1 INFO-VAX	Fri, 27 May 2005	Volume 2005 : Issue 293       Contents: Re: ABC problem with disk  Re: ABC problem with disk  Re: ABC problem with disk  Re: ABC problem with disk P Blessed are they that have not seen yet still believe! (Was: Re: HELP! Serious A' Re: Computerworld: "Ready for trouble?" ' Re: Computerworld: "Ready for trouble?" ' Re: Computerworld: "Ready for trouble?" ' Re: Computerworld: "Ready for trouble?" ' Re: Computerworld: "Ready for trouble?" % Re: DECwindows screen lock and PWDMIX  DEFRAG ovms 7.3-2  Re: DEFRAG ovms 7.3-2  Re: DEFRAG ovms 7.3-2  Re: DEFRAG ovms 7.3-2  Encompass Board of Directors  Re: Encompass Board of Directors  Re: Encompass Board of DirectorsP Re: HELP! Serious Alpha Image Activation problem. Symbol Resolution - No errors P Hewlett-Packard is expected to announce a new line of NonStop servers next week 4 Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter4 Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter4 Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter4 Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter4 Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter4 Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter4 Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter4 Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter4 Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter; HP to help governments with tracking users with NAtional ID ) Re: I guess this means all is well again.  Re: Installing a printer Re: Installing a printer Re: Installing a printer Re: Installing a printer Re: Installing a printer Re: Installing a printer Re: Installing a printer Re: Installing a printer Re: Installing a printer Re: Installing a printer installing decnet product  Re: installing decnet product  Re: SEARCH : AND NOT ? Re: SEARCH : AND NOT ? Re: upgrade 7.3-1 --> 7.3-2   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 12:41:32 -0700) From: "Joe Sewell" <ultrajoe@spamcop.net> " Subject: Re: ABC problem with diskC Message-ID: <1117136492.690846.246340@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    William Webb wrote: I > On 26 May 2005 07:23:30 -0700, Joe Sewell <ultrajoe@spamcop.net> wrote:  > > >Joe Sewell wrote:K > > >> Our organization has just gone to using ABC for networked backups of L > > >> machines scattered throughout the campus.  My particular machine see= msL > > >> to have a problem.  It has a 9-bay StorageWorks tower with 7 18GB di= sks H > > >> in it.  One of those disks seems to put ABC into an infinite loopL > > >> scanning for backup candidates.  If I manually run ABC INCREMENTAL w= ith L > > >> the /ALIAS=3DCOPY qualifier, it works just fine.  The default doesn'tK > > >> have the /ALIAS qualifier, and I've seen it churn for *days* without   > > >> backing up a single file. > > > < > > >> ANALYZE/DISK/REPAIR/READ/RECOR=ADD shows no problems. > > > 8 > > >> Anybody have any ideas what else to look at here? > > > J > > >Just to clarify, is ABC the product known as Archive Backup Client asI > > >documented at http://www.rdperf.com/RDHTML/l=ADiterature_main.html ?  > >  > > Yes, version 4.0.0.1.  > >  > >  > H > I'd try creating a VMS backup job that does a full backup on that disk > and nothing else.  > C > If it works, and the ABC backup doesn't, then you've eliminated a 1 > _whole lot of possibilities_ in one fell swoop.   D Good point.  I have already done that (BACKUP/IMAGE/NOALIAS... to be? precise), and it caught a few things that have since been fixed G (specifically a couple of files had directory entries but no valid file E header and vice-versa).  It still shows signs of slowness, but I have  yet to verify this 100%.  C I've discovered that ABC has a multi-pass system that I haven't yet G figured out completely, but it'll copy stuff, "deactivate" files in the A backup area, then copy more stuff if necessary.  I think it's the > latter that's slower than molasses in Antartica, but I'm still verifying that.   < > You've also made a point to your superiors in the process.  F As if the IT department (the ones administrating the VMS systems) will listen to an ex-SYS$MANAGER. :/    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 17:25:51 -0400 - From: William Webb <william.w.webb@gmail.com> " Subject: Re: ABC problem with disk7 Message-ID: <8660a3a1050526142552c7bfa7@mail.gmail.com>   G On 26 May 2005 12:41:32 -0700, Joe Sewell <ultrajoe@spamcop.net> wrote:  >=20 > William Webb wrote: K > > On 26 May 2005 07:23:30 -0700, Joe Sewell <ultrajoe@spamcop.net> wrote:  > > > >Joe Sewell wrote:L > > > >> Our organization has just gone to using ABC for networked backups = ofL > > > >> machines scattered throughout the campus.  My particular machine s= eemsL > > > >> to have a problem.  It has a 9-bay StorageWorks tower with 7 18GB = disks J > > > >> in it.  One of those disks seems to put ABC into an infinite loopL > > > >> scanning for backup candidates.  If I manually run ABC INCREMENTAL=  with L > > > >> the /ALIAS=3DCOPY qualifier, it works just fine.  The default does= n't L > > > >> have the /ALIAS qualifier, and I've seen it churn for *days* witho= ut" > > > >> backing up a single file. > > > > > > > > >> ANALYZE/DISK/REPAIR/READ/RECOR=ADD shows no problems. > > > > : > > > >> Anybody have any ideas what else to look at here? > > > > L > > > >Just to clarify, is ABC the product known as Archive Backup Client a= s K > > > >documented at http://www.rdperf.com/RDHTML/l=ADiterature_main.html ?  > > >  > > > Yes, version 4.0.0.1.  > > >  > > >  > > J > > I'd try creating a VMS backup job that does a full backup on that disk > > and nothing else.  > > E > > If it works, and the ABC backup doesn't, then you've eliminated a 3 > > _whole lot of possibilities_ in one fell swoop.  >=20F > Good point.  I have already done that (BACKUP/IMAGE/NOALIAS... to beA > precise), and it caught a few things that have since been fixed I > (specifically a couple of files had directory entries but no valid file G > header and vice-versa).  It still shows signs of slowness, but I have  > yet to verify this 100%. >=20E > I've discovered that ABC has a multi-pass system that I haven't yet I > figured out completely, but it'll copy stuff, "deactivate" files in the C > backup area, then copy more stuff if necessary.  I think it's the @ > latter that's slower than molasses in Antartica, but I'm still > verifying that.  >=20> > > You've also made a point to your superiors in the process. >=20H > As if the IT department (the ones administrating the VMS systems) will! > listen to an ex-SYS$MANAGER. :/  >=20 >=20  C Well, if all else fails, AFAIK, The Dilbert Store still sells those - ball caps with the fake pointy hair attached.    How many do you need?    --=20 C NOTE: This email address is only used for noncommerical VMS-related  correspondence. C All unsolicited commercial email will be deemed to be a request for 8 services pursuant to the terms and conditions located at# http://bellsouthpwp.net/w/e/webbww/    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 23:56:35 +0200 & From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@decus.ch>" Subject: Re: ABC problem with disk+ Message-ID: <3fmuvuF8m6ttU1@individual.net>    Joe Sewell wrote:   D > The complete backup command is generated from DCL code, so I'm not; > precisely sure what it is. I believe it's something line:  >  > $ ABC INCREMENTAL G > $1$DKB100:/IGNORE=INTERLOCK/LOG=(something)/SUMMARY=(something) ! I'd / > have to figure out what the "something's" are  > A > The logs don't show anything except that it stops at that disk.  >   H Just a gut feeling response, but how does ABC actually execute the jobs?  F Does ABC use spawned, detached or batch jobs? If so I'd be looking to  see if the quotas are adequate.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 20:58:50 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>" Subject: Re: ABC problem with disk* Message-ID: <42967EDA.AC5970E@comcast.net>   Joe Sewell wrote:  > K > >Archive backup client, eh? Haven't heard of that since about 1998 or so.   > >Not recommended then, either. > > K > >Use VMS BACKUP to backup VMS disks, or risk losing your data and/or your 4 > >ability to perform disaster recovery expediently. >  > Not an option.  H Protecting your company's data by doing proper backups is not an option?   That's *GOTTA* be a first!  : > This was installed by the system administrator (not me).F > The only reason I even noticed its existence on my machine is due toI > some system slowdown that I tracked down to this thing chewing up about  > 5% CPU time in kernel mode.   @ ...and the reason management continues to tolerate this is ... ?   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 18:16:50 +0000 (UTC) 3 From: "Richard Maher" <maher_rj@hotspamnotmail.com> Y Subject: Blessed are they that have not seen yet still believe! (Was: Re: HELP! Serious A ? Message-ID: <d753qg$qhq$1@nwrdmz01.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com>    Hi,   K For those of you that keep trying to stick your hand in my ribs, here's the  VAX version : -    $ @test  $ run test1  Test1 sym =         1  Test1 gbl = Hello  Share2 sym =         1 Share2 gbl = Hello
 $ ty test.com  $! $ on warning then exit* $ define/nolog share1 sys$login:share1.exe* $ define/nolog share2 sys$login:share2.exe $! $ create share1.mar            .title  fred my_sym == 1 ?         .psect  global_var,long,pic,ovr,rel,gbl,noshr,noexe,wrt /                         .ascii          "Hello" )                         .blkb           3   =         .psect  my_code,pic,con,rel,lcl,shr,exe,rd,nowrt,long            .entry     my_sub,^m<>         movzbl  #1,r0          ret            .end $! $ macro share1.mar> $ link/share=sys$login:share1.exe share1.obj,sys$input/options universal=my_sub universal=my_sym $! $ create share2.cob  identification division. program-id.    share2. data division. working-storage section.C 01  my_sym                  pic 9(9)   comp  value external my_sym. 0 01  global_var              pic x(5)   external. procedure division.  00. 4     display "Share2 sym = ", my_sym with conversion.(     display "Share2 gbl = ", global_var.     call "my_sub".     exit program.  end program share2.  $! $ cobol/lis share2.cob: $ link/share=sys$login:share2.exe share2.obj,sys$input/opt sys$login:share1.exe/share universal=share2 psect_attr=global_var,noshr  $! $ create test1.cob identification division. program-id.    test1.  data division. working-storage section.C 01  my_sym                  pic 9(9)   comp  value external my_sym. 0 01  global_var              pic x(5)   external. procedure division.  00. 3     display "Test1 sym = ", my_sym with conversion. '     display "Test1 gbl = ", global_var.      call "share2".
     stop run.  end program test1. $ cobol/lis test1.cob  $ link test1.obj,sys$input/opt psect_attr=global_var,noshr  sys$login:share2.exe/share $!   Regards Richard Maher   > "Richard Maher" <maher_rj@hotspamnotmail.com> wrote in message9 news:d73v42$djt$1@nwrdmz01.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com...  > Hi,  > E > Please can someone help me with this Global Symbol/Image Activation  problem L > I'm having when porting some code from VAX/VMS? See small example (75 line > reproducer) below. >  > In a nutshell : -  > L > 1) I have Sharable Image 1 (Share1) that has declared a Global, OverlayingJ > Psect (Global_Var) and a Global Constant (My_Sym). Share1 was written in# > Macro and initializes Global_Var. K > 2) When Linking Share1 I declare both Global_Var and My_Sym in the symbol  > table using the options fileI > 3) I have a second Shareable Image (Share2) that links against (Share1)  and H > calls a stub. Share2 also maps to Global_Var and references My_Sym and calls  > the stub (My_Sub) in Share1 J > 4) Finally, I have an executable image (Test1) that links against Share2 and  > also maps to Global_Var E > 4a) If it tries to reference My_Sym as an EXTERNAL constant it gets  > Undefined Symbol > K > If you run TEST1 you will see that Global_Var in SHARE1 and SHARE2 map to J > the same area but in TEST1 it contains rubbish. What am I doing wrong???! > Please Note: This works on VAX.  > D > I've come across this problem before with NEW code and was able toK > code/design around it, but this is existing code that would require MAJOR * > (even if doable) work to code around :-( > L > Please help if you can. Pointers to relevant documentation would be great. > @ > Can you get VMS support from HP if you're on the DSPP program? >  > Regards Richard Maher  >  > $! > $ on warning then exit, > $ define/nolog share1 sys$login:share1.exe, > $ define/nolog share2 sys$login:share2.exe > $! > $ create share1.mar  >  >         .title  Share One 
 > my_sym == 1 A >         .psect  global_var,long,pic,ovr,rel,gbl,noshr,noexe,wrt 1 >                         .ascii          "Hello" + >                         .blkb           3  > ? >         .psect  my_code,pic,con,rel,lcl,shr,exe,rd,nowrt,long  > & >         .call_entry     label=my_sub >         movzbl  #1,r0 
 >         ret  >  >         .end > $! > $ macro share1.mar@ > $ link/share=sys$login:share1.exe share1.obj,sys$input/options3 > symbol_vector = (                               - 3 >                 my_sub             = procedure, - 3 >                 global_var         = psect,     - 3 >                 my_sym             = data       -  >                 )  > $! > $ create share2.cob  > identification division. > program-id.    share2. > data division. > working-storage section.E > 01  my_sym                  pic 9(9)   comp  value external my_sym. 2 > 01  global_var              pic x(5)   external. > procedure division.  > 00. 6 >     display "Share2 sym = ", my_sym with conversion.* >     display "Share2 gbl = ", global_var. >     call "my_sub". >     exit program.  > end program share2.  > $! > $ cobol/lis share2.cob< > $ link/share=sys$login:share2.exe share2.obj,sys$input/opt > sys$login:share1.exe/share > psect_attr=global_var,noshr 3 > symbol_vector = (                               - 3 >                 share2             = procedure, - 3 >                 global_var         = psect,     - 3 >                 my_sym             = data       -  >                 )  > $! > $ create test1.cob > identification division. > program-id.    test1.  > data division. > working-storage section.F > *01  my_sym                  pic 9(9)   comp  value external my_sym.2 > 01  global_var              pic x(5)   external. > procedure division.  > 00. 6 > *    display "Test1 sym = ", my_sym with conversion.) >     display "Test1 gbl = ", global_var.  >     call "share2". >     stop run.  > end program test1. > $ cobol/lis test1.cob   > $ link test1.obj,sys$input/opt > psect_attr=global_var,noshr  > sys$login:share2.exe/share > $! >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 17:19:13 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 0 Subject: Re: Computerworld: "Ready for trouble?", Message-ID: <42963D4A.B92E94A4@teksavvy.com>   Tom Linden wrote: F > I would be interested to see a comparison of VMS and NSK in terms ofC > probability of failuer and availability.  I suspect that for most  > applicationsM > VMS does it just as well as NSK.  If I were Hurd, I would be trying to sell % > NSK, while it still has some value.   G VMS is much more likle Google in that respect. It provides the illusion H of total uptime because the failure of one box doesn't stop service. ButF there are huge differences in how transactions in progress when a node fails are handled.  D NSK provides tools to checkpoint a transaction in progress so that a< mirror image on a different CPU can take over and complete a
 transaction.    = VMS requires a "gateway" node running RTR who will resubmit a  transaction to another node.    H NSK also provides the hardware redundancy as well as OS support for such= redundancy so that some hardware failures are not seen by the G applications but still gerenate warnings to operators. VMS used to have  that with the FT vaxes.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 14:44:44 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> 0 Subject: Re: Computerworld: "Ready for trouble?"( Message-ID: <opsrej0uvjzgicya@hyrrokkin>  . On Thu, 26 May 2005 17:19:13 -0400, JF Mezei  % <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote:    > Tom Linden wrote: G >> I would be interested to see a comparison of VMS and NSK in terms of D >> probability of failuer and availability.  I suspect that for most >> applications K >> VMS does it just as well as NSK.  If I were Hurd, I would be trying to    >> sell & >> NSK, while it still has some value. > I > VMS is much more likle Google in that respect. It provides the illusion J > of total uptime because the failure of one box doesn't stop service. ButH > there are huge differences in how transactions in progress when a node > fails are handled. > F > NSK provides tools to checkpoint a transaction in progress so that a> > mirror image on a different CPU can take over and complete a > transaction.  G I am familiar with how it works,  but in practice restarting on another D cpu from the last checkpoint isn't terribly different from cluster  	 failover, H of course, likely the program would have to be restarted as opposed to   takingA off from last checkpoint, thus introducing an additional latency.    > ? > VMS requires a "gateway" node running RTR who will resubmit a  > transaction to another node. >  > J > NSK also provides the hardware redundancy as well as OS support for such? > redundancy so that some hardware failures are not seen by the I > applications but still gerenate warnings to operators. VMS used to have  > that with the FT vaxes.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 23:21:09 GMT * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com>0 Subject: Re: Computerworld: "Ready for trouble?"1 Message-ID: <FRsle.6120$RV4.882@news.cpqcorp.net>   : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote in message& news:42963D4A.B92E94A4@teksavvy.com...   > F > NSK provides tools to checkpoint a transaction in progress so that a> > mirror image on a different CPU can take over and complete a > transaction.   ...    >  > J > NSK also provides the hardware redundancy as well as OS support for such? > redundancy so that some hardware failures are not seen by the I > applications but still gerenate warnings to operators. VMS used to have  > that with the FT vaxes.   G From what I understand of NSK, it is a complete message passing system. E It doesn't do SMP.  Instead, CPU pairs run as independent nodes.  The D transaction processing system send messages between these instances.H If the instance fails to respond, then another instance takes over (mostD databases rely on multi-phase commits that make this possible).  TheG CPU node pairs are a lockstep pair of CPUs - if they ever differ - they I drop out (fail) of the system (IMHO - I don't think this part adds a huge  value).   K NSK is a unique kernel, with some UNIX bolted on to allow UNIX applications G to run (32-bit).  For what it does, it's absolutely reliable.  AFAIK it 	 *isn't* a J disaster tolerant system - that is, if the *site* fails - it fails.  AFAIK itE is also a single purpose type system - not a general purpose conputer 1 (even if it lets you run some UNIX applications).   F VMS is a SMP system.  The only CPU failure mode that isn't catastropicL in this type system is a detectable high rate of bcache errors... EverythingC else leaves the system in an indeterminate state.  So in the highly I unlikely event of a CPU failure, the VMS node is toast.  If you are using H VMS in a cluster, then you with some undefined lag, fail over to anotherE cluster member.  Those node could all have been running a transaction L system and it "could" all be transparent.  And it "could" be an entire site, and many miles apart.   C VMS is a general purpose system.  It can be used from anything from F realtime to timesharing to database transaction processing - just tuneJ it for your purpose.  It isn't the *best* at any of these things - you canC find "real" realtime systems, NSK is a "real" db transation system, I Tops-20 ;-) is a "real" timesharing system...  all of which are excellent  for their specific purpose.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 20:08:48 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 0 Subject: Re: Computerworld: "Ready for trouble?", Message-ID: <42966500.757DB4CA@teksavvy.com>   Tom Linden wrote:    I > I am familiar with how it works,  but in practice restarting on another D > cpu from the last checkpoint isn't terribly different from cluster > failover, H > of course, likely the program would have to be restarted as opposed to > takingC > off from last checkpoint, thus introducing an additional latency.   F The real issue is being able to provide garantee that any transactions in progress will not get lost.  G VMS is good at providing at least one host for an incoming transaction, A but no so great to handle failure in the middle of a transaction.   G There are ways around this, such as RTR, and one can write applications ; that are very cluster aware, and you could conceivably make H checkpointing between nodes and with lock manager make it possible for aA backup node to continue a transaction. But you could do that with G Windows too. NSK provides those tools so you don't have to rewite them.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 21:07:49 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 0 Subject: Re: Computerworld: "Ready for trouble?", Message-ID: <429672D1.47257543@teksavvy.com>   FredK wrote:I > From what I understand of NSK, it is a complete message passing system. G > It doesn't do SMP.  Instead, CPU pairs run as independent nodes.  The F > transaction processing system send messages between these instances.  H There is also communication between a master process on one node and itsG designated backup image on the backup node. But for this to happen, you H need software written to take advantage of this. Not all applications on= NSK are capable of running in "tandem" with a backup process.   F And this has interesting capacity planning implications since you needH to have sufficient processing to handle a semi-iddle backup process. AndH you need to distribute applications so that if one node fails, you don't overstress another node.  # > VMS is a general purpose system.    F WAS a general purpose system. Management has since greatlyt reduced itD versatility by reducing/stopping development in those areas that had. made it scalable from desktop to data centre.   D > it for your purpose.  It isn't the *best* at any of these things -  B VMS is still the best for clustering though, especially with nodesG separated by great distances. And with host based volume shadowing, you H also have the best in class in terms of disaster tolerance because it is. tighhtly coupled with the clustering software.   ------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 14:30:15 -0700# From: "Galen" <gltackett@gmail.com> . Subject: Re: DECwindows screen lock and PWDMIXB Message-ID: <1117143015.404449.39120@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   Paul,   E Thanks a million! We're currently without a support agreement but our F sales rep. treats us pretty well and may be able to get a copy for us.   Galen    ------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 13:49:07 -07007 From: "flamingomn@hotmail.com" <flamingomn@hotmail.com>  Subject: DEFRAG ovms 7.3-2C Message-ID: <1117140546.994013.180670@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   E In my current job, I have an ES45 with ovms 7.3-2 (no patches, that's F the next project). The company does NOT have a defragger for th disks.F Is there anything in the basic OVMS tools that I can do that will tellG me how defragged the disks are?  I'd like to show them that a defragger 
 is needed.! DECEVENT is not installed either.    thanks!  ann    ------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 14:22:29 -07007 From: "flamingomn@hotmail.com" <flamingomn@hotmail.com>  Subject: Re: DEFRAG ovms 7.3-2C Message-ID: <1117142549.709194.295840@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   F i remembered about ANALYZE/MEDIA.  when i try that though, it tells me* that the disk needs to be mounted foreign.   ann    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 17:34:09 -0400 - From: William Webb <william.w.webb@gmail.com>  Subject: Re: DEFRAG ovms 7.3-27 Message-ID: <8660a3a1050526143443b4fcf6@mail.gmail.com>   5 On 26 May 2005 13:49:07 -0700, flamingomn@hotmail.com  <flamingomn@hotmail.com> wrote: G > In my current job, I have an ES45 with ovms 7.3-2 (no patches, that's H > the next project). The company does NOT have a defragger for th disks.H > Is there anything in the basic OVMS tools that I can do that will tellI > me how defragged the disks are?  I'd like to show them that a defragger  > is needed.# > DECEVENT is not installed either.  >=20	 > thanks!  > ann  >=20 >=20  . I think you mean how fragmented the disks are.   : ^ )   > DFU (on the freeware CDs) will generate fragmentation reports.  D For a commercial site, however, you should use a commercial product.  > Any of the commercial vendors will be glad to give you a trial of their product. =20   : Contact me via email if you want recommendations and, more importantly, the opposite.   WWWebb --=20 C NOTE: This email address is only used for noncommerical VMS-related  correspondence. C All unsolicited commercial email will be deemed to be a request for 8 services pursuant to the terms and conditions located at# http://bellsouthpwp.net/w/e/webbww/    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 21:05:55 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> Subject: Re: DEFRAG ovms 7.3-2* Message-ID: <42968083.9C1ECDE@comcast.net>   "flamingomn@hotmail.com" wrote:  > G > In my current job, I have an ES45 with ovms 7.3-2 (no patches, that's H > the next project). The company does NOT have a defragger for th disks.H > Is there anything in the basic OVMS tools that I can do that will tellI > me how defragged the disks are?  I'd like to show them that a defragger  > is needed.  G Well, before you go doing that, first verify that disk fragmentation is C causing a performance problem. Otherwise, you'll be showing them "a   solution looking for a problem".  F Once you've accomplished that, if you still need it, look up Disk/FileG Utility (DFU) on the freeware CD. DFU's REPORT command shows a bunch of  good stuff about a volume.  # > DECEVENT is not installed either.   C That's a freebie if you have a support contract, but it suffers the H usual bit about annual license renewal if you need the features that theC license enables. Otherwise, it works just fine as a replacement for # ANALYZE/ERROR in a good many cases.    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 14:24:14 -0500 / From: "Stuart, Ed" <Ed.Stuart@austinenergy.com> % Subject: Encompass Board of Directors T Message-ID: <DA4AD590CAF06845B671C398333A89C60A88D2DC@ohms.electric.ci.austin.tx.us>  K It's time, once again, for the annual call for candidates for the Encompass  Board of Directors electionsK <http://www.encompassUS.org/news/electimeline2005.html>. All individual and G corporate members in good standing are eligible to run for the Board of K Directors. The directors elected will serve a three-year term, beginning on  January 1, 2006.    J As a member of Encompass, you have seen the benefits of participating in aK users group.  Managing a users group, however, affords you another level of I professional and personal benefit.  As a member of the Encompass Board of I Directors, you have an incredible opportunity to become a peer leader and F positively affect the future of this organization. We encourage you toK explore this opportunity and put your vision for the future of Encompass in 	 motion.     8 If you are interested in being a candidate, please go toH <http://www.encompassUS.org/news/electimeline2005.html> to complete your application for candidacy.  J The deadline for submitting your application for candidacy is Friday, JuneJ 10, 2005. The Encompass Nominating Committee will interview all applicantsH and the slate of candidates will be announced on the Web site on July 8, 2005.      : Thank you for your support and participation in Encompass!  
 Sincerely," The Encompass Nominating Committee   Martin Anilane Michelle Popejoy	 Ed Stuart    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 16:25:56 -0400  From: norm.raphael@metso.com) Subject: Re: Encompass Board of Directors Q Message-ID: <OFB90D0A85.32B9D74B-ON8525700D.00700BEA-8525700D.007049DD@metso.com>   J "Stuart, Ed" <Ed.Stuart@austinenergy.com> wrote on 05/26/2005 03:24:14 PM:  C > It's time, once again, for the annual call for candidates for the 	 Encompass  > Board of Directors electionsI > <http://www.encompassUS.org/news/electimeline2005.html>. All individual  and I > corporate members in good standing are eligible to run for the Board of J > Directors. The directors elected will serve a three-year term, beginning on > January 1, 2006. > J > As a member of Encompass, you have seen the benefits of participating in a J > users group.  Managing a users group, however, affords you another level ofK > professional and personal benefit.  As a member of the Encompass Board of K > Directors, you have an incredible opportunity to become a peer leader and H > positively affect the future of this organization. We encourage you toJ > explore this opportunity and put your vision for the future of Encompass in	 > motion.  > : > If you are interested in being a candidate, please go toJ > <http://www.encompassUS.org/news/electimeline2005.html> to complete your > application for candidacy. >   % FYI:  BOD Members whose terms are up:    1. Clay Denton 2. Clyde Poole 3. Kristi Browder   J You should either have the skillsets to compete against these individuals,D or should any choose not to run for reelection, replace them, and to7 complement the skillsets of the remaining 6 incumbents.   G > The deadline for submitting your application for candidacy is Friday,  JuneA > 10, 2005. The Encompass Nominating Committee will interview all 
 applicantsJ > and the slate of candidates will be announced on the Web site on July 8, > 2005.  > < > Thank you for your support and participation in Encompass! >  > Sincerely,$ > The Encompass Nominating Committee >  > Martin Anilane > Michelle Popejoy > Ed Stuart    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 17:39:19 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> ) Subject: Re: Encompass Board of Directors , Message-ID: <429641FE.B93CCFD6@teksavvy.com>   "Stuart, Ed" wrote:  > M > It's time, once again, for the annual call for candidates for the Encompass  > Board of Directors elections  + Does Encompass have any relevance anymore ?   H If it doesn't want to be DECUS, then it should fold itself into Interex.H You either have a user group focused on DEC gear/software (DECUS) or one: which is tied to its vendor's product portfolio (Interex).   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 16:32:41 -0400 $ From: "Hein" <hein.nomail@hp.nomail>Y Subject: Re: HELP! Serious Alpha Image Activation problem. Symbol Resolution - No errors  , Message-ID: <42957af4$1@usenet01.boi.hp.com>  ? "Richard Maher" <maher_rj@hotspamnotmail.com> wrote in message  9 news:d74vre$cct$1@nwrdmz02.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com... 
 > Et tu Hein?  > H > PLEASE shoot me down in flames on this, but dosen't SHR just create a  > Global$ > Section/ Process Shared data area?  M Yeah well, I put a caveat in my reply, as I could not readily find a systems  K with a cobol compiler (with a valid license), such that I could not try it   out like I normally would.  L I _thought_, best I could tell, that such global section shareable was what  you wanted. 7 Of course then you would have to install that shareable   8 I now found a compiler (on the 'testdrive' machine. See  http://www.testdrive.hp.com/ )D And when I tried it, with shr it of course told me to go pound sand: $ run test1 . %DCL-W-ACTIMAGE, error activating image SHARE17 -CLI-E-IMGNAME, image file $1$DKB300:[HEIN]SHARE1.EXE;2 A -SYSTEM-F-NOTINSTALL, writable shareable images must be installed    Taking my hp hat off... K So I could not shoot you down for that, but I'd like to shoot you down for  3 bothering us with this piece of shoddy engineering. M And no "it happened to work in the past" is no excuse for the pile of rubish   it is.K Ok, that's about as 'harsh' as I dare get in a public forum, putting my hp   hat back on...  . Thank you for your consise problem reproducer.L It looks like the Alpha linker refuses to 'pass on' global definitions from 3 a sub-ordinate share to a current share being made. J I would recommend you review that build procedures used as they appear to K create needless dependencies that might hurt you in maintaing the software   in question.M As there a particular reason why you can not have 'test1' directly reference  	 'share1'?  The following appears to work:   $ type tmp.com $! $ on warning then exit* $ define/nolog share1 sys$login:share1.exe* $ define/nolog share2 sys$login:share2.exe $! $ create share1.mar            .title  Share One  my_sym == 1 ?         .psect  global_var,long,pic,ovr,rel,gbl,noshr,noexe,wrt /                         .ascii          "Hello" )                         .blkb           3   =         .psect  my_code,pic,con,rel,lcl,shr,exe,rd,nowrt,long   $         .call_entry     label=my_sub         movzbl  #1,r0          ret            .end $! $ macro share1.mar> $ link/share=sys$login:share1.exe share1.obj,sys$input/options1 symbol_vector = (                               - 1                 my_sub             = procedure, - 1                 global_var         = psect,     - 1                 my_sym             = data       -                  )  $! $ create share2.cob  identification division. program-id.    share2. data division. working-storage section.C 01  my_sym                  pic 9(9)   comp  value external my_sym. 0 01  global_var              pic x(5)   external. procedure division.  00. 4     display "Share2 sym = ", my_sym with conversion.(     display "Share2 gbl = ", global_var.     call "my_sub".     exit program.  end program share2.  $! $ cobol/lis share2.cob: $ link/share=sys$login:share2.exe share2.obj,sys$input/opt sys$login:share1.exe/share psect_attr=global_var,noshr ' symbol_vector = (  share2 = procedure )  $! $ create test1.cob identification division. program-id.    test1.  data division. working-storage section.C 01  my_sym                  pic 9(9)   comp  value external my_sym. 0 01  global_var              pic x(5)   external. procedure division.  00. 3     display "Test1 sym = ", my_sym with conversion. '     display "Test1 gbl = ", global_var.      call "share2".
     stop run.  end program test1. $ cobol/lis test1.cob  $ link test1.obj,sys$input/opt psect_attr=global_var,noshr  sys$login:share1.exe/share sys$login:share2.exe/share $! $ @tmp $ run test1  Test1 sym =         1  Test1 gbl = Hello  Share2 sym =         1 Share2 gbl = Hello  M Of course the above is just with my 'trying to help' HP hat on, and I am not  L speaking with any authority or any linkage (sic) with VMS engineering other D than that I happened to work in that group for a while a decade ago.  M For official support in this matter, well you would have to open a call with   support!   Hope this helps some,  Regards, Hein.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 27 May 2005 07:31:55 +0200 - From: Didier Morandi <prenom.nom@freesurf.fr> Y Subject: Hewlett-Packard is expected to announce a new line of NonStop servers next week  4 Message-ID: <4296b0cd$0$26619$626a14ce@news.free.fr>  . Final step next week for HP's Itanium makeover  Stephen Shankland, CNET News.com  J http://www.zdnetindia.com/biztech/resources/serverzone/stories/122507.html  F Hewlett-Packard is expected to announce a new line of NonStop servers C next week, the final step in its plan to converge all its high-end  C server lines onto the Itanium processor, CNET News.com has learned.   H The NonStop servers are high-end machines used for demanding tasks such G as those required by the Nasdaq stock exchange. The machines today use  G Silicon Graphics' MIPS processors, making them something of an outcast  ? in HP's product lines, but moving to Itanium likely will boost   performance and reduce prices.  D The first Itanium-based NonStop models are expected to be generally D available in June and will use the current "Madison" version of the F processor, sources familiar with the situation said. HP will announce B the servers June 1, according to another source familiar with the  company's plans.  I Itanium, a chip family HP helped Intel develop, fell well short of early  ? expectations, but it's a more mainstream hardware and software  H foundation than MIPS. As a result, HP's years-long plan to move NonStop D to Itanium likely will help make the servers more competitive, said # Illuminata analyst Jonathan Eunice.   9 "I think that will fix a lot of the historical price and  A price-performance bugaboos," Eunice said. "NonStop will never be  H cheap--but at least it won't be wholly out of line with the rest of the  world."   ' HP declined to comment for this report.   G The Palo Alto, Calif.-based printer and computer maker expects a major  E performance boost out of the Itanium systems. The top-end MIPS-based  E S88000 introduced in 2004 has about 1.3 times the performance of its  H predecessor S86000, but HP believes the first Itanium systems will have G as much as 2.6 times that performance, according to an HP presentation   seen by CNET News.com.  B And future versions will doubtless be faster. A second-generation G Itanium NonStop model is scheduled to debut in late 2006 using Intel's  H "Montecito" version of Itanium, which employs dual processing cores and A which is due to arrive at the end of 2005, the presentation said.   H And a system with Montecito's "Montvale" successor is scheduled for the G second half of 2008. Further Itanium NonStop sequels are scheduled for  0 late 2009 and early 2011, the presentation said.  G The new line is expected to pick up not just the Itanium processor but  F also the Integrity brand name that's used for HP's mainstream Itanium E servers. It's expected to be called the Integrity NonStop NS-series.  G Another component making its way from the mainstream Integrity line to  G NonStop is the zx1 chipset to link processors to each other, to memory  & and to all other computing subsystems.  D The NonStop machines are the most powerful HP sells. That's because E software runs on top of a tightly linked network of numerous smaller  F machines that collectively make up a NonStop. In addition, processors E are linked in pairs that run in lockstep so processing errors can be   caught quickly.   H "NonStop is in there with (NCR's) Teradata and (IBM's) zSeries as folks C who've scaled the tallest peaks, and routinely do so with aplomb,"  D Eunice said. NonStop customers include Sabre Holdings, Barclaycard,  Travelocity and Vodafone.    Processor whiplash. The move to Itanium hasn't been easy, however.  D The NonStop line has endured some processor hairpin turns in recent C years. An initial plan to move from MIPS to Itanium was changed to  H feature the Alpha processor after Compaq Computer acquired Tandem. Then G Compaq decided to cancel the Alpha in 2001, and HP acquired Compaq and  & engineers dusted off the Itanium plan.  I And now the Itanium NonStop systems are arriving a few months late. When  C HP finalized its Compaq acquisition in 2002, it said it planned to   release the systems in 2004.  F Then there's the fact that delays and software barriers meant Itanium A didn't live up to the early hopes of HP and Intel. The companies  D expected Itanium to dominate the server market, but the chip missed F Intel shipment goals, and both companies now position it just for the  high-end server segment.  A Itanium is faring better than SGI's MIPS, though, and there's no  B question that the chip is permitting HP to gradually simplify its ! complicated processor foundation.   G The last new Alpha processor, the EV7z, has been released. The OpenVMS  H operating system that most often runs on Alpha-based machines today now H can run on Itanium, too. And the PA-8900 processor--the final member of C HP's PA-RISC processor family that powers the HP 9000 line of Unix   servers--is imminent.   D In the future, HP will use just two processor families: Itanium for H high-end servers, and x86 chips such as Intel's Xeon and Advanced Micro H Devices' Opteron for lower-end systems. The simplification is important G for HP as it tries to dramatically cut operating expenses and increase   profitability.  I HP's NonStop Enterprise Division has for years been led by Pauline Nist,  E a vice president. In May, however, Martin Fink took over the role in  I addition to his job as leader of the Open Source and Linux Organization.  G Nist now leads the Total Customer Experience group for HP's Enterprise   Server and Storage division.   D. --  1 Didier MORANDI - Expert informaticien - VMS / SAP 0   13 chemin du Gu, 1213 Petit-Lancy (GE) Suisse0 Tl. : +33(0)6 7983 6418 ~ www.didiermorandi.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 14:06:01 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> = Subject: Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter 0 Message-ID: <119c3v2dhgt4i20@corp.supernews.com>   icerq4a@spray.se wrote:  >  > JF Mezei wrote:  >  >>icerq4a@spray.se wrote:  >>J >>>Considering that HP is in a transition phase, I am surprised they do asI >>>well as they do. IBM is not in a transition phase, so I expect them to ; >>>have better figures, anything else would be embarrasing.  >>0 >>Transition phase ? Perhaps Transition Decade ? >>H >>HP has been transitioning HP-UX for how long now ? 10 years ?  So, theH >>IA64 came in very late in 2001 and was unusable, but HP customers haveD >>known since the mid 1990s that PaRisc was dead. And they are still! >>buying it over that IA64 thing.  >  > H > Real product usable for transition began to be available in 2002-2003.F > I think it is first in 2005 that the Integrity line is or will be onH > pair with 9000 on features, so lots of customers have had no reason toF > switch yet. Their current stuff works just fine. Migrations have notE > even yet begun. 2006-2008 is when PA-RISC users will begin to move. B > Most current Integrity sales are new systems and not systems for > replacement. >   G Well, as usual, you seem to miss the important part.  It was mid 1990s  I when HP-UX users were told that IA-64 would be the future.  Read that as   PA-RISC is a DEAD END!  I Any rational driver, when headed toward a brick wall, will find some way  + to stop or turn away from such an obsticle.   F PA-RISC users have known for 10 years that one day they would want to B buy a new system, and HP would say "too bad, none available, ever C again".  Such a fact automatically places users into a 'transition  G phase' regardless of how long of a period is involved.  Ok, reasonable  , period.  If it was 100 years, not a problem.  G Once HP made the announcement, any user would be looking at that brick  H wall, regardless of when the itanic became available, and regardless of + how long PA-RISC continued to be available.    --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 14:07:52 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> = Subject: Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter 0 Message-ID: <119c428p6db7n6c@corp.supernews.com>   JF Mezei wrote:  > AEF wrote: > K >>>As for what Hurd plans to do with HP, he said that he had spent the past H >>>month visiting thousands of HP customers and managers to get his head >  >  >>Thousands? In one month?   >  > J > read: He attended 6 marketing events where both customers and management@ > were present and where attendance was about 333.33333 persons.  G And how many fo those 333.33333 persons actually discussed their needs  I with him?  More likely, he talked, and they listened, with perhaps a few   questions from the audience.   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------   Date: 26 May 2005 18:29:54 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)= Subject: Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter + Message-ID: <3fmit2F8ei10U1@individual.net>   0 In article <119c428p6db7n6c@corp.supernews.com>,* 	Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes: > JF Mezei wrote: 
 >> AEF wrote:  >>  L >>>>As for what Hurd plans to do with HP, he said that he had spent the pastI >>>>month visiting thousands of HP customers and managers to get his head  >>   >>   >>>Thousands? In one month?  >>   >>  K >> read: He attended 6 marketing events where both customers and management A >> were present and where attendance was about 333.33333 persons.  > I > And how many fo those 333.33333 persons actually discussed their needs  K > with him?  More likely, he talked, and they listened, with perhaps a few   > questions from the audience.  E Much more likely a Windows Salesdroid talked and he stood int he back C out of the lights so no one actually knew he was there,  After all, B it says "visited". It doesn't say he actually had any contact with any of them.   bill    --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 11:44:10 -0700 From: icerq4a@spray.se= Subject: Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter B Message-ID: <1117133050.021013.11280@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>   Dave Froble wrote: > icerq4a@spray.se wrote:  > >  > > JF Mezei wrote:  > >  > >>icerq4a@spray.se wrote:  > >>L > >>>Considering that HP is in a transition phase, I am surprised they do asK > >>>well as they do. IBM is not in a transition phase, so I expect them to = > >>>have better figures, anything else would be embarrasing.  > >>2 > >>Transition phase ? Perhaps Transition Decade ? > >>J > >>HP has been transitioning HP-UX for how long now ? 10 years ?  So, theJ > >>IA64 came in very late in 2001 and was unusable, but HP customers haveF > >>known since the mid 1990s that PaRisc was dead. And they are still# > >>buying it over that IA64 thing.  > >  > > J > > Real product usable for transition began to be available in 2002-2003.H > > I think it is first in 2005 that the Integrity line is or will be onJ > > pair with 9000 on features, so lots of customers have had no reason toH > > switch yet. Their current stuff works just fine. Migrations have notG > > even yet begun. 2006-2008 is when PA-RISC users will begin to move. D > > Most current Integrity sales are new systems and not systems for > > replacement. > >  > H > Well, as usual, you seem to miss the important part.  It was mid 1990sJ > when HP-UX users were told that IA-64 would be the future.  Read that as > PA-RISC is a DEAD END!  F I don't doubt that, so I dont't understand what I miss. IA64 is partlyG a HP architecture and has been intended as the successor to PA-RISC for ; many years. Do you think I think PA-RISC is not a dead end?   G > PA-RISC users have known for 10 years that one day they would want to C > buy a new system, and HP would say "too bad, none available, ever 	 > again".   < PA-RISC users have been well aware of the situation of IA64,7 and HP have been pretty solid on their PA-RISC roadmap.   ;   Such a fact automatically places users into a 'transition H > phase' regardless of how long of a period is involved.  Ok, reasonable. > period.  If it was 100 years, not a problem.  * I don't understand what you want to say...D The _real_ transition phase began in 2003, before that and even tillD today most PA-RISC have been happy with what they have had. That has= not been such a large problem. The Alpha situation is totally 
 different.   ------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 11:54:02 -0700 From: icerq4a@spray.se= Subject: Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter C Message-ID: <1117133642.249477.147050@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>    Bill Todd wrote: > icerq4a@spray.se wrote:  >  > ...  > D > > Most current Integrity sales are new systems and not systems for > > replacement. > + > Do you have an actual reference for that,   / It something I have heard from HP sales people.    > or is it a 'fact' which you 2 > just decided to pull out of some bodily orifice?  & Is that an american way of insulting ?5 I thought especially you were more elegant than that?   E > For example, it would not take a *huge* migrating percentage of the E > Tru64 base to have accounted for a sizable percentage of BCS Itanic H > sales (given the modest magnitude of the latter) - and unlike the caseJ > with HP-UX (or even VMS), Tru64 customers who have decided to migrate atH > all have no reason to delay their move to HP-UX (however much they mayH > regret its necessity) but rather considerable incentive to start usingH > it for replacement systems as early as possible to see what they're up
 > against.  > I think most try to run their old systems as long as possible.7 HP ofcourse try to use money as an incentive to switch.    ------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 14:24:02 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) = Subject: Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter 3 Message-ID: <1zmIm6F$PSwP@eisner.encompasserve.org>   \ In article <1117133642.249477.147050@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>, icerq4a@spray.se writes:  ( > Is that an american way of insulting ?  A Please do not characterize all Americans for the habits of a few, A particularly when we have killfiled those few and only read their   comments when you quote them :-)   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 17:28:46 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> = Subject: Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter , Message-ID: <42963F86.DB54B47F@teksavvy.com>   icerq4a@spray.se wrote:    > > PA-RISC users have been well aware of the situation of IA64,9 > and HP have been pretty solid on their PA-RISC roadmap.   E HP had no problem extending the PaRisc chip lifetime when it realised , how late IA64 was. The roadmap was extended.  G HP quickened Alpha's demise by cancelling EV79, and changing the "Sales E at least until 2006" to "Sales end in 2006" even though customers are + not ready tomigrate to that IA64 thing yet.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 20:34:45 -0400 ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>= Subject: Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter = Message-ID: <g72dnXcHvqu79gvfRVn-sQ@metrocastcablevision.com>    icerq4a@spray.se wrote:  >  > Bill Todd wrote: >  >>icerq4a@spray.se wrote:  >> >>...  >> >>C >>>Most current Integrity sales are new systems and not systems for  >>>replacement.  >>+ >>Do you have an actual reference for that,  >  > 1 > It something I have heard from HP sales people.   E That places it somewhere in the limbo that connects fact, rumor, and   outright lies.   >  >  >>or is it a 'fact' which you 2 >>just decided to pull out of some bodily orifice? >  > ( > Is that an american way of insulting ?  I No:  it's a way of emphasizing that when one makes an assertion which is  D not prima facie obvious, one should provide something to back it up.  7 > I thought especially you were more elegant than that?   I I'm elegant when I consider it appropriate, not to meet any expectations  < which others might have.  In this case, I chose to be blunt.  H In a larger sense, what you think about Americans based on interchanges I in a newsgroup is not of much concern to me, especially considering that  @ what any competent individual thinks of us these days should be H dominated by the actions of our government - given that we've chosen to ? keep the current administration in office despite its flagrant  I violations of both domestic and international law.  Of course, they seem  F to have done much the same in both England and Australia, making them D rather like Italy and Spain playing to our Germany of the '30s (and C indeed the kind of blatant power-grabs going on here right now are  A reminiscent of some of the Nazis' maneuvering shortly before any  F pretense at democracy ceased to be necessary for them, so I'd suggest G worrying more about that and how it may affect the rest of the world -  G we may deserve to stew in the pot which we've created, but you don't -    than about newsgroup etiquette).   - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Fri, 27 May 2005 02:05:42 GMT * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com>= Subject: Re: HP Pulls Off a Respectable Second Fiscal Quarter 2 Message-ID: <Wfvle.6122$W_4.1903@news.cpqcorp.net>  5 "Bill Todd" <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote in message 7 news:g72dnXcHvqu79gvfRVn-sQ@metrocastcablevision.com...  > icerq4a@spray.se wrote:   9 > > I thought especially you were more elegant than that?  > J > I'm elegant when I consider it appropriate, not to meet any expectations> > which others might have.  In this case, I chose to be blunt. >   D Elegant?  Eloquent?  Neither of these seem to apply to anything I've9 yet read.  Belligerent?  Obstinate?  Obtuse?  Delusional?   
 Got Whine?  > Go ahead, wax "eloquent" in response ;-)  Let me paraphrase to@ help you out.  Alpha = gods work.  HP evil - infected by Compaq.; Weakened by wicked Digital.  IBM Power great.  AMD new god. = Kill VMS.  Die.  Die.  Die.  Bill omnipotent - seer of seers, = prognosticator of prognosticators (it's always groundhog day,  and Alpha died this morning).   2 I won't try to capture your political leanings ;-)   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 23:10:10 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> D Subject: HP to help governments with tracking users with NAtional ID+ Message-ID: <42968F77.794EECD@teksavvy.com>   G This is one time where I am happy HP is ignoring VMS. While such PR may G be good news in the USA, it isn't something HP should be bragging about E outside the USA where people still value governments who don't follow + their ever step and financial transactions.   C Besiodes, in countries with data privacy laws, the use of Microsoft 8 software may not be tolerated to safeguard private data.   ##> Hewlett-Packard plans to launch a product on Friday that helps4 governments check the digital identity of citizens.   F The technology, called the HP National Identity System, is designed toE be used in conjunction with a number of Microsoft products, including H its .Net line of server, database and middleware programs. The companies: plan to jointly develop, market and offer training for the authentication system.    B The product can be used to authenticate visitors to government Web@ sites, to control access to services and manage citizens' online identity, HP said.    ; In addition, the new product includes technology to make ID H documents--such as passports, driver's licenses and identity cards--moreF secure and "intelligent," the company said. The technology can fulfillD new secure ID requirements designed to heighten security at national borders, the company said.    H The National Identity System can handle numerous tasks, including onlineB and offline identity verification, live capture of demographic andD biometric data, and secure access to documents. It's also compatibleE with various biometric identification systems and incorporates public = key infrastructure and digital signatures, the company said.   ##   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 21:35:00 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>2 Subject: Re: I guess this means all is well again.+ Message-ID: <42968754.4D526341@comcast.net>    Wayne wrote: > 1 > http://www.infoconomy.com/pages/group106391.adp   F I think it means that others are discovering what we've known lo these many years.    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 14:10:05 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> ! Subject: Re: Installing a printer 0 Message-ID: <119c46e2mjf19c8@corp.supernews.com>   Doc. wrote: & > %NEWS-I-NEWMSG, Dave Froble wrote in* > news:1199g6gfq8kfgd8@corp.supernews.com  >  >  >>MJS wrote: >  > G >>>I've been wondering about that, read the DCPS System Manager manual  F >>>today but it only referred to Network or Serial printing. Can't say. >>>I've ever heard of a serial printer though? >>  >>That makes me feel really old. >  > M > Personally I pity the people that have never worked on code printed on 132-  > column music-score paper.  > & > Real listings have coffee rings. :-) >  >  > Doc.  E You can write on 'real listings', and they don't give you a headache.    --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 11:10:31 -07001 From: nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett) ! Subject: Re: Installing a printer - Message-ID: <ySn1enN00n6G@malvm7.mala.bc.ca.>   7 In article <8660a3a10505260831180bb4f8@mail.gmail.com>, 3     William Webb <william.w.webb@gmail.com> writes:  > 8 > Real line printers have bands and rows of hammers. =20 > *    I thought real line printers had drums.  ;    If it takes less than 4 people to move it then it can't   be a real line printer can it?   ------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 20:32:32 +01006 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)! Subject: Re: Installing a printer , Message-ID: <42963260$1@news.langstoeger.at>  p In article <OFE1CB18BA.25AD09D5-ON8525700C.0074965A-8525700C.0074D8FB@metso.com>, norm.raphael@metso.com writes:M >I think what's wanted here is a JetDirect parallel-to-ethernet box (or other M >vendors box ;) ) or card if the printer supports one, to interface to the IP 	 >network.   M As the vendors page tell, the printer already has a JetDirect card installed. K So all what's wanted here is to use it. But that was so far not what the OP : intended. He might has changed his mind in the meantime...   --   Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialist  E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 20:53:44 +01006 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)! Subject: Re: Installing a printer , Message-ID: <42963758$1@news.langstoeger.at>  T In article <3fkcerF8bpmcU1@individual.net>, Paul Sture <paul.sture@decus.ch> writes:C >But the JetDirect cards cost a fortune. I did find an alternative  G >solution early last year - look for stuff called "Print Servers". The  H >ones I'm thinking of could interface 2,4,8 etc parallel printers to an 7 >ethernet connection, giving each their own IP address.   M Which is one method, another method is giving them their own TCP port number.   G And the question for the HP JetDirect doesn't arise. Because the "N" in J "HP Laserjet 5100dtn" means the JetDirect (EIO) is already in the printer.   --   Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialist  E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 20:55:50 +0100 ( From: MJS <maniac449@nospam.hotmail.com>! Subject: Re: Installing a printer 9 Message-ID: <429629be$0$335$cc9e4d1f@news.dial.pipex.com>    Dave Froble wrote: > MJS wrote: > # >> Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote:  >>B >>> In article <42941b7d$0$347$cc9e4d1f@news.dial.pipex.com>, MJS * >>> <maniac449@nospam.hotmail.com> writes: >>> I >>>> We'd like to use the parallel port 'LRA0:' but also have the option  H >>>> of Ethernet.  As LRA0: is displayed when I 'SH DEV' I take it that 2 >>>> the driver for the port is already installed? >>>  >>>  >>>  >>> G >>> Yup. The driver for the parallel port is part of OpenVMS itself and D >>> is loaded automatically if the hardware is found (at boot time). >>> K >>> But, you can't use DCPS (as was my previous suggestion) on the parallel A >>> port. DCPS requires bidirectional communication (with the PS   >>> interpreter)H >>> and doesn't like parallel ports even when bidirectional (don't know 	 >>> why). K >>> And DCPS has a lot of goodies I personally can not imagine to ever miss  >>> again. So reconsider LAN.  >>>  >>G >> I've been wondering about that, read the DCPS System Manager manual  G >> today but it only referred to Network or Serial printing. Can't say  . >> I've ever heard of a serial printer though? >  >   > That makes me feel really old.  G I'm no spring chicken myself, just more used to PC systems (and Amigas  H from a long time ago) & using Parallel, USB or Ethernet; never heard of < serial printing.  Oh what a sheltered upbringing I've had :)  F Trying to setup a printer on VMS has been a real eye-opener, I wish I  could say in a good sense.   > I >> Looks as though my only real option is to acquire DCPS from somewhere  G >> an use the second Ethernet port on the AlphaServer for the printer,  , >> best I start reading up on UCX as well :( >  > C > No.  You don't run a direct point to point connection when using  K > ethernet.  Just hook the printer up as another node on whatever existing   > ethernet you already have. >   G I've use direct point to point Ethernet before (for a home PC network)  E by using a cross-over cable instead of a patch cable, are you saying  6 that this won't work for AlphaServer to Printer setup?  I Apologies for the late reply but a certain football match in Turkey last  G night had my complete attention, 'You'll Never Walk Alone' (sorry that   crept our ;) ).   
 Thanks to all  MJS    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 16:09:32 -0400 - From: William Webb <william.w.webb@gmail.com> ! Subject: Re: Installing a printer 7 Message-ID: <8660a3a1050526130972c519da@mail.gmail.com>   . On 26 May 2005 11:10:31 -0700, Malcolm Dunnett" <nothome@spammers.are.scum> wrote:9 > In article <8660a3a10505260831180bb4f8@mail.gmail.com>, 4 >    William Webb <william.w.webb@gmail.com> writes: > > < > > Real line printers have bands and rows of hammers. =3D20 > > + >   I thought real line printers had drums.  >=20; >   If it takes less than 4 people to move it then it can't   > be a real line printer can it? >=20 >=20  # How many sysadmins does it take....    --=20 C NOTE: This email address is only used for noncommerical VMS-related  correspondence. C All unsolicited commercial email will be deemed to be a request for 8 services pursuant to the terms and conditions located at# http://bellsouthpwp.net/w/e/webbww/    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 21:18:08 +0100 ( From: MJS <maniac449@nospam.hotmail.com>! Subject: Re: Installing a printer 9 Message-ID: <42962ef8$0$388$cc9e4d1f@news.dial.pipex.com>     Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote:f > In article <4294a25f$0$316$cc9e4d1f@news.dial.pipex.com>, MJS <maniac449@nospam.hotmail.com> writes: > F >>I've been wondering about that, read the DCPS System Manager manual K >>today but it only referred to Network or Serial printing. Can't say I've  ( >>ever heard of a serial printer though? >  > P > Wow, a newbie ;-) My first printer was a serial one: ITOH 8510SCR with 9600 BdP > Parallel was faster at this time (but a later times 115 kBd was quite as fast)P > but the dot matrix part of the printer was mostly the limiting factor, not theK > transfer speed (except maybe a complete page with graphics or selfdefined F > and downloaded character set). So, 9600Bd was enough for many years.0 > Things changed when PostScript was invented... >   H Newbie! Only to OVMS.  I have to say it does remind me of my Amiga days E in some respect, a good reliable OS but not much in the way of 'high   street' support.  I Can't beleive that one comment about serial printers has sparked so many   posts :O  M > Parallel had also the problem of what interface, Centronics or Dataproducts * > to use, which later Centronics won, IIRC > P > I was also a proud owner of a ITOH 1550 later (which was the 8510 with 132col)N > I did also use LA120 and LA100 printers from DEC, but I never owned them ;-) >   > Time Out!  Reminiscing about printers is entirely too geekish.   > K >>Looks as though my only real option is to acquire DCPS from somewhere an  J >>use the second Ethernet port on the AlphaServer for the printer, best I $ >>start reading up on UCX as well :( >  > M > Only if you insist on DCPS. And if you have a DCPS supported printer (which M > also means with a postscript interpreter) like yours and use network (means L > IP) printing, then I recommend DCPS (not pure TCPIP/UCX/TCPware/Multinet). > M > But you don't really need DCPS (like you don't need multinational character E > sets or graphics, pure ASCII does work, too - and did for decades).  > L > You also don't need to use the 2nd LAN port. What's wrong with the first ?> > Is the printer an equipment not to be connected to the LAN ? >  > HIH  >   F I need to print text files and PostScript formatted reports, and from 0 what I've gathered so far DCPS is the way ahead.  I If DCPS is the 'best' way to use a printer on VMS, why isn't it included  L on the driver disk as standard, particularly for 'Bulk/Commercial' printers?   MJS    ------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 15:07:15 -0500; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) ! Subject: Re: Installing a printer 3 Message-ID: <g6RZC8E98nv6@eisner.encompasserve.org>   V In article <3fm0bmF8gbinU1@individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes: > I > That's not the box that NASA needed a PDP-11 to read the telemetry from  > a few uears back, is it?  :-)   E    No.  I finished the port from the 11/70 to the 11/785 by replacing F    the latter with a 4000 Model 405.  The UDA was causing problems for    us.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 23:45:46 +0200 & From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@decus.ch>! Subject: Re: Installing a printer + Message-ID: <3fmubkF8gtd4U1@individual.net>    William Webb wrote:   B > On 25 May 2005 19:57:09 GMT, Doc. <doc@openvms-rocks.com> wrote: > & >>%NEWS-I-NEWMSG, Dave Froble wrote in) >>news:1199g6gfq8kfgd8@corp.supernews.com  >> >>
 >>>MJS wrote:  >>G >>>>I've been wondering about that, read the DCPS System Manager manual G >>>>today but it only referred to Network or Serial printing. Can't say / >>>>I've ever heard of a serial printer though?  >>> ! >>>That makes me feel really old.  >>M >>Personally I pity the people that have never worked on code printed on 132-  >>column music-score paper.  >>& >>Real listings have coffee rings. :-) >> >> >>Doc. >>--I >>OpenVMS:     Eight out of ten hackers prefer *other* operating systems. I >>http://www.openvms-rocks.com    Deathrow Public-Access OpenVMS Cluster.  >> >  > 6 > Real line printers have bands and rows of hammers.   > N > They can be used as musical instruments if you know what to print, and when. > H And need a set of gorilla sized guys to get them up a couple of flights 
 of stairs.   ------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 21:29:23 -0400+ From: "Joe Heimann" <heimann@ecs.umass.edu> ! Subject: Re: Installing a printer + Message-ID: <429677f3@news-1.oit.umass.edu>   2 Malcolm Dunnett <nothome@spammers.are.scum> wrote:9 > In article <8660a3a10505260831180bb4f8@mail.gmail.com>, 5 >     William Webb <william.w.webb@gmail.com> writes:  >>  9 >> Real line printers have bands and rows of hammers. =20  >>  , >    I thought real line printers had drums.  D Real line printers had print chains running in oil.  Hammers to makeD much loud noises, especially if the chain broke...  Oil all over the place if that happened as well.   = >    If it takes less than 4 people to move it then it can't    > be a real line printer can it?  D All the band and drum printers I ever moved only took two persons toD move as long as the casters were not broken.  The last chain printerB I worked with needed to be split into two units before it could be moved.   ------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 19:37:11 -0700 From: wthompson@racalinst.com " Subject: installing decnet productB Message-ID: <1117161431.793106.86860@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>  E I have successfully mounted what I considered to be the proper CD-ROM B -- the OpenVMS Alpha V7.2-1 Layered Products but I when I type theG command at the dollar prompt, "product install decnet_oci", it does not  recognize the product name.   E I think I am missing a step here.  When I enter this command one word  at a time it prompts me with:    _Product name (* to show list):      And if I enter   *    It says " no products were found matching: *  G .  So I am wondering if I have to give the system a product definition. =  It says "no products" and yet if I type "dir", I can clearly 4 see that I am looking at the contents of the CD-ROM.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 27 May 2005 03:13:23 +0000 7 From: David B Sneddon - bigpond <dbsneddon@bigpond.com> & Subject: Re: installing decnet product* Message-ID: <42969053.6030403@bigpond.com>  - wthompson@racalinst.com mentioned in passing: G > I have successfully mounted what I considered to be the proper CD-ROM D > -- the OpenVMS Alpha V7.2-1 Layered Products but I when I type theI > command at the dollar prompt, "product install decnet_oci", it does not  > recognize the product name.  > G > I think I am missing a step here.  When I enter this command one word  > at a time it prompts me with:  > ! > _Product name (* to show list):  >  >  > And if I enter >  > *  > 	 > It says $ > no products were found matching: * > I > .  So I am wondering if I have to give the system a product definition. ? >  It says "no products" and yet if I type "dir", I can clearly 6 > see that I am looking at the contents of the CD-ROM.   $ HELP PRODUCT INSTALL/SOURCE    may be of some assistance.   Regards, Dave --  B David B Sneddon (dbs) VMS Systems Programmer dbsneddon@bigpond.comB Sneddo's quick guide ...   http://www.users.bigpond.com/dbsneddon/B DBS freeware   http://www.users.bigpond.com/dbsneddon/software.htm   ------------------------------    Date: 26 May 2005 11:06:54 -0700$ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> Subject: Re: SEARCH : AND NOT ? C Message-ID: <1117130814.675756.304280@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    JF Mezei wrote:  > Is there a way to do:  > 3 > SEARCH RECIPES.TXT  CAKE,VANILLA /MATCH=AND_NOT ?  > J > In other words, I want all records that contain "CAKE" but NOT "VANILLA" > G > I know I can probably use a pipe to get all records that contain CAKE J > piked into a search that excludes anything with VANILLA. But it would be1 > nice to be able to do this in a single command.  >  > Is there a trick ? [...]      You can use FILTER:    $ TYPE RECIPES.TXT 1 CAKE 2 CAKE VANILLA 3 CAKE CHOC VANILLA 	 4 VANILLA  $ 2 $ FILTER VANILLA/MATCH=NOR SEARCH RECIPES.TXT CAKED %FILTER-I, SEARCHing for VANILLA/MATCH=NOR from $ SEARCH RECIPES.TXT CAKE 1 CAKE $   D Of course you need my FILTER DCL procedure to do this. FILTER can beD nested. It doesn't use PIPE; it uses temporary files. So there is no! subprocess-creation overhead! :-)   F Quoted strings can be problematic; however, you can use search strings like       ~~~,"my goal"    in place of        """my goal"""   C and it will work (assuming you have no ~~~ strings in your output!)    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 13:00:06 -0700  From: Z <Z@no.spam>  Subject: Re: SEARCH : AND NOT ? + Message-ID: <aVple.16128$cP2.8310@fe06.lga>    Hein wrote:  >>Is there a trick ? >  >  > Yeah, use perl:    Hmmm. Is there an echo in here?    ;')    ------------------------------  + Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 18:47:56 +0000 (UTC) P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)$ Subject: Re: upgrade 7.3-1 --> 7.3-2$ Message-ID: <d755kr$uo5$1@online.de>  E In article <bnale.1240$m%3.1208@trnddc02>, John Santos <john@egh.com>  writes:   1 > Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: F > > In article <1116715602.360936.38250@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,* > > "itjck01" <JKoska@bender.com> writes:  > > * > >>See OpenVMS Alpha 8.2 Release Notes...C > >>http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/82FINAL/6674/6674pro_install.html  > > ' > > Why 8.2?  I was upgrading to 7.3-2!  > C > Because the problem was discovered after V7.3-2 was released (and - > after the V7.3-2 Release Notes were writen?   D Yes, of course, I mean I normally don't read the release notes of a . version higher than the one I am upgrading to!   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2005.293 ************************