1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 15 Dec 2005	Volume 2005 : Issue 697       Contents:/ Re: Clustering: switches reliability/redundancy / Re: Clustering: switches reliability/redundancy / RE: Clustering: switches reliability/redundancy / Re: Clustering: switches reliability/redundancy  Database access from COBOL# Re: DECnet IV over Multinet Circuit  DESTA Memory hog DESTA Memory hog3 HP announces new Integrity Blade Servers - OpenVMS? 7 Re: HP announces new Integrity Blade Servers - OpenVMS? 7 Re: HP announces new Integrity Blade Servers - OpenVMS? + Re: Location of initial page and swap files " Re: M e z e i kooks out again..... monitoring VMS log files Re: monitoring VMS log files6 Re: Resale value of ES40 and lots of other VMS systems& Staggered Hobbyist licence renewalls ?* Re: Staggered Hobbyist licence renewalls ?* Re: Staggered Hobbyist licence renewalls ? Re: Storageworks shelves Re: Storageworks shelves  Re: UK VMS HP contract customers  Re: UK VMS HP contract customers  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------    Date: 15 Dec 2005 11:52:16 +01006 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)8 Subject: Re: Clustering: switches reliability/redundancy, Message-ID: <43a158f0$1@news.langstoeger.at>  \ In article <43A083F9.FD2F8780@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:: >Are hubs considered more "fault tolerant" than switches ?  L Depends on what you see as a hub. We as DEC customers see hubs as backplanesJ where repeater, bridge, switch, router, decserver modules are inserted ;-)   --   Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialist  E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 12:18:01 +0000 ! From: Baldrick <none@[127.0.0.1]> 8 Subject: Re: Clustering: switches reliability/redundancy' Message-ID: <dnrmtl$ph3$1@lore.csc.com>    JF Mezei wrote:    ... G > Are there considerations if a cluster nodes are all connected via the C > same switch/hub ? It the later fails, the whole cluster hangs and  > becomes inaccessible.   D Anything that is powered and losing its power could cut the cluster G connection is a point of failure to be avoided. It's all well and good  + making VLANS but they are the weakest link.   I Use multiple network cards and a direct, RX/TX swapped cable between the  E systems, and the cluster will stay up regardless of what the network  G nazi's get up to, Sure they'll complain because if its a network cable  E it has go be in their domain of interest, so they'll argue the point  A right up until, and beyond some failure or misconfigure of their  6 equipment, so it takes a brave person to take them on.  F I'm always in favour of removing as many dependencies as you can from G the cluster, direct system to system interconnects simplify everything.   H Kerry's right to point out that VMS has "taken steps" to provide higher G availability techniques but avoiding having to use them is even better  C so it's a good observation. Avoiding single points of failure is a  2 better, but not in my opinion perfect, compromise.  H In my (to be rescheduled) UK User Group "Making and Breaking" clusters, 5 I demonstrate the pros and cons of multiple switches.    --  E Regards, Nic Clews a.k.a. Mr. Car Park Charges, CSC Computer Sciences  nclews at csc dot com    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 10:29:43 -0500 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> 8 Subject: RE: Clustering: switches reliability/redundancyR Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB773631@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message------ > From: Baldrick [mailto:none@[127.0.0.1]]=20 ! > Sent: December 15, 2005 7:18 AM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com : > Subject: Re: Clustering: switches reliability/redundancy >=20 > JF Mezei wrote:  >=20 > ... : > > Are there considerations if a cluster nodes are all=20 > connected via the E > > same switch/hub ? It the later fails, the whole cluster hangs and  > > becomes inaccessible.=20 >=20H > Anything that is powered and losing its power could cut the cluster=20B > connection is a point of failure to be avoided. It's all well=20
 > and good=20 - > making VLANS but they are the weakest link.  >=20A > Use multiple network cards and a direct, RX/TX swapped cable=20  > between the=20I > systems, and the cluster will stay up regardless of what the network=20 = > nazi's get up to, Sure they'll complain because if its a=20  > network cable=20I > it has go be in their domain of interest, so they'll argue the point=20 E > right up until, and beyond some failure or misconfigure of their=20 8 > equipment, so it takes a brave person to take them on. >=20J > I'm always in favour of removing as many dependencies as you can from=20@ > the cluster, direct system to system interconnects simplify=20
 > everything.  >=20= > Kerry's right to point out that VMS has "taken steps" to=20  > provide higher=20 ? > availability techniques but avoiding having to use them is=20  > even better=20G > so it's a good observation. Avoiding single points of failure is a=20 4 > better, but not in my opinion perfect, compromise. >=20B > In my (to be rescheduled) UK User Group "Making and Breaking"=20 > clusters,=207 > I demonstrate the pros and cons of multiple switches.  >=20 > --=20 G > Regards, Nic Clews a.k.a. Mr. Car Park Charges, CSC Computer Sciences  > nclews at csc dot com  >=20   Nic ..  D Direct connect works ok with 2 systems, but then it gets complicatedF when you start adding systems from there i.e. need direct connect fromD each system directly to each other system.. Need to schedule systemsC down to add dedictaed nic's etc. Also, if the cable did get cut (or C pulled out), then do you put 2 cables in each system to every other  system?   ) Complications start rising exponentially.   D You are right though that if there will ever only be 2 systems, thenC direct connect (with 2 physical connections between each system) is , certainly a good way of linking the systems.   :-)   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------   Date: 15 Dec 2005 15:41:04 GMT1 From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) 8 Subject: Re: Clustering: switches reliability/redundancy, Message-ID: <40dh4gF19v5vrU1@individual.net>  R In article <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB773631@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>,* 	"Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> writes: > F > Direct connect works ok with 2 systems, but then it gets complicatedH > when you start adding systems from there i.e. need direct connect fromF > each system directly to each other system.. Need to schedule systemsE > down to add dedictaed nic's etc. Also, if the cable did get cut (or E > pulled out), then do you put 2 cables in each system to every other 	 > system?  > + > Complications start rising exponentially.  > F > You are right though that if there will ever only be 2 systems, thenE > direct connect (with 2 physical connections between each system) is . > certainly a good way of linking the systems. >   F As long as you remember not to run the two cables the same way so that) something that cuts #1 also cuts #2.  :-)    bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------   Date: 15 Dec 2005 15:52:28 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)# Subject: Database access from COBOL , Message-ID: <40dhpsF19v5vrU2@individual.net>  D Well, it looks like this semester of student VAX use went well.  NowF it is time to start building on this.  The students who just did data-F structures will be moving on to their first database course.  The lastG thing they did with COBOL on the VAX was ISAM.  Looks like a good lead- E up to see why databases are the next step.  So,  can someone point me F at some simple examples of database access from COBOL on VMS?  And letF me know which manual I shuold expect to find more detailed informationG about it?  (It would be nice if I had the time to pl,ay with it myself, H but I don't and I hate re-inventing the wheel anyway.)  Who knows, maybeF we are headed towards a VMS Renaisance in Education!!  Maybe if we getC through this next semester with the students working on VMS again I E can convince the professor involved to consider a paper for the Small = Colleges Conference about using VMS to handle these concepts.    bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 11:14:38 -0700 + From: Mark Berryman <mark@theberrymans.com> , Subject: Re: DECnet IV over Multinet Circuit% Message-ID: <43a1420f$1@mvb.saic.com>    Dave Froble wrote: > Bill Gunshannon wrote: >  >>K >> Our networking people installed a (industry standard) firewall here some I >> time ago that has turned TCPIP in to a stateful protocol.  That is, it K >> actually tracks sessions running through it and if a session is inactive H >> for a (operator defined) period of time it stops passing data for it 	 >> should K >> it become active again.  A real braindead idea, but I don;t have control L >> over it and it has forced me to institute keep-alives on all our remotelyI >> accessable servers even knowing and agreeing with Karn and Jacobsen on H >> "Keep-alives, a bad idea".  (We won't even go into the fact that thisE >> results in exactly the supposed network problem they claim it was   >> intended  >> to prevent!!) >  > B > While the general concept of anything's possible, many times we I > determine that some things just aren't to be tolerated.  Up until this  I > point in time, I could not come up with an ethical and good reason for  L > slavery.  I have now realized that there can be valid reasons for slavery. > A > Anyone described as a 'network person' should be a slave.  The  G > alternative is the chaos we now see where the inmates run the asylum.   D You are confusing network people with firewall people.  The two are I rarely the same and, in my experience at least, more problems are caused  D by those charged with "network security" than by those charged with ) "network implementation and maintenance".   
 Mark Berryman    ------------------------------    Date: 15 Dec 2005 07:01:22 -0800 From: comp.os.vms@hotmail.com  Subject: DESTA Memory hog C Message-ID: <1134655433.046524.155060@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    >From a DS25 4GB machine.   % $ pipe show sys |sear sys$input desta F 0000045D DESTA Director  HIB      6  1729374   0 00:11:02.78    189857 34869 M    This seems a tad excessive.   	 Dr. Dweeb    ------------------------------    Date: 15 Dec 2005 07:02:29 -0800 From: comp.os.vms@hotmail.com  Subject: DESTA Memory hog C Message-ID: <1134655316.309623.163070@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    >From a DS25 4GB machine.   % $ pipe show sys |sear sys$input desta F 0000045D DESTA Director  HIB      6  1729374   0 00:11:02.78    189857 34869 M    This seems a tad excessive.   	 Dr. Dweeb    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 08:23:43 -0800 ( From: Jeff Cameron <roktsci@comcast.net>< Subject: HP announces new Integrity Blade Servers - OpenVMS?0 Message-ID: <BFC6D88F.19046%roktsci@comcast.net>  8 So HP has now announced the new Integrity Blade Servers:  L http://h18004.www1.hp.com/products/servers/platforms/new11-01.html?jumpid=em _CTdec05_spot01   E They say it supports HPUX, Linux and Windows, but nothing of OpenVMS?    ------------------------------    Date: 15 Dec 2005 10:01:50 -0800; From: "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> @ Subject: Re: HP announces new Integrity Blade Servers - OpenVMS?C Message-ID: <1134669710.047729.158920@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>    Jeff Cameron wrote: : > So HP has now announced the new Integrity Blade Servers: > N > http://h18004.www1.hp.com/products/servers/platforms/new11-01.html?jumpid=em > _CTdec05_spot01  > G > They say it supports HPUX, Linux and Windows, but nothing of OpenVMS?   , Nice thought.  VMSCluster-in-a-shelf anyone?   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 10:32:12 -0800 ( From: Jeff Cameron <roktsci@comcast.net>@ Subject: Re: HP announces new Integrity Blade Servers - OpenVMS?0 Message-ID: <BFC6F6AC.19058%roktsci@comcast.net>    On 12/15/05 10:01 AM, in article6 1134669710.047729.158920@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com,< "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> wrote:   >  > Jeff Cameron wrote: ; >> So HP has now announced the new Integrity Blade Servers:  >>  O >> http://h18004.www1.hp.com/products/servers/platforms/new11-01.html?jumpid=em  >> _CTdec05_spot01 >>  H >> They say it supports HPUX, Linux and Windows, but nothing of OpenVMS? > . > Nice thought.  VMSCluster-in-a-shelf anyone? > E Or better yet a Galaxy in a shelf with VMS, Linux and HPUX instances.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 16:16:18 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com 4 Subject: Re: Location of initial page and swap files- Message-ID: <87k6e6pygd.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   = koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:   ^ > In article <439FDDF9.66377E5F@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:  F >> When a node boots, how does it know where its first page/swap filesF >> are to be located ? Does it look in [SYSxx.SYSEXE] for pagefile.sysC >> and swapfile.sys (hardcoded names) ? Or is there some file names D >> stored somewhere ? At what stage of booting is this done ? As far' >> as startup.com or well before this ?   E >    I'm pretty sure the first pagefile, swapfile, and dumpfile names @ >    are hardcoded.  But they'll be skipped if they don't exist.  G PAge, swap and dump file are hard coded and accessed very early, before E the file system is full up and running. If you boot without them, you 2 can see the "Failed to map <name>" on the console.  D >    You can't delete them while they're in use, but you can set the6 >    delete bit (complete the delete after reboot usinF >    analyze/disk/repair, or rename them and delete them after reboot.     J >> In [sys11.sysexe]satellite_page.com, there is code specific to my site,I >> code created by cluster_config.com.  Is it legal to edit this file and  >> change things in it ?  	 >    Yep.   I Very carfully... BTW, i use the file name AAA<SCSID>.PAGE|SWAP and put it E in [000000].  This automajikally sticks it right in the centre of the 2 disk next to the index file on an /image restore.    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 14:40:31 GMT S From: "Gregory Morrow" <gregorymorrowEMERGENCYCANCELLATIONARCHIMEDES@earthlink.net> + Subject: Re: M e z e i kooks out again..... B Message-ID: <zffof.5193$Dd2.1933@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>   Pavel wrote:  G > That's how some people get their kicks and propagate the bs.  This is + > just one reason why I prefer top posting.  > < > "Geoffrey Welsh" <reply@newsgroup.please> wrote in message0 > news:e8040$4399e75c$cf7045a6$7710@PRIMUS.CA... > : Gregory Morrow wrote:  > : > Nomen Nescio wrote:  > : > [...] E > : > Oh my, is all this stuff *really* true?  Pretty wierd if it is!  > : I > : It's rude enough to quote an entire long message just to add one line  > ofJ > : commentary but you had to quote in its entirety the pollution that 99% > of@ > : the readers of these groups had blocked.  Thanks, you moron. >  >  >      Top posting = rude   --   Best Greg   ------------------------------    Date: 15 Dec 2005 08:10:47 -0800- From: "tumblindice" <tumblindice@hotmail.com> ! Subject: monitoring VMS log files C Message-ID: <1134663047.292581.288940@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    Hi,   B    We would like to monitor our VMS logfiles, operator.log and theE security files to a machine that could send out email to notify us of F discrepancies. There are a few tools out there for UNIX but I have not< seen anything for VMS. Any help or pointers would be greatly appreciated. Thank you.     
     Robert       tumblindice@hotmail.com    ------------------------------    Date: 15 Dec 2005 08:25:26 -0800) From: "Ken Robinson" <kenrbnsn@gmail.com> % Subject: Re: monitoring VMS log files B Message-ID: <1134663926.819306.74400@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   tumblindice wrote: > Hi,  > D >    We would like to monitor our VMS logfiles, operator.log and theG > security files to a machine that could send out email to notify us of H > discrepancies. There are a few tools out there for UNIX but I have not> > seen anything for VMS. Any help or pointers would be greatly > appreciated. Thank you.   G There are a number of products like that. Two that come to mind are the F Unicenter Console Management for OpenVMS from CA and ConsoleWorks from, TECsys Developement <http://www.tditx.com/>.   Ken    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 11:46:03 +0000 ! From: Baldrick <none@[127.0.0.1]> ? Subject: Re: Resale value of ES40 and lots of other VMS systems ' Message-ID: <dnrl1s$pc0$1@lore.csc.com>   - David Turner, Island Computers US Corp wrote: M > Actually that ES40 pricing also includes the EIP package which is VERY VERY  > expensive for wjhat if offers N > Basically the same kinda thing that comes standard with EVERY OTHER OS!!!!!! > ( > EIP by itself sells for over $8000 !!! >  > David   " "Buy a license get free hardware".  B I've never really agreed with HP's (DEC/Compaq) policy on product H pricing. Integrity is a lot better but the VAX and Alpha traditional is I retained. One thing that REALLY annoys me is the price (say) of DEC Ada.  I A mature, never to be developed product, pretty much all the bugs beaten  I out of it, and it still costs an arm and a leg. BTW, it's MATURE because  ( HP say it is. So why keep the high cost?  @ Volume Shadowing on the other hand is still being developed and H improved, so that is understandable. Ditto networking an other products.  H Mature = no development = no developments and support costs = should be  cheaper.    Personal, but heartfelt opinion! --  E Regards, Nic Clews a.k.a. Mr. Car Park Charges, CSC Computer Sciences  nclews at csc dot com    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 04:08:01 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> / Subject: Staggered Hobbyist licence renewalls ? , Message-ID: <43A13268.4A2F2466@teksavvy.com>  H I got some new babies this week. My normal hobbyist renewall is in earlyH may. Does anyone know if I register for licences for me new babies todayE if the system will cue in to my DECUS number and issue licences which H expire at the same time as my current licences or will it issue licenses# with expiration in december 2006 ?    = I think I would prefer if they all expired at the same time.    G I take it I need to get layered products licences for each new system ? H I guess I can't register the same licence multiple times with a "on nodeE XXX" and "on node YYY" each time, right ?  (in a cluster with shared   LMF database).   ------------------------------    Date: 15 Dec 2005 01:55:14 -0800  From: "Eddie" <blokey@gmail.com>3 Subject: Re: Staggered Hobbyist licence renewalls ? C Message-ID: <1134640514.341202.304460@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>   F Base VMS license will have a new expiry date of DEC06, but the layered= products license will be the same as your current LP license.   G NB: As the layered products licenses are all 0 unit licenses, they will D load without a problem across the cluster.  You only need a new base$ license as they are marked NO_SHARE.   ------------------------------    Date: 15 Dec 2005 06:17:16 -0800; From: "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> 3 Subject: Re: Staggered Hobbyist licence renewalls ? C Message-ID: <1134656236.461914.226060@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    Eddie wrote:H > Base VMS license will have a new expiry date of DEC06, but the layered? > products license will be the same as your current LP license.  > I > NB: As the layered products licenses are all 0 unit licenses, they will F > load without a problem across the cluster.  You only need a new base& > license as they are marked NO_SHARE.  D My experience with generating licenses for newly aquired hardware isC that it sets the expiration date to the same as your older licenses E unless it's within a week or so (maybe month?) of the older license's  expiration date.  F And all you need to get is the base O/S PAK.  The layered product PAKsF you only need one set for each architecture.  Just load them once in a( cluster or on each non-clustered system.   ------------------------------   Date: 15 Dec 2005 14:03:13 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)! Subject: Re: Storageworks shelves , Message-ID: <40dbd1F19pu25U1@individual.net>  9 In article <Bieof.21861$Y72.1770@bignews1.bellsouth.net>, F 	"David Turner, Island Computers US Corp" <dbturner@icusc.com> writes:2 > Perhaps someone can explain to me the following: > E > Why, when SCSI was implemented, did it have the 7 drive limitation?  > Why not 16 or 32?  > Of course UW> is 14 but why? > J > Did someone in the SCSI original design team think that noone would ever > need more than 7 drives?  9 Why were the early PC BIOSes limited to such small disks? + Why was the 8088 limited to 640K of memory?   B Someone had to pick a number of bits to use for addressing and forC the original SCSI it was 3 bits.  Later increased to 4 bits. We see H this as a shortcoming now but that is because hindsight is always 20/20.   My $.02    bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 08:43:46 -0500 C From: "David Turner, Island Computers US Corp" <dbturner@icusc.com> ! Subject: Re: Storageworks shelves 9 Message-ID: <Bieof.21861$Y72.1770@bignews1.bellsouth.net>   0 Perhaps someone can explain to me the following:  C Why, when SCSI was implemented, did it have the 7 drive limitation?  Why not 16 or 32?  Of course UW> is 14 but why?  H Did someone in the SCSI original design team think that noone would ever need more than 7 drives?   DT   --     David B Turner Island Computers US Corp 2700 Gregory St, Suite 180 Savannah GA 31404  Tel: 912 447 6622 X201 Cell: 912 447 6622 X252  Fax: 912 201 0402  Email: dbturner@icusc.com  Web: http://www.islandco.com% ===================================== < All orders are subject to the following terms and conditions. of sale. These should be read before ordering.% http://www.islandco.com/warranty.html   : "William Webb" <william.w.webb@gmail.com> wrote in messageC news:8660a3a10512141413n64d30f3bx8e7796f49d14e8bd@mail.gmail.com... 7 On 14 Dec 2005 13:46:40 -0800, johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com ! <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> wrote:  >  > Bill Gunshannon wrote:G > > In article <1134593257.273430.292020@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>, G > >       "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> writes:  > > > Bill Gunshannon wrote:F > > >> Can anyone give me a quick rundown on the differences between aJ > > >> BA350-JA and a BA350-SB?  I have both.  With the JA all the devicesH > > >> are visable when hooked up to a PDP-11 with a CMD SCSI Module butH > > >> the same configuration with the SB reports all drives OFFLINE.  IF > > >> tried hooking them both up to a PC with an Adaptec Card and theG > > >> results are the same.  I can see no configuration options beyond H > > >> SHELF_OK and they are both configured the same for that (not that5 > > >> I expect it makes a difference to the PDP-11).  > > >>C > > >> It would be usefull to use both as sources for drives for my 	 PDP-11's.  > > >> > > > From the SOC (circa '96)D > > > http://h18000.www1.hp.com/products/quickspecs/SOC/QB001QPF.PDF > > > # > > > BA350-SB General description: E > > > Single-height shelf, configured for seven 3.5" devices, or four G > > > 3.5" devices and one 5.25" full-height device, or one 3.5" device H > > > and two 5.25" full-height devices. Installation of redundant powerI > > > supply reduces number of 3.5" devices by one. Two 5.25" half-height D > > > devices (RRD4x, TZK1x) can be mounted in one 5.25" full-height& > > > carrier. FCC class B certified . > > > " > > > Shelves for SW500 and SW800: > > > BA350-JA: H > > > Shelf for EISA-based server logic, includes power supply BA35X-HF,0 > > > dual-speed blowers, and mounting brackets. > > >  > > > BA350-SB: J > > > Shelf for 1 to 7 devices, 8-bit single-ended SCSI bus in back panel,K > > > dual-speed blowers. 3.5- and 5.25" form factor. FCC Class B certified  > > > G > > > I think they are the same basic shelf with different accessories. E > > > Looks like the -JA comes with mounting brackets and a P/S where  the -SB L > > > is a basic shelf.  Neither mentions the personality module But I thinkF > > > thre wasn't much choice for the BA350 shelf which is 8-bit only. > > D > > No "Personality Module" in either of them. Just drives and powerD > > supplies.  Behind the fans are the terminator and the connector.D > > Bothe are configured for single bus and exert SHELF_OK (although/ > > I suspect the PDP doesn't care about that.)  > H > Okay. I guess only the BA356 has them since it can support 8 or 16-bitE > drives and connections. I don't have any BA350's around any more to & > reference, just a couple of BA356's. >  > > J > > >                                                                  I'dI > > > suspect something is set different in your two personality modules. F > > > The other possibility is that the -SB has a problem on it's SCSI > > > backplane. > > > H > > > Does the system see the drives but they're offline or are they not seen
 > > > at all?  > > D > > I assume it doesn't see them as it should report what the drives< > > actually are and all it says is OFFLINE for all of them. > >  > > > How many drives?G > > > If the shelf is not full could it have a split backplane with the ! > > > drives on the "other" half?  > > H > > No split backplanes.  But I did have them both fully loaded. (I haveI > > since taken out two drives from the one that works as RSTS refuses to B > > even boot the install tape with more than 4 devices connected. > >  > > > K > > > Have you compared the switch settings on the two personality modules? : > > > 8-bit modules might not have any settings. Not sure.+ > > > Are the personality modules the same?  > > J > > No personality modules, just the backplane witht he cable connected to JA1, > > E > > I am begining to think the BA350-SB is just plain broke!!  Unless  someone J > > shows up here to tell me it is differnt than a JA and will not work inL > > this configuration.  Or maybe it actually requires a personality module?E > > I've known peopl eiwth and without built-in personality, maybe SB  Shelves  > > are the same way?  :-) > >  > > bill > >  > >  > > --G > > Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three  wolvesH > > bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. > > University of Scranton   |B > > Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h> >  >     B BA350s don't have a space (little thin slot at top, about half the) size of an SBB) for a personality module.   D They have two narrow SCSI connectors (50 pin HD) mounted directly on@ the backplane, which makes them a challenge to reach if you have squarish hands like I do.   F Other giveaways- BA350 round key, BA356 flat key if you still have the. front and back covers for the pedestal models.   WWWebb   --C NOTE: This email address is only used for noncommerical VMS-related  correspondence. C All unsolicited commercial email will be deemed to be a request for 8 services pursuant to the terms and conditions located at# http://bellsouthpwp.net/w/e/webbww/    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 15 Dec 2005 12:35:00 -0500 * From: "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca>) Subject: Re: UK VMS HP contract customers 0 Message-ID: <11q3a9ierr8jd94@corp.supernews.com>  G "David Turner, Island Computers US Corp" <dbturner@icusc.com> wrote in  ; message news:FvVnf.16454$MA2.6628@bignews6.bellsouth.net... I >I heard in the USA that several platforms have had suport canned on them  >  > DS10 DS20 DS20e ES40 >  > Anyone able to confirm that? >  > David  >   M Our HP representative assured us this is NOT the case, these machines CAN be   put on a maintenance contract.  H But malicious companies try to get contracts based on false information.F We got a call this morning, from a person that said HP will no longer % support these machines (that we own). M He maintained that support will end by 2006, which is totally false. He also  K tried to push some other hardware and suggested we go with something else,   software-wise.  J Again that's bad for VMS business when such people call a bunch of places G and tell them they use unsupported hardware, and also suggest that the  * software is not in a much better position.  M You should probably call your clients and ask where they got the information  J from. Possibly not directly from HP ? Or else the situation in the USA is   different than that in Canada...L And HP should send a mailing (it's been a very long time since I received a K nice toy from DEC/Compaq/HP in the mail!) to tell their customers what the  K plans are. This info is currently only available on the web afaik, and not  M all people will check (believe it or not HP, some people will not spend time  8 hunting for such information, it must be given to them).L So I'm waiting for a new OpenVMS t-shirt, and a copy of the HP statement on I AlphaServer support to go with it (and of course the necessary Integrity   servers flyer).    Syltrem    ------------------------------    Date: 15 Dec 2005 12:31:15 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) ) Subject: Re: UK VMS HP contract customers 3 Message-ID: <z5QD6njzGMqv@eisner.encompasserve.org>   ] In article <11q3a9ierr8jd94@corp.supernews.com>, "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca> writes:   L > Again that's bad for VMS business when such people call a bunch of places I > and tell them they use unsupported hardware, and also suggest that the  , > software is not in a much better position.  9 I tend to assume those who have chosen VMS are on average 2 _less_ vulnerable to such shenanigans than others.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2005.697 ************************                                                                                                                                                      nCҳEKSM{_^.BVhh&ŉ%V:/&.5*MbA#	Z
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