0 INFO-VAX	Thu, 10 Feb 2005	Volume 2005 : Issue 81      Contents:. Re: AXP 150: trying to upgrade disk, need help. Re: AXP 150: trying to upgrade disk, need helpP Re: Bets being taken on Itanic survival [was] Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired firedP Re: Bets being taken on Itanic survival [was] Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired firedP Re: Bets being taken on Itanic survival [was] Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired fired4 Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host?4 Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host?4 Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host?4 Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host?4 Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host?4 RE: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host?4 Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host?4 Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host?4 Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host?P Re: carly(tm) does Davos - selling HP..er... Apple iPods on the slopes slopessloE Re: carly(tm) does Davos - selling HP..er... Apple iPods on theslopes ! CEO definition, was: Wayman's bio 1 Couldn't have said it better myself  @openvms.org  Curly 2: the axeman returneth ! Re: Curly 2: the axeman returneth ! Re: Curly 2: the axeman returneth ! Re: Curly 2: the axeman returneth ! Re: Curly 2: the axeman returneth ! Re: Curly soon to be out of a job  Dvorak on whatshername Re: Full page color HP ad for  grep on openVMS? Re: grep on openVMS? Re: grep on openVMS? Re: grep on openVMS? Re: grep on openVMS? Re: grep on openVMS? Re: grep on openVMS? Re: grep on openVMS?% how to turn $6 into $6000! read this! % how to turn $6 into $6000! read this!  Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired- Re: Is $3 million really so much to spend.... - Re: Is $3 million really so much to spend.... ( Re: Loads of DS10L 466 in stock for $250( Re: Loads of DS10L 466 in stock for $250 One heck of a quote  Re: One heck of a quote % Re: OT- Like IBM stock when it was $1 5 Re: REBOOT or SHUTDOWN, how to tell in SYSSHUTDWN.COM 6 Re: REBOOT or SHUTDOWN, how to tell in SYSSHUTDWN.COM\6 Re: REBOOT or SHUTDOWN, how to tell in SYSSHUTDWN.COM\6 Re: REBOOT or SHUTDOWN, how to tell in SYSSHUTDWN.COM\! Re: Serving a different boot disk $ So how big a parachute did she have?( Re: So how big a parachute did she have?( Re: So how big a parachute did she have? Re: VAX 4000 m500A problem Re: VMS in medical business  Re: VMS in medical business  RE: VMS in medical business  Re: VMS in medical business  Re: VMS in medical business  Re: VMS in medical business  Re: VMS in medical business , Re: Why aren't more universities doing this?  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 17:34:35 -0500 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> 7 Subject: Re: AXP 150: trying to upgrade disk, need help 0 Message-ID: <110l3fhd9oguk48@corp.supernews.com>   tadamsmar@yahoo.com wrote:   > If I issue the command:  >  > INIT DKA100:  TEST >  > it works but then: >  > MOUNT DKA100: TEST > 1 > reports that the disk is offline.  Frustrating.  > F > Feeling the top of the drive, it feels cooler than the RZ26L that isG > mounted at the back of the enclosure.  So, I am not sure these drives * > would need extra cooling if they worked. >   B Me thinks you may have a bad drive.  Or was that issue previously F discussed?  Have you tested the drive on another system?  Do you have   another drive you can test with?   Dave   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 17:25:32 -0800  From: tadamsmar@yahoo.com 7 Subject: Re: AXP 150: trying to upgrade disk, need help C Message-ID: <1107998732.752541.253350@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>    Dave Froble wrote: > tadamsmar@yahoo.com wrote: >  > > If I issue the command:  > >  > > INIT DKA100:  TEST > >  > > it works but then: > >  > > MOUNT DKA100: TEST > > 3 > > reports that the disk is offline.  Frustrating.  > > E > > Feeling the top of the drive, it feels cooler than the RZ26L that  isB > > mounted at the back of the enclosure.  So, I am not sure these drives, > > would need extra cooling if they worked. > >  > C > Me thinks you may have a bad drive.  Or was that issue previously G > discussed?  Have you tested the drive on another system?  Do you have   " > another drive you can test with? >  > Dave   I do have another to test with.   F But, both drives were recently removed from an AlphaStation 400.  They= had functioned as a reliable system disk shadowset for years.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 13:59:54 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> Y Subject: Re: Bets being taken on Itanic survival [was] Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired fired B Message-ID: <1107974901.2e711b5a0f049d423439d3a98159ede6@teranews>   FredK wrote:N > The key here is "interim".  I would expect that in that capacity he will not > makeK > major changes in strategy - that is a job for the next CEO.  The question  > reallyL > is what the board thinks the strategy should be, and that will lead to who > they+ > finally pick and the direction things go.     / I agree. (oh no, the sky MUST be falling ...:-)   B And it hinges on the real reasons for her departure (what did they
 disagree on).   B For a company such as HP, there are some really big existentialistH questions ahead. Are they to be split and/or organised along consumer vs@ business product lines ?  Is there any synergy between the two ?  E And one must also look at the "channel".  Do HP printers benefit from B the PC distrribution channel or vice versa or are they pretty muchF independant ? Does HP want to do away with the 1980s "channel" for itsG PCs and sell direct to compete against Dell ? What sort of impact would  have on the printer business ?  A So, whether Printers should be kept or not, and of spun off, what ; printers should take with them isn't such an easy question.     H Right now, HP is right where IBM was just before Gerstner got the job atE IBM. IBM had already hired investment bankers to split itself up into G multiple companies, with many names already decided. He was able to put H a stop to this. In his book, there is no mention of big battles with theG board to keep IBM as one, nor is there one about the board choosing him O with a manadate to keep IBM as one. His mandate was to save IBM from bankrupcy.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 15:00:26 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> Y Subject: Re: Bets being taken on Itanic survival [was] Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired fired B Message-ID: <1107978530.0c46718b3c57843aeeddaa5a8d83aad5@teranews>   John Smith wrote: J > Carly was all for keeping the company together - it was her 'get big and > grow' vision.  > K > If there were disagreements at the Board level, then this was probably it F > because nothing else (except perhaps plasma TV's and iPod's and that2 > direction) was big enough to get her kicked out.   One can take an alternate view:   E The "pro breakup" are saying that HP would be worth more if split up. K What that really means is that the non-printer business is underperforming.    E The disagreements may be because Carly is simply not competant to fix D the broken parts and she just wants the glamour. (I posted a messageG about that , a quote from Gerstner's book a few days ago "Elephants can C dance" which has become that much more relevant with today's news).   C Gerstner had the same issues when he was brought in. But he saw the G company as a whole having more value if one were able to fix the broken ) parts inside it. And that is what he did.   H Carly failed to leverage the enterprise busines it got from Compaq. ManyB would argue that Compaq was just a name. It didn't have any wintelF customers (except the "channel"). It had enterprise business inherited from tandem and digital.  H And Carly failed to take the dramatic steps needed to restructure the PCE business. I don't meanmusical chairs games of who gets to direct that E division this week. I mean taking tough decisions of whether you drop D the channel and go direct sales to go head to head with Dell or not.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 21:00:40 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>Y Subject: Re: Bets being taken on Itanic survival [was] Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired fired * Message-ID: <420ACE58.7A26AA2@comcast.net>   John Smith wrote:  >  > Colin Butcher wrote:- > > http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=21175  > M > Now that the financial guy is in charge on an interim basis, as an agent of K > change, and has an intimate understanding of what really costs what - are N > there any takers that HP will step away from Itanic, and possibly enterprise > computing altogether?   C Enterprise is about the only place where HP makes any decent profit H (imagine how much more they could make or could have been making, had itG not been for the Alphacide!). I doubt they'll make any big changes here ' before the new CEO is firmly ensconced.   L > What's the betting line on HP being split into a printer/ink company and aL > separate computer company? I think the odds just got considerably shorter.  F I'd tend to agree, but I'd be inclined to think that just to cut theirC losses, they'd be likely to cede the desktop space to Dell, and the 7 hand-held space to the cell-phone industry (Motorola?).    <ramble>H VMS could be spun off into its own unit. That unit would then be free toH work not only with HP, but with Dell and IBM in the Itanic and/or x86-64E space, and with Samsung in the Alpha space (to perpetuate Alpha until > the market selects a direction in the Itanic / x86-64 choice).  E THEN, my fine friends, we'd be in a great position to see what impact E the new "Cell" CPU has on the market in the Enterprise space. Imagine E Cell-based Enterprise class systems all linked together the way Alpha G CPU chassis and CPUs are linked in the GS1280. Imagine entire groups of F Cell-based systems, all participating in a single VMS instance - thinkF of START CPU and STOP CPU as causing an entire Cell-based box to begin0 or cease participating in a single VMS instance.  D I was fairly burnt to start with, but that just blew my circuits! So+ many possibilities, so few probabilities... 	 </ramble>    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 18:58:55 GMT 0 From: John Santos <john.santos@post.harvard.edu>= Subject: Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host? > Message-ID: <MPG.1c74277acfac8ee29896e9@news.bellatlantic.net>  C In article <1107972718.571027.53640@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,   simonvarley@hotmail.com says... E > In looking through the MQSeries docs and scouring the Web, I've not ? > been able to answer the question of whether two different and H > geographically separate hosts can communicate if one uses MQSeries and > the other does not?  >  > Thanks > Simon   B MQseries is a layered application (middleware) that runs on top ofC TCP/IP.  (I don't know if it runs on any other transports as well.)   C It doesn't block any other form of TCP/IP (or DECnet or LAT or X.25  or SCS or ...) communications.  @ Both hosts must have MQSeries installed, in order to communicateE using MQSeries.  Both hosts must have TCP/IP installed to communicate C using TCP/IP.  Both hosts must have DECnet installed to communicate @ using DECnet.  Nothing prevents a host from having more than oneE type of network transport installed, or more than one layered network  application installed.   --   John   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 11:05:26 -0800  From: simonvarley@hotmail.com = Subject: Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host? B Message-ID: <1107975926.738276.26850@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>  F OK, so if I have a TCP/IP application on system A - that does not haveF MQSeries and I have MQSeries over TCP/IP running on system B, the onlyG thing system A's TCP/IP application needs is the msg interface spec for  MQSeries and we're good to go?  5 If that's the case where is that msg format defined ?  -- Simon    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 14:11:40 -0500# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> = Subject: Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host? , Message-ID: <M_adnZQEJJPu_ZffRVn-iw@igs.net>   John Santos wrote:D > In article <1107972718.571027.53640@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,! > simonvarley@hotmail.com says... F >> In looking through the MQSeries docs and scouring the Web, I've not@ >> been able to answer the question of whether two different andE >> geographically separate hosts can communicate if one uses MQSeries  >> and the other does not? >>	 >> Thanks  >> Simon > D > MQseries is a layered application (middleware) that runs on top ofE > TCP/IP.  (I don't know if it runs on any other transports as well.)  > E > It doesn't block any other form of TCP/IP (or DECnet or LAT or X.25   > or SCS or ...) communications. > B > Both hosts must have MQSeries installed, in order to communicateG > using MQSeries.  Both hosts must have TCP/IP installed to communicate E > using TCP/IP.  Both hosts must have DECnet installed to communicate B > using DECnet.  Nothing prevents a host from having more than oneG > type of network transport installed, or more than one layered network  > application installed.    : No message queue product on each end = no message passing.  ? There was some discussion years ago about message queue product G interoperability (ie. MQ, DECmessageQ, MSMQ, and a couple others) but I D never followed the discussions to know whether they ever came to any" agreements. We standardized on MQ.   --- OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style.    ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 11:46:50 -0800  From: simonvarley@hotmail.com = Subject: Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host? C Message-ID: <1107978410.328164.180900@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>   & OK, I have to have MQ on both systems.  E That's a pity since for me MQ is just an additional layer duplicating A the stuff I have in my existing applications. Hopefully, there is E someway to get it to passthrough without being too much of a resource F hog. I'll find out during the MQ training class I'll have to schedule. ---  Simon    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 15:11:06 -0500# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> = Subject: Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host? , Message-ID: <McCdnTbrY5L885ffRVn-pQ@igs.net>   simonvarley@hotmail.com wrote:( > OK, I have to have MQ on both systems. > G > That's a pity since for me MQ is just an additional layer duplicating C > the stuff I have in my existing applications. Hopefully, there is G > someway to get it to passthrough without being too much of a resource H > hog. I'll find out during the MQ training class I'll have to schedule.    C Don't knock it. MQ is extremely good at what it does - asynchronous D store/foreward message queueing.  If you have a need for it, use it.   Learn about its capabilities.    --- OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 15:31:27 -0500' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> = Subject: RE: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host? R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB53F21E@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----C > From: simonvarley@hotmail.com [mailto:simonvarley@hotmail.com]=20   > Sent: February 9, 2005 1:12 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ; > Subject: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host?  >=20E > In looking through the MQSeries docs and scouring the Web, I've not ? > been able to answer the question of whether two different and H > geographically separate hosts can communicate if one uses MQSeries and > the other does not?  >=20 > Thanks > Simon  >=20   Simon,  H To communicate, each host must agree on the protocols to be used. If oneF is using the proprietary protocols of MQ Series, then that is what the other host must also use.   F On OpenVMS, you can use MQ Series V5.3 as well, but if you are lookingH for other compatible App messaging options, you may want to consider theG SpiritSoft app messaging products. They are JMS industry std based, but & also have a MQ Series adapter as well.  
 Reference: http://www.spiritsoft.com    Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 13:24:20 -0800 C From: "Mission Critical Consulting, LLC" <soccer13player@yahoo.com> = Subject: Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host? C Message-ID: <1107984260.055389.124570@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>   C Having worked with MQSeries 5.2 on OpenVMS, I was very disappointed C with the lack of tools available for it on OpenVMS.  IBM ported the D core product, but not the tools.  Their documentation is pretty good though.   C As Mr. Main mentioned, there are other messaging products that have F MQSeries adapters available.  I think TIBCO does.  However, unless you@ already have a corporate messaging backbone that has an MQSeriesF adapter, getting MQSeries would avoid any possible differences that an adapter may have.   A I would recommend investigating QN-AppWatch and QN-StatWatch from 2 Reconda (www.reconda.com) for MQSeries management.     Main, Kerry wrote: > > -----Original Message-----B > > From: simonvarley@hotmail.com [mailto:simonvarley@hotmail.com]" > > Sent: February 9, 2005 1:12 PM > > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com = > > Subject: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host?  > > G > > In looking through the MQSeries docs and scouring the Web, I've not A > > been able to answer the question of whether two different and F > > geographically separate hosts can communicate if one uses MQSeries and  > > the other does not?  > > 
 > > Thanks	 > > Simon  > >  >  > Simon, > F > To communicate, each host must agree on the protocols to be used. If one D > is using the proprietary protocols of MQ Series, then that is what the  > other host must also use.  > @ > On OpenVMS, you can use MQ Series V5.3 as well, but if you are looking F > for other compatible App messaging options, you may want to consider the E > SpiritSoft app messaging products. They are JMS industry std based,  but ( > also have a MQ Series adapter as well. >  > Reference: > http://www.spiritsoft.com  > 	 > Regards  >  > Kerry Main > Senior Consultant  > HP Services Canada > Voice: 613-592-4660  > Fax: 613-591-4477  > kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom > (remove the DOT's and AT)  > & > "OpenVMS has always had integrity ..  > Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 13:59:04 -0800  From: simonvarley@hotmail.com = Subject: Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host? B Message-ID: <1107986344.322387.29630@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>  4 Thanks to all. Excellent answers. I'll check it out.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 18:02:20 -0500 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> = Subject: Re: Can I talk to MQSeries from a non-MQSeries host? 0 Message-ID: <110l53i83t37pd6@corp.supernews.com>   simonvarley@hotmail.com wrote:( > OK, I have to have MQ on both systems. > G > That's a pity since for me MQ is just an additional layer duplicating C > the stuff I have in my existing applications. Hopefully, there is G > someway to get it to passthrough without being too much of a resource H > hog. I'll find out during the MQ training class I'll have to schedule. > ---  > Simon  > ? I don't know your application or requirements, so cannot offer  G suggestions.  However, just because you have MQ on one system does not  H force you to use MQ.  Depending upon your requirements you can possibly   use other communication methods.   Dave   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 04:03:53 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com Y Subject: Re: carly(tm) does Davos - selling HP..er... Apple iPods on the slopes slopesslo - Message-ID: <87bratmrfa.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   % "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes:   G > http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/cmp/20050128/tc_cmp/59100270   D > .... `I think (2005) will be a year of growth in IT spending'' sheE > said, but added, ``we need to be realistic about what growth in the " > IT sector means going forward.''  I Sheesh! All the signs are that intrest rates are about to launch, and the H $40+ /bbl oil are about to bite. Reatial figure here showed a 3% DECLINEA in Dec quarter retail sales, and I expect it to continue sliding.   E AAnyone with a clue will be garding their cash and streching the life $ of all the kit that arrived for Y2K.   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 20:31:27 -0600 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>N Subject: Re: carly(tm) does Davos - selling HP..er... Apple iPods on theslopes+ Message-ID: <420AC77F.E40ADB47@comcast.net>    prep@prep.synonet.com wrote: > ' > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes:  > I > > http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/cmp/20050128/tc_cmp/59100270  > F > > .... `I think (2005) will be a year of growth in IT spending'' sheG > > said, but added, ``we need to be realistic about what growth in the $ > > IT sector means going forward.'' > K > Sheesh! All the signs are that intrest rates are about to launch, and the J > $40+ /bbl oil are about to bite. Reatial figure here showed a 3% DECLINEC > in Dec quarter retail sales, and I expect it to continue sliding.  > G > AAnyone with a clue will be garding their cash and streching the life & > of all the kit that arrived for Y2K.  @ We may be adding more GS1280s - dunno yet. We just added a thirdD GS1280/16 in Q4 of CY2004. (Hint for Cerner Millennium sites runningE Multinet: avoid V5 for now if you're trying to scale laterally. Scale D vertically by upgrading your GS1280s from /16 to /32. The inter-nodeA TCP/IP communications will kill you under certain circumstances.)   E Given the day's announcements, all bets are at least up in the air if  not off altogether.   D That said, I just got done re-implementing an Alpha 4100 (2 CIPCAs),C four SC008s and two HSJ pairs with a full complement of shelves and D spindles in an SW800 rack (de-implements an Alpha 2100A and four HSJ pairs).   7 So, the old co-exists with the new, for the time being.    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 21:23:08 -0800 ( From: Jeff Cameron <roktsci@comcast.net>* Subject: CEO definition, was: Wayman's bio/ Message-ID: <BE302FBC.677C%roktsci@comcast.net>   I Another CFO turned CEO. Nothing will change unless Wayman (Rainman) knows < the rule of CEO (which is lost among most US company CEO's).  	 CEO rule: G The letters in CEO should remind those with the title what the order of  importance is :    C: Customers E: Employees O: Owners (Stock holders).  I Too many CEOs with CFO mentalities typically reverse this or put the last  before the rest.  K A good lead for a company come from a CEO who puts them in the right order, I therefore making the company strong for the service it provides, which in # turn keeps the Stock holders happy.   I Placing the stockholders first will not drive your customers to be happy.   L IMO, which is why I'm just a lowly engineer saying "O-rings crack when cold"6 instead of making the big bucks like Curly or Rainman.   > John Smith wrote:  >>  Robert P. Wayman6 >> Chief Executive Officer and Chief Financial Officer >> Hewlett-Packard Company >>  O >> Robert P. Wayman was named chief executive officer on an interim basis of HP O >> in February 2005. In this role, he will continue to serve as chief financial G >> officer for HP, responsible for overall financial activities and for G >> multiple corporate departments at the company, including Controller, ( >> Treasury, Tax, Legal and Real Estate. >>  G >> On Feb. 8, 2005, Wayman was appointed to HP's board of directors. He K >> previously served as a member of the board from 1993 to 2002. He stepped H >> down upon completion of HP's merger with Compaq Computer Corporation. >>  I >> Wayman was named an executive vice president of HP in 1992 and assumed L >> additional responsibility for administration that same year. He was namedM >> senior vice president in 1987. Wayman was elected vice president and chief L >> financial officer in 1984 after being named controller in 1984 and deputy  >> corporate controller in 1981. >>  O >> In 1976, Wayman was named group controller for HP's former Instrument Group, I >> based in Palo Alto, Calif. He became division controller in 1973 after O >> serving in several accounting management positions. Wayman joined HP in 1969 D >> at its Loveland, Colo., Instrument Division as a cost accountant. >>  I >> In 1967, Wayman earned a bachelor's degree in science engineering from M >> Northwestern University in Evanston, Ill. He received a master's degree in 5 >> business administration from Northwestern in 1969.  >>  J >> Wayman serves as a director of CNF, Inc., and Sybase, Inc. He also is a: >> director of the Cultural Initiatives of Silicon Valley. >>  K >> He is a member of the Policy Council of the Tax Foundation, the Advisory I >> Board to the Northwestern University Kellogg School of Management, the L >> Financial Executives Institute and the Council of Financial Executives of >> the Conference Board. >>   >>   >> -- 0 >> OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style. >>   >>     ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 16:58:22 -0500# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> : Subject: Couldn't have said it better myself  @openvms.org, Message-ID: <soOdnbAIQcEbGpffRVn-iA@igs.net>  9 http://www.openvms.org/stories.php?story=05/02/09/5992181 J ....While many on Wall Street blessed the multibillion dollar Compaq deal,J it was not universally praised. Many felt that Compaq had not yet finished4 digesting its acquisition of Digital Equipment Corp.  K "The Compaq deal was stupid--there's no other good word for it. But the bad G thing is, it was stupid at the time, not just in retrospect," said Jeff I Matthews, general partner at Ram Partners, a Greenwich, Conn.-based hedge J fund that holds no interest in HP. "Walter Hewlett correctly tried to stopH it. But the board was in a position where it was either support Carly orG not, and they had to support Carly, even though it meant doing a really  stupid deal.  J "They spent $24 billion in HP stock buying Compaq, and they probably couldL have wired $24 billion directly to the bottom of the ocean and been in about4 as good shape as they are now," Matthews added. ....       Separately....  L http://www.crn.com/sections/breakingnews/breakingnews.jhtml;jsessionid=PRSX1. IYGX1UQ4QSNDBCSKH0CJUMEKJVN?articleId=59302327  L HP will stick to its strategy selling its portfolio of products, and it willG look for a CEO who believes in that approach, Dunn and Wayman said. "We K think it's a unique portfolio that is stronger together than apart," Wayman G said. There has been much speculation that HP would spin off its hugely E profitable printing business, but the executives said the board isn't G considering that. "What needs to be done is achieving the opportunities L present in a remarkable collection of businesses and assets that make up the HP portfolio," said Dunn.   L ...Sounds like Patricia needs a letter or 1000 from the VMS faithful just toD remind her to give us our fair share of advertising and marketing...      J Dunn said there wasn't a single triggering event that led the board to askI Fiorina to step down, a decision it's been considering over several weeks H with the help of outside advisers. She said a search for a new CEO wouldD begin immediately but added that no candidates for the job have been
 contacted.       and this....  L http://www.crn.com/sections/breakingnews/breakingnews.jhtml?articleId=593023 36  K Just three days before Fiorina's exit, announced Wednesday by HP's board of K directors, the Palo Alto, Calif.-based company was in the process of laying L off direct-sales account reps, sources said. As many as 2,000 employees were3 slated to be laid off, said one source close to HP.   B Sounds like the channel could use a little VMS advertising now....     --- - OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 11:44:41 -0800 ' From: David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu> & Subject: Curly 2: the axeman returneth+ Message-ID: <cudp79$os4$1@naig.caltech.edu>    Here's my nightmare scenario...   H The HP directors realize that once Qwest buys MCI Curly will be looking = for work.  With the incredible insight and business acumen so > aptly demonstrated by two decades of HP/Compaq/DEC boards they9 instantly grasp that this is a great opportunity to "Hire A that guy who did so well at Compaq" and "Helped with the merger". D You can almost hear the board discussion:  "He could hit the ground G running.  He's already familiar with parts of the company.  He's great  0 at cutting costs.  He does what the board asks."   Regards,   David Mathog mathog@caltech.edu   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 15:12:42 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> * Subject: Re: Curly 2: the axeman returnethB Message-ID: <1107979267.79ae865628e8bee876a46b4814ca0b17@teranews>   David Mathog wrote:  > ! > Here's my nightmare scenario...  > I > The HP directors realize that once Qwest buys MCI Curly will be looking  > for work.   & I was thinking about the same thing...   But I will go beyond this:  F The current accountant will be tasked to breakup the company, and then* seek 2 new CEOs for the respective parts.   / Curly gets the Wintel part (including printers) ( Bob Palmer gets the enterprise division.  O (Check out Palmer's Bio at AMD... he hasn't had any job since leaving Digital).    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 13:30:11 -0800 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> * Subject: Re: Curly 2: the axeman returneth( Message-ID: <opslx8ol0bzgicya@hyrrokkin>  G On Wed, 09 Feb 2005 11:44:41 -0800, David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu>    wrote:  ! > Here's my nightmare scenario...  > K > The HP directors realize that once Qwest buys MCI Curly will be looking   ? > for work.  With the incredible insight and business acumen so @ > aptly demonstrated by two decades of HP/Compaq/DEC boards they; > instantly grasp that this is a great opportunity to "Hire C > that guy who did so well at Compaq" and "Helped with the merger". G > You can almost hear the board discussion:  "He could hit the ground   J > running.  He's already familiar with parts of the company.  He's great  2 > at cutting costs.  He does what the board asks." >   K Didn't he and Carly receive about $180 Million collectively for the merger?   
 > Regards, >  > David Mathog > mathog@caltech.edu       --  C Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 16:35:33 -0500# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> * Subject: Re: Curly 2: the axeman returneth, Message-ID: <BeudneHlGYSwH5ffRVn-jA@igs.net>   Tom Linden wrote::G > On Wed, 09 Feb 2005 11:44:41 -0800, David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu>a > wrote: >P" >> Here's my nightmare scenario... >>B >> The HP directors realize that once Qwest buys MCI Curly will beH >> looking for work.  With the incredible insight and business acumen soA >> aptly demonstrated by two decades of HP/Compaq/DEC boards theye< >> instantly grasp that this is a great opportunity to "HireD >> that guy who did so well at Compaq" and "Helped with the merger".F >> You can almost hear the board discussion:  "He could hit the groundC >> running.  He's already familiar with parts of the company.  He'sa9 >> great at cutting costs.  He does what the board asks."a >> >QE > Didn't he and Carly receive about $180 Million collectively for the-	 > merger?s    ; You're off by an order of magnitude. Move the decimal left.h       --  - OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style.e   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 13:52:31 -0800t# From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com>.* Subject: Re: Curly 2: the axeman returneth( Message-ID: <opslx9ptsxzgicya@hyrrokkin>  E On Wed, 9 Feb 2005 16:35:33 -0500, John Smith <a@nonymous.com> wrote:t   > Tom Linden wrote:eH >> On Wed, 09 Feb 2005 11:44:41 -0800, David Mathog <mathog@caltech.edu>	 >> wrote:o >># >>> Here's my nightmare scenario...? >>> C >>> The HP directors realize that once Qwest buys MCI Curly will bepI >>> looking for work.  With the incredible insight and business acumen sotB >>> aptly demonstrated by two decades of HP/Compaq/DEC boards they= >>> instantly grasp that this is a great opportunity to "HireCE >>> that guy who did so well at Compaq" and "Helped with the merger".aG >>> You can almost hear the board discussion:  "He could hit the groundPD >>> running.  He's already familiar with parts of the company.  He's: >>> great at cutting costs.  He does what the board asks." >>>a >>F >> Didn't he and Carly receive about $180 Million collectively for the
 >> merger? >  >n= > You're off by an order of magnitude. Move the decimal left.D >LI Oh.  Wasn't there also a significant bonus if they both stayed for some   	 length ofM time postmerger? >  >e > -- >o/ > OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style.E >T >        -- oC Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/S   ------------------------------  * Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 18:53:01 +0000 (UTC)( From: m.kraemer@gsi.de (Michael Kraemer)* Subject: Re: Curly soon to be out of a job5 Message-ID: <cudm6d$lfr$1@lnx107.hrz.tu-darmstadt.de>e  r In article <1107973597.04d50b4767e4f04fad65185310eb5251@teranews>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes: > I > I had read some article asome time ago that she was well connected withmG > the Republican party. My expectation was that she would have gotten arH > job offer in January which would have given her an goot "out" stragegyI > to serve her country. My guess is that because problems started to brewoH > earlier than expected, she wasn't able to leave (because it would have3 > been an obvious "she's leeaving under pressure").w > J > Woudl a person of her stature have accepted anything less than something) > like director of homeland of security ?   2 In this position she could propose another merger,/ possibly US-Iraq, in order to fix some of thoset security problems down there.t   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 20:56:13 -0500# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>c Subject: Dvorak on whatshernamet, Message-ID: <ia-dnbGVYbTbIpffRVn-rA@igs.net>  9 http://www.openvms.org/stories.php?story=05/02/09/6593392o   ....J DEC was like the old H-P -- engineering driven with reputable products andK questionable marketing. The founder of the company Ken Olsen once said that.H the only reason to advertise was so your mom could know you worked for a
 real company.5  L Along the way DEC developed one of the most formidable service organizationsG in the world as well as the most powerful microprocessors available for  heavy-duty use, the Alpha chip.:  J In 1998 Compaq bought DEC for $9.6 billion. By buying Compaq, so Fiorina'sL argument went, H-P would get hold of one of its major competitors, DEC. This" would include the Alpha chip team.  A But what a difference three years of Compaq management had meant.eK Essentially DEC was ruined by the time H-P came around. Over time H-P wouldiJ lose what little talent was left at DEC merger and the fabulous Alpha chipI would go into hibernation as H-P chose to stick with the over-hyped Intel / Itanium architecture for its new servers.......,   --- OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style.o   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 17:42:05 -0800y( From: "denny" <denny_rich@ameritech.net>& Subject: Re: Full page color HP ad forC Message-ID: <1107999725.727885.210890@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>e  ; WWW.HP.COM  then SERVERS  then "browse servers-by operating  system-Openvms" .   ! That's it.  it was right there!!!1   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 14:49:25 -0600* From: Michael Clark <MClark@Nemschoff.com> Subject: grep on openVMS?tQ Message-ID: <A2A28DB6D52E084783ACD6E6C6F5D7900274FA17@EMAILSERVER2.nemschoff.com>   > Does OpenVMS have anything similar to the grep option on *nix?        A CONFIDENTIALITY NOTE: This electronic transmission, including allML attachments, is directed in confidence solely to the person(s) to whom it isL addressed, or an authorized recipient, and may not otherwise be distributed,L copied or disclosed. The contents of the transmission may also be subject toJ intellectual property rights and all such rights are expressly claimed andG are not waived. If you have received this transmission in error, pleasefH notify the sender immediately by return electronic transmission and thenH immediately delete this transmission, including all attachments, without* copying, distributing or disclosing same.    ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 13:03:48 -0800 ) From: "Ken Robinson" <kenrbnsn@rbnsn.com>  Subject: Re: grep on openVMS?oC Message-ID: <1107983028.004509.314930@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>s   Michael Clark wrote:@ > Does OpenVMS have anything similar to the grep option on *nix?   Which version?  G On V7.3-2 (alpha), at least, you can install GNV and get the bash shellH and then use grep.  4 I believe other people have ported grep to vms also.   Ken    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 16:13:17 -0500n# From: sol gongola <sol@adldata.com>s Subject: Re: grep on openVMS?B+ Message-ID: <420A7CED.27DC5AEC@adldata.com>-   Michael Clark wrote: > @ > Does OpenVMS have anything similar to the grep option on *nix? > ( vms has the search command (HELP SEARCH)  % google for "vms freeware grep" found: F http://www.supercrawler.com/Computers/Software/File_Management/Search/- http://vms.process.com/fileserv-software.htmle1 http://web2.cnam.fr/vms/logiciel/cd_freeware.htmld' http://www.djesys.com/vms/freeware.htmli	 and more!    solB   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 13:52:17 -0800t/ From: "puckout2@yahoo.com" <puckout2@yahoo.com>t Subject: Re: grep on openVMS?kC Message-ID: <1107985937.363747.174440@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>r   the search command+  SEARCH  filespec[,...] search-string[,...]y   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 13:52:47 -0800 / From: "puckout2@yahoo.com" <puckout2@yahoo.com>c Subject: Re: grep on openVMS?rC Message-ID: <1107985967.223659.240400@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>a   the search command+  SEARCH  filespec[,...] search-string[,...]w   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 22:31:07 GMTh+ From: "Anthony Borla" <ajborla@bigpond.com>t Subject: Re: grep on openVMS?e> Message-ID: <LawOd.154180$K7.53584@news-server.bigpond.net.au>  7 "Michael Clark" <MClark@Nemschoff.com> wrote in messageaK news:A2A28DB6D52E084783ACD6E6C6F5D7900274FA17@EMAILSERVER2.nemschoff.com...a >u0 > Does OpenVMS have anything similar to the grep > option on *nix?) >t  L I'd say any operating system that *didn't* offer similar functionality would be pretty deficient.   This link might be useful:  7     http://www.mcsr.olemiss.edu/unixhelp/VMStoUNIX.htmls  C And, for future reference, the 'help' command is quite useful beingw> OpenVMS's equivalent to the *nix 'man' command. Typing one of:       help   or:o       help hints   or:-       help dcl_tipse  9 at the DCL prompt is bound to furnish useful information.s   Cheers,c  
 Anthony Borla:   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 15:30:59 -0800  From: bob@instantwhip.com4 Subject: Re: grep on openVMS? C Message-ID: <1107991859.279134.272570@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>u   $ SEARCH  - OpenVMS uses English ... unix uses words that ' first graders don't even understand ...t   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 18:02:24 -0800  From: Z <Z@no.spam>a Subject: Re: grep on openVMS?m, Message-ID: <BlzOd.42762$365.21827@fe07.lga>   bob@instantwhip.com wrote:
 > $ SEARCH/ > OpenVMS uses English ... unix uses words thati) > first graders don't even understand ...a  F *nix grep understands regular expressions, making it much more useful G than $SEARCH. I usually end up in Perl on VMS to get access to regular t expressions.   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 16:00:03 -0800c From: dennis.plucinik@gmail.com . Subject: how to turn $6 into $6000! read this!C Message-ID: <1107993603.224833.309330@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>y  E HOW TO TURN 6 BUCKS INTO 6 THOUSAND! (WORLD WIDE) WARNING: R=ADEADING  THIS WILL CHANGE YOUR LIFE!F I found this on a Bulletin board and decided to try it. A little whileC back, I was browsing through newsgroups, just like you are now, andM? came across an article similar to this that said you could makeaD thousands of dollars within weeks with only an initial investment ofE $6.00! So I thought, "Yeah right, this must be a scam", but like mostaF of us, I was curious, so I kept reading. Anyway, it said that you sendE $1.00 to each of the 6 names and addresses stated in the article. You E then place your own name and address in the bottom of the list at #6,GF and post the article in at least 200 newsgroups. (There are thousands)     No catch, that was it.    G So after thinking it over, and talking to a few people first, I thought   D about trying it. I figured: "what have I got to lose except 6 stamps5  and $6.00, right?" Then I invested the measly $6.00.p    E Well GUESS WHAT!! Within 7 days, I started getting money in the mail!a    C I was shocked! I figured it would end soon, but the money just kept C coming in. In my first week, I made about $25.00. By the end of therE second week I had made a total of over $1,000.00! In the third week Il+ had over $10,000.00 and it's still growing.o    ? This is now my fourth week and I have made a total of just over , $42,000.00 and it's still coming in rapidly.    E It's certainly worth $6.00, and 6 stamps, I have spent more than that>D on the lottery!! Let me tell you how this works and mostimportantly,C why it works. Also, make sure you print a copy of this article NOW,c9 so you can get the information off of it, as you need it.     F I promise you that if you follow the directions exactly, that you willD start making more money than you thought possible by doing something so easy!    @ Suggestion: Read this entire message carefully! (Print it out orC download it.) Follow the simple directions and watch the money come B in! It's easy. It's legal, and your investment is only $6.00 (PlusD postage) IMPORTANT: This is not a rip-off; it is not indecent; it is nott? illegal; and it is virtually no risk because it really works!!!     E If all of the following instructions are adhered to exactly, you will,A receive extraordinary dividends. PLEASE NOTE: Please follow these/
 directions@ EXACTLY, and $50,000 or more can be yours in 20 to 60 days. ThisB program remains successful because of the honesty and integrity ofF the participants. Please continue its success by carefully adhering to the instructions.     D You will now become part of the Mail Order business. Inthis businessB your product is not solid and tangible, it's a service. You are inE the business of developing Mailing Lists. Many large corporations areDA happy to pay big bucks for quality lists. However, the money madei: from the mailing lists is secondary to the income which isD made from people like you and me asking to be included in that list.    % Here are the 4 easy steps to success:e    A STEP 1: Get 6 separate pieces of paper and write the following onf9 each piece of paper "PLEASE PUT ME ON YOUR MAILING LIST!"iB Now get 6 US $1.00 bills and place ONE inside EACH of the 6 piecesF of paper so the bill will not be seen through the envelope (to preventD thievery). Next, place one paper in each of the 6 envelopes and sealB them. You should now have 6 sealed envelopes, each with a piece of6 paper stating the above phrase, your name and address, and a $1.00 bill.     C What you are doing is creating a service. THIS IS ABSOLUTELY LEGAL! A You are requesting a legitimate service and you arepaying for it!>C Like most of us I was a little skeptical and a little worried about C the legal aspects of it all. So I checked it out with the U.S. PostiC Office (1-800-725-2161) and they confirmed that it is indeed legal.(    = Mail the 6 envelopes to the following addresses: Note=AD MaketD sure you put the correct amount of postage stamps on your envelopes.A Othercountries may need more stamps so be correct on how many you  put.And,C remember your business will be running Throughout the world so when/A you start posting messages or emails to people this will bring in D thousands of dollars from all over the world. So now, you have money flowing F in from countries! That's how I became so successful in this business.    0 Mail the 6 envelopes to the following addresses:     #1) Tom Zimmerman IV 193 Yard Stn Nesquehoning, PA. 18240r     #2) B. Pratt 5535 E 100 N Knox, IN 46534     #3) Michele Tyskaa
 PO Box 765 Northport, NY 11768,     #4) David Weir
 PO Box 144 Schooleys Mt., NJ 07870o     #5) S. Nagirnyak 14139 Pine Forest Drivem #208 North Royalton, OH 44133     #6) D. Pluciniks 355 Kaymar Dr. Amherst, NY 14228-    E STEP 2:Now take the #1 name off the list that you see above, move thevC other names up (6 becomes 5, 5 becomes 4, etc...) and add YOUR NAMES as number 6 on the list.    / STEP 3: Change anything you need to, but try tomB keep this article as close to original as possible. Now, post yourD amended article to at least 200 newsgroups. (I think there are closeF to 24,000 groups) All you need is 200, but remember, the more that youC post, the more money you make! This is perfectly legal! If you havedD any doubts, refer to Title 18 Sec. 1302 & 1341 of the Postal lottery laws.-    E Keep a copy of these steps for yourself and, whenever you need money,mB you can use it again, and again. PLEASE REMEMBER that this program> remains successful because of the honesty and integrity of theD participants and by their carefully adhering to the directions. LookB at it this way, if you are a person of integrity, the program willB continue and the money that so many others have received will comeE your way. NOTE: You may want to retain every name and address sent too you,E either on a computer or hard copy and keep the notes people send you.h    E This VERIFIES that you are truly providing a service. (Also, it might-C be a good idea to wrap the $1 bill in dark paper to reduce the riskfA of mail theft.) So, as each post is downloaded and the directionsh< carefully followed, six members will be reimbursed for their
 participation 8 as a List Developer with one dollar each. Your name willD move up the list geometrically so that when your name reaches the #1> position you will be receiving thousands of dollars in CASH!!!    C What an opportunity for only $6.00 ($1.00 for each of the first sixo peopleC listed above) Send it now, add your own name to the list and you're  in business!!!    D DIRECTIONS FOR HOW TO POST TO NEWSGROUPS: STEP 1: You do not need toB re-type this entire letter to do your own posting. Simply put yourB cursor at the beginning of this letter and drag your cursor to theE bottom of this document, and select ''copy'' from the edit menu. This 8 will copy the entire letter into the computer''s memory.    F STEP 2: Open a blank ''notepad'' file and place your cursor at the topE of the blank page. From the ''edit'' menu select ''paste''. This will E paste a copy of the letter into notepad so that you can add your nameV to the list.    D STEP 3: Save your new notepad file as a text file. If you want to doD your postings in different settings, you'll always have this file to go back to..    ; STEP 4: Use Netscape or Internet explorer and try searchingpC for various newsgroups (on-line forums, message boards, chat sites, 
 discussions.)i    A STEP 5: Visit these message boards and post this article as a new4= message by highlighting the text of this letter and selectingOF paste from the edit menu. Fill in the Subject, this will be the headerC that everyone sees as they scroll through the list of postings in amA particular group, click the post message button. You're done withu your first one!t    8 Congratulations...THAT''S IT! All you have to do is jumpG to different newsgroups and post away, after you get the hang of it, itM      . will take about 30 seconds for each newsgroup!    D **REMEMBER, THE MORE NEWSGROUPS YOU POST IN, THE MORE MONEY YOU WILL. MAKE!! BUT YOU HAVE TO POST A MINIMUM OF 200**    G that''s it! You will begin receiving money from around the World withino  A days! You may eventually want to rent a P.O. Box Due to the largeH amountsn coming to you!    = P=2ES. It's only 6 bucks what u got to lose? So check it out!,   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 16:02:13 -0800e From: dennis.plucinik@gmail.com . Subject: how to turn $6 into $6000! read this!B Message-ID: <1107993733.361789.18180@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>  E HOW TO TURN 6 BUCKS INTO 6 THOUSAND! (WORLD WIDE) WARNING: R=ADEADINGo THIS WILL CHANGE YOUR LIFE!F I found this on a Bulletin board and decided to try it. A little whileC back, I was browsing through newsgroups, just like you are now, and ? came across an article similar to this that said you could makeID thousands of dollars within weeks with only an initial investment ofE $6.00! So I thought, "Yeah right, this must be a scam", but like mostQF of us, I was curious, so I kept reading. Anyway, it said that you sendE $1.00 to each of the 6 names and addresses stated in the article. YoutE then place your own name and address in the bottom of the list at #6,SF and post the article in at least 200 newsgroups. (There are thousands)     No catch, that was it.    G So after thinking it over, and talking to a few people first, I thoughtg  D about trying it. I figured: "what have I got to lose except 6 stamps5  and $6.00, right?" Then I invested the measly $6.00.h    E Well GUESS WHAT!! Within 7 days, I started getting money in the mail!.    C I was shocked! I figured it would end soon, but the money just kepteC coming in. In my first week, I made about $25.00. By the end of thenE second week I had made a total of over $1,000.00! In the third week I + had over $10,000.00 and it's still growing."    ? This is now my fourth week and I have made a total of just over , $42,000.00 and it's still coming in rapidly.    E It's certainly worth $6.00, and 6 stamps, I have spent more than that.D on the lottery!! Let me tell you how this works and mostimportantly,C why it works. Also, make sure you print a copy of this article NOW,e9 so you can get the information off of it, as you need it.f    F I promise you that if you follow the directions exactly, that you willD start making more money than you thought possible by doing something so easy!    @ Suggestion: Read this entire message carefully! (Print it out orC download it.) Follow the simple directions and watch the money comefB in! It's easy. It's legal, and your investment is only $6.00 (PlusD postage) IMPORTANT: This is not a rip-off; it is not indecent; it is notl? illegal; and it is virtually no risk because it really works!!!     E If all of the following instructions are adhered to exactly, you willtA receive extraordinary dividends. PLEASE NOTE: Please follow theses
 directions@ EXACTLY, and $50,000 or more can be yours in 20 to 60 days. ThisB program remains successful because of the honesty and integrity ofF the participants. Please continue its success by carefully adhering to the instructions.     D You will now become part of the Mail Order business. Inthis businessB your product is not solid and tangible, it's a service. You are inE the business of developing Mailing Lists. Many large corporations aretA happy to pay big bucks for quality lists. However, the money made): from the mailing lists is secondary to the income which isD made from people like you and me asking to be included in that list.    % Here are the 4 easy steps to success:     A STEP 1: Get 6 separate pieces of paper and write the following oni9 each piece of paper "PLEASE PUT ME ON YOUR MAILING LIST!"EB Now get 6 US $1.00 bills and place ONE inside EACH of the 6 piecesF of paper so the bill will not be seen through the envelope (to preventD thievery). Next, place one paper in each of the 6 envelopes and sealB them. You should now have 6 sealed envelopes, each with a piece of6 paper stating the above phrase, your name and address, and a $1.00 bill.     C What you are doing is creating a service. THIS IS ABSOLUTELY LEGAL!oA You are requesting a legitimate service and you arepaying for it!hC Like most of us I was a little skeptical and a little worried about-C the legal aspects of it all. So I checked it out with the U.S. PosteC Office (1-800-725-2161) and they confirmed that it is indeed legal.e    = Mail the 6 envelopes to the following addresses: Note=AD MakeAD sure you put the correct amount of postage stamps on your envelopes.A Othercountries may need more stamps so be correct on how many you= put.AndcC remember your business will be running Throughout the world so whenyA you start posting messages or emails to people this will bring intD thousands of dollars from all over the world. So now, you have money flowing F in from countries! That's how I became so successful in this business.    0 Mail the 6 envelopes to the following addresses:     #1) Tom Zimmerman IV 193 Yard Stc Nesquehoning, PA. 18240d     #2) B. Pratt 5535 E 100 N Knox, IN 46534     #3) Michele Tyskaa
 PO Box 765 Northport, NY 11768e     #4) David Weir
 PO Box 144 Schooleys Mt., NJ 07870b     #5) S. Nagirnyak 14139 Pine Forest Drived #208 North Royalton, OH 44133     #6) D. Plucinik  355 Kaymar Dr. Amherst, NY 14228     E STEP 2:Now take the #1 name off the list that you see above, move the C other names up (6 becomes 5, 5 becomes 4, etc...) and add YOUR NAMEi as number 6 on the list.    / STEP 3: Change anything you need to, but try toeB keep this article as close to original as possible. Now, post yourD amended article to at least 200 newsgroups. (I think there are closeF to 24,000 groups) All you need is 200, but remember, the more that youC post, the more money you make! This is perfectly legal! If you haveJD any doubts, refer to Title 18 Sec. 1302 & 1341 of the Postal lottery laws.     E Keep a copy of these steps for yourself and, whenever you need money,OB you can use it again, and again. PLEASE REMEMBER that this program> remains successful because of the honesty and integrity of theD participants and by their carefully adhering to the directions. LookB at it this way, if you are a person of integrity, the program willB continue and the money that so many others have received will comeE your way. NOTE: You may want to retain every name and address sent ton you,E either on a computer or hard copy and keep the notes people send you.     E This VERIFIES that you are truly providing a service. (Also, it might C be a good idea to wrap the $1 bill in dark paper to reduce the riskuA of mail theft.) So, as each post is downloaded and the directionse< carefully followed, six members will be reimbursed for their
 participationh8 as a List Developer with one dollar each. Your name willD move up the list geometrically so that when your name reaches the #1> position you will be receiving thousands of dollars in CASH!!!    C What an opportunity for only $6.00 ($1.00 for each of the first sixn peopleC listed above) Send it now, add your own name to the list and you'rer in business!!!    D DIRECTIONS FOR HOW TO POST TO NEWSGROUPS: STEP 1: You do not need toB re-type this entire letter to do your own posting. Simply put yourB cursor at the beginning of this letter and drag your cursor to theE bottom of this document, and select ''copy'' from the edit menu. Thisy8 will copy the entire letter into the computer''s memory.    F STEP 2: Open a blank ''notepad'' file and place your cursor at the topE of the blank page. From the ''edit'' menu select ''paste''. This willrE paste a copy of the letter into notepad so that you can add your namet to the list.    D STEP 3: Save your new notepad file as a text file. If you want to doD your postings in different settings, you'll always have this file to go back to.i    ; STEP 4: Use Netscape or Internet explorer and try searchingeC for various newsgroups (on-line forums, message boards, chat sites,r
 discussions.)>    A STEP 5: Visit these message boards and post this article as a new = message by highlighting the text of this letter and selectingrF paste from the edit menu. Fill in the Subject, this will be the headerC that everyone sees as they scroll through the list of postings in adA particular group, click the post message button. You're done with> your first one!a    8 Congratulations...THAT''S IT! All you have to do is jumpG to different newsgroups and post away, after you get the hang of it, it       . will take about 30 seconds for each newsgroup!    D **REMEMBER, THE MORE NEWSGROUPS YOU POST IN, THE MORE MONEY YOU WILL. MAKE!! BUT YOU HAVE TO POST A MINIMUM OF 200**    G that''s it! You will begin receiving money from around the World withint  A days! You may eventually want to rent a P.O. Box Due to the large> amounts  coming to you!    = P=2ES. It's only 6 bucks what u got to lose? So check it out!    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 03:56:54 +0800a From: prep@prep.synonet.com % Subject: Re: HP's Carly Fiorina firedi- Message-ID: <87fz05mrqx.fsf@prep.synonet.com>d  " VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:  r > In article <1107956773.361962.281300@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>, "Mark  Round" <mark.round@gmail.com> writes:  $ >>"ding dong, the witch is dead...."  4 > ...making room for Bob Palmer to assume the helm!    > God help us.  @ Well, there is another beancounter holding the helm. I wonder if he is bald as well....   The year of the rooster indead!b   -- y< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.9@                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 17:04:10 -0500t- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>,% Subject: Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired B Message-ID: <1107985949.6684cf41b3c70cae39ddfb132404e86f@teranews>  H Lets not forget that Carly Fiorina's picture is on this week's "Fortune"& manazine with a pretty damning title.   B One must also look into the timing of litvik's resignation and theF bringing in of Perkins on the board. That is what probably changed theD balance of power and sealed Carly's exit. So this many not be a full unified board.    H BBC World Business Report had some coverage on this.  Interesting on how! the analysts are very PC centric.p  C They did interview Carol Loomis, the author of the Fortune magazine1G damning report on Carly.  Nowhere near as damning as Gerster was in hiss, book ( i discussed this in a previous post).  F There seems to be agreement from analysts that the accountant won't be breaking up the company.    F With analysts describing HP as a printer company who got distracted byG an unprofitable PC business, it makes one wonder whether Wall Street isiE not quite happy with the fact that Carly combined the printing and PCh businesses under the same head.i    E There is one big danger with this uncertainty: If HP were to spin offaE its IA64 based businesses, it would be an easy way for HP to wash itse@ hands from its contract with Intel and any obligations to Intel.  G The IA64 business would be be free to fail without impacting HP. And ituG probably woudln't have access to the capital needeed to port VMS, HP-UX B and Tandem to 8086 or Power or even Sparc once IA64 is widthdrawn.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 17:00:31 -0500# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>h% Subject: Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired , Message-ID: <et2dnVA6l7-bFZffRVn-vw@igs.net>   JF Mezei wrote:a@ > Lets not forget that Carly Fiorina's picture is on this week's1 > "Fortune" manazine with a pretty damning title.s >aD > One must also look into the timing of litvik's resignation and theH > bringing in of Perkins on the board. That is what probably changed theF > balance of power and sealed Carly's exit. So this many not be a full > unified board. >h >eF > BBC World Business Report had some coverage on this.  Interesting on' > how the analysts are very PC centric.- >-E > They did interview Carol Loomis, the author of the Fortune magazineiE > damning report on Carly.  Nowhere near as damning as Gerster was in 2 > his book ( i discussed this in a previous post). >mH > There seems to be agreement from analysts that the accountant won't be > breaking up the company. >  >kH > With analysts describing HP as a printer company who got distracted byF > an unprofitable PC business, it makes one wonder whether Wall StreetG > is not quite happy with the fact that Carly combined the printing and $ > PC businesses under the same head. >t >aG > There is one big danger with this uncertainty: If HP were to spin offyG > its IA64 based businesses, it would be an easy way for HP to wash its B > hands from its contract with Intel and any obligations to Intel. >eF > The IA64 business would be be free to fail without impacting HP. AndF > it probably woudln't have access to the capital needeed to port VMS,> > HP-UX and Tandem to 8086 or Power or even Sparc once IA64 is
 > widthdrawn.a    1 As if senior management would really give a damn.  --- OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style.i   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 17:00:23 -0500) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca>i% Subject: Re: HP's Carly Fiorina firedn: Message-ID: <6KvOd.25229$Ub4.937306@news20.bellglobal.com>  / "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message t& news:puCdndlkQvHDpZffRVn-iA@igs.net... > Dan Allen wrote: [...snip...] >.L > Another really good one to use would be The Who's "Won't Get Fooled Again"B > - images of snake oil salesmen hawking Windows, unix , and Linux >0  I Reality check for OpenVMS folk: "Meet the new boss, same as the old boss"x  
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,@ Ontario, Canada.9 http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html h   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 17:39:29 -0500# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> % Subject: Re: HP's Carly Fiorina firedW, Message-ID: <uuSdnf7ntIO1DJffRVn-iw@igs.net>   Neil Rieck wrote:r0 > "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message( > news:puCdndlkQvHDpZffRVn-iA@igs.net... >> Dan Allen wrote:  > [...snip...] >>F >> Another really good one to use would be The Who's "Won't Get FooledD >> Again" - images of snake oil salesmen hawking Windows, unix , and >> Linux >> >hE > Reality check for OpenVMS folk: "Meet the new boss, same as the old  > boss"   G It depends if the "boss" are the 'suits' or that the o/s itself is "TheoE Boss". But given the events of today, the connotation is probably the  former.    --- OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style.w   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 18:35:09 -0500 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com>y% Subject: Re: HP's Carly Fiorina firedx0 Message-ID: <110l712s5adqdac@corp.supernews.com>    VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:r > In article <1107956773.361962.281300@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>, "Mark  Round" <mark.round@gmail.com> writes: > $ >>"ding dong, the witch is dead...." >  > 4 > ...making room for Bob Palmer to assume the helm!  >  > God help us.  ) Even He wouldn't be enough help for that!a   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 19:01:24 -0500) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca>a% Subject: Re: HP's Carly Fiorina firede: Message-ID: <AvxOd.25281$Ub4.962545@news20.bellglobal.com>  / "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> wrote in message '& news:uuSdnf7ntIO1DJffRVn-iw@igs.net... [...snip...] >>F >> Reality check for OpenVMS folk: "Meet the new boss, same as the old >> boss" > I > It depends if the "boss" are the 'suits' or that the o/s itself is "ThefG > Boss". But given the events of today, the connotation is probably the 	 > former.s >v/ > OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style.- >-  L Yup! History has shown us that it's been all down hill since Ken Olsen left C and I'm still waiting for a change in management to prove me wrong!z  M On a related note, when John Roth left Nortel after destroying it, the board >M replaced him with CFO Frank Dunn who made matters worse. I know that Carly's M? replacement is just temporary, but I'm already getting nervous.r  
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,a Ontario, Canada.9 http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html     ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 19:51:03 -0500e- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>l% Subject: Re: HP's Carly Fiorina firedyB Message-ID: <1107995955.35f74dbd4b83bb770a1d5687dc291a28@teranews>   Neil Rieck wrote:oM > Yup! History has shown us that it's been all down hill since Ken Olsen left.E > and I'm still waiting for a change in management to prove me wrong!c  D In fairness, Olsen was ousted for good reason. The DECline had begunF under his reign. I don't blame him for not going "wintel", but I blameC him for refusing to admit that Pcs were serious competition to VMS.L    N > On a related note, when John Roth left Nortel after destroying it, the boardN > replaced him with CFO Frank Dunn who made matters worse. I know that Carly'sA > replacement is just temporary, but I'm already getting nervous.c  F Sometimes, the replacement guy has no choice but be bearer of bad newsC while he discovers how much of a mess the company is in. Nortel hade: plenty of self inflicted wounds though. Much more than HP.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 20:39:38 -060072 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>% Subject: Re: HP's Carly Fiorina fired:+ Message-ID: <420AC96A.9F90E3EC@comcast.net>o   prep@prep.synonet.com wrote: > $ > VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: > t > > In article <1107956773.361962.281300@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>, "Mark  Round" <mark.round@gmail.com> writes: > & > >>"ding dong, the witch is dead...." > 5 > > ...making room for Bob Palmer to assume the helm!e >  > > God help us. > B > Well, there is another beancounter holding the helm. I wonder if > he is bald as well.... > ! > The year of the rooster indead!m   Nahh, I won't say it...h   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systemss http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:o" http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/-  " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/n   Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 20:57:16 -0600 + From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)t% Subject: Re: HP's Carly Fiorina firedm3 Message-ID: <2r5QsrMHhpac@eisner.encompasserve.org>a  f In article <AvxOd.25281$Ub4.962545@news20.bellglobal.com>, "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> writes:   > O > On a related note, when John Roth left Nortel after destroying it, the board aO > replaced him with CFO Frank Dunn who made matters worse. I know that Carly's lA > replacement is just temporary, but I'm already getting nervous.  >   > 	Yeah... what a crack-up.  All these chuckleheads going on and: 	on about how bad things are, they'd go crazy if they were
 	Nortel fans!t  4 http://www.funlol.com/funpages/investmentadvice.html  J INVESTMENT ADVICE! If you bought $1000 worth of Nortel stock one year ago, it would now be worth $49.  @ If you bought $1000 worth of Budweiser (the beer, not the stock)< one year ago, drank all the beer, and traded in the cans for' the nickel deposit, you would have $79..  ) My advice to you is to start drinking! :)u   ---y  < 	By the way, that joke is about 2 years old - so take it for@ 	what it is worth.  That was true then, certainly not true todayG 	(unless Nortel is a penny stock).  Is Nortel worth more than $3 yet?  0@ 	Worth more than Sun stock?  Now that would really be something!   				Robp   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 21:10:33 -0600-2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>% Subject: Re: HP's Carly Fiorina firedr* Message-ID: <420AD0A8.C62E712@comcast.net>   Rob Young wrote: > h > In article <AvxOd.25281$Ub4.962545@news20.bellglobal.com>, "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> writes: >  > >oP > > On a related note, when John Roth left Nortel after destroying it, the boardP > > replaced him with CFO Frank Dunn who made matters worse. I know that Carly'sC > > replacement is just temporary, but I'm already getting nervous.t > >e > G >         Yeah... what a crack-up.  All these chuckleheads going on and C >         on about how bad things are, they'd go crazy if they werea >         Nortel fans! > 6 > http://www.funlol.com/funpages/investmentadvice.html > L > INVESTMENT ADVICE! If you bought $1000 worth of Nortel stock one year ago, > it would now be worth $49. > B > If you bought $1000 worth of Budweiser (the beer, not the stock)> > one year ago, drank all the beer, and traded in the cans for) > the nickel deposit, you would have $79.n > + > My advice to you is to start drinking! :)s >  > ---0 > 4 >         By the way, that joke is about 2 years old   Oh, it's older than that!e  B Go rent "Animal House" (the scene where Otter and Bluto are trying3 comfort Flounder on the loss of his brother's car).V   -- t David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems. http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:-" http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/j  " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/-   Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 23:57:56 -0500P- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>d% Subject: Re: HP's Carly Fiorina firedrB Message-ID: <1108010796.e9837afbf5650b97fa15b071bb36d74f@teranews>  , Well worth a read: (Dow Jones Business Wire)   > http://www.nyse.com/cgi-bin/ny_news?df=NY&r=S&sym=HPQ&sl=BW-02/09-17:29-2596|ON-02/09-16:39-1010|ON-02/09-16:10-987|BW-02/09-14:48-2006|ON-02/09-13:58-913|&sp=1  G After the merger, there was alrteady discussion on replacing Curly with-? a COO. Carly has opposed this since then, and due to recent badhD financials, the board wanted to apoint a COO to supplement Carly and Carly refused.  B Now, the bad one: They *are* considering Curly (amongst others) to replace Carly.  H But on the bright side, they are also to find a COO. So they are in fact looking for 2 people.e  @ Does anyone know the email address of Patricia Dunn ? It is timeE customers warned her not to even consider Curly the liar who betrayed5F customers and caused customers to distrust the owner of VMS as well as the downfall of Compaq.s   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 20:15:39 -0600l+ From: young_r@encompasserve.org (Rob Young)g6 Subject: Re: Is $3 million really so much to spend....3 Message-ID: <CH8GALwRFmBF@eisner.encompasserve.org>t  w In article <q_iOd.68235$K72.8342776@twister.southeast.rr.com>, "Kenneth Farmer" <kfarmer@NOSPAM.spyderbyte.com> writes:w   > 3 > How may people watch the Superbowl?  60 million?    . http://www.superbowl.com/features/general_info  M Super Bowl XXXVIII TV audience: Last year's game was the most watched programpO ever with 144.4 million viewers. The 10 most-watched programs in TV history are  all Super Bowls.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 22:40:53 -0500# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>n6 Subject: Re: Is $3 million really so much to spend...., Message-ID: <QN6dnYe-xOpRSpffRVn-3w@igs.net>   Rob Young wrote:@ > In article <q_iOd.68235$K72.8342776@twister.southeast.rr.com>,: > "Kenneth Farmer" <kfarmer@NOSPAM.spyderbyte.com> writes: >i >>3 >> How may people watch the Superbowl?  60 million?. > 0 > http://www.superbowl.com/features/general_info > G > Super Bowl XXXVIII TV audience: Last year's game was the most watchedm	 > programDE > ever with 144.4 million viewers. The 10 most-watched programs in TVE
 > history are  > all Super Bowls.    G And Rob thinks it's irrelevant to reach the owners of the 500+ employeen- business who watch the Stupid Bowl about VMS.o  K Ask just about any advertising agency worth its salt and they'll have reamslL of stats and probabilites about what percentage of red-headed IT managers ofJ Scottish origin (or any other group in the USA you care to ask them about)B watch the program and what sort of purchasing authority they have.    L I was out driving the other night and came home via a different route than IJ normally use. Within 1 mile of my house I saw 3 full-size billboards (whatK are they...20' x 60' or something like that) advertising Aston Martin cars.,D The cars cost something in the $200k-$400k range, or ballpark like a middling Alphaserver.a  H The Aston is going to be a depreciating asset (at least in the first fewK years of its life - assuming it isn't totalled), just like the Alphaserver.wF So basically the car will look pretty but make the guy who's company'sL profits afforded him the luxury of being able to buy one absolutely nothing,L whereas if he bought an Alpha/VMS box he might save his company the price of the system over a couple years.   1 The guy knows about Astons but nothing about VMS.tJ The local dealer will advertise and trade off the product image from otherL markets and sell 20-30 of them a year - I doubt HP sells that many Alphas of any size in my market annually.$   --- OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style.d   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 15:48:00 -0500n- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>r1 Subject: Re: Loads of DS10L 466 in stock for $250eB Message-ID: <1107981382.de523781a300d6649a901bd97d4bb18a@teranews>   Malcolm Dunnett wrote:  sF >     Does anyone really try to do real business via the postal system > anymore? How quaint :-)a  F When having things delivered from the USA to Canada, the postal systemC is usually the best way to ensure you avoid the PPB Highway Robberyh customs brokers used by UPS.  C I've had "Sorry sir, we don't deal with the US Postal Service, onlyW UPS". H to which I respond: "You mean, the USPS doesn't ever deliver any mail toI your address and you never ever send any documents by regular mail ?????"   9 UPS ground doesn't take much less time than regular mail.   G (Beware though: the USPS equivalent of priority post arrives via a realoF "courrier" and they use PBB Highway Robbery customs brokers). You need) to really specify regular postal service.n   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 16:05:55 -0600i4 From: kuhrt@nospammy.encompasserve.org (Marty Kuhrt)1 Subject: Re: Loads of DS10L 466 in stock for $250 3 Message-ID: <e0ItEfIjstju@eisner.encompasserve.org>l  c In article <3MAXX9iUUYzT@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes:0i > In article <cud8d6$buo$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk>, Chris Sharman <chris.sharman@sorry.nospam> writes:t0 >> David Turner, Island Computers US Corp wrote: >> c@ >>> Sent an email to you Chris - I need a configuration request. >>> Then I can quote >> nG >> Thanks for the quote - it seems spamfilters are now having to be so iF >> aggressive that legitimate email struggles to get through when not G >> whitelisted. I'm the same - the filters are good, but the volume of n@ >> 'maybe spam' is now so great that I miss real mail sometimes. > C > Email is your only choice - we tried to order by mail from Island F > based on their web site.  FIVE WEEKS later (after repeated followupsD > when no confirmation was received) they rejected our order, sayingE > they could not fill it (but giving no details) indicating they willE > not deal by mail.   2 I've ordered by phone without problem in the past.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 17:10:21 -0500# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>d Subject: One heck of a quote, Message-ID: <6aqdnVLAXbLFF5ffRVn-qQ@igs.net>  J "They spent $24 billion in HP stock buying Compaq, and they probably couldL have wired $24 billion directly to the bottom of the ocean and been in about as good shape as they are now,"t  # Do you think the guy's opinionated?tJ If I had said it in here, all the HP apologists would be down my throat in an instant.h  H It would be interesting to tally up all the profits generated by all theF pieces of Compaq that were kept in the merger (PC's, iPaq, Tru64, VMS,I Alphaservers, Tandem stuff) for all 3 years since the merger and see whattK the total is, and then look at that total profit less the percentage of alleK the costs associated with plant closings, layoff costs, etc... attributable D to former Compaq staff and facilities.    I'll bet it's pretty ugly.     ---f- OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style.    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 17:30:15 -0500n- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>   Subject: Re: One heck of a quoteB Message-ID: <1107987513.3269535ff6abd27f4b1e20d9b7877bd6@teranews>   John Smith wrote:4 > L > "They spent $24 billion in HP stock buying Compaq, and they probably couldN > have wired $24 billion directly to the bottom of the ocean and been in about! > as good shape as they are now,"    Subject:  Elephants can danceD'  Date:  Mon, 07 Feb 2005 17:18:33 -0500k/  From:  JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>v  Organization:  Relative   Newsgroups:   comp.os.vms.        I Just (finally) read Lou Gerstner's "Who says Elephants can't dance" book.d  C It was written circa 2002. (so Gerstner was fully aware of what waso  going on betwene HP and Compaq).  # Gerstner got in IBM  in April 1993.a  O In page 221 of the paperback, there is a most interesting section on takeovers.o  ? "We need to grow, so let's go acquire somebody" .... "This is a H contagious disease that infects too many executives. When given a choice@ of working hard to fix a base business or, instead, completing aG glamorous acquisition and crowing about its promise on the financial TVp2 stations, too many executives opt for the latter."    ? "A partial list of companies that were propopsed as acquisitionhH candidates include: MCI, Nortel, Compaq, SGI and Novell <...> InvestmentD bankers with thick blue books were alwasy ready to describe a yellowF brick road leading to the wonderful city of Oz. NOT ONE OF THESE DEALS WOULD HAVE WORKED.    E "I could tell a lot of investment-banker stories, but perhaps the onehG that stands out in my mind the most was the proposal from one bank thata IBM acquire Compaq Computer."i  G Gertsner then goes on showing how the investment bankers showed glowingoC success for IBM buying Compaq, but when Gertner looks into the finemH print, he realised that such a transaction would wipe out 5 years of IBMP profits (roughly $50 billion) and IBM would show huge losses during that period.  H When the banker was questioned the response was "Oh, investors would all, see right through this, it wouldn't matter".   ------  C What this tells me is that Capellas had been actively looking for a F buyer. There is no specific time mentioned for this story. But it doesE show that it wasn't people interested in buying Compaq, it was Compaqu7 hiring bankers to find anyone gullibe enough to buy it.f  D The timing of bank pitching Compaq to IBM would be most interesting.G Alpha had no value to HP. But would have had value to IBM. (perhaps notoB the chip itself, but the engineers and the intellectual property).D Perhaps Curly didn't kill alpha because it may have been of value toH some suitors such as IBM, but when time ran out and HP became the chosen8 suitor, then Curly killed Alpha and donated it to Intel.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 21:22:52 -0500g- From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network>s. Subject: Re: OT- Like IBM stock when it was $11 Message-ID: <7fWdncgswb7gWJffRVn-tA@adelphia.com>u   Larry Kilgallen wrote:_ > In article <1107859202.117805.75950@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, univms@bigfoot.com writes:  > * >>Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com    D For stock promotions enforcement(at)sec.gov is also interested, and * apparently someone actually is reading it.  T http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/businesstechnology/2002174701_courtside09.html   -Johnt wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Onlyr   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 20:21:15 -0600d2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>> Subject: Re: REBOOT or SHUTDOWN, how to tell in SYSSHUTDWN.COM+ Message-ID: <420AC51A.AA0B5EE5@comcast.net>O   Roy Omond wrote: >  > Jilly wrote: > J > > FYI I will log an enhancement request that SYSHUTDWN.COM be passed the > > SHUTDOWN.COM parameters. > >t > > David J Dachtera wrote:l > >n > >r > >>Beach Runner wrote:  > >> > >>>[snip]oB > >>>Just run the procedure shutdown.com and you have all control. > >>I > >>Not quite: SHUTDOWN(.COM) (apparently - haven't researched it myself)eJ > >>doesn't pass anything to SYSHUTDWN.COM to indicate the difference he's2 > >>looking for. See earlier posts in this thread. > ? > Hmmm... here's a thought.  This relies on DCL symbol scoping.  > . > When SYSHUTDWN.COM gets invoked, if it does: >  >         $ delete/symbol P1 >         .d >         .  >         $ delete/symbol P8 > A > Thereafter, P1 to P8 will be the ones belonging to the invokinga0 > procedure, which in this case is SHUTDOWN.COM. >  > Et voila !  * Just tried that on my little alpha here...   DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ ty com1.com $ @com2s $ exit DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ ty com2.com $ delete/symbol p1 $ delete/symbol p2 $ delete/symbol p3 $ delete/symbol p4 $ delete/symbol p5 $ delete/symbol p6 $ delete/symbol p7 $ delete/symbol p8 $!# $ write sys$output "P1 = ""''p1'"""a# $ write sys$output "P2 = ""''p2'"""a# $ write sys$output "P3 = ""''p3'"""d# $ write sys$output "P4 = ""''p4'"""o# $ write sys$output "P5 = ""''p5'"""t# $ write sys$output "P6 = ""''p6'"""b# $ write sys$output "P7 = ""''p7'"""I# $ write sys$output "P8 = ""''p8'""". $ exit( DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ @com1 a b c d e f g h P1 = "A" P2 = "B" P3 = "C" P4 = "D" P5 = "E" P6 = "F" P7 = "G" P8 = "H" DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ d   Well, shut my mouth WIDE open!   -- p David J Dachtera dba DJE Systemsm http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:o" http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/e  " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/i   Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 14:06:53 -0500i- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>o? Subject: Re: REBOOT or SHUTDOWN, how to tell in SYSSHUTDWN.COM\tB Message-ID: <1107975325.a9eb1f0736b448d3604bf3d34d571021@teranews>   > Jilly wrote:J > > FYI I will log an enhancement request that SYSHUTDWN.COM be passed the > > SHUTDOWN.COM parameters.  H But when you involke shutdown interactively and answer the prompts, doesC this result in the same symbols being set (P1 to Px) ? Or are therem internal symbols being set ?   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 16:28:50 -0600 - From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) ? Subject: Re: REBOOT or SHUTDOWN, how to tell in SYSSHUTDWN.COM\ 3 Message-ID: <6boyF4HPhxaY@eisner.encompasserve.org>t  \ In article <05020912160236@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>, brandon@dalsemi.com (John Brandon) writes: > Jilly wrote:I >> FYI I will log an enhancement request that SYSHUTDWN.COM be passed thec >> SHUTDOWN.COM parameters.  >  > I like that. >  > Kilgallen wrote:@ >> I think it should be the _resultant_ parameters (as passed to@ >> OPCCRASH.EXE) after defaulting has been applied.  Reinventing, >> the defaulting at each site would be bad. > ? > Either way.  Not sure why it would be bad - please elaborate?s  ? Everybody implements their own defaulting that a blank Pn meansl< "with whipped cream" and then VMS changes it so that Pn of a= single space means "with sugar-free whipped cream".  Everyonea4 will have to notice and update their own defaulting.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 21:03:08 -0600i2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>? Subject: Re: REBOOT or SHUTDOWN, how to tell in SYSSHUTDWN.COM\O+ Message-ID: <420ACEEC.E35B7B51@comcast.net>h   JF Mezei wrote:s >  > > Jilly wrote:L > > > FYI I will log an enhancement request that SYSHUTDWN.COM be passed the > > > SHUTDOWN.COM parameters. > J > But when you involke shutdown interactively and answer the prompts, doesE > this result in the same symbols being set (P1 to Px) ? Or are therei > internal symbols being set ?  E It looks like it's been "DCL-Dieted", but it's not wholly unreadable.t Check it out, I did.   -- i David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:." http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/l  " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/a   Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 04:11:05 +0800w From: prep@prep.synonet.com * Subject: Re: Serving a different boot disk- Message-ID: <877jlhmr3a.fsf@prep.synonet.com>d  4 "Stanley F. Quayle" <squayle@insight.rr.com> writes:  $ > But when I attempt to boot, I get:  > >     %%%%%%%%%%%  OPCOM   8-FEB-2005 17:22:45.11  %%%%%%%%%%%( >     Message from user DECNET on SIMH55/ >     DECnet event 0.7, aborted service requestA7 >     From node 1.400 (SIMH55),  8-FEB-2005 17:22:45.09 @ >     Circuit QNA-0, Line open error, File open error, Load file> >     %LAA-F-RMTNOTCLS, remote node is not a VAXcluster memberA >     Node = 1.499 (OFFICE), Ethernet address = 08-00-2B-2A-22-F8   A > It's not in the cluster.  Of course, it doesn't boot, either...w  B I HAS booted, and loaded LAA as well. LAA loooked at the world and told you it sucks...  B The load parameter you pass is the local root that THAT node sees,B from that node, not from the boot server. LAA uses MSCP btw so you6 have to have an MSCP server or a local attacked drive.   -- l< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.h@                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 23:15:08 GMTa  From: CJT <abujlehc@prodigy.net>- Subject: So how big a parachute did she have?h* Message-ID: <420A997C.6080909@prodigy.net>  1 You can round to the nearest million if you like.    -- gD The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt toC minimize spam.  Our true address is of the form che...@prodigy.net.    ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 15:31:27 -0800p  From: "mas" <mas769@hotmail.com>1 Subject: Re: So how big a parachute did she have? C Message-ID: <1107991887.590340.274150@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>e  + $21 million. Made for the rest of her life.n  B Even she would have trouble spending that on hairdos and such ;-).  J http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml?type=businessNews&storyID=7585388    
 CJT wrote:3 > You can round to the nearest million if you like.  >c > --F > The e-mail address in our reply-to line is reversed in an attempt toE > minimize spam.  Our true address is of the form che...@prodigy.net.    ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 21:17:44 -0600y4 From: kaplow_r@encompasserve.org.TRABoD (Bob Kaplow)1 Subject: Re: So how big a parachute did she have? 3 Message-ID: <h1abcCXZOLiA@eisner.encompasserve.org>   f In article <1107991887.590340.274150@c13g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>, "mas" <mas769@hotmail.com> writes:- > $21 million. Made for the rest of her life.p  J It should be no more than what the lowest paid recently laid off HP worker got.    1 	Bob Kaplow	NAR # 18L	TRA # "Impeach the TRA BoD"p& 		>>> To reply, remove the TRABoD! <<<K Kaplow Klips & Baffle:	http://nira-rocketry.org/LeadingEdge/Phantom4000.pdf L     www.encompasserve.org/~kaplow_r/    www.nira-rocketry.org    www.nar.org  H         It had become an universal and almost uncontroverted position inG         the several States, that the purposes of society do not requireeE         a surrender of all our rights to our ordinary governors; thatoH         there are certain portions of right not necessary to enable themE         to carry on an effective government, and which experience hashF         nevertheless proved they will be constantly encroaching on, ifC         submitted to them; that there are also certain fences whichhG         experience has proved peculiarly efficacious against wrong, and.H         rarely obstructive of right, which yet the governing powers haveC         ever shown a disposition to weaken and remove. Of the firstrH         kind, for instance, is freedom of religion; of the second, trialF         by jury, habeas corpus laws, free presses. -- Thomas Jefferson   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 21:42:38 -0500 % From: Howard Shubs <howard@shubs.net>u# Subject: Re: VAX 4000 m500A problem ; Message-ID: <howard-62162F.21423809022005@news.newsguy.com>   E In article <ToKdndkrytznmpffRVn-sw@rcn.net>, jmfbahciv@aol.com wrote:c  = > Why don't you wait until you get everything you need?  Then ( > pick the word you used the most often.   I should name a VAX "THE"?   -- r Nobody knows Particle Man.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 14:10:32 -0500n- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>g$ Subject: Re: VMS in medical businessB Message-ID: <1107975542.6d2906ae494871000b4279f4dbc4c7ad@teranews>   "Main, Kerry" wrote:  l? > Ayup .. Check out the following for some sample testimonials:h0 > http://h71000.www7.hp.com/success-stories.html    9 How does one get from the www.hp.com to the above link ?    E If ones gets to the vertical industry pages and you select "medical",5E does it bring you to the VMS page ? (last I had checked it didn't, it ! may have changed since Jan 18th).0  G My point remains: HP sent out a pre ss release where they had a perfectt@ opportunity to mention VMS since medical stuff is one of the fewG remaining market niches for VMS. They didn't. The VMS management should0B go to the person who write the PR and mention that next time, theyE should include VMS in medical, telecom etc press releases. It doesn't. cost anything or any budget.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 14:17:05 -0500# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>y$ Subject: Re: VMS in medical business, Message-ID: <8PCdnXCPTbEl_JffRVn-rg@igs.net>   JF Mezei wrote:P > "Main, Kerry" wrote: >s@ >> Ayup .. Check out the following for some sample testimonials:1 >> http://h71000.www7.hp.com/success-stories.html  >  >l: > How does one get from the www.hp.com to the above link ? >wG > If ones gets to the vertical industry pages and you select "medical",tG > does it bring you to the VMS page ? (last I had checked it didn't, itr# > may have changed since Jan 18th).o >(A > My point remains: HP sent out a pre ss release where they had anF > perfect opportunity to mention VMS since medical stuff is one of theF > few remaining market niches for VMS. They didn't. The VMS managementF > should go to the person who write the PR and mention that next time,D > they should include VMS in medical, telecom etc press releases. It& > doesn't cost anything or any budget.    0 Repeat after me....HP doesn't THINK -- IBM does.   --- OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 15:46:56 -0500' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>A$ Subject: RE: VMS in medical businessR Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB53F220@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----9 > From: JF Mezei [mailto:jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com]=20-  > Sent: February 9, 2005 2:11 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com-& > Subject: Re: VMS in medical business >=20 > "Main, Kerry" wrote: > =20iA > > Ayup .. Check out the following for some sample testimonials:e2 > > http://h71000.www7.hp.com/success-stories.html >=20 >=20= > How does one get from the www.hp.com to the above link ?=20  >=20G > If ones gets to the vertical industry pages and you select "medical",iG > does it bring you to the VMS page ? (last I had checked it didn't, itf# > may have changed since Jan 18th).i >=20B > My point remains: HP sent out a pre ss release where they had=20 > a perfectvB > opportunity to mention VMS since medical stuff is one of the few: > remaining market niches for VMS. They didn't. The VMS=20 > management should D > go to the person who write the PR and mention that next time, theyG > should include VMS in medical, telecom etc press releases. It doesn'to > cost anything or any budget. >e  C Conversely, are you saying that anytime HP releases something abouttD OpenVMS, it should state that "this compliments our existing Windows7 x86, HP-UX, NSK, and Linux offerings in this space?"=20e  G Hey, I am all for improving marketing, but this was clearly an x86 win. G If the Customer wants an x86 solution and feels that it will meet their C requirements, whether or not I would propose something different isnE irrelevant. I am just glad it was won by HP and not IBM, who no doubtnG were pitching their x86 platform equivalents as well - even though theyo* have alternate platform offerings as well.   Regardsp  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultanth HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660n Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  $ "OpenVMS has always had integrity .. Now, Integrity has OpenVMS .."   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 15:34:42 -0800a From: bob@instantwhip.com3$ Subject: Re: VMS in medical businessB Message-ID: <1107992082.176371.65620@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>  F no, they don't have alternative platforms ... everyone is offering the sameE thing ... windoze/unix/linux garbage!  OpenVMS is a unique OS that isrC being poorly managed, marketed ... the only advantage IBM has right G now over vms is marketing ... to believe otherwise makes you a fool ...W, I have been on both by the way so I know ...   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Feb 2005 16:01:28 -0800R From: bob@instantwhip.comm$ Subject: Re: VMS in medical businessC Message-ID: <1107992097.261527.240420@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>-  F no, they don't have alternative platforms ... everyone is offering the sameE thing ... windoze/unix/linux garbage!  OpenVMS is a unique OS that is7C being poorly managed, marketed ... the only advantage IBM has rightyG now over vms is marketing ... to believe otherwise makes you a fool ...D, I have been on both by the way so I know ...   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 9 Feb 2005 19:34:32 -0500# From: "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com>g$ Subject: Re: VMS in medical business, Message-ID: <vs6dnWh3YbrUMZffRVn-iw@igs.net>   bob@instantwhip.com wrote:H > no, they don't have alternative platforms ... everyone is offering the > sameG > thing ... windoze/unix/linux garbage!  OpenVMS is a unique OS that is E > being poorly managed, marketed ... the only advantage IBM has right- > now over vms is marketing ...     $ IBM has *always* had that advantage.F Back in the 80's, the standing wry comment was that if IBM owned DEC'sI product portfolio, or if DEC had IBM's marketing, either way one would be. absolutely untouchable.<     ---3- OpenVMS - The classics never go out of style.M   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2005 20:37:30 -0600d2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>$ Subject: Re: VMS in medical business+ Message-ID: <420AC8EA.ECFD5779@comcast.net>a   "Main, Kerry" wrote: > [snip]I > Hey, I am all for improving marketing, but this was clearly an x86 win.tI > If the Customer wants an x86 solution and feels that it will meet theirUE > requirements, whether or not I would propose something different is 
 > irrelevant.e   Well, yes and no.n  > If you can get your margins on the Wintel kit, then go for it.  A If the customer is sensitive about downtime, security, and so on, C suggesting an alternative only costs you a few minutes or less in aBD presentation. If they don't bite, you lost nothing, and maybe earnedF alittle extra something for demonstarting concern for the customer and? their business. If they do biet, you've opened a door you mightl$ otherwise have passed up altogether.  > As you and countless others have said, "there is a lot more toA 'marketing' than just advertising"! Salesmanship goes a long way.w  ; > I am just glad it was won by HP and not IBM, who no doubtMI > were pitching their x86 platform equivalents as well - even though theyR, > have alternate platform offerings as well.  C Again, if Wintel kit brings in the margins, that's the bottom line,  right?   ...or is it?   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems0 http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:'" http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/n   Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2005 03:49:52 +0800e From: prep@prep.synonet.com 5 Subject: Re: Why aren't more universities doing this?b- Message-ID: <87k6phms2n.fsf@prep.synonet.com>e  % "John Smith" <a@nonymous.com> writes:l  B > Got any big open source Cobol or open source PL/1 apps that needC > porting to VMS in mind? Then Bill could get a free Itanic for hist1 > school by getting those ported and web enabled.a  9 What is REX written in? Object REX is on SourceForge btw.s   -- i< Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda.i@                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2005.081 ************************