1 INFO-VAX	Sat, 04 Sep 2004	Volume 2004 : Issue 490       Contents:! RE: A whopping 50 percent...  ??? ( Re: Big IA64 test coming in a few months cluster problems (again) Re: cluster problems (again) Re: cluster tunning  Re: cluster tunning  Re: cluster tunning  Re: cluster tunning  Re: cluster tunning  Definition for SOR$GK_* ?  Re: Definition for SOR$GK_* ?  Re: Definition for SOR$GK_* ?  Re: Definition for SOR$GK_* ?  Re: Definition for SOR$GK_* ?  EV8 advertised by accident Re: EV8 advertised by accident Re: EV8 advertised by accident Re: EV8 advertised by accident Re: EV8 advertised by accident EV8 advertised by accident RE: EV8 advertised by accident Re: EV8 advertised by accident RE: EV8 advertised by accident Re: Flat panel VT replacement? Re: Future of Decnet Hackers' OS Preferences  HSG80 cache batteries  Re: HSG80 cache batteries < Re: Itanic Adoption Survey from 23-August-2004 Computerworld< Re: Itanic Adoption Survey from 23-August-2004 Computerworld< Re: Itanic Adoption Survey from 23-August-2004 Computerworld< Re: Itanic Adoption Survey from 23-August-2004 Computerworld< Re: Itanic Adoption Survey from 23-August-2004 Computerworld< Re: Itanic Adoption Survey from 23-August-2004 Computerworld" Re: Itanium: EFI... no fs0: device( RE: Planned port of freeware to Itanium?' Re: tcpdump does not produce any output ' Re: tcpdump does not produce any output - Tomcat on OpenVMS - Is source code available? 1 Re: Tomcat on OpenVMS - Is source code available? 1 Re: Tomcat on OpenVMS - Is source code available? 1 Re: Tomcat on OpenVMS - Is source code available? 1 Re: VMS website problem: DCPS release notes blank 1 Re: VMS website problem: DCPS release notes blank  Re: Yet Another Multia Question   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------   Date: 3 Sep 2004 13:10:54 -0500 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) * Subject: RE: A whopping 50 percent...  ???3 Message-ID: <qbuutExQVDCY@eisner.encompasserve.org>   _ In article <NDEMLKKEBOIFBMJLCECIKEPGDLAA.tom@kednos.com>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes:  > K > What about Fortran, Cobol, Pascal, Basic, PL/I which at the time probably 6 > accounted for well over 90% of the code base on VMS.  H    Mine all assumed 32 b integers, or were blessedly ignorant of integer    size.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 04 Sep 2004 01:47:39 +0800 , From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com>1 Subject: Re: Big IA64 test coming in a few months 0 Message-ID: <87zn47meh0.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>  , "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> writes:  > > Maybe - there seems to be some confusion about whether thoseC > chipsets got axed with so much else in the P4 (vs. Banias/Dothan) A > massacre.  But even if they didn't get dropped, there were none > > which actually doubled the bandwidth of the existing bus (it6 > increased by either 1/3 or 2/3, save possibly in the! > single-processor configuration.   C The new itanic chipset got the death knell. Next ones won't be till 2 '07 and will be also used with the pentium d'jour.  A As an aside to this, there has been nothing I've seen as yet that > would rule out the new chipset being son of IO7 and the memoryE controllers etc being on the CPU chip. That's what I'm expecting then  anyway.    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 19:06:20 +0100 + From: Rodrigo Ventura <yoda@isr.ist.utl.pt> ! Subject: cluster problems (again) ) Message-ID: <m3llfr5isj.fsf@pixie.isrnet>   E After re-installing everything I ran into the same problem as before: D when adding a third node to the cluster, it fails booting, aparently" because lack of pagefile/swapfile.  C I've been trying to trackdown the cause, but I can't find where the ? pagefile/swapfiles are setup during startup. I can't find it in 4 neither lanacp database, nor sysboot parameters, norF systartup_vms.com, and there is no specific startup for that node. So,A it is a mistery to me how one of the nodes works with the correct  pagefile...   A Maybe the problem is that it runs out of memory before having the C opportunity to setup the correct page/swapfile (which is in a local B disk). In that case, how could I add a temporary one in the master* node? In [SYSn.SYSEXE]? How can I do that?  F I could run it with "boot -fl 0,20000", but then how can I capture the- output to a file (say, in another node disk).   ? And just one more question: since MSCP is such low level, is it C possible to establish cluster connectivity (i.e., a running node to @ have access to the disks at the problematic one, and vice-versa)B before a complete boot? Somewhere between SYSBOOT and booting withA STARTUP_P1="min". And how can I inspect a node local disks before F booting -- SYSBOOT is so limited... (in linux I can always boot with aE -b flag, which means emergency boot, and which just executes a bash).    Cheers,    Rodrigo    --    : *** Rodrigo Martins de Matos Ventura <yoda@isr.ist.utl.pt>. ***  Web page: http://www.isr.ist.utl.pt/~yoda0 ***   Teaching Assistant and PhD Student at ISR:7 ***    Instituto de Sistemas e Robotica, Polo de Lisboa 4 ***     Instituto Superior Tecnico, Lisboa, PORTUGALH *** PGP fingerprint = 0119 AD13 9EEE 264A 3F10  31D3 89B3 C6C4 60C6 4585   ------------------------------  * Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 18:45:29 +0000 (UTC), From: lewis@PROBE.MITRE.ORG (Keith A. Lewis)% Subject: Re: cluster problems (again) . Message-ID: <chae49$ovs$1@newslocal.mitre.org>  | Rodrigo Ventura <yoda@isr.ist.utl.pt> writes in article <m3llfr5isj.fsf@pixie.isrnet> dated Fri, 03 Sep 2004 19:06:20 +0100:F >After re-installing everything I ran into the same problem as before:E >when adding a third node to the cluster, it fails booting, aparently # >because lack of pagefile/swapfile.   I One bug that bit me yesterday in CLUSTER_CONFIG.COM was that it created a K lowercase syscommon.dir on my ODS-5 system disk.  I guess I'd recommend SET " PROC/PARSE=TRAD before you run it.  D >I've been trying to trackdown the cause, but I can't find where the@ >pagefile/swapfiles are setup during startup. I can't find it in5 >neither lanacp database, nor sysboot parameters, nor G >systartup_vms.com, and there is no specific startup for that node. So, B >it is a mistery to me how one of the nodes works with the correct >pagefile...  K For satellite nodes, CLUSTER_CONFIG sets up a file in [SYSn.SYSEXE] called  J SATELLITE_PAGE.COM which is responsible for mounting the local disk(s) and installing the files.   B >Maybe the problem is that it runs out of memory before having theD >opportunity to setup the correct page/swapfile (which is in a localC >disk). In that case, how could I add a temporary one in the master + >node? In [SYSn.SYSEXE]? How can I do that?    $ SET DEF [SYSn.SYSEXE] ) $ MC SYSGEN CREATE PAGEFILE.SYS/SIZE=size ) $ MC SYSGEN CREATE SWAPFILE.SYS/SIZE=size   @ >And just one more question: since MSCP is such low level, is itD >possible to establish cluster connectivity (i.e., a running node toA >have access to the disks at the problematic one, and vice-versa) C >before a complete boot? Somewhere between SYSBOOT and booting with B >STARTUP_P1="min". And how can I inspect a node local disks beforeG >booting -- SYSBOOT is so limited... (in linux I can always boot with a F >-b flag, which means emergency boot, and which just executes a bash).  J If your satellite node has a CD (most do), you can boot from a copy of theI VMS distribution CD to check out what's on the local devices.  Select the 4 option called "execute DCL commands and procedures".  0 --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.org> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------  * Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 18:14:25 +0000 (UTC), From: lewis@PROBE.MITRE.ORG (Keith A. Lewis) Subject: Re: cluster tunning. Message-ID: <chaca1$n71$2@newslocal.mitre.org>  | Rodrigo Ventura <yoda@isr.ist.utl.pt> writes in article <m3u0uf5ttf.fsf@pixie.isrnet> dated Fri, 03 Sep 2004 15:08:12 +0100:E >I have a cluster with two nodes, say xpto1 and xpto2, where xpto1 is A >the "master", and xpto2 is a sattelite node, booting via network A >(interconnect=ethernet), with a local disk just for swapping and  >paging. >  >What I want to do is: > E >1. To make a shadow disk of system disk at xpto1, in a local disk of G >node xpto2. Given a mounted disk, how can I setup a shadow disk? Is it 9 >possible, or all shadow members have to be erased first?   I In order to make your shared system disk into a shadow set, you must shut J down all nodes and reboot them with the SHADOW_SYS_DISK parameter set to 1 (or 4097 if you prefer).    F >2. To make xpto2 boot from that shadow. Is it possible to boot from aG >local shadow, and then synchronize everything with the other member of  >the shadow, in another node?   L No.  When it boots from the local disk, that local disk becomes the master. K Any other members will be added as copies.  If the master xpto1 already has H that shadow set mounted, you'll get an "error mounting system disk" when xpto2 joins the cluster.  0 --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.org> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Sep 2004 13:15:34 -0500 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)  Subject: Re: cluster tunning3 Message-ID: <R7XbQikadVO7@eisner.encompasserve.org>   W In article <m3u0uf5ttf.fsf@pixie.isrnet>, Rodrigo Ventura <yoda@isr.ist.utl.pt> writes:  > F > 1. To make a shadow disk of system disk at xpto1, in a local disk ofH > node xpto2. Given a mounted disk, how can I setup a shadow disk? Is it: > possible, or all shadow members have to be erased first?  C    New members will be overwritten.   If there are any files on the 8    disk that you must preserve, put them somewhere else.  G > 2. To make xpto2 boot from that shadow. Is it possible to boot from a H > local shadow, and then synchronize everything with the other member of > the shadow, in another node?  D    IIRC all nodes must boot from the same physical disk and then addE    other memebers to the system disk shadow set.  But I haven't used  C    shadow in a long time and this limitation may have been removed.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 19:39:45 +0100 + From: Rodrigo Ventura <yoda@isr.ist.utl.pt>  Subject: Re: cluster tunning) Message-ID: <m3hdqf5h8u.fsf@pixie.isrnet>   L >>>>> "Bob" == Bob Koehler <koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org> writes:  D     Bob>    IIRC all nodes must boot from the same physical disk andF     Bob> then add other memebers to the system disk shadow set.  But IC     Bob> haven't used shadow in a long time and this limitation may      Bob> have been removed.   A If all member nodes boot from the same physical disk, how can one @ attain redundancy of the master node? Is it possible to have the; cluster up and running, regardless of what node/disk fails?    Cheers,    Rodrigo    --    : *** Rodrigo Martins de Matos Ventura <yoda@isr.ist.utl.pt>. ***  Web page: http://www.isr.ist.utl.pt/~yoda0 ***   Teaching Assistant and PhD Student at ISR:7 ***    Instituto de Sistemas e Robotica, Polo de Lisboa 4 ***     Instituto Superior Tecnico, Lisboa, PORTUGALH *** PGP fingerprint = 0119 AD13 9EEE 264A 3F10  31D3 89B3 C6C4 60C6 4585   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 21:03:36 GMT 0 From: John Santos <john.santos@post.harvard.edu> Subject: Re: cluster tunning> Message-ID: <MPG.1ba2a631606545c19896de@news.bellatlantic.net>  E In article <m3hdqf5h8u.fsf@pixie.isrnet>, yoda@isr.ist.utl.pt says... N > >>>>> "Bob" == Bob Koehler <koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org> writes: > F >     Bob>    IIRC all nodes must boot from the same physical disk andH >     Bob> then add other memebers to the system disk shadow set.  But IE >     Bob> haven't used shadow in a long time and this limitation may  >     Bob> have been removed.  > C > If all member nodes boot from the same physical disk, how can one B > attain redundancy of the master node? Is it possible to have the= > cluster up and running, regardless of what node/disk fails?  >   D You have to have external storage (CI, SAN, shared SCSI) for this toD work well.  These are disks that can be accessed over multiple pathsC and don't depend on any one node being up.  You can shadow two such @ disks (possibly on separate controllers, separate buses, or even* separate continents!) for full redundancy.  F If a disk is served by a single node (e.g. a typical local SCSI disk),@ then when that node goes down, you lose access to the disk.  The< rest of the cluster can ride out brief outages, using mount D verification, but if you want the other nodes to continue, then theyA have to drop the missing member from the set, which means it will @ immediately be out-of-date, and it will have to do a shadow-copy@ when the missing node reboots.  This is very time-consuming, and- you lose redundancy until the copy completes.   ? You could shadow two disks both on the master node, so you have 9 protection against single disk failure, but you are still * relying on the master node for all access.  @ You have to be very careful about shutdowns and really watch out> for what happens when you lose more than one system (I.e. site? power failure), if you are shadowing locally connected disks on  separate systems.   D I think Philip Helbig has been playing around a lot with this stuff,B so check his posts on the subject.  I don't think he has gotten it* to work exactly the way he would like yet.    	 > Cheers,  > 	 > Rodrigo  >  >    --   John   ------------------------------  * Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 22:12:29 +0000 (UTC), From: lewis@PROBE.MITRE.ORG (Keith A. Lewis) Subject: Re: cluster tunning. Message-ID: <chaq8d$3i9$1@newslocal.mitre.org>  | Rodrigo Ventura <yoda@isr.ist.utl.pt> writes in article <m3hdqf5h8u.fsf@pixie.isrnet> dated Fri, 03 Sep 2004 19:39:45 +0100:M >>>>>> "Bob" == Bob Koehler <koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org> writes:  > E >    Bob>    IIRC all nodes must boot from the same physical disk and G >    Bob> then add other memebers to the system disk shadow set.  But I D >    Bob> haven't used shadow in a long time and this limitation may >    Bob> have been removed. > B >If all member nodes boot from the same physical disk, how can oneA >attain redundancy of the master node? Is it possible to have the < >cluster up and running, regardless of what node/disk fails?  E Maybe Bob is thinking about a SCSI cluster.  You can only boot from a J physical disk if you're connected to it.  When booting over MSCP, you mustJ access a mountable volume, and physical disks cannot be mounted while they are shadow set members.   @ The best I have been able to do without SCSI clustering is this:  = Set all machines to boot from the ethernet device by default. 7 Boot the "master" node manually from its physical disk. - Let all members serve the shadow set and MOP. F Put commands in system startup procedures to add local shadow members.C Put commands in shutdown procedures to remove local shadow members.   H Then if the "master" node crashes, after SHADOW_MBR_TMO the cluster willI continue with the other member(s), and after you fix the problem with the @ master node, you can boot it, and then it will add its own disk.  ( The two problems with this strategy are:  I 1.  The first node has to be booted from a device other than bootdef_dev, 6 which means manual intervention after a power failure.  = 2.  Rebooting nodes with shadow members causes shadow copies.   H It should also be pointed out that you can't make a 2-node cluster trulyH redundant, as there will be at least one node whose loss would mean lossG of quorum.  The only way around this is a quorum disk connected to both / nodes, so you're back to SCSI clustering again.   0 --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.org> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------  * Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 17:58:57 +0000 (UTC). From: Dale Dellutri <ddelQQQlutr@panQQQix.com>" Subject: Definition for SOR$GK_* ?, Message-ID: <chabd1$lc8$1@reader1.panix.com>  A I'm trying to write a FORTRAN program which uses the SOR$ROUTINES @ (Sort/Merge Utility routines).  According to the OpenVMS Utility: Routines Manual, Sort/Merge Routines section, when callingB SOR$BEGIN_SORT, one needs to specify the sort process by passing a byte containing one of:      SOR$GK_RECORD (record sort)    SOR$GK_TAG (tag sort)    SOR$GK_ADDRESS (address sort)    SOR$GK_INDEX (index sort)   ? I specifically need SOR$GK_RECORD.  However, I can't find this  ? definition anywhere.  It is not in $SORDEF or SOR$ROUTINES (in  F SYS$LIBRARY:FORSYSDEF.TLB), nor any of the other TLB's in SYS$LIBRARY.  8 Where are these values defined, or what is their values?   (OpenVMS 7.3-1 on Alpha.)   E A web search seems to indicate that SOR$GK_RECORD = 1, but I'd reall  4 like to get the standard definition from the system.   --  7 Dale Dellutri <ddelQQQlutr@panQQQix.com> (lose the Q's)    ------------------------------  * Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 18:30:16 +0000 (UTC), From: lewis@PROBE.MITRE.ORG (Keith A. Lewis)& Subject: Re: Definition for SOR$GK_* ?. Message-ID: <chad7o$oap$1@newslocal.mitre.org>   Dale Dellutri <ddelQQQlutr@panQQQix.com> writes in article <chabd1$lc8$1@reader1.panix.com> dated Fri, 3 Sep 2004 17:58:57 +0000 (UTC):  >  SOR$GK_RECORD (record sort) >  SOR$GK_TAG (tag sort)  >  SOR$GK_ADDRESS (address sort) >  SOR$GK_INDEX (index sort) > @ >I specifically need SOR$GK_RECORD.  However, I can't find this @ >definition anywhere.  It is not in $SORDEF or SOR$ROUTINES (in G >SYS$LIBRARY:FORSYSDEF.TLB), nor any of the other TLB's in SYS$LIBRARY.  > 9 >Where are these values defined, or what is their values?   K Only the record sort is supported, and that is the default if you omit that 1 parameter (at least that's what I did in PL/I).     0 --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.org> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------  * Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 19:58:55 +0000 (UTC). From: Dale Dellutri <ddelQQQlutr@panQQQix.com>& Subject: Re: Definition for SOR$GK_* ?, Message-ID: <chaidu$nmh$1@reader1.panix.com>  V On Fri, 3 Sep 2004 18:30:16 +0000 (UTC), Keith A. Lewis <lewis@probe.mitre.org> wrote: > Dale Dellutri <ddelQQQlutr@panQQQix.com> writes in article <chabd1$lc8$1@reader1.panix.com> dated Fri, 3 Sep 2004 17:58:57 +0000 (UTC):   > >  SOR$GK_RECORD (record sort) > >  SOR$GK_TAG (tag sort)" > >  SOR$GK_ADDRESS (address sort) > >  SOR$GK_INDEX (index sort) > > B > >I specifically need SOR$GK_RECORD.  However, I can't find this B > >definition anywhere.  It is not in $SORDEF or SOR$ROUTINES (in I > >SYS$LIBRARY:FORSYSDEF.TLB), nor any of the other TLB's in SYS$LIBRARY.  > > ; > >Where are these values defined, or what is their values?   $ > Only the record sort is supported,  @ According to my manual, thats only true of the High-Performance  Sort/Merge Utility.   * > and that is the default if you omit that1 > parameter (at least that's what I did in PL/I).   ? I'll try this, but I'd still like to know where the values are   defined.   --  7 Dale Dellutri <ddelQQQlutr@panQQQix.com> (lose the Q's)    ------------------------------  * Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 21:54:33 +0000 (UTC), From: lewis@PROBE.MITRE.ORG (Keith A. Lewis)& Subject: Re: Definition for SOR$GK_* ?. Message-ID: <chap6o$32o$1@newslocal.mitre.org>   Dale Dellutri <ddelQQQlutr@panQQQix.com> writes in article <chaidu$nmh$1@reader1.panix.com> dated Fri, 3 Sep 2004 19:58:55 +0000 (UTC): % >> Only the record sort is supported,  > A >According to my manual, thats only true of the High-Performance   >Sort/Merge Utility.   You are correct, sir.   + >> and that is the default if you omit that 2 >> parameter (at least that's what I did in PL/I). > @ >I'll try this, but I'd still like to know where the values are 	 >defined.   ; Clearly they SHOULD be defined in $SORDEF, and they aren't.   0 --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.org> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Sep 2004 18:06:15 -0700 0 From: chris_doran@postmaster.co.uk (Chris Doran)& Subject: Re: Definition for SOR$GK_* ?= Message-ID: <948f0720.0409031706.1498f3ee@posting.google.com>   b Dale Dellutri <ddelQQQlutr@panQQQix.com> wrote in message news:<chabd1$lc8$1@reader1.panix.com>...C > I'm trying to write a FORTRAN program which uses the SOR$ROUTINES B > (Sort/Merge Utility routines).  According to the OpenVMS Utility< > Routines Manual, Sort/Merge Routines section, when callingD > SOR$BEGIN_SORT, one needs to specify the sort process by passing a > byte containing one of:  >  >   SOR$GK_RECORD (record sort)  >   SOR$GK_TAG (tag sort) ! >   SOR$GK_ADDRESS (address sort)  >   SOR$GK_INDEX (index sort)  > A > I specifically need SOR$GK_RECORD.  However, I can't find this  A > definition anywhere.  It is not in $SORDEF or SOR$ROUTINES (in  H > SYS$LIBRARY:FORSYSDEF.TLB), nor any of the other TLB's in SYS$LIBRARY. > : > Where are these values defined, or what is their values? >  > (OpenVMS 7.3-1 on Alpha.)  > G > A web search seems to indicate that SOR$GK_RECORD = 1, but I'd reall  6 > like to get the standard definition from the system.  D If you're programming in C, just declare them as globalvalues (DEC CA extension) and the linker will find them "from the system", e.g.:    #include <stdio.h>  D globalvalue SOR$GK_RECORD, SOR$GK_TAG, SOR$GK_ADDRESS, SOR$GK_INDEX;   main() { . printf("SOR$GK_RECORD = %d\n", SOR$GK_RECORD);( printf("SOR$GK_TAG = %d\n", SOR$GK_TAG);0 printf("SOR$GK_ADDRESS = %d\n", SOR$GK_ADDRESS);, printf("SOR$GK_INDEX = %d\n", SOR$GK_INDEX); }    which gives (VAX/VMS 6.2):   SOR$GK_RECORD = 1  SOR$GK_TAG = 2 SOR$GK_ADDRESS = 4 SOR$GK_INDEX = 3  E When/if I have time, I'll dig out the (ancient) microfiche to confirm  this.   F IIRC, there's a DEC FORTRAN equivalent of globalvalue, but it's been a long time... :)    Chris    ------------------------------   Date: 3 Sep 2004 12:31:13 -0700 & From: jordan@ccs4vms.com (Rich Jordan)# Subject: EV8 advertised by accident = Message-ID: <cc5619f2.0409031131.7bf3ffb4@posting.google.com>   F We just received a flier from HP.  "HP Business-Critical Server Family? Guide", Volume 1, February 2004.  Document ID is 5982-4274ENA1; F 02/2004 First one I've seen but since we aren't official resellers any" more perhaps thats to be expected.  A On the last content page, HPTC Scalable Products, the last column 7 lists the HP AlphaServer SC45.  Processor listed is....   & 64-bit Alpha EV8 processor at 1.25 GHz  E I don't suppose a 'false advertising' claim could be used to get said F system delivered as advertised... :)  but since its Tru64 only I guess  its not worth the effort anyway.   Rich CCS    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 15:40:05 -0400+ From: Lord Isildur <isildur@andrew.cmu.edu> ' Subject: Re: EV8 advertised by accident H Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.60-041.0409031538460.8368@unix44.andrew.cmu.edu>  I given how many times alpha has been 'cancelled' before, and the fact that G it really is the best machine out there.. i wouldnt be _too_ surprised  K if EV8 eventually did get into production. Still, what you saw was probably 4 just a mistkae and we probably won't see an EV8.. :(   isildur     & On Fri, 3 Sep 2004, Rich Jordan wrote:  H > We just received a flier from HP.  "HP Business-Critical Server FamilyA > Guide", Volume 1, February 2004.  Document ID is 5982-4274ENA1; H > 02/2004 First one I've seen but since we aren't official resellers any$ > more perhaps thats to be expected. > C > On the last content page, HPTC Scalable Products, the last column 9 > lists the HP AlphaServer SC45.  Processor listed is....  > ( > 64-bit Alpha EV8 processor at 1.25 GHz > G > I don't suppose a 'false advertising' claim could be used to get said H > system delivered as advertised... :)  but since its Tru64 only I guess" > its not worth the effort anyway. >  > Rich > CCS  >    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 20:07:37 GMT 6 From: "Kenneth Farmer" <kfarmer@NOSPAM.spyderbyte.com>' Subject: Re: EV8 advertised by accident < Message-ID: <da4_c.6185$683.774529@twister.southeast.rr.com>  3 "Rich Jordan" <jordan@ccs4vms.com> wrote in message 7 news:cc5619f2.0409031131.7bf3ffb4@posting.google.com... H > We just received a flier from HP.  "HP Business-Critical Server FamilyA > Guide", Volume 1, February 2004.  Document ID is 5982-4274ENA1; H > 02/2004 First one I've seen but since we aren't official resellers any$ > more perhaps thats to be expected. > C > On the last content page, HPTC Scalable Products, the last column 9 > lists the HP AlphaServer SC45.  Processor listed is....  > ( > 64-bit Alpha EV8 processor at 1.25 GHz > G > I don't suppose a 'false advertising' claim could be used to get said H > system delivered as advertised... :)  but since its Tru64 only I guess" > its not worth the effort anyway.      " > but since its Tru64 only I guess" > its not worth the effort anyway.   Take this as humor...   J Ever run Tru64 in a production environment?  If you had, you wouldn't makeK that statement.  If you did, and you had problems with Tru64, then whomever F handled the servers wasn't good at it.  Second best in many regards toH OpenVMS? Yes.  It could be easily claimed as the most reliable UNIX, andJ that comes from someone who has used them all, Solaris, AIX, HP-UX, Linux,G etc. Tru64 doesn't deserve that kinda of disrespectful comment.  I mean K after all, we are talking Alpha chips here anyway, right?  Tru64 is part of  the family.   I That's like looking at your brother on his death bed and saying, oh well, G that cure they were going to try might have worked, but he's not really  worth it anyway.   :)   Ken  ________________________" Kenneth R. Farmer <>< 336-736-7376$ SpyderByte: http://www.SpydeByte.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 13:38:24 -0700 + From: "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com> ' Subject: Re: EV8 advertised by accident ' Message-ID: <4138D640.2060100@MMaz.com>    Kenneth Farmer wrote:   4 >"Rich Jordan" <jordan@ccs4vms.com> wrote in message8 >news:cc5619f2.0409031131.7bf3ffb4@posting.google.com... >    > " >>but since its Tru64 only I guess" >>its not worth the effort anyway. >>     >> >Take this as humor... > K >Ever run Tru64 in a production environment?  If you had, you wouldn't make L >that statement.  If you did, and you had problems with Tru64, then whomeverG >handled the servers wasn't good at it.  Second best in many regards to I >OpenVMS? Yes.  It could be easily claimed as the most reliable UNIX, and K >that comes from someone who has used them all, Solaris, AIX, HP-UX, Linux, H >etc. Tru64 doesn't deserve that kinda of disrespectful comment.  I meanL >after all, we are talking Alpha chips here anyway, right?  Tru64 is part of >the family. >    > F Looking at it without the possibly implied 'tongue-in-cheek,' I ran a H DEC Unix box for years and frankly loved the disk and volume management 9 system that came with it and for Unix, it ran rock solid!    Barry    --    > Barry Treahy, Jr                       E-mail: Treahy@MMaz.com> Midwest Microwave                          Phone: 480/314-1320> Vice President & CIO                         FAX: 480/661-7028                            ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 21:05:23 GMT 1 From: Keith Parris <keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com> ' Subject: Re: EV8 advertised by accident 2 Message-ID: <n05_c.9727$YH6.4278@news.cpqcorp.net>   Rich Jordan wrote:( > 64-bit Alpha EV8 processor at 1.25 GHz  C Next thing you know, people will be jumping in claiming that HP is  H deliberately holding the clock rate back on this EV8 chip -- that it is . really capable of much higher clock rates. :-)  3 Seriously, I'm sure this is just a typo for "EV68".    ------------------------------   Date: 3 Sep 2004 14:38:36 -0700 & From: jordan@ccs4vms.com (Rich Jordan)# Subject: EV8 advertised by accident < Message-ID: <cc5619f2.0409031338.9e65c41@posting.google.com>  F We just received a flier from HP.  "HP Business-Critical Server Family? Guide", Volume 1, February 2004.  Document ID is 5982-4274ENA1; F 02/2004 First one I've seen but since we aren't official resellers any" more perhaps thats to be expected.  A On the last content page, HPTC Scalable Products, the last column 7 lists the HP AlphaServer SC45.  Processor listed is....   & 64-bit Alpha EV8 processor at 1.25 GHz  E I don't suppose a 'false advertising' claim could be used to get said F system delivered as advertised... :)  but since its Tru64 only I guess  its not worth the effort anyway.   Rich CCS    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 20:50:38 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> ' Subject: RE: EV8 advertised by accident R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB3E02E3@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----2 > From: Rich Jordan [mailto:jordan@ccs4vms.com]=20! > Sent: September 3, 2004 5:39 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com % > Subject: EV8 advertised by accident  >=20H > We just received a flier from HP.  "HP Business-Critical Server FamilyA > Guide", Volume 1, February 2004.  Document ID is 5982-4274ENA1; H > 02/2004 First one I've seen but since we aren't official resellers any$ > more perhaps thats to be expected. >=20C > On the last content page, HPTC Scalable Products, the last column 9 > lists the HP AlphaServer SC45.  Processor listed is....  >=20( > 64-bit Alpha EV8 processor at 1.25 GHz >=20G > I don't suppose a 'false advertising' claim could be used to get said H > system delivered as advertised... :)  but since its Tru64 only I guess" > its not worth the effort anyway. >=20 > Rich > CCS   H As someone pointed out earlier the latest ES45 is an EV68, 1.25Ghz basedD server. By the way, these servers are real screamers as these latestH ES45's have 16Mb cache *per cpu* while the 1Ghz ES45's have only 8MB per cpu.=20   " Something not many people realize.   Check specs out at: - http://h18002.www1.hp.com/alphaserver/es.html    Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 21:32:51 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> ' Subject: Re: EV8 advertised by accident , Message-ID: <41391B2B.D530D23D@teksavvy.com>   re: EVO used in an advert.  M Kerry Main is totally wrong with his answer. What is really happening is that N Carly is actually much smarter that she has lead us to belive. That whole IA64N love affair is just a large smokescreeen. Just like Carly wants to rule the TVM and other consumer appliances, she has set her eyes also on the CPU market.,    H In order to achieve this, she has made it appear to be best buddies withF Intel, giving Intel a false sense of security with its faltering IA64.L Meanwhile, in the basement of ZKO, there is a super secret team of engineersM who have kept working on Alpha all this time. Carly has created clones who go D back to the engineer's families every night, with the real engineers sequestered in ZKO's basement.  M Eventually, Carly will unleash Alpha EV8 which will kill off Intel, and Carly E will then rule the CPU industry and also control its competitor Dell.   M This particular ad is a serious leak in this secret plan, probably the result N of one of those sequestered engineers having found a way to send a message outN to the real world. One should really read between the lines in that message asK there is probably some additional hidden messages from that engineer giving 3 more details about his life in the basement of ZKO.   J And to anyone who denies there being a basement at ZKO, well, that is whatK *THEY* want you to believe. And yes, i am watching a james bond movie while  typing this.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 22:09:07 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>O' Subject: RE: EV8 advertised by accident R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB3E02E7@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----9 > From: JF Mezei [mailto:jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com]=20 ! > Sent: September 3, 2004 9:33 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ) > Subject: Re: EV8 advertised by accidentG >=20  	 [Snip ..]i  B > And to anyone who denies there being a basement at ZKO, well,=20 > that is what? > *THEY* want you to believe. And yes, i am watching a james=20  > bond movie while > typing this. >=20  G And after finally fighting the bad guys, James Bond finally gets to ript@ the black hood off the Spectre leader and .... Its Bob Palmer ..   :-)e  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultantt HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660c Fax: 613-591-4477o kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Sep 2004 16:49:31 -05004- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) ' Subject: Re: Flat panel VT replacement?A3 Message-ID: <SEHlPXr2$WHI@eisner.encompasserve.org>   U In article <00A3750D.2A4AAEC1@SendSpamHere.ORG>,   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: e > In article <riODvBo3p3G$@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes:uW >>In article <00A37471.B8EEB644@SendSpamHere.ORG>,   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:o >>L >>> I have a POwerbook G4 17" laptop with has built-in bluetooth.  I orderedM >>> Apple's bluetooth wireless keyboard.  It has the look, feel and layout ofo >>> the LK keyboards.  >>+ >>Control key directly to the left of "A" ?e > L > All of my LK keyboards have the caps lock key next to the "A".  So does my  = Ok, I stand corrected.  I was thinking of the original VT100.-  C Right now I am using an Apple Keyboard which has a wide control key  next to the A.  M > Apple bluetooth.  The control key is located next to what would be the com-?L > pose character key on the LK.  This move allows the keyboard to be squared. > off in a more convenient portable platform.   F But my finger searches for Control quite often, and down even with theG space bar is not where it looks.  This looks like a non-starter for me,eG while the VMS USB keyboard about which you recently inquired presumablyy has it right (my way :-).z  - >>And is there an equivalent wired keyboard ?, > ) > dunno...  I want to do away with wires.o  9 Whereas I have no interested in wireless computer access.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 04 Sep 2004 01:51:00 +0800 , From: Paul Repacholi <prep@prep.synonet.com> Subject: Re: Future of Decnetn0 Message-ID: <87vfevmebf.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>  " "Dr. Dweeb" <dr@dweeb.com> writes:  C > Do I want an Enzo or a GT3 ? Easy, Enzo every time - Porsches aren3 > perfectly functional but oh so boring. Yaaaawnnn.x  , So you have never over cooked a 911 then...    Boring? tonnnn   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.b@                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Sep 2004 20:02:51 -0700 . From: spamsink2001@yahoo.com (Alan E. Feldman)  Subject: Hackers' OS Preferences= Message-ID: <b096a4ee.0409031902.54cf6d2c@posting.google.com>6  j "Doc." <doc.cypher@openvms-rocks.com> wrote in message news:<Xns9558D68D6A990dcovmsrox@212.100.160.123>... [...]o  I > OpenVMS:     Eight out of ten hackers prefer *other* operating systems.-  5 So who are these two hackers who *do* prefer VMS? :-)g   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Sep 2004 14:40:31 -0700 # From: fernando.vallarino@oca.com.uyn Subject: HSG80 cache batteries= Message-ID: <5da5a1ff.0409031340.659aaf58@posting.google.com>h  E Last month we had serious problems with our production cluster, whicheE is integrated by one ES47 with VMS 7.3-2 and one GS80 with VMS 7.3-1,f, a couple of RA8000 mirrored and Rdb 7.1-241.E The troubles began with some database's corruption messages, but whent we, close and reopen it all become normal again.D In one of theese operations, the database become unavailable and our supportdE told us to recover the database. We did that. They saied, that it wast9 a hardware problem which generat our database corruption.pC During the following week, the problems repeated sevral times, with, someF data corruptions, until weekend, when the database was recovered again@ and the writeback caching was disabled in both RA8000 because we@ detected expired batteries in one of them. At the same time, Rdb@ global buffers where decrese from 100000 to 30000 in both nodes.C This week all things went normally. The batteries were changed, ande the D writeback caching enabled again. The other week all things went fine too, so, we 8 added 45000 global buffers in each node to our database.  ? Today HP say that the problem could be the number of RDB global  buffers, not the batteries.i  , We think that the problem was the batteries.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 04 Sep 2004 01:13:22 GMTo  From: John Santos <john@egh.com>" Subject: Re: HSG80 cache batteries( Message-ID: <SE8_c.788$PK3.669@trnddc08>  $ fernando.vallarino@oca.com.uy wrote:G > Last month we had serious problems with our production cluster, whichLG > is integrated by one ES47 with VMS 7.3-2 and one GS80 with VMS 7.3-1,g. > a couple of RA8000 mirrored and Rdb 7.1-241.G > The troubles began with some database's corruption messages, but when8 > we. > close and reopen it all become normal again.F > In one of theese operations, the database become unavailable and our	 > supportoG > told us to recover the database. We did that. They saied, that it was ; > a hardware problem which generat our database corruption. E > During the following week, the problems repeated sevral times, withb > someH > data corruptions, until weekend, when the database was recovered againB > and the writeback caching was disabled in both RA8000 because weB > detected expired batteries in one of them. At the same time, RdbB > global buffers where decrese from 100000 to 30000 in both nodes.E > This week all things went normally. The batteries were changed, and  > the F > writeback caching enabled again. The other week all things went fine
 > too, so, weh: > added 45000 global buffers in each node to our database. > A > Today HP say that the problem could be the number of RDB globala > buffers, not the batteries.o > . > We think that the problem was the batteries.  > I don't know of any specific problems with global buffers, but< I think if the problem was caused by the batteries, it would2 only have produced symptoms when the power failed.  ( You don't mention having power problems.  ; If bad batteries could cause problems with the cache in the = absence of a power failure, then I think you would have stille< seen problems even with the write-back cache disabled, since: the memory is still used as a write-through cache and read cache.   -- E John SantosS Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 14:06:50 -0400# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>iE Subject: Re: Itanic Adoption Survey from 23-August-2004 Computerworldv, Message-ID: <K7OdnbONUqMkL6XcRVn-iw@igs.net>   Barry Treahy, Jr. wrote:E > I know, I'm more than a week behind on reading, but did anyone else D > see this little interesting survey (+/- 4% error) from Interex/HP? > ? > How does your organization view HP's Itanium Server road map?a >. > No plan to upgrade: 42%h > Not sure: 17%, > Plans to upgrade: 16% % > Has concerns/not a good option: 15%t > Has already implemented: 9%S >cA > Amazing that HP can proceed to keep their collective heads in aeD > dark-space, and ignore that folks are still not fond of Itanic, or4 > perhaps still angered about the demise of Alpha... >- > Barry-    F 42+17+15 = 74% that could be considering Sun or IBM as a more reliable partnerh   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 14:20:01 -0400a- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>tE Subject: Re: Itanic Adoption Survey from 23-August-2004 Computerworld , Message-ID: <4138B5CD.27972189@teksavvy.com>   "Barry Treahy, Jr." wrote:A > Amazing that HP can proceed to keep their collective heads in atD > dark-space, and ignore that folks are still not fond of Itanic, or4 > perhaps still angered about the demise of Alpha...  L The only metric HP shareholders are *really* worried about is the percentageJ of its customers who will migrate to Sun or IBM. A customer who stays with- Alpha-VMS will still generate profits for HP.r  H But Carly is worried about IA64's success or lack thereof because of herI personal realtionshps with Intel and Microsoft which are very significante% parts of her all-too-important Image.2   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 18:38:01 GMTc1 From: Keith Parris <keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com> E Subject: Re: Itanic Adoption Survey from 23-August-2004 Computerworldf2 Message-ID: <dS2_c.9688$Vt6.7578@news.cpqcorp.net>   Barry Treahy, Jr. wrote:? > How does your organization view HP's Itanium Server road map?o >  > No plan to upgrade: 42%r > Not sure: 17%e > Plans to upgrade: 16% % > Has concerns/not a good option: 15%  > Has already implemented: 9%b  ? This survey is from Interex, and reflects mostly pre-merger HP -D customers. So adoption rates will ramp up significantly faster over I time. Remember there's still one more generation of PA-RISC planned. For nI OpenVMS, the first production release, 8.2, isn't quite out yet, and the 3E performance cross-over point between Alpha and Itanium is just being sI reached about now -- see TechWeb, "HP's 64-bit Milestone: Itanium Passes  = The Alpha" http://www.techweb.com/wire/story/TWB20040820S0005w  H And here are some very-different findings from a another recent survey, C from Forrester Research, entitled "Firms Stay The Course On Server   Technologies":  C "Itanium gains particular interest from firms, with 94% of Itanium mG owners reporting plans to buy more  and 50% of respondents that don't n" have Itanium also plan to buy it."   andf  G "Firms Plan Large Buys Of Itanium  And Continued Buys Of 32-Bit Intel m	 And RISC"d  G http://www.forrester.com/Research/Document/Excerpt/0,7211,34343,00.htmla   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 16:07:18 -0400* From: "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net>E Subject: Re: Itanic Adoption Survey from 23-August-2004 Computerworlds= Message-ID: <qb6dneU1d8Q1U6XcRVn-rg@metrocastcablevision.com>q  6 "Barry Treahy, Jr." <Treahy@MMaz.com> wrote in message! news:413896EA.7000002@MMaz.com...rI > I know, I'm more than a week behind on reading, but did anyone else seei@ > this little interesting survey (+/- 4% error) from Interex/HP? >t? > How does your organization view HP's Itanium Server road map?m >t > No plan to upgrade: 42%n > Not sure: 17%a > Plans to upgrade: 16% % > Has concerns/not a good option: 15%t > Has already implemented: 9%o > A > Amazing that HP can proceed to keep their collective heads in ahD > dark-space, and ignore that folks are still not fond of Itanic, or4 > perhaps still angered about the demise of Alpha... >g > Barry/  C Perhaps the respondents were simply confused by the use of the termS? 'upgrade', and more would have responded differently had a more , value-neutral term like 'migrate' been used.  J Just trying to find a positive way to look at this, since Keith's response1 really didn't quite cut the mustard in that area.e   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 16:26:00 -0400c- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>cE Subject: Re: Itanic Adoption Survey from 23-August-2004 Computerworlde, Message-ID: <4138D357.B6E51F59@teksavvy.com>   John Smith wrote:hH > 42+17+15 = 74% that could be considering Sun or IBM as a more reliable	 > partnero    L This is misleading. Many may not be considering the downgrade to IA64 simplyM because their current infrastructure is big enough to handle the load and allhF new applications are being added to different systems. Many may not beJ thinking about downgrade to IA64 simply because they don't plan on keepingL their VMS systems long enough to be an issue. For such customers, IA64 isn'tN even an issue because they wouldn't have upgraded to some galaxy class machine9 anyways, they would have stayed with VAX or small Alphas.t   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 16:33:12 -0400g- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> E Subject: Re: Itanic Adoption Survey from 23-August-2004 Computerworld , Message-ID: <4138D506.3030BDFE@teksavvy.com>   Bill Todd wrote:E > Perhaps the respondents were simply confused by the use of the termcA > 'upgrade', and more would have responded differently had a moreg. > value-neutral term like 'migrate' been used.    L What the current survey resuls show is that customers do not have confidence in that IA64 thing.l  M Assuming IA64 does survive and eventually unmistakenly surpasses the now deadsI Alpha and PaRisc products, customers may not have a choice but to do thatnJ migration to that IA64. For one thing, you can expect HP to coax customersJ into those costly migrations by adjusting maintenance costs of ALpha basedK systems to make the expensive migration look like the better business deal.b  L But until that happens, customers will comfortably remain on their PaRisc orJ Alpha platforms and just add more CPUs as needed. (or squarely put any newL application on a totally different platform from a more trustworthy vendor).   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 14:30:09 -0400e- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>d+ Subject: Re: Itanium: EFI... no fs0: device , Message-ID: <4138B82C.CD17C4BC@teksavvy.com>   Fred Kleinsorge wrote:J > Repeat after me...  this is NOT a "Windows" issue.  Replace Windows with0 > Linux, or HP-UX and you have the *same* issue.  N Except malicious viri/trojan/worms are most often targetted at Windows because$ it is such an easy target to infect.  N > Lets say, attached SCSI...  what *we* see is a device controller.  How do weK > see that?  We walk the PCI bus.  The firmware (in the IA64 case) tells usmK > where to find the PCI bus.  SYSMAN IO AUTO invokes an image (when it sees L > the port driver for the controller loaded) that POLLS the SCSI bus looking > for LUNs.m  M OK thanks. I was under the impression that the ROM did that trick, since evensJ on a microvax, you can do a >>> SHOW DEVICE and it will list the available	 devices. h  J > Yes, except the "primitive ROM" should read "EFI".  Which "peeks" at theN > disk to find the partition information, and locates EFI partitions, which it/ > can then use to find boot loaders for the OS.o  I What is the proper terminology to describe the ROM based firmware that is I activated at power-up and whose job is to seek an EFI partition ? (I usedC "primitive ROM" for it) ?e  M What is the proper terminology to describe the actual software that is loadedoN from an EFI partition by the "primitive ROM" and then executed to continue the booting process ?i   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 15:42:35 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>w1 Subject: RE: Planned port of freeware to Itanium?tR Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB3E02C4@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message------ > From: John Smith [mailto:a@nonymous.com]=20i" > Sent: September 3, 2004 11:20 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comh3 > Subject: Re: Planned port of freeware to Itanium?n >=20 > Main, Kerry wrote: > >> -----Original Message----- 9 > >> From: Larry Kilgallen [mailto:Kilgallen@SpamCop.net]s$ > >> Sent: September 1, 2004 5:23 PM > >> To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com6 > >> Subject: Re: Planned port of freeware to Itanium? > >> > > 
 > > [snip ..]d  
 > > Larry, > >uE > > The following url that describes a University porting open source, > > prog's to OpenVMS Itanium:2 > > http://h71000.www7.hp.com/news/ospp_turin.html >=20 >=20D > This was supposed to be a programme which had a moderate number of< > universities participating wherein students were to get=20 > academic credit forD? > the work they did in porting. Beyond this one institution,=20K > how many othersc > are participating and where? >=20  E Don't know if this was the same thing or not. Drop Sue a line to findg out more on this..  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultanty HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660c Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------   Date: 3 SEP 2004 16:36:36 GMT$4 From: karcher@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu (Carl Karcher)0 Subject: Re: tcpdump does not produce any output5 Message-ID: <3SEP04.16363617@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu>Y  + In a previous article, Ben Armstrong wrote:TE ->I'm trying to use tcpdump-lan.exe from the tcpdump 3.7.2 package inrG ->Freeware 6.0 and cannot get it to produce any output, even with privst5 ->turned on. Any clues as to how to get this to work?   D You didn't mention what network stack is installed but if you didn't7 already know, HP TCPIP V5.4 includes a working tcpdump.-   --G -- Carl Karcher, Waisman Computing Services, Waisman Center, UW-MadisonR5 --              karcher.nomorespxm@waisman.wisc.edu  *   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 18:02:38 -0300Q* From: Ben Armstrong <ben@bgpc.dymaxion.ca>0 Subject: Re: tcpdump does not produce any output= Message-ID: <pan.2004.09.03.21.02.38.938400@bgpc.dymaxion.ca>_  7 On Fri, 03 Sep 2004 16:36:36 +0000, Carl Karcher wrote:_  - > In a previous article, Ben Armstrong wrote:GG > ->I'm trying to use tcpdump-lan.exe from the tcpdump 3.7.2 package iniI > ->Freeware 6.0 and cannot get it to produce any output, even with privs 7 > ->turned on. Any clues as to how to get this to work?  > F > You didn't mention what network stack is installed but if you didn't9 > already know, HP TCPIP V5.4 includes a working tcpdump.   J It varies from one system to the next.  My test system is TCPIP 5.3 ECO 4.; Some of them are more recent than that, and some are older.p   Ben  -- -G       Ben Armstrong                -.       Medianet Development Group, E       BArmstrong@dymaxion.ca         `-.    Dymaxion Research Limited H       <URL: http://www.dymaxion.ca/>    `-  Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 18:38:43 -0400:* From: Chuck Chopp <ChuckChopp@rtfmcsi.com>6 Subject: Tomcat on OpenVMS - Is source code available?: Message-ID: <un6_c.86985$%n4.14845@bignews6.bellsouth.net>  J Is the Java source code for Tomcat [as built by HP for the CSWS_JAVA v2.1  product] available for review?  K I know it is based on Tomcat v4.1.24, which is the version that it reports dF in the server log files.  I'm currently tracking down the source of a J problem with "ClassNotfoundException" errors occurring when JSP files are M being automatically compiled into Java class files when a webapp is deployed  H on OpenVMS.  Given that Tomcat is open source, I was expecting that the K source code for CSWS_JAVA v2.1 would be available in the event that it was hK necessary to rebuild the product from scratch for purposes of fixing a bug I in the product.k  K Is there any contact information for Powell "Hap" Hazzard at HP?  His name iF appears in numerous comments in the Tomcat configuration files and it L appears that he's been one of the people responsible for maintenance of the 9 Tomcat implementation used in the CSWS JAVA v2.1 product.$  & To refresh, the problem is as follows:  H The Servlet v2.3 specifications allow for JSP pages to be places in the J "WEB-INF" subfolder of a webapp to enable them to be protected from being M directly accessed by a web browser.  When located in that subfolder, the JSP nI files can only be accessed if the webapp deliberately performs a forward d/ action that results in the JSP being displayed.t  H On Tomcat v4.1.30 [on WinXP SP1] and on Tomcat v4.1.28 [on NetWare v6.5 E SP2], a webapp configured in this manner deploys & executes properly.S  I On Tomcat v4.1.24 [on OpenVMS Alpha v7.3-1, CSWS_JAVA v2.1 installed], a  L webapp configured in this manner will deploy but fails to execute properly. I   The JSP files in the "WEB-INF" subfolder do not get compiled into Java oM class files properly and a "ClassNotFoundException" error occurs.  I can see DK the ".java" source files in the work folder for the webapp, so I know that QK the JSP files themselves were found.  However, the automatically generated  I source files for the JSPs end up not being compiled into ".class" files. rE Other JSP files located in the root folder of the webapp or in other sI subfolders not located under "WEB-INF" can be successfully compiled into e% Java ".class" files w/o any problems.i  M It makes no difference if JDK v1.4.1 or v1.4.2 is used, and both versions of KJ the JDK have been tested with all 3 platforms on which this test work has  been performed.   J At this point I'd say that CSWS_JAVA v2.1 is failing to be compliant with ) the Servlet v2.3 specs [section SRV.6.5].N     --   Chuck Chopp:  8 ChuckChopp (at) rtfmcsi (dot) com http://www.rtfmcsi.com  @ RTFM Consulting Services Inc.     864 801 2795 voice & voicemail2 103 Autumn Hill Road              864 801 2774 fax Greer, SC  29651  , Do not send me unsolicited commercial email.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 23:26:38 GMTCL From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing): Subject: Re: Tomcat on OpenVMS - Is source code available?6 Message-ID: <00A3755B.4067A8EA@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  g In article <un6_c.86985$%n4.14845@bignews6.bellsouth.net>, Chuck Chopp <ChuckChopp@rtfmcsi.com> writes:KK >Is the Java source code for Tomcat [as built by HP for the CSWS_JAVA v2.1 X >product] available for review?h > L >I know it is based on Tomcat v4.1.24, which is the version that it reports G >in the server log files.  I'm currently tracking down the source of a rK >problem with "ClassNotfoundException" errors occurring when JSP files are lN >being automatically compiled into Java class files when a webapp is deployed I >on OpenVMS.  Given that Tomcat is open source, I was expecting that the rL >source code for CSWS_JAVA v2.1 would be available in the event that it was L >necessary to rebuild the product from scratch for purposes of fixing a bug  >in the product. >iL >Is there any contact information for Powell "Hap" Hazzard at HP?  His name G >appears in numerous comments in the Tomcat configuration files and it aM >appears that he's been one of the people responsible for maintenance of the h: >Tomcat implementation used in the CSWS JAVA v2.1 product.  < I would try writing to firstname dot lastname at hp dot com.  K Do you have a VMS support contract?  I'm under the impression that all thisrJ SWS stuff is covered under VMS support, and you can actually log a call on your TomCat problem.   -- Alan-   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 03 Sep 2004 20:08:28 -0400 * From: Chuck Chopp <ChuckChopp@rtfmcsi.com>: Subject: Re: Tomcat on OpenVMS - Is source code available?: Message-ID: <EH7_c.87307$%n4.70200@bignews6.bellsouth.net>  , Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote:  M > Do you have a VMS support contract?  I'm under the impression that all this_L > SWS stuff is covered under VMS support, and you can actually log a call on > your TomCat problem.  M I encountered this while doing some learning in a hobbyist environment.  I'm iM not certain that there's a way to open a support incident in that situation. SI   If anybody else is using Tomcat on OpenVMS *and* on at least one other NM platform, I'd be glad to provide my webapp archive file to them to drop in &  I test to see if the problem can be reproduced on their own OpenVMS system.S  G Given that Apache & Tomcat are open source, I thought that part of the sM license terms for the software included the requirement that the source code  B for the applications be made available along with the binary kits.     -- v Chuck Choppt  8 ChuckChopp (at) rtfmcsi (dot) com http://www.rtfmcsi.com  @ RTFM Consulting Services Inc.     864 801 2795 voice & voicemail2 103 Autumn Hill Road              864 801 2774 fax Greer, SC  29651  , Do not send me unsolicited commercial email.   ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 04 Sep 2004 00:32:46 GMTrL From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing): Subject: Re: Tomcat on OpenVMS - Is source code available?6 Message-ID: <00A37564.7D1C3C04@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  g In article <EH7_c.87307$%n4.70200@bignews6.bellsouth.net>, Chuck Chopp <ChuckChopp@rtfmcsi.com> writes:s- >Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote:  >oN >> Do you have a VMS support contract?  I'm under the impression that all thisM >> SWS stuff is covered under VMS support, and you can actually log a call oni >> your TomCat problem.a >8N >I encountered this while doing some learning in a hobbyist environment.  I'm N >not certain that there's a way to open a support incident in that situation. J >  If anybody else is using Tomcat on OpenVMS *and* on at least one other N >platform, I'd be glad to provide my webapp archive file to them to drop in & J >test to see if the problem can be reproduced on their own OpenVMS system. >hH >Given that Apache & Tomcat are open source, I thought that part of the N >license terms for the software included the requirement that the source code C >for the applications be made available along with the binary kits.h  J I'm only using Tomcat on VMS, and that not very much.  (I haven't had much chance to dig into it yet.)i  M But on Apache, I note that the sources easily available for CSWS aren't up toeO date.  VMS Engineering has been helpful when we asked for them, but haven't hadr time to do up a proper kit.y   -- Alanl   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Sep 2004 17:08:11 -0500r- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)_: Subject: Re: VMS website problem: DCPS release notes blank3 Message-ID: <x1FnzkNssYqf@eisner.encompasserve.org>-  b In article <030920041043272055%paul.anderson@hp.com>, Paul Anderson <paul.anderson@hp.com> writes:7 > In article <4137E927.A9D4C262@teksavvy.com>, JF MezeiD' > <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote:w > F >> which should contain the DCPS release notes in html format yields aF >> blank page with only the HP logos at the top. Looking at the source/ >> reveals a ton of javascript but no contents.y > C > I can view the release notes with Mozilla on OpenVMS, OmniWeb andtB > Safari on Macintosh and Mozilla Firefox and Internet Exploder on< > Windows.  What browser and operating system are you using?  4 http://validator.w3.org finds 46 errors on the page.  C Netscape Communicator V4.75-20000815 on MacOS 9.1 shows no content,r just the boilerplate.a   ------------------------------   Date: 3 Sep 2004 17:09:06 -0500x- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)i: Subject: Re: VMS website problem: DCPS release notes blank3 Message-ID: <FjvMpBrUt6Gx@eisner.encompasserve.org>f  b In article <030920041054301832%paul.anderson@hp.com>, Paul Anderson <paul.anderson@hp.com> writes:7 > In article <41387FB0.6B3DAB22@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezein' > <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote:, > F >> Just ran it through http://validator.w3.org and there are plenty of@ >> structural mistakes (nested <head> etc), as well as plenty ofA >> microsoft mistakes ( <script language= instead of the standard  >> <script type=  )8 > F > BTW, the DCPS HTML documentation is created by DECdocument.  I don'tG > know if additional changes are made by the time it gets to the publicm > site.c  A The part that I can see is the part _not_ created by DECdocument.n   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 3 Sep 2004 14:01:58 -05000 From: Kevin Monceaux <OwnedByDogs@grandecom.net>( Subject: Re: Yet Another Multia Question1 Message-ID: <20040903190158.GB2449@grandecom.net>a  	 Eberhard,l  H On Fri, Sep 03, 2004 at 09:44:05AM +0200, Eberhard Heuser-Hofmann wrote:  ; > I have produced a Multia bootable CDROM with OpenVMS 7.3.e  ' Is that CDROM available to hobbyists?  c  ? > You must update the firmware as described on the freeware CD.s  G I've already updated the firmware.  Now I just need soem install media.d   Kevinf http://www.RawFedDogs.netc   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2004.490 ************************4 First one I've seen but since we aren't official resellers any" more perhaps thats to be expected.  A On the last content page, HPTC Scalable Products, the last column 7 lists the HP AlphaServer SC45.  Processor listed is....   & 64-bit Alpha EV8 processor at 1.25 GHz  E I don't suppose a 'false advertising' claim coul                                <Z   <Z                     
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                 PK     m0oI              modify-attrib/chfpro/relink.com  Ŏ8   H                                 &*5   7q	Z                     
                 PK    !0[s                modify-attrib/chfpro/utility.c  F)   O   H   7 &                           m W   	Z                     
                 PK
      0                     A^ modify-attrib/chfpro/bin/alpha/  3             