1 INFO-VAX	Fri, 19 Nov 2004	Volume 2004 : Issue 642       Contents:& Re: %SYSTEM-F-ACCVIO, access violation9 Re: (Just for fun) What if DEC had licensed VMS to Apple? , BM benchmark leaves server rivals breathless0 Re: BM benchmark leaves server rivals breathless Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw !: Re: Extending DCL [was: Re: DCL suggestion for f$verify()]: Re: Extending DCL [was: Re: DCL suggestion for f$verify()]: Re: Extending DCL [was: Re: DCL suggestion for f$verify()]G Re: Getting to know what subprocess is the parent of another subprocess G Re: Getting to know what subprocess is the parent of another subprocess G Re: Getting to know what subprocess is the parent of another subprocess A Re: How do I attach zip csv and other binary files from Vms mail? A Re: How do I attach zip csv and other binary files from Vms mail? A Re: How do I attach zip csv and other binary files from Vms mail?  Itanium vs Power5 4 Re: Looking for feedback on using EDM to back up VMS9 Re: Microsoft to skip Itanium with supercomputing Windows 9 Re: Microsoft to skip Itanium with supercomputing Windows , Re: Online forums for former digits/deccies?, Re: Online forums for former digits/deccies? Re: OT: Reality check on RFID 5 problems with pcfns portmapper and SIMH VAX simulator  Re: Radeon 7500 problem  Re: raid hardware  Re: raid hardware 1 Re: reporter inquiry: Is HP selling AlphaServers? 1 Re: reporter inquiry: Is HP selling AlphaServers? 1 Re: reporter inquiry: Is HP selling AlphaServers? 1 Re: reporter inquiry: Is HP selling AlphaServers? 1 Re: reporter inquiry: Is HP selling AlphaServers? % Re: RMS Files and directories Indexes " Re: Solaris 10 - no charge for o/s" Re: Solaris 10 - no charge for o/s Re: ssh set password8 Re: this newsgroup heavily trolled by gay Darrell Larose8 Re: this newsgroup heavily trolled by gay Darrell Larose  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 19:51:00 -0000 1 From: wspencer@ap.dontspamme.org (Warren Spencer) / Subject: Re: %SYSTEM-F-ACCVIO, access violation 1 Message-ID: <95A59AE57wspenceraporg@216.168.3.30>   J himanshu.patni@gmail.com (Himanshu) wrote in <19cf7b88.0411160210.4ab5c5a1 @posting.google.com>:    >address=42441430   M There's a problem with the code.  Looks like you're trying to execute data.    Wild pointer?  Is this C code?   ws   --   Warren Spencer Senior Software Engineer The Associated Press   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 00:37:24 GMT 3 From: Jeffrey R. Burgess <jburgess@carolina.rr.com> B Subject: Re: (Just for fun) What if DEC had licensed VMS to Apple?8 Message-ID: <2004111819372416807%jburgess@carolinarrcom>  D On 2004-11-17 06:29:42 -0500, "Galen" <gspamtackett@yahoo.com> said:  F > I've heard it rumored that this was actually considered at one time.H > Perhaps it was back around the time that DEC and Apple had their brief > alliance.  > C > Would OS X have been built on VMS instead of Mach/OpenBSD/Darwin?  > :-)   D YOU RULE!!!!!  I have OFTEN asked this question.  I imagine all the F great combinations between the two.  No one made a better system than F Digital.  I have never seen such engineering.  If no one believes me, 7 just disassemble a VAX 6000 series cabinet.  Beautiful!   E I have been called all kinds of names... my favorite: DEC Biggot  My  E 1988 Ford Ranger has a NC license plate: VAX-VMS.  I remember at the  A time the forward slash was not available so I had to go with the  E hyphen.  To the left of the plate I had an official dec block letter  E bumper sticker.  It's mostly gone, but I'm known for the plate.  (In  G fact, my fiance just bought a new car.  Everyone's first question was:  1 Where is the truck?  Where is the license plate?)   F My company has made the move from VMS to unix and all various related D products.  It just kills me when I hear someone get excited about a F unix cluster - or worse, how much better unix scripting is.  Please!  C I'm so ready for a VMS job again here in Charlotte (see my earlier  B post.)  If ANYONE has work they need done from Charlotte on a VMS  system - email me!  B Yes, I can imagine OpenVMS/PPC platforms.  New I/O bulkheads with H FireWire ports and the like.  Mix-and-match GROWABLE machines that have H NO DOWNTIME.  MacClusters...  Applications like iPhoto for OpenVMS/PPC. C  MacWindows and DECWindows on the same display.  All the wonderful  > 2-5-2 part numbers and model numbers....  "I'd like a PPC Mac G (AA-PPCAA-A1) or an Alpha Mac (BA-AXPAA-A1) with OpenVMS unlimited use  A license (AA-001AA-AA).  I want to plug in a FireWire card for 16  = devices (model FW01-AA).  Also need a MacServer 200 and some   VT-MAC-2000's.  H Ahhhhhhhh.  Dreams are wonderful.  I say we bring DEC from the dead and  go see Steve Jobs in CA.  B Seriously, I'm hurting for VMS work.  This unix mess..... (Yes, I ! realize the Mac runs OS X - unix)    Jeff  C PS - Sorry for the long rant.  I can't help myself on these topics.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 21:39:28 -0000 1 From: wspencer@ap.dontspamme.org (Warren Spencer) 5 Subject: BM benchmark leaves server rivals breathless 1 Message-ID: <95A5AC486wspenceraporg@216.168.3.30>   9 Looks like Itanium is eating dust (yet again?).  Um, wow:   ; http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/11/18/ibm_shatterrs_tpcc/    ws   --   Warren Spencer Senior Software Engineer The Associated Press   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 17:16:29 -0500 # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> 9 Subject: Re: BM benchmark leaves server rivals breathless , Message-ID: <XeOdnUoea5ujggDcRVn-2Q@igs.net>   Warren Spencer wrote: ; > Looks like Itanium is eating dust (yet again?).  Um, wow:  > = > http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/11/18/ibm_shatterrs_tpcc/   H Guess it's time for intel to ship the dual-core EV8..er, um...Itanium 3.  @ Wouldda been on the market round about now too if not for curly.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 19:51:51 GMT 3 From: hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond) % Subject: Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! 2 Message-ID: <r37nd.3163$Xp4.1741@news.cpqcorp.net>  : In article <00A3B0E7.9C61712D@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman-   @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:   J >'Tis my understanding that Mr. Einstein's theories state that any assump-J >tion that time is consistent for all observers it not true.  I do not be-: >lieve that his theories show that time varies negatively.  K I'm not a theoretical physicist -- I don't even play one on the InterNet -- B but my layman's understanding is that the equations which describeG relativety have solutions that include negative delta time.  This could C be interprted as showing that movement it time is no different than A movement in space -- i.e. both "forward" and "backward" motion is  allowed.   --  J       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale  FL  USAF           (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 21:59:14 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG% Subject: Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! 0 Message-ID: <00A3B118.73EFF71C@SendSpamHere.ORG>  h In article <r37nd.3163$Xp4.1741@news.cpqcorp.net>, hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond) writes:; >In article <00A3B0E7.9C61712D@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman-    >@SendSpamHere.ORG writes: > K >>'Tis my understanding that Mr. Einstein's theories state that any assump- K >>tion that time is consistent for all observers it not true.  I do not be- ; >>lieve that his theories show that time varies negatively.  > L >I'm not a theoretical physicist -- I don't even play one on the InterNet --C >but my layman's understanding is that the equations which describe H >relativety have solutions that include negative delta time.  This couldD >be interprted as showing that movement it time is no different thanB >movement in space -- i.e. both "forward" and "backward" motion is	 >allowed.   G I'm reviewing my books Morse & Feshbach, Stratton, Arfken and Bergmann.    --  < http://www.ProvN.com  for the *best* OpenVMS system security=                       solutions that others only claim to be.  --  , Cyber-Terrorism (si'-ber tayr'-or-iz-em) n.:M   The release of, the sale of, or the use of any Micro$oft software product!   --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 23:15:18 +0100 3 From: Michael Unger <spam.to.unger@spamgourmet.com> % Subject: Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! + Message-ID: <304lfjF2sedggU1@uni-berlin.de>   - On 2004-11-18 16:35, "Charlie Hammond" wrote:   / > In article <419CAAA8.434D90D5@teksavvy.com>,  1 > JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:  > L >>DECW$CLOCK seem's to be programmed to only update its display when the new; >>time is greater than the time displayed on the screen....  > & > Short answer: Live with it.  <smile> > I > Longer anwser:  There are many places where OpenVMS and layerd products F > (such as DECwindows) running on OpenVMS display results based on the< > underlying assumption that time moves only forward.  [...]4   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ >  > [...]   # What about "Daylight Savings Time"?    Michael    --  ; Real names enhance the probability of getting real answers. 5 My e-mail account at DECUS Munich is no longer valid.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 18:04:51 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> % Subject: Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! , Message-ID: <419D2A92.B73F10A2@teksavvy.com>  ! VAXman-, @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: K > 'Tis my understanding that Mr. Einstein's theories state that any assump- K > tion that time is consistent for all observers it not true.  I do not be- ; > lieve that his theories show that time varies negatively.   = It does every year in most parts of the world, by one hour...    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 18:11:58 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> % Subject: Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! , Message-ID: <419D2C3C.49387318@teksavvy.com>   Michael Unger wrote:> > > underlying assumption that time moves only forward.  [...]6 >   ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > 	 > > [...]  > % > What about "Daylight Savings Time"?     M And what about all those times when Captains Kirk, Picard, Janeway and Archer 2 took the wrong turn and ended up in the past ? :-)   ------------------------------    Date: 18 Nov 2004 17:40:50 -0800- From: elementyl@hotmail.com (James Wilkinson) % Subject: Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! = Message-ID: <e2ac4c66.0411181740.43f9fc7b@posting.google.com>    Charlie Hammond wrote:/ > In article <419CAAA8.434D90D5@teksavvy.com>,  1 > JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:  > M > >DECW$CLOCK seem's to be programmed to only update its display when the new < > >time is greater than the time displayed on the screen.... > & > Short answer: Live with it.  <smile> > G > In most cases, I think that the results you see are ultimately caused H > by the way which the system service, $SETIMER works.  A future time isH > passed to $SETIMER, and an AST is delivered when that time is reached.I > If time is set back before that time is reached, the timer continues to . > wait until the time it was given is reached.  D No, I looked at this recently and this is not a problem with the wayE that $SETIMR itself is called.  This causes a big problem with one of C our X apps on DST fallback.  I have checked the timer queue and the F timer is properly a delta timer rather than an absolute timer, howeverA when it expires it then creates another delta timer that seems to  compensate for the time change.   F This seems to be a consequence of calling XtAppAddTimeOut, which seemsB to re-issue an "adjusted" delta timer on the caller's behalf (gee,. thanks) when the original delta timer expires.  8 Here is a small program which demonstrates this problem:   ---test.c---   #include <stdio.h>   #include <Xm/Xm.h> #include <Xm/Label.h>    XtAppContext app;  Widget top;    int counter = 0;  D static void TherapyTimer ( XtPointer client_data, XtIntervalId *id ) {        /* Send a message ... */C     fprintf ( stderr, "...Message...%d...\n", counter++ ); fflush ( 	 stderr );   5     /* Make sure this function is called again ... */ 7     XtAppAddTimeOut ( app, 10000, TherapyTimer, NULL );    }   " void main (int argc, char **argv ) {   #     /* Create user interface ... */ F     top = XtAppInitialize ( &app, "TimeTest", 0, 0, &argc, argv, 0, 0, 0 );E     XtCreateManagedWidget ( "label", xmLabelWidgetClass, top, 0, 0 );      XtRealizeWidget ( top );  5     /* Make sure this function is called again ... */ C     XtAppAddTimeOut ( app, 10000, TherapyTimer, (XtPointer) NULL );        /* Xt event loop ... */      XtAppMainLoop ( app );   }    --- end test.c---   E Just build and run this, then set the time back to see this behavior.    James    ------------------------------    Date: 18 Nov 2004 20:11:42 -0800. From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman)% Subject: Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! = Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0411182011.3ae5e45c@posting.google.com>   m hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond) wrote in message news:<r37nd.3163$Xp4.1741@news.cpqcorp.net>... < > In article <00A3B0E7.9C61712D@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman-   > @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:  > L > >'Tis my understanding that Mr. Einstein's theories state that any assump-L > >tion that time is consistent for all observers it not true.  I do not be-< > >lieve that his theories show that time varies negatively.  F Correct, but I'd put it that different observers in different inertialC reference frames will, in general, come up with different delta-T's B for the same event. But these effects are completely negligible atD ordinary speeds. Even at half the speed of light, the "gamma factor"D is only 1.15, meaning that if it takes 10 min. to smoke a cigarette,D someone whizzing by at half the speed of light will see it take 11.5E minutes. At 1/10 the speed of light, the gamma factor is already down D to 1.01. At normal terrestrial speeds it factor is for all practical" purposes indistinguishable from 1.  M > I'm not a theoretical physicist -- I don't even play one on the InterNet -- D > but my layman's understanding is that the equations which describeI > relativety have solutions that include negative delta time.  This could E > be interprted as showing that movement it time is no different than C > movement in space -- i.e. both "forward" and "backward" motion is 
 > allowed.  < Nope. The laws of physics do not allow for time reversal for8 macroscopic events. It is forbidden by the Second Law of Thermodynamics.   E On a microscopic scale it is a much more involved story. For the vast C majority of particle reactions, time is "reversible". Not that that F means that time goes backwards in such reactions -- it only means thatD one cannot distinguish between whether a "film" of such reactions isC being run forwards or backwards in time. If you watched such a film C run in either direction, you would see no violations of the laws of F physics. You would not be able to tell which was forward and which wasD backward. This, of course, doesn't hold true on a macrosopics scale.> If we film an egg being dropped on the floor, and run the film& backwards, we know something is wrong.  ? In any event, I am not aware of any law of physics that forbids # setting a clock to an earlier time!   D Bonus comment: The Seinfeld Principle of Space-Time Assymetry: (fromD his book) You can measure distance by time: "How far is that place?"F "About 20 minutes." But it doesn't work the other way around: "When do$ you get off work?" "Around 3 miles."   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 00:37:56 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> % Subject: Re: DECW$CLOCK design flaw ! , Message-ID: <419D869C.FDF561A1@teksavvy.com>   "Alan E. Feldman" wrote:> > Nope. The laws of physics do not allow for time reversal for: > macroscopic events. It is forbidden by the Second Law of > Thermodynamics.   M Laws were made to be broken. And there is no police to enforce those laws :-)   H > physics. You would not be able to tell which was forward and which wasF > backward. This, of course, doesn't hold true on a macrosopics scale.@ > If we film an egg being dropped on the floor, and run the film( > backwards, we know something is wrong.  L However, there was a british documentary series called "Red Dwarf" when theyK landed on a planet where people lived backwards. They filled an empty glass N with beer coming out of their mouth, then handed the bartender a full glass ofN beer and the bartender then forced them to accept money - a newspaper headlineR had "bankrobbers will force bank teller to accept X thousands of pounds tomorrow".  < On that planet, bicycles rode backwards, as did cars/trucks.  E So it is pretty arrogant for humans to assume that time runs forwards N everywhere in this and any other universes :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 20:22:35 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>C Subject: Re: Extending DCL [was: Re: DCL suggestion for f$verify()] + Message-ID: <419D58EB.C56E8F68@comcast.net>    John Vottero wrote:  > [snip] > I want to be able toE > add qualifiers that can be applied to commands that I didn't write.   D Well, some things can be done by "jacketing" the target program withD another that sets up the environment befor transferring control. ForE others, you can try to provide an extended RTL or some other hackery.   A Beyond that, you'll have to find a way to make Alpha (and, later, 5 Itanic) images patchable so you can add code to them.   ; ...or write a *REALLY* *GOOD* image-to-Macro/32 translator.    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 20:37:17 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>C Subject: Re: Extending DCL [was: Re: DCL suggestion for f$verify()] + Message-ID: <419D5C5C.3BEEE934@comcast.net>    John Vottero wrote:  > J > "Bob Koehler" <koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org> wrote in message/ > news:YOsppH214McM@eisner.encompasserve.org... M > > In article <eVNmd.167$iU3.154@newssvr31.news.prodigy.com>, "John Vottero"  > > <John@mvpsi.com> writes: > >>& > >> $ filelist = DIR/MODI/SINCE=TODAY > > : > >   Ugh.  Man, you're getting to much like eunichs here. > > G > >   Looping over f$search and f$file_attributes will do this for you.  >  > Ok, but how about: >  > $ filelist = SEARCH *.C XYZ  > F > The point is, if commands return objects instead of text, you can do > interesting things.    Here's my approach to that:   
 Lprocess.COM:   
 $ SET NOON $READ_PIPE:  $ READ/END=EOF_PIPE SYS$PIPE P9  $! Do something with P9  $ GOTO READ_PIPE
 $EOF_PIPE: $ EXIT  
 ...then...  ! $ PIPE SEARCH *.C XYZ | @Lprocess   E For example, here's a particularly dangerous little piece of code (if - you don't have privileges, it's not too bad):   
 LPROC.COM:  
 $ SET NOON( $ IF P2 .EQS. "" THEN P2 := SHOW PROCESS $READ_PIPE:  $ READ/END=EOF_PIPE SYS$PIPE P9 2 $ PID = F$ELEM( 0, ",", F$EDIT( P9, "COMPRESS" ) ) $ 'P2'/IDENT='PID' $ GOTO READ_PIPE
 $EOF_PIPE: $ EXIT  $ ...which can be implemented like so:  + $ PIPE SHOW SYSTEM/PROC=SYMBIONT_* | @LPROC   B That's from a recent bout with hundreds of orphaned print symbiontH processes due to the activities of a rogue user. (Used up MAXPROCESSCNT;E batch queues stopped, users were locked out (no process slots). Turns 9 out its a known issue with the PSM$ routines in the RTL.)   G Suggests some interesting possibilities, if you can open your mind to a  different approach.    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 20:55:11 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>C Subject: Re: Extending DCL [was: Re: DCL suggestion for f$verify()] + Message-ID: <419D608E.8C55190A@comcast.net>    Martin Vorlaender wrote: > & > John Vottero <John@mvpsi.com> wrote:G > > It looks like Microsoft realizes that a command line environment is  > > important. > A > I think they realized the need for a good scripting environment F > earlier. IIRC, they payed a company named HIP Communications to portD > Perl to Win32. It was delivered as part of the WinNT Resource Kit.C > HIP later was renamed to ActiveState, and ActiveState Perl now is  > _the_ Win32 Perl port.   Found this URL by way of Yahoo!   / http://www.activestate.com/Products/ActivePerl/    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 14:13:45 -0500 & From: Jilly <jilly@clarityconnect.com>P Subject: Re: Getting to know what subprocess is the parent of another subprocess8 Message-ID: <1100805188.ZzsIUONxwn9C0vz6zCRCNw@teranews>   ANA/SYS & SHOW PROCESS/IND={pid of a subprocess}D Process index: 002D   Name: SYSTEM_44         Extended PID: 000026ADD -------------------------------------------------------------------- .  . F Master internal PID      00010021    Subprocess count                0F Creator extended PID     00000061    Creator internal PID     00010021 .   L This tells me that process with PID of 26AD is a subprocess of process whoseH PID is 61 and that 61 is also the process at the top of the job tree andE since this process has a Subprocess count of 0 it has no subprocesses  itself.    Jilly    Syltrem wrote:   > Given: > $ sh proc/subp/id=0000021E >   EDICOM_DET_52 (*)  >     EDIMGR_1 >       PostRecvIRM3146  >     EDIMGR_2 >       MainRecvSIQ3147  > I > How does the SHOW command know that SUBprocess EDIMGR_2 is the one that & > spawned SUBprocess MainRecvSIQ3147 ? > L > It appears to me that it knows, because it does the correct indentation in > the display. > 
 > Thanks ! >    --  B Jilly - Working from Home in the Chemung River Valley, Waverly, NYB       - jilly@clarityconnect.com         http://www.jilly.baka.comE       - mark.jilson@hp.com               http://www.hp.com/go/openvms ;       - http://www.jilsonracing.com      Go Fast, Turn Left C       - http://www.chemungspeedrome.com  Door Handle to Door Handle    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 21:46:27 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>P Subject: Re: Getting to know what subprocess is the parent of another subprocess+ Message-ID: <419D6C93.9A94E362@comcast.net>    Syltrem wrote: >  > Given: > $ sh proc/subp/id=0000021E >   EDICOM_DET_52 (*)  >     EDIMGR_1 >       PostRecvIRM3146  >     EDIMGR_2 >       MainRecvSIQ3147  > I > How does the SHOW command know that SUBprocess EDIMGR_2 is the one that & > spawned SUBprocess MainRecvSIQ3147 ? > L > It appears to me that it knows, because it does the correct indentation in > the display.  H See if the CREATOR keyword for F$GETJPI() is documented for your version of VMS.    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    ------------------------------    Date: 18 Nov 2004 20:57:23 -0800  From: "Barry" <dysert@gmail.com>P Subject: Re: Getting to know what subprocess is the parent of another subprocessC Message-ID: <1100840242.974697.194730@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>   F I'm not sure how SHOW knows (though I could certainly take an educatedG guess), if *you* want to know a subprocess's parent, I think there's an G item code to F$GETJPI that's called MASTER_PID or something.  Do a Help D on LEX F$GETJPI and I'm sure it will jump out at you (maybe it's notE master you're looking for, but you'll be able to find it).  Sorry I'm + not a VAX right now or I'd be more helpful.    ------------------------------    Date: 18 Nov 2004 16:29:48 -0800) From: "Sarkunarajah S" <ngroup@gmail.com> J Subject: Re: How do I attach zip csv and other binary files from Vms mail?C Message-ID: <1100824188.516270.233100@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>    hi, 2 You could check an earlier post to this newsgroup. http://groups.google.com.my/groups?q=Sending+RFC+based+Mail+with+MC+MIME&hl=en&lr=&selm=8GX8c.9367%24wg1.8841%40edtnps84&rnum=1   C If for any reason the URL breaks, you could search comp.os.vms for: % "Sending RFC based Mail with MC MIME"    thanks...sarkunarajah s    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 21:45:17 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>J Subject: Re: How do I attach zip csv and other binary files from Vms mail?+ Message-ID: <419D6C4D.8A238251@comcast.net>    "Stewart, Bill" wrote: > N >         We have an OpenVMS cluster running version 7.3-2 Alpha.  What is theN > procedure to send attachments from OpenVMS through our PMDF system in such aM > way that they will show up as attachments when the mail gets to an exchange 	 > server?   " We use UUENCODE with good success.   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    ------------------------------    Date: 18 Nov 2004 20:50:57 -0800  From: "Barry" <dysert@gmail.com>J Subject: Re: How do I attach zip csv and other binary files from Vms mail?C Message-ID: <1100839857.035475.149700@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>   + If memory serves, there's also MAIL/FOREIGN    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 14:59:33 -0500 5 From: "rob kas" <droprob@nospam-paychoice.com-nospam>  Subject: Itanium vs Power50 Message-ID: <10ppvsviff9pkf7@corp.supernews.com>  I     Wonder if Terry is gonna change his mind that Power5 isn't ready for  
 Primetime.  @      http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/11/18/ibm_shatterrs_tpcc/    8                                                     Rob    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 19:46:33 GMT & From: Lee Mah <lytmah@telusplanet.net>= Subject: Re: Looking for feedback on using EDM to back up VMS - Message-ID: <t_6nd.188266$9b.126902@edtnps84>   , This is a multi-part message in MIME format.& --------------0505000904050905030201049 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed  Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   F I think we've gone off course on my post.  What I want is information  from VMSI users who have replaced their VMS BACKUP procedures (of files and images) J with an EDM solution.  Who knows?  Maybe there are none and I'll be on the bleeding edge.. How functional and reliable is the EDM system?7 Ease of restoring individual files and images from EDM? F I've got 80 shadow sets to back up.  I'm currently using VMS BACKUP toG save images and files.  Regardless of which mode the data was saved in, E I can recover files quite easily, even from the DLT at a remote site. I Each node has a local backup of the system disk and will also have a SAN   backupG with separate FC paths.  In fact, we booted off the SAN backup with no  	 problems. * So node and cluster uptime are not issues.     David J Dachtera wrote:    >David Froble wrote: >    >  >>Lee wrote: >> >>     >>? >>>Rob is almost correct.  We'll eventually put the 4-node ES45 A >>>cluster on a GS1280 cluster.  The ES45 cluster is still on HSJ 3 >>>but will be migrating to foreign SAN eventually. < >>>I've set up 8 foreign SAN shadow disks on a second GS12801 >>>cluster for running a third-party application. ? >>>The plan is to drop our current DLT tape systems and use EDM A >>>for backup.  Hence my quest for information on the EDM backup.  >>> < >>>Our 3-site, 5-node cluster remains running as long as any2 >>>combination of two sites AND 3 nodes remain up.	 >>>        >>> Q >>David seems to be worried about restoring from scratch.  There is a real simple  >>solution for that. >>M >>Assuming that you're running your system off the SAN, HSJ, or whatever, ...  >>     >> > @ >...and if the SAN, CI, etc. and the building within which it is  >contained gets destroyed, ... ? > ! >Keyphrase: "Business Continuity"  >  >    >   & --------------050500090405090503020104) Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii  Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit   ? <!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN">  <html> <head>I   <meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html;charset=ISO-8859-1">    <title></title>  </head> ' <body text="#000000" bgcolor="#ffffff"> J I think we've gone off course on my post.&nbsp; What I want is information from VMS<br>A users who have replaced their VMS BACKUP procedures (of files and  images)<br> P with an EDM solution.&nbsp; Who knows?&nbsp; Maybe there are none and I'll be on the<br>  bleeding edge.<br>2 How functional and reliable is the EDM system?<br>; Ease of restoring individual files and images from EDM?<br> O I've got 80 shadow sets to back up.&nbsp; I'm currently using VMS BACKUP to<br> P save images and files.&nbsp; Regardless of which mode the data was saved in,<br>I I can recover files quite easily, even from the DLT at a remote site.<br> D Each node has a local backup of the system disk and will also have a SAN backup<br>K with separate FC paths.&nbsp; In fact, we booted off the SAN backup with no 
 problems.<br> . So node and cluster uptime are not issues.<br> <br> <br> David J Dachtera wrote:<br> @ <blockquote type="cite" cite="mid419C0A43.196B2783@comcast.net">"   <pre wrap="">David Froble wrote:   </pre>   <blockquote type="cite">     <pre wrap="">Lee wrote:   
     </pre>     <blockquote type="cite">O       <pre wrap="">Rob is almost correct.  We'll eventually put the 4-node ES45 > cluster on a GS1280 cluster.  The ES45 cluster is still on HSJ0 but will be migrating to foreign SAN eventually.9 I've set up 8 foreign SAN shadow disks on a second GS1280 . cluster for running a third-party application.< The plan is to drop our current DLT tape systems and use EDM> for backup.  Hence my quest for information on the EDM backup.  9 Our 3-site, 5-node cluster remains running as long as any / combination of two sites AND 3 nodes remain up.        </pre>     </blockquote> `     <pre wrap="">David seems to be worried about restoring from scratch.  There is a real simple solution for that.  K Assuming that you're running your system off the SAN, HSJ, or whatever, ... 
     </pre>   </blockquote>    <pre wrap=""><!---->? ...and if the SAN, CI, etc. and the building within which it is  contained gets destroyed, ... ?     Keyphrase: "Business Continuity"     </pre>
 </blockquote>  </body>  </html>   ( --------------050500090405090503020104--   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 18:52:43 -0000 1 From: wspencer@ap.dontspamme.org (Warren Spencer) B Subject: Re: Microsoft to skip Itanium with supercomputing Windows1 Message-ID: <95A587839wspenceraporg@216.168.3.30>   @ david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk wrote in <cmr0qc$1s5$1@news.mdx.ac.uk>:  : >In article <fMydnSiwKLEXZg3cRVn-ig@igs.net>, "John Smith"A >Of course. But all we can do is point out the fact that the term G >clustering has these multiple meanings and if their requirement is for I >shared access or high availability Microsoft does not have the solution.   J Bingo!  Wish you had been around to talk to some of my previous managers, G who thought that when Microsoft said "cluster", they meant the OpenVMS e kind.   K Having been exposed to other clustering technologies (like Microsoft's and vG Beowolf [the most common type of Linux cluster]), I'll happily confirm WG they're "different".  MS's cluster shares little or nothing, but their  K intent is to address availability, by failing over services to a surviving C cluster member.!  L Beowolf, on the other hand, shares nothing, and I don't think can even fail G over a service (not sure on that one).  Worse (or better, depending on  F viewpoint), Beowolf cluster members have no network connection to the K outside world - they connect only to the master node of the cluster.  This sH makes for a very efficient Compute Farm, but is essentially useless for K high-availability business apps. But the huge clusters we're hearing about rG these days to address protein folding or global weather prediction are  8 mostly about computation - so this model fits just fine.  J So there you have it - at least 3 general types of "clusters".  Shame ole = DEC didn't lock up the "cluster" term with some IP legaleese!b   ws   -- e Warren Spencer Senior Software Engineer The Associated Press   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 16:25:50 -0500 # From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>rB Subject: Re: Microsoft to skip Itanium with supercomputing Windows, Message-ID: <QuydnUqOgOjCjgDcRVn-3Q@igs.net>   Warren Spencer wrote:bB > david20@alpha1.mdx.ac.uk wrote in <cmr0qc$1s5$1@news.mdx.ac.uk>: >H< >> In article <fMydnSiwKLEXZg3cRVn-ig@igs.net>, "John Smith"C >> Of course. But all we can do is point out the fact that the termeE >> clustering has these multiple meanings and if their requirement is E >> for shared access or high availability Microsoft does not have thee >> solution. > A > Bingo!  Wish you had been around to talk to some of my previoussF > managers, who thought that when Microsoft said "cluster", they meant > the OpenVMS kind.o >d< > Having been exposed to other clustering technologies (likeC > Microsoft's and Beowolf [the most common type of Linux cluster]), G > I'll happily confirm they're "different".  MS's cluster shares little%E > or nothing, but their intent is to address availability, by failing@. > over services to a surviving cluster member. >uC > Beowolf, on the other hand, shares nothing, and I don't think canaE > even fail over a service (not sure on that one).  Worse (or better, B > depending on viewpoint), Beowolf cluster members have no networkC > connection to the outside world - they connect only to the master E > node of the cluster.  This makes for a very efficient Compute Farm, E > but is essentially useless for high-availability business apps. ButuE > the huge clusters we're hearing about these days to address protein1E > folding or global weather prediction are mostly about computation -G > so this model fits just fine.i > G > So there you have it - at least 3 general types of "clusters".  Shame C > ole DEC didn't lock up the "cluster" term with some IP legaleese!i    K Then the others would have come up with some other term which might even be/J more descriptive or convey the idea better - "Cooperative Computing" as an example.  F Or as another example  "On-Demand"  - which is a whole lot better than "Adaptive Enterprise".   ------------------------------    Date: 18 Nov 2004 14:03:43 -0800$ From: leeroth@my-deja.com (Lee Roth)5 Subject: Re: Online forums for former digits/deccies? = Message-ID: <d0e744c9.0411181403.1e194209@posting.google.com>V  K Z <z@no.spam> wrote in message news:<10po80ofee0lv3d@corp.supernews.com>...g > Lee Roth wrote:n: > > Anyone have any pointers to active forums specifically" > > aimed at former DEC employees? > > D > > One interesting site is http://www.decalumni.com/ but they don't. > > appear to have an online discussion forum. > J > Lee Roth ... geez, your name sounds familiar ... did you use Notes much?  D Sure... the 'box, digital-way-of-working, marketing, and I was admin? for a couple of others as well. If I recall correctly, I used 4m different "notes clients" while at DEC.  A I've got some old tapes somewhere with a copy of "that file" that ? was the DEC internal public list of all of the notesfiles - the @ NODE::DIRECTORY:FILENAME of where you grabbed that file is still burned into my brain...   ? "Z" eh? Do you have a homepage (that I just looked at) that hash> half a car sticking out of the wall? If so, I recall your name as well from the notesfiles!!   B I'm half afraid to create an online forum for ex-digits - it might@ smoke my webhosting company server, but I think one is certainly needed.a   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 18:47:11 -0700t4 From: "Dale E. Coy" <daleecoy@obfuscation.spinn.net>5 Subject: Re: Online forums for former digits/deccies?20 Message-ID: <10pqk571pgr4c18@corp.supernews.com>  2 "Lee Roth" <leeroth@my-deja.com> wrote in message 6 news:d0e744c9.0411161246.3563844@posting.google.com...8 > Anyone have any pointers to active forums specifically  > aimed at former DEC employees? > B > One interesting site is http://www.decalumni.com/ but they don't, > appear to have an online discussion forum. >r	 > Thanks!r  M The DECUServe system would be very willing to set up such a forum, using DEC b Notes.  K If this is of interest to you, get a (free) account on DECUServe, and then  ( send vmsmail to me (coy) on that system.   HOW TO:e  J To sign up:  just Telnet to decuserve.org, use username REGISTRATION, and  follow the bouncing ball.hI It's nice if you sign up using accurate information, and DECUServe won't 0) sell it to anybody.  Oh - there's no fee,o6 and no requirement to be a member of any organization.   Other info: L Doing that gets you a regular account on an OpenVMS system that is superbly  managed by volunteers.L You'll be able to use the DEC Notes software to ask questions (and help the  community with your answers). H DEC Notes provides an "Unseen Map" to track notes you have already read.  I DECUServe provides a reasonably full set of OpenVMS software, as well as - MultiNet and PMDF.I You get an email account that benefits from excellent inbound filtering. a& You can set up a personal web page(s).K Other things too numerous to mention, in a friendly environment.  And many c folks on DECUServe find thatJ it's beneficial to have a VMS account on "another" system to occasionally - facilitate testing on their "regular" system.m   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 20:02:43 -0000b1 From: wspencer@ap.dontspamme.org (Warren Spencer)n& Subject: Re: OT: Reality check on RFID1 Message-ID: <95A59A107wspenceraporg@216.168.3.30>   0 jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com (JF Mezei) wrote in" <4198C60D.4A368162@teksavvy.com>:   B >RFID seems to be the buzzword-du-jour these days. Everything from >Passport to vegetables. i >iE >And now, in today's news, they want to tag Viagra bottles to preventk >counterfeit drugs.o >.E >So, when the pharmacists gets his bulk bottle of viagra, how will hedF >know if the RFID chip in it is real or if it is fake if both spew outD >some random number ? Shirley counterfeiters will be able to produce8 >goods with the right labels and accompanying chip etc ? > 4 >What is so great about RFID compared to bar codes ?  K It's not so much that the number uttered by the rfid tag can be parsed and FI confirmed to be valid - it's more that your reader system can inquire on ,K the number back at the manufacturer's system, and confirm it's valid - and .D matches on product description, etc.  AND - hasn't been used before.  J This is how concert tickets work - each bar code is valid only until it's H used once - and this is confirmed by contacting the database of all bar L code numbers.  A subsequent ticket with the same number will be rejected by  the system.c   ws   -- - Warren Spencer Senior Software Engineer The Associated Press   ------------------------------    Date: 18 Nov 2004 11:41:22 -0800 From: fleckr@ccc-ctc.com (rich)a> Subject: problems with pcfns portmapper and SIMH VAX simulator= Message-ID: <890e2766.0411181141.42ac0dab@posting.google.com>a  ; We have  been testing the SIMH code to run a VAX simulator.o  F Everything seems to work except for being able to mount the VAX drives on a PC through E pcnfs. After a reboot we can scan and see the exported drives and theh RPC services' using hummingbirds remote info utility.t  E As soon as we try to mount a drive, it fails asking for a valid  usero nameB and password. Subsequent attempts return a Bad network name error.? Checking the services and exports, they disappear and the error-( message says Remote program unavailable.  E Checking the tcpip service portmapper fails.  Stopping and restartingC theC= portmapper service does not help.  Only a reboot restarts the  portmapper.1  D We have no problems mounting the drives on an IRIX system using nfs.  C The proxy,map,export and host settings  match our existing real VAX  settings# which we mount can mount on the PC.d  E The only difference I can see is in the proxy setting is for the typen/ where ONDC shows up on the real VAX and only ONt shows up on the VAX simulator.  ; Any ideas on what to look for or try would much appreciateds   Thanks in advancen   Rich   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 23:07:24 +0100e3 From: Michael Unger <spam.to.unger@spamgourmet.com>^  Subject: Re: Radeon 7500 problem+ Message-ID: <304lfhF2quimmU1@uni-berlin.de>   - On 2004-11-18 15:37, "Fred Kleinsorge" wrote:i   > [...]n > N > Something interesting to note however - my testing has shown that very oftenM > you are better off with the analog output.  Why?  A lot of code was writteniN > using normal CRT's, when you get a true clean digital-to-digital signal I'veL > seen many instances where "smooth" shading (for example) shows interestingJ > artifacts and the shading isn't as smooth as the programmer thought ;-).  D "In theory there is no difference between theory and practice but in practice there is ..." :-)   Michaelt   -- e; Real names enhance the probability of getting real answers.h5 My e-mail account at DECUS Munich is no longer valid.-   ------------------------------    Date: 18 Nov 2004 11:45:11 -0800, From: JimStrehlow@data911.com (Jim Strehlow) Subject: Re: raid hardware= Message-ID: <4b6ec350.0411181145.1df96999@posting.google.com>   % sean@obanion.us (Sean O'Banion) wrotey > Jim,C > What I'm using now looks like it's a lot bigger than what you are  > after. ... 8 You are correct that is larger than our current servers.  > That will be useful for a new customer who can afford a largerC configuration. We now know more about the EVA series and options to-	 consider.-  % Thank you for sharing with the group.    Jim, Alameda, CA, USAo   ------------------------------    Date: 18 Nov 2004 22:04:49 -0800% From: sean@obanion.us (Sean O'Banion)n Subject: Re: raid hardware= Message-ID: <dffe4465.0411182204.2ba2b02c@posting.google.com>   E The point I was tying to make about needing the SAN Appliance runningmD is that even if you use SSSU, if the SAN Appliance, or Command View,) is not running, SSSU does not run either.c     Sean  ] "Marty O'Connor" <moconnor@dvfs.com> wrote in message news:<304875F2rb9vnU1@uni-berlin.de>... 4 > "Sean O'Banion" <sean@obanion.us> wrote in message9 > news:dffe4465.0411171741.453e5156@posting.google.com...T > : > : There is also a command line utility (SSSU) for hosts,@ > : including VMS, that replicates Command View's functionality. > : J > : Note that this means without the SAN Appliance, no changes can be made > : to the EVA.  > d > Not totally true. You can do most (if not all) configuration work on the EVA using SSSU. This is a] > very painful way to do it if typing everything in manually. I use the SSSU command "capturehd > configuration" every night to snap shot the configuration. Using this output as a starting point Ie > have made procedures to create/delete snap clones, added/delete disks, etc. This allows stuff to bes( > built into batch jobs to run whenever. >  > Marty O'Connor   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 19:44:15 -0000 1 From: wspencer@ap.dontspamme.org (Warren Spencer).: Subject: Re: reporter inquiry: Is HP selling AlphaServers?1 Message-ID: <95A59E3E3wspenceraporg@216.168.3.30>   D smoke11@yahoo.com (smoke11) wrote in <Lg3nd.6841$qS4.1892@trnddc09>:   >Looking into Alpha sales .... > I >-- Is anyone having trouble buying them from HP? Are HP AlphaServer repsf1 >available? Is HP trying to selling AlphaServers?i >iG >-- Anyone surprised by revenue decline on AlphaServers? (Why buy new?)U >)! >-- OpenVMS implications, if any?a >* >Patrick Thibodeau >Senior Editor >Computerworld$ >patrick_thibodeau@computerworld.com  L ComputerWorld is visiting us in comp.os.vms?  Welcome!  We sure appreciated @ ComputerWorld's recent OpenVMS article.  Keep up the great work!   ws   -- e Warren Spencer Senior Software Engineer The Associated Press   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 20:01:50 GMT*# From: "smoke11" <smoke11@yahoo.com> : Subject: Re: reporter inquiry: Is HP selling AlphaServers?* Message-ID: <Oc7nd.6665$J55.3908@trnddc06>  F Just a follow...regarding my yahoo email. That's how my news reader isK configured. I can also be reached via www.computerworld.com homepage, wherefC you will find an email link to my name. Please look under contacts.   . "smoke11" <smoke11@yahoo.com> wrote in message$ news:Lg3nd.6841$qS4.1892@trnddc09... > Looking into Alpha sales ....a >cJ > -- Is anyone having trouble buying them from HP? Are HP AlphaServer reps2 > available? Is HP trying to selling AlphaServers? >tH > -- Anyone surprised by revenue decline on AlphaServers? (Why buy new?) >v" > -- OpenVMS implications, if any? >e > Patrick Thibodeauo > Senior Editors > Computerworldo% > patrick_thibodeau@computerworld.coms >e >i >i   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 18:02:40 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>t: Subject: Re: reporter inquiry: Is HP selling AlphaServers?, Message-ID: <419D2A0F.AB129B2B@teksavvy.com>   smoke11 wrote:H > -- Anyone surprised by revenue decline on AlphaServers? (Why buy new?)  G The surprise is that Alpha sales have surpassed IA64 sales for so long,iM considering Alpha was killed on June 25 2001, not been marketed and HP tryingt to push its IA64 things.  @ Also remember that HP killed Tru64 (DEC Unix) in September 2001.  N Since that time, the VMS marketplace has essentially been on hold, awaiting toI see what happens. HP refused to divulge VMS' fate betwene the time of theiL merger announcement (Sept 2001) and the actual merger on May 7th 2002, while2 the fate of all other products had been announced.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 21:22:37 -0600h2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>: Subject: Re: reporter inquiry: Is HP selling AlphaServers?+ Message-ID: <419D66FD.A71B7A37@comcast.net>    David Froble wrote:  >  > smoke11 wrote: > ! > > Looking into Alpha sales ....  > >rL > > -- Is anyone having trouble buying them from HP? Are HP AlphaServer reps4 > > available? Is HP trying to selling AlphaServers? > >"J > > -- Anyone surprised by revenue decline on AlphaServers? (Why buy new?) > >e$ > > -- OpenVMS implications, if any? > >u > > Patrick Thibodeaus > > Senior Editorh > > Computerworldt' > > patrick_thibodeau@computerworld.comi > >s > >k > >  > >  > G > If you want conspiracy theories, you've come to the right place.  :-)   5 ...or for user perceptions, they abound here as well.w   -- i David J Dachtera dba DJE Systemsn http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:a" http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/i  " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/e   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 21:44:12 -0600s2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>: Subject: Re: reporter inquiry: Is HP selling AlphaServers?+ Message-ID: <419D6C0C.E717D11F@comcast.net>n   smoke11 wrote: >  > Looking into Alpha sales ....  > J > -- Is anyone having trouble buying them from HP? Are HP AlphaServer reps2 > available? Is HP trying to selling AlphaServers?  B The biggest problem is HP pushing non-VMS solutions to current VMSH customers. Most of HP's sales force has never even heard of either Alpha or VMS.b  4 New VMS customers? Forget it. HP is in total denial.  H > -- Anyone surprised by revenue decline on AlphaServers? (Why buy new?)  D Well, considering the last new Alpha chips have already been fabbed,E this is not surprising. There will only ever be used Alphas from thisaH point forward. Prospects who do actually manage to remain prospects willF be less likely to by dead technology except to preserve their existingE investment until such time (if any) as VMS on Itanic finally appears.c  F Then, of course, there's the dubious future of Itanic itself. Hardly a? day goes by without a report in the trade press of another IA64a1 abandonment by an ISV, and integrator, and so on.k  A Of course, there's always the most ubiquitous CPU on the planet -rF Intel's x86 chips, AMD's similar products, etc.; but, that would againC mean VMS and HP coming out of their tradition of denial about IA32. C Almost certain salvation for VMS, but the least likely eventuality.e  " > -- OpenVMS implications, if any?  D The two actions that VMS/HP *MUST* take to ensure the future of VMS:   1. Port to IA32t$ 2. Advertise - Advertise - Advertise  9 ...are the two actions VMS/HP are the most loath to take.a  H IA32 and it's imitators are the most ubiquitous CPUs on the planet. TensE of billions of dollars of hardware and software sales annually. VMS's  share of that market? Zero.   = Without vigorous, active marketing, including ubiquitous masstC advertising, it is very likely that the current market climate willmD spell the demise of VMS. VMS ownership's and management's continuingH refusal to go beyond "stealth marketing" makes this a virtual certainty.  D Instead of taking Micro$lop's place as the server platform of choiceD because of VMS's security and stability, VMS will fade ignominiously@ into oblivion, virtually unnoticed by the rest of the EDP world.   -- I David J Dachtera dba DJE Systemso http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:0" http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/s  " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 20:58:18 -0600a2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>. Subject: Re: RMS Files and directories Indexes+ Message-ID: <419D614A.A674F390@comcast.net>o   Bob Koehler wrote: > b > In article <419C0D62.A912ED7C@comcast.net>, David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> writes: > ) > > D'ya ever have to deal with All-in-1?n > ) >    No.  Never used it, never missed it.h  @ You're lucky. It was a MOTHER! ...but it did some useful things.   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systemsu http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:e" http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/o  " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 21:01:00 -0600n2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>+ Subject: Re: Solaris 10 - no charge for o/s + Message-ID: <419D61EC.7F8E9388@comcast.net>P   Bob Koehler wrote: > ^ > In article <419C18EA.2335F92D@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes: > > Q > > It is more complicated than that. VMS suffers from multiple diseases. Lack ofI8 > > marketing is just one. Its 1990s history is another. > D >    Remember UNIX recovered from its 1970's history.  AT&T actively, >    marketed it and still couldn't sell it.  F Before Micro$lop's time, and the proliferation of ubiquitous x86-based: machines. Today, it would just be another UN*X "also ran".   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systemst http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:a" http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/w  " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/t   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 21:14:39 -0600/2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>+ Subject: Re: Solaris 10 - no charge for o/s0+ Message-ID: <419D651F.734FE69F@comcast.net>o   John Smith wrote:R >  > David J Dachtera wrote:s
 > > [snip]D > > Well, *ALPHA* sales are down because it was killed in its prime. > >aA > > VMS sales are down due to (need I say it?) stealth marketing.o > >kI > > ...and I'm kinda disappointed you didn't offer a 30-second commercial G > > script siezing upon the opportunity to illustrate *WHY* TCO mattersaB > > and how to get the bean counters past the sticker shock of the > > cost-to-acquire. > J > Actually it's so bloody discouraging that we are giving consideration toK > abandoning VMS-based solutions altogether if only to have more consistentUB > cash flow in the business by focusing selling non-VMS solutions.  F The entire VMS field feels your pain. Some businesses died as a resultB of VMS management's stupidity. Others abandoned ship. Still others> re-birthed themselves as vednors of other products (as you areG contemplating - gotta eat and pay the bills, y'know). The few of us whow2 remain have become or returned to being employees.  L > I for one am getting extremely tired of C-level execs and those just below1 > them in positions of influence telling us that:e > # > a) they've never heard of VMS, ore > M > b) people at HP tell them that they should be using Windows or Linux, maybeD > HP-UX, orb > * > c) They don't use VMS in their shops, or > N > d) VMS is as good as dead so why don't we re-write our app to run on Solaris > or AIX or Linux, or  > H > e) they know VMS is good or better than good or even the best but that1 > they'll never be able to sell it internally, orI > N > f) Alpha is dead and IA-64 is in trouble and they aren't into buying trouble$ > (career limiting and all that), or > 1 > g) they have not seen or heard of VMS in years.c  3 I will probably post that to VMS/HP brass tomorrow.b  L > The only 'spots' I feel like writing these days are the verbatim quotes ofL > these execs shooting down VMS-based solutions out of ignorance, stupidity,L > timidity, or the fact that their offices are lined with trinkets from Sun, > Dell, IBM, and Microsoft.t  
 I hear ya.  M > Maybe some 1/2 hour late-nite 'infomercial' spots that can be had for a fewaJ > thousand bucks a week to run each night discussing HP management in thisM > regard will make me feel better. Perhaps some news agency will pick them up K > as a news story and flash it around the world - have to ask my friends atjM > Reuters & Bloomberg what they think. Or a streaming video presentation withlM > a link sent out in about 100,000 e-mails to the computing press, investment F > banking firms technology analysts, etc....   I'm feeling better just > thinking about this.     I like it, too!   8 > Maybe I'll call it "Farenheit 6/25" - How to Hand Your! > Customers to Your Competitors".e  G ...or, "How to Destroy A Profitable Business ... Without Really Trying"y  D > As we all know - it isn't the product that's the problem, it's theM > management.   HP seems to prefer that the ISV's push on a rope or piss inton9 > the wind before they will lift a finger to promote VMS.p  ! That's why I think its up to us. p  A Perhaps as this winter goes on I will develop a new section of myoC website dedicated to starting up a new entity to market OpenVMS and F related hardware and software. Beats me how the hell it could be done,D but I think many businesses started out not knowing how to get thereC until they started on their way, picking up bits and pieces as they.D went. Maybe its as simple as "watch what the 'big boys' do, and thenH don't do it", since "their way" seems to lead only to the destruction of< valuable, profitable products, due to actions taken based on: bad/incomplete/biased information obtained at great price.   -- u David J Dachtera dba DJE Systemsp http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:7" http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/t  " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/s   ------------------------------    Date: 18 Nov 2004 15:40:00 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)j Subject: Re: ssh set password 3 Message-ID: <dWPZfHv6KQtw@eisner.encompasserve.org>   | In article <pan.2004.11.18.15.03.31.225780@NeOmSaPiAlM.arizona.edu>, Todd Merritt <tmerritt@NeOmSaPiAlM.arizona.edu> writes:= > On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 20:24:23 -0600, David J Dachtera wrote:H >  >> Todd Merritt wrote: >>> M >>> I'm not vms guru, so hopefully somebody here can help me out.  I'm tryingoM >>> to write a perl script to change my password on a vms box.  The script istN >>> run from a unix box and connects to the vms box via ssh and I was planningC >>> on scripting the "set password" exchange, but I connect and seeh >>> $set verify 
 >>> $set noonm >>> H >>> and where I would expect to see the set password I'm sending and theM >>> ensuing dialog I get nothing.  Is there something I should be looking for N >>> here ?  Is there something special about "set"  that is preventing it fromM >>> running ?  I tried replacing it with just dir and that works as expected.c >> tK >> Without clearer information about what you're up to, I'd have to suggestnF >> implementing an authentication scheme that allows this, rather than! >> trying to hack it up this way.m > G > I'm not sure what you mean.  My problem isn't with authenticating, my = > problem is getting the VMS side to let me run set password.   B Setting the password by calling $ACM on the current version of VMS will accomplish the same thing.r   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 18 Nov 2004 18:46:47 -0500M8 From: "Andrew" <andrew@dont.spam.leathalproductions.com>A Subject: Re: this newsgroup heavily trolled by gay Darrell Larose-7 Message-ID: <Ivand.14422$UO4.735@fe04.usenetserver.com>-  
 Nomen Nescio,y  K Why do you have to hide behind a fake email address, are you afraid people eK here will find out where you live and go to your home to find out that you uG are still living with mommy and daddy, or that you are one of the most - wanted kiddy porn dealers?   Regards, Andrew    3 "Nomen Nescio" <nobody@dizum.com> wrote in message -2 news:4e1f16935b857e4c69fad7f8df9be405@dizum.com...C > Darrell Larose <cota348@rogers.com> masturbated while fantasizinga  > about JF Mezei and ejaculated: >f >>4 >>"Nomen Nescio" <nobody@dizum.com> wrote in message4 >>news:b2cbaabfa66fb5294289c9101525431e@dizum.com... >>> ' >>TROLLS again, and again... ad nauseum- >-C > Poor Darrell Larose ... still in love with JF Mezei even after JFaG > rejected him and scolded him and humiliated him publically ... LOL!!!M >  > Poor gay Darrell.....  >6 > Darrell Larose > 121 Northwestern Ave > Ottawa, ON K1Y 0M1 > (613) 725-0245 > cota348@rogers.com > ad607@FreeNet.Carleton.CA  >    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 06:17:37 GMT & From: Ben Peres <benperes@serepneb.ca>A Subject: Re: this newsgroup heavily trolled by gay Darrell Larosee- Message-ID: <5egnd.168078$df2.67379@edtnps89>g  
 Andrew wrote:  > Nomen Nescio,o > M > Why do you have to hide behind a fake email address, are you afraid people lM > here will find out where you live and go to your home to find out that you MI > are still living with mommy and daddy, or that you are one of the most   > wanted kiddy porn dealers? > 
 > Regards, > Andrew >  > 5 > "Nomen Nescio" <nobody@dizum.com> wrote in message h4 > news:4e1f16935b857e4c69fad7f8df9be405@dizum.com... > C >>Darrell Larose <cota348@rogers.com> masturbated while fantasizingp  >>about JF Mezei and ejaculated: >> >>5 >>>"Nomen Nescio" <nobody@dizum.com> wrote in messagee5 >>>news:b2cbaabfa66fb5294289c9101525431e@dizum.com...o >>>r( >>>TROLLS again, and again... ad nauseum >>C >>Poor Darrell Larose ... still in love with JF Mezei even after JFcG >>rejected him and scolded him and humiliated him publically ... LOL!!!l >> >>Poor gay Darrell.....  >> >>Darrell Larose >>121 Northwestern Ave >>Ottawa, ON K1Y 0M1 >>(613) 725-0245 >>cota348@rogers.com >>ad607@FreeNet.Carleton.CAa >> >  >  >  >   B As I have said he has made unsubstatiated allegations in accusing 3 someone he doesn't even know of molesting children.,  ) Of course such things can get you killed.y   Benm   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2004.642 ************************d about restoring from scratch.  There is a real simple  >>solution for that. >>M >>Assuming that you're running your system off the SAN, HSJ, or whatever, ...  >>     >> > @ >...and if the SAN, CI, etc. and the building within which it is  >contained gets destroyed, ... ? > ! >Keyphrase: "Business Continuity"  >  >    >   & --------------050500090405090503020104) Content-Type: text/html; charset=us-ascii  Conten7]`UE>4iu|\Q̓	l1V~|LdWd3#d;~|Z
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