1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 09 Jun 2005	Volume 2005 : Issue 320       Contents:
 Re: a sad day 
 Re: a sad day 
 Re: a sad day 
 Re: a sad day 
 Re: a sad day 
 Re: a sad day  FS : Electrical Components$ Re: Industry standard is ridiculous!$ Re: Industry standard is ridiculous!$ Re: Industry standard is ridiculous!$ RE: Industry standard is ridiculous!3 Re: Intel neuters Montvale, Itanic screams in alarm 3 Re: Intel neuters Montvale, Itanic screams in alarm 0 Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)0 RE: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)0 Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)0 RE: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)0 RE: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)0 RE: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)0 RE: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)0 Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)0 Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!). Re: OpenVMS BootCamp (anonymous) pixes - Day 3$ Re: Possible to top FTP "cd" command" TCPIP 5.0 SLIP transplant to 5.3 ? Re: vms and linux  Re: vms and linux   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 06:36:11 GMT + From: LESLIE@JRLVAX.HOUSTON.RR.COM (leslie)  Subject: Re: a sad day7 Message-ID: <vrRpe.31230$PR6.2521@tornado.texas.rr.com>    Z (Z@no.spam) wrote: : J : We in the USA certainly could lower our overall health care costs if we F : had more rationing and longer waiting lists for services, like some J : other nations with more "progressive" and "equitable" health care plans. :   D Globalization could lower health costs, if the savings are passed onC to the end users, by using overseas pathologists, radiologists, and 3 sending patients overseas, aka "medical tourism"...   E    http://www.hindustantimes.com/2004/Aug/10/5983_939559,00430005.htm J    India to be outsourcing hub for pathological tests : HindustanTimes.com  5   "India to be outsourcing hub for pathological tests     Indo-Asian News Service    New Delhi, August 10   H    A vast base of inexpensive professionals, latest equipment, IT skillsI    and a focus on quality may turn India into a preferred destination for "    pathological tests outsourcing.  C    After carving out a niche for itself in the global market as the E    electronic housekeeper to the world, one of Asia's fastest growing C    economies plans to strike it big in the medical test outsourcing 8    business, with clients in the Middle East and Europe.  F    According to industry representatives, hospitals in the Middle EastB    and London are increasingly shipping blood samples to India forF    various pathological tests to cut costs and clear the huge backlog.  	    [snip]   I    Industry officials say most leading pathological centres in India were ?    going for international quality accreditation to enhance the E    "confidence level" among their existing and prospective customers.   E    Singh of SRL Ranbaxy said the College of American Pathologists had C    accredited his laboratories for conducting high-end pathological 	    tests.   F    "Outsourcing of pathological tests is different from outsourcing ofI    other services because we deal with human lives. So there can't be any -    compromise on the quality front," he said.   E    "Many laboratories in India are following protocols and procedures H    that are of international standards. Overseas hospital chains are now!    beginning to acknowledge this.   B    "This has resulted in many of them exploring the possibility ofF    sending samples to India. Many Indian laboratories are in the trial    mode these days..."    N   http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/nationworld/2002069711_indiamed23.html;   India's low price, high-tech care draw "medical tourists"   8   "Friday, October 22, 2004 - Page updated at 12:00 A.M.  <    India's low price, high-tech care draw "medical tourists"      By John Lancaster    The Washington Post  H    Last month, Howard Staab, who had a life-threatening heart condition,F    flew to India from North Carolina with his partner, Maggi Grace, so*    surgeons could replace his heart valve.  D    NEW DELHI -- Three months ago, Howard Staab, 53, learned he had aH    life-threatening heart condition and would have to undergo surgery atE    a cost of up to $200,000, an impossible sum for the carpenter from G    Durham, N.C., who has no health insurance. So, he outsourced the job     to India.  E    Taking his cue from cost-cutting U.S. businesses, Staab last month D    flew about 7,500 miles to New Delhi, where doctors at the EscortsH    Heart Institute & Research Centre replaced his balky heart valve withA    one harvested from a pig. Total bill: about $10,000, including ?    round-trip airfare and a planned side trip to the Taj Mahal.   I    "The Indian doctors, they did such a fine job here and took care of us F    so well," said Staab, a bicycling enthusiast who was accompanied to%    India by his partner, Maggi Grace.   I    Staab is one of a growing number of people known as "medical tourists" E    who are traveling to India in search of First World health care at H    Third World prices. Last year, about 150,000 foreigners visited IndiaC    for medical procedures, and the number is increasing at about 15 G    percent a year, said Zakariah Ahmed, a health-care specialist at the )    Confederation of Indian Industries..."   I    Eager to cash in on the trend, posh private hospitals are beginning to H    offer services tailored for foreign patients, such as airport pickup,F    Internet-equipped private rooms and package deals that combine, forC    example, tummy-tuck surgery with several nights in a maharajah's E    palace. Some hospitals are pushing treatment regimens that augment D    standard medicine with yoga and other forms of traditional Indian    healing.   C    The phenomenon is another example of how India is profiting from I    globalization -- the growing integration of world economies -- just as D    it has in such other service industries as insurance and banking,D    which are outsourcing a growing assortment of office tasks to theD    country. A recent study by the McKinsey consulting firm estimatedE    India's medical-tourist industry could yield up to $2.2 billion in     annual revenue by 2012.  F    "If we do this right, we can heal the world," said Prathap Reddy, aD    physician who founded Apollo Hospitals, a 6,400-bed chain that isI    headquartered in the coastal city of Chennai and is one of the biggest )    private health-care providers in Asia.       Robotic surgery    E    The trend is in its early stages. Most foreigners treated in India E    come from other developing countries in Asia, Africa or the Middle G    East, where top-quality hospitals and health professionals are often     hard to find.  I    Patients from the United States and Europe are relatively rare because <    of the distance they must travel and, hospital executivesC    acknowledged, because India continues to suffer from an image of     poverty and poor hygiene.  H    As a whole, India's health-care system is hardly a model, with barelyG    four doctors for every 10,000 people, compared with 27 in the United D    States, according to the World Bank. Health care accounts for 5.1H    percent of India's gross domestic product compared with 14 percent in    the United States.   G    On the other hand, India offers a growing number of private "centers F    of excellence," where the quality of care is as good or better thanI    that of big-city hospitals in the United States or Europe, said Naresh F    Trehan, a cardiovascular surgeon who runs Escorts and performed the    operation on Staab.  D    Trehan said, for example, that the death rate for coronary-bypassG    patients at Escorts is 0.8 percent. By contrast, the 1999 death rate I    for the same procedure at New York-Presbyterian Hospital, where former E    President Bill Clinton recently underwent bypass surgery, was 2.35 B    percent, according to a 2002 study by the New York State Health    Department..."     I An acquaintance recently went home to the Philippines to see her daughter E graduate from college and get dental work done at ~10% of the cost in  the U.S.     --Jerry Leslie9   Note: leslie@jrlvax.houston.rr.com is invalid for email    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 03:41:07 -0400 ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> Subject: Re: a sad day= Message-ID: <1NWdnatEycwIbzrfRVn-ig@metrocastcablevision.com>    Rob Young wrote:n > In article <7JUN05.10250562@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu>, karcher@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu (Carl Karcher) writes: >  > H >>While you pay little or no tax on the the first few K of income, thoseD >>with large incomes, particularly from non-wages (investments), canI >>afford to hire lawyers and tax consultants to make use of countless tax C >>shelters and legal loopholes to greatly reduce and even eliminate D >>their taxes. As your non-wage income goes up your chances of being >>audited go down in the US. >> >  > 
 > 	Mythology.   F No, Rob:  just the kind of truth that you try to spin away, as usual. = Let's look as what kind of tripe you've offered up this time:   +    How about that bastion of liberalism the  > 	New York Times as a source,  B If you believe that the NYT resembles anything like a 'bastion of H liberalism' any more, you must have missed their aggressive support for I the myths Dubya & Co. were propounding with regard to the need to invade  D Iraq a while ago (the NYT actually publicly apologized recently for I their flag-waving myopia and flagrant lack of objective scrutiny in this  H area, though AFAIK blatant cheerleaders like Judith Miller are still on  their payroll).   C The American media, with no major exceptions (though real and even  I fairly objective news does manage to sneak through many major outlets on  D an unpredictable basis) are solidly in the pockets of their fat-cat H owners and/or shaking in their Guccis over what might happen to them if A they actually report things in an aggressive and unbiased manner.      citing the CBO:  > Q > "Fully one-third of President Bush's tax cuts in the last three years have gone P > to people with the top 1% of income who have earned an average of $1.2 millionK > annually, according to a report by the CBO to be published today. The new Q > estimates confirm what independent tax analysts have long said, that Mr. Bush's E > tax cuts have been heavily skewed to the very wealthiest taxpayers.    So, far, so good.       Those areK > the people, however, who pay a disproportionate share of federal taxes."    E Well, yuh:  that's what a progressive tax system *does*:  instead of  I taxing at a flat rate, the rate is *supposed* to increase with increased  9 income, so that higher incomes are *by definition* taxed  G 'disproportionately' - and in any tax system really worthy of the name  / 'progressive', quite disproportionately indeed.    > K > "The tax cuts of 2001 and 2003 reduced tax rates for people in all income O > brackets but they had a disproportionate effect on people at the very highest O > levels because they had already been paying a disproportionate share of total  > federal taxes   H And that is where whatever 'logic' this article might have pretended to ? completely falls apart.  Because since a progressive system is  G *supposed* to tax higher incomes disproportionately, there's no reason  B whatsoever to reduce the degree of this disproportionality simply + because tax rates as a whole are decreased.   H But reduce the *degree* of disproportionality is precisely what Dubya's : cuts did, bringing us closer to that Forbes favorite, the " not-progressive-at-all 'flat tax'.  @ > and in part because stock dividends get a special lower rate."   Hold this thought for later.   >  > ( > 	Also - from another great source  :-)  9 I'll just bet:  this one is worded very carefully indeed.    > O > The CBO analysis, Effective Tax Rates Under Law, 2001 to 2014, shows that the O > income tax remains highly progressive, the top 5% of earners paying more than # > half of all federal income taxes.    Well, let's examine that first.   H If the top 5% of earners earned more than half the total earned income, D then the system as described would not be progressive *at all*:  it F would be flat-tax-caliber or possibly worse.  And while I don't think H things have gotten *quite* that bad yet, the raw statistic quoted above I clearly says nothing about just *how* progressive the income tax is (and  0 likely suggests that it's not very progressive).  H It is also instructive to compare this statistic (that the top 5% still D pay over half the total taxes under Bush's tax cuts) to the earlier C statement that a full 1/3 of the cuts went to just the top 1%.  It  F emphasizes what you're attempting to dispute:  that Dubya's cuts were E *heavily* slanted toward the *very wealthy* - the people by far most  C able to pay their not-all-that-disproportionate share (at least by  H historical standards:  I can remember a time when the top marginal U.S. F tax rate was a full 70%, and by George we not only managed to survive > that period but positively thrived during it) got the biggest I disproportional amount whacked off it, while the middle class, including  I people who compared with us might well be considered fairly wealthy, got  # to take up the slack that was left.   -   As a result of the tax cuts since 2001, all N > taxpayers face lower effective federal income tax rates than they would haveO > without the tax cuts. While many characterize the CBO report as evidence that O > the tax cuts shifted the burden of taxation to the middle class, the CBO data O > show precisely the opposite effect. The tax cuts actually made the tax system P > more progressive. The highest 20% of earners now pay a larger share of federal: > income taxes than they would have without the tax cuts.   E "The highest 20% of earners" is the gotcha here, because, of course,  C earned income is a relatively small portion of what the wealthiest  I people in this country get taxed upon.  Or, to put it more plainly, 'the  I highest 20% of earners' does not overlap anywhere nearly completely with  I 'the 20% with the highest total income' - and since 1/3 of the Bush cuts  B went to those with the top *1%* of income, you'd need very nearly E complete overlap indeed to make anything like the point that's being  	 promoted.   H As the NYT noted above, unearned income (such as dividends, plus IIRC a E significant cut in capital gains taxation) was a major factor in the  D Bush tax cut regime.  So rather than prove what it purports to, the C above actually substantiates what it purports to refute:  *the tax  > burden shifted from unearned to earned income, and the former C characterizes the highest incomes in this country while the latter  * characterizes income in the middle class*.  I Furthermore, the population selected for this comparison is significant.  G   'The middle class' extends *far* beyond the lowest 80% of incomes in  I this country, and by including a very substantial amount of middle-class  H income (say, the amount earned by those in the 80% - 95% region, though I 'the middle class' may well extend even higher than that) the comparison  D attempts to use a lot of the mid-to-upper middle class who bore the @ brunt of the tax shift to prove how 'progressive' it really was.  G News flash:  getting rid of a lot of progressivity at the absolute top  A of the heap by shifting the burden toward the middle is *not* an  H increase in progressivity but the exact opposite.  Once again, contrast I the fact that 1/3 of the cuts went to the top 1% with the attempt to use  I   the top 20% in this comparison and any competent and unbiased observer  E (not you, Rob, on either count) will start to see behind the curtain.    - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 08:21:00 -0500 . From: Alphaman <alphaman-nix-spam@alphant.com> Subject: Re: a sad day7 Message-ID: <4add1$42a8423d$186088ed$26076@KNOLOGY.NET>    Richard Maher wrote:7 > Regards Richard (sorry to be posting about VMS) Maher  > N > "Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply" <helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de>1 > wrote in message news:d820sf$vdf$8@online.de...  > = >>In article <Z3Uoe.5490$U4.776839@news.xtra.co.nz>, "Lurker"  >><nowhere@nothing.com> writes:       E *sigh*  Brothers and sisters arguing on a funeral thread.  I suppose  L Terry would be laughing his ass off, knowing the c.o.v. newsgroup endures...  A But don't let me interrupt the thread, just thought I'd share my   observation.   Aaron    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 08:25:10 -0700  From: Z <Z@no.spam>  Subject: Re: a sad day+ Message-ID: <ldZpe.18251$QX1.3989@fe06.lga>    Bill Todd wrote:J > But reduce the *degree* of disproportionality is precisely what Dubya's < > cuts did, bringing us closer to that Forbes favorite, the $ > not-progressive-at-all 'flat tax'.  I Forbes' flat tax is indeed progressive since the first ~$30-35K is taxed   at ZERO percent.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 11:56:53 -0400 ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> Subject: Re: a sad day= Message-ID: <oLednfzIcpBb-zXfRVn-3A@metrocastcablevision.com>    Z wrote: > Bill Todd wrote: > C >> But reduce the *degree* of disproportionality is precisely what  E >> Dubya's cuts did, bringing us closer to that Forbes favorite, the  % >> not-progressive-at-all 'flat tax'.  >  > K > Forbes' flat tax is indeed progressive since the first ~$30-35K is taxed   > at ZERO percent.  G My statement stands:  the flat tax per se (which is what the statement  G referred to) is not progressive at all, and the Forbes modification to  G it which you describe qualifies as the most minimal (single-step) form  ? of progressivity only if one looks not at rates (which is what  ? progressivity normally refers to) but at ancillary tweaks like  H deductions (which of course can effectively be progressive, regressive, B or neutral, depending upon what they apply to - and the tweaks in H Dubya's changes which shifted the tax burden toward earned income were,  as already noted, regressive).   - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 10:16:04 -0700  From: Z <Z@no.spam>  Subject: Re: a sad day* Message-ID: <jR_pe.7444$rt3.3042@fe03.lga>   Bill Todd wrote:
 > Z wrote: >  >> Bill Todd wrote:  >>D >>> But reduce the *degree* of disproportionality is precisely what F >>> Dubya's cuts did, bringing us closer to that Forbes favorite, the & >>> not-progressive-at-all 'flat tax'. >> >> >>F >> Forbes' flat tax is indeed progressive since the first ~$30-35K is  >> taxed at ZERO percent.  >  > I > My statement stands:  the flat tax per se (which is what the statement    F Your statement stands as false. The Forbes proposal has ALWAYS had an % exclusion for the first $N of income.   @ We obviously have different opinions of what "not at all" means.  = You seem to think it means "some, but not as much as I want."    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 15:28:26 GMT 2 From: P. Guy1969<projectguy1969REM0VE@hotmail.com># Subject: FS : Electrical Components / Message-ID: <ueZpe.1617723$Xk.1214518@pd7tw3no>    <HTML> <HEAD>A <META NAME="GENERATOR" Content="Microsoft DHTML Editing Control">  <TITLE></TITLE>  </HEAD>  <BODY>
 <P>Hi,</P>O <P>I've added some more items on my eBay.&nbsp; Please go and check if you are   interested.</P>  <P>Thanks!</P> <P>P. Guy1969</P> @ <P>OMRON H3G-8C 60S. SOLID STATE TIMER W/CLIPS &amp; MOUNTING<A ~ href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=4660&amp;item=7522479921&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW"><FONT   color=#0000cc></FONT></A><BR><A  href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=4660&amp;item=7522479921&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=4660&amp;item=7522479921&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW</A></P>@ <P>OMRON H3G-8C 60S. SOLID STATE TIMER W/CLIPS &amp; MOUNTING<A w href="cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=4660&amp;item=7522480438&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW"><FONT    color=#0000cc></FONT></A><BR><A  href="http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=4660&amp;item=7522480438&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=4660&amp;item=7522480438&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW</A></P>< <P>SIEMENS 3SE3210-1D SIGUARD POSITION (LIMIT) SWITCH<BR><A href="javascript:ol('http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=58169&amp;item=7521442941&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW');">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=58169&amp;item=7521442941&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW</A><BR><BR>2X  7 OMRON Z15GQ-B BASIC SWITCH (MICRO ACTIVE SWITCH)<BR><A  href="javascript:ol('http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=58169&amp;item=7521443528&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW');">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=58169&amp;item=7521443528&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW</A><BR><BR>TELEMECANIQUE . XCK-T102 POSITION SWITCH (LIMIT SWITCH)<BR><A href="javascript:ol('http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=58169&amp;item=7521443709&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW');">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=58169&amp;item=7521443709&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW</A><BR><BR>OMRON 4 Z-15GQ22-B BASIC SWITCH (MICRO ACTIVE SWITCH)<BR><A href="javascript:ol('http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=58169&amp;item=7521443889&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW');">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=58169&amp;item=7521443889&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW</A><BR><BR>TELEMECANIQUE / GV2-M32 MANUAL MOTOR STARTER W/ GV2-AN11<BR><A  href="javascript:ol('http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=42924&amp;item=7521444470&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW');">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=42924&amp;item=7521444470&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW</A><BR><BR>TELEMECANIQUE . / SQUARE-D GV2ME14 MANUAL MOTOR STARTER<BR><A href="javascript:ol('http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=42924&amp;item=7521444733&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW');">http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&amp;category=42924&amp;item=7521444733&amp;rd=1&amp;ssPageName=WDVW</A><BR></P> </BODY>  </HTML>    ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 09:12:24 +02003 From: "Dr. Dweeb" <NOSPAM_5msg0h202@sneakemail.com> - Subject: Re: Industry standard is ridiculous! = Message-ID: <42a7ebd9$0$67261$157c6196@dreader2.cybercity.dk>    John Vottero wrote: 6 > "Dave Froble" <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote in message, > news:11aelo8nfuaajf6@corp.supernews.com... >> Bob Kaplow wrote: >>G >>> And the R&D costs for a new engine are probably on the order of the  >>> cost of  >>> designing a new chip.  >>+ >> As with CPUs, it depends upon your goal.  >>C >> Designing a new Formula One engine, with the goal of winning the $ >> championship, will require a bit. >>A >> Designing another 4-cyl engine, which you can already do while D >> asleep, is a bit easier.  You're already borrowing 99% or it fromJ >> the current design. How many people does it take to design a CPU?  How  >> long?  What= >> equipment is required?  I don't see why it's so expensive.  >>: >> Now, fabing, testing, tweeking, and such, that will add >> significantly to the tab. >>9 >> What's it cost to run a Formula One team for a season?  >> > G > Formula One budgets are top secret.  Do you want to win?  Ferrari may G > spend as much as $443 million a year.  The HP sponsored Williams team A > squeaks by on only $350 million a year.  The Minardi team works , > miracles to survive on $39 million a year. > * > These numbers are pure speculation from: > 4 > http://www.fastmachines.com/archives/f1/001603.php >   J It is generally accepted that Toyota currently have the biggest budget in  F1. D Ferraris budget has to include Schumi, who at $35+m is not cheap :-)   Dweeb  > % >> Did I just answer my own question?  >> >> -- 7 >> David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450 7 >> Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596 A >> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com  >> 170 Grimplin Road >> Vanderbilt, PA  15486     ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 03:39:57 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> - Subject: Re: Industry standard is ridiculous! , Message-ID: <42A7F214.8FCB0EC0@teksavvy.com>   "Dr. Dweeb" wrote:K > It is generally accepted that Toyota currently have the biggest budget in  > F1. F > Ferraris budget has to include Schumi, who at $35+m is not cheap :-)  @ The Formula 1 stuff is more like IBM's Blue Gene special one off6 supercomputers  computers that are R&D and PR driven. 9 They're "hand made" and not designed for mass production.     B What is important here is the Toyota Corolla, the mass market highQ volume stuff. That is where Intel is good at and that is where it really matters.   E The 8086 is the Toyota Corolla of the CPU industry. IA64 is more like F the Range Rover. Expensive, low volume and not viable, expecially whenA there is serious competitors in the all terrain vehicles who have G cheaper products that work just as well if not better. (And that is why E Rover is out of business). Toyota also gained a huge foothold in that E amrket and displaced Rover. (The real outback Toyotas are not sold in 9 North america but are widesprad in Australia and Africa).    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 12:26:03 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> - Subject: Re: Industry standard is ridiculous! 0 Message-ID: <11agr9viv1l94d9@corp.supernews.com>   JF Mezei wrote:  > "Dr. Dweeb" wrote: > K >>It is generally accepted that Toyota currently have the biggest budget in  >>F1. F >>Ferraris budget has to include Schumi, who at $35+m is not cheap :-) >  > B > The Formula 1 stuff is more like IBM's Blue Gene special one off8 > supercomputers  computers that are R&D and PR driven. ; > They're "hand made" and not designed for mass production.   9 Or Alpha.  One of the things about Alpha was that it was   leading/bleeding edge.  F Some VMS users seem to feel the need for the high performance special  stuff.  Not all.   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 13:07:49 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> - Subject: RE: Industry standard is ridiculous! R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB6508DE@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----3 > From: Dave Froble [mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com]=20  > Sent: June 9, 2005 12:26 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com / > Subject: Re: Industry standard is ridiculous!  >=20 > JF Mezei wrote:  > > "Dr. Dweeb" wrote: > >=20> > >>It is generally accepted that Toyota currently have the=20 > biggest budget in  > >>F1. H > >>Ferraris budget has to include Schumi, who at $35+m is not cheap :-) > >=20 > >=20D > > The Formula 1 stuff is more like IBM's Blue Gene special one off< > > supercomputers  computers that are R&D and PR driven.=20= > > They're "hand made" and not designed for mass production.  >=20= > Or Alpha.  One of the things about Alpha was that it was=20  > leading/bleeding edge. >=20J > Some VMS users seem to feel the need for the high performance special=20 > stuff.  Not all. >=20  < Yep - and this applies to the x86 market in general as well.  D Case in point - almost all med-large companies I deal with today areB looking at consolidation of servers, app's and db's in one form or another.=20    The reason?=20  ? Companies have huge numbers of servers (hundred's and in bigger H companies, thousands) whereby the avg server utilization is in the rangeE of 10-20%. This is especially true in the Windows one-app, one server ' space, but also the UNIX world as well.   E In the past, Cust's were typically looking to greenfield systems on a F one to one basis. They would argue internally over whether they shouldC get a 2.8Ghz system vs a 3Ghz system - even though the system it is @ replacing is currently 10-20% busy and half the speed of the newH systems. So in the future, if a one-one replacement is done as it was inB the past, then it will result in server utilizations of even lower' 5-10%. Not a great investment strategy.   G Any wonder why consolidation, stacking, partitioning and virtualization  is such a hot topic these days?    :-)   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Jun 2005 07:15:59 -0500 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) < Subject: Re: Intel neuters Montvale, Itanic screams in alarm3 Message-ID: <XUg$8o11Fp+t@eisner.encompasserve.org>   \ In article <42A735D3.CD50CD63@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes: > c > https://developer.apple.com/documentation/MacOSX/Conceptual/universal_binary/universal_binary.pdf  >   2    That's exactly what I was looking for.  Thanks.   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Jun 2005 10:24:29 -0700  From: bob@instantwhip.com < Subject: Re: Intel neuters Montvale, Itanic screams in alarmC Message-ID: <1118337869.034773.191460@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   4 so if ia64 is done for, what is vms going to run on?   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 07:28:17 -0500( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com>9 Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!) / Message-ID: <00A4504D.44968D0A.1@tachysoft.com>   > >From: wayne@tachysoft.xxx.504279.killspam.00c3 (Wayne Sewell): >Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!) >Date: 8 Jun 2005 16:47:33 CDT/ >Message-ID: <JcI3nSOo7Bbw@tachxxsoftxxconsult> + >From: "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca>  >X-Newsgroups: comp.os.vms: >Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)  H >1) Take a good backup of every disk (if at all possible, image backups)  >2) Restore to the other machine >3) Boot MinimumL >4) Edit the SYLOGICALS.COM (or your own .COM that defines logical names forA >the disks) and map the logicals to the new disks on this machine L >5) Possibly change the Ethernet adapter in your IP config (had to do it for
 >Multinet)  I With TCPWARE, you have to get a new license key, since the address of the ' network adapter is embedded in the key.      >6) Reboot normal  > I >That's mostly it I guess. If logical names are properly used, all should  >work fine.  > O =============================================================================== N Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738   wayne@tachysoft.com; http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html    O =============================================================================== P Jake Blues:"You traded the Caddy for a microphone? ...... Okay, I can buy that."   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 08:57:34 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> 9 Subject: RE: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!) R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB6508B7@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----4 > From: Wayne Sewell [mailto:wayne@tachysoft.com]=20 > Sent: June 9, 2005 8:28 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ; > Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)  >=20@ > >From: wayne@tachysoft.xxx.504279.killspam.00c3 (Wayne Sewell)< > >Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)  > >Date: 8 Jun 2005 16:47:33 CDT1 > >Message-ID: <JcI3nSOo7Bbw@tachxxsoftxxconsult> - > >From: "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca>  > >X-Newsgroups: comp.os.vms< > >Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!) >=20> > >1) Take a good backup of every disk (if at all possible,=20 > image backups)" > >2) Restore to the other machine > >3) Boot Minimum? > >4) Edit the SYLOGICALS.COM (or your own .COM that defines=20  > logical names for C > >the disks) and map the logicals to the new disks on this machine ? > >5) Possibly change the Ethernet adapter in your IP config=20  > (had to do it for  > >Multinet) >=20? > With TCPWARE, you have to get a new license key, since the=20  > address of the) > network adapter is embedded in the key.  >=20 >=20 > >6) Reboot normal  > >E= > >That's mostly it I guess. If logical names are properly=20  > used, all should
 > >work fine.e > >u > =sL =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=$ =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D5 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3Dn? > Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738  =20S > wayne@tachysoft.coml? > http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html  =20a > =mL =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=$ =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D5 > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3DD> > Jake Blues:"You traded the Caddy for a microphone? ......=20 > Okay, I can buy that." >=20  E I would expand Wayne's comment to "review all OpenVMS and third party-G software products (including support utilities) for potential licensingLA changes that might be required by moving to a new server hardware- configuration".=20  E As an example, the issue of some third party products position on per G cpu licensing and whether dual cores are treated as separate processorstH is still very much on a vendor by vendor basis. Also, moving from single. cpu to dual cpu would require SMP license etc.  = Another area to examine would be batch queues. If the currentsG environment is a heavy batch environment, then the moving of these jobsaA to the new environment needs to be planned as batch jobs keep the.D physical characteristics of where they were originally submitted to.  A Likely already mentioned, but when moving production app's on anysH platform, you need to ensure that all third party products are supported7 by the vendors on the target OS environment version.=20A   Regardso  
 Kerry Main Senior Consultants HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477d kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 10:49:28 -0400* From: "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca>9 Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!) 3 Message-ID: <BGYpe.2219$g4.32584@tor-nn1.netcom.ca>p  < "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> a crit dans le message deL news:FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB6508B7@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net...  G > I would expand Wayne's comment to "review all OpenVMS and third party I > software products (including support utilities) for potential licensing C > changes that might be required by moving to a new server hardwaren > configuration".f >nG I skipped that step. You may have to get new licenses from the vendors. L So this means you have to boot minimum, edit your SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM and makeI sure your applications and batch queues don't start. Boot normal. InstalluH new license keys and test. Then after you can start the applications and
 batch queues.e  G > As an example, the issue of some third party products position on peryI > cpu licensing and whether dual cores are treated as separate processorssJ > is still very much on a vendor by vendor basis. Also, moving from single0 > cpu to dual cpu would require SMP license etc. > ? > Another area to examine would be batch queues. If the currentfI > environment is a heavy batch environment, then the moving of these jobs C > to the new environment needs to be planned as batch jobs keep theiF > physical characteristics of where they were originally submitted to.  K I don't understand. Batch jobs will just start on the queues. Of course you K have to be careful about SYSGEN parameters on the new machine but basically K all should work, you only have to tune later. It's more of a problem if youdF plan to move to a significantly smaller machine but other than that...   >tC > Likely already mentioned, but when moving production app's on anyaJ > platform, you need to ensure that all third party products are supported6 > by the vendors on the target OS environment version. >e  E If you do an IMAGE restore, then it's the same OS and version, just ar3 different hardware and that should not be an issue.r   -- o Syltremo   OpenVMS 7.3-1 + Oracle 8.1.7.4H http://pages.infinit.net/syltrem (OpenVMS related web site, en franais)% ---zulu is not in my email address---r   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 11:26:16 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>d9 Subject: RE: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)dR Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB6508D1@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----4 > From: Syltrem [mailto:syltremzulu@videotron.ca]=20 > Sent: June 9, 2005 10:49 AMe > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com,; > Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)l >=20@ > "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> a =E9crit dans le message de@ > news:FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB6508B7@tayexc19.americas. > cpqcorp.net... >=20  	 [snip...]a  A > > Another area to examine would be batch queues. If the current @ > > environment is a heavy batch environment, then the moving=20 > of these jobseE > > to the new environment needs to be planned as batch jobs keep the H > > physical characteristics of where they were originally submitted to. >=20B > I don't understand. Batch jobs will just start on the queues.=20 > Of course youaB > have to be careful about SYSGEN parameters on the new machine=20 > but basicallyaA > all should work, you only have to tune later. It's more of a=20  > problem if youH > plan to move to a significantly smaller machine but other than that... >=20  D Take a look at the existing jobs submitted to batch queues via the = following example:1 $ pipe show queu/all/full|search sys$pipe "File:"   I Notice the physical device reference - these jobs will not run if moved =h= as is (e.g. image restore) to a new system. They need to be = 
 re-submitted.e =20u > > E > > Likely already mentioned, but when moving production app's on anysA > > platform, you need to ensure that all third party products=20  > are supportedi8 > > by the vendors on the target OS environment version. > >i >=20G > If you do an IMAGE restore, then it's the same OS and version, just ai5 > different hardware and that should not be an issue.  >=20 > --=20a  I Correct. The note was in reference to moving to a new server that might =sA require a new OS version that what the old system version was at.r   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior ConsultantM HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660a Fax: 613-591-4477s kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 11:41:10 -0400 From: norm.raphael@metso.com9 Subject: RE: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)nQ Message-ID: <OFC27A3A1F.8B25130E-ON8525701B.00560444-8525701B.00561DB0@metso.com>f  B "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> wrote on 06/09/2005 11:26:16 AM:   >a > > -----Original Message-----3 > > From: Syltrem [mailto:syltremzulu@videotron.ca]  > > Sent: June 9, 2005 10:49 AMi > > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com = > > Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)  > >iB > > "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> a =E9crit dans le message deB > > news:FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB6508B7@tayexc19.americas. > > cpqcorp.net... > >  >  > [snip...]r >vC > > > Another area to examine would be batch queues. If the currentt? > > > environment is a heavy batch environment, then the movingn > > of these jobseH > > > to the new environment needs to be planned as batch jobs keep the=  H > > > physical characteristics of where they were originally submitted = to.B > >lA > > I don't understand. Batch jobs will just start on the queues.o > > Of course youdA > > have to be careful about SYSGEN parameters on the new machinea > > but basicallyo@ > > all should work, you only have to tune later. It's more of a > > problem if youH > > plan to move to a significantly smaller machine but other than that= .. > >o >oD > Take a look at the existing jobs submitted to batch queues via the > following example:3 > $ pipe show queu/all/full|search sys$pipe "File:"e  H There is a DCL Utility called FIXQUE.COM that proports to get all queue=  B information into a reload file that can be edited, then run on theH new system.  I don't know where it lives, now, of if it wants updating.=    F $!  Copyright (c) 1991,1992 Digital Equipment Corporation.  All rights	 reserved.>H $! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - = - -  -eH $! Procedure to try and gather all possible information out of an exist= ingl5 $! queue file, to prepare for an attempt at recovery.i $!H $! As output, creates a command procedure called FIXQUE_RELOAD.COM whic= h  caneH $! be run to restore the previously existing queues, jobs, characterist= ics,? $! and form definitions after creating a new, empty queue file.v $!     >pC > Notice the physical device reference - these jobs will not run ifYC > moved as is (e.g. image restore) to a new system. They need to bei > re-submitted.n >  > > >aH > > > Likely already mentioned, but when moving production app's on any=  @ > > > platform, you need to ensure that all third party products > > are supported(: > > > by the vendors on the target OS environment version. > > >n > >pH > > If you do an IMAGE restore, then it's the same OS and version, just=  a7 > > different hardware and that should not be an issue.a > >) > > -- >mC > Correct. The note was in reference to moving to a new server thatyH > might require a new OS version that what the old system version was a= t. >t	 > Regards  >  > Kerry Main > Senior Consultant- > HP Services Canada > Voice: 613-592-4660v > Fax: 613-591-4477t > kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom > (remove the DOT's and AT)e >d7 > OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.=e   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 11:43:24 -0400 From: norm.raphael@metso.com9 Subject: RE: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)yQ Message-ID: <OFC27A3A1F.8B25130E-ON8525701B.00560444-8525701B.0056523F@metso.com>f  H Sorry for the double post, but Keith Parris's name is all over the vers= ionv I have.a  B "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> wrote on 06/09/2005 11:26:16 AM:   >T > > -----Original Message-----3 > > From: Syltrem [mailto:syltremzulu@videotron.ca]  > > Sent: June 9, 2005 10:49 AMg > > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comt= > > Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)e > >iB > > "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> a =E9crit dans le message deB > > news:FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB6508B7@tayexc19.americas. > > cpqcorp.net... > >e >q > [snip...]r >nC > > > Another area to examine would be batch queues. If the currentt? > > > environment is a heavy batch environment, then the movingt > > of these jobsoH > > > to the new environment needs to be planned as batch jobs keep the=  H > > > physical characteristics of where they were originally submitted = to.' > >'A > > I don't understand. Batch jobs will just start on the queues.c > > Of course yousA > > have to be careful about SYSGEN parameters on the new machinel > > but basicallyn@ > > all should work, you only have to tune later. It's more of a > > problem if youH > > plan to move to a significantly smaller machine but other than that= .. > >p >iD > Take a look at the existing jobs submitted to batch queues via the > following example:3 > $ pipe show queu/all/full|search sys$pipe "File:"   H There is a DCL Utility called FIXQUE.COM that proports to get all queue=  B information into a reload file that can be edited, then run on theH new system.  I don't know where it lives, now, of if it wants updating.=    F $!  Copyright (c) 1991,1992 Digital Equipment Corporation.  All rights	 reserved.sH $! - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - = - -s - H $! Procedure to try and gather all possible information out of an exist= ing 5 $! queue file, to prepare for an attempt at recovery.r $!H $! As output, creates a command procedure called FIXQUE_RELOAD.COM whic= hl cansH $! be run to restore the previously existing queues, jobs, characterist= ics,? $! and form definitions after creating a new, empty queue file.g $!     > C > Notice the physical device reference - these jobs will not run if.C > moved as is (e.g. image restore) to a new system. They need to be  > re-submitted.h >  > > >aH > > > Likely already mentioned, but when moving production app's on any=  @ > > > platform, you need to ensure that all third party products > > are supportede: > > > by the vendors on the target OS environment version. > > >t > > H > > If you do an IMAGE restore, then it's the same OS and version, just=  a7 > > different hardware and that should not be an issue.  > >w > > -- > C > Correct. The note was in reference to moving to a new server thatnH > might require a new OS version that what the old system version was a= t. > 	 > Regardso >  > Kerry Main > Senior Consultantd > HP Services Canada > Voice: 613-592-4660i > Fax: 613-591-4477o > kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom > (remove the DOT's and AT)a >a7 > OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.=    ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 12:08:55 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com>y9 Subject: RE: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)uR Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB6508D5@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----A > From: norm.raphael@metso.com [mailto:norm.raphael@metso.com]=20  > Sent: June 9, 2005 11:41 AM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Comx; > Subject: RE: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)t >=20D > "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> wrote on 06/09/2005 11:26:16 AM: >=20 > >l  > > > -----Original Message-----5 > > > From: Syltrem [mailto:syltremzulu@videotron.ca]p! > > > Sent: June 9, 2005 10:49 AM  > > > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Coma? > > > Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)  > > > D > > > "Main, Kerry" <kerry.main@hp.com> a =E9crit dans le message deD > > > news:FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB6508B7@tayexc19.americas. > > > cpqcorp.net... > > >i > > 
 > > [snip...]s > >NE > > > > Another area to examine would be batch queues. If the currentfA > > > > environment is a heavy batch environment, then the movingu > > > of these jobso> > > > > to the new environment needs to be planned as batch=20 > jobs keep thetA > > > > physical characteristics of where they were originally=20a > submitted to.t > > >eC > > > I don't understand. Batch jobs will just start on the queues.r > > > Of course youoC > > > have to be careful about SYSGEN parameters on the new machinet > > > but basicallynB > > > all should work, you only have to tune later. It's more of a > > > problem if youB > > > plan to move to a significantly smaller machine but other=20
 > than that.., > > >o > >aF > > Take a look at the existing jobs submitted to batch queues via the > > following example:5 > > $ pipe show queu/all/full|search sys$pipe "File:"e >=20B > There is a DCL Utility called FIXQUE.COM that proports to get=20 > all queueiD > information into a reload file that can be edited, then run on theB > new system.  I don't know where it lives, now, of if it wants=20 > updating.  >=20  	 [snip ..]e  H As a protection, for any type of migration to a different system, once =I all users are off the system and all batch and print queues stopped, as = D a "just in case" step, I would create a log file (and being really =A paranoid would print the log files to paper as well) of all the = ; appropriate batch *and* device (e.g. printer) que info e.g.u  D $show queue/batch/all/full/out=3Dold_system_batch__queue_details.logB $show queue/dev/all/full/out=3Dold_system_device_queue_details.log  I And of course, a full backup of the old system before starting any data =a% migration to a new system is assumed.-   :-)e   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultantv HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660f Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 11:53:25 -0500( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com>9 Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)t/ Message-ID: <00A45072.4E8C7A93.1@tachysoft.com>o  > >From: wayne@tachysoft.xxx.504279.killspam.00c3 (Wayne Sewell): >Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!) >Date: 9 Jun 2005 11:06:27 CDT/ >Message-ID: <JxCk4UYieSS9@tachxxsoftxxconsult> + >From: "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca>p >X-Newsgroups: comp.os.vms: >Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)   >>@ >> Another area to examine would be batch queues. If the currentJ >> environment is a heavy batch environment, then the moving of these jobsD >> to the new environment needs to be planned as batch jobs keep theG >> physical characteristics of where they were originally submitted to.n >cL >I don't understand. Batch jobs will just start on the queues. Of course youL >have to be careful about SYSGEN parameters on the new machine but basicallyL >all should work, you only have to tune later. It's more of a problem if youG >plan to move to a significantly smaller machine but other than that...e >n  J Here's an example.  This job is currently in a batch queue on my system, a* nightly tapesys backup of important files.  ( Batch queue TAPE$HARDY, idle, on HARDY::P   /BASE_PRIORITY=4 /JOB_LIMIT=1 /OWNER=[TAPESYS] /PROTECTION=(S:RSMD,O:RSMD,G,W)  4   Entry  Jobname         Username             Status4   -----  -------         --------             ------     964  SYSBAK_HOTSTUFF_1S                          TAPESYS              Holding until  9-JUN-2005 20:30:00.00e}          Submitted  9-JUN-2005 00:05:07.30 /KEEP /LOG=LAUREL$DKB100:[TAPESYS_PRODUCTION.][SYSBAK.LOGS]SYSBAK_HOTSTUFF_1.LOG; w7          /PARAM=("HOTSTUFF","1") /NOPRINT /PRIORITY=100 G          File: _LAUREL$DKB100:[TAPESYS_PRODUCTION.SYSTEM]SYSBAK.BIS;7766    N Note that the file name contains a physical device name, despite the fact thatM it was submitted using a logical name.  This is the "physical characteristics > of where they were originally submitted to" mentioned earlier.  M So *if* you place the disk cloned from _LAUREL$DKB100: into the same relative L slot on the same relative scsi controller on the new system, then this batchL job will work.  If the disk has a different scsi ID on the new system, or isH not on the second scsi controller, the name will be different, such as  H _LAUREL$DKC400:, and the job will fail because it can't find the command procedure on _LAUREL$DKB100: .O ===============================================================================oN Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738   wayne@tachysoft.com; http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html    O =============================================================================== P Jake Blues:"You traded the Caddy for a microphone? ...... Okay, I can buy that."   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 13:53:47 -0400- From: William Webb <william.w.webb@gmail.com>e9 Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)e7 Message-ID: <8660a3a105060910536a43d9a8@mail.gmail.com>   4 On 6/9/05, Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com> wrote:@ > >From: wayne@tachysoft.xxx.504279.killspam.00c3 (Wayne Sewell)< > >Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!)  > >Date: 9 Jun 2005 11:06:27 CDT1 > >Message-ID: <JxCk4UYieSS9@tachxxsoftxxconsult>l- > >From: "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca>& > >X-Newsgroups: comp.os.vms< > >Subject: Re: Migration checklist (no, not away from VMS!) >=20 > >>B > >> Another area to examine would be batch queues. If the currentL > >> environment is a heavy batch environment, then the moving of these job= s?F > >> to the new environment needs to be planned as batch jobs keep theI > >> physical characteristics of where they were originally submitted to.s > >IL > >I don't understand. Batch jobs will just start on the queues. Of course = youWL > >have to be careful about SYSGEN parameters on the new machine but basica= lly3L > >all should work, you only have to tune later. It's more of a problem if = youII > >plan to move to a significantly smaller machine but other than that...? > >t >=20L > Here's an example.  This job is currently in a batch queue on my system, = ab, > nightly tapesys backup of important files. >=20* > Batch queue TAPE$HARDY, idle, on HARDY::L >  /BASE_PRIORITY=3D4 /JOB_LIMIT=3D1 /OWNER=3D[TAPESYS] /PROTECTION=3D(S:RS= MD,O:RSMD,G,W) >=205 >  Entry  Jobname         Username             Statusg5 >  -----  -------         --------             ------D >    964  SYSBAK_HOTSTUFF_1/L >                         TAPESYS              Holding until  9-JUN-2005 20=	 :30:00.00WL >         Submitted  9-JUN-2005 00:05:07.30 /KEEP /LOG=3DLAUREL$DKB100:[TAP=4 ESYS_PRODUCTION.][SYSBAK.LOGS]SYSBAK_HOTSTUFF_1.LOG;< >         /PARAM=3D("HOTSTUFF","1") /NOPRINT /PRIORITY=3D100H >         File: _LAUREL$DKB100:[TAPESYS_PRODUCTION.SYSTEM]SYSBAK.BIS;776 >=20 >=20L > Note that the file name contains a physical device name, despite the fact=  thatSL > it was submitted using a logical name.  This is the "physical characteris= tics@ > of where they were originally submitted to" mentioned earlier. >=20L > So *if* you place the disk cloned from _LAUREL$DKB100: into the same rela= tiveL > slot on the same relative scsi controller on the new system, then this ba= tch L > job will work.  If the disk has a different scsi ID on the new system, or=  iswH > not on the second scsi controller, the name will be different, such asJ > _LAUREL$DKC400:, and the job will fail because it can't find the command  > procedure on _LAUREL$DKB100: .K > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=AL =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D.L > Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738   wayne@tachysof= t.comp: > http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.htmlK > =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=eL =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=L =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D= =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D L > Jake Blues:"You traded the Caddy for a microphone? ...... Okay, I can buy=  that."u >=20  E Thanks, everybody.  In addition to the generic gotchas, my particulare; concerns specifically address the retention of historic ABSnE information, and I've opened a call about  that.  Got two really nice>4 upgrade checklists from HP in the meantime, as well.  	 Wayne,=20   F Your point is well taken-- just about the only time I believe in usingA physical device names is in SYLOGICALS.COM, although there may beuD application-specific exceptions to the general rule, but if and only& if a logical absolutely can't be used.   WWWebb   --=20 C NOTE: This email address is only used for noncommerical VMS-related> correspondence.tC All unsolicited commercial email will be deemed to be a request for 8 services pursuant to the terms and conditions located at# http://bellsouthpwp.net/w/e/webbww/r   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 11:01:40 +0200i- From: Didier Morandi <prenom.nom@freesurf.fr> 7 Subject: Re: OpenVMS BootCamp (anonymous) pixes - Day 3a3 Message-ID: <42a80574$0$5105$636a15ce@news.free.fr>.  ( Day 3: http://didier.morandi.free.fr/d3/  8 pix, you'll understand why :-)   D.   ------------------------------   Date: 9 Jun 2005 07:59:44 -0700r* From: "MDPlatts" <martin.platts@cdl.co.uk>- Subject: Re: Possible to top FTP "cd" command+C Message-ID: <1118329184.430590.112200@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>n  E thanks - I'll have a look at that - seems a pity that UCX doesnt have  such a feature though.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 09 Jun 2005 03:14:12 -0400a- From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> + Subject: TCPIP 5.0 SLIP transplant to 5.3 ?-, Message-ID: <42A7EC0C.8232137B@teksavvy.com>  H On VAX, the SLIP interface for TCPIP Services 5.3  crashes the node when activated. dH TCPIP SET INTERFACE SL1/serial=txc0:/host=(10.1.0.11)  crashes a system.  B With TCPIP 5.0 the SLIP interface seems to work more or less (flow control issues though).   4 Does anyone know which files contain the SLIP code ?  F Would it be possible to transplant the SLIP executable/driver/whatever from 5.0 onto 5.3 ?u  G This would allow me to upgrade the 5.0 node to 5.3, while retaining theeA SLIP capability to let my PDA connect. I already know that I mustoG manually revert the IMAP files from 5.3-2 to 5.3 since at 5.3-2 IMAP ono VAX crashes.  ( The other option is to move to Multinet.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 10:11:06 +0200+ From: "Michel HERRSCHER" <mhc@herrscher.fr>c Subject: Re: vms and linux6 Message-ID: <42a7f958$0$3144$8fcfb975@news.wanadoo.fr>  ' Dans un message Keith A. Lewis disait :b  2 > Disinfo <d151nf0rm4@libero.it> writes in articleC > <pan.2005.06.08.15.18.12.214200@libero.it> dated Wed, 08 Jun 2005r > 15:10:45 GMT:c   >oB > Since VMS and Linux both respect standards, the sky's the limit.  E nooooo sky is the first step , Galaxies are the limits now....  ;-)))1   Sorry for such a bad joke..l   -- f Michel HERRSCHER CONSULTANT:   ------------------------------  $ Date: Thu, 9 Jun 2005 08:49:36 -0400* From: "Syltrem" <syltremzulu@videotron.ca> Subject: Re: vms and linux3 Message-ID: <mWWpe.2215$g4.32591@tor-nn1.netcom.ca>u  I "David J Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> a crit dans le message det% news:42A7A42D.CA1637F5@comcast.net...f > Disinfo wrote: > >u
 > > hallo,E > > im' looking for any links or suggestions to be able to connect my . > > microvax3100 with vms, to my server linux.: > > i made a lot of research but without enaught answeres. > > thank's  >d
 > Um, TCP/IP?g > A > Terse questions beget terse answers. What are you trying to do?c >     > You may possibly be thinking about Samba without knowing it...
 www.samba.orga   -- l Syltremi   OpenVMS 7.3-1 + Oracle 8.1.7.4H http://pages.infinit.net/syltrem (OpenVMS related web site, en franais)% ---zulu is not in my email address---- > -- - > David J Dachtera > dba DJE Systems2 > http://www.djesys.com/ >i+ > Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page:I$ > http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ >-* > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:! > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/  >-$ > Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page:! > http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/2 >  > Coming soon:( > Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2005.320 ************************