1 INFO-VAX	Wed, 06 Apr 2005	Volume 2005 : Issue 192       Contents: compressing ftp  Re: DECCXX 7.x for AlphaH Re: Different behaviour of HP C on Alpha and VAX (thanks Ed, FJ and Hof)5 Re: DS15 RADEON 7500 hang solved (at least partially) 5 Re: Frustration!  EB64+ too old to run OpenVMS 7.3-1? 5 Re: Frustration!  EB64+ too old to run OpenVMS 7.3-1? 5 Re: Frustration!  EB64+ too old to run OpenVMS 7.3-1? 4 Re: High File Watermarking question for Hoff Hoffman4 Re: High File Watermarking question for Hoff Hoffman4 Re: High File Watermarking question for Hoff Hoffman4 Re: High File Watermarking question for Hoff Hoffman4 Re: High File Watermarking question for Hoff Hoffman4 Re: High File Watermarking question for Hoff Hoffman: Re: Maximum Mailbox limitations with OVMS732 and TCPIP54E4P Problem with Magneto-Optical and SCSI Bus going from Alpha 7.3 to 7.3-2 7.3-27.3* Re: problem with router---NAT and caching?* Re: problem with router---NAT and caching?* Re: problem with router---NAT and caching?/ Re: Procedure for installing PERL modules (LWP)  Re: Remote printing woes.  Re: Remote printing woes.  Re: Remote printing woes.  Re: shadow minicopy ; Stalker and Sophos Announce Support for OpenVMS (and Tru64) * SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?. Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?. Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?. Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?. Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?. Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?. Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?. Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?. Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?" Synergex/DE Now on OpenVMS Itanium Re: Time change questions  Re: Time change questions  Re: Time change questions  Re: Time change questions 0 Vernon, the VMS shark, looking for early testers4 Re: Vernon, the VMS shark, looking for early testers4 Re: Vernon, the VMS shark, looking for early testers4 Re: Vernon, the VMS shark, looking for early testers Re: VMS Command language.  Re: VMS Command language. # RE: VMS:  nothing else can compare? F Re: Which release notes say sts$manager:utc$configure_tdf  is obsoleteE Re: Which release notes say sts$manager:utc$configure_tdf is obsolete E Re: Which release notes say sts$manager:utc$configure_tdf is obsolete   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 10:45:16 +0100 0 From: Chris Sharman <chris.sharman@sorry.nospam> Subject: compressing ftp4 Message-ID: <d30b3c$kaq$1$8302bc10@news.demon.co.uk>  A Anyone know of an ftp client for vms which supports compression ?  There's now an rfc: G http://www.ietf.org/internet-drafts/draft-preston-ftpext-deflate-03.txt   D Presently using hgftp (can't see any mention), VMS 7.3-1, tcp/ip 5.3   Thanks Chris    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 13:04:37 GMT 5 From: "Ed Vogel" <edward.vogel_stop_the_spam.@hp.com> ! Subject: Re: DECCXX 7.x for Alpha 2 Message-ID: <F7R4e.3064$2C1.2785@news.cpqcorp.net>  4 "JOUKJ" <joukj@hrem.stm.tudelft.nl> wrote in message5 news:75ba9$4253cd2e$82a1f19e$6516@news1.tudelft.nl... 	 > Hi all,  > H > Does anybody knows when a release of DECCXX7.x for OpenVMS Alpha is to4 > be expected? Or is there some beta version around?  D     We expect to have a release available sometime this summer/fall.B     I have send your e-mail address to my manager, when field test'     kits are ready, he may contact you.    > I > I realy need the std:: namespace which will be present in that version.  > H     We are still working on this functionality for Alpha.  It was fairlyC     eaiser on IPF where we did not have to worry about compatiblity G     with existing objects.  There are still a few compatibily issues we B     need to resolve on Alpha.  So...there is some chance that this3     functionality will not be in the Alpha release.        Ed Vogel#     DEC/Compaq/HP C/C++ Engineering    ------------------------------   Date: 6 Apr 2005 02:20:32 -0700 1 From: ralf.gaertner@t-systems.com (Ralf Gaertner) Q Subject: Re: Different behaviour of HP C on Alpha and VAX (thanks Ed, FJ and Hof) = Message-ID: <e1b5cbf1.0504060120.62c385df@posting.google.com>   v ralf.gaertner@t-systems.com (Ralf Gaertner) wrote in message news:<e1b5cbf1.0504050103.4df3235d@posting.google.com>...G > I have a program which generates different messages on Alpha and VAX.  > - > - VAXstation 4000 , VMS 7.2 , DEC C 6.4-005  > G >   CC/DECC/OBJ=DSA1:[TEXMF2003.SOURCE.CWEB-3-64.VMS]CWEAVE.VAX_OBJ_V72  >     /DEFINE=(OPENVMS) 4 > DSA1:[TEXMF2003.SOURCE.CWEB-3-64.VMS]CWEAVE.C/LIST > * > - DS10 , VMS 7.2-1 , DEC C 6.4-005-46B10 > E >   CC/OBJ=DSA1:[TEXMF2003.SOURCE.CWEB-3-64.VMS]CWEAVE.AXP_OBJ_V721 -  >     /DEFINE=(OPENVMS) 4 > DSA1:[TEXMF2003.SOURCE.CWEB-3-64.VMS]CWEAVE.C/LIST > D > On the VAX the compiler does it's job without any messages, on the
 > Alpha I get , > a "informational message" and a "warning": >  > 3122 extern int strlen();  > ...........1@ > %CC-I-INTRINSICINT, (1) In this statement, the return type for > intrinsic 3 > "strlen" is being changed from "size_t" to "int".  > C > 3383 strcpy(collate+1," \1\2\3\4\5\6\7\10\11\12\13\14\15\16\17"); ? > .......1                                                      G > %CC-W-PTRMISMATCH1, (1) In this statement, the referenced type of the 	 > pointer D > value "collate+1" is "unsigned char", which is not compatible with > "char"3 > because they differ by signed/unsigned attribute.  > A > The warning is correct, since the array "collate" is defined as  > "unsigned char" G > and strcpy wants "char". But why is this only recognized on the Alpha  > and not on the VAX ? > G > P.S. I am attending the german DECUS symposium so I don't need a fast  > explanation.  ? Ed, thanks for the detailed explanation. You are right that the E declaration is loacally. The code is written by D.E.Knuth  and S.Levy B (available form an CTAN archive under systems/cweb) and ironicallyC they state that they are using local declarations to avoid problems A with include files; they don't know whether string.h or strings.h E should be used (and both exist within HP C). Unfortunately the strcpy D function from string.h wants a char and the array collate is defined by"   typedef char unsigned eight_bits  B JF, compiling with the /UNSIGNED qualifier looks to me more like a. workaround than a proper software development.  D Hoff, the /DEFINE=OPENVMS declares a hook to call a routine to parseF command line arguments using the CLD interface instead of the standard argc/argv construction.   ? I seems that I have to use the memmove function or write my own A "strcpy" (in fact with a diffent name) to use the eight_bits data  type.   C Thanks to all who replied and now I know what to do at the weekend.    Ralf   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Apr 2005 04:35:14 -0700 # From: "Galen" <gltackett@gmail.com> > Subject: Re: DS15 RADEON 7500 hang solved (at least partially)C Message-ID: <1112787314.082881.164730@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>    FredK wrote: > E > When the system locks up like that, it is likely that something has  wedgedA > on the PCI bus.  Since some of the problems are bus interaction  issues, 6 > you might try changing the slot that the card is in. >   G I moved the Radeon 7500 to a different slot a week ago. The DS10 hasn't E hung up since I did that. I also have the new Graphics V3 ECO for VMS $ V7.3-2 and will try it out soon too.  , I'll post again when there's more to report.   --   Galen    ------------------------------   Date: 6 Apr 2005 06:01:10 GMT 2 From: "Dave Weatherall" <djw-nothere@nospam.nohow>> Subject: Re: Frustration!  EB64+ too old to run OpenVMS 7.3-1?? Message-ID: <DTiotGxQ0bj6-pn2-jq2elsf78Wd7@dave2_os2.home.ours>   E On Tue, 5 Apr 2005 16:23:27 UTC, hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) wrote:   E >   or 4D20 will *probably* work here, but some of the newer graphics F >   controllers require EV6-class processors and non-swizzled bus I/O.   HoffF           you and Fred have mentioned 'swizzled' before. At the time ID thought must check it out but I forgot so, before I do again, can I  ask : what does 'swizzle' mean?    --   Cheers - Dave W.   ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 07:04:34 +0000 (UTC)P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)> Subject: Re: Frustration!  EB64+ too old to run OpenVMS 7.3-1?$ Message-ID: <d301m2$gc7$1@online.de>  F In article <3Yy4e.2985$vH.1818@news.cpqcorp.net>, hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) writes:    C >   I would personally aim for an AlphaStation series, including an B >   XP900, XP1000 or equivalent box.  I would not acquire an AlphaC >   system with less than an EV56 processor, and I would prefer and 6 >   would look for an EV6-class processor, or better.   F Why?  Obviously, these are more powerful machines.  Assuming, however,B that one doesn't need the power, is there a reason to say "EV56 orH later, preferably EV6 or later"?  One such reason would be that VMS 8.2 F won't support older ALPHAs (a few were dropped in 7.3-2); any idea if E this will be the case?  In particular, I have (at home) EV4 and EV45  C systems (and lots of VAXes); it would be nice to have at least 8.2  D supported on them (as a hobbyist, I am not concerned with "official G support" in the sense of help if something goes wrong, but rather with  0 being able to expect the configuration to work).   ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 14:08:39 +0000 (UTC)- From: klewis@OMEGA.MITRE.ORG (Keith A. Lewis) > Subject: Re: Frustration!  EB64+ too old to run OpenVMS 7.3-1?. Message-ID: <d30qh7$hml$2@newslocal.mitre.org>   helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) writes in article <d301m2$gc7$1@online.de> dated Wed, 6 Apr 2005 07:04:34 +0000 (UTC): G >In article <3Yy4e.2985$vH.1818@news.cpqcorp.net>, hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff  >Hoffman) writes:  > D >>   I would personally aim for an AlphaStation series, including anC >>   XP900, XP1000 or equivalent box.  I would not acquire an Alpha D >>   system with less than an EV56 processor, and I would prefer and7 >>   would look for an EV6-class processor, or better.   > G >Why?  Obviously, these are more powerful machines.  Assuming, however, C >that one doesn't need the power, is there a reason to say "EV56 or I >later, preferably EV6 or later"?  One such reason would be that VMS 8.2  G >won't support older ALPHAs (a few were dropped in 7.3-2); any idea if  F >this will be the case?  In particular, I have (at home) EV4 and EV45 D >systems (and lots of VAXes); it would be nice to have at least 8.2 E >supported on them (as a hobbyist, I am not concerned with "official  H >support" in the sense of help if something goes wrong, but rather with 1 >being able to expect the configuration to work).   L That's just it.  The older, slower machines go to the non-paying hobbyists. K At some point it becomes unproductive for HP to support them.  Remember who K you're dealing with -- this is a company that makes expiring ink cartriges. J If they can make a DEC 3000 obsolete, it represents a potential sale of anL XP1000 or even an Itanium.  The newer your CPU, the longer they have to waitI before this action would piss off an important business customer.  Hoff's 4 advice seems especially good for the long-term user.  0 --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.org> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 09:15:34 +0200% From: "Fred Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@KVI.nl> = Subject: Re: High File Watermarking question for Hoff Hoffman . Message-ID: <d3015i$3sc$1@info.service.rug.nl>  7 "Jeff Cameron" <roktsci@comcast.net> wrote in message = ) news:BE787C79.B0C0%roktsci@comcast.net...  > Dear Hoff, >=20$ > Settle an argument, if you please. >=20D > Is the following true or not, about High file Watermarking in VMS?  > Please feel free to elaborate. >=20 > Assertion:E > On a disk with High File Watermarking enabled, blocks are zeroed on  > allocation/extent.=20   D This was true only for the first versions of high file watermarking.F Later versions don't actually zero these blocks. It is sufficient to = return@ zero's when it is attempted to read blocks beyond the watermark.   > Supplemental: F > In the case of sequential files, the bytes between the logical and = physicalE > EOF are also zeroed when the logical file mark location is written.  >=20 > Thank you! > Jeff Cameron >    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 05:18:20 -0700 ( From: Jeff Cameron <roktsci@comcast.net>= Subject: Re: High File Watermarking question for Hoff Hoffman / Message-ID: <BE79219C.B135%roktsci@comcast.net>   K On 4/5/05 9:02 PM, in article bZNpq01qOQDe@eisner.encompasserve.org, "Larry ) Kilgallen" <Kilgallen@SpamCop.net> wrote:   > > In article <BE787C79.B0C0%roktsci@comcast.net>, Jeff Cameron > <roktsci@comcast.net> writes: 
 >> Dear Hoff,  >>  % >> Settle an argument, if you please.  >>  E >> Is the following true or not, about High file Watermarking in VMS? ! >> Please feel free to elaborate.  >>  
 >> Assertion: F >> On a disk with High File Watermarking enabled, blocks are zeroed on >> allocation/extent.  >>   >> Supplemental:N >> In the case of sequential files, the bytes between the logical and physicalF >> EOF are also zeroed when the logical file mark location is written. > E > Note that this is a _different_ assertion than the one in the other B > thread, which suggested that blocks on disk would be zeroed whenE > a file is opened, even though the EOF was at the start of the file.  Larry,    G So now you are saying that when you open a new file that blocks are not J allocated? If you are contending that I said "Blocks are zeroed on openingD an existing file", that is NOT what I meant or said. Maybe I did notL specifically say "When opening a NEW file", but that is what I always meant.  I All of my tests were opening a NEW files, which allocates blocks fro free 6 space, and with HFWM enabled, these blocks are zeroed.  K From the beginning of this thread we have only been talking about opening a   new file on a HFWM enabled disk.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 05:31:10 -0700 ( From: Jeff Cameron <roktsci@comcast.net>= Subject: Re: High File Watermarking question for Hoff Hoffman / Message-ID: <BE79249E.B137%roktsci@comcast.net>   F On 4/6/05 12:15 AM, in article d3015i$3sc$1@info.service.rug.nl, "Fred  Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@KVI.nl> wrote:   > 7 > "Jeff Cameron" <roktsci@comcast.net> wrote in message + > news:BE787C79.B0C0%roktsci@comcast.net... 
 >> Dear Hoff,  >>  % >> Settle an argument, if you please.  >>  E >> Is the following true or not, about High file Watermarking in VMS? ! >> Please feel free to elaborate.  >>  
 >> Assertion: F >> On a disk with High File Watermarking enabled, blocks are zeroed on >> allocation/extent.  > F > This was true only for the first versions of high file watermarking.M > Later versions don't actually zero these blocks. It is sufficient to return B > zero's when it is attempted to read blocks beyond the watermark. >  >> Supplemental:N >> In the case of sequential files, the bytes between the logical and physicalF >> EOF are also zeroed when the logical file mark location is written. >>  
 >> Thank you!  >> Jeff Cameron  >>  L I can see the advantage of doing so, but I continue to believe otherwise for several reasons:  & 1. The system Manager's manual states:G " For nonshared sequential  files, the performance impact of high-water K marking is minimal.  However, for files of nonsequential format, high-water J marking creates  some overhead; the system erases the previous contents ofE the disk  blocks allocated every time a file is created or extended."   C 2. When opening a new file using the system service SYS$ASSIGN thus G bypassing RMS, and not writing filemarks, that the newly allocated disk  blocks are always all zeros.  K 3. A very simple test where you open a new file preallocating a meg or more I of space clearly takes much longer on volume with HFWM enabled, than on a J volume that does not. (In this test opening a new file can literarily takeL several seconds with HFWM enabled, where it is almost immediate when HFWM is not enabled.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 12:44:43 GMT ( From: "Hein" <hein.nomail@hp.nomail.com>= Subject: Re: High File Watermarking question for Hoff Hoffman 1 Message-ID: <%QQ4e.3063$cI1.852@news.cpqcorp.net>   5 "Jeff Cameron" <roktsci@comcast.net> wrote in message ) news:BE79219C.B135%roktsci@comcast.net... F > On 4/5/05 9:02 PM, in article bZNpq01qOQDe@eisner.encompasserve.org, "Larry+ > Kilgallen" <Kilgallen@SpamCop.net> wrote:  > @ > > In article <BE787C79.B0C0%roktsci@comcast.net>, Jeff Cameron! > > <roktsci@comcast.net> writes:  > >> Dear Hoff,  > >>' > >> Settle an argument, if you please.  > >>G > >> Is the following true or not, about High file Watermarking in VMS? # > >> Please feel free to elaborate.  > >> > >> Assertion: H > >> On a disk with High File Watermarking enabled, blocks are zeroed on > >> allocation/extent.   G FALSE. Blocks are only zeroed when the EOF is moved in a non-sequential  manner. I Simple example: SET FILE/END. Or, a random access $PUT for a fixed length  record6 Block beyond EOF always return zeroes with HWM actives   > >> > >> Supplemental:G > >> In the case of sequential files, the bytes between the logical and  physicalH > >> EOF are also zeroed when the logical file mark location is written.  L FALSE. The blocks between HWM and target write are zeroed, not all allocated blocks.   G > > Note that this is a _different_ assertion than the one in the other D > > thread, which suggested that blocks on disk would be zeroed whenG > > a file is opened, even though the EOF was at the start of the file.    Right Larry.   > Larry, > I > So now you are saying that when you open a new file that blocks are not 
 allocated?  I No, he says they are not zeroed. The allocation method does not depend on  HWM.B But indeed blocks are not allocated to a new files, unless that is specifically requested. G Often the first allocation (using RMS) only happens on the first record  write.  A > If you are contending that I said "Blocks are zeroed on opening F > an existing file", that is NOT what I meant or said. Maybe I did notG > specifically say "When opening a NEW file", but that is what I always  meant.   Irrelevant.    Hope this helps, Hein.     K > All of my tests were opening a NEW files, which allocates blocks fro free 8 > space, and with HFWM enabled, these blocks are zeroed. > K > From the beginning of this thread we have only been talking about opening  a " > new file on a HFWM enabled disk. >    ------------------------------   Date: 6 Apr 2005 08:39:57 -0500  From: briggs@encompasserve.org= Subject: Re: High File Watermarking question for Hoff Hoffman 3 Message-ID: <vtfkjNORGCw8@eisner.encompasserve.org>   Z In article <BE79219C.B135%roktsci@comcast.net>, Jeff Cameron <roktsci@comcast.net> writes:M > From the beginning of this thread we have only been talking about opening a " > new file on a HFWM enabled disk.    A new file of what organization?  C When creating a new sequential file with a huge initial allocation, C the highwater mark is initially placed at the beginning of block 0.    Try it.    $ COPY NL: XYZ.DAT /ALLO=1000 # $ DUMP /HEAD XYZ.DAT /BLOCK=COUNT=0  ...	+     Highest block written:                0  ...  $   8 Highwater marking incurs no overhead for this operation.  B Now, if you move the end of file mark with $ SET FILE /END, you do incur some overhead.   $ SET FILE /END XYZ.DAT # $ DUMP /HEAD XYZ.DAT /BLOCK=COUNT=0  ... .     Highest block written:                1008 ...   D In normal operation on sequential files, you will typically be doingF a WRITE as your first operation on each block as the file is processedA and you will be updating the file header with updated end-of-file 2 and highwater information when you close the file.   	John Briggs   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 11:32:09 -0400 & From: Jilly <jilly@clarityconnect.com>= Subject: Re: High File Watermarking question for Hoff Hoffman B Message-ID: <1112801524.2336f00db1168742742166e80fd7d505@teranews>  K For those so inclined here is a little test, on an Alpha, you can do to see K what actually gets done at the VMS IO level.  Use a spare DK or DG disk, w/ 1 HWM enabled, that no one else is doing any IO to.    $ MOUNT/... testdisk	 $ ANA/SYS  DKLOG START testdisk EXIT/ $ COPY/ALLOC=1000 NL: testdisk:[000000]JUNK.DAT > $ ! wait a min or 2 so you can see the seperate steps in DKLOG( $ SET FILE/END testdisk:[000000]JUNK.DAT	 $ ANA/SYS  SET OUT DKLOG.LOG  DKLOG SHOW testdisk 
 DKLOG STOP DKLOG CLEAR testdisk EXIT  < Now DKLOG.LOG will have all the IO activity to the testdisk.   briggs@encompasserve.org wrote:   > > In article <BE79219C.B135%roktsci@comcast.net>, Jeff Cameron > <roktsci@comcast.net> writes: L >> From the beginning of this thread we have only been talking about opening% >> a new file on a HFWM enabled disk.  > " > A new file of what organization? > E > When creating a new sequential file with a huge initial allocation, E > the highwater mark is initially placed at the beginning of block 0.  > 	 > Try it.  >  > $ COPY NL: XYZ.DAT /ALLO=1000 % > $ DUMP /HEAD XYZ.DAT /BLOCK=COUNT=0  > ... - >     Highest block written:                0  > ...  > $  > : > Highwater marking incurs no overhead for this operation. > D > Now, if you move the end of file mark with $ SET FILE /END, you do > incur some overhead. >  > $ SET FILE /END XYZ.DAT % > $ DUMP /HEAD XYZ.DAT /BLOCK=COUNT=0  > ... 0 >     Highest block written:                1008 > ...  > F > In normal operation on sequential files, you will typically be doingH > a WRITE as your first operation on each block as the file is processedC > and you will be updating the file header with updated end-of-file 4 > and highwater information when you close the file. > 
 > John Briggs    --  B Jilly - Working from Home in the Chemung River Valley, Waverly, NYF       - jilly@stny.rr.com                http://home.stny.rr.com/jillyE       - mark.jilson@hp.com               http://www.hp.com/go/openvms ;       - http://www.jilsonracing.com      Go Fast, Turn Left C       - http://www.chemungspeedrome.com  Door Handle to Door Handle    ------------------------------   Date: 6 Apr 2005 15:17:28 +0100 6 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)C Subject: Re: Maximum Mailbox limitations with OVMS732 and TCPIP54E4 * Message-ID: <4253fd88@NEWS.LANGSTOEGER.AT>  h In article <1112732351.281800.268140@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, dave.baxter@bannerhealth.com writes:A >With OpenVMS 7.3-2 and TCPIP V5.4 ECO4, the maximum number of BG  >devices is increased to 32767.   8 As I see it, vanilla V5.4 brought the support, not ECO4.= But ECO4 is the current ECO for V5.4 and fixes a lot of bugs.   A >                               I understand that this is done by F >setting the sysconfig parameter "ovms_unit_maximum = 32767".   Do anyB >of the other parameters have to be changed?   In particular, I am >thinking about  > * >"ovms_unit_limit" (currently set to 9998)  , This is a status and not a config parameter.D It shows the calculated maximum number of concurrent BG device units# that can coexist at any given time. ! You cannot modify this parameter.   ) >"ovms_unit_fast_credel"  (currently = 0)   G The way as I read the release notes, setting "1" is required for BG>10k E otherwise it is only recommended (for systems "where large numbers of D BG devices are continously being created and deleted"). But I hadn'tF tried it, so I don't know if my interpretation of the release notes isH right. If you have enough memory (fast_credel needs some virtual memory)" set it to 1 and then forget it ;-)    E However, by using the scalable kernel of V5.4 (by defining the system D logical TCPIP$STARTUP_CPU_IMAGES to "PERF=ALL" - NOTE: there is onlyG the scalable kernel in V5.5 so no logical required then) TCPIP modifies  itself these parameters to   	ovms_unit_maximum = 32767 	ovms_unit_fast_credel = 1 	ovms_unit_minimum = 2   --   Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialist  E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 04:41:33 -0600 1 From: Sliderbot <sliderbot@cableNOSPAMMERone.net> Y Subject: Problem with Magneto-Optical and SCSI Bus going from Alpha 7.3 to 7.3-2 7.3-27.3 0 Message-ID: <1157f6q92751472@corp.supernews.com>  F I have had two problems occur when changing operating system versions:  I 1) I can no longer read 600mbyte magneto-optical 512k/sector media in my   2.3 Gbyte 512k/sector drive.  F 2) If I have a disk mounted on an external bus from a LSI Logic 8952U G SCSI card, I get a SCSI bus reset and crash if I start hitting the IDE   system disk very hard.  G I could sure use some help/ideas, and unfortunately am very limited in  G what I can do along the patches line.  The VMS distribution comes from  G an control system vendor that provides that and the distribution, so I  & cannot randomly load patches.  Thanks.   ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 09:10:46 +0000 (UTC)P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)3 Subject: Re: problem with router---NAT and caching? $ Message-ID: <d3092l$pau$1@online.de>  D In article <d2tnl1$iab$1@online.de>, helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de3 (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) writes:     > > The giveaway is J > > that only port 6000 is affected.  Probably tomorrow morning I'll test M > > JF's suggestion that it is some security feature in DECwindows, i.e. the  M > > problem should go away if I restart DECwindows.  Maybe the IP address is  5 > > cached somewhere in DECwindows when it starts up.  > 1 > OK, I just restarted DECwindows.  Same problem.   J > I just noticed something.  Changing the IP address as above (ifconfig -a> > shows that it is picked up) does NOT change the logical nameH > TCPIP$INET_HOSTADDR.  I have to go to work now, but will try changing F > this as well tonight or tomorrow morning and see if that solves the : > problem.  It might be that DECwindows uses this logical.  G Redefining the logicals as well doesn't help.  I also tried restarting  E TCPIP.  Doesn't help.  Next I'll try restarting TCPIP AND restarting  5 DECwindows.  If that doesn't work, I'll try a reboot.   A I'm pretty sure that the problem is at the VMS end and not at the C router: only port 6000 is affected, so it seems to be a DECwindows  I problem; I can see all the information in the router and the old address  D is nowhere to be found; for the router port 6000 is nothing special.  H Before I restart TCPIP and DECwindows and possibly reboot, I would like  to understand the following:  3    o  TCPIP SET INTERFACE <interface> <new address>   8    o  TCPIP SET CONF INTERFACE <interface> <new address>  !    o  @SYS$STARTUP:TCPIP_SHUTDOWN        o  @SYS$STARTUP:TCPIP_STARTUP  G    o  TCPIP$INET_HOST_ADDR (and UCX$INET_HOSTADDR; not sure why this is D       still there) STILL point to the OLD IP address.  Where is this       information stored?    ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 09:34:06 +0000 (UTC)P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)3 Subject: Re: problem with router---NAT and caching? $ Message-ID: <d30aed$rdo$1@online.de>  F > In article <d2tnl1$iab$1@online.de>, helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de5 > (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) writes:    J > Before I restart TCPIP and DECwindows and possibly reboot, I would like  > to understand the following: > 5 >    o  TCPIP SET INTERFACE <interface> <new address>  > : >    o  TCPIP SET CONF INTERFACE <interface> <new address> > # >    o  @SYS$STARTUP:TCPIP_SHUTDOWN  > " >    o  @SYS$STARTUP:TCPIP_STARTUP > I >    o  TCPIP$INET_HOST_ADDR (and UCX$INET_HOSTADDR; not sure why this is F >       still there) STILL point to the OLD IP address.  Where is this >       information stored?   D The address is stored in SYS$SYSTEM:TCPIP$CONFIG.DAT.  The "normal" I address of the machine is in there.  If I do a SET CONF INTERFACE, I see  F the new address IN ADDITION TO THE OLD ADDRESS.  If I then do another F SET CONF INTERFACE, then I see again the new address and the original B address, but not the previous address.  In other words, this file G contains a particular address, which is apparently fixed (I don't know  H why) and also the result of the LATEST TCPIP SET CONF INTERFACE command.  G It can't be set during startup of TCPIP, since I change the address in  G the configuration with TCPIP SET CONF INTERFACE then restarted TCPIP.   D My guess is that the TCPIP$INET_HOSTADDR logical is for some reason $ picking up this "permanent" address.  B Whether this has anything to do with my DECwindows-remote-display  problem I don't know.    ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 14:18:17 +0000 (UTC)- From: klewis@OMEGA.MITRE.ORG (Keith A. Lewis) 3 Subject: Re: problem with router---NAT and caching? . Message-ID: <d30r39$hml$3@newslocal.mitre.org>   helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) writes in article <d30aed$rdo$1@online.de> dated Wed, 6 Apr 2005 09:34:06 +0000 (UTC): G >> In article <d2tnl1$iab$1@online.de>, helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de 6 >> (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) writes:  > K >> Before I restart TCPIP and DECwindows and possibly reboot, I would like   >> to understand the following:   G Back in the '90s I attempted to use DECwindows on some Alphas which had K multiple tcp/ip interfaces to different networks.  I found I could only get F the DECwindows server to work on one interface at a time.  IIRC it wasF always the lowest numbered one, EWA0.  I don't know if this limitationK persists in the current DECwindows, or if it's related to your problem, but F for testing you might want to use Apache or the telnet service as your: primary server-side tool.  (Ping is OK, but it's not tcp.)  0 --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.org> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Apr 2005 06:01:11 GMT 2 From: "Dave Weatherall" <djw-nothere@nospam.nohow>8 Subject: Re: Procedure for installing PERL modules (LWP)? Message-ID: <DTiotGxQ0bj6-pn2-DdkUdd1LTnHC@dave2_os2.home.ours>   2 On Wed, 6 Apr 2005 03:32:25 UTC, "Craig A. Berry" & <craigberry@mac.com.spamfooler> wrote:   <Snip>   I > to do with Apache 2.0).  The work on Mozilla was a rare and refreshing  I > exception to this tendency, but I haven't seen signs that this work is  
 > ongoing.  @ I read yesterday (German C't magazine) that developement of new E versions of Mozilla had stopped. Maintenance work continues, however.    --   Cheers - Dave W.   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Apr 2005 06:58:02 -0700 # From: Chris@Reinhartfoodservice.com " Subject: Re: Remote printing woes.C Message-ID: <1112795882.386812.196610@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>   G I am not familiar with the Ricoh 1060 printers but the Ricoh printers I 0 have worked with use port 10001 instead of 9100.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 15:11:36 +0100 % From: David Gray <police@spamcop.net> " Subject: Re: Remote printing woes.8 Message-ID: <2er75116f0k131tvja1cmc02tiqme062sv@4ax.com>   Hi,   5 On Tue, 05 Apr 2005 19:13:59 -0500, David J Dachtera   >> Any thoughts? > H >Well, I'm a Multinet guy, myself, so I can't speak to your queue setup. > C >Instead, I'll refer you to the on-line doc.'s for TCP/IP Services.  >  >Go to the OpenVMS page at HP: >http://www.hp.com/go/openvms  > F >..., look under OpenVMS Information, and take the link to the OpenVMSE >Documentation page. There, you'll find a link to the TCP/IP Services G >documentation (currently, http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/tcpip54.html - # >subject to change without notice).    Ok thanks for that.       F >By the way: can you Telnet to the printer? ...on port 515? ...on port >9100?  / No I cannot telnet to either of the two ports.     > I >Should you happen to have a system running Multinet, try this command to 7 >see if it will show you what ports it is listening on:  >  >$ MULT SHOW/CONN/SNMP=a.b.c.d > 4 >(insert your printer's IP address, as appropriate).   No multinet I'm afraid.    Cheers 	Dave.     ------------------------------   Date: 6 Apr 2005 09:59:34 -0500  From: briggs@encompasserve.org" Subject: Re: Remote printing woes.3 Message-ID: <UEnkGrIq2Z$3@eisner.encompasserve.org>r  ` In article <2er75116f0k131tvja1cmc02tiqme062sv@4ax.com>, David Gray <police@spamcop.net> writes:  [David Dachtera (I think) asked]G >>By the way: can you Telnet to the printer? ...on port 515? ...on portH >>9100?e > 1 > No I cannot telnet to either of the two ports.    < How quickly does the connection fail?  And with what status?  D If it's a slow failure (a few seconds to a minute or so) then you're9 probably looking at a non-existent IP address, a firewallo) blockage or a bit-bucket routing failure.i  @ If it's a fast failure (instant) then you're probably looking at8 a printer that's not listening on the port, a router ACLF that's rejecting your connection or some other routing failure that is reported back to the client.  C PING or TRACEROUTE will diagnose most routing issues not associated 
 with ACLs.  D With Unix and Multinet, the status that I get when the server is not8 listening on the specified port is "connection refused".  G A router ACL (ICMP host unreachable, administratively prohibited) givesT/ me a "No route to host" diagnostic on Multinet.U   	John Briggs   ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 07:23:59 +0000 (UTC)P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) Subject: Re: shadow minicopy$ Message-ID: <d302qf$ien$1@online.de>  9 In article <d2uv7h$4vk$1@news01.intel.com>, Ken Fairfielde! <my.full.name@intel.com> writes: O  K > >>     Finally, its recommended VAX nodes in a mixed-architecture clustereI > >>have SHADOW_MAX_COPY set to 0 because they cannot have Write Bitmaps,iH > >>and if they "accidently" pick up the copy, it will be done as a full > >>copy, not a mini-copy.  B Of course, if both members are on a VAX (this is only the case forE system-disk shadow sets), I would prefer that VAX to do the copy, not G another system.  This is only an issue when replacing a failed disk or :H adding an additional member to a shadow set in order to make a copy (of H course, I'll have to shut down to dismount it cleanly, but I can add it G without a reboot).  Since SHADOW_MAX_COPY is dynamic, perhaps I should -C set it to 0 on the VAXes and then change it on the fly on the rare  E occasions when I need to do a full copy on the VAX (in such cases, a f. minicopy would not be possible even on ALPHA).  J > > I have VAXes and ALPHAs in the cluster.  I have shadow sets with both K > > members on the same VAX, on two different VAXes, and on the same ALPHA.eG > > None on two different ALPHAs yet, but that will probably come soon.7 > > K > > Which type of shadow set could benefit from MINIMERGE? From MINICOPY?  0E > > Is it clear from which node the DISMOUNT would have to be issued.@ > E >      Well the VAXes can't do minicopy at all.  The shadow sets that7B > have both members on a single VAX should not be a problem since,G > presumably, when that VAX goes down, those shadow sets get dismountedlF > cleanly and won't need a copy.   Get a less-than-clean dismount, and& > you'll need to merge (but not copy).   Right, but see above.   H >      For the case where shadow set members are on different VAX nodes,E > you may be able to do a Dismount/Policy=Minicopy _from an Alpha_ ofaF > the shadow set member attached to the shutting-down VAX.  The manualH > didn't list any restrictions on doing a minicopy of MSCP-served disks,H > so the Alpha _should_ be able to do the minicopy when the VAX reboots.  D This is the case I'm interested in.  I have my biggest shadow set (aI pair of 9GB Seagate disks) on two VAXes, primarily to avoid copies since SG I reboot ALPHAs much more often (since patches are much more common).  AG However, occasionally a VAX reboot is necessary, such as when applying -I patches, doing an upgrade etc.  In such cases, I reboot only one node at fF a time, to keep the shadow set up, but it would be nice if there copy ) were faster (it takes several hours now).a  G > For a full-copy, you'd want to avoid such a "remote shadow copy", but D > for a minicopy, there are relatively few disk blocks that actually1 > need to be copied so it's really not a problem.   E Right.  Again, see above for cases where a full copy would be needed.   G >      For the shadow sets with both members attached to a given Alpha,[E > it seems this is the same as shadow sets with both members attachedVA > to the same VAX.  Get a clean dismount of the shadow set during F > shutdown and you're set.  Get a less-than-clean dismount, and you'll > need to merge.  C Again, if I add an additional disk to the shadow set so that I can OI extract a clean copy after shutting down the system, I would need a full o copy.u  F >      VAXes can't do HBMM either so a full merge of shadow sets whereF > both members are attached to the same VAX would be a sort of a worst	 > case.     $ Right, but fortunately this is rare.  = > If you install the HBMM kit on your Alphas, and if at leastnG > one Alpha stays up when another cluster member goes down, it _should_7D > be able to do minimerges on the available shadow sets (if both/allB > members are still available, not for those where one member gets; > dropped when its host leaves the cluster; that's a copy).h  G I'm assuming that SHADOW_MAX_COPY also applies to merges.  If not, let nD me know.  If I set it to 1 on the ALPHAs (with higher values, I get G errors due to packet collisions on the LAN---this is an LAVC) and 0 on iH the VAXes, then in the case of a VAX system crash followed by automatic H reboot, the surviving ALPHAs should be able to minimerge the VAX shadow 
 sets---right?h  A >      Personally, I'd expect this to work, Alphas minimerging oroE > minicopying shadow sets with members attached to VAXes, but I'm noteE > sure VMS Engineering has tested it; we haven't).   Also, I may haveaH > missed some key restriction in the docs (since we weren't "interested"D > in VAXes during our testing).  I think it's well worth reading theE > HBMM Release Notes and the Volume Shadowing manual, and then try itg, > out if it's not explicitly disallowed. :-)  I Right.  I might have a similar test cluster I can play with.  Otherwise, DE I suppose that I can't break anything and the worst case will be the e situation as it is now anyway.  H >      Note that HBMM (and minicopy, IIRC) requires your Alphas to be at0 > V7.3-1 or above, and your VAXes to be at V7.3.  F That's the case now.  Actually, I plan to go to 7.3-2 first.  Is HBMM I and minicopy really available for 7.3-1?  If so, is it in a patch, or is i it a separate kit?   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 10:21:58 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>aD Subject: Stalker and Sophos Announce Support for OpenVMS (and Tru64)R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB59579A@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>  = The readers of this list might be interested in the following   announcements on March 22, 2005:  9 http://www.stalker.com/content/news_article_03222005.htmlIF http://www.sophos.com/pressoffice/pressrel/us/20050322stalkersoft.htmlF "Sophos and Stalker Software partner to provide total virus protection  G Lynnfield, MA - Sophos, a global leader in network security and StalkeriF Software, the technology leader in email, collaboration, and real-timeH communication solutions, today announced a formal partnership. With thisD agreement, Stalker Software offers CommuniGate Pro messaging users aE sophisticated and comprehensive anti-virus solution. Stalker Software:E and Sophos joined forces in response to demand in the Japanese marketxF from partners as well as to the needs of customers running on HP Tru64C and OpenVMS, platforms that have historically been neglected by ther anti-virus software industry.t   [snip..]   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultantc HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477r kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Apr 2005 23:41:18 -0700-% From: Bart.Zorn@xs4all.nl (Bart Zorn)23 Subject: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?T= Message-ID: <a98cd882.0504052241.4de24f32@posting.google.com>R  E According to HELP SUBMIT /USER you need CMKRNL privilege and read AND$ WRITE access to SYSUAF.t  @ And indeed, when you try it with only read access to SYSUAF, the command fails.  F Does anybody have any idea what/why SUBMIT/USER would want to write to SYSUAF ?  B It looks like it does not write anything, though, because there is nothing in the audit log.s  	 Bart Zornu   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 09:33:09 +0200h& From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@decus.ch>7 Subject: Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?o, Message-ID: <3bhhlkF6hsvi1U3@individual.net>   Michel HERRSCHER wrote:   $ > Dans un message Bart Zorn disait : >  >  > H >>Does anybody have any idea what/why SUBMIT/USER would want to write to
 >>SYSUAF ? >> >  >  >  >  > D >>It looks like it does not write anything, though, because there is >>nothing in the audit log.e >  >  > K > NOP ....it is to record last batch login on the user record ... I supposel > : I wouldn't have thought so. Think about SUBMIT/USER/AFTER.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 09:20:24 +0200+ From: "Michel HERRSCHER" <mhc@herrscher.fr>l7 Subject: Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?t6 Message-ID: <42538db6$0$3116$8fcfb975@news.wanadoo.fr>  " Dans un message Bart Zorn disait :    H > Does anybody have any idea what/why SUBMIT/USER would want to write to
 > SYSUAF ? >e        D > It looks like it does not write anything, though, because there is > nothing in the audit log.s    I NOP ....it is to record last batch login on the user record ... I supposeo   -- i Michel HERRSCHER CONSULTANT ; Prsident WINDASSO - Association des utilisateurs WxxDEV(c)n# Tel : +33450870912 Fax:+33450871741h http://www.windasso.orgs   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Apr 2005 01:01:03 -0700r  From: "JLR" <jl.rayon@gmail.com>7 Subject: Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ? B Message-ID: <1112774463.426091.84970@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>  1 May be to look if the user have the BATCH access.n   exemple:  # Primary days:   Mon Tue Wed Thu FriA+ Secondary days:                     Sat Sun F Primary   000000000011111111112222  Secondary 000000000011111111112222F Day Hours 012345678901234567890123  Day Hours 012345678901234567890123F Network:  ##--####################            ----#################---   JLRt   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Apr 2005 01:08:29 -0700i  From: "JLR" <jl.rayon@gmail.com>7 Subject: Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?eC Message-ID: <1112774909.205767.205790@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>t   Oups..  F Primary   000000000011111111112222  Secondary 000000000011111111112222F Day Hours 012345678901234567890123  Day Hours 012345678901234567890123G Network:   ##--####################            ----#################--- $ Batch:      ##--#################### ----#################---% Local:       ##--####################u ----#################---% Dialup:      ##--####################u ----#################---G Remote:    ##--####################            ----#################---n   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 05:11:19 -04002- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>t7 Subject: Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?fB Message-ID: <1112778661.1fef56a297a23b15dfb60199d86f5b85@teranews>   Bart Zorn wrote:H > Does anybody have any idea what/why SUBMIT/USER would want to write to
 > SYSUAF ?    G When you submit/user, the queue manager  accesses SYSUAF on the node itgG is running on as the job is being accepted, so it isn't just the SUBMIT & command which wants access to SYSUAF.   H There may be cases where an application uses $SNDJBC to submit jobs, andE if this is done from an application installed with CMKRNL for anotherwH purpose,  it would allow a submit/user even though the user shoudln't be? allowed. Requiring write access to the file bypasses  installedyG privileges and requires write access. (unless the app also has sysprv).,   That is just my speculation.   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Apr 2005 07:26:15 -0700t% From: Bart.Zorn@xs4all.nl (Bart Zorn) 7 Subject: Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?e= Message-ID: <a98cd882.0504060626.2c2e0c33@posting.google.com>@  w JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote in message news:<1112778661.1fef56a297a23b15dfb60199d86f5b85@teranews>...t > Bart Zorn wrote:J > > Does anybody have any idea what/why SUBMIT/USER would want to write to > > SYSUAF ? >  > I > When you submit/user, the queue manager  accesses SYSUAF on the node it I > is running on as the job is being accepted, so it isn't just the SUBMITn( > command which wants access to SYSUAF.  > J > There may be cases where an application uses $SNDJBC to submit jobs, andG > if this is done from an application installed with CMKRNL for anothergJ > purpose,  it would allow a submit/user even though the user shoudln't beA > allowed. Requiring write access to the file bypasses  installedaI > privileges and requires write access. (unless the app also has sysprv).i >  > That is just my speculation.  F Could be. However, I find it a bit far-fetched. The queue manager also- would need only read access for that purpose.   D In general, I can accept that read access is needed, but I don't see any need for write access.  B Logging the last non-interactive access is done by LOGINOUT at theC moment the batch job actually starts, under the specified username.t   Anyone any other ideas?   	 Bart Zorni   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Apr 2005 10:08:14 -0500h From: briggs@encompasserve.org7 Subject: Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ?l3 Message-ID: <uKDMdo1I$YuM@eisner.encompasserve.org>l  e In article <a98cd882.0504060626.2c2e0c33@posting.google.com>, Bart.Zorn@xs4all.nl (Bart Zorn) writes:ey > JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote in message news:<1112778661.1fef56a297a23b15dfb60199d86f5b85@teranews>...o >> Bart Zorn wrote:uK >> > Does anybody have any idea what/why SUBMIT/USER would want to write to7
 >> > SYSUAF ?s >> m >> nJ >> When you submit/user, the queue manager  accesses SYSUAF on the node itJ >> is running on as the job is being accepted, so it isn't just the SUBMIT) >> command which wants access to SYSUAF. 0 >> kK >> There may be cases where an application uses $SNDJBC to submit jobs, andaH >> if this is done from an application installed with CMKRNL for anotherK >> purpose,  it would allow a submit/user even though the user shoudln't beiB >> allowed. Requiring write access to the file bypasses  installedJ >> privileges and requires write access. (unless the app also has sysprv). >> t >> That is just my speculation.t > H > Could be. However, I find it a bit far-fetched. The queue manager also/ > would need only read access for that purpose.  > F > In general, I can accept that read access is needed, but I don't see > any need for write access. > D > Logging the last non-interactive access is done by LOGINOUT at theE > moment the batch job actually starts, under the specified username.s >  > Anyone any other ideas?h   I like JF's suggestion.:  D If you _don't_ have write access to the UAF, it's not clear that you? are really a system mangler.  For those systems on which SYSUAF > has world read access enabled, read access doesn't prove much.  F Of course, if someone has "chicken" privilege [change mode to Colonel]@ turned on, and they know what they're doing, they own the system4 anyway.  But not everyone knows what they are doing.   	John Briggs   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 11:37:51 -04004 From: "Peter Weaver" <newsgroup@weaverconsulting.ca>7 Subject: Re: SUBMIT/USER needs write access to SYSUAF ? , Message-ID: <3bie2jF6j1r9sU1@individual.net>   Bart Zorn wrote: >...H > Does anybody have any idea what/why SUBMIT/USER would want to write to
 > SYSUAF ? > D > It looks like it does not write anything, though, because there is > nothing in the audit log.- >...   $ SET WATCH/CLASS=MAJOR FILE7 tells me that SUBMIT/USER is not writing to the SYSUAF;o  C %XQP, Thread #0, Access SYSUAF.DAT;1 (10065,168,0) Status: 00000001sD %XQP, Thread #0, Deaccess (10065,168,0) Reads: 4, Writes: 0, Status: 00000001  9 at least on a V7.1 VAX with both SUBMIT and SUBMIT/AFTER.n   --   Peter Weaver Weaver Consulting Services Inc.s Canadian VAR for CHARON-VAXy www.weaverconsulting.ca@   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 11:37:34 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>t+ Subject: Synergex/DE Now on OpenVMS ItaniumlR Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB5957B0@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>  F Apologies if this was previously posted, but I did not remember seeing it posted here.=20  E For those on the list that use Synergex/DE, the following might be of>	 interest:/  ; http://www.synergex.com/Company/Articledetail.asp?id=3D2707 > "Synergy/DE now available on HP OpenVMS for Integrity Servers"   February 17, 2005=20  C GOLD RIVER, Calif. and PALO ALTO, Calif. -- Synergex today releasedHG Synergy/DE 8.1.7c on HP OpenVMS 8.2 for HP Integrity servers. With thislB release, Synergex customers can easily move their Synergy businessH applications to the new Itanium(r) 2-based HP Integrity server platform.  8 OpenVMS for Integrity servers provides a cost-effective,B industry-standard platform for OpenVMS developers. The new OpenVMSB version (8.2) enhances key properties of OpenVMS such as security,A scalability, availability, performance, and interoperability with  UNIX(r).=20o  E "We have a strong relationship with Synergex and were pleased to worktE with them on the Synergy/DE port to OpenVMS for Integrity servers. WeyF look forward to working with Synergex and their customers through thisH migration and beyond," said Mark Gorham, VP, OpenVMS systems division at HP.=20  F Synergex's port to OpenVMS on the Integrity server platform involved aE collaborative effort between Synergex and HP--and both companies willeA provide assistance to Synergex customers with their migrations tos Integrity servers.   [snip..]   Regardsh  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultanti HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 13:52:10 +0000 (UTC)- From: klewis@OMEGA.MITRE.ORG (Keith A. Lewis)M" Subject: Re: Time change questions. Message-ID: <d30pia$hml$1@newslocal.mitre.org>   hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond) writes in article <ssC4e.3028$r%.1746@news.cpqcorp.net> dated Tue, 05 Apr 2005 20:22:48 GMT:E >In article <1112725735.230292.165410@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>, m >tadamsmar@yahoo.com writes: >: >...D >>           ... trains play catch-up in the spring and wait at the : >>station for an hour in the fall to get back on schedule. >o8 >(1) This statement is biased to the northern hemisphere  I No, DST works the same way down under -- spring forward, fall back.  TheyiF just don't have spring and fall at the same time as we do.   Where DST& doesn't play well is near the equator.  E >(2) In the specific case of Amtrack, the trains always play catch-up 1 >and never succeed.  O.K., _ALMOST_ never...  ;-)o  G Poor Amtrak.  A train company trying to survive in the land of Orville,a Wilbur, and Henry.  0 --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.org> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 13:56:05 GMT 3 From: hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond)p" Subject: Re: Time change questions1 Message-ID: <VTR4e.3070$XL1.635@news.cpqcorp.net>a  , In article <d2utns$4a6$1@news01.intel.com>, . Ken Fairfield <my.full.name@intel.com> writes:  - >  @sys$manager:utc$configure_tdf SET -240 60 % >                                 ^^^: >g@ >     I just wanted to note that, while Charlie Hammond has gone: >to great lengths to discourage use of this procedure,this< >procedure still operates as expected if you comment-out the% >"EXIT 2" following his warning text.V  + This depends on your expectations!  <smile>W  ; >     We still use this procedure for "business reasons".      Have you investigated using:  +     @SYS$MANAGER:UTC$TIME_SETUP TDF -240 60k  , This has the advantage of being supported.  E UTD$CONFIGURE_TDF.COM is no longer maintained by OpenVMS engineering.K   --  J       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale  FL  USAF           (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 17:11:06 GMTo3 From: hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond)i" Subject: Re: Time change questions2 Message-ID: <KKU4e.3112$BZ1.1943@news.cpqcorp.net>  / In article <d30pia$hml$1@newslocal.mitre.org>,  / klewis@OMEGA.MITRE.ORG (Keith A. Lewis) writes: / >hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond) k\ writes in article <ssC4e.3028$r%.1746@news.cpqcorp.net> dated Tue, 05 Apr 2005 20:22:48 GMT:F >>In article <1112725735.230292.165410@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,  >>tadamsmar@yahoo.com writes:u >> >>...eE >>>           ... trains play catch-up in the spring and wait at the h; >>>station for an hour in the fall to get back on schedule.  >>9 >>(1) This statement is biased to the northern hemisphere. > J >No, DST works the same way down under -- spring forward, fall back.  TheyG >just don't have spring and fall at the same time as we do.   Where DSTu' >doesn't play well is near the equator.l ..   I stand corrected.   --  J       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale  FL  USAF           (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 10:49:14 -0700m, From: Ken Fairfield <my.full.name@intel.com>" Subject: Re: Time change questions+ Message-ID: <d317er$6jn$1@news01.intel.com>c   Charlie Hammond wrote:. > In article <d2utns$4a6$1@news01.intel.com>, 0 > Ken Fairfield <my.full.name@intel.com> writes: >  > - >> @sys$manager:utc$configure_tdf SET -240 60j% >>                                ^^^t >>@ >>    I just wanted to note that, while Charlie Hammond has gone; >>to great lengths to discourage use of this procedure,thisp= >>procedure still operates as expected if you comment-out the-& >>"EXIT 2" following his warning text. >  > - > This depends on your expectations!  <smile>i > ; >>    We still use this procedure for "business reasons".  u >  >  > Have you investigated using: > - >     @SYS$MANAGER:UTC$TIME_SETUP TDF -240 60d > . > This has the advantage of being supported.  G > UTD$CONFIGURE_TDF.COM is no longer maintained by OpenVMS engineering.   E     Thanks Charlie, I'll check that out.  In our environment, I wouldiD leave off the 3rd parameter since I _don't_ want the clock to changeG (we take care of that "external" to this routine).  My main requirementiF is to avoid interactive prompting and to change the in-memory TDF cell value...   	-Ken_ -- c6 I don't speak for Intel, Intel doesn't speak for me...  
 Ken Fairfield"! D1C Automation VMS System Supports" who:   kenneth dot h dot fairfield where: intel dot com   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 08:15:28 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>o9 Subject: Vernon, the VMS shark, looking for early testersaB Message-ID: <1112789730.3713bfac4406c53314e1a7f4c6efcf24@teranews>  E I've created a .zip file with a few vector formats of Vernon, the VMSsB shark. I'd appreciate if anyone with Freehand or Illustrator couldE download the zip file, open it and try to open the artwork with theirP, software and let me know if it works or not.  G the download page is at http://www.vaxination.ca/vms/shark/index.html , ) look for the "Vernon vector sources box".   H If you have illustrator and are able to open the file, I'd be interestedE to know if the shark is still divided into many named layers or if it- comes out as a flat object.   H The stuff was created on a MAC, downlaods is binary to VMS, used ZIP 2.2E to pack it (without the /VMS switch).  Am able to unpack it on my MACl@ and use the files, except that the README.TXT has the wrong lineB terminations. (if I zipped it on the MAC, then unzipping it on VMSB resulted in the files being qualified as STREAM-LF, but having istF contents as STREAM-CR resulting in "record too long for user's buffer"F message. However, once fixed, I was able to include the .eps file intoE decwrite. (I am still at 7.2 so still have the ability to include epss  files in decwrite or cda-viewer.  A The zip fiel also include the original corel .PICT file stored in E macbinary. The CDA converters onVMS seem happy with the file, but thesC resulting object is totally transparent ( but there is an object ).r  H I know that the CDA converters expect a macbinary format for PICT files.D However, not sure about Windows boxes whi have capability to look at PICT files.H  < (it is under construction, so the page may not look good :-(    A Once I know this works, I will then rasterize various versions incA various sizes and backgrounds (as well as some transparent ones).l  F And if you have additional information to provide about the origins of' the VMS shark, please forward it to me.b  E Does anyone knwo which font was used to write the "OpenVMS" above theiE shark in the various square images that have bene generated so far one
 others ites ?s   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 14:59:00 +0200a3 From: Michael Unger <spam.to.unger@spamgourmet.com>e= Subject: Re: Vernon, the VMS shark, looking for early testerse, Message-ID: <3bi4t8F6f6c4cU1@individual.net>  & On 2005-04-06 14:15, "JF Mezei" wrote:  G > I've created a .zip file with a few vector formats of Vernon, the VMS D > shark. I'd appreciate if anyone with Freehand or Illustrator couldG > download the zip file, open it and try to open the artwork with theirg. > software and let me know if it works or not. >  > [...]  > J > I know that the CDA converters expect a macbinary format for PICT files.F > However, not sure about Windows boxes whi have capability to look at
 > PICT files.   H I have been able to get the zip archive and to extract the various files: on a W2k system; Adobe Acrobat (v6.0) was able to open theG "shark_1teeth.eps" file and to convert it to PDF (about 200x135 mm page G size, 21 kB file size). Then I created a high quality JPG file from thed% PDF (1578x1066 px, 137 kB file size).   0 I haven't tested the "shark_2teeth.eps" version.   > [...]r > C > Once I know this works, I will then rasterize various versions indC > various sizes and backgrounds (as well as some transparent ones).P  % I already have my JPG version ... ;-)(   > [...]T   Michaeln   --  ; Real names enhance the probability of getting real answers.d5 My e-mail account at DECUS Munich is no longer valid.-   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 15:29:13 +0200r3 From: Michael Unger <spam.to.unger@spamgourmet.com>-= Subject: Re: Vernon, the VMS shark, looking for early testersT, Message-ID: <3bi6l1F6kqqtbU1@individual.net>  & On 2005-04-06 14:15, "JF Mezei" wrote:  G > I've created a .zip file with a few vector formats of Vernon, the VMStD > shark. I'd appreciate if anyone with Freehand or Illustrator couldG > download the zip file, open it and try to open the artwork with theirC. > software and let me know if it works or not. >  > [...]I > G > Does anyone knwo which font was used to write the "OpenVMS" above thePG > shark in the various square images that have bene generated so far onT > others ites ?C  G I've finally found that font (or at least a font which looks very, very E similar) in the W2k standard fonts package -- it is called "Mistral".    Michaels   -- n; Real names enhance the probability of getting real answers.m5 My e-mail account at DECUS Munich is no longer valid.e   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 11:34:48 -0400# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>n= Subject: Re: Vernon, the VMS shark, looking for early testersu, Message-ID: <voednTs0bf08nMnfRVn-gg@igs.net>   JF Mezei wrote:rG > I've created a .zip file with a few vector formats of Vernon, the VMSoD > shark. I'd appreciate if anyone with Freehand or Illustrator couldG > download the zip file, open it and try to open the artwork with theiri. > software and let me know if it works or not. > G > the download page is at http://www.vaxination.ca/vms/shark/index.htmli- > , look for the "Vernon vector sources box".h >h? > If you have illustrator and are able to open the file, I'd beoB > interested to know if the shark is still divided into many named- > layers or if it comes out as a flat object.E >GF > The stuff was created on a MAC, downlaods is binary to VMS, used ZIPG > 2.2 to pack it (without the /VMS switch).  Am able to unpack it on myTF > MAC and use the files, except that the README.TXT has the wrong lineD > terminations. (if I zipped it on the MAC, then unzipping it on VMSD > resulted in the files being qualified as STREAM-LF, but having istH > contents as STREAM-CR resulting in "record too long for user's buffer"H > message. However, once fixed, I was able to include the .eps file intoG > decwrite. (I am still at 7.2 so still have the ability to include epso" > files in decwrite or cda-viewer. >tC > The zip fiel also include the original corel .PICT file stored inhG > macbinary. The CDA converters onVMS seem happy with the file, but theaE > resulting object is totally transparent ( but there is an object ).s >sC > I know that the CDA converters expect a macbinary format for PICT E > files. However, not sure about Windows boxes whi have capability to  > look at PICT files.l >(> > (it is under construction, so the page may not look good :-( >  >}C > Once I know this works, I will then rasterize various versions inoC > various sizes and backgrounds (as well as some transparent ones).M > H > And if you have additional information to provide about the origins of) > the VMS shark, please forward it to me.- > G > Does anyone knwo which font was used to write the "OpenVMS" above the5G > shark in the various square images that have bene generated so far on  > others ites ?o    B I have not looked at the font but offer the following suggestions:  I a) Wordperfect (PC versions) and Corel Draw shipped with what seems to be C about 1000 fonts....there may be a match in their font collections.o  F b) You could check on-line with several of the type foundry's - Adobe,0 Letraset, Bitstream to see which font it may be.     --F OpenVMS - The never advertised operating system with the dwindling ISV base.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 09:13:48 +0200@& From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@decus.ch>" Subject: Re: VMS Command language., Message-ID: <3bhghaF6hsvi1U1@individual.net>   Bill Gunshannon wrote:  8 > In article <slrnd53vs0.e75.usenet@gaia.roc2.gblx.net>,* > 	Dan Foster <usenet@evilphb.org> writes: > H >>DEC also had a POSIX CLI available as well, IIRC. I don't think it was >>used much, if at all.s >> >  > F > It's been a long time since I tried, so my memory may be a bit foggyD > but, I seem to remember there was an option at one time (and maybe9 > still!) that let you set an optional CLI at login time.l >    $ help login /cliv   LOGIN       /CLIe  *          /CLI=command-language-interpreter  E       Specifies the name of an alternate command language interpretereB       (CLI) to override the default CLI listed in the UAF. The CLIF       you specify must be located in SYS$SYSTEM and have the file type       .EXE.   C       If you do not specify a command interpreter by using the /CLIBD       qualifier and you do not have a default CLI listed in the UAF,<       the system supplies the qualifier /CLI=DCL by default.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 09:25:54 +0200+ From: "Michel HERRSCHER" <mhc@herrscher.fr>i" Subject: Re: VMS Command language.7 Message-ID: <42538eff$0$25023$8fcfb975@news.wanadoo.fr>   ( Dans un message Larry Kilgallen disait :  D > In article <4252406E.12270.42684CB@localhost>, "Stanley F. Quayle"" > <squayle@insight.rr.com> writes:, >> On 4 Apr 2005 at 17:27, Tom Linden wrote:* >>> Was there ever any alternative to DCL?  C YOURS one, as you can include your very personnal and extensive newm& commands... complie and then use it...  E Also remember that one user may use DCL another POsix ( up to V7 if I @ remember ) and a third MVOPRTD ( My Very Own Replacement To DCL)   ;-)))   4 HOVWCALT ( Hoping OpenVms Will Continue A Long Time) Michel HERRSCHER CONSULTANTa; Prsident WINDASSO - Association des utilisateurs WxxDEV(c)s# Tel : +33450870912 Fax:+33450871741  http://www.windasso.orga   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 09:46:49 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>k, Subject: RE: VMS:  nothing else can compare?R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB595790@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----7 > From: Rob Young [mailto:young_r@encompasserve.org]=20u > Sent: April 6, 2005 1:34 AM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com - > Subject: Re: VMS: nothing else can compare?n >=20  	 [snip ..]d  ? 	Where does the uptime come from?  RAC.  RAC on Linux clusters.l< 	Doesn't matter if the nodes drop like flies.  You can thank< 	the VMS folks that passed it to the Tru64 folks who (insert? 	best crazy conspiracy theory here) passed it to Larry who toldm> 	the troops to stuff it in Oracle.  Real Clustering.  Was that undere9 	GP Bob's watch?  I forget.  Point is, earlier you state:$   [snip..]  B There is a lot more to consider than just cheap HW when looking atE mission critical app's. The HW is typically the smallest piece of theo pie to worry about.=20  F Typically staffing who understand the business and the way it works isD the biggest costs, so throwing out the old staff because they do not7 understand Linux is in many cases simply not an option.s  C Keep in mind that RAC adds 50% additional cost *per cpu* for Oracle G licensing, so list price is $40K + 20K =3D $60K *per cpu* (not system).mG And this is true for Linux as well. So, a 2 system x86 system with dualiE processors each will cost USD $250K to license with Oracle EnterpriselE RAC (subtract 10-25% for corp discounts). Dual quad x86 Linux servers B with Oracle Enterprise RAC would be $1M USD (again - subtract corp. discounts). And then add annual support costs.  F Not sure if this has changed at all with Oracle 10G. I am sure someone' will correct me if this is not correct.s  E Also, keep in mind that some environments have large mission criticalvD batch jobs which run for extended periods, so these also need to runE with no system downtime. When a node does go down, they need to start 2 over and in some cases, this can be disastrous.=20   Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior ConsultantG HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660m Fax: 613-591-4477M kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 14:00:49 GMT 3 From: hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com (Charlie Hammond)lO Subject: Re: Which release notes say sts$manager:utc$configure_tdf  is obsolete 1 Message-ID: <lYR4e.3071$XL1.624@news.cpqcorp.net>   C In article <1112736805.cef0188be9903805e8f7dac63b33a56d@teranews>, e/ JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:i  I >It would have been nice if there had been proper plannin from day 1 withwG >one central clock keeping set of functions/database/logicals, and that F >any other application, such as NTP would have been adapted to work onM >that and rely on that not changing because it was done right from the start.s  A Yes, if things were different they wouldn't be the same.  <smile>v  E My vote would be to keep ALL time in UTC and display it in local timec% when and as necessary. {sigh}  If....l   --  J       Charlie Hammond -- Hewlett-Packard Company -- Ft Lauderdale  FL  USAF           (hammond@not@peek.ssr.hp.com -- remove "@not" when replying)J       All opinions expressed are my own and not necessarily my employer's.   ------------------------------   Date: 6 Apr 2005 06:03:50 -0700  From: tadamsmar@yahoo.com N Subject: Re: Which release notes say sts$manager:utc$configure_tdf is obsoleteB Message-ID: <1112792630.826678.69320@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>   JF Mezei wrote:y > Hoff Hoffman wrote: G > >   timekeeping as related to OpenVMS, as twice a year this newsgroup  sees aB > >   barrage of various DST-related problems and problem reports. >sA > Interestingly, this year, the questions appeared well after then event. > Usually they happen before ! >mF > It seems to me that VMS was quite late in implementing automated andB > systematic tize zone and tiem change handling and it was done inD > hodgepodge way. DECNET-5 seemd to have soemthing in it that did itF > automatically. Now, NTP seems broken and can't do it and needs to be' > shutdown while somethng else does it.r  > Does NTP really need to be shutdown?  I don't plan to do that.  : I have now set up my systems with AUTO_DLIGHT_SAV set to 1  F I figure it will change the system time and the TDF "simulataneously".B I can't see how NTP could do much wrong in this circumstance.  Our/ systems are not in use at 2AM on Sunday anyway.e  G I plan to log in from home on Sunday and confirm stuff.  I hope I don'ta have to drive to work.   > E > It would have been nice if there had been proper plannin from day 1s withC > one central clock keeping set of functions/database/logicals, andc thatG > any other application, such as NTP would have been adapted to work on G > that and rely on that not changing because it was done right from thes start. >a@ > And the system routines such as $GETIM could have had an extra	 parameterpC > SYS$TIME_LOCAL, SYS$TIME_GMT and SYS$TIME_OFFSET which would haveiG > provided applications with one standard and consistent way to gettings > the time they wanted.s >IE > When I coded message router gateway to SMTP, and from POP, I had to  haveD > my own GMT offsets because those were not available at the time on VMS.D > So twice a year, I need to update the configuration files on thoseF > applications and because I don't really know what is "stable" on VMS inG > terms of timekeeping that I could use (and also how to trigger a timet" > change event in an application).  E There is a TDF change event, but no nifty way to get advanced warningd of scheduled TDF changes.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 09:47:15 -0400t6 From: Brad Hamilton <brMadAhaPmiSlton@coMmcAasPt.Snet>N Subject: Re: Which release notes say sts$manager:utc$configure_tdf is obsolete0 Message-ID: <zcKdnZuZUO_4dc7fRVn-sA@comcast.com>   tadamsmar@yahoo.com wrote: > JF Mezei wrote:0F >>It seems to me that VMS was quite late in implementing automated andB >>systematic tize zone and tiem change handling and it was done inD >>hodgepodge way. DECNET-5 seemd to have soemthing in it that did itF >>automatically. Now, NTP seems broken and can't do it and needs to be' >>shutdown while somethng else does it.c > @ > Does NTP really need to be shutdown?  I don't plan to do that. > < > I have now set up my systems with AUTO_DLIGHT_SAV set to 1 >r  G I'm into this discussion quite late, and I apologize if I'm going over l ground previously unearthed.  H I use NTP, AUTO_DLIGHT_SAV set to 1 in MODPARAMS.DAT, and TCPware.  The ? following entries displayed on my console log this past Sunday:i  8 %%%%%%%%%%%  OPCOM   3-APR-2005 03:00:00.24  %%%%%%%%%%%" Message from user SYSTEM on RABBIT= %TDF-I-TDFSET, Summer time or standard time changeover - new  , SYS$TIMEZONE_DIFFERENTIAL=-14400/old=-18000.  8 %%%%%%%%%%%  OPCOM   3-APR-2005 03:00:49.99  %%%%%%%%%%%" Message from user SYSTEM on RABBITG %TCPWARE_NTP-I-DSTCHANGE, Clock will be stepped forward 60 minutes due v to daylight savingsy  I Looks as though NTP, TCPware, and VMS did what I intended them to do.  I aH did not shut down NTP, and I see nothing "broken" here.  Of course, I'm I not using TCP/IP Services for VMS, so that may be the limiting factor in g this thread.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2005.192 ************************