run?  Re: Sun On The Run?  Re: Sun On The Run?  Re: Sun On The Run?  Re: Sun On The Run?  Re: Sun On The Run? 6 Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy?6 Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy?6 Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy?6 Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy?6 Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy?6 Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy?6 Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy? TK50 expansion cabinet Two Node Cluster Config  Re: Two Node Cluster Config  Re: What is ZIC ?? Re: What is ZIC ?? Re: What is ZIC ??2 Re: Why does smtp mail between local systems fail? Re: XP1000 technical manual? Re: Zip/update Issue3 Re: [GAME] you've been appointed VMS Mkt Mgr, so... 3 Re: [GAME] you've been appointed VMS Mkt Mgr, so... . Re: [OT] Recycling (Was: Destroying CDR media) Re: [TCPIP V5.4] More rants  Re: [TCPIP V5.4] More rants  Re: [TCPIP V5.4] More rants   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 16:30:39 -0800 . From: alexdaniels@themail.co.uk (Alex Daniels)' Subject: Re: ADMIN SHOW CONNECTIONS ??? = Message-ID: <9f7f13a8.0403051630.1adbfd42@posting.google.com>   a brandon@dalsemi.com (John Brandon) wrote in message news:<04030512240131@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>... 0 > I am running Advanced Server V7.2A for OpenVMS >  > $ ADMIN SHOW CONNECTIONS > .. >   Total of 54 connections  > 4 > Q#1) Is this reflective of the number of licenses? > @ > Q#2) If not, how do I determine the number of licenses in use? >   6 1. Number of connections != number of licences in use.   2.   IIRC...   # $ @sys$startup:pwrk$define_commands  $ pwlic   B This will show you the number of licenses across the cluster. I am; taking it from this you are running server based licencing.    Alex   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 19:08:58 -0600 - From: Hunter Goatley <goathunter@goatley.com> 1 Subject: ANN: GETCMD V4.0 (for OpenVMS IA64, too) * Message-ID: <404924AA.8030808@goatley.com>  9 GETCMD V4.0 is now available for download.  GETCMD allows 9 a suitably-privileged user display the DCL command recall 7 buffer for any interactive process.  Changes to the DCL > command recall buffer in OpenVMS Alpha V7.3-2 and OpenVMS IA646 necessitated changes to GETCMD.  This version now runs: correctly on OpenVMS VAX V5.0 or later, OpenVMS Alpha V1.5) or later, and OpenVMS IA64 V8.1 or later.   9 GETCMD can be downloaded using any of the following URLs:    http://www.process.com/openvms/   6 ftp://ftp.process.com/vms-freeware/fileserv/getcmd.zip; http://vms.process.com/ftp/vms-freeware/fileserv/getcmd.zip   2 ftp://ftp.tmk.com/vms-freeware/fileserv/getcmd.zip7 http://www.tmk.com/ftp/vms-freeware/fileserv/getcmd.zip    and the usual mirrors.   Hunter ------9 Hunter Goatley, Process Software, http://www.process.com/ ; <goathunter@GOATLEY.COM>     http://www.goatley.com/hunter/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 19:04:27 -0600 - From: Hunter Goatley <goathunter@goatley.com> - Subject: ANN: HGFTP V3.1-2 - Security upgrade ( Message-ID: <4049239B.80906@goatley.com>  : A security problem was found with HGFTP running on OpenVMS: Alpha V7.3-2.  The problem has been found and corrected in7 HGFTP V3.1-2, which is now available for download.  All * HGFTP sites running V7.3-2 should upgrade.  : HGFTP is an FTP client and server for OpenVMS VAX, OpenVMS: Alpha, and OpenVMS IA64.  It works with MultiNet, TCPware, and TCP/IP Services.   http://www.process.com/openvms/   5 ftp://ftp.process.com/vms-freeware/fileserv/hgftp.zip : http://vms.process.com/ftp/vms-freeware/fileserv/hgftp.zip  1 ftp://ftp.tmk.com/vms-freeware/fileserv/hgftp.zip 6 http://www.tmk.com/ftp/vms-freeware/fileserv/hgftp.zip   and the usual mirrors.   Hunter ------9 Hunter Goatley, Process Software, http://www.process.com/ ; <goathunter@GOATLEY.COM>     http://www.goatley.com/hunter/    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 00:06:00 GMT 6 From: "Ed Havelaar" <e.havelaar@regy.canterbury.ac.nz>, Subject: Re: ARG_GTR_32_BITS from sys$getuai@ Message-ID: <938e1d7e8cf3604b9ab0aadd9dc73572@news.teranews.com>  B Oops, I should have seen that!  Thank you that worked much better.  J I note in passing that using the UAI$_OWNER item of sys$getuai() returns aL string with a one-byte prefix supposedly telling you how long the string is;F it doesn't seem to take extra space characters on the end into account! though... at least... not always.    - Ed.   B "Hein van den Heuvel" <hein_news@eps.zko.dec.com> wrote in message& news:40457036$1@usenet01.boi.hp.com... > C > "Ed Havelaar" <e.havelaar@regy.canterbury.ac.nz> wrote in message < > news:43f0377d4225785035d1820ce07e109b@news.teranews.com... > > Hi,  > > I > > My function below returns "SYSTEM-F-ARG_GTR_32_BITS , argument is not  > 32-bit, > > sign-extended value", which is annoying.+ > > Which argument is it complaining about?  > F > It complains about the descriptor userdesc which you passed by value instead # > of by reference. Classic C error.  > ; > Try: int ret_code = sys$getuai (0, 0, &userdesc, itmlst);  > H > As userdesc has bits set in the address long, it looked like an 64 bitH > address. There is no prolem with itmlst because it is an array and 'c' will
 > 'helps'. >  > Hein.  > ( > >    $DESCRIPTOR (userdesc, userCode);0 > >    userdesc.dsc$w_length = strlen(userCode); > :  > >     item_node itmlst[2]= {6 > >         {maxOwnerLen, UAI$_OWNER, owner, &retlen}, > >         {0, 0, 0, 0}
 > >     };; > >     int ret_code = sys$getuai (0, 0, userdesc, itmlst);  >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 03:11:31 +0100 2 From: martin@radiogaga.harz.de (Martin Vorlaender), Subject: Re: ARG_GTR_32_BITS from sys$getuai; Message-ID: <4047e1d3.524144494f47414741@radiogaga.harz.de>   5 Ed Havelaar (e.havelaar@regy.canterbury.ac.nz) wrote: L > I note in passing that using the UAI$_OWNER item of sys$getuai() returns aN > string with a one-byte prefix supposedly telling you how long the string is;  A That's what the System Services Reference Manual's description of  UAI$_OWNER says.  H > it doesn't seem to take extra space characters on the end into account# > though... at least... not always.   H It definitely shouldn't. Did you pass at least 32 for the buffer length?   cu,    Martin --  <                         | Martin Vorlaender | OpenVMS rules!1  OpenVMS: Where do you  | work: mv@pdv-systeme.de D  want to BE today?      |   http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/8                         | home: martin@radiogaga.harz.de   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 20:17:18 -0600 @ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>4 Subject: Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape?6 Message-ID: <4047E32E.9BFEABAF@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>   Daryl Jones wrote: >  > Dear John Santos:  > G > The issue is not that it may pertain to 9 track tapes only. The issue C > raised was that is or was a problem with tape backup and restores B > using block size greater than 32256 and nobody had a solution or= > understanding of the problem. That by itself is worry some.   F It's probably safe to say that there is enough experience collectively? across the VMS user base that such worries are today unfounded.   H From my own experience, I've done multi-volume restores successfully for; many years, and I have long been using the 65024 blocksize.   H So, while that may have been an issue in the past, I believe it has beenH cleared up since VMS V7.1 and later (including mandatory BACKUP patches)% when BACKUP got some major revisions.   F > What you are sugggesting is the problem doesn't exist because of theD > hardware performance is much better. On small sites where multipleF > savesets can be stored on one tape. I'll buy in to it. However, whatH > about multi-volume savesets with a large block size? I don't know manyH > System Managers or DBAs using VMS and Backup that had to rebuild their+ > site from tape except for maybe the WTC?    H I've done it many times on DR tests since 1997, V6.2 (VAX and Alpha) andH later. Works just fine, with volume cross-overs being handled quite well in mid-saveset.    > Maybe the problem isn't or' > wasn't cause by Multi-volume saveset?   D It may very well have been. However, this has likely long since been fixed.  H If you are currently experiencing a problem, the support channels should( be very useful in reaching a resolution.   --   David J. Dachtera  dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 4 Mar 2004 21:37:11 -0500  From: John Santos <JOHN@egh.com>4 Subject: Re: Best Backup Blocksize for 110SDLT Tape?6 Message-ID: <1040304211742.15727B-100000@Ives.egh.com>  ! On 4 Mar 2004, Daryl Jones wrote:    > Dear John Santos:  > G > The issue is not that it may pertain to 9 track tapes only. The issue C > raised was that is or was a problem with tape backup and restores B > using block size greater than 32256 and nobody had a solution or= > understanding of the problem. That by itself is worry some.   E No one else has ever experienced or heard of any such problem, AFAIK.   C I certainly haven't, and I've been doing VMS backups (and restores) % since VMS backup was released (V3.0?)   G The *only* problem with blocksize > 32256 is the documented restriction D that the resulting ANSI tape files can't be copied to disk.  Restore, from tape has *always* (AFAICR) worked fine.   > F > What you are sugggesting is the problem doesn't exist because of theD > hardware performance is much better. On small sites where multipleF > savesets can be stored on one tape. I'll buy in to it. However, whatH > about multi-volume savesets with a large block size? I don't know manyH > System Managers or DBAs using VMS and Backup that had to rebuild theirF > site from tape except for maybe the WTC?  Maybe the problem isn't or' > wasn't cause by Multi-volume saveset?   @ Are you claiming that multi-volume tape savesets with blocksizes> larger than 32256 won't restore?  I've never had any problems.   > 
 > Regards,
 > Daryl Jones  >  >  > ` > John Santos <JOHN@egh.com> wrote in message news:<1040303234647.15727A-100000@Ives.egh.com>...* > > On Thu, 4 Mar 2004, Tom Simpson wrote: > > Q > > > One factor (especially with older tape drives and lower bit densities) that Q > > > could be a problem is the physical length of tape it takes to write a large M > > > block of data.  Last time I checked, the standard distance from the EOT R > > > marker to the physical end-of-tape is roughly 15-20 feet.  If 20 feet is notP > > > enough space to fit a data block, then the backup could fail.  The typicalR > > > symptom would be the tape runs off the end of the reel (on 9 track tapes for > > > example).  > > > P > > > The way a tape drive works (at least the way they used to work...I'm goingQ > > > way back here...) is that they attempt to finish writing the block they are N > > > currently on, even if it is past the EOT marker.  If there is not enoughA > > > physical tape left to complete the block, the party's over.  > > > L > > > With the MUCH higher bit densities of today's tape drives, I think theN > > > likelihood of that happening is very small, if it could happen at all...M > > > This is, of course, speculation on my part triggered by first-hand (and M > > > out-of-date) tape drive technology knowledge...  Even at 6250BPI, a 64K 6 > > > block of data would take a lot of tape to write.Q > > > That would be roughly ((64000blocks * 512 bytes per block) / 6250 bpi) / 12  > > > = 436 ft. ?? > > H > > A 64K block contains 64000 (or 65536 bytes, if "K" means 1024).  YouH > > are multiplying by 512 unnecessarily.  So on a 6250bpi tape, this isE > > 10.24 inches.  Should easily fit before the physical end-of-tape. E > > (It also requires a tape mark, some EOV labels, and a couple more G > > tape marks.  IIRC, 9-track tape marks are 1/2 inch, irrespective of 
 > > density.)  > > I > > At 800bpi, the record is 80 inches, (6'8"), so this is getting really 	 > > iffy.  > > F > > In either case, if there is a bad spot on the tape, the drive willG > > space forward looking for good tape and with records this long, you C > > could be in "reel" trouble :-)  Everyone should have the fun of H > > reloading a 9-track tape from the end by hand, at some time in their	 > > life!  > > B > > But this thread was about SDLT, not 9-track, and 32256 is onlyC > > relevent to disk save-sets, not tape save-sets, so we're really  > > getting off-track here.  > >  > >  > > >  > > > Regards,	 > > > Tom  > > > J > > > "Daryl Jones" <jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net> wrote in message< > > > news:8a646952.0403022253.69a3161@posting.google.com... > > > > Dear David J. Dachtera:  > > > > N > > > > I have been told by more than a couple System Manager that the maximumL > > > > backup block size should be the same as the default backup blocksizeK > > > > when you are backing up from disk to disk which is 32256. Any block L > > > > size other greater than 32256 will cause the backup restore to fail.H > > > > Thus makeing the backup useless. This isn't theory because thoseN > > > > System Managers actually tested the backup and restores with different > > > > blocksize for proof. > > > > F > > > > Could you further explain to me or provide a reference on your. > > > > recommendation that you have provided. > > > >  > > > > Thanks,  > > > > Daryl Jones  > > > >  > > > > K > > > > "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net> wrote in ? > >  message news:<40453492.27B758CE@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>...  > > > > > Hal Kuff wrote:  > > > > > > L > > > > > >     In search of best blocksize for SDLT tape at 110GB.... using > >  MSL5026O > > > > > > tape library over 1gb Fibre Channel to OpenVMS ES40 type systems on  > >  1gbG > > > > > > Fibre Channel...... Have not seen the 50-60% improvement in  > >  performance we 0 > > > > > > expected over DLT8000/DLTIV Tape.... > > > > > > Q > > > > > >    Can anyone reccomend an init, mount, and backup command that works  > >  for > > > > > > your site...	 > > > > > N > > > > > Before you go digging that deep, check that your NSRs are configuredR > > > > > correctly. Make sure that the SCSI cards are in the high-numbered slots,R > > > > > not the low. That will approximately double your throughput if they were > > > > > wrong before. 	 > > > > > O > > > > > Otherwise, the usual rules still apply: us ethe largest blocksize you O > > > > > can live with: 65024 if you don't need to read the savesets with RMS, $ > > > > > less than 32767 if you do. > > >  > > >  > > >  > > >  >  >    --   John Santos  Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 21:06:41 +0100 " From: Didier Morandi <no@spam.com> Subject: Re: Charon Vax VUPs2 Message-ID: <4048de03$0$284$626a14ce@news.free.fr>   Tim ffrench-Lynch wrote:@ > Realistically how fast is Charon-VAX running on a high end PC?  
 17 to 38 VUPS    http://www.futurevax.com/    D.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 14:02:09 -0700 + From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com>  Subject: Re: Charon Vax VUPs' Message-ID: <4048EAD1.4010204@MMaz.com>    Didier Morandi wrote:    > Tim ffrench-Lynch wrote: > A >> Realistically how fast is Charon-VAX running on a high end PC?  >  >  > 17 to 38 VUPS  > D I would not consider that good specs for a high-end system when I'm E seeing 53 VUP's on my prior mentioned AMD based system along with an  D incredible jump in I/O throughput and bandwidth...  If you want the ) specs of what I'm running, let me know...    Barry    --    > Barry Treahy, Jr                       E-mail: Treahy@MMaz.com> Midwest Microwave                          Phone: 480/314-1320> Vice President & CIO                         FAX: 480/661-7028                            ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 15:14:54 -0800 . From: alexdaniels@themail.co.uk (Alex Daniels)D Subject: Re: Destroying CDR media (Was: Support of USB Memory stick)= Message-ID: <9f7f13a8.0403051514.32b039b9@posting.google.com>   q "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message news:<Am02c.89159$sl.2266@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>...  > Paul Sture wrote:  > > William Webb wrote:  > >>? > >> Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com> wrote in message 4 > >> news:<4047A988.9D7B5D43@applied-synergy.com>... > >>> Alex Daniels wrote:  > >>>>A > >>>> Chris Scheers <chris@applied-synergy.com> wrote in message 6 > >>>> news:<40464CF9.66638A33@applied-synergy.com>... > >>>>> Nic Clews wrote: > >>>>> I > >>>>>> Yes. [In a certain case] the current proposal is a tape solution E > >>>>>> to move relatively (less than 100 meg) small amounts of data I > >>>>>> from one system to another. CDR was investigated, but due to the D > >>>>>> nature of the data add complications to destroying the used > >>>>>> media.  > >>>>> 9 > >>>>> I thought that was what microwave ovens were for.  > >>>>> G > >>>>> And the associated light show is an entertaining bonus.  <grin>  > >>>>J > >>>> The light show is most entertaining, although one ex-girlfriend didB > >>>> seem to have her objections me using her microwave for this > >>>> purpose.  > >>>>I > >>>> As for it being an effective means of erasing the data, I'm not so J > >>>> sure.. the CD is thin bit of metal foil attached to a polycarbonateH > >>>> disc. The microwave munches up the foil into lots of tiny pieces. > >>>>H > >>>> I would imagine one could with enough time and effort, take these > >>>> tiny H > >>>> bits and with the right equipment read a small amount of data off > >>>> each D > >>>> one. Depends how important truly erasing the data is I guess. > >>>  > >>> G > >>> Well, that's true of any destruction method.  Some people put CDs J > >>> through shredders.  You could still put the pieces back together and > >>> read some data.  > >>> D > >>> I suspect that if you converted the CD to plasma someone wouldG > >>> point out that you could always reassemble the original molecules   > >>> and read the data.  <grin> > >>> F > >>> You need to balance the time and cost of reconstructing the dataH > >>> against the value of the data.  All the various methods have their
 > >>> places.   D I guess my point is with CDR's you cant do a delete/erase init/eraseB first, before you deguass and distroy the media. A number of eraseB cycles are usually accepted as being good enough to wipe the data, before you wack the media.  C I havnt done it in some time, but IIRC, you can even write your own   pattern for delete/erase to use.  D At most of the sites I have worked at, microwaving a CD would not beF considered secure enough. however a few erases on a USB stick probably	 would be.    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Mar 2004 20:43:10 -0600 + From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)  Subject: Re: EVA disk storage 3 Message-ID: <NhSle85yJTZg@eisner.encompasserve.org>    In article <23Q1c.3569$lP1.1220868226@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com>, Michael Austin <maustin@no-more-spam.firstdbasource.com> writes:  > Rob Young wrote:  9 > I don't know where you are getting the 18TB number from   D 	Go back and look at what Andrew is quoting.  Andrew is seldom wrong? 	on numbers.  To keep him honest, I went and double-checked the B 	model he was referring to and it indeed has an 18 TByte capacity.   > but since the J > XP1024 is essentially the "big" Lighting, it has a cacity of 1024x146GB F > is more like 150TB -- and looking to add the 309GB drive capability.  D 	Right.  But that isn't what Andrew was quoting.  You could probably? 	do 6 EVA 5000s with expansion and have higher capacity and pay A 	a whole lot less than a fully loaded Hitachi box if capacity and B 	availability was/is your goal.  I would guess the amount of cache4 	(cash $$$) to support 1024 XP drives is intriguing.   	The box is a pricey one:   2 http://www.nwfusion.com/news/2003/1013hitachi.html  H "The price of the 9900V ranges from $200,000 to $8 million, depending on configuration."   K > So, back to my original question.  Does the Lightning truely work -- and  $ > perform well in the OpenVMS space.  ? 	I'm sure it does.  I know of one customer but am certainly not = 	going to name drop here.  Contact me at the email address if A 	interested, I'll mention the customer name, you can contact them G 	directly.  Or go the more formal route - ask Hitachi or a Hitachi rep   	for the reference site.  K > Quite frankly, I tend to take Gartner with a a grain of salt - more like   > a salt block...   A 	But the report is based on real data - not opinion.  Now you may B 	have a problem with their data and methods, but like anything useB 	it as a guide or starting place.  But as far as I can tell, doing? 	even a modest amount of digging - the numbers seem reasonable.   G 	Ever wonder why you can't find list prices on most monolithic boxes?   H 	If you have to ask price, you can't afford it.  "But if you buy today, E 	you'll receive the deepest discounts given out in the past 2 years,   	blah, blah, blah."    				Rob    ------------------------------  * Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:19:51 +0000 (UTC)6 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)) Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS 0 Message-ID: <newscache$vuw2uh$ohk$1@news.sil.at>  w In article <8a646952.0403041624.67271536@posting.google.com>, jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net (Daryl Jones) writes: G >When Sybase made the decision to go to fewer platforms to support, VMS B >was going to be one of them. However, Sybase was in such terribleG >financial problems with red ink. They had to go for the platforms that C >had growth potential to dig their way out of red ink to black. The " >problem wasn't VMS but Sybase!!!!  = But VMS now has the (one more big) problem because of this...    --   Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialist  E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 13:58:14 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> ) Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS G Message-ID: <WH%1c.87329$sl.43631@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>    Daryl Jones wrote: > Dear John Smith: > H > When Sybase made the decision to go to fewer platforms to support, VMSC > was going to be one of them. However, Sybase was in such terrible H > financial problems with red ink. They had to go for the platforms thatD > had growth potential to dig their way out of red ink to black. The# > problem wasn't VMS but Sybase!!!!     L No. The reason Sybase dropped VMS was that Digtial/Compaq were doing nothing* to ensure that the VMS market was growing.  H With Digital/Compaq doing ZERO advertising and marketing for VMS, SybaseK rightly concluded that for them to continue banging their heads against the J wall in the VMS space made no financial sense as they'd never recoup theirE investment in develpong and supporting new versions of Sybase ASE (or  whatever) on VMS.   I Customers are generally more loath to switch db vendors than they are o/s J vendors, so when Sybase said to its VMS customers that it was time to moveG to unix just how many of Sybase's customers decided to switch to Rdb or G Oracle just so they could stay with VMS long term? The majority of them I decided to slowly migrate from VMS/Sybase to Unix/Sybase. Sybase kept the  customer, not VMS.  H Time has proven that Sybase's decision was correct as the VMS market hasK shrunk considerably since their decision, as it has also proven correct for " may other former VMS ISV partners.  > THe blame falls squarely on the shoulders of the executives at Digital/Compaq, and now HP.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:57:51 +0100  From: "Dr. Dweeb" <dr@dweeb.com>8 Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS and Peoplesoft- Message-ID: <c29q00$1omv$1@news.cybercity.dk>    Main, Kerry wrote: >> -----Original Message----- + >> From: John Smith [mailto:a@nonymous.com]  >> Sent: March 4, 2004 5:49 PM >> To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com, >> Subject: Re: GTECH, Lotteries and OpenVMS >> >> Rob Young wrote:  >>> In articleE >>> <UIH1c.76728$sl.7900@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>, "John # >>> Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes:  >>>> Rob Young wrote:  >>> D >>>> If Ellison thought for a moment that it would be better for hisG >>>> shareholders (he being one of the larger ones) that Rdb disappear, ; >>>> then that's what will happen - customer migrations and  >> costs to the  >>>> customer be damned. >>> F >>> Nice try.  I'd like to see him discontinue RDB.  A number of those= >>> customers would migrate to a product *other* than Oracle. 
 >> That isn't 0 >>> smart business.  Larry is smarter than that. >>>  >> >>; >> Remind me again how many Peoplesoft customers don't want < >> Orcale to buy that company. How many of them will look to; >> other vendors? Don't forget that Oracle's plan of record = >> there is to kill the Peoplesoft product lineup and migrate + >> all those customers to the Oracle suite.  >>= >> Once Larry gets something into his bonnet he is not easily < >> dissuaded. God help VMS if he decides Rdb's number is up. >> >  > John,  > H > As mentioned previously, Oracle's public statement is to *not* to kill@ > the PeopleSoft products, but rather integrate them into OracleC > offerings - and they use Oracle Rdb as an example where they have F > acquired technology and continued to enhance them - NOT kill them asG > you imply with your "Oracles plan of record is to migrate them to the  > Oracle suite" statement. >  > Reference:< > http://www.oracle.com/peoplesoft/index.html?customers.html@ > "We know how to do this. When Oracle acquired Rdb from DigitalD > Equipment Corporation in 1994, we promised to focus on quality andC > stability while enhancing features based on customer demand. Nine G > years and thousands of satisfied customers later, we're doing exactly F > that. In fact, we've developed more than 50 percent of the code base0 > and sponsor annual customer forums worldwide." >   K Sadly, this may have been the random factor that saved Rdb from Larrys axe.    Was this how it went ???  C Someone astute in an Oracle suit remembers that pesky Rdb division.   K Suit: "Hey, Larry, remember that other database Rdb we picked up for a song ! from Digital about 10 years ago?"   L Larry: "Shit, are those guys still around - I though we canned that division# years ago !  They are still here? "   
 Suit "Yep"  L Larry: "Well deep six em, we do not need this sort of baggage in the new net centric Oracle ... blah...blah"   K Suit: "Well Larry, they actually are still here, and doing what they always I did.  We have moved a lot of their engineers over to important stuff now, J but we still support and enhance the product.  And Larry, here is the goodG news.  The fact that they stayed under your radar and kept alive inside , Oracle can now be used to our advantage ..."  G And thus came the statement Kerry posted, and thus Rdb survived to live  another day.    H By the way, anyone who has worked with monolithic software packages likeE Peoplesoft, OracleFinancials, SAP etc knows full well that you cannot I "integrate them into" another product.  This is bullshit and everyone who   understands the issues knows it.  L Shit, SAP is said to have well over a billion lines of code, and I have seenH how bad the code is.  Oracle Financials is nothing to shout hooray aboutL either when it comes to technical quality.  I have no reason to believe thatI PeopleSoft does not also carry around the baggage of past sins in copious   quantities like the competitors.  J This is about buying market share and eliminating a competitor.  If OracleJ gets PeopleSoft (is the jury in yet? I have not been following) then it isL goodbye PeopleSoft and hello a lot of very pissed customers who might chooseJ "anything but Oracle" as the escape strategy.  Rather like people were/are8 choosing "anything but CompaQ/HP" as an escape strategy.  < There will be no "integration" because it is technically notI feasible/impossible.  Functionality from PeopleSoft that OracleFinancials K does not contain, might be retro-fitted to OracleFinancials, but it will be K new code.  Oracle could do this by buying a copy of the software to see how H it works rather than buying PeopleSoft the company- so why bother?  (see paragraph above)  
 Dr. Dweeb.  
 > Regards, >  > Kerry Main > Senior Consultant  > HP Services Canada > Voice: 613-592-4660  > Fax: 613-591-4477  > Email: kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom - > (remove the DOT's and AT for email address)    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 21:09:48 GMT 0 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com>1 Subject: Re: How to Ping Between OpenVMS and Unix = Message-ID: <w062c.88733$Wa.36907@news-server.bigpond.net.au>   J You don't mention what version of TCP/IP.  This should work on V5.* on the	 VMS side:   (     $ @sys$manager:tcpip$define_commands+     $ route add -net 191.1.2/24 192.168.3.2   B On UNIX side (you don't mention which UNIX), something similar to:  +     $ route add -net 192.168.3/24 191.1.2.2    Matt.      --  = -------------------------------------------------------------  OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering Enterprise Computing Group Hewlett-Packard Company  Gold Coast, AUSTRALIA = -------------------------------------------------------------     : "Yong Boon, Lim" <limyb@megasteel.com.my> wrote in message$ news:c29kte$5bm$1@news4.jaring.my...	 > Friend,  > L >     l've one OpenVMS server and one Unix server on SINGLE physical network > WITHOUT gateway in between. / >     These systems have different subnet, i.e.  > 
 >     OpenVMS  >         IP : 192.168.3.2  >         Subnet : 255.255.255.0 > 
 >     Unix >        IP : 191.1.2.2  >        Subnet : 255.255.255.0  > J >    In order for both system to be able to "PING" each others, what exact' > configuration (and command like Route 5 >    or UCX Add Route?) should l add to both systems?  >  >     Thank in advance!  > 
 > Regards, > Lim  >  >    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 07:55:59 -0600 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) 1 Subject: Re: How to Ping Between OpenVMS and Unix 3 Message-ID: <dgPFK2y3P48v@eisner.encompasserve.org>   b In article <404864BE.5C05615@aaa.com>, Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com> writes:0 > Don't you ned at least one "router" on the net > "between" the two ?  >  > Jan-Erik.   C    Not if each knows the route to the other's subnet is via itself. 3    All he needs are the commands to add the routes.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 13:11:25 +0100  From: "Dr. Dweeb" <dr@dweeb.com>4 Subject: Re: Intel Article in Business Week Magazine- Message-ID: <c29qpd$1pl6$1@news.cybercity.dk>    Fred Kleinsorge wrote:8 > "Bill Johnson" <res0xcil@verizon.net> wrote in message4 > news:w2d1c.32998$C65.28358@nwrddc01.gnilink.net...C >> So the question is - with alpha now dead and at end of life, andyD >> Intel scrapping the Itanium in favor of it 32 bit chip with 64bit> >> extensions, where does VMS run and have real longevity on a- >> processor platform customers can count on?  >> >VA > Intel isn't scrapping Itanium.  Alpha isn't yet at EOL either -o( > plenty being built and sold every day.  K Yeah, and those big Marvels really hummmmm.  Especially with the latest VMSTJ version which has really improved things massively.  The figures Ive seenH for a large european bank for throughput improvement (same machine, sameJ load) suggest that VMS engineering has definitely not been sleeping at theG wheel !  IIRC the improvement was considerably larger than a normal CPUa( speed-bump improvement might have given.  K Ooops - chop ... chop ... chop ... chop ... (black helicopters approaching)k  D Could the VMS engineering achievements in improving large SMP systemJ throughput for GS320 customers by 20-30% have been known some time ago and@ been part of the jsutification for ditching the EV79x plans ????  @ pohc ...pohc ...pohc ...pohc ...pohc (black helicoptors leaving)    K Q: Has there ever in the history of Microsoft been a performance release ofb one of their operating systems?e  J In the old days, there was a regular pattern for VMS performance releases.I I do not think MS even know what the concept is - they belong squarely inT> the "build bigger hardware" camp when it comes to performance.  
 Dr. Dweeb.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 15:05:05 -06004( From: brandon@dalsemi.com (John Brandon)' Subject: IPC$ and Advanced Server, ????r1 Message-ID: <04030515050535@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>u  8 I posted an earlier SOS about ADMIN SHOW CONNECTIONS ???  H So I thought I would be more specific about my IPC$ problem in this one.  . I am running Advanced Server V7.2A for OpenVMS     I do the following:w   $ ADMIN SHOW CONNECTIONS   Connections on server "MYNODE":   @ User name             Computer name    Share name    Opens  TimeD --------------------  ---------------  ------------  -----  --------D A_USER                A_USER           IPC$              0  16 04:18 ..D A_USER                A_USER           SHARE             0  31 16:59D A_USER                A_USER           MYSHARE           0  31 16:59     Total of XXX connections  / The IPC$ goes on for 110 different connections.-   The Window client is W/XP.     How do I resolve this?           J*o*h*n B*r*a*n*d*o*n) VMS Systems AdministratorO* firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 12:07:45 +0000oO From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com>nC Subject: Re: It is almost certain now, INTEL will have 64bit x86 !! 0 Message-ID: <c29qii$588$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   Dirk Munk wrote:* > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy wrote: >  >> Rick Jones wrote: >>& >>> Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy 2 >>> <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> wrote: >>>s >>>> Rick Jones wrote: >>>>( >>>>> Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy 4 >>>>> <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> wrote: >>>i >>>  >>>u >>> E >>>> What exactly don't you understand ? the MAXCPU configs on F15K'saE >>>> or the differences between this and the configuration of a 8400.g >>>y >>>  >>>j >>>AG >>>> Discussions about trading the 17 I/O slots (you need 1) for MAXCPUoK >>>> cards in F15K's are irrelevent in a discussion about the configurationu) >>>> restrictions of an AlphaServer 8400.a >>>c >>>  >>>r >>>aI >>> Tell you what - you can pick first - which would you like to be?  TheV- >>> pot? Or the Kettle?  I'll take the other.c >>>sB >>> I didn't say the tradeoffs were identical, I said they soundedH >>> similar.  They are similar in that if you want the maximum CPU countH >>> on the 15K, you have to have the minimum I/O count.  If you want theG >>> maximum I/O, you could not have the maximum CPUs on the 15K.  I seed( >>> that as similar, perhaps you do not. >>>i >>G >> However since this discussion was about a 64bit OS to support a DBMSp@ >> being able to open very large amounts of memory the fact thatC >> you can do this on a F15K with a very large number of CPU's (72)pG >> a very large amount of memory (576 GB) and a very high I/O bandwidth/6 >> tends to rather destroy the point of your argument. >  > H > Was there a F15K when the 8400 was on the market? By the way the 8400 I > max. I/O configuration was 12 hoses with 12 PCI slots each, or 144 PCI t > slots in total.i >   ; No but the E10000K was, do you need to know anything else ?T  G > What is the purpose of writing about the ancient 8400? Most of those l= > will have been scrapped by now. We did over the past years.r >   B And that from someone who introduced the PDP11 into the discussion0 do I really need to respond ????????????????????    K > The point was that a 64 bit *architecture* was developed on which 64 bit .F > operating systems could run that were capable of addressing lots of J > memory. It was all about *vision*, about future directions, and setting G > up a path to that future. At the time the Alpha appeared, memory was aK > still very expensive, about a 100 times more expensive then now. I doubt oH > if anyone could have build a working computer with let's say 128GB at  > the time.- >   A You cannot compute anything on Vision or Roadmap and the sad facte? is that at the time of the Digital 64bit marketing BS fest they_? hadn't managed to design a system that allowed you to make much73 practical use of the 64bit features being marketed.!  < That only arrived sort of with higher density memory and the GS140.    ? >> A fully configured F25K has 54 x 66Mhz 64 bit PCI busses ande! >> 18 x 33 Mhz 64 bit PCI busses.  >  > H > Busses or slots? How many slots in a bus ? A standard PC for instance H > has 1 PCI bus, with 5 slots. All slots have to share the bandwidth of 
 > the bus. >   * Busses thats what the post said wasn't it.  G > By the way, you accused me of having the facts wrong on the E4900. I cK > showed you where the information came from (the SUN web site), and since .< > then it was very quiet, I haven't seen any reply from you. > I http://www.sun.com/products-n-solutions/hardware/docs/pdf/805-7362-12.pdf    regards. Andrew Harrisone   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 01:56:32 GMTrL From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU ("Alan Winston - SSRL Admin Cmptg Mgr"). Subject: Re: Libary/CDD Question for Vax-Basic6 Message-ID: <00A2E59A.7DFEB9A8@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  r In article <d7d0c297.0403041521.38ad17f5@posting.google.com>, vibroplex@mindspring.com (Derek Cohn/WB0TUA) writes: >Dear Friends, > A >You guys have been very helpful in the past and I'd like to posedB >another question.  Currently, I have a data file with a structureG >defined in a CDD.  I have a text library entry that points to the data F >in the CDD.  In my VAX Basic code, I use a %include statement for theC >text library and the structure in the CDD is brought in at compiler >time just fine. >3F >My question is about using a parallel data structure identical to theD >entry in the CDD.  I need to create another file that must have theE >identical structure to the first file.  I thought the best way to docG >this was to try to use the same CDD entry for both (so I wouldn't haveeD >to maintain two entries to keep them synchronized).  My bright idea >didn't work (compile errors). >s >Here's the record in the CDD: >  >DMU> lis edidb_record         N >   EDIDB_RECORD;1 <CDD$RECORD>t >DMU>                            > A >Here are the two library objects pointing to the same CDD entry:  >u2 > %INCLUDE %FROM %CDD "FILES.EDIDB_RECORD"        2 > MAP ( EDIDB.MAP ) EDIDB_RECORD    EDIDB         2 > MAP ( EDIDB.MAP ) STRING EDIDB_T_RECORD =  512  2 >                                                 2 > %INCLUDE %FROM %CDD "FILES.EDIDB_RECORD"        2 > MAP ( AEDIDB.MAP ) AEDIDB_RECORD          AEDIDB2 > MAP ( AEDIDB.MAP ) STRING AEDIDB_T_RECORD =  512 >,) >Here are examples of the compile errors:J >aD >%BASIC-E-CDDDUPREC, (1) record EDIDB_RECORD from CDD/Repository has >duplicate name1 >DG >%BASIC-E-CDDAMBFLD, (1) ambiguous field name EDIDB_RECORD::T_PONO from  >CDD/Repository  >eD >Can anyone suggest how I can use the single CDD entry to define twoD >identical structures in my program?  I'm a novice with both the CDD= >and the Library utility so any detailed explanation would be  >gratefully accepted!o >r  K I use CDD includes from Fortran, so don't know what BASIC syntax is to get lG this done. To do what you're trying to do, I'd use only one DICTIONARY S4 statement; that would pull in a record definition.    M Then I'd declare two different instances based on the same record definition.a Actual example:n           parameter SP_MAX = 10   B         dictionary 'cdd$top.user_support.scheduled_proposals/list'  @         record /scheduled_proposals/ sp(SP_MAX), save_sp(SP_MAX)4         record /scheduled_proposals/ init_sp(SP_MAX)(         record /scheduled_proposals/ eqn    M This uses the scheduled_proposals record structure to declare three differente5 arrays of structures and a single stand-alone record.   J I think BASIC is choking because the second include tries to redeclare the" already declared record structure.     -- Alanr --  O =============================================================================== 0  Alan Winston --- WINSTON@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDUM  Disclaimer: I speak only for myself, not SLAC or SSRL   Phone:  650/926-3056-M  Paper mail to: SSRL -- SLAC BIN 99, 2575 Sand Hill Rd, Menlo Park CA   94025rO ===============================================================================,   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 12:17:52 +0000nO From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com>., Subject: Re: Not meaning to feed Andrew.....0 Message-ID: <c29r5h$5ee$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   Bob Ceculski wrote:p > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> wrote in message news:<c2559b$hng$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>...u > E >>You don't seem to get it, Rob and Bobs mistakes have been corrected7C >>regularly but that doesn't stop them rolling out exactly the same F >>warmed over argument a few months later. Few newsgroups have postersD >>so wrong and so persistently wrong. The closest you get to Rob andC >>Bob etc's behaviour in other groups is when the FreeBSD and Linuxn >>folks get going. >>	 >>Regardss >>Andrew Harrisonl >  > 8 > you do get it, but can't or don't want to admit it ...6 > I have provided countless examples as have others on5 > the security and stability of OpenVMS ... there ares8 > studies (techwise) and real life trials (defcon9) that8 > prove this along with real life testimonies, including6 > mine of 19 years ... but all these mean nothing?  In8 > your world, we are all liars, techwise is techfoolish,8 > and defcon9 are a bunch of 1st graders ... everyone is8 > a liar, and you have come to save the day ... well you8 > are at it, you still haven't responded to the IBM guys7 > post about VMS vs unix/linux security ... but alas, Iu7 > suppose IBM gurus don't have a clue about VMS either!k2 > Thank goodness you are here Andrew to set us all > straight ... :)b    2 Bob Defcon9 is irrelevant, a group of hackers with4 no experience of OpenVMS didn't manage to break into4 the system from a standing start wow what a suprise.  1 TechWise has been demonstrated to be rubbish, you / cannot compare the cost of downtime two systemse4 where one has 3-4 x the capacity of the other. Sorry1 but it is TechFoolish made even worse by the fact22 that it keeps being warmed over without correcting/ the basic flaw that makes the study worthless..i  6 And your security musings don't make me laugh not even4 HPQ thinks that its a good idea not to use firewalls etc.  7 You CERT claims again more BS which has been disproved.   7 You alternate IP stack invunerability claims again moret BS that has been disproved.   7 You Alpha fast SPARC slow claims again more foolishnesst that has been disproved.   You Slowaris claims ditto.  ; You attempts to lump all Linux/Windows/UNIX security issuese into one. Ditto.  9 Come on Bob, its not as if you have managed to handle onew8 of these issues properly let alone the majority of them.   Regardsh Andrew Harrisonh   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 12:44:29 +0000iO From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> , Subject: Re: Not meaning to feed Andrew.....0 Message-ID: <c29snd$5v3$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   Main, Kerry wrote:   > C > Check this out: an extract from what you posted as a means of notnJ > attacking OpenVMS, but attacking HP while at the same time trying to put > Sun on a pedestal. >  > [snip ..]  >  > * >>From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy 0 >>[mailto:Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com]  >>Sent: January 23, 2004 6:01 AM >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ) >>Subject: Re: 500.000 AMD64's shipped...t >  > E >>There is a huge difference between being late to deliver a product  G >>(every IT vendor is guilty of this) to not delivering the product at iA >>all because you have decided to axe it without consulting your o >>customer base. >>H >>Sun is the first category along with Intel, IBM, SGI etc HP is in the  >>second category. >  > & > To which I replied and pointed out:  >  > ++++  J > Re: Sun not in category of axing products without consulting Customers.. > 
 > ROTFL !! >    Ohhh dear ohhh dear ohhh dear.    B Firstly was there a mass outcry when we dropped the Cobalt brand ?   yes or no ?c  ? Of course the answer is no and thats mainly because you can getsA firewall, proxy etc applicances from Sun running Solaris or Linuxy> on x86 boxes managed by the same Control Station software that@ managed the Cobalt boxes but they arn't called Cobalt any longer& and they arn't the Cobalt blue colour.  C How about the one example you really didn't want to mention Solaris > x86, Sun dropped it, our users complained we reinstated it and7 Solaris 10 for x86 is available for beta customers etc.6  8 Compare that with Alpha, Tru64 features in HP-UX etc and8 you really don't have a leg to stand on because they are diametrically opposite.   > You answer actually demonstrates wonderfully what we have just; being discussing. You statement was irrelevant Fud mine wasc an uncomfortable fact.  : As always the number of smileys you put in your posting is9 just one of a variety of signals that you are posting BS.m  > Keep it up though and thanks for the reminder Kerry you proved: my point without me having bother trawling through google.   Regardst Andrew Harrisonz   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 00:20:52 GMTe4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>P Subject: Re: OpenVMS virus proof while other disks get zapped by latest viruses!0 Message-ID: <4047C47A.155DC7DE@blueyonder.co.uk>   Bob Ceculski wrote:o > d > "rob kas" <rob@paychoice.com.noSPAM> wrote in message news:<104eebok3ks8jd4@corp.supernews.com>... > > Bob  > > ( > > What do you run on your VMS systems? > >t > >                       RobL > 
 > everything!a  A presumably you mean YOUR whole business, and not everything other 6 people might consider they need to run their business.  0 -- i tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 17:04:06 -0800 ( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)P Subject: Re: OpenVMS virus proof while other disks get zapped by latest viruses!= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0403051704.1be5ed50@posting.google.com>o   Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> wrote in message news:<c29u3i$6fq$2@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>...l > Bob Ceculski wrote:of > > "rob kas" <rob@paychoice.com.noSPAM> wrote in message news:<104eebok3ks8jd4@corp.supernews.com>... > >  > >>Bobe > >>( > >>What do you run on your VMS systems? > >> > >>                      Robt > >  > >  > > everything!  > # > Do you have windows desktops ????  > 	 > Regards  > Andrew Harrison   < no, we have thin clients that run powerterm for vt emulation6 and choice of browser (windows or mozilla) for web and6 email access ... we are virus proof and unhackable ...   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 17:06:14 -0800e( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)P Subject: Re: OpenVMS virus proof while other disks get zapped by latest viruses!= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0403051706.64d91a0b@posting.google.com>-   Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> wrote in message news:<c29u2b$6fq$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>...  > Bob Ceculski wrote:c> > > I don't know if anyone has noticed, but a lot of companies: > > are getting creamed by the latest round of viruses ...; > > My boss has 4 friends from other companies who have allt= > > lost servers ... but our "unhackable" virus proof OpenVMS ; > > servers just keep humming along 24X7 ... isn't it greatd > > to be on OpenVMS?  :)  > < > It may have escaped your notice but the only OS's infected8 > by the viruses you refer to are Windows based. By your6 > definition that makes all other OS's from Solaris to > Palmos unhackable. > 	 > Regards/ > Andrew Harrisoni  : go look at the latest certs for slowaris and linux and VMS+ then come back and tell us all about it ...-   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 03:18:05 GMT / From: brooks@cuebid.zko.dec.nospam (Rob Brooks) B Subject: Re: Question on VMS 7.3-2 Sysgen parameter SHADOW_SITE_ID- Message-ID: <EtN388obD3Qm@cuebid.zko.dec.com><  ( Lee Mah <lytmah@telusplanet.net> writes:7 > Has anyone tried setting this parameter to a non-zero % > value to improve read performance?.w  A Well, this parameter is aimed at clusters that are not housed in  @ a single location.  If your entire cluster is in a single room, / SHADOW_SITE_ID is not particularly interesting.h  A Do you have a specific question?  If you have a disaster-tolerant4A cluster with shadow sets that have members at more than one site,>' then this parameter can certainly help.h   -- n  M Rob Brooks    VMS Engineering -- I/O Exec Group     brooks!cuebid.zko.dec.comm   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 05:05:44 GMTi& From: Lee Mah <lytmah@telusplanet.net>B Subject: Re: Question on VMS 7.3-2 Sysgen parameter SHADOW_SITE_ID, Message-ID: <IUT1c.134560$Hy3.7717@edtnps89>  , This is a multi-part message in MIME format.& --------------0306090803090500050708059 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=floweds Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7biti  5 I've got 70+ shadow sets across two production sites, 1 plus a third quorum site, for disaster-tolerance. B I would like to hear from those who have implemented this feature.   Rob Brooks wrote:h  ) >Lee Mah <lytmah@telusplanet.net> writes:p >  r >a7 >>Has anyone tried setting this parameter to a non-zeroo% >>value to improve read performance?.u >>     >> >cB >Well, this parameter is aimed at clusters that are not housed in A >a single location.  If your entire cluster is in a single room,  0 >SHADOW_SITE_ID is not particularly interesting. >rB >Do you have a specific question?  If you have a disaster-tolerantB >cluster with shadow sets that have members at more than one site,( >then this parameter can certainly help. >o >  r >d  & --------------030609080309050005070805) Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-asciis Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   ? <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">  <html> <head>I   <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1">n   <title></title>g </head> ' <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff">d9 I've got 70+ shadow sets across two production sites,<br>R5 plus a third quorum site, for disaster-tolerance.<br> F I would like to hear from those who have implemented this feature.<br> <br> Rob Brooks wrote:<br>hB <blockquote type="cite" cite="midEtN388obD3Qm@cuebid.zko.dec.com">   <pre wrap="">Lee Mah <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" href="mailto:lytmah@telusplanet.net">&lt;lytmah@telusplanet.net&gt;</a> writes:g   </pre>   <blockquote type="cite">F     <pre wrap="">Has anyone tried setting this parameter to a non-zero# value to improve read performance?. 
     </pre>   </blockquote>m   <pre wrap=""><!---->A Well, this parameter is aimed at clusters that are not housed in e@ a single location.  If your entire cluster is in a single room, / SHADOW_SITE_ID is not particularly interesting.s  A Do you have a specific question?  If you have a disaster-tolerantrA cluster with shadow sets that have members at more than one site, ' then this parameter can certainly help.t     </pre>
 </blockquote>g </body>b </html>k  ( --------------030609080309050005070805--   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 03:02:57 +0100 2 From: martin@radiogaga.harz.de (Martin Vorlaender) Subject: Re: Recursive COPY2; Message-ID: <4047dfd1.524144494f47414741@radiogaga.harz.de>B  2 Richard B. Gilbert (rgilbert88@comcast.net) wrote: > Michael D. Ober wrote:E > > Does anyone have a DCL script that takes a source and destination C > > directory and recursively copies the source to the destination.n; > > Similar to the DOS XCOPY /S or the Unix cp -r commands.  >c > How about: > 9 > $ BACKUP /LOG  SOURCE_DISK:[SOURCE_DIRECTORY...]*.*;*  r > DEST_DISK:[DEST_DIRECTORY] - >        /BY_OWNER=ORIGINALt  B If you omit the "..." in the destination, all files will end up in% [DEST_DIRECTORY] - no subdirectories.k   cu,o   Martin -- nA                            | Martin Vorlaender  |  OpenVMS rules!p4  UNIX is user friendly.    | work: mv@pdv-systeme.deG  It's just selective about |   http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/e;  who its friends are.      | home: martin@radiogaga.harz.de,   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 22:15:11 -0800 $ From: leeroth@my-deja.com (Lee Roth)" Subject: SIMH and TK50/TK70 tapes?= Message-ID: <d0e744c9.0403052215.557eb16f@posting.google.com>   = I have an old Microvax with a TK70 tape drive that I'd reallyn@ like to get rid of... (hint: it has a low WAF - "Wife Acceptance; Factor") but I still have some TK50 and TK70 tapes that I'ma@ interested in (maybe, someday) reading the files from- they were@ all made with VMS BACKUP. Most of the data is text, but some are	 binaries.m  B I was wondering if I got a TKxx/DLT2000 SCSI tape drive (that will? handle reading TK50/TK70 format tapes) if I could do one of thet	 follwing:   = 1) Find some kind of Linux-compatable program that could read-> the *.BCK file savesets from tape onto Linux (and then on into VMS running via SIMH)g  B 2) Use 'dd' to suck the entire tape into an image file under Linux( and then mount it somehow under SIMH/VMS  ? Or... do I just need to get a cheapie little Alpha with SCSI tos do all of this?    Thanks!t   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 17:05:03 -0800i3 From: Alan Frisbie <Usenet01REMOVE@Flying-Disk.com>i" Subject: SSH login problem -- Bug?. Message-ID: <4047D23F.8020106@Flying-Disk.com>  = I was trying to use SSH for the first time with a VMS system,e" but was having trouble logging in.  , This is a VMS v7.3-2 system with TCP/IP v5.47 No patches have been applied.   The installation was ane update from VMS v7.2-1.e  ; I went throught the configuration procedure for both client 4 and server, as described in the Guide to SSH manual.3 After completing that, I ran TCPIP$SSH_SHUTDOWN and-5 TCPIP$SSH_STARTUP to make sure it was all initialized:8 properly.   There were no errors throughout all of this.  ;  From a Red Hat 8.0 Linux system on the same LAN, I entered.      ssh -l frisbie vmshostl5 and went throught the initial key exchange.   It then:8 asked for my password, but I got the "Permission denied,5 please try again" message three times before it quit.w  2 To verify that SSH was working on the Linux box, I8 successfully connected to another site with no problems.  7 To verify that I was connecting to the VMS box and thatc4 it was possible to log in, I telnetted from the same9 Linux box to the same VMS system.   I was able to log in,d4 and got the message that there had been three failed login attempts.l  2 This told me that SSH is working and attempting to9 validate my password on the correct account, but failing.   9 As an experiment, I tried using SSH to the SYSTEM accountc on the VMS box.   It worked!  9 The critical difference in the SYSUAF records for the two  accounts is:  A Username: SYSTEM                           Owner:  SYSTEM MANAGERt  D Expiration:            (none)    Pwdminimum:  8   Login Fails:     0> Pwdlifetime:           (none)    Pwdchange:  31-DEC-2003 16:21  ? Username: FRISBIE                          Owner:  Alan Frisbie D Expiration:            (none)    Pwdminimum:  6   Login Fails:     0> Pwdlifetime:           (none)    Pwdchange:      (pre-expired)  > Even though the pre-expired status does not prevent logins via@ telnet, set host, or via a directly-connected terminal, SSH does
 not allow it.o  > Is this a bug in SSH, or a bug in all the other login methods?   Thanks,q Alan   ------------------------------  * Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:35:46 +0000 (UTC)6 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)& Subject: Re: SSH login problem -- Bug?0 Message-ID: <newscache$elx2uh$rhk$1@news.sil.at>  d In article <4047D23F.8020106@Flying-Disk.com>, Alan Frisbie <Usenet01REMOVE@Flying-Disk.com> writes:> >I was trying to use SSH for the first time with a VMS system,# >but was having trouble logging in.@  ; SSH is not bug free, but it works on my systems. Since V5.3   - >This is a VMS v7.3-2 system with TCP/IP v5.478 >No patches have been applied.   The installation was an >update from VMS v7.2-1.  G Consider the ECOs (though they are not related to the problem) as well.o  < >I went throught the configuration procedure for both client5 >and server, as described in the Guide to SSH manual.e4 >After completing that, I ran TCPIP$SSH_SHUTDOWN and6 >TCPIP$SSH_STARTUP to make sure it was all initialized9 >properly.   There were no errors throughout all of this.t   Sounds good.  < > From a Red Hat 8.0 Linux system on the same LAN, I entered >     ssh -l frisbie vmshost  6 Why not starting with the SSH client of TCPIP itself ?   	$ SSH localhost  6 >and went throught the initial key exchange.   It then9 >asked for my password, but I got the "Permission denied,t6 >please try again" message three times before it quit.  3 3 times ? Strange. What does SHOW INTRUSIONS tell ?o  3 >To verify that SSH was working on the Linux box, It9 >successfully connected to another site with no problems.e   Ok.i  8 >To verify that I was connecting to the VMS box and that5 >it was possible to log in, I telnetted from the same*: >Linux box to the same VMS system.   I was able to log in,5 >and got the message that there had been three failedd >login attempts.  C 3 login failures and 3 error message. Coincidence ? Don't think so.O  3 >This told me that SSH is working and attempting tor: >validate my password on the correct account, but failing.  ; Maybe it is not the passwort, but the login process itself.m  : >As an experiment, I tried using SSH to the SYSTEM account >on the VMS box.   It worked!n   Ok.r  : >The critical difference in the SYSUAF records for the two
 >accounts is:n >eB >Username: SYSTEM                           Owner:  SYSTEM MANAGER >iE >Expiration:            (none)    Pwdminimum:  8   Login Fails:     0p? >Pwdlifetime:           (none)    Pwdchange:  31-DEC-2003 16:21s >e@ >Username: FRISBIE                          Owner:  Alan FrisbieE >Expiration:            (none)    Pwdminimum:  6   Login Fails:     0o? >Pwdlifetime:           (none)    Pwdchange:      (pre-expired)    There is the problem7 SSH doesn't support changing the password during login. D Login with SSH to SYSTEM, SET HOST 0, login with FRISBIE, change the6 password and then SSH starts to work fot FRISBIE, too.  ? >Even though the pre-expired status does not prevent logins viamA >telnet, set host, or via a directly-connected terminal, SSH doese >not allow it.  E Indeed. There are restrictions in SSH (like SYS$WELCOME/SYS$ANNOUNCE)yH with which you have to live (for quite some time and the next versions).  ? >Is this a bug in SSH, or a bug in all the other login methods?y  " Another question/rant for Matt ;-)   --   Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialists E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 05:42:47 +0100e2 From: martin@radiogaga.harz.de (Martin Vorlaender)& Subject: Re: SSH login problem -- Bug?; Message-ID: <40480547.524144494f47414741@radiogaga.harz.de>y  4 Alan Frisbie (Usenet01REMOVE@Flying-Disk.com) wrote:? > I was trying to use SSH for the first time with a VMS system,n$ > but was having trouble logging in. ...s= >  From a Red Hat 8.0 Linux system on the same LAN, I entereda >      ssh -l frisbie vmshost 7 > and went throught the initial key exchange.   It thena: > asked for my password, but I got the "Permission denied,7 > please try again" message three times before it quit.  ...p; > As an experiment, I tried using SSH to the SYSTEM accountv > on the VMS box.   It worked! >o; > The critical difference in the SYSUAF records for the two  > accounts is: >hC > Username: SYSTEM                           Owner:  SYSTEM MANAGER  >oF > Expiration:            (none)    Pwdminimum:  8   Login Fails:     0@ > Pwdlifetime:           (none)    Pwdchange:  31-DEC-2003 16:21 >uA > Username: FRISBIE                          Owner:  Alan FrisbienF > Expiration:            (none)    Pwdminimum:  6   Login Fails:     0@ > Pwdlifetime:           (none)    Pwdchange:      (pre-expired)  @ > Even though the pre-expired status does not prevent logins viaB > telnet, set host, or via a directly-connected terminal, SSH does > not allow it.u >n@ > Is this a bug in SSH, or a bug in all the other login methods?  > It's not a bug in SSH, it's an omission in the protocol. WhileC telnet et al do merely connect, and the set password is executed by0C loginout, the password exchange is part of the protocol in SSH (you.D could be authenticated by other means, or authentication by passwordE could be disabled), and expired passwords have not been accounted for  in the SSH specification.i   cu,d   Martin -- n@   OpenVMS:                | Martin Vorlaender  |  OpenVMS rules!3    The operating system   | work: mv@pdv-systeme.deiF    God runs the           |   http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/:    earth simulation on.   | home: martin@radiogaga.harz.de   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 17:10:28 -0800/( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)& Subject: Re: SSH login problem -- Bug?= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0403051710.4adb422f@posting.google.com>-  i Alan Frisbie <Usenet01REMOVE@Flying-Disk.com> wrote in message news:<4048C171.4060607@Flying-Disk.com>.... > Martin Vorlaender wrote:8 > > Alan Frisbie (Usenet01REMOVE@Flying-Disk.com) wrote: >  tC > > > I was trying to use SSH for the first time with a VMS system,e( > > > but was having trouble logging in. >   ? > > > The critical difference in the SYSUAF records for the twox > > > accounts is: >   G > > > Username: SYSTEM                           Owner:  SYSTEM MANAGERb > > >tJ > > > Expiration:            (none)    Pwdminimum:  8   Login Fails:     0D > > > Pwdlifetime:           (none)    Pwdchange:  31-DEC-2003 16:21 > > >vE > > > Username: FRISBIE                          Owner:  Alan Frisbie-J > > > Expiration:            (none)    Pwdminimum:  6   Login Fails:     0D > > > Pwdlifetime:           (none)    Pwdchange:      (pre-expired) >   D > > > Even though the pre-expired status does not prevent logins viaF > > > telnet, set host, or via a directly-connected terminal, SSH does > > > not allow it.  > > > D > > > Is this a bug in SSH, or a bug in all the other login methods? >   B > > It's not a bug in SSH, it's an omission in the protocol. WhileG > > telnet et al do merely connect, and the set password is executed by-G > > loginout, the password exchange is part of the protocol in SSH (youbH > > could be authenticated by other means, or authentication by passwordI > > could be disabled), and expired passwords have not been accounted forB > > in the SSH specification.n > ? > OK, I can buy that.   What would be a good work-around for use  > given the following situation: > ? >    1. All the accounts in question are captive accounts (i.e.i >       no DCL prompt allowed).h > 8 >    2. All user account passwords expire every 90 days. > > >    3. Some users need access to our application from outside> >       the building, using their laptop computer, an Internet= >       connection, and (most likely) Kermit-95 v2.1 (we lovei
 >       it!).y > D >    4. We are paranoid about security, so we would like to use SSH. > @ >    5. Some of these users are outside sales people who may not@ >       visit our facility more than once a year, if that, so we@ >       have to handle expiring passwords without their physical >       presence.m > 	 > Thanks,r > Alan  A if you are worried about security, I hope you are using ssh2, noto3 ssh, and TCPware ssh2 is very easy to configure ...c   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 14:41:40 -0800r7 From: jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net (Daryl Jones)  Subject: Re: Sun On The Run?= Message-ID: <8a646952.0403051441.4dacd449@posting.google.com>9   Dear Andrew Harrison:o   First:  @ Why is Andrew Harrison trying to argue with this article in this% forum? You need to go the Linux site!o   Second:a  D What is being done to SUN by LINUX it is the same thing SUN has beenE doing to HP, IBM, Compaq, and others and vise versa. Take over a DatakD Center by initially cutting its prices and then later boosting them." Business as usual in the IT world.   Third:  2 What does Andrew Harrison have to do with OpenVMS?   Regards, Daryl Jones0     Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew No.Harrison No@nospamn.sun.com> wrote in message news:<c29tha$669$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>...m > Daryl Jones wrote:( > > Home > Technology > Enterprise Tech  > >  t
 > > Linux  > > Sun On The Run? ' > > Daniel Lyons, 03.03.04, 9:52 AM ET r > > G > > NEW YORK - Gerry Louw is a longtime fan of Sun Microsystems and itsHE > > powerful Unix-based computers. In fact, he has been running Sun's E > > pricey machines at various companies for more than ten years. Yet-C > > today, Louw, chief information officer of VMS, a 1,000-employee_E > > company in New York, is ripping out hundreds of Sun servers in 16 G > > locations and replacing them with inexpensive servers running IntelS2 > > processors and Linux, a free operating system. > >  >  > Sigh.s > 	 > FirstlyeB > Linux will not be free unless they intend to only use OpenSourceC > components and in reality they are highly unlikely to save money.tA > This is one of the most pervasive Linux myths. There are places-B > where Linux saves mone, but general purpose tier 2 and 3 serving > is not one of them.o > ? > Just for grins pull the HP sponsored Linux TCO studies or the:> > RedHat ones, spot the obvious attempts to make Linux cheaperA > than Solaris/AIX etc, remove them and hey presto it costs more.  > > > Makes you wonder why they had to assume that a company would@ > use Sun 6800s as tier 1 web servers and then compare that with@ > the costs of using 2 way Xeons running Linux as one study did. > > > Secondly everything is cyclical, the project I am working on@ > is for a company with 120000 employees, we are replacing every= > single HP and IBM server and thats over a 1000 systems with>> > a rather smaller number of Sun's and 2 years in we know that > this has saved money.A > A > Or how about the NHS, Sun is replacing a range of small systemsPB > some windows some not with much larger centralised stystems. TheA > deal is worth  250,000,000 to Sun or put another way almost the E > same revenue as 2 years worth of worldwide OpenVMS server revenues.l > 	 > ThirdlyVG > What does this have to do with OpenVMS except to compare and contrasttE > the revenues Sun is getting from one project in one customer in thee3 > UK with the total worldwide revenues for OpenVMS.> > 	 > Regardso > Andrew Harrisonm >  > > For more of this article:  > > K > > http://www.forbes.com/technology/2004/03/03/cz dl 0303linux.html?partnea >  r=newscom > > / > > As you can see, the article is from FORBES.s > >  > > Regards, > > Daryl Jonesa   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 22:44:32 GMT # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>e Subject: Re: Sun On The Run?G Message-ID: <kjO1c.81762$sl.54636@news01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>/   Roert G. Schaffrath wrote:e > rob kas wrote: >>0 >> "CJT" <abujlehc@prodigy.net> wrote in message' >> news:40476AB1.1050604@prodigy.net.... >>> Bob Ceculski wrote:  >>> 
 >>> <snip>F >>>> OpenVMS will not be going anywhere for a long time ... businessesC >>>> that want low TCO and security and uptime depend on it ... andwE >>>> look at the latest virus rampage wiping out server after server,eF >>>> but not VMS servers ... we will be on VMS as long as it is aroundD >>>> because not even a free garbage linux server can offer what VMS >>>> can, and TCO proves it ...o >>>a  >>> That sounds a lot like Wang. >>>l >>" >>                And Data General >  > ...and Prime ! >aB > BTW, I did like the DG MV series - AOS/VS was an interesting OS.   And Honeywell.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:18:11 +1100r' From: nospam <x@wedontwantyourspam.com>  Subject: Re: Sun On The Run?5 Message-ID: <BC6E0463.25326%x@wedontwantyourspam.com>w  F in article 20040304084917.4e285ec6.mathog@caltech.edu, David Mathog at- mathog@caltech.edu wrote on 05/03/2004 03:49:d  $ > On Thu, 04 Mar 2004 15:33:33 +1100* > nospam <x@wedontwantyourspam.com> wrote: > A >> Then Intel x86 boxes can be the cheapest solution. Having saidfN >> that people use that to convince them selves that's the way too go and thenM >> start spending similar money because they don't buy "put together yourselfbN >> clones" and buy SAN storage and SDLT or other tape solutions and everythingB >> else you really need in a production bet you business solution. > O > There was no problem at all attaching a Quantum SDLT 320 to our Linux server.s  > I don't understand your point.  J The point is (outside of the nice little discounts you probably getting asL caltech) that the surrounding support infrastructure still sets you back andH arm or a leg and is indifferent to the CPU/OS who's cost can soon becomeF less significant in the grand scheme. So arguing that people who startI pricing linux at the desktop should not translate that costing to running,J 300-1000 oracle users. Where systems capable of running that kind load areH not as significantly cheaper because they linux. The savings don't scale	 linearly.-   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Mar 2004 00:20:42 GMT2( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) Subject: Re: Sun On The Run?: Message-ID: <c2b5gq$1q16f9$1@ID-135708.news.uni-berlin.de>  = In article <8a646952.0403051419.3ebf0749@posting.google.com>,e: 	jones.computer.srv@worldnet.att.net (Daryl Jones) writes: > Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew No.Harrison No@nospamn.sun.com> wrote in message news:<c29tim$669$2@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>...e >> John Smith wrote:  >> > Ro ert G. Schaffrath wrote: >> > o >> >>rob kas wrote:n >> >> 3 >> >>>"CJT" <abujlehc@prodigy.net> wrote in message * >> >>>news:40476AB1.1050604@prodigy.net... >> >>> >> >>>>Bob Ceculski wrote: >> >>>>i
 >> >>>><snip>u >> >>>> I >> >>>>>OpenVMS will not be going anywhere for a long time ... businesseseF >> >>>>>that want low TCO and security and uptime depend on it ... andH >> >>>>>look at the latest virus rampage wiping out server after server,I >> >>>>>but not VMS servers ... we will be on VMS as long as it is around G >> >>>>>because not even a free garbage linux server can offer what VMS " >> >>>>>can, and TCO proves it ... >> >>>>a# >> >>>>That sounds a lot like Wang.% >> >>>>S >> >>>% >> >>>               And Data GeneralD >> >>D >> >>...and Prime !  >> >>DE >> >>BTW, I did like the DG MV series - AOS/VS was an interesting OS.  >> >   >> >   >> > And Honeywell.M >> > F >> > I >> And Digital >>   >> 	And Compaq >  >             And SunE  > Why would you include Sun in a list of computer companies thatC no longer exist?  People here may not like it, but it has outlastedr= all the others mentioned above, including Digital and Compaq.D   bill   -- AJ Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   i   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 12:58:17 +0000 O From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com>d Subject: Re: Sun On The Run?0 Message-ID: <c29tha$669$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   Daryl Jones wrote:( > Home > Technology > Enterprise Tech=20 > =20e
 > Linux=20 > Sun On The Run?=20' > Daniel Lyons, 03.03.04, 9:52 AM ET=20  >=20E > NEW YORK - Gerry Louw is a longtime fan of Sun Microsystems and itslC > powerful Unix-based computers. In fact, he has been running Sun's,C > pricey machines at various companies for more than ten years. Yet)A > today, Louw, chief information officer of VMS, a 1,000-employeeuC > company in New York, is ripping out hundreds of Sun servers in 16 E > locations and replacing them with inexpensive servers running Intelg0 > processors and Linux, a free operating system. >=20   Sigh.r   Firstlyt@ Linux will not be free unless they intend to only use OpenSourceA components and in reality they are highly unlikely to save money.S? This is one of the most pervasive Linux myths. There are places @ where Linux saves mone, but general purpose tier 2 and 3 serving is not one of them.d  = Just for grins pull the HP sponsored Linux TCO studies or the=< RedHat ones, spot the obvious attempts to make Linux cheaper? than Solaris/AIX etc, remove them and hey presto it costs more.r  < Makes you wonder why they had to assume that a company would> use Sun 6800s as tier 1 web servers and then compare that with> the costs of using 2 way Xeons running Linux as one study did.  < Secondly everything is cyclical, the project I am working on> is for a company with 120000 employees, we are replacing every; single HP and IBM server and thats over a 1000 systems witho< a rather smaller number of Sun's and 2 years in we know that this has saved money.e  ? Or how about the NHS, Sun is replacing a range of small systemsw@ some windows some not with much larger centralised stystems. TheA deal is worth =A3250,000,000 to Sun or put another way almost thewC same revenue as 2 years worth of worldwide OpenVMS server revenues.r   ThirdlylE What does this have to do with OpenVMS except to compare and contrast C the revenues Sun is getting from one project in one customer in thed1 UK with the total worldwide revenues for OpenVMS.c   Regardsr Andrew Harrisond   > For more of this article:g >=20J > http://www.forbes.com/technology/2004/03/03/cz_dl_0303linux.html?partne= r=3Dnewscom  >=20- > As you can see, the article is from FORBES.s >=20
 > Regards,
 > Daryl Jones1   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 12:59:02 +0000 O From: Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com>V Subject: Re: Sun On The Run?0 Message-ID: <c29tim$669$2@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>   John Smith wrote:  > Ro=DFert G. Schaffrath wrote:r >=20 >>rob kas wrote: >>0 >>>"CJT" <abujlehc@prodigy.net> wrote in message' >>>news:40476AB1.1050604@prodigy.net...d >>>  >>>>Bob Ceculski wrote:  >>>>
 >>>><snip> >>>>F >>>>>OpenVMS will not be going anywhere for a long time ... businessesC >>>>>that want low TCO and security and uptime depend on it ... andaE >>>>>look at the latest virus rampage wiping out server after server,eF >>>>>but not VMS servers ... we will be on VMS as long as it is aroundD >>>>>because not even a free garbage linux server can offer what VMS >>>>>can, and TCO proves it ...  >>>>  >>>>That sounds a lot like Wang. >>>> >>>r" >>>               And Data General >> >>...and Prime ! >>B >>BTW, I did like the DG MV series - AOS/VS was an interesting OS. >=20 >=20 > And Honeywell. >=20 >=20 And DigitalC   	And Compaqa   regardsl Andrew Harrisons   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 20:27:16 GMTl" From: GreyCloud <mist@Cumulus.com>? Subject: Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy? 7 Message-ID: <Eo52c.708$Wc4.1298@bcandid.telisphere.com>j   Island Computers USA wrote:r  L > Am I the only one that remains optimistic that HP will just go back to the8 > original "round wheel" that has already been invented?K > Is it that much work for Intel to tool up for another generation of Alpha.C > chips? (Itanium Hexagonal wheel couold cause a problem I suppose)t > J > I thought all the grunt work for T64/VMS/NT/2000/Linux compatibility was > there already in the Alpha.iK > It never ever made any sense to me to dump the world's fastest CPU for an 6 > Intel Alpha Clone (well, a mutated clone named IA64) >   A I may have to do some business with you in a few months from now.0I I have an old vax4000 vlc that needs a new hard drive and also I want to i> upgrade the o/s.  Also need a cdrom drive to load the o/s and F programming language updates.  I'm not sure if a link between a PC to - vax would solve this problem or just a dream.a   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 14:34:54 -0800 1 From: susan_skonetski@hotmail.com (Sue Skonetski)S? Subject: Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy?p= Message-ID: <857e9e41.0403051434.1f13f8ef@posting.google.com>    Folks,  D The sky is still not falling.  If we were to spend our time writtingB rebuttals to everything the Inquirer said, we would spend our lifeD doing it instead of real work, and while that may please some folks,? we would not make our roadmaps.  Lets face it how many negativecD articles have there been about (you choose) companies, CEO's, chips,< printers, people, plain gossip.  I can not believe that this5 intelligent bunch of people gives credence to gossip.t  A Terry Shannon has posted a note on his page with permission of hp A http://www.shannonknowshpc.com/stories.php?story=04/03/05/2668752    Sues    s fabiopenvms@yahoo.com.br (Fabio Cardoso) wrote in message news:<f30679fb.0403041647.28a64584@posting.google.com>...X > THE DARKNESS IS FALLING ...  >  > + > http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=14521o >  > - > Sending a message to Intel about the Itanicw >  > 6 > By INQUIRER staff: quinta-feira 04 maro 2004, 17:21 > G >  RUMOURS - and they remain just that as we write this ? suggest HP is H > thinking about making big changes to its IA-64 (Itanium) line up, withE > May Day expected to be the day when it's all change at the company.vA > One rumour has it that HP could even EOL the IA-64, which wouldeA > certainly drop a bombshell on planet Intel - and which we think  > somewhat unlikely. > E > HP has a complicated set of roadmaps which place the Itanium at the:3 > centre of its future for large scale enterprises.l > E > But we understand that HP is more than a little upset at Intel overu; > its recent announcement of 64-32 bit Xeons and Prescotts.e > C > How HP would square the end of the line of the IA-64 to its large @ > corporate and federal customers remains unclear. It has made aH > commitment to migrate OpenVMS to the IPF platform, and there's no word% > of change from that division of HP.g > F > But we're watching closely to see just what it intends to do towards# > the end of April and early May. -   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 20:32:49 -0500C* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>? Subject: Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy?1) Message-ID: <4047D8A7.9311CCD7@istop.com>o   Fabio Cardoso wrote:+ > http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=14521sH > thinking about making big changes to its IA-64 (Itanium) line up, withE > May Day expected to be the day when it's all change at the company.   N HP cannot go on without a major announcement. It isn't "business as usual". SoL HP needs to make ist roadmap credible under the new environment. Speculation isn't good.v  A > One rumour has it that HP could even EOL the IA-64, which would A > certainly drop a bombshell on planet Intel - and which we thinko > somewhat unlikely.  K Nothing HP will announce will be a bombshell to Intel. Carly and Grove have M been planning this for some time.  And if Intel announces the end of IA64, it1 won't be a bombshell to HP.t  E > HP has a complicated set of roadmaps which place the Itanium at thed3 > centre of its future for large scale enterprises.1  N But except for HP-UX, none of this has been put into production yet. So endingF this now would prevent HP being forced to support IA64 for 5/10 years.  E > But we understand that HP is more than a little upset at Intel overi; > its recent announcement of 64-32 bit Xeons and Prescotts.   M Both HP and Intel have known for many years that because IA64 didn't pan out,cN the 8086 remain the high volume, industry standard and would scale to 64 bits.N HP has nobody to blame but itself for having prematurely bet all its eggs into that IA64 basket.   L And it isn't as if there weren't plenty of warnings that IA64 wasn't a rightG architecture. Digital customers had seen all the presentations from DECe# technies about why IA64 was flawed.c  C > How HP would square the end of the line of the IA-64 to its larget2 > corporate and federal customers remains unclear.  M Since very few have actually commercially embarked on that IA64 sinking ship, J it won't affect many paying customers at this point in time. And HP has toM face the fact that customers, from this point on, will be reluctant to embark8D on a port of their own infrastructure to such an uncertain platform.  I So, whether Intel has 3 years worth of IA64's improvements or not doesn'toI matter if HP customers refuse to buy IA64 machines and embark on a costlyeJ migration (to the customer). And if HP has to subsidize customers to adoptM IA64 for a couple of years, then that is not a good business decisions from af shareholder's point of view.   > It has made alH > commitment to migrate OpenVMS to the IPF platform, and there's no word% > of change from that division of HP.n  N But since customers don't want to migrate to it, breaking that commitment willM be welcome, espcially if HP annoucend EV7z will be followed by EV79 to bridgem the gap.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 12:17:09 +0100  From: "Dr. Dweeb" <dr@dweeb.com>? Subject: Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy? - Message-ID: <c29njm$1lu2$1@news.cybercity.dk>7   JF Mezei wrote:  > Fabio Cardoso wrote:, >> http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=14521D >> thinking about making big changes to its IA-64 (Itanium) line up,B >> with May Day expected to be the day when it's all change at the >> company.  > E > HP cannot go on without a major announcement. It isn't "business ash@ > usual". So HP needs to make ist roadmap credible under the new& > environment. Speculation isn't good. >pB >> One rumour has it that HP could even EOL the IA-64, which wouldB >> certainly drop a bombshell on planet Intel - and which we think >> somewhat unlikely.  >iB > Nothing HP will announce will be a bombshell to Intel. Carly andF > Grove have been planning this for some time.  And if Intel announces1 > the end of IA64, it won't be a bombshell to HP.n >eF >> HP has a complicated set of roadmaps which place the Itanium at the4 >> centre of its future for large scale enterprises. >;F > But except for HP-UX, none of this has been put into production yet.F > So ending this now would prevent HP being forced to support IA64 for
 > 5/10 years.o >nF >> But we understand that HP is more than a little upset at Intel over< >> its recent announcement of 64-32 bit Xeons and Prescotts. >aF > Both HP and Intel have known for many years that because IA64 didn'tG > pan out, the 8086 remain the high volume, industry standard and woulde@ > scale to 64 bits. HP has nobody to blame but itself for having5 > prematurely bet all its eggs into that IA64 basket.> > F > And it isn't as if there weren't plenty of warnings that IA64 wasn't: > a right architecture. Digital customers had seen all the< > presentations from DEC technies about why IA64 was flawed. >yD >> How HP would square the end of the line of the IA-64 to its large3 >> corporate and federal customers remains unclear.w >=A > Since very few have actually commercially embarked on that IA64hF > sinking ship, it won't affect many paying customers at this point inG > time. And HP has to face the fact that customers, from this point on,pF > will be reluctant to embark on a port of their own infrastructure to > such an uncertain platform.t > C > So, whether Intel has 3 years worth of IA64's improvements or notlG > doesn't matter if HP customers refuse to buy IA64 machines and embark-E > on a costly migration (to the customer). And if HP has to subsidize0C > customers to adopt IA64 for a couple of years, then that is not a:= > good business decisions from a shareholder's point of view.o >a >> It has made aD >> commitment to migrate OpenVMS to the IPF platform, and there's no+ >> word of change from that division of HP.k >a@ > But since customers don't want to migrate to it, breaking thatD > commitment will be welcome, espcially if HP annoucend EV7z will be% > followed by EV79 to bridge the gap.    "Mind the Gap"  H Err. The gap to ??  There is no EV8 or EV9 (at least not on any plans weL know about, though EV8 could feasibly be reignited), so do I presume you areI speaking of a gap until the AMD64 architecture becomes the path of forceda	 upgrade ?   
 Dr. Dweeb.   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 17:27:12 -0800r( From: bob@instantwhip.com (Bob Ceculski)? Subject: Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy?v= Message-ID: <d7791aa1.0403051727.77a07314@posting.google.com>,   Andrew Harrison SUNUK Consultancy <Andrew_No.Harrison_No@nospamn.sun.com> wrote in message news:<c2a4bq$8j0$1@new-usenet.uk.sun.com>...a > Island Computers USA wrote:3N > > Am I the only one that remains optimistic that HP will just go back to the: > > original "round wheel" that has already been invented?M > > Is it that much work for Intel to tool up for another generation of AlphasE > > chips? (Itanium Hexagonal wheel couold cause a problem I suppose)  > >  > D > Why would Intel want to do another generation of Alpha processors. > E > If HP have to dump IA64 the only OS that is still under developmentaD > on Alpha will be OpenVMS, Tru64 is dissapearing fast and HP-UX and& > Tandem are unlikely to run on Alpha. > H > This would leave Intel trying to develop what would to all intents andE > purposes be a new CPU platform (no Windows, no commercial UNIX etc)iC > and one that only as a revenue stream of ~250 million a year withe > the one available OS.j > A > You then get to the issue of if Intel could do a new generation B > of Alpha processors and that would be tricky. The compiler teamsA > for Alpha all work for HP and if HP dump Itanium then the Intelc* > HP relationship is going to be strained. > A > In addition many of the Alpha engineers jumped ship rather than ; > joining Intel, some have gone to startups, some have gonee> > to AMD and some have gone to Sun. Why do you think Sun has a9 > microprocessor development facility in the Boston area.a > @ > However I cannot se HP dumping Itanium its too integrated with, > their DNA for them to do so at this point. > 	 > Regardsm > Andrew Harrisone  ? forget intel ... many of those alpha engineers would, given the : chance, love to come back and continue EV8-9 if they saw a= commitment by HP ... and if they drop itanium, they will haveo< to start back up alpha support ... or they will lose massiveA amounts of high end high margin customers who pay for support ands> services, because hospitals and banks and stock markets cannot< just go to unix/linux/windows and watch there businesses get> hacked to pieces by hackers, viruses and downtime ... no if HP= doesn't want to make enemies, they will sell VMS and alpha toSA someone else if they are stupid enough not to want it themselves.e> HP is at a crossroads to use VMS and alpha or itanium on their< own and continue to rival IBM or to become another commodity< vendor cranking out low or no margin product while IBM reaps> all the benefits ... its a shame IBM doesn't own VMS on power,= they would rule the os world on both the high/medium end, andeA agressively market VMS againset unix/linux/windoze on the low endo= as well ... remember, VMS has the structure now to easily run ; any unix/linux free opensource garbage ... put VMS againset 6 unix/linux and that market would be dead in a year ...   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 20:42:09 -0500* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>? Subject: Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy?l2 Message-ID: <Cq6dndTvF6_RsdTdRVn-hw@metrocast.net>  7 "Chuck Chopp" <ChuckChopp@rtfmcsi.com> wrote in messaged4 news:Hy82c.49632$0l1.24160@bignews3.bellsouth.net...   ...l  L > What ever happened to the FX-32 product that Digital had developed?  I hadH > my little Multia running WinNT v4.0 with FX-32 installed and was quite5 > successfully running x86 applications at that time.)  D Reportedly ISVs were reluctant to certify (and sometimes even merelyE support) their IA32 software running under FX!32, good though it was.aH Whether any relatively normal IA32 code (that would run under 32-bit NT). *actually* had problems on FX!32 I don't know.     Did the technology atmK > the heart of FX-32 get canibalized and turned into the IA32/x86 emulationf' > services for Windows running on IA64?.  J Not according to a conversation I had last year with Anton Chernoff, IIRC:B while the functions were similar, the development was independent.   - bill   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 21:30:28 -0500* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>? Subject: Re: The Inquirer:   HP re-thinking its IA-64 strategy?r2 Message-ID: <YMadnWG3hq0CqtTd4p2dnA@metrocast.net>  F "Island Computers USA" <dbturner@islandco.com.nospam> wrote in message* news:104gv4unkljjibf@news.supernews.com...L > Am I the only one that remains optimistic that HP will just go back to the8 > original "round wheel" that has already been invented?  G One of only a few, most likely.  ISTR that John Smith remains similarlyiI optimistic, but I haven't been since the merger went through (which I wasoI sure would muddle things up beyond the point where resurrecting Alpha waseK feasible - for that matter, I lost most hope when the merger was announced,kI for the same reason; before that, I hoped that the catastrophic effect byrL the Alphacide on Alpha sales would be sufficient to get Curly booted out andD the decision reevaluated, while most of the engineers might still be: available rather than solidly embedded in Intel projects).  K > Is it that much work for Intel to tool up for another generation of AlphaaC > chips? (Itanium Hexagonal wheel couold cause a problem I suppose)h  K Last I knew IBM Microelectronics was the Alpha foundry.  I strongly suspectuL that they'd still be happy to make Alphas if HP were interested (the volumes+ wouldn't tax their capacity significantly).   I But that would only at best bring back EV79 in 130 nm.  EV8 would requireiI far more development to complete than the remaining Alpha engineers at HPSF are capable of - and whether enough could be coaxed back from Intel to  suffice is questionable at best.   >LJ > I thought all the grunt work for T64/VMS/NT/2000/Linux compatibility was > there already in the Alpha.EK > It never ever made any sense to me to dump the world's fastest CPU for an)6 > Intel Alpha Clone (well, a mutated clone named IA64)  4 It never made any sense to any competent individual.   >s >e > Not trolling, just venting >nJ > Oh and VMS People - We have sold MORE VMS systems in 2003 than 2001-2002 > combined.EJ > The real "fall-off" id Tru64 - people in the Unix world seem to be quite > fickle...p  K Not so much fickle, as forced out.  VMS and Linux Alpha users at least haveeJ the option to continue using the OSs they know and love on other hardware,L but Tru64 is a complete dead end:  its users have to migrate to *some* otherK OS as well as to other hardware, and if they choose HP-UX they have to moveuD to a big-endian architecture as well (with little guarantee that theJ promised and then significantly-delayed importation of *some* useful Tru64) features into HP-UX will actually occur).E  ? So little wonder that they're looking at other Unixes - perhaps-K little-endian ones, and preferably from a vendor whom they believe they cana trust.   - bill   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 13:31:43 -0600s4 From: kuhrt@nospammy.encompasserve.org (Marty Kuhrt) Subject: TK50 expansion cabinetE3 Message-ID: <b3A00DtvCncF@eisner.encompasserve.org>o  % Looking for a TK50 expansion cabinet?u  = http://esurplusauction.com/IANAuction/ca?ianac=view&auc=52203u  7 Not my sale, but I thought someone might be interested.    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 16:55:17 -0800 . From: Jack.Trachtman@vmmc.org (Jack Trachtman)  Subject: Two Node Cluster Config= Message-ID: <69d784c4.0403051655.51c04fa3@posting.google.com>r  - I have a two node cluster with a quorum disk.S  8 I want a configuration where either node can continue to@ run even if both the other node and quorum disk are unavailable.  @ Is giving each node its own quorum disk the only way to do this?   thanks   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 17:57:56 -0700o% From: Dan O'Reilly <dano@process.com>u$ Subject: Re: Two Node Cluster ConfigB Message-ID: <6.0.0.22.2.20040305175502.01ff46f8@raptor.psccos.com>  D I do that.  I can run up to 4 nodes in my cluster or as few as 1.  IK use a quorum disk and make sure the EXPECTED_VOTES is set to 1.  My cluster D is for development purposes, including some privileged code, so it'sI susceptible to the occasional crash now and again, and as it's at home, I H try not running more than my main node (mail server, etc) if I can avoid) it, since I'm paying for the electricity.y  + At 05:55 PM 3/5/2004, Jack Trachtman wrote: . >I have a two node cluster with a quorum disk. >o9 >I want a configuration where either node can continue to A >run even if both the other node and quorum disk are unavailable.d >aA >Is giving each node its own quorum disk the only way to do this?a >n >thanks    ------J +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+J | Dan O'Reilly                  |  "There are 10 types of people in this |J | Principal Engineer            |   world: those who understand binary   |J | Process Software              |   and those who don't."                |J | http://www.process.com        |                                        |J +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 04 12:25:38 PSTn From: mckinneyj@cpva.saic.coms Subject: Re: What is ZIC ??e( Message-ID: <uUhRM$CTcLMP@cpva.saic.com>  ' In article <40484974.A1D5B57D@aaa.com>, <  Jan-Erik =?iso-8859-1?Q?S=F6derholm?= <aaa@aaa.com> writes: > Hi.a7 > Just now I was going to type ZIP to see the switches.f8 > By mistake I typed ZIC instead and got the following : >  > $ zic @ > zic: usage is zic [ -v ] [ "-L" leapseconds ] [ -d directory ]+ >          [-y yearistype] [ filename ... ]o >  >  > I found a VERB for ZIC : >  > $ verb zic > define verb ZIC( >    image ZIC  >    parameter P1, label=OPTION1 >       value (type=$file)  >    parameter P2, label=OPTION2 >       value (type=$file)  >    parameter P3, label=OPTION3 >       value (type=$file)  >    parameter P4, label=OPTION4 >       value (type=$file)  >    parameter P5, label=OPTION5 >       value (type=$file)  >    parameter P6, label=OPTION6 >       value (type=$file)  >    parameter P7, label=OPTION7 >       value (type=$file)  >    parameter P8, label=OPTION8 >       value (type=$file) >    nodisallows >  > $  > 5 > But no online help either directly in VMS or in thee9 > TCPIP help. The image is called ZIC.EXE in SYS$SYSTEM:.- >  > Any ideas ? What does it do ?  >  > Jan-Erik.o  K It's the tool used to create custom binary timezone rules files - you mightnJ want to use it if your systems reside in a location for which VMS does notI have a predefined rule. My recollection is that ZIC = zone_info_compiler.hH It reads your ascii text file that contains a formatted set of rules and outputs a binary.    -- s - Jims   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:08:11 +0000 - From: John Laird <nospam@laird-towers.org.uk>d Subject: Re: What is ZIC ??n8 Message-ID: <fakg40tdagutv2skkuu2hncenb0qt8n1cc@4ax.com>  K On Fri, 05 Mar 2004 10:33:40 +0100, Jan-Erik Sderholm <aaa@aaa.com> wrote:   4 >But no online help either directly in VMS or in the8 >TCPIP help. The image is called ZIC.EXE in SYS$SYSTEM:. >  >Any ideas ? What does it do ?  
 Google found: ; http://h71000.www7.hp.com/DOC/73final/6494/6494pro_006.htmln  & Another one of those Unix-y utilities.   -- d3 The more things change, the more they stay insane.     Mail john rather than nospam...    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 17:20:33 -0800 . From: alexdaniels@themail.co.uk (Alex Daniels) Subject: Re: What is ZIC ??-= Message-ID: <9f7f13a8.0403051720.26d84b0f@posting.google.com>t  h Valentin Likoum <me@privacy.net> wrote in message news:<c29qtq$1qsiji$1@ID-184585.news.uni-berlin.de>... > Jan-Erik Sderholm wrote:e > > Hi. 9 > > Just now I was going to type ZIP to see the switches.g	 >  [snip]s > > ! > > Any ideas ? What does it do ?h > ? >    timeZone Info Compiler. If you have not found appropriate s> > timezone in UTC$TIME_SETUP.COM you could pull timezone info < > source from somewhere or create it by hand and compile it  > with ZIC.s  A Luckly being in GMT I don't need to involve myself with this unix  port..  " But here is the unix help on it...   Alex   zic - time zone compiler e	 SYNOPSIS rC zic [ -v ] [ -d directory ] [ -l localtime ] [ -p posixrules ] [ -L ; leapsecondfilename ] [ -s ] [ -y command ] [ filename ... ]m DESCRIPTION E Zic reads text from the file(s) named on the command line and creates C the time conversion information files specified in this input. If a * filename is -, the standard input is read. These options are available:    
 -d directory aF Create time conversion information files in the named directory rather+ than in the standard directory named below.  -l timezone C Use the given time zone as local time. Zic will act as if the inputp! contained a link line of the formd  4       Link       timezone                  localtime     -p timezone D Use the given time zone's rules when handling POSIX-format time zoneD environment variables. Zic will act as if the input contained a link line of the form  5       Link       timezone                  posixrulesy     -L leapsecondfilename B Read leap second information from the file with the given name. IfE this option is not used, no leap second information appears in outputr files. -v tF Complain if a year that appears in a data file is outside the range of& years representable by time(2) values. -s  D Limit time values stored in output files to values that are the same@ whether they're taken to be signed or unsigned. You can use this) option to generate SVVS-compatible files.8 -y command  E Use the given command rather than yearistype when checking year typess (see below).@ Input lines are made up of fields. Fields are separated from oneE another by any number of white space characters. Leading and trailingrF white space on input lines is ignored. An unquoted sharp character (#)F in the input introduces a comment which extends to the end of the line@ the sharp character appears on. White space characters and sharpE characters may be enclosed in double quotes (") if they're to be usedrD as part of a field. Any line that is blank (after comment stripping)E is ignored. Non-blank lines are expected to be of one of three types:O' rule lines, zone lines, and link lines.    A rule line has the form i          e  @ Rule  NAME  FROM  TO    TYPE  IN   ON       AT    SAVE  LETTER/S   For example:        r9 Rule  US    1967  1973  -     Apr  lastSun  2:00  1:00  DS    ) The fields that make up a rule line are:   NAME eE Gives the (arbitrary) name of the set of rules this rule is part of. 0 FROM  D Gives the first year in which the rule applies. Any integer year canD be supplied; the Gregorian calendar is assumed. The word minimum (orD an abbreviation) means the minimum year representable as an integer.< The word maximum (or an abbreviation) means the maximum yearB representable as an integer. Rules can describe times that are notE representable as time values, with the unrepresentable times ignored;<F this allows rules to be portable among hosts with differing time value types. TO  F Gives the final year in which the rule applies. In addition to minimumF and maximum (as above), the word only (or an abbreviation) may be used& to repeat the value of the FROM field. TYPE  C Gives the type of year in which the rule applies. If TYPE is - thentD the rule applies in all years between FROM and TO inclusive. If TYPE0 is something else, then zic executes the command       yearistype year typeD to check the type of a year: an exit status of zero is taken to meanE that the year is of the given type; an exit status of one is taken tod, mean that the year is not of the given type. IN gB Names the month in which the rule takes effect. Month names may be abbreviated. ON 8> Gives the day on which the rule takes effect. Recognized forms include:   5        the fifth of the month2% lastSun  the last Sunday in the monthc% lastMon  the last Monday in the monthc, Sun>=8   first Sunday on or after the eighth* Sun<=25  last Sunday on or before the 25th  D Names of days of the week may be abbreviated or spelled out in full.6 Note that there must be no spaces within the ON field.   AT fF Gives the time of day at which the rule takes effect. Recognized forms include:   2        time in hours" 2:00     time in hours and minutes3 15:00    24-hour format time (for times after noon)S, 1:28:14  time in hours, minutes, and seconds -        equivalent to 0  @ where hour 0 is midnight at the start of the day, and hour 24 isE midnight at the end of the day. Any of these forms may be followed byeD the letter w if the given time is local time, s if the given time isD local time, or u (or g or z) if the given time is universal time; in8 the absence of an indicator, wall clock time is assumed.   SAVE  D Gives the amount of time to be added to local standard time when theA rule is in effect. This field has the same format as the AT fields9 (although, of course, the w and s suffixes are not used).0	 LETTER/S rE Gives the (for example, the or in or of time zone abbreviations to beaB used when this rule is in effect. If this field is -, the variable
 part is null.- A zone line has the form            0= Zone  NAME                GMTOFF  RULES/SAVE  FORMAT  [UNTIL]:   For example:    D      Zone                 Australia/Adelaide  9:30    AusCST1971 Oct 31 2:004    ) The fields that make up a zone line are:   NAME cE The name of the time zone. This is the name used in creating the timeU) conversion information file for the zone.a GMTOFF mC The amount of time to add to UTC to get standard time in this zone.J@ This field has the same format as the AT and SAVE fields of ruleC lines; begin the field with a minus sign if time must be subtractede	 from UTC.> RULES/SAVE BD The name of the rule(s) that apply in the time zone or, alternately,C an amount of time to add to local standard time. If this field is -e3 then standard time always applies in the time zone.o FORMAT  E The format for time zone abbreviations in this time zone. The pair ofrE characters %s is used to show where the of the time zone abbreviation > goes. Alternately, a slash (/) separates standard and daylight abbreviations. UNTIL F The time at which the UTC offset or the rule(s) change for a location.E It is specified as a year, a month, a day, and a time of day. If this C is specified, the time zone information is generated from the given D UTC offset and rule change until the time specified. The month, day,E and time of day have the same format as the IN, ON, and AT columns of D a rule; trailing columns can be omitted, and default to the earliest' possible value for the missing columns.hC The next line must be a line; this has the same form as a zone lineeD except that the string and the name are omitted, as the continuationA line will place information starting at the time specified as thesA UNTIL field in the previous line in the file used by the previousgA line. Continuation lines may contain an UNTIL field, just as zoneyB lines do, indicating that the next line is a further continuation. A link line has the form r          0 Link  LINK-FROM        LINK-TO   For example:    3      Link              Europe/IstanbulAsia/Istanbulj    F The LINK-FROM field should appear as the NAME field in some zone line;= the LINK-TO field is used as an alternate name for that zone. C Except for continuation lines, lines may appear in any order in the: input.  F Lines in the file that describes leap seconds have the following form:             + Leap  YEAR  MONTH  DAY  HH:MM:SS  CORR  R/Sb   For example:        c) Leap  1974  Dec    31   23:59:60  +     Sh    C The YEAR, MONTH, DAY, and HH:MM:SS fields tell when the leap second0@ happened. The CORR field should be if a second was added or if aC second was skipped. The R/S field should be (an abbreviation of) ifvD the leap second time given by the other fields should be interpretedC as UTC or (an abbreviation of) if the leap second time given by the < other fields should be interpreted as local wall clock time. NOTE iE For areas with more than two types of local time, you may need to useeE local standard time in the AT field of the earliest transition time's3@ rule to ensure that the earliest transition time recorded in the compiled file is correct.h   ------------------------------  * Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 22:11:12 +0000 (UTC)* From: bleau@umtof.umd.edu (Lawrence Bleau); Subject: Re: Why does smtp mail between local systems fail?a0 Message-ID: <c2atu0$9vt$1@grapevine.wam.umd.edu>  X In article <c272mb$h1q@newton.cc.rl.ac.uk>, "Richard Brodie" <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk> writes: >dN >Assuming that it is DNS related it some way still, I would trace DNS requests? >(with a monitor, or TCPTRACE/PORT=LOCAL=53) on umtof. See whata1 >happens on the wire when you connect from umace.r  H I did the above command on umtof and tried to connect to it from umace. F Nothing was output, and it took ~25 secs.  I then tried from uleis (IPK 129.2.163.207), another system I administer.  This took ~33 secs, and I did0J get some output, ~15 secs after I entered the telnet command.  Here it is:   $ tcptrace/port=local=53H    FCA30281   E27E0201   00003E35   1C00C045    0000    E...5>....~.....H    00000000   00000000   9BEE6411 | 010000E0    0010    .....d..........F        0000   00000000   00000000   00000000    0020    ..............   So, what do you make of it?    Lawrence Bleau University of Maryland" Physics Dept., Space Physics Group 301-405-6223 bleau@umtof.umd.eduD   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 15:21:33 -0800 ) From: thursday@allidaho.com (jon_norstog)-% Subject: Re: XP1000 technical manual?0; Message-ID: <f9b3265.0403051521.70742b3@posting.google.com>A   To the list:  D I never found anything on the XP1000 except the setup manual.  I didA find a technical reference manual for the PWS 433/500/600 series,  about 120 pages or so.  D As far as memory goes, any good matched set of PC100 or PC133 sdram,C ECC registered and preferably CL2, will work in both the XP and theoC PWS series machines.  XP sets are 4 pieces, PWS sets are a pair.  I 1 haven't tried mixing brands in a memory bank yet.T  C I have found that the SRM will pass on memory that is bad enough tosE mess up machine function, but that AlphaBios (ARC) will detect memorye? that is even a little bit off.  If you eBay make sure you get atE money-back guarantee, then test the stuff immediately in both SRM and 
 AlphaBios.  
 good luck!   jn  I >    Now that you mention it, Crucial (Micron) sent me a set of four with>I > a Micron label marked "MT18LSDT3272G-10EE1 PC100-222-622R 256MB, SDRAM,rG > 100MHz, CL2, ECC", and a Crucial label marked "CT32M72S4R7E.18T", anddJ > they worked fine before the incident.  (Hmmm.  Maybe they'll work in the@ > PWS500a.  I must investigate.)  These appear on Ebay with some+ > frequency, though seldom in sets of four.i > J > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > 6 >    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98185 >    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-orge >    Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547a   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 19:54:50 -0600n@ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net> Subject: Re: Zip/update Issue 6 Message-ID: <4047DDEA.EA26C6DA@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>   Don Sykes wrote: >  > David J. Dachtera wrote: >  > > Don Sykes wrote: > >n
 > >>[snip]I > >>All the SEzip files and standard zip files are created on the NT thencK > >>zipped together and then ftp'd (as bin) to VMS. Then I just do an unziph > >>on VMS.  > >e > >lL > > O.k. There's the piece that was ambiguous. At first it appeared that youJ > > were trying to use VMS ZIP to update a file within an archive produced > > on a non-VMS system. > F > Yes. That IS it. Once the SEzip files have been unzipped onto my VMSH > server they are ready to be distributed (downloaded to customers), BUTJ > they still don't contain a valid license, because I need the customer toF > enter stuff on my VMS web server to create the valid license, THEN IE > need to update the files with the newly created licenses and that'swH > where the problem comes in. If I didn't have to update them they couldD > be downloaded from VMS and they would work fine(they just wouldn't > contain the right licenses).  6 O.k. Let's see if I understand the sequence of events:    1. UNZIP selfextr.exeE     ?: If you only need to update one file in the archive, why do youo        bother to UNZIP?t  @  2. Replace one file in the directory tree(s) with a new version  (  3. ZIP/UDPATE selfextr.exe vms_filespec3     (which actually makes both 1 and 2 unnecessary)m  ;  4. Make "selfextr.exe" available to customer for download.a  I Seems to me the problem occurs somewhere between steps 1 and 2, and that 4) ZIP is not really involved at that point.   D The answer may be as simple as adding a CONVERT/FDL into the process that  updates the archive.  ; Hint: The following is equally as effective as CONVERT/FDL:r   $ COPY NLA0: filespec $ $ SET FILE/ATTR=(RFM=STMLF) filespec $ APPEND license_file filespec  H So, based on your original observations and problem statements, I'd only add to that:  G o Make sure your file transfers are binary when passing the SE archivesh between NT and VMS  A o Make sure the file to be updated has the correct RMS attributesn BEFORE  attempting the update.     > >t > >kC > >>Remember, all these files work fine on NT (or other fine M$ OS)iJ > >>after they're downloaded from VMS. It's only after I do an update to a" > >>SEzip that I have the problem. > >>7 > >>After the unzip on VMS all the SEzip files show as:2 > >X > >a  > > Please define "SEzip files". > Self Extracting Zipl   Errrr, I gathered that.g  9 However, you're using "SEzip files" in multiple contexts:   $ o referring to the SE archive itselfF o referring to the contents of the SE archive, as unzipped on your VMS system.      > >  > > I > >>     Organization: SEQ   RecordFormat: STMLF     RecordAttributes: CRr- > >>     MaxRecordSize: 0    LongestRecord: 0- > >>J > >>and as I said I can download them back to my NT at this point and they > >>work fine.   What are "they" ("them")?e   ...the SE archives?a   ...the files they contain(ed)?   > >t > >mB > > Maybe you should post (or e-mail) the commands you're using toH > > accomplish the task you're attempting. We're getting too confused by > > terminology here.d > >e  > What I'd like to use is just :) > $ zip/update MySEzip.exe newLicense.keya >  > When it's just a regular zip:a$ > $ zip/update My.zip newLicense.key
 > works fine.n  * That first command should work fine, too.   3 Please post the results of this sequence of events:I    1. FTP the SE archive to VMS.  I  2. Directory/FULL MySEzip.exe; (if it doesn't show Fixed-512, your file  C     transfer method is improper; the archive is already corrupted).e  G  3. Directory/FULL vms_filespec	! The file to be updated in the archivef  '  4. ZIP/UPDATE MySEzip.exe vms_filespec   >  5. Directory/full MySEzip.exe; (should still show Fixed-512).  % ...and we'll work forward from there.a   -- r David J. Dachterae dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/r   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 04 Mar 2004 23:03:13 GMTl# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>a< Subject: Re: [GAME] you've been appointed VMS Mkt Mgr, so...H Message-ID: <RAO1c.138216$Qg7.6196@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com>   Main, Kerry wrote: >,H > Well, I am certainly not saying OpenVMS corp level marketing could not
 > improve,  K Improve? From what level ... non-existent?  Kant and Kierkegaard would have 
 fun with you.t   OpenVMS Marketing Dept. slogan:tJ "I think, therefore I do nothing 'cuz carly(tm) would have my ass if I did
 anything."      ? > but since the UNIX OS architecture (which Solaris, AIX, HPUX,eD > Linux and free whatevers are based on) is older than OpenVMS by atD > least 8 years, that has not stopped these older UNIX's from making
 > headway.  J I guess that makes them legacy systems, thus they should be retired and beE replaced with HP's more morden operating systems - OpenVMS and Tru64.    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 00:30:02 GMTc4 From: Tim Llewellyn <tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk>< Subject: Re: [GAME] you've been appointed VMS Mkt Mgr, so...0 Message-ID: <4047C684.DC59B54E@blueyonder.co.uk>   John Smith wrote:h >  > Main, Kerry wrote: > >uJ > > Well, I am certainly not saying OpenVMS corp level marketing could not > > improve, > M > Improve? From what level ... non-existent?  Kant and Kierkegaard would have  > fun with you.o > ! > OpenVMS Marketing Dept. slogan: L > "I think, therefore I do nothing 'cuz carly(tm) would have my ass if I did > anything." > A > > but since the UNIX OS architecture (which Solaris, AIX, HPUX,zF > > Linux and free whatevers are based on) is older than OpenVMS by atF > > least 8 years, that has not stopped these older UNIX's from making > > headway. > L > I guess that makes them legacy systems, thus they should be retired and beG > replaced with HP's more morden operating systems - OpenVMS and Tru64.   F OK so I should not have brought up the OS age, it is the perception ofL VMS that is the problem. Many will have experienced overloaded and neglectedK systems that noone but the gurus could understand properly that eventually  Y went away soon after the gurus did and they were glad about it because the gurus witteredbU on about things like security, defensive coding and zero downtime clusters (something N that is obviously a lie because we cant do it with our (insert non-VMS cluster5 name here)). Or heard about such from their teachers.i   Who said life was fair?e     -- a tim.llewellyn@blueyonder.co.uk   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Mar 2004 15:24:18 -0800s. From: alexdaniels@themail.co.uk (Alex Daniels)7 Subject: Re: [OT] Recycling (Was: Destroying CDR media)l= Message-ID: <9f7f13a8.0403051524.2aad3a66@posting.google.com>   b Paul Sture <nospam@sture.homeip.net> wrote in message news:<4048ADE4.74C975D0@sture.homeip.net>... > John Laird wrote:t > > L > > On Fri, 05 Mar 2004 15:20:17 +0100, Paul Sture <nospam@sture.homeip.net>
 > > wrote: > > K > > >About 40,000 tons of plastic in the form of CD-ROMs arrive annually on 1 > > >the German market (source: ALLIANCE Coburg).m > > >rJ > > >That converts to 12.5 billion pieces.  When spread over the area of aG > > >soccer field, this number of CDS would give a height of 26 meters.i > > I > > What is the population of Germany, something around 100-120 million ?nD > > That's 100 CDs, *thrown away*, for every man, woman and child !! > >h > H > Germany has a population of ~82 million. If I understood it correctly G > that 40,000 tonnes represents the amount arriving in the shops rather F > than the amount being thrown away. But think about the number of CDsI > which come with software, peripherals, and on magazine covers and it iso > probably a staggering amount.w >  aH > > I notice you mentioned "most of Europe" when referring to recycling. > M > Certainly the German speaking parts. Perhaps have should have said "much ofr > Europe" there. > N > Here in Switzerland, the only rubbish bags they will take cost ~1 GBP apieceQ > for a 35 litre bag (suitable for a bin underneath the kitchen sink). And, whereyL > I am at least, there are fines for putting designated items such as glass,Q > electronics, batteries etc in those bags. It's not that bad - I have green bins F > at home for organic stuff, and there are various drop off points for7 > recyclable items, often inside shops for small stuff.  > P > Since a year or so ago, there is a smallish recyclying surcharge on electronicP > goods when you buy them, with the idea that you can take old stuff back to anyO > electrical shop and they will dispose of it properly for you for free. BeforetQ > that, you had to either buy new goods or pay the shop to dispose of stuff. Thatn! > could be difficult / expensive.u > P > yes it can be a pain, but apparently they have managed to reduce the amount of@ > non-recycled rubbish per household quite quite significantly.  > E > Many people take stuff into work and use their employers' recycling0 > facilities too. :-)w > P > There's a rubbish plant near me which burns the combustible stuff and providesP > heating for the local housing. IIRC Germany has had such plants for many years > now. > 	 > >  HereAO > > in the yoo-kay, we cannot make up our minds whether to be last in the queuenL > > (a general rule) or right up at the front with no way of dealing with itM > > (fridge mountains).  There is also a story (the exact truth is not known)"I > > that we used to have a very very efficient used tyre recycling schemelN > > entirely outside any official channels.  Once we decided to conform to theL > > EC bureaucratic methodology, recycling rates plummeted once many partiesN > > realised the extra paperwork and levy collections resulted in overall lost > > revenue.  Sigh.m > >  > L > Sad. When I was young the local (UK) council collected paper and cardboardM > seperately and apparently made a profit on it. Somewhere along the way they ? > lost the plot and forgot that money can be made from rubbish.n > P > But recently I heard of some UK council or other which had hit the targets forM > collecting recyclable rubbish separately, only to throw it in landfill with  > all the rest.n >  > Sigh.   C Don't quote me as I do not have any figures to back it up, but I do E remember seeing on a number of different documentrys that we (the UK)r? are among the worst of northern europe countries for recycling.h  > And I have definetly not seen any CD recycling schemes here...   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 00:11:55 GMTn0 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com>$ Subject: Re: [TCPIP V5.4] More rants= Message-ID: <fBP1c.87307$Wa.11589@news-server.bigpond.net.au>e  F > 1) SSH (server) doesn't honor SYS$ANNOUNCE and SYS$WELCOME logicals.= > (TCPware does it ;-) Why ? Couldn't be security, could it ?s >u   >3) TCPIP HELP SYSCONFIG tellsC >"The subsystem-name argument is required for all flags except -s." J >where in fact it doesn't require the subsystem-name argument with "-m" as well.   6 Thanks for the feedback Peter.  I'll pass these along.  L Robert addressed 2) and 4).  I can't add any more than our kernel-master has already stated ;)u   Cheers,i Matt.n   --  = -------------------------------------------------------------d OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering Enterprise Computing Group Hewlett-Packard Companyt Gold Coast, AUSTRALIAy= -------------------------------------------------------------s   ------------------------------  * Date: Fri, 5 Mar 2004 01:06:32 +0000 (UTC)6 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)$ Subject: Re: [TCPIP V5.4] More rants0 Message-ID: <newscache$p8w2uh$w1k$1@news.sil.at>  e In article <2zJ1c.212$Mq3.100@news.cpqcorp.net>, "Robert Rappaport" <Robert.Rappaport@hp.com> writes:eC >I will respond to just two of the complaints in this message and IhB >will attempt (if possible) to get others more knowledgeable other" >topics to resond to those issues.  < I'm very glad to now know more members of TCPIP engineering.N Welcome to the wonderful world of USENET as well (I hope you stay here longer)" Do you have summer or winter now ?    ? >Complaint #2 reports that while looking at a dump in SDA whereT; >the TCP/IP Scalable Kernel is running we see messages thatt? >inform us that "this is NOT a valid version of TCPIP".  I must.D >admit that this is an annoyance for me too.  However, the statementB >is false and the problem arises because SDA has read in the wrongE >symbol table.  That is, the defining of the TCPIP$STARTUP_CPU_IMAGESp> >logical, before TCP/IP was started caused OpenVMS to load theE >images associated with the Scaling Kernel into memory.  These imagesu? >are TCPIP$BGDRIVER_PERF.EXE, TCPIP$INTERNET_SERVICES_PERF.EXE,A >and TCPIP$TNDRIVER_PERF.EXE). >tH >However, SDA incorrectly reads in the Classic Kernel symbol table files= >(i.e. TCPIP$BGDRIVER.STB, TCPIP$INTERNET_SERVICES.STB, etc.)eL >and then gets confused when trying to determine if the version of TCP/IP isM >valid because it looks in the wrong place (due to the wrong symbol table) toi! >find the validation information.a >nN >I am sorry about this and I am not sure if we will be able to fix this in theH >near future because of other more urgent matters that must be addressedL >and because this will fix itself in future versions when the Scaling KernelI >becomes the only TCP/IP Kernel in the kit and reverts back to the simpleo >names.t  , Now things become much more clearer. Thanks.L But alas TCPIP V5.5 is some more years away (at least for most customers)...  D >         For now, to get around this problem what I do when runningJ >SDA on a crash (or live system) that has the Scaling Kernel loaded, is toH >have copies of the various XXX_PERF.STB files in a side directory whereN >I have also renamed these files.  That is, in my side directory I have a copy4 >of SYS$SYSTEM:TCPIP$BGDRIVER_PERF.STB whose name isG >[side-dir]TCPIP$BGDRIVER.STB.  Also I have renamed copies of the othersE >STB files with the "_PERF" removed.  Then in SDA, after invoking the E >TCPIP command I read the renamed STB files are needed.  For example:n >e6 >SDA> read/image [side-dir]TCPIP$INTERNET_SERVICES.STB- >SDA> read/image [side-dir]TCPIP$BGDRIVER.STBk  ; In TCPIP$STARTUP.COM there could be a workaround like this.?  D 	$ DEFI/SYS/EXE TCPIP$INTERNET_SERVICES TCPIP$INTERNET_SERVICES_PERF 	...  . But ok, there are more important things to do.   >Also I would add: > 0 >SDA> read sys$system:TCPIP$NET_GLOBALS_PERF.STB >t@ >to get the proper structure definitions for the Scaling Kernel. >w0 >If I am looking at TNDRIVER pieces I would add: >l- >SDA> read/image [side-dir]TCPIP$TNDRIVER.STBa >h1 >Finally, if I am looking at the INETACP process:- >d, >SDA> read sys$system:TCPIP$INETACP_PERF.STB  > I do have a SDA$INIT with a log of explicit READ commands now.C I tried to keep it platform independant, but alas, it is no longer.d    ? >Complaint # 4 deals with PWIPDRIVER problems in SDA.  Here therF >problem arises due to the constraint that we name our TCPIP$PWIDRIVERC >simply PWIPDRIVER as far as OpenVMS is concerned.  This is so thatsG >we remain compatible with the other providers of OpenVMS TCP/IP stacksdD >and with PathWorks and DECnet.  That is, because there are multipleB >possible TCP/IP products that one might use on OpenVMS, all theseA >products must use a common name for PWIPDRIVER so that PathWorkssF >and DECnet can find whichever one is running on a system.  This meansF >that a similar naming problem arises in SDA such as the problem aboveB >with the "_PERF" differences.  For the PWIPDRIVER problem, what I; >do is to have a copy of TCPIP$PWIPDRIVER.STB whose name ist >PWIPDRIVER.STB.  H Bingo. This is it and it is ok and in fact there is already such a file. But (as I wrote):f  ? 1) There is a (current) TCPIP$PWIPDRIVER.STB (which isn't used)oI 2) There is a (old/wrong) PWIPDRIVER.STB (but why) which is used instead.nF 3) Thus is in SYS$SHARE (to be found with SDA$READ_DIR) but why not inD 	SYS$LOADABLE_IMAGES (this would be much more logical in my eyes) ??  : and at last something I think you can't directly influenceI 4) Why SDA$READ_DIR logical doesn't include SYS$SYSTEM is still a miracleo. or in other words (and this you can influence)M 4a) Why do you deliver .STB files in SYS$SYSTEM where SDA doesn't find them ?,  G >                 I would either put this copy into SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB]-@ >or into my [side-dir].  If it is in SYS$COMMON:[SYSLIB] then itI >will be read automatically and SDA will not complain when performing thecF >READ/EXEC command.  If it is in my [side-dir] then after invoking the
 >READ/EXEC >command I would:a >n) >SDA> read/image [side-dir]PWIPDRIVER.STBo >u< >I hope these suggestions relieve some of your frustrations.   Indeed, it helps.d; I now have a better understanding for doing my workarounds.-D I only hoped. that the next ECO (which is just around the corner ??)L will make (most of) them already unneccessary. Ok, forgive me my dreaming...   -- g Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER7% Network and OpenVMS system specialisto E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Mar 2004 01:21:56 -0500u* From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@istop.com>$ Subject: Re: [TCPIP V5.4] More rants( Message-ID: <40481C5E.2008A4A@istop.com>    Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote:> > I'm very glad to now know more members of TCPIP engineering.P > Welcome to the wonderful world of USENET as well (I hope you stay here longer)$ > Do you have summer or winter now ?  4 No, that is not the question to ask Mr Rappaport....  1 It is:  "Do you go surfing during lunch break ?" eW or      "Do you write TCPIP code while sipping a drink by  a pool on your WiFi laptop?" K or	   "Are you emprisoned in a former Digital building with Sue making sure- you do your work?"   :-) :-) :-) :-)    ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2004.130 ************************se who understand binary   |J | Process Software              |   and those who don't."                |J | http://www.process.com        |                                        |J +--------------------------+WZLb@ t<
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