1 INFO-VAX	Fri, 29 Apr 2005	Volume 2005 : Issue 237       Contents:= Re: 64 bit addressing in FORTRAN with (character) descriptors  Re: Appletalk on Alphas  Re: Appletalk on Alphas 7 Re: CDE under DECwindows: customization, documentation?  Re: Compiler bug check Re: DEC/MMJ connectors Re: DEC/MMJ connectors DEC/MMJ connectors Re: DEC/MMJ connectors Re: DEC/MMJ connectors Re: DECsystem 5500, Re: Flash Card reader with VMS Now available, Re: Flash Card reader with VMS Now available- Re: How about a PCI DAQ card in an Alpha PWS? - Re: How about a PCI DAQ card in an Alpha PWS? * Re: INSTALL utility callable from FORTRAN?( Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!( Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  Kill multiple processes by name?$ Re: Kill multiple processes by name?$ Re: Kill multiple processes by name?C Re: Lexical function to set environmental variables of AlphaStation  Re: Login mystery  Re: Login mystery < Re: More ISE's OpenVMS/RTR cluster - talk about scalability!< Re: More ISE's OpenVMS/RTR cluster - talk about scalability!< Re: More ISE's OpenVMS/RTR cluster - talk about scalability!" RE: Once more looking for VMS help Re: OpenVMS License plates Re: OT: Requiem for a Feline Re: OT: Requiem for a Feline Re: Problem with file delete Re: Slow Filesystem I/O  TCPIP V5.5 on OpenVMS V8.25 Re: VMS equivalent of % xset fp+ directory_with_fonts + Re: What is Different or Special About VMS? + Re: What is Different or Special About VMS? + Re: What is Different or Special About VMS?   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 15:57:22 -0400 3 From: Steve Lionel <Steve.Lionel@REMOVEintelME.com> F Subject: Re: 64 bit addressing in FORTRAN with (character) descriptors8 Message-ID: <4tf271t528ulaupcn014uve5vnsd5t7m6n@4ax.com>  J On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 18:45:26 +0200, Albrecht Schlosser <ajs856@tiscali.de> wrote:  L >BTW, I found another "problem" with subroutines and descriptor types. If a O >subroutine includes an interface definition for itself, then it doesn't apply  5 >the 64-bit attribute to its own formal parameter(s).   M No surprise - that's not legal Fortran.  Or rather, the SHOW you are defining > in the interface is not the same one as the routine you're in.  L You cannot define an "interface to self".  Within the routine, you can applyN attributes to the dummy arguments, but you can't create an interface block for	 yourself.    Steve    ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 14:47:10 -0700$ From: "Ed Wilts" <ewilts@ewilts.org>  Subject: Re: Appletalk on AlphasC Message-ID: <1114724829.973805.142600@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>    Thanks Paul & David.  C I did consider the Linux approach (we do some of this already for a F separate customer community) but of course, the beauty of Appletalk isB its feedback to the user when the printer jams, runs out of paper,C toner low, etc.  With the print job offloaded to a Linux system via , lpr, we lose the feedback to the originator.  D I'm not surprised it's dead.  After all, Appletalk should be dead byC now...  I just wanted a definitive answer to pass on to my customer  base and I think I have that.    Thanks, 	    .../Ed    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 19:31:56 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>   Subject: Re: Appletalk on AlphasB Message-ID: <1114731117.f86e14bd065ac4c696840e692a174a29@teranews>   David Mathog wrote: ? > Your best (quickest, cheapest) method for regaining access to  > those printers is: > A > 1. Set up a linux box (it doesn't need to be very big, firewall $ >     as appropriate for your site.)  H When more and more tasks cannot be accomplished on VMS due to abandonnedG software and you need linux boxes, more and more, your focus will shift A on adding more applications on Linux and eventually be stuck with F limited fuinctionality (for your company) on VMS systems which will no> longer be considered strategic for your company's development.  H It is one thing to not get new software like firefox etc, but it is evenG worse when you stop supporting software that was available in the past.   E I realise that it isn't VMS engineers' faults. They shouldn't have to @ spend their own leasure time supporting half of VMS with HP only sponsoring the other half.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 20:41:44 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>@ Subject: Re: CDE under DECwindows: customization, documentation?+ Message-ID: <427190D7.EF846501@comcast.net>    JF Mezei wrote:  > G > Once VMS is on the 8086, it will be there for quite some time and can % > finally start to be improved again.  > " > A rolling stone gathers no moss.  5 Too bad this one is embedded in a former lava flow...    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 14:58:44 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>  Subject: Re: Compiler bug check ( Message-ID: <opspypz6hnzgicya@hyrrokkin>  H On Thu, 28 Apr 2005 20:37:08 GMT, cdm <charlie.mccutcheon@hp.com> wrote:  E >> Can anyone give me some clues as to what "middle end phase" means?  > L > Middle of the C compiler.  The VCG is the VAX Code Generator.  The phase   > of the? > compiler that creates the VAX assembly code for your program.    VCG doesn''t generate assembly.    > K > Old compilers probably aren't supported any more, if the previous reply   
 > is rightL > about the 1995 release date.  This could easily be an environment issue,   > where C > something not obvious changed but effected how the compiler runs.  >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 21:17:30 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> Subject: Re: DEC/MMJ connectors + Message-ID: <4271993A.59977873@comcast.net>    GreyCloud wrote: > < > Does anyone know where I can get a 6-pin DEC/MMJ to female > db25 cable??0 > I managed to acquire an unused VT420 terminal.  D There's actually an adapter for that. H-857x, I think. Many variantsD depending upon the pinout (DCE or DTE, DB25M or DB25F, etc.). H-8575H sticks in my mind for some reason as a common one for use with terminals2 that don't have MMJ jacks. Should be MMJ to DB25F.  F See also "MOD-TAP" and Black Box whilst Googling, searching eBay, etc. ...    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 21:20:02 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> Subject: Re: DEC/MMJ connectors + Message-ID: <427199D2.A6A57363@comcast.net>    David J Dachtera wrote:  >  > GreyCloud wrote: > > > > > Does anyone know where I can get a 6-pin DEC/MMJ to female > > db25 cable??2 > > I managed to acquire an unused VT420 terminal. > F > There's actually an adapter for that. H-857x, I think. Many variantsF > depending upon the pinout (DCE or DTE, DB25M or DB25F, etc.). H-8575J > sticks in my mind for some reason as a common one for use with terminals4 > that don't have MMJ jacks. Should be MMJ to DB25F. > H > See also "MOD-TAP" and Black Box whilst Googling, searching eBay, etc. > ...   G The one I use here says H8571-A on it. H8575-A had lots of filtering in > it for stray RF and such (Class B computing devices, I think).   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 20:04:12 -0600 " From: GreyCloud <cumulus@mist.com> Subject: DEC/MMJ connectors ( Message-ID: <4271961C.5731CA01@mist.com>  : Does anyone know where I can get a 6-pin DEC/MMJ to female db25 cable??. I managed to acquire an unused VT420 terminal.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 22:42:06 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>  Subject: Re: DEC/MMJ connectors B Message-ID: <1114742507.82b9a3c46740485a1e73fb57feac15e5@teranews>   GreyCloud wrote: > < > Does anyone know where I can get a 6-pin DEC/MMJ to female > db25 cable??0 > I managed to acquire an unused VT420 terminal.  G I have H8571-A, it has MMJ female and DB25 female connectors. (you need  a male DB25 cable)  G VT220 and intl VT320 had male DB25s connectors on the terminal, so this  adaptor fit onto the terminal.  E I am in canada. If you can't find a source closer to you, let me know F via email and we could work things out.  I accept payment in chocolate bars :-)   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2005 03:20:56 GMT / From: Adam Stouffer <adam_stouffer@hotmail.com>  Subject: Re: DEC/MMJ connectors ( Message-ID: <sKhce.2208$pc7.38@trndny05>   GreyCloud wrote:< > Does anyone know where I can get a 6-pin DEC/MMJ to female > db25 cable??0 > I managed to acquire an unused VT420 terminal.  E http://www.l-com.com/shopping/search/resultsmain.jsp?sSearch=mmj+db25      Adam   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 29 Apr 2005 03:42:23 GMT ( From: "P. Thompson" <no-spam@new.rr.com> Subject: Re: DECsystem 5500 E Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.62.0504282240180.27715@localhost.localdomain>   3 On Wed, 26 Apr 2005 tomarsin2015@comcast.net wrote:    > E > the version. I seen some where that Linux will run on a 5500, but I A > would like Ultrix. If you have the binaries you can ftp them to  > 68.35.167.136     G Nope, definitely no Linux for the 5500.  A severe lack of QBUS drivers. H No NetBSD even, because until recently not enough technical information C was available.  Perhaps some day NetBSD will support the 5400/5500  	 machines.      --- 6 Lord, protect me from those to whom you speak directlyE perl -e '#this program inspired by LookWAYup;print("hello world\n");'    ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 11:20:10 -07009 From: "Alphaman" <alphaman-nix-spam@hsv.sungardtrust.com> 5 Subject: Re: Flash Card reader with VMS Now available C Message-ID: <1114712410.345978.287300@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>   B Any possibility of a supported PCI-to-IDE interface card that this* could be plugged in to my AlphaServer 800?  D What file system is supported on the cards?  ODS-2 & -5? ODS-3 & -4?A Or can "PCDISK" type utilities be fooled into working with it for  reading/writing FAT16?  F I can see where this would be useful for digital cameras, MP3 players,G and PDAs as well as your stated use of backup media and CD replacement, > although at $179, it's obviously a little steep for hobbyists.   TIA, Aaron       - David Turner, Island Computers US Corp wrote:  > IDE  > B > Plugs right in to DS10/DS10L Main Logic Board + DS20e, ES40, PWS Miata GL > not Miata etc.D > Pretty much anything that uses the current IDE interface for alpha > 9 > Still testing - we'll be releasing them next month end. F > We're waiting for the large CompactFlash cards to come in to be able to do  > full system backups etc. > 2 > Will notify people on this NG when ready to ship >  > David    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 23:32:56 -0400 - From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network> 5 Subject: Re: Flash Card reader with VMS Now available 1 Message-ID: <Y6SdnY9iq8R3N-zfRVn-tw@adelphia.com>    Alphaman wrote: D > Any possibility of a supported PCI-to-IDE interface card that this, > could be plugged in to my AlphaServer 800?  > I use a USB card in my DS10.  I had to add it's PCI id to the G sys$system:sys$user_config.dat.  An Adaptec USB model that was on sale  + just seemed to just work in another system.   7 I do not think I paid more than $20 for either of them.   F > What file system is supported on the cards?  ODS-2 & -5? ODS-3 & -4?  F On my HP Photosmart 7960 Printer, only FAT file system seems to work, - and I have only done a mount/foreign on that.   H For my other low cost USB card readers, ODS-2 or 5 works in addition to : FAT.  Of course I have only used 128MB CompactFlash media.  C > Or can "PCDISK" type utilities be fooled into working with it for  > reading/writing FAT16?  K You might try the mtools on the Freeware disk.  I have not had time to yet.   ; > I can see where this would be useful for digital cameras,   D Most digital cameras seem to be able to be put in a mode where they H appear as a FAT formatted disk.  The two HP ones that I have do, and if 4 you can read FAT on VMS you can transfer the images.   -John  wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 11:43:40 -0700 4 From: Alan Frisbie <Usenet02_REMOVE@Flying-Disk.com>6 Subject: Re: How about a PCI DAQ card in an Alpha PWS?% Message-ID: <1114713800.969859@smirk>   
 Jon wrote:  N > While the substantial cost benefits of PC DAQ cards cannot be ignored, does N > this really mean having to use another OS? An interesting question concerns N > the behavior of these cards in a PCI slot of, say, an Alpha PWS. Given that K > it may be possible to find a PCI DAQ card that avoids SRM level (PnP PCI  M > Bios) problems that are often experienced with non-supported hardware, the  F > next step would involve writing an OpenVMS device driver. While the H > documentation of some manufacturers is limited, others provide fairly M > complete details of the I/O address map, including the relative addressing  O > of Data and CSR registers, a description of various bits etc., together with  L > timing diagrams showing the operation etc. Attempting to write an OpenVMS K > device driver with MACRO64 is luring because 1000's of lines of existing  L > higher level code could then be used, but of course this would be full of I > dangers. However with adequate product manuals writing a device driver  C > should not be too difficult. Anyone with comments / experience /   > suggestions? > H > There could be $$$ in it too. Consider that the Logical Co. are still I > selling the OpenVMS HX device driver for $495 and this just allows the  K > digital IO of the old Q-Bus DRQ3B to be emulated with their DCI-1100 PCI   > card.   C Depending on the complexity and level of testing and documentation, = a new custom VMS device driver can run $20K to $30K, or more, = whether you do it yourself or hire a consultant.   Of course, < this gives you the source code and exactly the functions you, desire (assuming that you specified them :-)  B You can hire someone with experience, or do it yourself, in-house.@ It is the old trade-off:  Speed, Quality, Price -- Pick any two.  C Writing a VMS device driver is not difficult -- the second or third @ time.   Just give yourself *lots* of time for the learning curveB and getting all the nit-picky details right.   If you have written? a Windows/NT or /2000 device driver, you will find the concepts  amazingly similar.  ? If you hire a consultant, I highly recommend that you initially ; hire them to work with you to define exactly what you want. = This should include a complete functional specification, with 9 acceptance criteria.   This will often open your (and the 8 consultant's) eyes to issues that you didn't anticipate.  9 Once you have a specification, then ask the consultant to 9 submit a quote for the driver itself, along with any test : programs, documentation, etc.   Of course, you should have= made it clear from the beginning that you were planning to do ; this.   With a quote in hand, you can decide if you want to > write it yourself or hire this consultant (or a different one) to write it.  @ If you don't feel comfortable with this consultant (and this can= happen for reasons that are nobody's fault), it has only cost > you what you paid for defining the problem, which needed to be done anyway.  9 I have done this several times when writing custom device A drivers and it has always made for a better working relationship.    Alan   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 11:56:58 -0700 , From: Ken Fairfield <my.full.name@intel.com>6 Subject: Re: How about a PCI DAQ card in an Alpha PWS?+ Message-ID: <d4rbm2$cq2$1@news01.intel.com>   
 Jon wrote:N > Thank you to those who responded to the earlier post "Could a PC do this?". N > Having accepted the advantages, power and functionality provided by OpenVMS N > for data acquisition (EFN, QIO, AST etc.) the difficulty of reproducing the O > previously proven configuration remains with the cost of the hardware, which  L > was the ONLY reason for considering an alternative PC-based system in the N > first place. It is not so much the $2K for the DCI-1100 PCI card, but a new  > Tustin A/D costs around $20K.    [...etc., deleted...]   C      Along the lines that Alan relpied, when we migrated from VAXes D to Alphas at SLAC, we had a consultant develop a new PCI board (yes,C the hardware, from scratch) and driver for the AS4100.  Previously, D we'd been using a BI-based board for which he'd also done the HW&SW.  A      I don't have any idea of costs (I was in system managerment, A not budgeting :-), but if this sounds at all interesting, contact < me privately and I'll dig out his information pass it along.   	-Ken  --  6 I don't speak for Intel, Intel doesn't speak for me...  
 Ken Fairfield ! D1C Automation VMS System Support " who:   kenneth dot h dot fairfield where: intel dot com   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 18:17:52 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) 3 Subject: Re: INSTALL utility callable from FORTRAN? 3 Message-ID: <Bj3mfMogGRbC@eisner.encompasserve.org>   \ In article <05042717213282@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>, brandon@dalsemi.com (John Brandon) writes:N >> In article <05042714520665@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>, brandon@dalsemi.com (John >> Brandon) writes: A >> > Is there a way to call the DCL utility INSTALL from FORTRAN?  >>  F >> You can check this out by doing an ANALYZE/IMAGE of INSTALL.EXE andG >> seeing that there is no shareable image specific to INSTALL.  So the ( >> answer to your direct question is No. >>  K >> Presumably you do not like LIB$SPAWN or LIB$DO_COMMAND for your purpose. @ >> It would be good for you to explain what is wrong with those. > P > I was looking for a way to allow a non-privelged user (development) to install > specific applications.    0 Why do those applications have to be installed ?   	Performance ?   	Security ?    	Feng Shui ?  M > I could create an application that makes use of $SNDJBC or create a captive 1 > account that allows for intended installations.   = As often is the case, describing the overall goal might help.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 15:10:57 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> 1 Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! 0 Message-ID: <1172d9u1dcpv92a@corp.supernews.com>   Main, Kerry wrote: >>-----Original Message-----1 >>From: Dave Froble [mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com]   >>Sent: April 27, 2005 10:34 PM  >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 3 >>Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  >> >  >  > [snip...]  >  >  > @ >>Forget about your roadmaps, or lack of same, just look at the 
 >>issue from  ? >>the perspective of where AMD will push Intel.  Then remember  
 >>one little  ? >>thing, HP doesn't own the itanic, has moved the rest of it's   >>engineers + >>to Intel, and cannot proceed on it's own.  >>> >>If you want another reason to respect Poewr and SPARC, it's 
 >>that their  0 >>owners control their own destiny.  HP doesn't. >> >>Dave >  > I > Dave, Let me turn this around a tad and say "look at AMD and Intel from  > an unbiased perspective".  > J > Yes, AMD has a good offering with its x86 chips and competition is good,& > so I hope they continue to do well.  > H > However, look at this from an analysts perspective as outlined in this
 > article: > J > http://news.com.com/AMD+posts+loss%2C+will+spin+off+memory-chip+unit/210$ > 0-1006_3-5669787.html?tag=nefd.top > A > April 13, 2005 - AMD posts loss, will spin off memory-chip unit D > "The announcement came as AMD said it swung to a loss in the firstA > quarter, hurt by weak pricing for memory chips amid an industry F > oversupply. The loss was $17.4 million, or 4 cents a share, comparedC > with a year-earlier profit of $45.1 million, or 12 cents a share. ( > Analysts had been expecting a profit."  L Well, spinning off the losing unit will insure that that won't happen again.  - > Now, contrast the above with the following: B > http://www.intel.com/pressroom/archive/releases/20050419corp.htmI > SANTA CLARA, Calif., April 19, 2005 - Intel Corporation today announced I > first-quarter revenue of $9.4 billion, up 17 percent year-over-year and  > down 2 percent sequentially.  D I've already written elsewhere that Intel is still making plenty of I money.  The majority of PCs won't use Opteron, or Athlon FX55, and such.  H   Intel at this time will still get the major part of the PC CPU market.  G I also wrote that the perceptions that AMD is superior can kill Intel.  B Given time, users will form the opinion that they need to use AMD I because it's better, even though they don't need the performance.  Intel  G cannot allow that to happen.  Therefore, Intel will push their own x86  % chips as far and as fast as they can.   E It's not Opteron that will kill itanic.  It's Intel's own chips that   will kill itanic.   F > The point is that AMD has some good chip offerings, but they clearlyH > need to do better financially in the future. And getting ISV's to take@ > advantage of their 64bit capabilities is not going to be easy.  H Things like this don't happen overnight.  But is is happening right now.  J > And Intel has many product lines from which to absorb individual product > up's and down's. > @ > As I said in an earlier thread - the game has only just begun.  E My fear is that the future for itanic is doubtful, and therefore the    future for VMS becomes doubtful.   Dave   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 16:44:11 -0400 ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>1 Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! = Message-ID: <H7ydnZa7WqCG1uzfRVn-pA@metrocastcablevision.com>    Main, Kerry wrote: >>-----Original Message-----2 >>From: Bill Todd [mailto:billtodd@metrocast.net]  >>Sent: April 28, 2005 11:25 AM  >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 3 >>Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  >> >>Main, Kerry wrote: >> >>>>-----Original Message-----4 >>>>From: Bill Todd [mailto:billtodd@metrocast.net] ! >>>>Sent: April 28, 2005 10:23 AM  >>>>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 5 >>>>Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  >>>> >>>  >>>  >>>[Misc snipped ..] >>>  >>>  >>> ? >>>>Well, duh:  IBM has the most scalable systems, whether you   >>>>want high-end 8 >>>>enterprise-level gear or scaled-up low-to-mid-range  >>>>enterprise-qualify  A >>>>boxes with x86 compatibility - both with service and support   >>>>(including  @ >>>>any level of consultation you might require) second to none. >>>>A >>>>Why exactly *wouldn't* a customer 'think IBM first'?  If you   >>>>still have  E >>>>difficulty understanding this, you might ask Terry:  he seems to.  >>>> >>>  >>>  >>>[misc snipped..]  >>> - >>>Bill, when did you start working for IBM?   >>G >>I fully understand that you wouldn't recognize (or at least publicly  > >>agree with) an objective assessment if it jumped up and bit 
 >>you in the  F >>ass, Kerry.  But why don't you ask the same question of your former ; >>cohort in spin Terry?  Even while vigorously pimping for   >>cHumPaq he was  " >>never loath to give IBM its due. >> >  > * > "Objective assessment" ... Puulllease ..  I As I said, you wouldn't recognize one if it jumped up and bit you in the  H ass.  And it is frequently my pleasure to offer them up to do precisely - that - attempt to spin them away as you will.   !   Giving IBM their due is not the J > issue as IBM is a good company, a good competitor and a good Customer ofG > HP. Like all large companies, they have strengths and weaknesses. And A > they have had to make some tough decisions in the past as well.  > J > However, what would have happened if I (or anyone from HP) had used your > words on this newsgroup:   > G > "Well, duh:  HP {you said IBM] has the most scalable systems, whether G > you want high-end enterprise-level gear or scaled-up low-to-mid-range I > enterprise-qualify boxes with x86 compatibility - both with service and H > support (including any level of consultation you might require) secondE > to none. Why exactly *wouldn't* a customer 'think HP [you said IBM) 
 > first'?" > H > Whoever posted that would have been crucified as a Sales and Marketing > type.   I Well, yuh, Kerry:  because it would be, quite unlike the statement which  * I made about IBM, so demonstrably *false*.  A But then truth has never seemed to be something which you valued  F overmuch, so the distinction might be difficult for you to appreciate.   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 18:59:42 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> 1 Subject: RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB5ECE8F@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----4 > From: Bill Todd [mailto:billtodd@metrocast.net]=20 > Sent: April 28, 2005 4:44 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 3 > Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  >=20 > Main, Kerry wrote: > >>-----Original Message-----6 > >>From: Bill Todd [mailto:billtodd@metrocast.net]=20! > >>Sent: April 28, 2005 11:25 AM  > >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 5 > >>Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  > >>  
 [snip ...]   > >=20, > > "Objective assessment" ... Puulllease .. >=20B > As I said, you wouldn't recognize one if it jumped up and bit=20 > you in the=20 B > ass.  And it is frequently my pleasure to offer them up to do=20 > precisely=20/ > that - attempt to spin them away as you will.  >=20# >   Giving IBM their due is not the > > > issue as IBM is a good company, a good competitor and a=20 > good Customer of< > > HP. Like all large companies, they have strengths and=20 > weaknesses. And C > > they have had to make some tough decisions in the past as well.  > >=20A > > However, what would have happened if I (or anyone from HP)=20  > had used your  > > words on this newsgroup:=20  > >=20; > > "Well, duh:  HP {you said IBM] has the most scalable=20  > systems, whether; > > you want high-end enterprise-level gear or scaled-up=20  > low-to-mid-rangeB > > enterprise-qualify boxes with x86 compatibility - both with=20
 > service and = > > support (including any level of consultation you might=20  > require) second G > > to none. Why exactly *wouldn't* a customer 'think HP [you said IBM)  > > first'?" > >=20? > > Whoever posted that would have been crucified as a Sales=20  > and Marketing 	 > > type.  >=20= > Well, yuh, Kerry:  because it would be, quite unlike the=20  > statement which=20, > I made about IBM, so demonstrably *false*. >=20E > But then truth has never seemed to be something which you valued=20 H > overmuch, so the distinction might be difficult for you to appreciate. >=20 > - bill  B Ah yes, always the ever so elequent slinger of personal insults on	 c.o.v.=20    Very professional... Not.   , Ah well, it is a newsgroup, so snipe away...   :-)   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 19:35:07 -0400 ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>1 Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! = Message-ID: <Xv6dncP0y-ux7uzfRVn-pQ@metrocastcablevision.com>    Main, Kerry wrote:   ...   D > Ah yes, always the ever so elequent slinger of personal insults on	 > c.o.v.    I Well, I may not always qualify as eloquent, but at least I can spell the   word.   H Other than that, I find virtue in calling a spade a spade - yet another 9 area you do not appear to be at all well-acquainted with.    - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 21:32:53 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> 1 Subject: RE: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB5ECE99@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----4 > From: Bill Todd [mailto:billtodd@metrocast.net]=20 > Sent: April 28, 2005 7:35 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 3 > Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  >=20 > Main, Kerry wrote: >=20 > ...  >=20F > > Ah yes, always the ever so elequent slinger of personal insults on
 > > c.o.v.=20  >=20? > Well, I may not always qualify as eloquent, but at least I=20  > can spell the=20 > word.  >=20  D So now you not only *correct* other obviously misguided thoughts andE ideas that do not agree with yours, but also have taken up correcting ! spelling as well? In a newsgroup?    :-) :-)    Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 22:12:03 -0400 ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>1 Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability! = Message-ID: <i-CdnaGCJetpCuzfRVn-1Q@metrocastcablevision.com>    Main, Kerry wrote: >>-----Original Message-----2 >>From: Bill Todd [mailto:billtodd@metrocast.net]  >>Sent: April 28, 2005 7:35 PM >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 3 >>Subject: Re: ISE proves OpenVMS future viability!  >> >>Main, Kerry wrote: >> >>...  >> >>E >>>Ah yes, always the ever so elequent slinger of personal insults on 
 >>>c.o.v.  >>= >>Well, I may not always qualify as eloquent, but at least I   >>can spell the  >>word.  >> >  > F > So now you not only *correct* other obviously misguided thoughts andG > ideas that do not agree with yours, but also have taken up correcting # > spelling as well? In a newsgroup?   C Only when the content to which I'm responding isn't worth anything  G better.  Besides, while I don't harbor much hope that your ethics will  H ever improve, it's at least remotely possible that your spelling might,  with coaching.   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 19:03:25 -0700 % From: DeanW <dean.woodward@gmail.com> ) Subject: Kill multiple processes by name? 6 Message-ID: <3f119ada05042819031317a40@mail.gmail.com>  E I've just had someone banging away, trying to break in via SSH. While E I shut it off at the firewall (after 980 failures- just a couple past F VMS setting intruder status, heh...), there are still a couple hundredD dropped SSH processes that I wish I could clear out. Is there a toolD that can kill a group of processes based on a wild-carded name, such as TCPIP$SS_*?   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 22:44:49 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> - Subject: Re: Kill multiple processes by name? B Message-ID: <1114742669.0a6d1ad31dc28ad3120305f57741ec36@teranews>   DeanW wrote:F > dropped SSH processes that I wish I could clear out. Is there a toolF > that can kill a group of processes based on a wild-carded name, such > as TCPIP$SS_*?  C You could do F$GETJPI loop to scan through processes and STOP/ID if  F$LOCATE finds TCPIP$SSH   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 22:22:35 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) - Subject: Re: Kill multiple processes by name?n3 Message-ID: <6WRK1JDfZ4gQ@eisner.encompasserve.org>t  ^ In article <3f119ada05042819031317a40@mail.gmail.com>, DeanW <dean.woodward@gmail.com> writes:G > I've just had someone banging away, trying to break in via SSH. While G > I shut it off at the firewall (after 980 failures- just a couple pastEH > VMS setting intruder status, heh...), there are still a couple hundredF > dropped SSH processes that I wish I could clear out. Is there a toolF > that can kill a group of processes based on a wild-carded name, such > as TCPIP$SS_*?  $ Did you consider the value shown by:   	MCR SYSGEN SHOW TTY_TIMEOUT   ?t   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 20:50:08 -0500e2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>L Subject: Re: Lexical function to set environmental variables of AlphaStation+ Message-ID: <427192D0.57B5D19C@comcast.net>m   Rudolf Wingert wrote:c >  > Hello, > F > AFAIK there is an undocumented lexical function to set environmental2 > variables. Does anybody know how it can be done?  H I thought I'd read something about F$SETENV(), but it may have just beenC a wish list item. If its there at all, it's likely undocumented andt likely V7.3-2 or later.E   -- m David J Dachtera dba DJE SystemsM http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/t   Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 20:36:36 -0500-2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> Subject: Re: Login mystery+ Message-ID: <42718FA4.61B9ACE0@comcast.net>t   JF Mezei wrote:: >  > David J Dachtera wrote:AE > > >      Where's the smiley, Bob?  Of course.  What I actually types( > > > is "mc sysman", lowercase and all. > % > > Can I get fries with my McSYSMAN?s > D > Sorry, you can't. The owner of the McSYSMAN utility has been underF > trememdous pressure to cut the fat from its product portfolio.  TheyJ > don't want to be seen as "with fries ?" anymore, it should be "would you* > like a McSalad with this ?" from now on. > F > There's even been a documentary about this: "Superzize that cluster" > :-) :-) :-) :-)  > A > Time for the VMS engineers to change the DECW$BURGER utility to  > DECW$SALAD.EXE  :-)p  $ Dunno... I still like REQUEST/PIZZA.  3 Does anyone still have doc. on a standard DECpizza?    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:r" http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/n  " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/i   Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 20:38:27 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> Subject: Re: Login mystery+ Message-ID: <42719012.94AC0058@comcast.net>t   John Santos wrote: >  > ... "MC_bletch" ...f   Wanna wipe that up, man?   -- y David J Dachtera dba DJE Systemse http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/<  " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/g   Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 15:51:37 -0400e' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> E Subject: Re: More ISE's OpenVMS/RTR cluster - talk about scalability! 0 Message-ID: <1172fm5g8dhiu14@corp.supernews.com>   FredK wrote:6 > "Dave Froble" <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote in message, > news:1170jgjai81m660@corp.supernews.com... >  >>FredK wrote: >> >>E >>>You may now return to your normally scheduled "Itanic Deathwatch".n >>C >>Isn't the fact that there is such a monster a reason for concern?s >>J >>Keep in mind that overall, these aren't people saying "Oh Boy, itanic isJ >>gonna die!"  These are (the majority) people saying "Oh Shit, where will >>we be if itanic dies?" >  > F > Frankly Dave, you'd be suprised just how little the subject actually1 > comes up, and how quickly the issue is settled.  > @ > Now, of course - *this* is the Internet, where anybody with an@ > opinion can repeat it over and over and over and over until it > seems like the truth.n > C > The "Itanic Deathwatch" has an easily countable number of people,uF > and no matter what forum you go to - odds are it will contain mostly > the same people. > C > Keep in mind, that overall these people have been predicting both E > the demise of VMS *and* the demise of Itanium for years.  They also F > tend to be the same people who continue to flog the Alpha-EV8-would-A > have-solved-world-hunger and Curly and Carly are Evil ratholes.eB > These people seem to have lost any touch with reality, and won'tI > even consider for an instant that Itanium isn't anything but a steaming ? > pile of crap...  because geeze, Alpha could have been better.a  ) So what do you want, quantity or quality?e  E Or we could revisit Brian's 50 billion flies and their favorite food.5  E When a few people said that Hammer would significantly affect Intel, iA many others claimed they were just a few troublemakers.  Can you  / possibly deny that their foresight was correct?@  H When you can see something coming, but the majority don't want it to be + so, does their denial really mean anything?    -- G4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486t   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 18:20:42 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)rE Subject: Re: More ISE's OpenVMS/RTR cluster - talk about scalability! 3 Message-ID: <Ge7xRKE+5Kik@eisner.encompasserve.org>h  Z In article <1170jgjai81m660@corp.supernews.com>, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes: > FredK wrote: > E >> You may now return to your normally scheduled "Itanic Deathwatch".  > C > Isn't the fact that there is such a monster a reason for concern?b > K > Keep in mind that overall, these aren't people saying "Oh Boy, itanic is pK > gonna die!"  These are (the majority) people saying "Oh Shit, where will o > we be if itanic dies?"  G Whereas the rest of us are saying, "When will these people go elsewheretA and let us use this newsgroup for serious technical discussions."    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 19:47:17 -0400 ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>E Subject: Re: More ISE's OpenVMS/RTR cluster - talk about scalability!t= Message-ID: <1JadnXUIlOCb6-zfRVn-gw@metrocastcablevision.com>M   Larry Kilgallen wrote:\ > In article <1170jgjai81m660@corp.supernews.com>, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes: >  >>FredK wrote: >> >>E >>>You may now return to your normally scheduled "Itanic Deathwatch".h >>C >>Isn't the fact that there is such a monster a reason for concern?c >>K >>Keep in mind that overall, these aren't people saying "Oh Boy, itanic is tK >>gonna die!"  These are (the majority) people saying "Oh Shit, where will y >>we be if itanic dies?" >  > I > Whereas the rest of us are saying, "When will these people go elsewhere0C > and let us use this newsgroup for serious technical discussions."n  D What a silly question!  The answer has been crystal-clear to anyone F paying even marginal attention for nearly four years now:  as soon as F cHumPaq fixes the problems it created by its long-term neglect of VMS F (and of course as greatly exacerbated by its perfidy and mendacity in A the killing of Alpha and its subsequent diversion of primary VMS hA development effort into an otherwise superfluous port to Itanic).n  D Perhaps you need to prod cHumPaq along a bit in this effort, if the   situation is not to your liking.   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 14:56:32 -0400a' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>.+ Subject: RE: Once more looking for VMS helpeR Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB5ECE77@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----$ > From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu=20A > [mailto:bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu] On Behalf Of Bill GunshannonC > Sent: April 28, 2005 11:17 AM7 > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Como) > Subject: Once more looking for VMS helpM >=20H > I have finally gotten the power in for my "new" Vaxen.  It now appearsH > I am going to need help just getting them up and running before I even$ > get to the VMS (or Cluster) stage. >=20F > So, with that, is there anyone here who would be willing to get withF > me via Email (so we don't completely bore the group or show them howF > little I really know :-) to figure out how to setup and configure=20D > these systems?  Basicly, we're talking VAX 6640 and a StorageworksF > cabinet connected by CI. (Actually, I am assuming I even have enoughB > pieces to hook everything together.  I could be wrong even about > that.) >=20 > Any volunteers?  >=20 > bill >=20 > --=20f    C Bill - drop me a direct email and I will forward some VAX 6000 techn/ documents and guides that may be of assistance.    Regards-  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant, HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660o Fax: 613-591-4477r kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 17:50:02 -0400 ) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca>p# Subject: Re: OpenVMS License platesl; Message-ID: <lUcce.10237$BW6.1028623@news20.bellglobal.com>-   I vote for:a   Hack-free and cool.:  
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,r Ontario, Canada.! http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/n    / <susan_skonetski@hotmail.com> wrote in message  = news:1114649387.641371.224700@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... 
 > Dear Folks,I >eF > One thing is for sure the VMS folks are truly a creative bunch, fromE > the hundreds of suggestions I have managed to narrow it down to theoI > ones that I could possibly do without offending trademarks, cultures orNH > people and other companies (not mentioning names but blue screens wereF > mentioned a lot) which eliminated a huge percentage of them.  What II > would like to do is get the following list down to about 5 then put thel@ > 5 on www.openvms.org and have folks vote.  If you see anythingF > seriously wrong with any of the suggestions below please let me knowH > and I will eliminate the choice.  Please send your feedback by Friday. >hI > How to get them once we decide - Boot Camp (of course)  and I will make@D > sure that they are in New Orleans as well as any OpenVMS Technical; > Update Day and then we will see what else comes along ;')h >r > Warm Regards as always,m > Suep >e >n) > Always had integrity - Now on Integrityn >C( > Serious Computing for Serious Business >i* > When you are done playing with computers >  > Safe and Secure  >f) > The Gold Standard in Cluster TechnologyD >a% > Reliability, Security, Availabilityi >n  > When downtime is not an option > % > My only Operating System Is OpenVMSi >. > I'd rather be running OpenVMSn >  > Run OpenVMS Ask me how >e > Hack free and cool >i4 > OpenVMS - Reliability measured in years, not tears > ( > OpenVMS - When security REALLY matters >t# > OpenVMS -Now with added Integritya >f > Solid, Secure, Savvy >n" > Facing the future with Integrity >e > Your Money Rides on Us > $ > OpenVMS - The Bet Your Business OS >  > Integrity Matterss >e# > OpenVMS - 100% uptime is possiblep >o > OpenVMS - Drive Safe!h >    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 20:34:56 -0500:2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>% Subject: Re: OT: Requiem for a Feliner+ Message-ID: <42718F40.38101249@comcast.net>9  
 "Doc." wrote:d > : > %NEWS-I-NEWMSG, leslie wrote in news:oNMbe.30749$h6.4695 > @tornado.texas.rr.coma > & > >    http://www.savingsandclone.com/K > >    Genetic Savings and Clone - the leading provider of pet gene bankingh  > >    and pet cloning services. > ? > The *boggle* factor is the $32K price tag for a cloned kitty.i  D Even "fur-bearin' critters" have personalities. As such, I prefer to; think of each as unique, and would rather keep it that way.2   -- O David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems9 http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:e" http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/c  " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/y   Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 21:57:47 -0400e- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>s% Subject: Re: OT: Requiem for a Feline B Message-ID: <1114739863.8cdce0f5d4eb271f6a806acd4f1cc53a@teranews>   David J Dachtera wrote:eA > > The *boggle* factor is the $32K price tag for a cloned kitty.o > F > Even "fur-bearin' critters" have personalities. As such, I prefer to= > think of each as unique, and would rather keep it that way.  >   H And contrary to most science fiction, when you clone a being, the clonedH lifeform does not inherit the memories, knowledge and personality of the previous lifeform.  G It may inherit certain traits that are the result of genetics, but muchnF of a personality is gotten from the environment after conception, muchG of which can enhance or diminish genetic originated behaviour patterns. A Cats will all go for mice. That is part of their genes, just likePB squirrels going for nuts. Those are genes common to a species, not specific to an individual.    A A VMS system builds a certain personality over the years with theVH lint/applications it accumulates and it is very much a reflection of itsG master/system manager. But cloning animals is more like duplicating VMSi= distribution medium instead of duplicating populated systems.,  ) (how's that for bringing this on topic ?)    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 19:28:33 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>g% Subject: Re: Problem with file delete B Message-ID: <1114730919.1ec5703ed7a64a0fac9b458c171c7511@teranews>   Michael Moroney wrote:J > Is erase-on-delete set for the volume or file?  If so, it will take time, > to overwrite all those blocks with zeroes.    C Wouldn't this be done synchronously and be garanteed to be complete ' before the delete operation completes ?    ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 23:47:05 -0500+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)t  Subject: Re: Slow Filesystem I/O3 Message-ID: <VEZYDSNQHZ$k@eisner.encompasserve.org>d  h In article <pPednc3nOIbBEvffRVn-tQ@metrocastcablevision.com>, Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> writes:   > K > Of course, VMS's default buffer size is ridiculously small, and IIRC VMS eF > does not by default perform multi-buffered writing (or in fact lazy J > writing at all, so the operation that exceeds the buffer's capacity has F > to wait for a synchronous disk access to occur), so voila:  you get F > close to the worst of *both* worlds (though if you're willing to go G > beyond VMS's defaults and tweak things you can obtain performance at  K > least comparable to that of Windows, and if you're good at such tweaking u > often even somewhat better). > H > Any operating system at all serious about its future would have fixed J > such default behavior a decade or more ago:  looking like an utter slug I > when compared with the default behavior on Windows or Unix, especially  I > while providing no stronger guarantees that the data has actually made  . > it onto the disk as compensation, is absurd. >   B 	I disagree.  IBM has been packing along mainframes with all theirI 	warts for years.  Newer hardware has masked the problem you describe fora= 	the most part (smallness of buffers).  I'd guess a very highdA 	percentage of VMS storage today is modern disk subsystems (HSG80r& 	or better) as storage infrastructure.  ; 	I'm seeing reads that hit disk cache and come back in lessa@ 	than a millisecond in some cases , which tells me it takes that  	long or less to write to cache.  9 	Bill Gates is promoting flash on a hard drive as a quickt< 	wake-up for Longhorn and accessing frequently touched stuff  A http://www.zdnetindia.com/techzone/enterprise/stories/120985.htmln  E 	(Funny thing there of course is the info is in the modest 128 MBytes2= 	of flash memory on the disk but isn't in the 4 Gigabytes of n& 	local memory?  I don't get that one).  E 	It will only get better with MRAM and its *anticipated* use to mask  H 	filesystem or IO slowness (write to MRAM - destage to storage frame at  	your leisure).   > 	Cache is getting bigger, cpus faster, storage subsystems much@ 	more powerful, interconnects much faster (2 Gigabit fibre cardsE 	the norm today), the "problem" of a slow filesystem is a non-problemiG 	in my opinion.  In some ways (as much as I liked Spiralog), Spiralog'snC 	timing was quite unfortunate as a few short years later the entire B 	infrastructure was so much faster and write-back cache the norm -, 	Spiralog wouldn't have been a big win.  (1)  > 	I'd guess filesystem development will run along the lines of C 	Centera.  Massive object oriented catalogs.  Won't matter how sloweB 	the filesystem is, the hardware will be there to mask it or alongD 	shortly to fix the slowness.  In Centera's case - that was exactly G 	what happened.  Competitive talk (been there, heard  that, read about  C 	it) was Centera was slow - true at the time.  But the next gen got F 	faster and I'm sure a follow-up generation will be even faster still.   				Rob'  J (1)  Lesson:  Careful what problem you are solving.  Those nasty hardware ;      folks might just come along and make you look foolish.    ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 17:10:22 -05007 From: "Gareth V. Williams" <graff@cfa0.cfa.harvard.edu>K# Subject: TCPIP V5.5 on OpenVMS V8.2i. Message-ID: <4271513e@cfanews.cfa.harvard.edu>  B Last night I upgraded my home system from V7.3-2 to V8.2, in orderE to try out the new V5.5 TCPIP.  The X11 forwarding via the "standard"lA U**x mechanism works very nicely: I simply logged into a U**x box < at work, type "nutscrape" and up popped the Netscape window.  = I was disappointed to find that sftp will still only transferi2 Stream-LF (or fixed-length 512-byte record) files.  E Is this restriction likely to be lifted in the next version of TCPIP?o  C I have a large number of command files that copy datafiles from ourP= work VMS cluster onto the U**x webserver--it is impractial tooA preconvert every single file into Stream-LF format before copying C them.  In addition, most of these command files rename the files asfD they copy them (not possible with sftp) or append them onto existingI remote files (also not possible).  So the inability to copy non-Stream-LFpD files is but one hurdle to our adopting sftp for use in all cases...   <rant>I Why couldn't sftp have been designed to be backwards-compatible with ftp?lE Then in order to have encrypted transfer, all one would need to do top7 make existing ftp-using command files work would be to:c $ FTP :== SFTP
 and voila!< The implementation of SSH has been very badly thought out... </rant>n     --  H ------------------------------------------------------------------------H Gareth V. Williams, MS 18, 60 Garden Street, Cambridge, MA 02138, U.S.A.+ Associate Director, IAU Minor Planet Center H gwilliams@cfa.harvard.edu        http://cfa-www.harvard.edu/iau/mpc.html7 OpenVMS & RISC OS: refined choices in operating systems    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 20:00:13 -0400b- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>h> Subject: Re: VMS equivalent of % xset fp+ directory_with_fontsB Message-ID: <1114732820.4491da9d39008cb840480267c09e232f@teranews>  / Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: H > Fine.  That's where I put some Cyrillic fonts I already have, but they# > are just one size/strength/style.   D Bitmap fonts are like that. You need one file for each size and fontH style. So you need 6 files if you want 1 font with 2 sizes and each size with book, italic and bold.    You may want to take a peek at: 8 http://www.msu.edu/~huntharo/xwin/docs/xwindows/XLFD.pdf  D It is a PDF file. I had a nice html link once but lost it. The aboveQ gives a good description of font handling in X widnows. It originated at Digital.l   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 18:07:08 -0400i- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 4 Subject: Re: What is Different or Special About VMS?B Message-ID: <1114726041.002f2e09e8873bce8cd1be8e3ee64ad2@teranews>   norm.raphael@metso.com wrote: J > > With considerably more difficulty that going from 68K MacOS to PowerPC > MacOS> > D > Please forgive my ignorance of MacOS.  Does that run on SuperDome?  D It has to do about platform changes. Apple did an extremely eloquestF move from 68k to PowerPc with an automatic emulator that could kick inE on the fly for drivers and the apple equivalent of a shareable image.u* Even parts of the OPS were still 68k code.  E Most applications ran essentially unchanged. You often just needed toeG increase the amount of memory allocated to that app. No licencing junk, E no fuss, no issue, and not a whole bunch of packages that never  werelH ported to Alpha. Digital could have done the VAX to Alpha transition farN better both on technical but most importantly business practices pont of view.   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 17:55:32 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)a4 Subject: Re: What is Different or Special About VMS?3 Message-ID: <BHcZvpg+SV4o@eisner.encompasserve.org>   p In article <OF5C272AAC.75A781F0-ON85256FF1.00513B7D-85256FF1.0051228F@metso.com>, norm.raphael@metso.com writes: >  >  >  >  >  > J > Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) wrote on 04/27/2005 05:47:04 PM: > @ >> In article <OF5B7866DF.97C48143-ON85256FF0.005F7A94-85256FF0.6 >> 005F8C0F@metso.com>, norm.raphael@metso.com writes: >>A >> > Do not forget that the executable can migrate as-is (in mostl> >> > cases) or very easily from any old VAX to any newer Alpha >> > to any new IA64.  >>I >> With considerably more difficulty that going from 68K MacOS to PowerPCr > MacOS> > D > Please forgive my ignorance of MacOS.  Does that run on SuperDome?  F No, but when one went from 68K to PPC, all the MacOS images (including device drivers) _just_worked_.   ------------------------------    Date: 28 Apr 2005 22:34:51 -0500; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler)-4 Subject: Re: What is Different or Special About VMS?3 Message-ID: <d4FcgXqIsRmD@eisner.encompasserve.org>j  W In article <3dc4u8F6tagnqU1@individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:s > 0 > I didn't say that.  I said that DEFCON didn't.  H    Except that VMS was at DEFCON and was attacked.  RSX and CPM weren't.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2005.237 ************************