1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 28 Apr 2005	Volume 2005 : Issue 236       Contents:= Re: 64 bit addressing in FORTRAN with (character) descriptors = Re: 64 bit addressing in FORTRAN with (character) descriptors = Re: 64 bit addressing in FORTRAN with (character) descriptors  Re: Appletalk on Alphas  Re: Appletalk on Alphas  ASP, OSU, OpenVMS  Re: ASP, OSU, OpenVMS 4 Re: How to get queue name from inside it's symbiont?( Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!? Lexical function to set environmental variables of AlphaStation 8 Re: Maybe HP should get out of the hardware business....8 Re: Maybe HP should get out of the hardware business....8 Re: Maybe HP should get out of the hardware business....< Re: More ISE's OpenVMS/RTR cluster - talk about scalability!< Re: More ISE's OpenVMS/RTR cluster - talk about scalability!3 Re: mysql #1030 - Got error 127 from storage engine 3 Re: mysql #1030 - Got error 127 from storage engine  Once more looking for VMS help" Re: Once more looking for VMS help Re: Problem with file delete TCPIP FTP Problem OpenVMS 7.3 ! Re: TCPIP FTP Problem OpenVMS 7.3 ! Re: TCPIP FTP Problem OpenVMS 7.3  The Intel Alpha Legacy question + Re: What is Different or Special About VMS? + Re: What is Different or Special About VMS? + RE: What is Different or Special About VMS? + Re: What is Different or Special About VMS? + Re: What is Different or Special About VMS?   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 09:03:53 -0400 3 From: Steve Lionel <Steve.Lionel@REMOVEintelME.com> F Subject: Re: 64 bit addressing in FORTRAN with (character) descriptors8 Message-ID: <snn171l5nqi1qpmv3ar1r78nhaar3g81pv@4ax.com>  J On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 11:04:06 +0200, Albrecht Schlosser <ajs856@tiscali.de> wrote:  R >But, just to be clear: 64-bit descriptors _are_ working (with CDEC$ directives), N >but the default is 32-bit descriptors. What I'm looking for is to change the - >_default_ to 64-bit by a commandline switch.  > O >Something like $ CC/POINTER_SIZE=64. Suggestion: $ FORTRAN/DESCRIPTOR_SIZE=64.   F When we added 64-bit descriptor support to Fortran, we did not provideJ command-line switches for it.  The ADDRESS64 attribute is the only option.   Steve    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 09:07:56 -0400 3 From: Steve Lionel <Steve.Lionel@REMOVEintelME.com> F Subject: Re: 64 bit addressing in FORTRAN with (character) descriptors8 Message-ID: <0qn17113kq3k7ep87rsfajf34929n4tn5f@4ax.com>  I On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 21:33:22 +0000 (UTC), helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de 1 (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) wrote:   C >How much of Fortran 2003 does HP Fortran V8.0-48071-50EAE support?   K Well, it supports all of F95, which makes up a large part of F2003. It also D supports the features from TR15581 which made their way into F2003 -L ALLOCATABLE dummy arguments, function values and components of derived type.N Then there's lots of little things standardized in F2003 which were extensions earlier, such as VOLATILE.  ; I certainly can't speak for HP's future plans in this area.    Steve    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 11:28:19 -0400 3 From: Steve Lionel <Steve.Lionel@REMOVEintelME.com> F Subject: Re: 64 bit addressing in FORTRAN with (character) descriptors8 Message-ID: <5uv1711t6t2uh9rfvnmraphdkhrq6smspu@4ax.com>  J On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 16:33:27 +0200, Albrecht Schlosser <ajs856@tiscali.de> wrote:   >>  I >> When we added 64-bit descriptor support to Fortran, we did not provide M >> command-line switches for it.  The ADDRESS64 attribute is the only option.  >>   >> Steve >  >Oh, that's a pity :-( >  >But is there still hope?   M Not for me to say.   Do note that you can detect which kind of descriptor you I were passed - if the 16-bit length and 32-bit pointer are -1, then it's a  64-bit descriptor.   Steve    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 15:25:38 GMT * From: Paul Anderson <paul.anderson@hp.com>  Subject: Re: Appletalk on Alphas5 Message-ID: <280420051125086515%paul.anderson@hp.com>   E In article <1114637986.111114.68190@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, Ed   Wilts <ewilts@ewilts.org> wrote:  F > The DCPS 2.4 release notes state that Appletalk no longer works withE > VMS V8.2.  There's nothing in the 8.2 release notes and I do recall D > that in an earlier release of VMS, Engineering had discovered that< > Appletalk was broken but managed to bring it back to life.  D PATHWORKS for OpenVMS (Macintosh) [MSA] has not been supported for aD number of years.  Therefore, I don't think the fact that the product? actually doesn't work with OpenVMS V8.2 would be mentioned.  We G mentioned in the DCPS release notes because we know people still use it 
 for printing.   F MSA V1.3 was released in 1995.  V1.3A, released in 1997, added support7 for OpenVMS V7.1.  Nothing has been changed since then.   < > Is there any hope that we'll get Appletalk working on 8.2?  @ I doubt it.  Changes to operating system internals in V8.2 wouldA require at least a re-build of the MSA kit, and perhaps some code  changes.  F > If not, we're stuck at 7.3 with over 300 Appletalk-only printers outG > there in my user base...  If it's dead, it's dead - heck, it has been B > 6+ years since Appletalk was sold, but I need the facts to do my > planning.   G I'm not the Official Source here, but I believe it's dead, Jim.  If you C still need to print to AppleTalk-only printers, you need to keep at  least one V7.3 system running.   Paul   --    Paul Anderson   OpenVMS Engineering    Hewlett-Packard Company    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 08:45:04 -0700 ' From: David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu>   Subject: Re: Appletalk on Alphas+ Message-ID: <d4r0e1$8dh$1@naig.caltech.edu>    Ed Wilts wrote: F > The DCPS 2.4 release notes state that Appletalk no longer works withE > VMS V8.2.  There's nothing in the 8.2 release notes and I do recall D > that in an earlier release of VMS, Engineering had discovered that< > Appletalk was broken but managed to bring it back to life. > E > Is there any hope that we'll get Appletalk working on 8.2?  If not, G > we're stuck at 7.3 with over 300 Appletalk-only printers out there in G > my user base...  If it's dead, it's dead - heck, it has been 6+ years C > since Appletalk was sold, but I need the facts to do my planning.   7 I still have nightmares about the time I tried to track : down the various components of MSA to see if Digipaq could5 release the source.  That was a lesson in "how not to 9 license other people's software" I'll never forget.  It's E filed in my memory under "little wonder this company is going under!"   = Your best (quickest, cheapest) method for regaining access to  those printers is:  ? 1. Set up a linux box (it doesn't need to be very big, firewall "     as appropriate for your site.)7 2. Set up CUPS and appletalk on that linux box.  See my 7     handy documents on the appletalk part of this here:   > ftp://saf.bio.caltech.edu/pub/software/linux_or_unix_tools/papT ftp://saf.bio.caltech.edu/pub/software/linux_or_unix_tools/pap_backend_with_cups.txt  @ 3. Set up the printers on the linux box, here's one entry in my @ printers.conf file to give you an idea what it should look like:   <Printer campbell> Info Campbell Lab  Location Braun first floor3 DeviceURI pap://HP LaserJet 2100 Series__at__net12/ 
 State Idle
 Accepting Yes  JobSheets none none 
 QuotaPeriod 0  PageLimit 0  KLimit 0
 </Printer>  ? Note that there must be a ppd corresponding to to each printer, > in this case it is /etc/cups/ppd/campbell.ppd.  If you use the; cups web interface to add printers you will be prompted for 
 this info.    = 4. Direct all your VMS printers through the linux box via lpr   = I don't recall if Knoppix has appletalk built into it or not. 9 If it does you could easily test this nondestructively by A running Knoppix from its CD on pretty much any PC you have handy.   9 If you have way, way, WAY too much time on your hands and < a death wish grab the source for netatalk and start porting.   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@caltech.edu   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 08:02:19 -0500 + From: Chuck Aaron <caaron@ceris.purdue.edu>  Subject: ASP, OSU, OpenVMS5 Message-ID: <d4qmsp$8vt$1@mailhub227.itcs.purdue.edu>    Group,   4 Via ASP's, can an ACCESS database be linked to a webJ page so users can query the data via osu web server running openvms 7.3-2?   K If you have any examples on how to do this it would be greatly appreciated.     Thanks,  Chuck    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 15:22:53 +0100 0 From: Chris Sharman <chris.sharman@sorry.nospam> Subject: Re: ASP, OSU, OpenVMS4 Message-ID: <d4qrju$7mh$1$830fa7a5@news.demon.co.uk>   Chuck Aaron wrote:   > Group, > 6 > Via ASP's, can an ACCESS database be linked to a webL > page so users can query the data via osu web server running openvms 7.3-2?  H asp is an ms proprietary language I believe - unsupported by everything  except IIS. A You could perhaps write cgi on osu server to generate fetch_http  H requests to an iis server - we've done similar to serve VMS data to the 2 DMZ, which then serves it on to the outside world.  F There's a lot to be said for Apache, php, mysql - all run on both vms 7 and windows, so you could move your access db to mysql.    Chris    ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 07:10:13 +0000 (UTC) < From: gartmann@non.immunbio.mpg.de.sens (Christoph Gartmann)= Subject: Re: How to get queue name from inside it's symbiont? ) Message-ID: <d4q28k$9k9$1@news.BelWue.DE>   h In article <57c54cc6.0504272027.f787f57@posting.google.com>, valent314@mail.ru (Valentin Likoum) writes:F >  I wrote small symbiont replacement routines and I need to pass some9 >parameters to them. Obvious way is through logicals like C ><fac>$<queue>_<param>, but then I need to know the queue name this * >symbiont is running for. How can I do it?  G This is some Pascal code that I took from a symbiont I wrote years ago:   6    rc : = smb$read_message( stream, buffer, request );	    REPEAT D       rc := smb$read_message_item( buffer, context, code, message );    UNTIL code = smbmsg$k_queue;     queuname := message;   C The code is part of the asynchronous procedure that is mentioned in " smg$initialize (second parameter).   Regards,    Christoph Gartmann    --  E  Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452   ImmunbiologieI  Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de   D-79011  Freiburg, Germany 9                http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 02:00:59 -0400 ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>1 Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! = Message-ID: <yMKdnW7iyOmA4e3fRVn-iA@metrocastcablevision.com>    Main, Kerry wrote:   ...   H > Well, lets see what the performance numbers are for Itanium later this > year.   % ROB, STOP POSTING UNDER KERRY'S NAME!    ...   J > As someone else reported in another thread, those that do not learn fromI > the past are doomed to repeat it e.g. focus on Alpha from a performance G > perspective and just assuming that because it was much faster that it ( > would automatically make it a success.  I Right.  It's not as if POWER5 had a major corporation's solid commitment  F behind it (as Alpha didn't), or a thriving and growing installed base G (as Alpha didn't - though Tru64 was starting to make a pretty credible  B run at creating one until its legs got cut out from under it), or C significant use in embedded markets and by other vendors (as Alpha  & didn't) or - gasp! - actual marketing.   > H > Like all vendors moving from 32bit to 64bit, AMD has a ton of ISV workI > to do to get their app's running and optimized for the 64bit components J > of their chip. For many of the developers in the x86 Windows/Linux worldH > optimizing features like 64bit tuning, threads and SMP is not going to > happen overnight.   I Ah, but it beyond any shadow of a doubt *will* happen, and sooner rather  F than later, because AMD created a situation where Intel was forced to F take the other 90% of the x86 market into 64-bitness, like it or not, G and guess what?  64-bit applications developed for either platform run  F just *fine* on the other (just as, of course, 32-bit applications do).  G IBM has either been incredibly lucky or incredibly crafty in all this.  D First, it stood shoulder-to-shoulder with AMD at Opteron's launch 2 H years ago, helping create the credible low-end 64-bit competition which H forced Intel to reverse its "No 64-bitness for x86 - no way, no how, or A in any event not until a lot later!" stance.  Then, it created a  I world-beating Xeon chipset (which, unlike its previous chipset, supports  G only x86, not Itanic) which takes maximal advantage not of Opteron but  D of the far-higher-volume, far-better-established Xeon market to cut A Itanic's low-end legs out from underneath it - but this was only  I possible because it had already used Opteron to force Intel's 64-bit x86   hand.   E IBM has managed to use Opteron to make Intel create the engine which  D best attacks Itanic from below, without the need to depend upon any A hesitation which enterprises might feel toward embracing Opteron  I (excellent platform though it may be) and AMD.  And IBM will continue to  E give Opteron as much support as it needs to ensure that Intel has to  C keep Xeon competitive.  But no one else will be able to offer Xeon  H systems that scale the way IBM's do, so even if IBM loses an occasional = POWER5 sale to Xeon it will most likely still be an IBM sale.   G Really makes Carly&Curly's grandiose schemes look like the work of the   rankest of amateurs, no?   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 09:25:48 +0200 ( From: "Rudolf Wingert" <win@fom.fgan.de>1 Subject: RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! 3 Message-ID: <001701c54bc3$7fd52c30$994614ac@wat153>    Hello,  H > These folks are big iron types and OpenVMS is not supported on the big Itanium @ > based Superdome systems until VMS V8.2-1 (fall/later this year timeframe as I > recall).    C AFAIK not supported means not does not function. At DECUS symposium F Neuss/Germany the most one of OpenVMS engineers did say, it works. You# can run OpenVMS 8.2 on a Superdome.    Best regards R. Wingert    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 12:23:16 GMT * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com>1 Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! 2 Message-ID: <UA4ce.4639$hW1.2501@news.cpqcorp.net>  3 "Rudolf Wingert" <win@fom.fgan.de> wrote in message - news:001701c54bc3$7fd52c30$994614ac@wat153...  > Hello, > J > > These folks are big iron types and OpenVMS is not supported on the big	 > Itanium B > > based Superdome systems until VMS V8.2-1 (fall/later this year > timeframe as I > > recall). > E > AFAIK not supported means not does not function. At DECUS symposium H > Neuss/Germany the most one of OpenVMS engineers did say, it works. You% > can run OpenVMS 8.2 on a Superdome.  >   F The engineering work to support a new system is typically only a smallD fraction of the total work and time needed to get it to market.  The: Superdome in out lab has been running for quite some time.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 08:39:56 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> 1 Subject: RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB5ECE31@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----4 > From: Bill Todd [mailto:billtodd@metrocast.net]=20 > Sent: April 28, 2005 2:01 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 3 > Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  >=20   [snip..]    0 >  But no one else will be able to offer Xeon=20A > systems that scale the way IBM's do, so even if IBM loses an=20  > occasional=20 ? > POWER5 sale to Xeon it will most likely still be an IBM sale.  >=20? > Really makes Carly&Curly's grandiose schemes look like the=20  > work of the=20 > rankest of amateurs, no? >=20 > - bill >=20  F Lets see now if get this brilliant mulit-platform strategy straight ..D get Cust's to think IBM first, get Sales folks to think "it does not? matter which platform the Cust buys as long as it is IBM" ..=20   1 Wow, now I wonder why HP never thought of that ..    :-)   F Course, there will be no internal rivalry among the Sales force and ofD course there will be no problems positioning which 64bit platform to choose for what requirement..    Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 08:46:33 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> 1 Subject: RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB5ECE33@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----2 > From: Rudolf Wingert [mailto:win@fom.fgan.de]=20 > Sent: April 28, 2005 3:26 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 3 > Subject: RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  >=20 > Hello, >=20B > > These folks are big iron types and OpenVMS is not supported=20 > on the big	 > Itanium B > > based Superdome systems until VMS V8.2-1 (fall/later this year > timeframe as I > > recall).=20  >=20E > AFAIK not supported means not does not function. At DECUS symposium H > Neuss/Germany the most one of OpenVMS engineers did say, it works. You% > can run OpenVMS 8.2 on a Superdome.  >=20 > Best regards R. Wingert  >=20 >=20  > You are correct. OpenVMS has been running for some time now on@ Superdome, but there are things like partitioning which requires additional tuning etc.  
 Reference:C http://www.shannonknowshpc.com/stories.php?story=3D04/01/13/3323598 F "HP Demonstrates Partitioned, Clustered, Mixed-OS IPF-Inside Superdome System" ( Tuesday January 13 2004 @ 11:40PM EST=20   Extract:> Westborough, Massachusetts, USA 13 January 2004--At the firm'sH Enterprise Storage and Servers Industry Analyst Summit held here west ofC Boston, HP--consistent with our expectations--today demonstrated an H Itanium-based HP Integrity Superdome server running OpenVMS V8.1, HP-UX,A Red Hat Linux, and Windows in four separate hard partitions, each  consisting of a 4-CPU cell."   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 10:23:22 -0400 ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>1 Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! = Message-ID: <MLadnbuHZP1GbO3fRVn-sw@metrocastcablevision.com>    Main, Kerry wrote:   ...   H > Lets see now if get this brilliant mulit-platform strategy straight ..  H I realize it may be difficult for someone coming from an environment as G incompetent as cHumPaq's, Kerry, but if you work at it hard enough you  < might succeed (though you clearly haven't quite got it yet).    > get Cust's to think IBM first,  I Well, duh:  IBM has the most scalable systems, whether you want high-end  G enterprise-level gear or scaled-up low-to-mid-range enterprise-qualify  H boxes with x86 compatibility - both with service and support (including < any level of consultation you might require) second to none.  H Why exactly *wouldn't* a customer 'think IBM first'?  If you still have A difficulty understanding this, you might ask Terry:  he seems to.   '   get Sales folks to think "it does not > > matter which platform the Cust buys as long as it is IBM" ..  0 Oh, dear me, no:  that's cHumPaq-level thinking.  H IBM knows very well which side of its bread is best-buttered.  But if a E customer's requirements favor the other side, why, it's got the best  G solution there as well, and would much rather sell it to you than have   you go elsewhere.   F Simple, really - at least for those who aren't blinded by 'strategic' I considerations into believing that they can shape customer tastes rather   than cater to them.    - bill   ------------------------------   Date: 28 Apr 2005 14:43:28 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)1 Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! , Message-ID: <3dcb4gF6qpjt7U1@individual.net>  = In article <MLadnbuHZP1GbO3fRVn-sw@metrocastcablevision.com>, + 	Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> writes:  > Main, Kerry wrote: > * >>   get Sales folks to think "it does not? >> matter which platform the Cust buys as long as it is IBM" ..  > 2 > Oh, dear me, no:  that's cHumPaq-level thinking. >   C If only that were true.  Of course there was a time (think Digital) E when something similar was.  (Obligatory supporting anecdote:  I once C worked on a bid that came down to my company bidding Primes and DEC D bidding a VAX.  We won the benchmark, partly because DEC didn't evenD do it.  They were bidding a machine that had not started rolling offB the assemblyline yet.  We dropped our bidding efforts when the manC in charge of the procurement made the statement "I don't care which D machine wins the contract as long as it says VAX on the front."  So,D there actually was a time when the name was all it took to win salesD even if you weren't IBM.  Oh yeah, I have also been involved in bids8 where IBM was the competitor and they were bidding VAX.)   bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 11:12:30 -0400 # From: "Dan Allen" <dallen@nist.gov> 1 Subject: RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! : Message-ID: <JFEPKAPBPMDFDBOIANGDEEEEGFAA.dallen@nist.gov>   > -----Original Message-----F > From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu [mailto:bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu]On > Behalf Of Bill Gunshannon ) > Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 10:43 AM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 3 > Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!   F > even if you weren't IBM.  Oh yeah, I have also been involved in bids: > where IBM was the competitor and they were bidding VAX.) >  > bill  N Witnessed a big-bucks menage-a-trois with IBM, Unisys and CDC all bidding VAX.L DEC actually withdrew in a fit of pique over a cardreader/punch requirement.   Dan    >  > --L > Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesF > bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. > University of Scranton   |@ > Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h> >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 08:01:01 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> 1 Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! ( Message-ID: <opspx6nzvjzgicya@hyrrokkin>  K On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 22:08:54 GMT, FredK <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com> wrote:   C > Not really.  Once Opteron systems have scaled sufficiently, SPARC  > will die.  > ) >> SPARC has been exceedingly successful. 2 > You can only throw good money after bad so long.  / I wonder if this doesn't also apply to Itanium?    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 11:10:23 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> 1 Subject: RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB5ECE4F@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----4 > From: Bill Todd [mailto:billtodd@metrocast.net]=20 > Sent: April 28, 2005 10:23 AM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 3 > Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  >=20   [Misc snipped ..]    >=20? > Well, duh:  IBM has the most scalable systems, whether you=20  > want high-end=208 > enterprise-level gear or scaled-up low-to-mid-range=20 > enterprise-qualify=20 A > boxes with x86 compatibility - both with service and support=20  > (including=20 > > any level of consultation you might require) second to none. >=20A > Why exactly *wouldn't* a customer 'think IBM first'?  If you=20  > still have=20 C > difficulty understanding this, you might ask Terry:  he seems to.  >=20   [misc snipped..]  , Bill, when did you start working for IBM?=20   :-)   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------   Date: 28 Apr 2005 15:18:08 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)1 Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! , Message-ID: <3dcd5gF6pvp2oU2@individual.net>  ( In article <opspx6nzvjzgicya@hyrrokkin>,& 	"Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes:M > On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 22:08:54 GMT, FredK <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com> wrote:  > D >> Not really.  Once Opteron systems have scaled sufficiently, SPARC >> will die. >>* >>> SPARC has been exceedingly successful.3 >> You can only throw good money after bad so long.  > 1 > I wonder if this doesn't also apply to Itanium?   A I was going to ask this, but I bit my tongue and sat on my hands.    bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 11:20:12 -0400 ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>1 Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! = Message-ID: <I4Sdnb7xWMCwYu3fRVn-3w@metrocastcablevision.com>    Bill Gunshannon wrote:* > In article <opspx6nzvjzgicya@hyrrokkin>,( > 	"Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes: > M >>On Wed, 27 Apr 2005 22:08:54 GMT, FredK <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com> wrote:  >> >>D >>>Not really.  Once Opteron systems have scaled sufficiently, SPARC >>>will die. >>>  >>> * >>>>SPARC has been exceedingly successful. >>> 3 >>>You can only throw good money after bad so long.  >>1 >>I wonder if this doesn't also apply to Itanium?  >  > C > I was going to ask this, but I bit my tongue and sat on my hands.   H Well, I guess that beats biting your hands and sitting on your tongue...   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 11:24:31 -0400 ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>1 Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! = Message-ID: <1sednedaisetnezfRVn-iQ@metrocastcablevision.com>    Main, Kerry wrote: >>-----Original Message-----2 >>From: Bill Todd [mailto:billtodd@metrocast.net]  >>Sent: April 28, 2005 10:23 AM  >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 3 >>Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  >> >  >  > [Misc snipped ..]  >  > = >>Well, duh:  IBM has the most scalable systems, whether you   >>want high-end 6 >>enterprise-level gear or scaled-up low-to-mid-range  >>enterprise-qualify  ? >>boxes with x86 compatibility - both with service and support  
 >>(including  > >>any level of consultation you might require) second to none. >>? >>Why exactly *wouldn't* a customer 'think IBM first'?  If you  
 >>still have  C >>difficulty understanding this, you might ask Terry:  he seems to.  >> >  >  > [misc snipped..] > , > Bill, when did you start working for IBM?   E I fully understand that you wouldn't recognize (or at least publicly  G agree with) an objective assessment if it jumped up and bit you in the  D ass, Kerry.  But why don't you ask the same question of your former H cohort in spin Terry?  Even while vigorously pimping for cHumPaq he was   never loath to give IBM its due.   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 12:10:36 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> 1 Subject: RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB5ECE54@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----4 > From: Bill Todd [mailto:billtodd@metrocast.net]=20 > Sent: April 28, 2005 11:25 AM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 3 > Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  >=20 > Main, Kerry wrote: > >>-----Original Message-----6 > >>From: Bill Todd [mailto:billtodd@metrocast.net]=20! > >>Sent: April 28, 2005 10:23 AM  > >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 5 > >>Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  > >> > >=20 > >=20 > > [Misc snipped ..]  > >=20 > >=20A > >>Well, duh:  IBM has the most scalable systems, whether you=20  > >>want high-end=20: > >>enterprise-level gear or scaled-up low-to-mid-range=20 > >>enterprise-qualify=20 C > >>boxes with x86 compatibility - both with service and support=20  > >>(including=20 @ > >>any level of consultation you might require) second to none. > >>C > >>Why exactly *wouldn't* a customer 'think IBM first'?  If you=20  > >>still have=20 E > >>difficulty understanding this, you might ask Terry:  he seems to.  > >> > >=20 > >=20 > > [misc snipped..] > >=200 > > Bill, when did you start working for IBM?=20 >=20I > I fully understand that you wouldn't recognize (or at least publicly=20 @ > agree with) an objective assessment if it jumped up and bit=20 > you in the=20 H > ass, Kerry.  But why don't you ask the same question of your former=20= > cohort in spin Terry?  Even while vigorously pimping for=20  > cHumPaq he was=20 " > never loath to give IBM its due. >=20  H "Objective assessment" ... Puulllease .. Giving IBM their due is not theH issue as IBM is a good company, a good competitor and a good Customer ofE HP. Like all large companies, they have strengths and weaknesses. And ? they have had to make some tough decisions in the past as well.   H However, what would have happened if I (or anyone from HP) had used your words on this newsgroup:=20   E "Well, duh:  HP {you said IBM] has the most scalable systems, whether E you want high-end enterprise-level gear or scaled-up low-to-mid-range G enterprise-qualify boxes with x86 compatibility - both with service and F support (including any level of consultation you might require) secondC to none. Why exactly *wouldn't* a customer 'think HP [you said IBM)  first'?"  F Whoever posted that would have been crucified as a Sales and Marketing type.    Regards,  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 13:44:25 +0200 ( From: "Rudolf Wingert" <win@fom.fgan.de>H Subject: Lexical function to set environmental variables of AlphaStation3 Message-ID: <000401c54be7$a07d6c30$994614ac@wat153>    Hello,  D AFAIK there is an undocumented lexical function to set environmental0 variables. Does anybody know how it can be done?   TIA and regards R. Wingert   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 13:50:40 +0200 + From: Karsten Nyblad <nospam@nospam.nospam> A Subject: Re: Maybe HP should get out of the hardware business.... = Message-ID: <4270ce11$0$78284$157c6196@dreader1.cybercity.dk>    Dr. Dweeb wrote: > clip ....  > C > What is interesting about this, is that each one of these Windows F > servers was purchased at the time because of not only cost, but alsoH > "latest and greatest" performance numbers. So, x years later and theseA > "great performance" servers are only 15-20% busy at peak times.  >  > L > I think the reason they all have so many servers is that each server only M > runs ONE service.  IIRC this was the MS recommended deployment strategy, I  O > guess to cover up the obvious problems the OS had dealing with more than one  L > task simultaneously, and one service crashing whole machines and thus all  > other services.  > M >  It may be that Win2003/EE SP1 (my current OS version btw) is sufficiently  M > stable and adept that it is now a feasible exercise to consolidate windows  
 > servers. > - > I am not an expert on these matters though.  >  > Dr. Dweebs > 	 > clip ..w  G One of the problems on the Windows platform is that you usually do not pE know what the installation scripts do to your machine.  Thus, if you nI install a second service, there is a chance that the first service stops EC working, and that you do not have any idea why it stopped working.  B Further. on Windows you typically have to reboot after installing I software.  Thus you cannot count on installing a second services without SH   stopping the first.  These are two problems that have to be addressed G before I am willing to call Windows a server operating system, and two rJ problems that makes it reasonable to have one service per Windows machine.   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 09:10:24 -0700* From: "Alan Greig" <greigaln@netscape.net>A Subject: Re: Maybe HP should get out of the hardware business.... B Message-ID: <1114704624.405006.93650@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>   JF Mezei wrote:w > Bill Todd wrote:: > > While the slope beyond 16 sockets levels off some (theG > > 16-socket-and-under systems are fully-connected at the board level,O >V >RG > In the case of Wildwire/Galaxy class machines, doesn't that allow themB > scaling beyond the maximum combination of CPUs on one "system" ? > G > I.E.,  could they, today, build an opteron based Galaxy class machinerG > with similar interconnects between  4 cpu units, allowing much biggerb > machines to be built ?  $ Yes. Want to see what Cray is doing?  W http://investors.cray.com/phoenix.zhtml?c=98390&p=irol-newsArticle&ID=698646&highlight=r  @ "Cray has helped prepare the way for the next stage in processorF evolution by designing the Cray XD1 and the Cray XT3 supercomputers toD take advantage of Dual-Core AMD Opteron processor performance," saidA Ben Williams, vice president of Commercial and Server/WorkstationrF business at AMD. "As dual-core AMD64 technology is also based on AMD'sA Direct Connect Architecture, it continues to eliminate processor,nG memory and I/O bottlenecks, while enhancing overall performance for HPC+ applications."  D Dual-core processors allow Cray to achieve very high density in bothG the Cray XD1 and Cray XT3 supercomputers. One Cray XD1 cabinet provides2B 288 AMD Opteron 200 Series processor cores, boosting its computingG capability from the 744 gigaflops (744 billion calculations per second)ZE available with single-core processors to more than 1.2 teraflops. Thet? Cray XT3 supercomputer, based on the Sandia Red Storm massivelysB parallel processor (MPP) system design, can operate with more thanF 60,000 processor cores -- delivering up to 269 teraflops (269 trillionB FLOPS), an increase of 109 teraflops over single-core devices. TheD 10,000 processor Cray XT3 supercomputer installed at Sandia NationalA Laboratories is the largest Opteron processor-based system in theA world."1  C 269 teraflops is around 4 times the record currently held by IBM in- posted results.   F As of yet Microsoft don't have a "Windows for Nukes" which would scale this far :-) --
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 09:58:40 -0700* From: "Alan Greig" <greigaln@netscape.net>A Subject: Re: Maybe HP should get out of the hardware business....dB Message-ID: <1114707520.874176.37690@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>   Alan Greig wrote:i >wB > As of yet Microsoft don't have a "Windows for Nukes" which would scaleP > this far :-)  B Some fascinating further info or what the US government says about relative chip performance:  I http://www.cs.sandia.gov/PublicationsPresentations/2004/CCPE03-Sandia.pdf   @ "In any case, as discussed in Section 3 below, these and similar considerations led us toG rank the processor choices for Red Storm based on effectiveness for our< design, ignoring  cost for the moment, as follows. 1. HP Alpha EV7r 2. AMD Opteron! 3. Intel Pentium-4 and AMD Athlond 4. IBM Power-4 5. Intel Itanium II E When we take into account performance relative to price, this ranking: changesB	 somewhat:  1. AMD Opteron! 2. Intel Pentium-4 and AMD Athlono 3. HP Alpha EV7h 4. IBM Power-4 5. Intel Itanium II"  G And this was *prior* to the dual core introduction - although they knewrG it was on its way. Care to think what the Sandia people think of HP? In0D some documents the fury over Alphas cancellation oozes off the page.  D There's a fascinating load of techical info at Sandia I am ploughingG through right now. So I might vanish any second. When you start readingcC dual core Opteron quotes attributed "Vice-President Nuclear Weaponsn# Design" I reach for my tinfoil hat.o -- i
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 02:19:01 -0400n( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>E Subject: Re: More ISE's OpenVMS/RTR cluster - talk about scalability!l= Message-ID: <peOdnQTLQobFHe3fRVn-rw@metrocastcablevision.com>p   FredK wrote:   ...   B > These people seem to have lost any touch with reality, and won'tI > even consider for an instant that Itanium isn't anything but a steamingP > pile of crap...a  H You're either just too dense to understand, Fred, or just never learned 
 to listen.  H The only Itanic which was a steaming pile of crap (or 'smoking brick of I death' as Terry called it before being seduced - suckered? - by the dark  ? side) was Merced:  the rest have been nothing all that special 2F (especially given their power consumption and considering the mammoth H resources in time, money, and desperately-increasing amounts of on-chip E cache which have been poured into them), but only worthy of outright kL derision in proportion to the degree which HP persisted in over-hyping them.  B And if Montecito actually lives up to its hype (though that would F certainly be a first for the family, so pardon me for being less than I breathless with anticipation) it might actually look pretty good (though uH likely still not as good as POWER5, let alone the POWER5+ product which . should be debuting about when Montecito does).  / >  because geeze, Alpha could have been better.h  F Yup, that's the problem - particularly when combined with the blatant G lies that cHumPaq tried to make stick in this area and its callous and  G unilateral abrogation of very specific long-term public commitments to e its Alpha users.  E Which is why it's actually been your upper-level management that has eI been the *real* steaming pile of crap over the years - and one by one we  F seem to be seeing them getting recognized as such (though we've still  got a few to go yet).    - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 07:48:35 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> E Subject: Re: More ISE's OpenVMS/RTR cluster - talk about scalability! ( Message-ID: <opspx529wezgicya@hyrrokkin>  K On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 03:13:33 GMT, FredK <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com> wrote:s   > 6 > "Dave Froble" <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote in message, > news:1170jgjai81m660@corp.supernews.com... >> FredK wrote:o >>G >> > You may now return to your normally scheduled "Itanic Deathwatch"., >>D >> Isn't the fact that there is such a monster a reason for concern? >>K >> Keep in mind that overall, these aren't people saying "Oh Boy, itanic isyK >> gonna die!"  These are (the majority) people saying "Oh Shit, where willd >> we be if itanic dies?"k >rF > Frankly Dave, you'd be suprised just how little the subject actually1 > comes up, and how quickly the issue is settled.l >x@ > Now, of course - *this* is the Internet, where anybody with an@ > opinion can repeat it over and over and over and over until it > seems like the truth.s >lC > The "Itanic Deathwatch" has an easily countable number of people,nF > and no matter what forum you go to - odds are it will contain mostly > the same people. > C > Keep in mind, that overall these people have been predicting botheE > the demise of VMS *and* the demise of Itanium for years.  They also F > tend to be the same people who continue to flog the Alpha-EV8-would-A > have-solved-world-hunger and Curly and Carly are Evil ratholes. B > These people seem to have lost any touch with reality, and won'tI > even consider for an instant that Itanium isn't anything but a steamingy? > pile of crap...  because geeze, Alpha could have been better.r >iL I don't think anybody doubts the potential to make Itanium competitive, at   least,K I don't, but at what cost?  Imagine for a moment that you are Mark Hurd andtJ you are looking  at (1) the ongoing cost to sustain Itanium to keep pace   withF the perfomance of the competiton (Notably IBM) and (2) the very real  
 likelihoodE that it will _not_ be an industry standard chip with any reasonable  2 expectationsI of volume production.  What do you do?  What are your options?  What is   	 your ROI?rL You will certainly look at your options and I imagine one of those will be  	 analyzinglL the cost to move to Opteron/X86.  Reviving Alpha is probably a bad idea as   too muchK time has passed.  I just saw yesterday that TSMC now has brought online a    65nm& facility.  When will Itanium be there?   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 08:59:01 +0100>0 From: Chris Sharman <chris.sharman@sorry.nospam>< Subject: Re: mysql #1030 - Got error 127 from storage engine4 Message-ID: <d4q545$61l$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk>   Jean-Franois Pironne wrote:y7 >> Alpha VMS 7.3-1, Apache 2.0, php 4.3.2, mysql 4.1.9,I >> php_msql client 3.23.49 >>L >> Using the issue tracker 4.0.4 package, it broke with no error indication.G >> Using phpmyadmin indicates #1030 - Got error 127 from storage engine  >> on the issues table.  > % > Which storage engine have you used?l > B > Only Innodb work correctly, MyISAM is know to have some problem.K > Anyway ony Innodb support transaction, so I strongly suggest to only use :F > this storage engine, this is the default on OpenVMS and probably in  > future MySQL version.w  I Innodb is the default, right ? I didn't change it. [vms]my.cnf has lines sF relating to innodb, and the rest are commented out. I didn't make any  changes.F I wondered about skip-networking & safe-updates, but didn't turn them A on, since I didn't really understand the implications. Should I ?s  H But the repair article I saw said it was only for MyISAM - which may be 1 why it didn't repair innodb that well, I suppose.    Thanks,o Chris   ( >> I'm guessing it's a mysql corruption. >> Can anyone confirm ?o >> How can I fix it ?d2 >> Is there any known issue which could cause it ? >> >> Cross-posted to VAMPe >>
 >> Thanks, >> Chris >> >  > Jean-Franois    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 16:25:12 +0200n1 From: =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Jean-Fran=E7ois_Pi=E9ronne?=a< Subject: Re: mysql #1030 - Got error 127 from storage engine6 Message-ID: <4270f251$0$1222$8fcfb975@news.wanadoo.fr>   Chris Sharman wrote: > Jean-Franois Pironne wrote:  > 8 >>> Alpha VMS 7.3-1, Apache 2.0, php 4.3.2, mysql 4.1.9, >>> php_msql client 3.23.49  >>> B >>> Using the issue tracker 4.0.4 package, it broke with no error  >>> indication. H >>> Using phpmyadmin indicates #1030 - Got error 127 from storage engine >>> on the issues table. >> >>& >> Which storage engine have you used? >>C >> Only Innodb work correctly, MyISAM is know to have some problem. H >> Anyway ony Innodb support transaction, so I strongly suggest to only H >> use this storage engine, this is the default on OpenVMS and probably  >> in future MySQL version.t >  > K > Innodb is the default, right ? I didn't change it. [vms]my.cnf has lines uH > relating to innodb, and the rest are commented out. I didn't make any 
 > changes.  D Right, Innodb is the default, but you can specify when you create a : table which storage engine you want to use for this table. You can used) mysql> show table status like 'my_table';o  & to check which storage engine is used.  H > I wondered about skip-networking & safe-updates, but didn't turn them C > on, since I didn't really understand the implications. Should I ?d > J > But the repair article I saw said it was only for MyISAM - which may be 3 > why it didn't repair innodb that well, I suppose.4 > 	 > Thanks,t > Chris  > ) >>> I'm guessing it's a mysql corruption.t >>> Can anyone confirm ? >>> How can I fix it ?3 >>> Is there any known issue which could cause it ?w >>>  >>> Cross-posted to VAMP >>>t >>> Thanks,a	 >>> Chrisi >>>  >> >> Jean-Franois   ------------------------------   Date: 28 Apr 2005 15:17:07 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)' Subject: Once more looking for VMS helpc, Message-ID: <3dcd3jF6pvp2oU1@individual.net>  F I have finally gotten the power in for my "new" Vaxen.  It now appearsF I am going to need help just getting them up and running before I even" get to the VMS (or Cluster) stage.  D So, with that, is there anyone here who would be willing to get withD me via Email (so we don't completely bore the group or show them howB little I really know :-) to figure out how to setup and configure B these systems?  Basicly, we're talking VAX 6640 and a StorageworksD cabinet connected by CI. (Actually, I am assuming I even have enough@ pieces to hook everything together.  I could be wrong even about that.)   Any volunteers?x   bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   c   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 10:10:50 -0700 From: bill@wcschmidt.com+ Subject: Re: Once more looking for VMS helphC Message-ID: <1114708250.550791.284260@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>f   Bill,d  8 do you have a list of equipment that you are trying use?1 It's been a while since I worked on a 6000 serie.aF What media will you be trying to load with, I recall these didn't come with/ a CD rom, do you have a info server available ?   7 You can reach me at (bill@wcschmidt.com) or take a tripn to(www.wcschmidt.com)l   Bill Gunshannon wrote:@ > I have finally gotten the power in for my "new" Vaxen.  It now appearslC > I am going to need help just getting them up and running before I- even$ > get to the VMS (or Cluster) stage. > F > So, with that, is there anyone here who would be willing to get withF > me via Email (so we don't completely bore the group or show them howC > little I really know :-) to figure out how to setup and configuresD > these systems?  Basicly, we're talking VAX 6640 and a StorageworksF > cabinet connected by CI. (Actually, I am assuming I even have enoughB > pieces to hook everything together.  I could be wrong even about > that.) >s > Any volunteers?o >o > bill >n > --E > Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Threer wolvesF > bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. > University of Scranton   |@ > Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 15:43:53 +0000 (UTC)r7 From: moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney)$% Subject: Re: Problem with file delete ( Message-ID: <d4r0bp$vou$1@pcls4.std.com>  G "@no$pam.comcast.net" <""thomas.simpson1\"@no$pam.comcast.net"> writes:m  I >We intermittently get a failure that appears to be due to a significant  J >delay after a large file is deleted and the free blocks info on the disk J >is updated.  Of course, by the time I log back in (after hours) the free I >space on the target disk looks normal.  Is this a know problem or issue?e5 >The file that is deleted is very large (29M blocks).a  H Is erase-on-delete set for the volume or file?  If so, it will take time* to overwrite all those blocks with zeroes. -- - -Mike-   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 01:12:54 -0500r, From: "Meat Loaf" <julie.dayton@comcast.net>& Subject: TCPIP FTP Problem OpenVMS 7.30 Message-ID: <hpGdnctkk8d74-3fRVn-gQ@comcast.com>  F I have been running OpenVMS on an AlphaServer 2100 for about two yearsB and have not had any problems.  And by the way it is a pretty busyB system running several Sybase 11 databases and the last reboot was@ after a scheduled PM.  The system had been up for over 200 days.  C Anyway I recently purchased an Alpha XP900 to replace one of my oldoF Alpha 200 4/233 workstations.  I installed OpenVMS 7.3 on this box andE I have not been able to get the FTP Server to accept a connection.  IhD have compared account settings, tcpip configs and file ownership andB protection between the two Alpha's, but the XP900 FTP Server has a problem.  , The following is what I get in the log file:     $ type *.log  # DKA:[TCPIP$FTP]TCPIP$FTP_RUN.LOG;57f  G %SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV, insufficient privilege or object protection violationn8   TCPIP$FTP    job terminated at 27-APR-2005 12:34:14.26     Accounting information: D   Buffered I/O count:                 31      Peak working set size: 1408@   Direct I/O count:                   24      Peak virtual size: 168064>   Page faults:                       181      Mounted volumes: 03C   Charged CPU time:        0 00:00:00.03      Elapsed time:       0O 00:00:00.18w $   6 Not sure what's wrong.  Any help would be appreciated.   Don-   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 07:02:09 GMTK  From: John Santos <john@egh.com>* Subject: Re: TCPIP FTP Problem OpenVMS 7.3) Message-ID: <RT%be.9522$yc.6093@trnddc04>A   Meat Loaf wrote:H > I have been running OpenVMS on an AlphaServer 2100 for about two yearsD > and have not had any problems.  And by the way it is a pretty busyD > system running several Sybase 11 databases and the last reboot wasB > after a scheduled PM.  The system had been up for over 200 days. > E > Anyway I recently purchased an Alpha XP900 to replace one of my old H > Alpha 200 4/233 workstations.  I installed OpenVMS 7.3 on this box andG > I have not been able to get the FTP Server to accept a connection.  IUF > have compared account settings, tcpip configs and file ownership andD > protection between the two Alpha's, but the XP900 FTP Server has a
 > problem. > . > The following is what I get in the log file: >  >  > $ type *.log > % > DKA:[TCPIP$FTP]TCPIP$FTP_RUN.LOG;57i >   7 Protection code or ownership of SYS$SYLOGIN (by defaulte; SYS$MANAGER:SYLOGIN.COM) or some other .COM file or program1% that gets run automatically at login?n  @ You should be seeing a startup message from the FTP server here,< and since it seems not to be getting that far, I would check for a login/startup problem.   HTHi      I > %SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV, insufficient privilege or object protection violationo: >   TCPIP$FTP    job terminated at 27-APR-2005 12:34:14.26 >  >   Accounting information:yF >   Buffered I/O count:                 31      Peak working set size: > 1408B >   Direct I/O count:                   24      Peak virtual size: > 168064@ >   Page faults:                       181      Mounted volumes: > 06E >   Charged CPU time:        0 00:00:00.03      Elapsed time:       0T
 > 00:00:00.18S > $a > 8 > Not sure what's wrong.  Any help would be appreciated. >  > Don-     -- - John Santos  Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 09:46:42 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>b* Subject: Re: TCPIP FTP Problem OpenVMS 7.3B Message-ID: <1114696027.7c6ca2e0c5394ab535a30f11bbafd0ac@teranews>   Meat Loaf wrote:% > DKA:[TCPIP$FTP]TCPIP$FTP_RUN.LOG;57g > I > %SYSTEM-F-NOPRIV, insufficient privilege or object protection violationt: >   TCPIP$FTP    job terminated at 27-APR-2005 12:34:14.26   do a $TCPIP TCPIP> SHOW SERV FTP /FULL  ! The username should be TCPIP$FTP,hH tryng to run TCPIP$FTP_RUN.COM with output to the file you showed above.  1 You then exit, and do a DIR/SEC  DISK:[TCPIP$FTP]   D There should be a login.com owned by TCPIP$FTP and the logfiles also owned by TCPIP$FTP  H If you do a DIR/SEC DISK:[000000]TCPIP$FTP.DIR that should also be owned by TCPIP$FTP  E Now, the next thing is that TCPIP$FTP user must be able to access thekB files in SYS$SYSTEM, notably TCPIP$FTP_RUN.COM and the executables
 within it.  H Since you're not getting anything in your log file, it is likely that itH wasn't even able to access the FTP_RUN.COM file. You might wish to check# its security. It should be world:REr  E You may with to edit t he login.com in the TCPIP$FTP directory to SETt5 VERIFY, and add a few commands such as SHOW PROC/ALL.   D This way, when TCPIP SERVICES next attempts to start the FTP server,1 you'll have more information logged to that file.e   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 05:31:40 -0700( From: greigaln@netscape.net (Alan Greig)( Subject: The Intel Alpha Legacy question= Message-ID: <d391276d.0504280431.56f18ca7@posting.google.com>e  9 Just posted by the Inquirer. I wonder what they can mean?d) http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=22870f+ The riddle of the Intel Alpha sands, shiftsd   Shifting characterst  3 By Charlie Demerjian: Thursday 28 April 2005, 10:00l [Advert] A RIDDLE FOR YOU.m  E Q: What do you get when you take two senior Alpha guys, and move theme to Intel? A: Tukwila.P  ? How about another one? What do you get when you have two seniorw> ex-Alpha guys, and their project gets cut out from under them?  D A: This page http://www.intel.com/pressroom/kits/bios/dcasaletto.htmC and this page  http://www.intel.com/pressroom/kits/bios/jemer.htm ,k* and in a few years, some kick-ass Xeons.    ------------------------------   Date: 28 Apr 2005 12:57:44 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)4 Subject: Re: What is Different or Special About VMS?, Message-ID: <3dc4u8F6tagnqU1@individual.net>  3 In article <K3$s2NopcnpO@eisner.encompasserve.org>,,> 	koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:Y > In article <3da5a5F6o3ic3U1@individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:  >> oF >> Give it a break, Bob.  Using that criteria so are Primos, RSX, RSTS >> and CPM.m > D >    You've never broken into RSX or CPM?  What planet have you been >    programming on? >   C I didn't say that.  I said that DEFCON didn't.  Which is only meant B to show that what DEFCON does or doesn't do is really meaningless.E And that if an OS is obscure enough no matter how vulnerable it might@D be the odds are in favor of a small group like DEFCON not having any9 attendees with the requisite knowledge to to do the deed.-  F Just like I said about CERT.  Primos, RSX and RSTS are still very muchB in use. (Can't say about CPM. :-) But there are absolutely no CERTE advisories about them.  Does that trully mean they are "un-hackable"?RD Any of us who have worked with any of them in days gone by know thatD is not the case.  It merely means that security by obscurity is wellF entrenched when the system is so deep in the legacy (there's that wordG again) mindset.  Sadly, VMS is moving in that direction.  To be honest,tJ reports in CERT would probably do more good than bad.  I doubt any seriousF holes are likely to be found, but at least it would make VMS look less  dead and definitely less legacy.   bill   -- hJ Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>   n   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 06:43:43 -0700$ From: "Craig Dedo" <cdedo@wi.rr.com>4 Subject: Re: What is Different or Special About VMS?C Message-ID: <1114695823.098851.232370@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>e   s...@obanion.us wrote:E > After your presentation, could you come back and let us know how itn9 > went, what the reaction was, what the questions were...d >n >a > Sean  G     I would be happy to let everyone know how it went.  I will give the10 talk at 8:45 a.m. Central Time on Friday, May 6. >m > Craig Dedo wrote:pD > > Recently, I have been asked to make a presentation about the VMSD > > operating system to an introductory computer science class at an areaD > > high school.  The time for the presentation, including Q&A, will last aF > > little under an hour.  Most of the students are at an introductory5 > > level in terms of software development expertise.  > > G > > The teacher has asked me to concentrate on what makes VMS differenthF > > from other operating systems, e.g., Windows or the various Unixes. IeD > > should answer the question, "Why should a person choose VMS as a( > > development or production platform?" > >    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 10:21:46 -0400u' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>y4 Subject: RE: What is Different or Special About VMS?R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB5ECE43@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----. > From: Craig Dedo [mailto:cdedo@wi.rr.com]=20 > Sent: April 28, 2005 9:44 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.ComD6 > Subject: Re: What is Different or Special About VMS? >=20 >=20 > s...@obanion.us wrote:G > > After your presentation, could you come back and let us know how itr; > > went, what the reaction was, what the questions were...  > >c > >: > > Sean >=20> >     I would be happy to let everyone know how it went.  I=20 > will give thee2 > talk at 8:45 a.m. Central Time on Friday, May 6. > >. > > Craig Dedo wrote: F > > > Recently, I have been asked to make a presentation about the VMSF > > > operating system to an introductory computer science class at an > areaF > > > high school.  The time for the presentation, including Q&A, will > last aH > > > little under an hour.  Most of the students are at an introductory7 > > > level in terms of software development expertise.d > > > B > > > The teacher has asked me to concentrate on what makes VMS=20 > differentsH > > > from other operating systems, e.g., Windows or the various Unixes. > IfF > > > should answer the question, "Why should a person choose VMS as a* > > > development or production platform?" > > >- >=20 >=20   Craig,  ; There is also some good info on Keith Parris's web site at:@  D http://www2.openvms.org/kparris/ (see intro to OpenVMS technologies)  H Also, I have some slides with screen shots of how the OpenVMS Management< Station and Availability Manager can be used - they show howA point-n-click GUI's can be used to assist in managing OpenVMS.=204  7 Drop me a note offline and I will forward these to you.>   Regards.  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultantd HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 10:47:56 -0400a From: norm.raphael@metso.com4 Subject: Re: What is Different or Special About VMS?Q Message-ID: <OF5C272AAC.75A781F0-ON85256FF1.00513B7D-85256FF1.0051228F@metso.com>1  H Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote on 04/27/2005 05:47:04 PM:  ? > In article <OF5B7866DF.97C48143-ON85256FF0.005F7A94-85256FF0.i5 > 005F8C0F@metso.com>, norm.raphael@metso.com writes:- >O@ > > Do not forget that the executable can migrate as-is (in most= > > cases) or very easily from any old VAX to any newer Alphai > > to any new IA64. >EH > With considerably more difficulty that going from 68K MacOS to PowerPC MacOS>  B Please forgive my ignorance of MacOS.  Does that run on SuperDome?   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 09:58:21 +0700& From: Joshua Cope <joshua.cope@hp.com>4 Subject: Re: What is Different or Special About VMS?9 Message-ID: <Xns964679E8EC5B2joshuacopehpcom@15.8.40.106>   H > No, if you want something that is hard to explain, try ASTs (which are+ > probably the most unique feature of VMS).g   The description at r  > http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/default.asp?url=/library/en-1 us/dllproc/base/asynchronous_procedure_calls.asp s  % isn't bad. Same idea, different name.e   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2005.236 ************************