1 INFO-VAX	Sat, 06 Aug 2005	Volume 2005 : Issue 435       Contents:% Announcement:  New PL/I kit for Alpha , Best backup software to use with tape robots0 Re: Best backup software to use with tape robots0 Re: Best backup software to use with tape robots0 Re: Best backup software to use with tape robots0 Re: Best backup software to use with tape robots0 Re: Best backup software to use with tape robots Re: C compiler, 7-character CRC 3 Re: Data File Search Order in Some VMS Applications 3 Re: Data File Search Order in Some VMS Applications 3 Re: Data File Search Order in Some VMS Applications 3 Re: Data File Search Order in Some VMS Applications 3 Re: Data File Search Order in Some VMS Applications 1 Re: Digital logo and other character cell draws..  EFI is out to lunch  Re: EFI is out to lunch  Re: EFI is out to lunch  Re: EFI is out to lunch  Re: EFI is out to lunch  Re: EFI is out to lunch  Re: EFI is out to lunch  Re: EFI is out to lunch  Re: EFI is out to lunch  Re: EFI is out to lunch  Re: HP cuts announced  Re: HP cuts announced  Re: HP cuts announced  Re: HP cuts announced 7 HP Pearl - HP Says Over 5,000 Applications on Integrity / Re: Intel hammer another nail in Itanium coffin / Re: Intel hammer another nail in Itanium coffin / Re: Intel hammer another nail in Itanium coffin / Re: Intel hammer another nail in Itanium coffin / Re: Intel hammer another nail in Itanium coffin ( Re: M e z e i  newest member of Al Qaeda( Re: M e z e i  newest member of Al Qaeda0 Re: Moving a UAF file from one Alpha to another. OpenVMS Pearl from Aug 3rd' OpenVMS Sessions at HP Technology Forum  Re: OT: Re: LaTeX ---> PDF& PL/I for OpenVM HTML Documentation kit  Re: Rdb 72 FT2 for Alpha and I64  Re: Rdb 72 FT2 for Alpha and I64  Re: Rdb 72 FT2 for Alpha and I64  Re: Rdb 72 FT2 for Alpha and I64  Re: Rdb 72 FT2 for Alpha and I64' strange terminal-characteristic problem + Re: strange terminal-characteristic problem  Updated VMS Information , VMS Technical Journal Call for Participation2 Re: Where is Macro 32 in OpenVMS 7.3 Distribution?4 Why is disk I/O operation rate .GT. direct I/O rate? www.weatherduck.com DOWN?  Re: www.weatherduck.com DOWN?  Re: www.weatherduck.com DOWN?   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 11:39:49 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> . Subject: Announcement:  New PL/I kit for Alpha( Message-ID: <opsu1ssnd6zgicya@hyrrokkin>  9 A new kit is now available for download from our website, 7 which includes a complete rebuild of the GEM interface.   < This fixes a cute bug.  When compiling with /SHOW=STATISTICSD the compile speed is computed in lines per minute.  Time is measuredD in in units of a hundredth of a millisecond,  which turned out to beK zero for a small program on an ES47.  When this code was originally written I in 1978 for the VAX I guess it was never thought that computers would get 
 that fast!   Tom    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 11:58:33 -0600 + From: Mark Berryman <mark@theberrymans.com> 5 Subject: Best backup software to use with tape robots % Message-ID: <42f3465a$1@mvb.saic.com>   G I have just acquired a tape robot to do backups with (an ADIC Faststor  G 22) and there seems to be a number of products on the CONDIST meant to  H use such things.  Would anyone be willing to share their opinions as to G which software is best for managing backups to a tape robot?  or which  E of the packages on the CONDIST is still being actively supported and  
 developed?  F Ideally, I'd like a package that supports one host with access to the F tape device but allows other hosts to make use of it via the network. C ABS and SLS appear to have had this but it isn't supported in V8.2.   
 Mark Berryman    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 14:51:38 -0400- From: William Webb <william.w.webb@gmail.com> 9 Subject: Re: Best backup software to use with tape robots 7 Message-ID: <8660a3a105080511511e548918@mail.gmail.com>   7 On 8/5/05, Mark Berryman <mark@theberrymans.com> wrote: H > I have just acquired a tape robot to do backups with (an ADIC FaststorH > 22) and there seems to be a number of products on the CONDIST meant toI > use such things.  Would anyone be willing to share their opinions as to H > which software is best for managing backups to a tape robot?  or whichF > of the packages on the CONDIST is still being actively supported and > developed? >=20G > Ideally, I'd like a package that supports one host with access to the G > tape device but allows other hosts to make use of it via the network. E > ABS and SLS appear to have had this but it isn't supported in V8.2.  >=20 > Mark Berryman  >=20
 I'm confused.   E Speaking strictly of ABS through Version 4.1 which is the most recent  with which I've worked:   B The remote device management capabilities which made client/serverD backups possible in prior versions of ABS were DECnet-only, and were: based on technology licensed from Touch Technologies, Inc.  F While Touch did make a TCPIP remote device driver, it was not licensed, for inclusion in the ABS/MDMS product suite.  L Page two of the ABS 4.3 SPD  http://h18000.www1.hp.com/info/SP4816/SP4816PF= PDF=20  > mentions the Remote Device Facility (RDF) (still appears to be DECnet/DECnet-plus only).   F but it states that ABS is supported on all systems on which OpenVMS is
 qualified.  > Where specifically did you see the not-on-8.2 information? =20   I missed it.  C You do need to purchase VMS client licenses ($500 a pop last time I F had to order one, warning! information may be dated.) or else it won'tC do client/server jobs if VMS clients are involved.  Can't speak for @ NT/UX, as I haven't had the, ahem, pleasure of being tasked with setting such things up.    WWWebb       --=20 C NOTE: This email address is only used for noncommerical VMS-related  correspondence. C All unsolicited commercial email will be deemed to be a request for 8 services pursuant to the terms and conditions located at# http://bellsouthpwp.net/w/e/webbww/    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 17:04:13 -0600 + From: Mark Berryman <mark@theberrymans.com> 9 Subject: Re: Best backup software to use with tape robots % Message-ID: <42f38dfd$1@mvb.saic.com>    William Webb wrote: 9 > On 8/5/05, Mark Berryman <mark@theberrymans.com> wrote:  > H >>I have just acquired a tape robot to do backups with (an ADIC FaststorH >>22) and there seems to be a number of products on the CONDIST meant toI >>use such things.  Would anyone be willing to share their opinions as to H >>which software is best for managing backups to a tape robot?  or whichF >>of the packages on the CONDIST is still being actively supported and >>developed? >>G >>Ideally, I'd like a package that supports one host with access to the G >>tape device but allows other hosts to make use of it via the network. E >>ABS and SLS appear to have had this but it isn't supported in V8.2.  >> >>Mark Berryman  >> >  > I'm confused.  > G > Speaking strictly of ABS through Version 4.1 which is the most recent  > with which I've worked:  > D > The remote device management capabilities which made client/serverF > backups possible in prior versions of ABS were DECnet-only, and were< > based on technology licensed from Touch Technologies, Inc. > H > While Touch did make a TCPIP remote device driver, it was not licensed. > for inclusion in the ABS/MDMS product suite. > Q > Page two of the ABS 4.3 SPD  http://h18000.www1.hp.com/info/SP4816/SP4816PFPDF   > @ > mentions the Remote Device Facility (RDF) (still appears to be > DECnet/DECnet-plus only).  > H > but it states that ABS is supported on all systems on which OpenVMS is > qualified. > > > Where specifically did you see the not-on-8.2 information?   >  > I missed it.  I It is in the installation guide.  It states that RDF is not supported on  E V8.2 Alpha or V8.2 I64.  The version I was looking at was V4.3.  The  G release notes of this version say it is the version qualified for V8.2.   
 Mark Berryman    ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 18:22:20 -0500( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com>9 Subject: Re: Best backup software to use with tape robots / Message-ID: <00A47D73.14EB8D28.3@tachysoft.com>   & >Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 11:58:33 -0600, >From: Mark Berryman <mark@theberrymans.com>F >User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7.2)- >            Gecko/20040804 Netscape/7.2 (ax)  >X-Accept-Language: en-us, en  >MIME-Version: 1.0 >X-Newsgroups: comp.os.vms6 >Subject: Best backup software to use with tape robots: >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed  >Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit& >Message-ID: <42f3465a$1@mvb.saic.com>. >X-Trace: 5 Aug 2005 10:58:34 -0800, 10.7.0.61
 >Lines: 12 >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com >X-Gateway-Source-Info: USENET > H >I have just acquired a tape robot to do backups with (an ADIC Faststor H >22) and there seems to be a number of products on the CONDIST meant to I >use such things.  Would anyone be willing to share their opinions as to  H >which software is best for managing backups to a tape robot?  or which F >of the packages on the CONDIST is still being actively supported and  >developed?  > G >Ideally, I'd like a package that supports one host with access to the  G >tape device but allows other hosts to make use of it via the network.  D >ABS and SLS appear to have had this but it isn't supported in V8.2. >   M Unless, you are locked into the condist, the combination of TAPESYS, THRUWAY, I and JB can do this stuff.  While tapesys 6.2 is not yet released, it will O support vms 8.2 on both alpha and itanium.  THRUWAY handles the remote disk and L tape stuff, allowing your tape drive node to access disks on all other nodesL using decnet, tcp, or icc.  JB's remote robot capability allows all nodes toI perform robot operations, even for robots directly connected by scsi to a  single node.  I If you are talking about alpha 8.2, everything is working and the release N should take place in the near future.  The thruway capability (it makes use ofN drivers and kernel mode code) is still in work on itanium.  But tapesys and jb are running on itanium fine.   Wayne O =============================================================================== N Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738   wayne@tachysoft.com; http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html    O =============================================================================== P Jake Blues:"You traded the Caddy for a microphone? ...... Okay, I can buy that."   ------------------------------  $ Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 18:25:04 -0500( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com>9 Subject: Re: Best backup software to use with tape robots / Message-ID: <00A47D73.7684E499.5@tachysoft.com>   . >From: William Webb <william.w.webb@gmail.com> >X-Newsgroups: comp.os.vms: >Subject: Re: Best backup software to use with tape robots8 >Message-ID: <8660a3a105080511511e548918@mail.gmail.com>% >Date: Fri, 5 Aug 2005 14:51:38 -0400 . >Organization: Info-VAX<==>comp.os.vms Gateway$ >X-Gateway-Source-Info: Mailing List
 >Lines: 55 >Content-Disposition: inline, >Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable- >Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1  >MIME-Version: 1.0 >To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com > 8 >On 8/5/05, Mark Berryman <mark@theberrymans.com> wrote:I >> I have just acquired a tape robot to do backups with (an ADIC Faststor I >> 22) and there seems to be a number of products on the CONDIST meant to J >> use such things.  Would anyone be willing to share their opinions as toI >> which software is best for managing backups to a tape robot?  or which G >> of the packages on the CONDIST is still being actively supported and 
 >> developed?  >>=20 H >> Ideally, I'd like a package that supports one host with access to theH >> tape device but allows other hosts to make use of it via the network.F >> ABS and SLS appear to have had this but it isn't supported in V8.2. >>=20  >> Mark Berryman >>=20  >I'm confused. > F >Speaking strictly of ABS through Version 4.1 which is the most recent >with which I've worked: > C >The remote device management capabilities which made client/server E >backups possible in prior versions of ABS were DECnet-only, and were ; >based on technology licensed from Touch Technologies, Inc.  > G >While Touch did make a TCPIP remote device driver, it was not licensed - >for inclusion in the ABS/MDMS product suite.  > M >Page two of the ABS 4.3 SPD  http://h18000.www1.hp.com/info/SP4816/SP4816PF=  >PDF=20  > ? >mentions the Remote Device Facility (RDF) (still appears to be  >DECnet/DECnet-plus only). > G >but it states that ABS is supported on all systems on which OpenVMS is  >qualified.  > ? >Where specifically did you see the not-on-8.2 information? =20  > 
 >I missed it.  > D >You do need to purchase VMS client licenses ($500 a pop last time IG >had to order one, warning! information may be dated.) or else it won't D >do client/server jobs if VMS clients are involved.  Can't speak forA >NT/UX, as I haven't had the, ahem, pleasure of being tasked with  >setting such things up. >     N The THRUWAY remote disk and tape product from software partners will work with either decnet or tcpip.    Wayne O =============================================================================== N Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738   wayne@tachysoft.com; http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html    O =============================================================================== P Jake Blues:"You traded the Caddy for a microphone? ...... Okay, I can buy that."   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 22:14:18 -0700 ( From: Jeff Cameron <roktsci@comcast.net>9 Subject: Re: Best backup software to use with tape robots 0 Message-ID: <BF19953A.11E19%roktsci@comcast.net>  G On 8/5/05 10:58 AM, in article 42f3465a$1@mvb.saic.com, "Mark Berryman"  <mark@theberrymans.com> wrote:  H > I have just acquired a tape robot to do backups with (an ADIC FaststorH > 22) and there seems to be a number of products on the CONDIST meant toI > use such things.  Would anyone be willing to share their opinions as to H > which software is best for managing backups to a tape robot?  or whichF > of the packages on the CONDIST is still being actively supported and > developed? > G > Ideally, I'd like a package that supports one host with access to the G > tape device but allows other hosts to make use of it via the network. E > ABS and SLS appear to have had this but it isn't supported in V8.2.  >  > Mark Berryman    Go to :   1 http://support.mti.com/MTICare/OpenVMS/licreq.htm   ? And request a 60 day Evaluation License for RLM and TapeControl   E Try them out. They come with 60 day telephone support to help you get  started.   Jeff   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 23:28:00 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) ( Subject: Re: C compiler, 7-character CRC2 Message-ID: <4CSIe.9960$jY6.4818@news.cpqcorp.net>  p In article <42f0b4f6$0$16478$91cee783@newsreader02.highway.telekom.at>, "Walter Kuhn" <w.kuhn@ksg.co.at> writes:; :we are using the OpenVMS C-Compiler (V6.2) with the option  :  :/names=shortened  : L :For some automatic code generation (for combining Pascal and Java code) we K :would need the algorithm of the C-Compiler that is used for computing the  5 :7-character CRC ... checksum outside the C compiler?   >   libxml2 has an example of what I think you are doing -- I've?   ported 2.6.20 over a while back, and noticed what I think you :   want to do implemented within the config.vms file there.       http://xmlsoft.org/   @   I would guess that whomever implemented that within config.vms>   simply set up the shortened symbol values based on empirical=   compilation -- you can use the CXXDEMANGLE command and the  #   CC/REPOSITORY support here, too.    =   Based on the HP C++ documentation, there do look to be some >   differences here between OpenVMS Alpha and OpenVMS I64, too.<   For interface details, the C++ manuals point to this site:  0     http://www.codesourcery.com/cxx-abi/abi.html  C   [FWIW, the usual CRC seen on OpenVMS is available via lib$crc(),  ?   and most stuff I'm aware of seems to be using the AUTODIN II  @   CRC -- I do not know what CRC was used by the C team, however.?   (The code I implemented for recent OpenVMS releases generates @   the AUTODIN II, however -- this CRC is common across Ethernet,=   EFI, DECnet and at least a few other spots, and it's buried >   in parts of OpenVMS, too, FWIW.)  I'd *NOT* go after the CRC>   directly, but would use the materials from the documentation   around external symbols.]   B   There's a reference to mangling in the shareable image cookbook:  ?     http://h71000.www7.hp.com/wizard/swdev/ovms-shexe-cook.html   0   specifically to the C++ mangling materials in:  %      SYS$COMMON:[SYSHLP.EXAMPLES.CXX]   =   The SW.CXX examples and friends were omitted from C++ V6.5, >   but versions of around V5.6 and up should have an example.  <   The examples are apparently being reworked -- I don't know<   about the release schedule, if any, however.  (The support=   folks will likely be able to get you an official update on  =   the status and plans, or potentially an early copy of these -   if such is available -- I'd certainly ask.)      --  ;   I'm playing "loose" with the term "mangling" here, as C++ >   has rather more around this than just shortening the symbol.  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 14:36:46 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> < Subject: Re: Data File Search Order in Some VMS Applications, Message-ID: <42F3B1BD.F6B9143C@teksavvy.com>   John wrote: H > If a program in VMS wants to use a data file, there would be a 'searchI > order' that's generally used... but I can't remember the way it worked. " > I *think* it was something like: > @ > if exists SYS$SYSTEM:SYSUAF.DAT         ! The default location# >    sysuaf = SYS$SYSTEM:SYSUAF.DAT  > A > else if exists SYS$DEFAULT:SYSUAF.DAT   ! The current directory $ >    sysuaf = SYS$DEFAULT:SYSUAF.DAT > E > else if exists $trnlnm(SYSUAF)          ! The logical name location  >    sysuaf = $trnlnm(SYSUAF)     ( There is a built-in mechanism for this.   ? There is the file spec,  default file spec, related file spec .    HELP LEX F$PARSE  ( In the above case, I *THINK* it goes as:   filespec = SYSUAF ! default file spec SYS$SYSTEM:.DAT  related file spec: empty   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Aug 2005 11:47:57 -0700 $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>< Subject: Re: Data File Search Order in Some VMS ApplicationsC Message-ID: <1123267677.076054.242020@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>    John wrote:  > 'lo all... > K > I've been away from VMS system management for a while (I last managed VMS D > v5.x systems) now but I'm looking to implement something I vaguely
 > remember...  > H > If a program in VMS wants to use a data file, there would be a 'searchI > order' that's generally used... but I can't remember the way it worked. " > I *think* it was something like: > @ > if exists SYS$SYSTEM:SYSUAF.DAT         ! The default location# >    sysuaf = SYS$SYSTEM:SYSUAF.DAT  > A > else if exists SYS$DEFAULT:SYSUAF.DAT   ! The current directory $ >    sysuaf = SYS$DEFAULT:SYSUAF.DAT > E > else if exists $trnlnm(SYSUAF)          ! The logical name location  >    sysuaf = $trnlnm(SYSUAF)  >  > else" >    flag error: can't find SYSUAF >  > endif  > J > Would someone please point me to the correct sequence of checking and/orJ > the relevant system guide or manual that explains the order.  I rememberF > it somewhere in dealing with SYSUAF, queue manager files, LGICMD and > LOGIN.COM execution, etc > ) > Thanks for any forthcoming suggestions.  >  >  > John    > Search order for SYSUAF.DAT? It depends on a number of things,C including whether it's a lookup for a login or just someone running 
 AUTHORIZE.  D Search order for any file? You ask about a data file then talk about0 SYSUAF.DAT. There are many other data files! ;-)   What are you asking?   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 00:30:37 -0000  From: John <ozman@ozbus.net.au> < Subject: Re: Data File Search Order in Some VMS Applications: Message-ID: <Xns96AA6AF6C5727ozmanozbusnetau@216.168.3.30>   >>A >> If a program in VMS wants to use a data file, there would be a G >> 'search order' that's generally used... but I can't remember the way . >> it worked. I *think* it was something like: >>A >> if exists SYS$SYSTEM:SYSUAF.DAT         ! The default location $ >>    sysuaf = SYS$SYSTEM:SYSUAF.DAT >>B >> else if exists SYS$DEFAULT:SYSUAF.DAT   ! The current directory% >>    sysuaf = SYS$DEFAULT:SYSUAF.DAT  >>F >> else if exists $trnlnm(SYSUAF)          ! The logical name location >>    sysuaf = $trnlnm(SYSUAF) >> >> else # >>    flag error: can't find SYSUAF  >> >> endif >>   [...]    > @ > Search order for SYSUAF.DAT? It depends on a number of things,E > including whether it's a lookup for a login or just someone running  > AUTHORIZE. > F > Search order for any file? You ask about a data file then talk about2 > SYSUAF.DAT. There are many other data files! ;-) >  > What are you asking?  I I can remember reading in the docs somewhere about how a particular file  E is located when a certain application is run (it might have been the  C queue file, JBCSYSQUE.DAT, SYSUAF or RIGHTSLIST) and I'm trying to   remember where I saw it.   It said *something* like:   H '...the default location is checked (SYS$SYSTEM) and if the file is not C found, the logical name ABCDEF is checked and if defined, the file   specified is used.'   F That's not a real quote -- I'm trying assemble the basic idea from my D memory.  It's really something like I described in my original post.  C This is NOT to be confused with the 'search order' when you assign  6 multiple equivalence names to a single logical name.    H I've been through the RMS side of things, where it fills-in the missing G portions of a file specification (that's where things like F$PARSE get  : their operation from) but that's not what I'm looking for.  H All I can remember is reading the big orange or grey doc set and seeing % something mentioned like I described.   C I'm currently ploughing my way through the System Manager's Manual  I (http://www.itec.suny.edu/scsys/vms/ovmsdoc073/v73/6017/6017pro_contents.  html) ...but am having no joy.     John   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 21:06:45 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> < Subject: Re: Data File Search Order in Some VMS Applications, Message-ID: <42F40D21.71A19D7E@teksavvy.com>   John wrote: I > I've been through the RMS side of things, where it fills-in the missing H > portions of a file specification (that's where things like F$PARSE get< > their operation from) but that's not what I'm looking for.   Actually it it.     8 $write sys$output f$parse("SYSUAF","SYS$SYSTEM:.DAT",,,) SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSEXE]SYSUAF.DAT  " $define SYAUAF sys$login:LOGIN.COM8 $write sys$output f$parse("SYSUAF","SYS$SYSTEM:.DAT",,,) USRDIR:[JFMEZEI]LOGIN.COM     H If the logical is defined its value is used to make the full file name.     H The other mechanism (which is used for "SYS$SYSTEM") is that of logicals haveing multiple values.  X DEFINE MYLOG  sys$login:login.com, sys$system:sysuaf.dat, $disk4:[recipes]chocolate.cake  N if you try to access "mylog", the file system fill find the first of the files
 on the list.    I (this is how sys$sysroot is defined to point first to the system specific ? directory root and then the cluster common directory structure)    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 01:17:55 -0000  From: John <ozman@ozbus.net.au> < Subject: Re: Data File Search Order in Some VMS Applications: Message-ID: <Xns96AA72FAC2904ozmanozbusnetau@216.168.3.30>  0 JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote in% news:42F3B1BD.F6B9143C@teksavvy.com:    * > There is a built-in mechanism for this.  > A > There is the file spec,  default file spec, related file spec .  >  > HELP LEX F$PARSE > * > In the above case, I *THINK* it goes as: >  > filespec = SYSUAF # > default file spec SYS$SYSTEM:.DAT  > related file spec: empty  G I've been looking-up a bit on f$parse() and even though my memory tells D me I'm looking for a specific example of locating files, it might beC that I'm remembering a specific example of using f$parse(), I'm not 
 really sure.    ? It's way too long ago since I did my 'Advanced VMS Features and  Techniques' course :p   H Not quite there yet but I'm getting closer to tieing this down.. thanks.     John   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 02:09:38 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com : Subject: Re: Digital logo and other character cell draws..- Message-ID: <87zmrw45nh.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   / William Webb <william.w.webb@gmail.com> writes:   ; > On 8/4/05, Alex van Denzel <vandenzel@hotmail.com> wrote:    >>   >>             /\  >>             \ \ >>            \ \ \  >>           \ \ \ >>         /  \ \  / >>        / /  \/ / /  >>       / / /\  / / /\  >>       \/ / /  \/ / /  >>         / / /\  / / >>          /  \ \  /  >>            \ \ \  >>           \ \ \ >>            \ \  >>             \/  >>     > Hah!  + > Makes me think of the old "See Figure 1."    Naughty, naughty!!     --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 18:00:02 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: EFI is out to lunch0 Message-ID: <00A47D4E.709018DB@SendSpamHere.ORG>   My EFI console is horked.   A I shutdown VMS and returned to the console and the Shell> prompt  @ seemed to be in a loop repeating over and over.  I held down theA CTRL-B and managed to get back to the MP menu.  I powered off the A system and then powered it back on.  As soon as I go the the COn- $ sole the Shell. prompt is looping.    . Anyone ever see this?  What do I do to fix it?     --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 18:11:25 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG  Subject: Re: EFI is out to lunch0 Message-ID: <00A47D50.071C9501@SendSpamHere.ORG>  S In article <00A47D4E.709018DB@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:  >My EFI console is horked. > B >I shutdown VMS and returned to the console and the Shell> prompt A >seemed to be in a loop repeating over and over.  I held down the B >CTRL-B and managed to get back to the MP menu.  I powered off theB >system and then powered it back on.  As soon as I go the the COn-% >sole the Shell. prompt is looping.    > / >Anyone ever see this?  What do I do to fix it?    It's even worse now.      MP MAIN MENU:            CO: Console          VFP: Virtual Front Panel          CM: Command Menu           CL: Console Log          SL: Show Event Logs)         CSP: Connect to Service Processor           SE: Enter OS Session           HE: Main Help Menu            X: Exit Connection   [uninitialized] MP> CO [uninitialized] MP> CO      /         (Use Ctrl-B to return to MP main menu.)       < - - - - - - - - - - Prior Console Output - - - - - - - - - - Shell> Shell> Shell> Shell> Shell> Shell> Shell> Shell>        MP MAIN MENU:            CO: Console          VFP: Virtual Front Panel          CM: Command Menu           CL: Console Log          SL: Show Event Logs)         CSP: Connect to Service Processor           SE: Enter OS Session           HE: Main Help Menu            X: Exit Connection   [uninitialized] MP>   0 And this will repeat over and over if I type CO.  , ...and I can no longer get into the CM menu.    ; If this thing is already toast I'm not going to be pleased. : (It figures this is the kind of birthday present I'd get.) --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 19:57:15 GMT & From: John Reagan <john.reagan@hp.com>  Subject: Re: EFI is out to lunch2 Message-ID: <vwPIe.9944$jV6.4117@news.cpqcorp.net>    VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > My EFI console is horked.  > C > I shutdown VMS and returned to the console and the Shell> prompt  B > seemed to be in a loop repeating over and over.  I held down theC > CTRL-B and managed to get back to the MP menu.  I powered off the C > system and then powered it back on.  As soon as I go the the COn- & > sole the Shell. prompt is looping.   > 0 > Anyone ever see this?  What do I do to fix it? >  >   D How exactly did you power it off?  To be sure, yank the power cord,   count to 10 and plug it back in.   --   John Reagan / HP Pascal/{A|I}MACRO for OpenVMS Project Leader  Hewlett-Packard Company    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 20:31:46 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG  Subject: Re: EFI is out to lunch0 Message-ID: <00A47D63.A28FC6DB@SendSpamHere.ORG>  [ In article <vwPIe.9944$jV6.4117@news.cpqcorp.net>, John Reagan <john.reagan@hp.com> writes: ! >VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:  >> My EFI console is horked. >>  D >> I shutdown VMS and returned to the console and the Shell> prompt C >> seemed to be in a loop repeating over and over.  I held down the D >> CTRL-B and managed to get back to the MP menu.  I powered off theD >> system and then powered it back on.  As soon as I go the the COn-' >> sole the Shell. prompt is looping.    >>  1 >> Anyone ever see this?  What do I do to fix it?  >>   >>   > E >How exactly did you power it off?  To be sure, yank the power cord,  ! >count to 10 and plug it back in.    CM> pc -off -nc   # is how I've been turning it off and    CM> pc -on -nc   is how I've been turning it on.     I I've pulled the plug and I've depressed the little reset switch in on the I rear apron.  I've tried holding the reset button while plugging the beast I back in too -- I've had some electronics such as my Apple Airport Express   which requires that to reset it.    I All I did was shutdown VMS.  Then at the console, I hit a carriage return H to reboot it.  I waited for it to fall into the EFI Boot so I could typeJ Shell> boot -fl 0,1 (I have b, bo, boo, boot aliased to the vms_loader.efiK routine) to drop into SYSBOOT.  It never stops looping at the Shell> prompt H as if somebody was holding down the carriage return key.  I know that isI not the case because I can cold boot the rx2600 and type commands at any  G of the other menus.  It's just this EFI boot that seems to be buggered.      --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 17:02:36 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>   Subject: Re: EFI is out to lunch0 Message-ID: <11f7kpf3c3rk4d5@corp.supernews.com>    VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:] > In article <vwPIe.9944$jV6.4117@news.cpqcorp.net>, John Reagan <john.reagan@hp.com> writes:  > " >>VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: >> >>>My EFI console is horked. >>> D >>>I shutdown VMS and returned to the console and the Shell> prompt C >>>seemed to be in a loop repeating over and over.  I held down the D >>>CTRL-B and managed to get back to the MP menu.  I powered off theD >>>system and then powered it back on.  As soon as I go the the COn-' >>>sole the Shell. prompt is looping.    >>> 1 >>>Anyone ever see this?  What do I do to fix it?  >>>  >>>  >>F >>How exactly did you power it off?  To be sure, yank the power cord, " >>count to 10 and plug it back in. >  >  > CM> pc -off -nc  > % > is how I've been turning it off and  >  > CM> pc -on -nc > ! > is how I've been turning it on.  >  > K > I've pulled the plug and I've depressed the little reset switch in on the K > rear apron.  I've tried holding the reset button while plugging the beast K > back in too -- I've had some electronics such as my Apple Airport Express " > which requires that to reset it. >  > K > All I did was shutdown VMS.  Then at the console, I hit a carriage return J > to reboot it.  I waited for it to fall into the EFI Boot so I could typeL > Shell> boot -fl 0,1 (I have b, bo, boo, boot aliased to the vms_loader.efiM > routine) to drop into SYSBOOT.  It never stops looping at the Shell> prompt J > as if somebody was holding down the carriage return key.  I know that isK > not the case because I can cold boot the rx2600 and type commands at any  I > of the other menus.  It's just this EFI boot that seems to be buggered.  >  >   I I did read some mention that HP was able to build itanic systems cheaper  - than DEC/Compaq/HP could build Alpha systems.   : My Daddy used to tell me, "Son, you get what you pay for!"   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 21:17:44 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG  Subject: Re: EFI is out to lunch0 Message-ID: <00A47D6A.0E658DBF@SendSpamHere.ORG>  Z In article <11f7kpf3c3rk4d5@corp.supernews.com>, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes:J >I did read some mention that HP was able to build itanic systems cheaper . >than DEC/Compaq/HP could build Alpha systems. > ; >My Daddy used to tell me, "Son, you get what you pay for!"     Reliability      /\      /  \	    /    \ 
   /______\ Price  Performance  " I've seen this someplace before...  J At $2K, even if a highly discounted intel developer forum machine, I wouldJ have used the money for a new 20" iMac G5 instead of (what this might turn% out to be) and expensive boat anchor.   J Anyway, I'm still plunking away at trying to get the thing to stop looping	 at Shell>      --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------   Date: 5 Aug 2005 14:54:08 -0700  From: jordan@ccs4vms.com  Subject: Re: EFI is out to lunchC Message-ID: <1123278848.526977.287110@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    Hoff Hoffman wrote: U > In article <00A47D4E.709018DB@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:  > # > ..the Shell. prompt is looping...  > : 1 > :Anyone ever see this?  What do I do to fix it?  > B >   I've not seen this.  My first assumption would be garbage on aA >   console serial line somewhere, the second would be a firmware B >   error (something has destabilized the firmware), and the thirdD >   would be the traditional catch-all check for a hardware problem. > A >   The consoles on I64 can have more than one connection, and it A >   can be a bit surprising when you first see another session on 0 >   another line acquire and access the console. > B >   I'd first run a hard reset on whatever box this is, which doesD >   appear to have been done based on a later posting in the thread.? >   I'd check the other serial lines for problems -- if you are ? >   using serial connection, I'll ssume you're connected to the B >   MP console DB25 connection (H8571-E to get to DECconnect).  IfC >   using the MP NIC to connect, I'd try a hard reset on the server C >   and on the local switch, and -- for testing -- would set all to  >   10 megabits half-duplex. > B >   I'd then look to a firmware load, and to hardware diagnostics. >  >   A couple of questions:' >     Which particular Integrity model? @ >     What is the firmware revision (shown during the power-up)? > P >  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------M >     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq P >  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------G >         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    Hoff, Brian,C      that reminded me of a problem some folks used to see on (some) F Alpha systems when a modem or other responsive device was plugged intoA the serial port.  Apparently the console sent 'something' out the E serial port when certain commands were executed or initialization was B being performed even if the console was set to graphics mode; mostF modems would echo back the OK or Error, then the console would send anG error (or just the prompt again...  I don't know if this was across all D models, or if only certain versions were affected.  I think I saw itD once on a UDB, but I never had a modem hooked up to any other Alpha.  :      Its worth checking those serial ports as Hoff stated.   Rich   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 21:52:06 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)   Subject: Re: EFI is out to lunch2 Message-ID: <acRIe.9956$7L6.4459@news.cpqcorp.net>  S In article <00A47D4E.709018DB@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:   ! ..the Shell. prompt is looping...  : / :Anyone ever see this?  What do I do to fix it?   @   I've not seen this.  My first assumption would be garbage on a?   console serial line somewhere, the second would be a firmware @   error (something has destabilized the firmware), and the thirdB   would be the traditional catch-all check for a hardware problem.  ?   The consoles on I64 can have more than one connection, and it ?   can be a bit surprising when you first see another session on .   another line acquire and access the console.  @   I'd first run a hard reset on whatever box this is, which doesB   appear to have been done based on a later posting in the thread.=   I'd check the other serial lines for problems -- if you are >   using serial connection, I'll assume you're connected to the@   MP console DB25 connection (H8571-E to get to DECconnect).  IfA   using the MP NIC to connect, I'd try a hard reset on the server A   and on the local switch, and -- for testing -- would set all to    10 megabits half-duplex.    @   I'd then look to a firmware load, and to hardware diagnostics.     A couple of questions:&     Which particular Integrity model? >     What is the firmware revision (shown during the power-up)?  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 22:09:26 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG  Subject: Re: EFI is out to lunch0 Message-ID: <00A47D71.475E2746@SendSpamHere.ORG>  X In article <acRIe.9956$7L6.4459@news.cpqcorp.net>, hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) writes:T >In article <00A47D4E.709018DB@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: > # >...the Shell. prompt is looping...  >:0 >:Anyone ever see this?  What do I do to fix it? > A >  I've not seen this.  My first assumption would be garbage on a @ >  console serial line somewhere, the second would be a firmwareA >  error (something has destabilized the firmware), and the third C >  would be the traditional catch-all check for a hardware problem.   C I'm only connected serially to the three-legged DB9/DB25 connector. > The only network is to the gigabit port on the main processor.    @ >  The consoles on I64 can have more than one connection, and it@ >  can be a bit surprising when you first see another session on/ >  another line acquire and access the console.  > A >  I'd first run a hard reset on whatever box this is, which does C >  appear to have been done based on a later posting in the thread. > >  I'd check the other serial lines for problems -- if you are? >  using serial connection, I'll assume you're connected to the A >  MP console DB25 connection (H8571-E to get to DECconnect).  If B >  using the MP NIC to connect, I'd try a hard reset on the serverB >  and on the local switch, and -- for testing -- would set all to >  10 megabits half-duplex.  > A >  I'd then look to a firmware load, and to hardware diagnostics.   B Any hints on reloading this f/w?  It's looking like a last resort.     >  A couple of questions: ' >    Which particular Integrity model?     rx2600.     ? >    What is the firmware revision (shown during the power-up)?   2 I've got to run now to get my son from daycare...   C Check back here later (tomorrow) and I'll have the f/w rev for you.    --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 20:20:29 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>   Subject: Re: EFI is out to lunch, Message-ID: <42F4024D.40CFF38E@teksavvy.com>   re: EFO menu gone nuts.   L Have you tried to remove any battery inside the computer, let the IA64 thingL truly forget everything and then power things back up so that it would start% fresh without any stored parameters ?   / (or is there a EFI command to zap nvram to 0 ?)    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 18:42:18 GMT 1 From: Keith Parris <keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com>  Subject: Re: HP cuts announced1 Message-ID: <eqOIe.9941$bR6.644@news.cpqcorp.net>   ( Alan Greig wrote (quoting The Inquirer):/ > Colorado Springs has until October 31 to live   F As an occupant of said Colorado Springs facility, I can state this is  hogwash.  G It looks like someone took the HP press release which talks about cuts  H in "internal support" functions (HR, Finance, IT) and got that mixed up F with external Customer Support functions, which are not the target of 	 the cuts.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 14:47:12 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>  Subject: Re: HP cuts announced, Message-ID: <42F3B42C.910DA40E@teksavvy.com>   Alan Greig wrote:  > + > http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=25182   $ Actually, the relevant paragraph is: ##J So, morale is back in the dumpster, the grand old days of Carly are comingI back quickly, and the honeymoon looks to be almost over. I was a fool for J thinking  this time would be different, I admit it. I actually believed HPJ when it said the  people that mattered would not be affected, and that theI 'golfing' tier of  management would be shown the door, not the people who  matter. Silly me.  ##    M As I had said, while the initial announcement mentioned reducing redundancies G in administrative stuff, in the end, politics and power plays will have 3 shifted the layoffs to weaker departments instead.    U Just the news of HP killing its support infrastructure will give HP a very bad image.   L Ironic that just as Hurd had fixed the slaes problems with storage which hadJ caused storage to dwindle, he is now killing its support, so storage won't have a chance to recover.   J Note to VMS engineers: when you move to Mumbai, make sure you get powerfulI sump pumps for your basements. When it rains, it really rains. They got 1  metre of RAIN last week.   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 19:42:16 GMT ( From: Alan Greig <greigaln@netscape.net> Subject: Re: HP cuts announced; Message-ID: <siPIe.8232$ia4.5341@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk>    Keith Parris wrote:    > H > As an occupant of said Colorado Springs facility, I can state this is 
 > hogwash. > I > It looks like someone took the HP press release which talks about cuts  J > in "internal support" functions (HR, Finance, IT) and got that mixed up H > with external Customer Support functions, which are not the target of  > the cuts.   I If it's untrue then someone should tell The Inquirer. It doesn't look to  H me as if they took a press release about transferring HR/Finance etc as H they explicitly mention HP-UX and VMS. I hope they've got the wrong end 8 of the stick and not just got the info before employees. --  
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 21:11:10 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: Re: HP cuts announced0 Message-ID: <00A47D69.23DA714F@SendSpamHere.ORG>  f In article <siPIe.8232$ia4.5341@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk>, Alan Greig <greigaln@netscape.net> writes: >  >  >Keith Parris wrote: >  >>  I >> As an occupant of said Colorado Springs facility, I can state this is   >> hogwash.  >>  J >> It looks like someone took the HP press release which talks about cuts K >> in "internal support" functions (HR, Finance, IT) and got that mixed up  I >> with external Customer Support functions, which are not the target of   >> the cuts. > J >If it's untrue then someone should tell The Inquirer. It doesn't look to I >me as if they took a press release about transferring HR/Finance etc as  I >they explicitly mention HP-UX and VMS. I hope they've got the wrong end  9 >of the stick and not just got the info before employees.   J If it's not true, it would appear to be only a matter of time. DNSlink/WISI was taken away and we were sent packing to that hostile interface at itrc J (I loathe not being able to edit with a familiar editor and have to resortJ to what little I can do with the arrows and delete key in a web page text I input window) it would see that the likes of the CSC was in jeopardy.  As J for outsourcing, HP has already outsourced VMS support to a great many of J the people who we know from here.  I see many familiar names from here and Eisner in that itrc forum.    G I'm not fond of the assigned code number to access itrc.  It was easily J misplaced/forgotten and virtually impossible to recover.  Thanks to Keith F Parris at the last bootcamp, I was able to finally get back onto itrc.   --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------   Date: 5 Aug 2005 20:28:31 -0700 ! From: susan_skonetski@hotmail.com @ Subject: HP Pearl - HP Says Over 5,000 Applications on IntegrityB Message-ID: <1123298911.073847.31150@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>   -----Original Message----- From: Skonetski, Susan% Sent: Friday, August 05, 2005 6:23 PM $ To: VMS-SIG@LISTSERV.ENCOMPASSUS.ORG@ Subject: HP Pearl - HP Says Over 5,000 Applications on Integrity Servers - External Use     Dear Distribution lists,  F Depending on when you read this email it's a great way to end or start( the week, not to mention its great news.  C HP BCS has exceed our goal of Applications on VMS and that includes * applications on VMS, please take a look at  2 http://www.itjungle.com/tug/tug080405-story05.html  # Here is just a part of the article.  ...   F To help show the momentum behind Itanium--and to goose it a little--HPB has been keeping track of how quickly application vendors roll outF support for the Integrity boxes. Rich Marcello, the general manager of@ HP's Business Critical Server unit, which controls the IntegrityF platform as well as HP's HP-UX, OpenVMS, and NonStop operating systemsF and the use of Windows and Linux platforms on those boxes, said in hisF blog this week that the application count has risen above 5,000 on theF Integrity machines. HP had set a goal of 4,500 applications by the end of 2005.  > In April 2003, HP said there were over 300 applications on the= Integrity machines and the company had hopes of getting 1,000 A applications on the boxes within the following 6 to 9 months ....   F Warm Regards and as always if you need anything please do not hesitate to ask.    Sue    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Aug 2005 15:21:51 -0500 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) 8 Subject: Re: Intel hammer another nail in Itanium coffin3 Message-ID: <kbrhrJEr15ws@eisner.encompasserve.org>   h In article <gZednaOyo46p5GzfRVn-uA@metrocastcablevision.com>, Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> writes: > K > Unless VMS sales pick up by an order of magnitude or more such that they  J > can support Itanic on their own, its failure to compete elsewhere (such J > as Unix and Windows, where better alternatives *do* exist) will doom it F > to extinction - regardless of whether VMS people find it acceptable.  G    No, it depends on your application.  For number-crunching or running 9    Billy's bloat-ware you do need ever faster processors.   G    My VAX 4000 Model 505 running at a top load of 5% CPU utilization is >    turning enough cycles through the idle loop already.  On anG    application that neither UNIX or Windows can handle with the fastest D    processors now shipping.  Replacing it with an IA64 might save us1    some maintenance bucks, if we were paying any.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 16:47:20 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> 8 Subject: Re: Intel hammer another nail in Itanium coffin0 Message-ID: <11f7jsmo631u7f3@corp.supernews.com>   Bob Koehler wrote:j > In article <gZednaOyo46p5GzfRVn-uA@metrocastcablevision.com>, Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> writes: > K >>Unless VMS sales pick up by an order of magnitude or more such that they  J >>can support Itanic on their own, its failure to compete elsewhere (such J >>as Unix and Windows, where better alternatives *do* exist) will doom it F >>to extinction - regardless of whether VMS people find it acceptable. >  > I >    No, it depends on your application.  For number-crunching or running ; >    Billy's bloat-ware you do need ever faster processors.  > I >    My VAX 4000 Model 505 running at a top load of 5% CPU utilization is @ >    turning enough cycles through the idle loop already.  On anI >    application that neither UNIX or Windows can handle with the fastest F >    processors now shipping.  Replacing it with an IA64 might save us3 >    some maintenance bucks, if we were paying any.  >   F An interesting statement.  Care to share some details of what type of E application runs so much better on VMS?  Specifics on why it runs so   much better on VMS?    --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 16:52:12 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> 8 Subject: Re: Intel hammer another nail in Itanium coffin0 Message-ID: <11f7k62avg3b644@corp.supernews.com>   Dr. Dweeb wrote:7 > "Dave Froble" <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote in message  , > news:11f70ccqdedvp59@corp.supernews.com... >  >>Alan Greig wrote:  >> >>>  >>>Bill Gunshannon wrote:  >>>  >>> , >>>>In article <42F29DC3.6D9D94F8@mist.com>,, >>>>    GreyCloud <cumulus@mist.com> writes: >>>> >>>>@ >>>>>I don't know what would be standing in the way of M$ buying' >>>>>the complete OpenVMS line from HP,  >>>> >>>> >>>>H >>>>How about the idea that they have no interest in it at all as it hasK >>>>much less marketability than their current OS.  The only other possible J >>>>reason for MS buying VMS would be to kill it. But then they would haveE >>>>to see it as offering some kind of competition, which it doesn't.  >>>  >>> M >>>Other than to "sunset" the product the only major company that I think it  G >>>might just make sense for to buy VMS at this point in time would be  M >>>Intel. If Intel bought VMS and announced an X86-64 port and the intention  J >>>to take it back into the mainstream then the cat would really be among I >>>the pigeons. Unlikely but not totally impossible I would have thought  ! >>>given Intel's reliance on VMS.  >>L >>Not sure if I have any valid reason to feel this way, but I just wouldn't J >>trust Intel.  Not sure what part they played in killing Alpha, but they  >>sure had motive. >> >  > H > HP has entrusted Intel its future - at least from a computer producer  > viewpoint.9 > Someone there thinks that Intel is to be trusted - lol.   B I've got to disagree.  Yes, for VMS, and a few other things.  But I generic Unix is ported to x86 (Opteron) rather easily.  For the majority  H of what HP thinks they want to sell, AMD is a valid second (and better) F source.  (Better from a performance perspective.  Intel kickbacks and  discounts are another matter.)  B Not saying there wouldn't be pain and issues, but they could live B without Intel.  Some specific products would get most of the pain.   > Dr. Dweeb  >  > J >>If they had VMS, possibly the largest effort they would make is to find K >>some way to insure that it didn't run on Opteron, if they did port it to  
 >>64 bit x86.  >> >> >>--  6 >>David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04506 >>Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596@ >>DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com >>170 Grimplin Road  >>Vanderbilt, PA  15486  >  >  >      --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 21:26:40 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> 8 Subject: Re: Intel hammer another nail in Itanium coffin( Message-ID: <opsu2jyqb0zgicya@hyrrokkin>  G On Fri, 05 Aug 2005 16:47:20 -0400, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>    wrote:   > Bob Koehler wrote:L >> In article <gZednaOyo46p5GzfRVn-uA@metrocastcablevision.com>, Bill Todd  # >> <billtodd@metrocast.net> writes:  >>I >>> Unless VMS sales pick up by an order of magnitude or more such that   L >>> they can support Itanic on their own, its failure to compete elsewhere  K >>> (such as Unix and Windows, where better alternatives *do* exist) will   F >>> doom it to extinction - regardless of whether VMS people find it   >>> acceptable. F >>      No, it depends on your application.  For number-crunching or  
 >> running< >>    Billy's bloat-ware you do need ever faster processors.K >>     My VAX 4000 Model 505 running at a top load of 5% CPU utilization is A >>    turning enough cycles through the idle loop already.  On an J >>    application that neither UNIX or Windows can handle with the fastestG >>    processors now shipping.  Replacing it with an IA64 might save us 4 >>    some maintenance bucks, if we were paying any. >> > I > An interesting statement.  Care to share some details of what type of   H > application runs so much better on VMS?  Specifics on why it runs so   > much better on VMS?  > " Do note, that he said VAX 4000/505   ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 01:46:58 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> 8 Subject: Re: Intel hammer another nail in Itanium coffin0 Message-ID: <11f8jgr2c1ubedd@corp.supernews.com>   Tom Linden wrote: I > On Fri, 05 Aug 2005 16:47:20 -0400, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>    > wrote: >  >> Bob Koehler wrote:  >>G >>> In article <gZednaOyo46p5GzfRVn-uA@metrocastcablevision.com>, Bill  * >>> Todd  <billtodd@metrocast.net> writes: >>> J >>>> Unless VMS sales pick up by an order of magnitude or more such that  B >>>> they can support Itanic on their own, its failure to compete J >>>> elsewhere  (such as Unix and Windows, where better alternatives *do* D >>>> exist) will  doom it to extinction - regardless of whether VMS   >>>> people find it  acceptable. >>> G >>>      No, it depends on your application.  For number-crunching or    >>> running = >>>    Billy's bloat-ware you do need ever faster processors. L >>>     My VAX 4000 Model 505 running at a top load of 5% CPU utilization isB >>>    turning enough cycles through the idle loop already.  On anK >>>    application that neither UNIX or Windows can handle with the fastest H >>>    processors now shipping.  Replacing it with an IA64 might save us5 >>>    some maintenance bucks, if we were paying any.  >>>  >>J >> An interesting statement.  Care to share some details of what type of  I >> application runs so much better on VMS?  Specifics on why it runs so    >> much better on VMS? >>$ > Do note, that he said VAX 4000/505 >   / I don't recognize that particular model number.   J You'll have to speak slowly and spell out the whole think for dumb old me.   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 17:28:36 -0400 ( From: Rick Nelson <rainbow07@copper.net>1 Subject: Re: M e z e i  newest member of Al Qaeda + Message-ID: <42f3da6b_4@newsfeed.slurp.net>   8 Well, isn't that a healthy thought about the USA and UK.  B I mean the police state model.  It's coming true - if you look at E history - the USA was the victor over NAZI Germany - and the USA has  C finally taken the mask off of its NAZI face.  Look at how abuse is  I generational..  War is evil and the evil of the broken is handed down to  D the victors.  Look at the way the world is now evolving..  The rich I think they can create a slave class by manipulating the bigotries of the  
 very poor.  B It would be very sad to see a plutocrappyisty bloom in 'MERKA~~! +   Turd Flower.   Thanks,    Rick       Nomen Nescio wrote: 2 > JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> trolled: >  >  >>Bob wrote: >>@ >>>Hello all, not living in Canada anymore I forget to check our >>>newsgroups. >>O >>Sorry to hear you have moved to the United Police States of America. Remember M >>to never contradict authorities, especially since under the currnet regime, F >>non citizens are not granted the protection of the USA constitution,O >>especially with regards to due legal process. And don't wear a backpack ever. B >>(oh sorry, that is in the UK where they shoot tourists to kill). >  > ; > I suggest you never try to enter the US or UK . . . . . .  >  > Q > http://groups-beta.google.com/group/can.internet.highspeed/msg/00f228f329364dc5  >  >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 23:37:19 -0500 , From: rk <stellare@nospamplease.comcast.net>1 Subject: Re: M e z e i  newest member of Al Qaeda . Message-ID: <Xns96AA65302FA2rk@216.196.97.136>   Nomen Nescio wrote:   2 > JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> trolled: >  >>Bob wrote: >>> A >>> Hello all, not living in Canada anymore I forget to check our  >>> newsgroups.  >>F >>Sorry to hear you have moved to the United Police States of America.F >>Remember to never contradict authorities, especially since under theH >>currnet regime, non citizens are not granted the protection of the USAG >>constitution, especially with regards to due legal process. And don't E >>wear a backpack ever. (oh sorry, that is in the UK where they shoot  >>tourists to kill).    K I find France's response to current world events interesting.  As recently  " reported in the Telegraph we find:  <    His proposals reflect French determination to act swiftly<    against extremists in defiance of the human rights lobby,<    which is noticeably less vocal in France than in Britain.  :    Imams and their followers who fuel anti-western feeling<    among impressionable young French Muslims will be rounded5    up and returned to their countries of origin, ...    N And the French government is putting houses of worshop under surveillance and L Imams they don't like will be expelled from the country.  But what are they 4 doing to their own citizens?  Back to the Telegraph!  B    Those who have assumed French citizenship will not be protectedA    from deportation. Mr Sarkozy said he will reactivate measures, @    "already available in our penal code but simply not used", to5    strip undesirables of their adopted nationality. "    Interesting.   --   rkG ivy_mike wrote: Similar to one I used to hear, dealing with the origin  I of the Grand Canyon.  The story goes that it came into existence after a  H Jew lost a nickel in the area, on his way west during wagon train days. * jfm replied: LOL ! Hadn't heard that one !   --------------------   For proper context.   $ 12. ivy_mike   Mar 18 2003, 4:18 pm    Newsgroups: rec.travel.air  % From: ivy_m...@my-deja.com (ivy_mike) ! Date: 18 Mar 2003 12:18:24 -0800  " Local: Tues, Mar 18 2003 4:18 pm   Subject: Re: Orange again !   < JF Mezei <jfmezei.spam...@vl.videotron.ca> wrote in message , <news:3E76AD6B.5050C005@vl.videotron.ca>...  > the troll rk wrote:    > > --   > > rk  L > > "Just make sure all crewmembers are jewish. Then you throw a penny into B > > the Soyuz capsule and all 12 will find a way to fit in there" # > > -- JF Mezei, February 8, 2003.    L Similar to one I used to hear, dealing with the origin of the Grand Canyon. E The story goes that it came into existence after a Jew lost a nickel  6 in the area, on his way west during wagon train days.    --   Regards, IM   2 ==================================================   '    13. JF Mezei   Mar 18 2003, 5:03 pm     Newsgroups: rec.travel.air  0 From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spam...@vl.videotron.ca>& Date: Tue, 18 Mar 2003 16:05:48 -0400  Subject: Re: Orange again !    ivy_mike wrote: N > Similar to one I used to hear, dealing with the origin of the Grand Canyon. G > The story goes that it came into existence after a Jew lost a nickel  8 > in the area, on his way west during wagon train days.      LOL ! Hadn't heard that one !       ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 23:37:49 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) 9 Subject: Re: Moving a UAF file from one Alpha to another. 2 Message-ID: <hLSIe.9963$jY6.5515@news.cpqcorp.net>  r In article <1123074170.522103.212460@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "DerekB" <derek.boczenowski@gmail.com> writes:A :I would like to copy a user authorization file from one Alpha to 	 :another.   ?   The following was originally posted in Ask The Wizard (9573), -   in response to a rather similar question...   *     <http://www.hp.com/go/openvms/wizard/>   	--   =   "Which files are required is highly dependant on your goal.   ?   The list of files typically shared within a cluster is listed /   within SYLOGICALS.TEMPLATE on V7.2 and later.   @   The salient concern involves the binary identifier values thatB   are stored on various objects; these binary values must match in2   order to avoid access-related security problems.  "   The OpenVMS FAQ section entitled  ;     Can I copy SYSUAF to another version? To VAX? To Alpha?       will certainly be of interest.  A   Information on merging or splitting a cluster is also available @   here in Ask The Wizard in topics including (60), (203), (767),?   (915), (961), (1201), (1861), (6106), (6735), (6982), (6982), =   and others.  Merging is discussed in (1729), (2590), (3291)    and others."   	--   ?   What many folks miss when copying the files around -- copying ?   the files does work, too -- are the values of the identifiers >   from the previous RIGHTSLIST and associated with the entries>   in SYSUAF, as these binary values can be attached to queues,=   files, global sections or pretty much any security-relevent    object on the system.   =   OpenVMS stores the mapping between the text identifiers and >   the binary identifier values in RIGHTSLIST, and attaches the5   binary identifier values to pretty much everything.   >   If you swap files around -- which works just file -- you may>   have a mess in your security, and within your file or object<   ownership displays, and other such.  Everything works, but<   you may have these odd displays, or you might have objects<   that are allowing or denying access in unexpected ways, or<   spurious audits, etc.  If the new identifiers from the new>   RIGHTSLIST file collide with the old identifiers attached to=   the various objects, well, things can get a little weird...   6   For more, see the FAQ and the other ATW discussions.  :   There are also previous discussions here in comp.os.vms.  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Aug 2005 20:35:44 -0700 ! From: susan_skonetski@hotmail.com # Subject: OpenVMS Pearl from Aug 3rd B Message-ID: <1123299344.702544.40820@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   -----Original Message----- From: Skonetski, Susan( Sent: Wednesday, August 03, 2005 1:18 PM To: Skonetski, Susan) Subject: HP OpenVMS Pearl - Computerworld     \ http://www.computerworld.com/hardwaretopics/hardware/mainframes/story/0,10801,102865,00.html    ? JULY 04, 2005 (COMPUTERWORLD) - Frank da Cruz, an IT manager at F Columbia University, says it's not fashionable to admit to running oldD systems. "People say they have to have the latest version of WindowsF and the latest three-letter acronym or buzzword or their stock will go> down," he says. "But the people in the back office are runningF something that's really battle-proven and tested and secure, like VMS,
 for example." G Da Cruz is the author of an online history of computing. Among the gems @ to be found in it is his "Glossary of Forgotten Terms." Here's a  sampling from the good old days:     batch    core   CRT    drum  
 paper tape  	 plugboard    punched card   relay    remote job entry   TTY D For definitions of those terms and much more information about those- mad mainframes, check out da Cruz's Web site:  www.columbia.edu/acis/history    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Aug 2005 20:27:41 -0700 ! From: susan_skonetski@hotmail.com 0 Subject: OpenVMS Sessions at HP Technology ForumC Message-ID: <1123298861.830646.264850@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>    Dear Folks,   G The following is the list of VMS sessions at the HP Technology Forum in E New Orleans September 12-15.  I may have missed a few but I hope not. 0 To register or for more information please visit! http://www.hptechnologyforum.com/   C If you are attending there are a couple of key sessions that really F should not be missed and obviously the most important one would be theB OpenVMS Strategy and Futures by Ann McQuaid that is session numberF 1217, the VMS Roadmap presentation is officially called (session #1224E HP OpenVMS Technical Update and Roadmaps by Mary Jane Vazquez).  Greg D Jordan is doing a performance session and he always does a great job (session number 1225).E Brad McCusker is doing a talk on SAMBA - 1661 Samba on OpenVMS: Where E Did My Advanced Server Go.  And it goes with out saying that any talk F by an OpenVMS Ambassador or Engineer/Product Manager will be excellent ;')   ? As you can tell from the attached list, there are sessions from G Customers, Partners, Consultants, Training partners (Bruden and Parsec) 3 Engineering, Product Management and even Marketing.   
 Warm Regards,  Sue    Session	Title						Speaker  > 1093  Oracle Rdb Port to HP OpenVMS I64  Norm Lastovica Oracle  D 1100  Introduction to System Dump Analyzer(SDA)by Viewing HP OpenVMS* Process Internals Wayne Sauer PARSEC Group  D 1121  Using Free Tools to Analyze HP OpenVMS Performance Wayne Sauer PARSEC Group  G 1128Using HP OpenVMS Virtualization Technologies to Your Advantage Dave  Holt, HP, OpenVMS Group   D 1134 HP OpenVMS: Moving from HP Alpha to HP Integrity Servers Gaitan D'Antoni, HP, OpenVMS Group   B 1137  HP OpenVMS Security: Deploying and Using It  Leo Demers, HP,
 OpenVMS Group   F 1146 Migrating HP OpenVMS Storage Environments without Interruption or/ Disruption Robert Gezelter, Software Consultant   D 1159  Living with the Past; Ensuring the Future  Robert Rabbin Logic Technology,   3 1162   DCL Programming  David Dachtera, DJE Systems   G 1184 Migrating to a Virtual VAX: An Introduction Stanley Quayle, Quayle  Consulting Inc  F 1185 Managing Multi-user Windows (Citrix) from a System Manager's View& Thomas Wirt, Kittle's Home Furnishings  D 1217 HP OpenVMS Strategy and Futures , Ann McQuaid OpenVMS , General Manager, HP   D 1218 HP Business Critical Servers Strategy: Helping You Plan for the( Future Donald Jenkins VP, BCS Marketing,  D 1224 HP OpenVMS Technical Update and Roadmaps Mary Jane Vazquez, HP,
 OpenVMS Group   B 1225 HP OpenVMS Alpha and HP Integrity Performance Comparison Greg Jordan, HP, OpenVMS Group   G 1237 A Survey of Cluster Technologies Ken Moreau, HP OpenVMS Ambassador   @ 1251 TCP/IP 5.5 Technical Update and Beyond Yanick Pouffary, HP,
 OpenVMS Group   > 1252 Migrating Legacy HP OpenVMS Applications to Java Jennifer McNeill,CipherSoft Inc.   D 1336 HP OpenVMS Distributed Locking Internals and Performance, Bruce Ellis, BRUDEN Corporation   C 1411 Unified Extended Firmware Interface and Multi-operating System  Support , Dong Wei, HP  B 1422 Simple Tricks to Manage HP OpenVMS Bruce Claremont, Migration Specialties International, Inc  D 1424 Using HP OpenVMS to Comply with Sarbanes-Oxley Bruce Claremont,( Migration Specialties International, Inc  7 1457 Ugly Duckling or Racing Pigeon? John Apps, HP, BCS   ? 1502 HP OpenVMS System Administration for Non-HP OpenVMS System < Administrators  Stephen De Dalto, Digitask Consultants, Inc.  F 1525Using HP OpenVMS for an Adaptive Enterprise Today Keith Parris, HP/ OpenVMS Ambassador, Dave Holt HP, OpenVMS Group   @ 1530 Long-distance HP OpenVMS Clusters Keith Parris, HP, OpenVMS
 Ambassador  E 1532 HP Integrity EFI and MP/iLO Multi-operating System Deployment Al ! Lanseigne HP, Robert Alexander HP   C 1546 HP OpenVMS Volume Shadowing in Action Keith Parris, HP OpenVMS 
 Ambassador  A 1596 Host-based Volume Shadowing: Steady State and Error Recovery - Algorithms Wes Roberts, HP OpenVMS Ambassador   E 1661 Samba on OpenVMS: Where Did My Advanced Server Go? Brad McCusker  HP, BCS   @ 1781 Finding and Resolving HP OpenVMS Performance Problems Barry Kierstein HP, OpenVMS Group   D 1783 HP OpenVMS Storage/Storage Area Network (SAN): Technical UpdateE and Things You Need to Know about Setting Up and Managing SANs for HP A OpenVMS Andy Schneider HP, OpenVMS Group, Wes Roberts HP, OpenVMS 
 Ambassador  @ 1798 Get the Most from Your HP OpenVMS System: Tuning HP OpenVMS& Working Sets Wayne Sauer  PARSEC Group  C 1818 HP OpenVMS Enterprise Backup Solutions Spencer Duchene hp Data @ Protector, Andy Schneider HPOpenVMS Group, Bengt Mossberg I-S-E,9 Michael Grinnell, HP, Phil Jamieson Software Partners Inc    ------------------------------  # Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 02:20:57 GMT " From: Randy Yates <yates@ieee.org># Subject: Re: OT: Re: LaTeX ---> PDF # Message-ID: <mznviz5n.fsf@ieee.org>   = koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:   M > In article <k6j7k88o.fsf_-_@ieee.org>, Randy Yates <yates@ieee.org> writes:  >>    >> VMS - what a great OS it was! >  >    What a great OS it _IS_.   B Thank you all for the corrections and updates. I had no idea thereD was an "openVMS" and associated support. I may actually take you up  on getting a version running.  --  8 %  Randy Yates                  % "And all that I can do5 %% Fuquay-Varina, NC            %  is say I'm sorry,  = %%% 919-577-9882                %  that's the way it goes..." P %%%% <yates@ieee.org>           % Getting To The Point', *Balance of Power*, ELO" http://home.earthlink.net/~yatescr   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 11:22:59 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> / Subject: PL/I for OpenVM HTML Documentation kit ( Message-ID: <opsu1r0lg8zgicya@hyrrokkin>  H In response to demand we are pleased to offer all the PL/I documentationJ in HTML as a single kit for FREE download.  This will allow you to installI the HTML docs locally for faster access for your users. The kit is in the F form of a  saveset and when you run backup  it will create a directory [.HTML] @ once installed to access the documentation point your browser to7 [.html]docs.html  All HREFs are relative to this point.   K To access the documentation point your browser to  ftp://ftp.kednos.com/pub K and download PLI_HTML_DOCS.BCK  or the zipped version PLI_HTML_DOCS_BCK.ZIP 9 or simply fetch with anonymous ftp from the command line.   H Transferring the documentation to a Unix or Windows system is left as an excercise to the reader.   Tom    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 18:23:31 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com ) Subject: Re: Rdb 72 FT2 for Alpha and I64 - Message-ID: <874qa465ss.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   7 rdeininger@mindspringdot.com (Robert Deininger) writes:   D > Nobody particularly likes it.  The "idiot" (your term) who came upB > with it doesn't like it either.  All the reasonable names run upF > against Intel trademark problems, and getting permission to use themA > would have required some poor soul to spend months dealing with F > lawyers in at least two big, dumb corporations, with no guarantee ofF > success.  Meanwhile V8.2 would have been held up waiting for a name.  E So hp, half OWNER of right to the itanic have to go on bended knee to I untel for the `rights' to use the name of their own stuff. There seems to E be more idiocy in there than can be grasped by mere mortals. I wonder C what chance mere customers will have in this sort of pissing fight.   E > But this was more information you did not possess, so naturally you : > just assume other folks are idiots and should be knifed.   > Go knife yourself.  6 With the one in your back? or should we bring our own.  @ IMO, the name is just plain pathetic, and has NO redeaming merit at all.    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Aug 2005 14:06:13 -0700 # From: "WhoDat?" <whohe@whoever.com> ) Subject: Re: Rdb 72 FT2 for Alpha and I64 C Message-ID: <1123275973.750833.285520@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>    Dr. Dweeb wrote:C > "Norman Lastovica" <norman.lastovica@oracle.com> wrote in message & > news:42F0EFBF.FFBD8B0B@oracle.com...J > >         Oracle is pleased to announce the availability of Field Test 2J > >    for it's continuing Rdb 7.2 Beta Program.  The field test of OracleI > >    Rdb 7.2 is available to run on OpenVMS Industry Standard 64 for HP F > >    Integrity Servers and for OpenVMS for AlphaServer systems.  The <snip>E > I really wish that OracleRdb would stop mouthing the HP mantra that L > Integrity 64 systems are "Industry Standard".  I do not observe widespreadL > acceptance of this particular hardware architecture sufficient to merit t= he > moniker "Industry Standard". >   # Found this "white paper" from 2002.   A  < http://h71028.www7.hp.com/ERC/downloads/Server_Landscape.pdf >   or to read it in HTML:   < http://tinyurl.com/dwfca >   * (Sorry, copy & paste doesn't format well.)   ## Insight  64+ *Industry-standard 64-Bit Microprocessors * !     *Will Permanently Alter the * !      *High End Systems Landscape*  Nathan Brookwood Principal Analyst  (Nathan@Insight64.com) September 2002 ## .=2E. 6 (Haven't read the entire article because I went into a: thought loop when I got to the following and had to reboot
 my brain:)   ##5 *Proprietary processors* are sold only in conjunction 4 with complete computer systems, and are not marketed3 as processors per se. Proprietary processors rarely 3 appear on the merchant semiconductor market. Buyers 7 normally associate proprietary processors with a single 6 system supplier (e.g., SPARC with Sun, POWER with IBM,1 PA-RISC with HP), although other system suppliers 6 occasionally offer use these processors in their lines8 e=2Eg., Fujitsu with SPARC, Bull with POWER and NEC with	 PA-RISC).   7 *Industry-standard processors* are sold on the merchant 8 semiconductor market to original equipment manufacturers: (OEMs) that incorporate these processors into systems sold7 to end users. Suppliers of industry-standard processors 8 sometimes package their wares with other system building3 blocks (typically boards and chasses), and sell the > resulting assemblies to OEM customers. Insight 64's definition; of "industry-standard processor"=9D relies on the processor 9 supplier's position in the system component supply chain, 8 rather than on the installed base or annual sales of the$ processor or processor architecture.; Prominent general purpose industry-standard microprocessors : include Intel's Pentium, Celeron, Xeon, and Itanium lines,: the IBM/Motorola PowerPC, the AMD Athlon and Duron series,! and the planned AMD Opteron line.  ##  * (assume (R) or TM in all the right places)  = So, by this person's definition, Itanium is I.S., but a quick ; Google shows that most other sources believe I.S. means X86 = compatable. I wonder how much HP paid for this "white paper"?    **********************   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 16:56:04 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> ) Subject: Re: Rdb 72 FT2 for Alpha and I64 0 Message-ID: <11f7kd5fhuaqi35@corp.supernews.com>   prep@prep.synonet.com wrote:9 > rdeininger@mindspringdot.com (Robert Deininger) writes:  >  > D >>Nobody particularly likes it.  The "idiot" (your term) who came upB >>with it doesn't like it either.  All the reasonable names run upF >>against Intel trademark problems, and getting permission to use themA >>would have required some poor soul to spend months dealing with F >>lawyers in at least two big, dumb corporations, with no guarantee ofF >>success.  Meanwhile V8.2 would have been held up waiting for a name. >  > G > So hp, half OWNER of right to the itanic have to go on bended knee to K > untel for the `rights' to use the name of their own stuff. There seems to G > be more idiocy in there than can be grasped by mere mortals. I wonder E > what chance mere customers will have in this sort of pissing fight.  >  > E >>But this was more information you did not possess, so naturally you : >>just assume other folks are idiots and should be knifed. >  >  >>Go knife yourself. >  > 8 > With the one in your back? or should we bring our own. > B > IMO, the name is just plain pathetic, and has NO redeaming merit	 > at all.  >   F I'm thinking this entire perspective is upside-down.  Intel should be E pleased if a software product is ported to one of it's products, and  F include a reference to the Intel product in the name of the software. @ One might think that they might normally pay for this to happen.  I With that in mind, I don't buy the argument that some Intel product name  . couldn't be used to describe "VMS for itanic".   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 21:08:19 GMT ( From: Alan Greig <greigaln@netscape.net>) Subject: Re: Rdb 72 FT2 for Alpha and I64 ; Message-ID: <7zQIe.8347$ia4.3688@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk>    Dave Froble wrote:    H > I'm thinking this entire perspective is upside-down.  Intel should be G > pleased if a software product is ported to one of it's products, and  H > include a reference to the Intel product in the name of the software. B > One might think that they might normally pay for this to happen.  ; There is something a bit strange at the Intel web site. At  : http://www.intel.com/products/processor/itanium2/index.htmI it used to mention VMS even when it was listed as "planned". Now it says:   
 "Features:  	  Based on EPIC architecture? Enhanced Machine Check Architecture (MCA) with Extensive Error   Correcting Code (ECC) > Operating System Support HP-UX*, Linux*, Windows Server* 2003"  G Where's VMS gone? You can still find it in the PDFs but its not on the  7 main page. Probably just not important enough for them.     K > With that in mind, I don't buy the argument that some Intel product name  0 > couldn't be used to describe "VMS for itanic". >    --  
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 20:37:11 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> ) Subject: Re: Rdb 72 FT2 for Alpha and I64 0 Message-ID: <11f81bldi75rc4e@corp.supernews.com>   Alan Greig wrote:  >  >  > Dave Froble wrote: >  > I >> I'm thinking this entire perspective is upside-down.  Intel should be  H >> pleased if a software product is ported to one of it's products, and I >> include a reference to the Intel product in the name of the software.  C >> One might think that they might normally pay for this to happen.  >  > = > There is something a bit strange at the Intel web site. At  < > http://www.intel.com/products/processor/itanium2/index.htmK > it used to mention VMS even when it was listed as "planned". Now it says:  >  > "Features:       > Based on EPIC architectureA > Enhanced Machine Check Architecture (MCA) with Extensive Error   > Correcting Code (ECC) @ > Operating System Support HP-UX*, Linux*, Windows Server* 2003" > I > Where's VMS gone? You can still find it in the PDFs but its not on the  9 > main page. Probably just not important enough for them.   I VMS no longer runs on a RISC processor, the last remaining target of the  7 itanic.  The knife in question resides in Alpha's back.   G >> With that in mind, I don't buy the argument that some Intel product  6 >> name couldn't be used to describe "VMS for itanic". >> >      --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  * Date: Sat, 6 Aug 2005 03:27:48 +0000 (UTC)P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)0 Subject: strange terminal-characteristic problem$ Message-ID: <dd1ank$f8l$2@online.de>  @ I have a node in my cluster where I can't properly edit from theG console.  I see "line noise" with EDT (and with TPU), bogus blank lines F etc.  If I connect to the same node with LAT or TELNET from a console E login, then all is OK.  Other console terminals on other nodes don't   have this problem.  , All of my consoles are real VT320 terminals.  C The output of SHOW TERMINAL is the same from all console terminals.   ) The terminal setup screens are identical.   ) I SWAPPED THE TERMINALS: problem remains.   F I REPLACED BOTH NODES WITH PHYSICALLY SIMILAR MACHINES.  Same problem.  G The "funny" node is a VAXstation (was 60, now is 90A).  The other nodes < in the cluster are a VAX (was 100A, now 105A) and an ALPHA. H Interestingly, I have a standalone node which is also a VAXstation (60) ! and it exhibits the same problem.   A What in the world could cause funny console behaviour only for a   particular range of hardware?   I All of the console cables are similar (DEC 423 (a.k.a. MMJ), "data leads  + only") and of similar length (1--2 meters).    ------------------------------  % Date: Sat, 06 Aug 2005 01:28:13 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 4 Subject: Re: strange terminal-characteristic problem, Message-ID: <42F44A57.97E28951@teksavvy.com>  / Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: B > I have a node in my cluster where I can't properly edit from theI > console.  I see "line noise" with EDT (and with TPU), bogus blank lines G > etc.  If I connect to the same node with LAT or TELNET from a console F > login, then all is OK.  Other console terminals on other nodes don't > have this problem.    H Does the target now have a SET TERM/INQUIRE during the login sequence  ?  N Make sure that both the originating and destination node have similar terminalD characteristics in terms of SET TERM/EIGHTBIT or SET TERM/NOEIGHTBIT   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Aug 2005 20:34:43 -0700 ! From: susan_skonetski@hotmail.com   Subject: Updated VMS InformationC Message-ID: <1123299283.870916.231120@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   & Sent to email distribution on Aug 3rd.   Dear Distribution lists,  C Enclosed please find the most recent updated VMS information.  Also D attached to this is a PDF of the MAY 2005 Information age article on the Rumors of the Death of VMS.   
 Warm Regards,  Sue    1. Notes from Sue B 2. **** Time Sensitive first Encompass Local User Group meeting inB Denver ********************* 3. In The Press 4. Partners 5. Jobs -G Please note that I have nothing to do with recruiting, I just care that < my friends have jobs, and customers have the folks they need     1. Notes from Sue   A If you would like to do an article for the next technical journal " please submit article abstract at:F "http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/journal/cfp.html" to date in 05 the0 technical journal has received over 27,300 viewsF "http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/journal/index.html".  Articles willE be due in November, you will receive a template this month (.doc)with  an acceptance note.   C Folks, are you part of the IRTC (sort of like a notes file)more and ; more folks are starting to join in, here is the overall url H "http://forums1.itrc.hp.com/service/forums/home.do?admit=-682735245+1123B 033791272+28353475" where you can register and OpenVMS has its own link. 6 Its not perfect but nothing is and you can post files.  G Ok, this is not VMS related but one of the engineers told me about this  and its funny Geeksta Rap 8 "http://www.wired.com/news/culture/0,1284,67970,00.html"  G We have extended the OpenVMS Hobbyist contest until August 5th, because A Island Computers has donated a DS10L to the winner we wanted more 9 people to have the opportunity to enter.  www.openvms.org   E There will be certification testing at the HP Technology Forum in New = Orleans, as an update from Doug Dickerson (of Boot Camp fame)   G "Looking to add another credential to your certification portfolio? How G about fulfilling requirements for a CCR? Your HP Certified Professional C Program has an exclusive deal for you! For the first time ever, the F Program Office is offering unlimited free certification testing duringG the conference for all HP Certified Professionals. You can take as many D high stakes exams as you want during the week at no charge to you inG our onsite Prometric Testing Center. (This offer is limited only by the D number of total tests given all week, and no one person can take the@ same exam more than twice. Free testing is only for HP Certified Professionals.)   E The planned hours of operation of the Prometric Testing Center are as  follows:  7 Monday - 9:00AM-6:00PM with last test started at 5:00PM D Tuesday - 8:00AM-6:00PM with last test started at 5:00PM Wednesday -G 8:00AM-8:00PM with last test started at 7:00PM Thursday - 8:00AM-5:00PM   with last test started at 4:00PM  E You'll be able to schedule your testing session with Prometric before @ the conference begins. Watch this site for more details to come.  Y "http://www.hp.com/certification/americas/hp_technology_forum/certification_testing.html"   G _______________________________________________________________________   B 2. **** Time Sensitive first Encompass Local User Group meeting in Denver ********************* --- # (Info courtesy of OpenVMS Planet at : http://www.openvmsplanet.org/community/viewtopic.php?t=13)  C The Rocky Mountain Local Users Group is having its first meeting on E August 10, 2005 at PARSEC Group in downtown Denver. Refreshments will D be served at 6:30 p.m. and the meeting will start at 7:00 p.m.  ComeB and get acquainted, share your ideas, and hear a presentation from; Computer Associates on managing OpenVMS in a multi-platform  environment.   When:  August 10, 2005 at 6:30 p.m.   Where: PARSEC Group 999 18th Street 
 Suite 3230 Denver, CO  80202 F ______________________________________________________________________ 3. In The Press   H "http://informationweek.com/story/showArticle.jhtml?articleID=166401565"8 - Great quote from a friend in HP Storage - Chet Jacobs.G _______________________________________________________________________    4. Partners   ? Acucorp and HP relationship  http://www.acucorp.com/markets/hp/    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Aug 2005 20:29:47 -0700 ! From: susan_skonetski@hotmail.com 5 Subject: VMS Technical Journal Call for Participation C Message-ID: <1123298987.507979.133590@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>    Dear Folks,   E If you would like to submit an article for the next OpenVMS Technical > Journal please submit your abstract on the following web page.  2 http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/journal/cfp.html  = Thank you as always for your help, support and participation.   - Abstracts will be accepted until August 20th.   F Articles will be due November 15 for publication in January.  A memberF of the OpenVMS doc team will be reviewing your article and contact you for MAJOR issues.   E We have had nearly 30,000 views already this year of the VTJ which is D excellent.  Also if you have not already done so please feel free to; rate the articles or send a comment, we love your feedback. 6 "http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/journal/index.html"  
 Warm Regards,   / Sue Skonetski, on behalf of the entire VTJ team  Editor   ------------------------------   Date: 5 Aug 2005 15:12:17 -0500 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) ; Subject: Re: Where is Macro 32 in OpenVMS 7.3 Distribution? 3 Message-ID: <7DZYa+1oI+4W@eisner.encompasserve.org>   e In article <96A58C76Dwspenceraporg@216.168.3.30>, wspencer@ap.dontspamme.org (Warren Spencer) writes:  > Folks, > K > Thanks to those who helped me find the Macro-64 install kit (on freeware  K > disk v4).  But now I find I also need Macro-32, and can't find it on the  M > freeware disks.  Could someone please point me to it?  We're running 7.3-2   > on an Alpha.  C    Unless you worked hard, it was installed with VMS.  Just use it.    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Aug 2005 11:58:30 -0700 $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>= Subject: Why is disk I/O operation rate .GT. direct I/O rate? C Message-ID: <1123268310.575806.162030@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>    Hello COV readers,  G Is this a bug? Are some I/O operations to disk not direct I/O's? If so, . how does that work? Is it something else? TIA.  3                             VAX/VMS Monitor Utility 2                              I/O SYSTEM STATISTICSG                                  on node XXXXX        From:  4-AUG-2005  12:00:01G                                     SUMMARY           To:    4-AUG-2005  22:00:10  @                                        CUR        AVE        MIN MAX   @     Direct I/O Rate                   1.61       3.62       0.68 32.00 @     Buffered I/O Rate                 4.48       9.57       2.54 132.00 [...] 3                             VAX/VMS Monitor Utility 1                               DISK I/O STATISTICS G                                  on node XXXXX        From:  4-AUG-2005  12:00:01G                                     SUMMARY           To:    4-AUG-2005  22:00:10  D I/O Operation Rate                         CUR        AVE        MIN     MAX   D XXXXX$DKA100:         OPENVMS061          3.03       4.55       0.89   37.43 D XXXXX$DKA200:         DATA1               0.00       0.08       0.00   20.19    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 14:20:30 -0500 + From: brandon@dalsemi.com (BRANDON, JOHN M) " Subject: www.weatherduck.com DOWN?1 Message-ID: <05080514203095@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>   : I can not get to www.weatherduck.us - I assume it is down.  ) Does anyone have a phone number for them?    TIA        John "REBOOT" Brandon  VMS Systems Administrator * firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 05 Aug 2005 15:09:37 -0500  From: Jim <none@example.com>& Subject: Re: www.weatherduck.com DOWN?0 Message-ID: <_aadnQ9KMoccWm7fRVn-rQ@comcast.com>  X brandon@dalsemi.com (BRANDON, JOHN M) wrote in news:05080514203095@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com:  < > I can not get to www.weatherduck.us - I assume it is down.  / Their "contact" page is in the Google archives:   o http://64.233.161.104/search?q=cache:zihgZr6w5IoJ:www.weatherduck.us/contacts.htm+site:www.weatherduck.us&hl=en    http://tinyurl.com/9myms   It includes   7   Telephone (262) 662-4029 or (800) 854-0180 in the USA    Fax (262) 662-1098   Jim    ------------------------------   Date: 5 Aug 2005 14:38:50 -0700 ; From: "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> & Subject: Re: www.weatherduck.com DOWN?B Message-ID: <1123277930.410577.13110@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   BRANDON, JOHN M wrote:< > I can not get to www.weatherduck.us - I assume it is down. > + > Does anyone have a phone number for them?  >  > TIA  >  >  >  > John "REBOOT" Brandon  > VMS Systems Administrator , > firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com  < It's working right now for me.  5:39PM EDT Cincinnati, Ohio.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2005.435 ************************                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                