1 INFO-VAX	Mon, 08 Nov 2004	Volume 2004 : Issue 620       Contents:4 Re: An interesting link about CPU families over time" Core dump from an image w/ ACCVIO?& Re: Core dump from an image w/ ACCVIO?& Re: Core dump from an image w/ ACCVIO?& Re: Core dump from an image w/ ACCVIO? Re: How to start NTP service? ! Re: LNM$SYSCLUSTER_TABLE question ! Re: LNM$SYSCLUSTER_TABLE question " Re: Need help with a PeeCee again." Re: Need help with a PeeCee again." Re: Need help with a PeeCee again. Re: NFS weirdness ! Sample C program to read Monitor? ' Re: Service Contract for Alpha Hardware   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 07 Nov 2004 18:47:13 -0500 ( From: David Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>= Subject: Re: An interesting link about CPU families over time , Message-ID: <418EB401.1050204@tsoft-inc.com>   John Smith wrote:   - > http://www3.sk.sympatico.ca/jbayko/cpu.html  >  >  >   M Remembering some possibly friction between Alpha designers and Compaq system   integration people:   O (though rumour has it Compaq parners Samsung and IBM were able to produce 1GHz  Q Alphas in 1999, but were forbidden by Compaq because they did not have a support  # chip set able to handle that speed)   P If there is any substance to the above extract, then it'd be another example of O company infighting ending up being the doom of all, similar to the hostilities  3 reported between VMS people and Unix people at DEC.    --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 07 Nov 2004 13:29:47 -0800  From: Z <z@no.spam> + Subject: Core dump from an image w/ ACCVIO? 0 Message-ID: <10ot4t8bf7stgba@corp.supernews.com>  ( When an image ACCVIOs I get a traceback.  2 Sometimes that's enough, but most times, it's not.  E I'd like to get a core dump, as I would on Unix, a core that I could  A load into the debugger to aid in the analysis of what went wrong.    Is that possible on VMS?   If so, how?   E This is Open VMS 7-1.2.  Code is written DEC C, compiled with /DEBUG  C but not linked /DEBUG.  I cannot replace the image with the ACCVIO  B problem (it's on a customer system and ANY new code must first be 2 approved) with another version, built differently.  E But I can change SYSGEN params, for example, if one of them will get   me a core dump on ACCVIO.   @ Also, the image is run in a detached process, if that makes any  difference.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 07 Nov 2004 16:19:24 -0600 * From: Roy Goodman <rlgoodman@acnospam.org>/ Subject: Re: Core dump from an image w/ ACCVIO? 9 Message-ID: <Xns959AB01E4C42Frlgoodmannyc@216.196.97.142>   ? Z <z@no.spam> wrote in news:10ot4t8bf7stgba@corp.supernews.com:    > G > I'd like to get a core dump, as I would on Unix, a core that I could  C > load into the debugger to aid in the analysis of what went wrong.  >    $ HELP SET PROCESS /DUMP   Roy $ (remove "nospa" from Email to reply)   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 07 Nov 2004 16:20:20 -0600 * From: Roy Goodman <rlgoodman@acnospam.org>/ Subject: Re: Core dump from an image w/ ACCVIO? 9 Message-ID: <Xns959AB046DED31rlgoodmannyc@216.196.97.142>   ? Z <z@no.spam> wrote in news:10ot4t8bf7stgba@corp.supernews.com:   G > I'd like to get a core dump, as I would on Unix, a core that I could  C > load into the debugger to aid in the analysis of what went wrong.   # SET PROCESS /DUMP is what you want.    Roy $ (remove "nospa" from Email to reply)   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 07 Nov 2004 15:29:47 -0800  From: Z <z@no.spam> / Subject: Re: Core dump from an image w/ ACCVIO? 0 Message-ID: <10otbu7ejrede0c@corp.supernews.com>   Roy Goodman wrote:G >>I'd like to get a core dump, as I would on Unix, a core that I could  C >>load into the debugger to aid in the analysis of what went wrong.   % > SET PROCESS /DUMP is what you want.   & Now why didn't I ever see that before?   Thanks.    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Nov 2004 03:10:16 GMT 0 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com>& Subject: Re: How to start NTP service?= Message-ID: <ssBjd.25726$K7.21665@news-server.bigpond.net.au>   < There's no mention of which version of TCP/IP you are using.   >First, it didn't haveE >sys$specific:[tcpip$ntp] folder, but I simply copied them from other 	 >systems.   L Generally, using manual steps like this are frought with downline problems. G Leave it for TCPIP$CONFIG to perform whatever steps it needs to create  E directories, accounts and other service specific info.  Then you can  * customise the service some more if needed.   Personally, I would:     - tcpip$ntp_shutdown-     - rename/remove the directory you created 3     - rerun TCPIP$CONFIG and enable the NTP service     > $     tcpip enable service NTPF > %TCPIP-E-STARTERROR, error starting NTP service -SYSTEM-F-DEVACTIVE,  L This log file doesn't appear to be representative of the problem you had in F the first attempt.  It seems the first attempt actuall did enable the , service, even though it started with errors.  . You can check this with  "tcpip show service".G Also check the NTP log file: sys$specific:[tcpip$ntp]*.log.  Check the  2 mangement guide if you need more detailed logging.  ! However, back in the base thread:   7 >%SET-F-PWDLOCKED, password is locked to prevent change C >%DCL-W-SKPDAT, image data (records not beginning with "$") ignored " >Group number 3655 already exists.9 >TCPIP requires a unique group number.  Please try again.  >Enter UIC group number:  I Perhpas you have another account using the group number 3655?  Check the  L authorization file and either reassign the group, or give TCPIP a new group  number.    Matt.    --  = -------------------------------------------------------------  OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering Enterprise Computing Group Hewlett-Packard Company  Gold Coast, AUSTRALIA = -------------------------------------------------------------     3 "Dejan Terzic" <dterzic@hemo.net> wrote in message  7 news:3fbb7bf7.0411020507.2b13967d@posting.google.com... A >I made a log what is happening when I run tcpip$ntp_startup.com:  >  > $ ! * > $ ! File name:     TCPIP$NTP_STARTUP.COM8 > $ ! Product:        Compaq TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS > $ ! Version:        V5.3-01  > $ ! 4 > $ ! Copyright 2002 Compaq Computer Corporation $ !< > $ ! COMPAQ Registered in U.S. Patent and Trademark Office. > $ ! H > $ ! Confidential computer software.  Valid license from  Compaq $ ! orF > authorized sublicensor required for possession, use  or $ ! copying.3 > Consistent with FAR 12.211 and 12.212, Commercial A > $ ! Computer Software,   Computer Software Documentation,   and E > $ ! Technical Data for Commercial Items  are  licensed  to  the $ ! = > U.S. Government under vendor's standard commercial license.  > $ !  > $     gosub set_dclcmds  > $ set_dclcmds: > $     call     := call > $     close    := close  > $     copy     := copy > $     create   := create > $     deassign := deassign > $     define   := define > $     delete   := delete > $     exit     := exit > $     gosub    := gosub  > $     inquire  := inquire  > $     install  := install  > $     open     := open > $     pipe     := pipe > $     purge    := purge  > $     read     := read > $     rename   := rename > $     return   := return > $     search   := search > $     set      := set  > $     show     := show > $     start    := start  > $     stop     := stop > $     type     := type > $     wait     := wait > $     write    := write  > $     return > $     set noon* > $     set symbol /scope=(nolocal,global)) > $     on control_y then goto abort_exit 0 > $     serv_proc   = f$environment("procedure")> > $     serv_id     = f$parse(serv_proc,,,"name") - "_STARTUP"H > $     serv_nam   = f$parse(serv_proc,,,"name") - "TCPIP$" - "_STARTUP"I > $     serv_privs  = f$edit("cmkrnl,netmbx,oper,sysnam,sysprv","upcase") L > $     serv_tailor = f$edit("sys$startup:TCPIP$NTP_systartup.com","upcase")C > $     serv_upinfo = " 2-NOV-2004 13:59:16.35  User: DEJAN       "  > $ ! & > $ ! get startup procedure parameters > $ !  > $ get_parameters: 7 > $     tcpip$param_loginfo == f$edit(p1,"trim,upcase")  > $ ! ! > $ ! check if network is started  > $ !  > $ check_network:+ > $     if .not. f$getdvi("_bg0:","exists") 
 > $     endif  > $ ( > $     if .not. f$getdvi("_bg0:","mnt")
 > $     endif  > $ ! / > $ ! check license needed to start service $ !  > $ check_license:- > $     if f$type(tcpip$license_run) .eqs. "" 
 > $     endif  > $ " > $     if .not. tcpip$license_run
 > $     endif  > $ ! ) > $ ! check if service is already started  > $ !  > $ check_startup: > $     serv_startup =B > f$trnlnm("TCPIP$NTP_started","tcpip$startup_table",,"executive")  > $     if serv_startup .nes. ""
 > $     endif  > $ ! 0 > $ ! set privileges needed to start service $ ! > $ set_privileges: ) > $     prev_privs = f$setprv(serv_privs) ( > $     if .not. f$privilege(serv_privs)
 > $     endif  > $ !   > $ ! install and tailor service > $ !  > $ install_service:@ > $     define /table=tcpip$startup_table/executive_mode/nolog -D >   TCPIP$NTP_started "Started:  2-NOV-2004 13:59:16.35  User: DEJAN >   " 8 > %SYSTEM-F-NOLOGTAB, no logical name table name match $; > $     image = f$edit("sys$system:tcpip$ntp.exe","upcase") 3 > $     call install_image SYS$SYSTEM:TCPIP$NTP.EXE $ > "cmkrnl,log_io,oper,setprv,sysprv" > $ install_image: subroutine  > $     set noon > $     status = 1 > $ ) > $     p1 = p1 - f$parse(p1,,,"version")  > $   > $     if f$search(p1) .eqs. "" > $     else, > $   if .not. f$file_attributes(p1,"known") > $   endif 
 > $     endif  > $  > $     exit status  > $     if .not. $status
 > $     endif  > $ . > $     if f$trnlnm("tcpip$ntp_conf") .eqs. ""
 > $     endif  > $ 2 > $     if f$trnlnm("tcpip$ntp_tempfile") .eqs. ""
 > $     endif  > $ 3 > $     if f$trnlnm("tcpip$ntp_res_child") .eqs. "" 
 > $     endif  > $ < > $     call log_info "%TCPIP-I-INFO, logical names created" > $ log_info: subroutine > $     set noon > $ C > $     if (tcpip$param_loginfo .eqs. "") .or. (tcpip$param_loginfo  > .nes. "QUIET") > $     then= > $   write sys$output "%TCPIP-I-INFO, logical names created" & > %TCPIP-I-INFO, logical names created
 > $     endif  > $  > $     exit 1 > $ ) > $     if f$search(serv_tailor) .nes. "" 
 > $     endif  > $ !  > $ ! enable service > $ !  > $ enable_service:   > $     tcpip enable service NTPF > %TCPIP-E-STARTERROR, error starting NTP service -SYSTEM-F-DEVACTIVE, > device is active > $     if .not. $status > $     thenC > $   tcpip$serv_fail == "TCPIP-E-ENABLERR, error enabling service"  > $   goto error_exit  > $ error_exit:   > $     serv_status = %x10000002H > $     write sys$output "%TCPIP-E-STARTFAIL, failed to start TCPIP$NTP"/ > %TCPIP-E-STARTFAIL, failed to start TCPIP$NTP D > $     write sys$output "-TCPIP-E-ENABLERR, error enabling service"+ > -TCPIP-E-ENABLERR, error enabling service  > $     goto exit 	 > $ exit: / > $     if f$type(tcpip$param_loginfo) .nes. ""  > $     then/ > $   delete /symbol/global tcpip$param_loginfo 
 > $     endif  > $ + > $     if f$type(tcpip$serv_fail) .nes. ""  > $     then+ > $   delete /symbol/global tcpip$serv_fail 
 > $     endif  > $ & > $     if f$type(prev_privs) .nes. "" > $     then' > $   prev_privs = f$setprv(prev_privs) 
 > $     endif  > $  > $     exit serv_status     ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 07 Nov 2004 19:24:25 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>* Subject: Re: LNM$SYSCLUSTER_TABLE question+ Message-ID: <418ECAC9.550A6A46@comcast.net>   / Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote:  > > > In article <418D49CE.6FFBFCC8@comcast.net>, David J Dachtera% > <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> writes:  >  > > > $ sh log testtest > > > > %SHOW-S-NOTRAN, no translation for logical name TESTTEST4 > > > $ define/log/table=lnm$syscluster testtest foo4 > > > $ define/log/table=lnm$syscluster testtest foo4 > > > $ define/log/table=lnm$syscluster testtest barF > > > %DCL-I-SUPERSEDE, previous value of TESTTEST has been superseded1 > > > $ define/log/table=lnm$process testtest foo 1 > > > $ define/log/table=lnm$process testtest foo F > > > %DCL-I-SUPERSEDE, previous value of TESTTEST has been superseded1 > > > $ define/log/table=lnm$process testtest bar F > > > %DCL-I-SUPERSEDE, previous value of TESTTEST has been superseded > > > L > > > This looks to me like, in the case of lnm$syscluster, first a check isK > > > done to see if the value has changed, but not for other tables.  This L > > > makes sense, since probably for other tables it is quicker to redefineJ > > > it than to test it, but the opposite is true for lnm$syscluster.  Of' > > > course, the results are the same.  > > K > > I think what must be remembered is that the propagation of cluster-wide K > > logical names from the DEFINE-ing node to the other cluster partners is H > > going to take a little time. I'm sure it's possible that you hit theG > > thing fast enough that it hadn't fully propagated yet. You probably H > > wouldn't want the DEFINE to be synchronous, and not return until allJ > > nodes have propagated - that could take a while, and if one node has aL > > problem, it would hang your procedure just waiting for that to complete. >  > No, the message never comes.   ...and I wouldn't expect it to.   0 The first DEFINE should, of course, be "silent".  E If the second is also silent, then I'm sure engineering would also be G interested; however, I would not expect a message to appear later about H a condition that did not yet exist at the time the second DEFINE command* was issued (propagation was not complete).  H Then, again, Rob Brooks says it *IS* synchronous (potential issues). OneD more reason for engineering to look at it cock-eyed, I should think.   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 07 Nov 2004 21:53:37 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> * Subject: Re: LNM$SYSCLUSTER_TABLE question, Message-ID: <418EDFA7.1BF274FC@teksavvy.com>   $HELP V72 programming Cluster   = There is a flag added for SYS$TRNLNM called LNM$M_INTERLOCKED   M When setting this flag (not set by default), the system service waits for all M updates to be completed before proceeding with translation. However that help L page also mentions that updates to the clusterwide tables are done instantlyA on the same node (they just take a little longer on other nodes).   J This doesn't quite answer the original question, but it does allude to theG existance of some transaction queue for logical name definitions in the I clusterwide table. And it would therefore make sense for a command not to S create a change transaction of the translation of a logical isn't actually changed.   K Nevertheless, at the DCL point of view, the message should still be issued.    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 07 Nov 2004 19:54:36 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG+ Subject: Re: Need help with a PeeCee again. 0 Message-ID: <00A3A862.3822741F@SendSpamHere.ORG>  \ In article <418E6160.D34193AD@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:" >VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: >>  P >> My wife has scanned 1000s of pictures and cleaned them up using PhotoShop Pro >> on a -- eeek -- PeeCee. >  >Cause for divorce :-) >  > N >> She burned them to CDs for me and I cannot read them on VMS.  All the names< >> have a ~ in them and gobbledegook alphanumeric scrambles. > L >You are seeing the raw 8.3 names of the Microsoft extended file system. You6 >need a Joliet extension of ISO CDs to see full names. > 6 >> How can she put these on CD that I can access them. > @ >Could she not copy the contents with FTP over to your machine ?  J That would require putting that Swiss-cheese security poor shitload excuse of an OS on my network.       + >> I can't wait until I can get her the G5.  > M >One of those rare occasions where the husband can shape the wife to fit him. ' >Usually works the other way around :-)   ; I never had to shape her!  She's always fit *real* nice! ])    --  < http://www.ProvN.com  for the *best* OpenVMS system security=                       solutions that others only claim to be.  --  , Cyber-Terrorism (si'-ber tayr'-or-iz-em) n.:M   The release of, the sale of, or the use of any Micro$oft software product!   --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 07 Nov 2004 15:51:09 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> + Subject: Re: Need help with a PeeCee again. , Message-ID: <418E8ABA.B36237B7@teksavvy.com>  ! VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: L > That would require putting that Swiss-cheese security poor shitload excuse > of an OS on my network.   F It can't infect your VMS or MAC boxes. And while you might not want itG permanently connected, a connection just to perform a well defined task & (transfer files) wouldn't hurt anyone.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Sun, 7 Nov 2004 16:28:49 -0500# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> + Subject: Re: Need help with a PeeCee again. , Message-ID: <7OSdnTRviu4ODhPcRVn-qg@igs.net>    VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:7 > In article <418E6160.D34193AD@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei ( > <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:$ >> VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: >>> C >>> My wife has scanned 1000s of pictures and cleaned them up using ) >>> PhotoShop Pro on a -- eeek -- PeeCee.  >> >> Cause for divorce :-) >> >>E >>> She burned them to CDs for me and I cannot read them on VMS.  All G >>> the names have a ~ in them and gobbledegook alphanumeric scrambles.  >>B >> You are seeing the raw 8.3 names of the Microsoft extended fileD >> system. You need a Joliet extension of ISO CDs to see full names. >>7 >>> How can she put these on CD that I can access them.  >>B >> Could she not copy the contents with FTP over to your machine ? > E > That would require putting that Swiss-cheese security poor shitload  > excuse > of an OS on my network.   % Kermit them over a dialup connection.    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 08 Nov 2004 02:44:17 GMT 0 From: "Matt Muggeridge" <Matt.Muggeridge@hp.com> Subject: Re: NFS weirdness= Message-ID: <54Bjd.25661$K7.20167@news-server.bigpond.net.au>   A I don't know for sure, but I wonder if this is the result of DCL  I automatically upper casing the filename before sending it off to the NFS   server.  On your NFS client...   Things to try:       - double quote the filename      - set proc/parse=extended   K Also check the help on "set proc/case=sensitive", but be careful with this   one.   Matt.    --  = -------------------------------------------------------------  OpenVMS TCP/IP Engineering Enterprise Computing Group Hewlett-Packard Company  Gold Coast, AUSTRALIA = -------------------------------------------------------------     : "Keith A. Lewis" <lewis@PROBE.MITRE.ORG> wrote in message ( news:cm5mou$jhd$1@newslocal.mitre.org...H > Since I installed OpenVMS 7.3-2 and TCPIP 5.4, I have had the problem  > shown  > below. > 5 > $ dir/sec dsa0:[vms$common.syshlp.images]compaq.gif  > + > Directory DSA0:[VMS$COMMON.SYSHLP.IMAGES]  > E > Compaq.gif;1         [LEWIS]                          (RE,RE,RE,RE)  >  > Total of 1 file.C > $ search dsa0:[vms$common.syshlp.images]compaq.gif 2.718281828936 ) > %SEARCH-I-NOMATCHES, no strings matched   > $ dir/sec dnfs2:[cd]compaq.gif >  > Directory DNFS2:[CD] > K > Compaq.gif;1         [LEWIS]                          (RWED,RWED,RED,RED)  >  > Total of 1 file.. > $ search dnfs2:[cd]compaq.gif 2.718281828936@ > %SEARCH-W-OPENIN, error opening DNFS2:[CD]compaq.gif; as input > -RMS-E-FNF, file not found! > %SEARCH-E-NOFILE, no file found  > A > I just installed the latest UPDATE patch and TCPIP ECO, and the @ > problem persists.  It was not there under 7.3-1 and TCPIP 5.3. > K > DNFS2 is mounted /stru=5 /noadf.  It is hosted on a Fedora Core 1 system. 2 > If I rename the file to all uppercase, it works. > 2 > --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.orgA > The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.     ------------------------------   Date: 7 Nov 2004 21:08:28 -0800 ' From: timasmith@hotmail.com (Tim Smith) * Subject: Sample C program to read Monitor?= Message-ID: <a7234bb1.0411072108.1903241e@posting.google.com>   D I dont suppose anyone has a sample C program which reads the MonitorD file - doesnt need to be complete but perhaps something that gets me4 started e.g. reads the fileheader, systemheader etc.  ) Its a struggle to read even a date in :-)    Tim    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Nov 2004 21:58:21 +0100 0 From: Keith Cayemberg <keith.cayemberg@arcor.de>0 Subject: Re: Service Contract for Alpha HardwareB Message-ID: <418be971$0$22609$9b4e6d93@newsread4.arcor-online.net>   Main, Kerry wrote: >>-----Original Message-----7 >>From: Roy Omond [mailto:Roy.Omond@BlueBubble.UK.Com]    >>Sent: November 4, 2004 9:23 AM >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 2 >>Subject: Re: Service Contract for Alpha Hardware >> >>Keith Cayemberg wrote: >> >>>[...snip...]  >>> ! >>>_VMS HARDWARE REPAIR SERVICES_  >>>  >>>ABACUS COMPUTING - UK+ >>>http://www.abacus-computing.com/home.htm  >>>   >>>Beovax Computer Services - UK$ >>>http://www.beovax.co.uk/index.htm >>; >>How strange that Keith didn't mention his *own* company !  >>: >>In the UK, the main Alpha Hardware maintenance companies9 >>with whom I deal on a daily basis are (in no particular 
 >>order:-) >>+ >>o	Synstar (very recently purchased by HP)  >>o	Maindec  >>o	Fujitsu (formerly ICL)	 >>and ...  >>o	IBM  >> >>Roy Omond  >>Blue Bubble Ltd. >> >  >  > Roy, > I > For all the marketing and positioning, both IBM and HP do a fair amount J > of business with each other. Both companies order and support the others? > hardware and software as our Customers requirements dictate.   > H > Any SI who does not do this is not really in the solutions integration > business.  > G > Some examples - I have been on the phone providing support for IBM on G > relatively obscure OpenVMS issues their Customers were having. I have H > also been lead SA for large RFP's where we have positioned competitorsJ > gear (including SUN btw) as that is what the Customer was looking for orH > what made the most sense. In the Managed Services business, it is evenF > more transparent where HP staff supports very large installations of/ > z/OS, Solaris, AIX and many other platforms.   > ? > IBM does the same thing with HP / Sun / ?? platforms as well.  > ' > New theme these days is coopetition.   >  > :-)  > 
 > Regards, >  > Kerry Main > Senior Consultant  > HP Services Canada > Voice: 613-592-4660  > Fax: 613-591-4477  > kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom > (remove the DOT's and AT)  > & > "OpenVMS has always had integrity ..  > Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .." >  >  >  >   G Kerry is right. In the IT Services Industry the customer often doesn't  G want to have to coordinate multiple service providers. These customers  B want to see offers with prices for a complete package of services E without regard to who owns which technology. Behind the scenes, when  H performing a service involving a third-party technology, it may be that I the service company has the expertise in-house or it may need to acquire  A services from subcontractors or the even technology owner itself.   D Lou Gerstner is said to have saved IBM in the early 90's in part by H breaking the NIH Syndrome and insisting that IBM provide any product or F service required to get and keep a customer. Each business unit needs A the freedom to offer what the customer needs in order to compete  G effectively against the equivalent business unit of a competitor. IBM,  I in the past, has won bidding wars for customers by offering OpenVMS when  4 Hew-DEC-PAQ-ard offered Tru/64 on the same hardware.  I Almost any large customer has a complex multi-platform environment. That  I I have a job with IBM, is primarily due to IBM having a lot of important  G customers which have VMS machines doing important things next to their  E other systems; some, many or none of which are from IBM. Any company  D wanting to be in the outsourcing service business (one of the great D growth areas in IBM the last 10 years) needs to be able to tell the F customer it will deal with all the their existing in-house technology.  F In the VMS HW Repair list, I was trying to provide companies which do G the repairs and field services on this class of hardware themselves. I  I didn't include HP since it was too obvious of a source. I didn't include  I IBM since I am not aware of any IBM department which performs the repair  F or field service of VAX or Alpha hardware themselves. I may be wrong, > IBM is huge, and it may be that IBM has trained field service G technicians for VAX or Alpha in a specific country. I'm just not aware   of it.  B Here are a couple more examples of coopetition between HP and IBM.  H        - To my knowledge IBM Microelectronics produces (under a contractB          with HP) all of the EV7 chips  used in the current models          of AlphaServers.   B        - IBM has a contract with HP (actually made with Compaq) toB          to work together in making HP systems compatible with ESS>          (shark) and IBM systems compatible with StorageWorks.  3 IBM also develops Software which runs on OpenVMS...   / IBM MQSeries : Platforms : Compaq OpenVMS Alpha ; http://www-4.ibm.com/software/ts/mqseries/platforms/vmsaxp/ G IBM MQSeries - OpenVMS Clusters and IBM MQSeries Failover Sets - VTJ v4 P http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/journal/v4/vms_clusters_and_ibms_mqseries.htmlB IBM (United Kingdom Laboratories) - OpenVMS Business Partner Brief3 http://h71000.www7.hp.com/partners/ibmuk/index.html   G IBM - UniData - an extended relational database designed for embedding   in vertical applications0 http://www-306.ibm.com/software/data/u2/unidata/  $ IBM SCR - Security Controls Reporter/ http://sdsg.lagaude.ibm.com/sdsgSCR/ScrRoot.htm , IBM SCR - Download Extractors - SECAUDIT_VMSO http://sdsg.lagaude.ibm.com/sdsgSCR/download_extractor/ScrExtractorDownload.htm      Cheers!    Keith Cayemberg    ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2004.620 ************************                