1 INFO-VAX	Fri, 11 Nov 2005	Volume 2005 : Issue 630       Contents:! ATI Radeon 7500 & AlphaStation600 % Re: ATI Radeon 7500 & AlphaStation600 % Re: ATI Radeon 7500 & AlphaStation600 % Re: ATI Radeon 7500 & AlphaStation600 % Re: ATI Radeon 7500 & AlphaStation600 ( Re: EDIT / EDT with change command issue? Re: failSAFE IP - Looks good! Who's using it? (and why/why-not) ? Re: failSAFE IP - Looks good! Who's using it? (and why/why-not) ? Re: failSAFE IP - Looks good! Who's using it? (and why/why-not) ? Re: failSAFE IP - Looks good! Who's using it? (and why/why-not) " Re: File spec wildcard match test?" Re: File spec wildcard match test?" Re: File spec wildcard match test?" Re: File spec wildcard match test?" Re: File spec wildcard match test?" Re: File spec wildcard match test?" Re: File spec wildcard match test?" Re: File spec wildcard match test?" Re: File spec wildcard match test?C Re: Files in a Windows machine recorded on CD to be read on OpenVMS . Re: FW: OT: Microsoft drop more Itanic support. Re: FW: OT: Microsoft drop more Itanic support Parity Errors on Disk  Re: Parity Errors on Disk  Re: Parity Errors on Disk - Re: Request for feedback - BACKUP enhancement - Re: Request for feedback - BACKUP enhancement - Re: Request for feedback - BACKUP enhancement - Re: Request for feedback - BACKUP enhancement - Re: Request for feedback - BACKUP enhancement - Re: Request for feedback - BACKUP enhancement = Re: Video card Digital PCI ZLXp-L1 compatibility with OpenVMS = Re: Video card Digital PCI ZLXp-L1 compatibility with OpenVMS = Re: Video card Digital PCI ZLXp-L1 compatibility with OpenVMS ; Where to locate ECU diskette for 2100 & 2100A Alphaservers? ? Re: Where to locate ECU diskette for 2100 & 2100A Alphaservers? 9 Re: Will Digital's abandonned software ever go "public" ? 9 Re: Will Digital's abandonned software ever go "public" ? 9 Re: Will Digital's abandonned software ever go "public" ? 9 Re: Will Digital's abandonned software ever go "public" ?   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 15:30:07 +0000 (UTC) < From: gartmann@non.immunbio.mpg.de.sens (Christoph Gartmann)* Subject: ATI Radeon 7500 & AlphaStation600) Message-ID: <dl2ddv$jkt$1@news.BelWue.DE>    Hello,  L in order to have more than 256 colors I tried to replace the PowerStorm 3D30N (PBXGB-AA) with an ATI Radeon 7500 (RV2P-3 Version 1.2) in an AlphaStation600.I But the card didn't work at all. During boot I saw the "countdown" on the H little LCD display but it stopped at "eb". So, isn't this card supportedE on the AlphaStation600? Or do I need to change some console variable? 6 The card as such is working all right in a Windows PC.   Regards,    Christoph Gartmann    --  E  Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452   ImmunbiologieI  Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de   D-79011  Freiburg, Germany 9                http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 08:26:38 -0800 From: jordan@ccs4vms.com. Subject: Re: ATI Radeon 7500 & AlphaStation600C Message-ID: <1131726398.340684.143640@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   G The Radeon, as well as the Oxygen cards and Powerstorm 300/350 are only E supported on EV6 and later systems; some may be more restrictive than  that.   F Your best bet for more colors on the AS600 would be a Powersotmr 4D20,E or alternatively a ZLXp-E2/E3, or ZLXp-L1/L2 (at least until the next G version of VMS comes out when the Ls are desupported).  I'd try for the F 4D20, but they are hard to get and still rather pricy due to being the( best card available for pre-EV6 systems.   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 08:55:25 -0800; From: "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> . Subject: Re: ATI Radeon 7500 & AlphaStation600C Message-ID: <1131728125.609918.238860@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>    jordan@ccs4vms.com wrote: I > The Radeon, as well as the Oxygen cards and Powerstorm 300/350 are only G > supported on EV6 and later systems; some may be more restrictive than  > that.  > H > Your best bet for more colors on the AS600 would be a Powersotmr 4D20,G > or alternatively a ZLXp-E2/E3, or ZLXp-L1/L2 (at least until the next I > version of VMS comes out when the Ls are desupported).  I'd try for the H > 4D20, but they are hard to get and still rather pricy due to being the* > best card available for pre-EV6 systems.  D On Ebay they typically start bidding at $199 US.  There is one thereD now for that price. Clay Denton is the seller and a very good guy. IB have bought many things from him and his word is good.  That beingD said, there is also one currently going in the $25 range.  Seller isG unknown and with 4 days left could easliy hit the $200 mark also.  Keep G a sharp eye out and you may get a good deal. I managed to snag a 4D20 a D little over two months ago for $60 with shipping.  Works great in my PWS500.    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 10:20:53 -0800 From: jordan@ccs4vms.com. Subject: Re: ATI Radeon 7500 & AlphaStation600B Message-ID: <1131733253.037089.11000@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>  D The Elsa card _should_ work, especially if its a DEC/Compaq labelledG unit (I was also able to use an IBM labelled one in a DS10 a while ago) D but I've never tried one in a machine that old.  That would be a lot@ cheaper than the 4D20, but if you want to run at high resolutionB (1280x1024) 24/32 bit color mode you can get some video artifacts,@ fringing, edge tearing, etc; Fred K has commented on this card's@ limitations in the past.  Lower resolution or lower color levels alleviate the problems.   F Sometmes the cheapest way to get a 4D20 is to watch for Alpha PersonalB Workstations for sale.  I've seen the odd PWS433/500 with PBXGB-CAA PowerStorm 4D20 go for the same or less as the loose board.  Plus  shipping of course...    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 19:40:08 +0100 + From: Marc Schlensog <fishtank.spam@web.de> . Subject: Re: ATI Radeon 7500 & AlphaStation600: Message-ID: <20051111194008.1fe014ae.fishtank.spam@web.de>   On 11 Nov 2005 10:20:53 -0800  jordan@ccs4vms.com wrote:   F > The Elsa card _should_ work, especially if its a DEC/Compaq labelledD > unit (I was also able to use an IBM labelled one in a DS10 a whileG > ago) but I've never tried one in a machine that old.  That would be a F > lot cheaper than the 4D20, but if you want to run at high resolutionD > (1280x1024) 24/32 bit color mode you can get some video artifacts,B > fringing, edge tearing, etc; Fred K has commented on this card'sB > limitations in the past.  Lower resolution or lower color levels > alleviate the problems.  > H > Sometmes the cheapest way to get a 4D20 is to watch for Alpha PersonalD > Workstations for sale.  I've seen the odd PWS433/500 with PBXGB-CAC > PowerStorm 4D20 go for the same or less as the loose board.  Plus  > shipping of course...  >   B Can't say anything about VMS, but I had a Permedia2-based PCI-cardC in an AXPpci33 (noname) once and it worked just fine in 16bit-mode.    Marc   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 05:14:54 -0800< From: "Hein RMS van den Heuvel" <heinvandenheuvel@gmail.com>1 Subject: Re: EDIT / EDT with change command issue B Message-ID: <1131714893.965815.78960@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>  D In case you are wonderings.... my reply snuck in before the question> was asked, or at least so it seems with my google news reader.   Hein.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 09:35:53 +0300 U From: "Ruslan R. Laishev" <zzLaishev-@-DeltaTelecom.zz.RU-please-remove-zz-for.reply> H Subject: Re: failSAFE IP - Looks good! Who's using it? (and why/why-not)3 Message-ID: <2A0ECF773F0D9C640F05E9E018D6A30D@nntp>    Hi !  I 	We used failSAFE IP on the RADIUS/AAA for performing A12 authentication  8 of IMT-MC-450i (CDMA2000) EV-DO subscribers. Looks nice!     Richard Maher wrote:   > Hi,  > I > I came across this "failSAFE IP" documentation the other day and became B > quite interested in the functionality that it provides. My briefL > understanding is that when an interface (or whole other node in a cluster)K > dies it can automatically ifconfig its IP address to another interface in M > the same box (or other box in the cluster). And when the original interface M > becomes available again then it fails back seemlessly-like. Does that sound  > about right? > J > Leaving aside cluster-aliases and DNS load-balancing servers and all theJ > other good IP-clustering stuff for the moment, is anyone out there using' > failSAFE? Any brick-bats or bouquets?  > G > You're normally all over this sort of stuff Kerry; thumbs up or down?  >  > Regards Richard Maher  >  >  >      --   Cheers, Ruslan. D +---------------------pure personal opinion------------------------+C   RADIUS Server for OpenVMS project - www.starlet.spb.ru/radiusvms/ >   ICQ: 319518233, Skype: SysMan-One, Mobile: +7 (901) 316-3222   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 15:22:56 +0800 3 From: "Richard Maher" <maher_rj@hotspamnotmail.com> H Subject: Re: failSAFE IP - Looks good! Who's using it? (and why/why-not)1 Message-ID: <dl1guq$8f1$1@news-02.connect.com.au>   	 Hi David,   J > See the description in the documentation, re: cautions about the minimumE > number of interfaces in the scenario to prevent "false fail-overs".   G I searched the VMS Doc site for failSAFE and came up with the following G Technical Journal article. (Save anyone else from having to look it up)   [ http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/journal/v2/articles/tcpip.html#_Avoiding_Phantom_Failures   J It doesn't look like that difficult a problem to solve, and along with theJ cluster failure split-brain problem it gives the System Managers something# to plan for and do for a change :-)   J > > Just keep plugging away at 1.2.3.4 and it will automagically be sorted out!" > > What could be wrong with that? > I > Services that aren't smart/persistent enough to keep hacking away at an B > apparently dead address until it "magically" comes back to life.  L So what's Plan B? Fall over in a screaming heap? How do the options of PlansH A and B vary in anyway with regard to failSAFE IP as opposed to say, the flushing of DNS cache?  H Sure if somethin's not there, you can go off and cry about it or you canD tell the network/system managers that's something's not right, whileH continuing to get everybody out of the car and then putting them back inF again, after waiting a respectible "pause-for-thought" interval beforeL retring. I like to call mine T3$TIP_UNRESOLVED_SEARCH_DETENT (which defaults
 to 3 seconds)   K Apart from sulking, what other strategies are there? Polling is anathema to H me! But without any meaningful events in this Unixie TCP/IP C world it's+ hard for a bloke to remain event driven :-(    Regards Richard Maher   G PS. Kerry, I know you have something to say about this (and I'm sure we , haven't fallen out) so can I please hear it?  ? "David J Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> wrote in message % news:43740D79.A0A0941B@comcast.net...  > Richard Maher wrote: > >  > > Hi,  > > I > > Thanks to JF, John (good to see you're still around), Carl, Peter and  Dave# > > for the advice and experiences.  > > K > > To my mind, the only reason not to use failSAFE IP would be if you were ; > > achieving similar functionality with Clsuter-Aliases or  DNS-name-resolution,H > > but why failSAFE IP is head and shoulders above the rest is that theH > > *original* IP address for the failed interface/node lives on. That's gotta J > > be the mut's nuts! (And an application/cluster-recovery life-saver for me!) > J > See the description in the documentation, re: cautions about the minimumE > number of interfaces in the scenario to prevent "false fail-overs".  > J > > Just keep plugging away at 1.2.3.4 and it will automagically be sorted out!" > > What could be wrong with that? > I > Services that aren't smart/persistent enough to keep hacking away at an B > apparently dead address until it "magically" comes back to life. >  > --   > David J Dachtera > dba DJE Systems  > http://www.djesys.com/ > + > Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: $ > http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ > * > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:! > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/  > $ > Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page:! > http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/  >  > Coming soon:( > Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 15:25:41 +0800 3 From: "Richard Maher" <maher_rj@hotspamnotmail.com> H Subject: Re: failSAFE IP - Looks good! Who's using it? (and why/why-not)1 Message-ID: <dl1h40$8lq$1@news-02.connect.com.au>   
 Hi Ruslan,   Good to hear from you again.  I > We used failSAFE IP on the RADIUS/AAA for performing A12 authentication : > of IMT-MC-450i (CDMA2000) EV-DO subscribers. Looks nice!   Great! (I think???)    Cheers Richard Maher   "Ruslan R. Laishev" L <zzLaishev-@-DeltaTelecom.zz.RU-please-remove-zz-for.reply> wrote in message- news:2A0ECF773F0D9C640F05E9E018D6A30D@nntp...  > Hi ! > I > We used failSAFE IP on the RADIUS/AAA for performing A12 authentication : > of IMT-MC-450i (CDMA2000) EV-DO subscribers. Looks nice! >  >  > Richard Maher wrote: >  > > Hi,  > > K > > I came across this "failSAFE IP" documentation the other day and became D > > quite interested in the functionality that it provides. My briefE > > understanding is that when an interface (or whole other node in a  cluster)J > > dies it can automatically ifconfig its IP address to another interface inE > > the same box (or other box in the cluster). And when the original 	 interface I > > becomes available again then it fails back seemlessly-like. Does that  sound  > > about right? > > L > > Leaving aside cluster-aliases and DNS load-balancing servers and all theL > > other good IP-clustering stuff for the moment, is anyone out there using) > > failSAFE? Any brick-bats or bouquets?  > > I > > You're normally all over this sort of stuff Kerry; thumbs up or down?  > >  > > Regards Richard Maher  > >  > >  > >  >  >  > --   > Cheers, Ruslan. F > +---------------------pure personal opinion------------------------+E >   RADIUS Server for OpenVMS project - www.starlet.spb.ru/radiusvms/ @ >   ICQ: 319518233, Skype: SysMan-One, Mobile: +7 (901) 316-3222   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 09:42:18 -0800" From: dave.baxter@bannerhealth.comH Subject: Re: failSAFE IP - Looks good! Who's using it? (and why/why-not)C Message-ID: <1131730937.991301.200950@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    Peter,G         Does this approach also protect you against the simple "someone - accidentally unplugged the cable" scenario???    Dave.     Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote:o > In article <10NOV05.10210648@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu>, karcher@thuria.waisman.wisc.edu (Carl Karcher) writes: E > >I've been using this (two interfaces on the same box) since it was F > >available. Works like a charm - really impresses the network types. > 9 > For 2 interfaces on the same box, I prefer LAN failover  > 
 > 	$ MC LANCP 8 > 	LANCP> DEFINE DEVICE LLA0/FAILOVER=(EWA0,EWB0)/ENABLE > 1 > which works for all protocols, not only for IP.  >  > YMMV >  > -- > Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER ' > Network and OpenVMS system specialist  > E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atH > A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 04:21:53 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> + Subject: Re: File spec wildcard match test? , Message-ID: <43746283.E59CA57D@teksavvy.com>  # Ok, different twist to the problem.   H SYS$PARSE has the ability for you to provide default file specs, related$ file specs and the actual file spec.  % I haven't thought this through but...   C lets say you want to  COOK [...]*.CHOCOLATE  /exclude=[...]MOUSSE.*   B so cook uses sys$Parse and sys$search to get the *.CHOCOLATE list.  F For each file, you might be able to build some sys$parse that uses theH $SEARCH result and the /exclude with proper use of defeault, related andA actual specs to test if the $SEARCH result would result in $PARSE : finding the file (hence telling you to exclude that file).  " Again, this is just brainstorming.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 04:29:25 -0500 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> + Subject: Re: File spec wildcard match test? 0 Message-ID: <11n8p36khac9ib4@corp.supernews.com>   Larry Kilgallen wrote:a > In article <05111019182678_202AC911@antinode.org>, sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) writes:  > / >>From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)  >> >>I >>>To find all files in a directory tree properly, one needs to call RMS.  >>( >>   Which is not what I'm trying to do. >  > C > I did not notice an English language description of what you were " > trying to do.  Please elaborate.  I Since ZIP is a utility for moving files, activity would include taking a  G copy of data from disk, and placing a copy of data on disk.  In either  I case, one or more file specifications would be involved.  It seems to me  F that being able to fully parse and understand a file specification is 
 the issue.  L >>>>   Has anyone else noticed that "Zip -x" (or "-i") doesn't deal properly# >>>>with "..." in a directory spec?  >>> @ >>>I thought there were multiple implementations of Zip for VMS. >>G >>   I refer to the Info-ZIP Zip.  You have in mind which other ones?   0 >>(GNU zip, which lacks "-i" and "-x", perhaps?) >  >  > I am not a Zip user.  9 I'm an infrequent user, but at times it's quite valuable.   E >>>The one you are using was probably written in C, and C programmers C >>>have a habit of thinking that all file systems are like Unix and % >>>should be handled by calling CRTL.    Ah, my daily anti-C 'fix'.  I >>   Please let me know when you can supply a superior replacement.  Feel , >>free to write it in any language you wish. >  > 7 > It is more likely to be done by someone who uses Zip. D > If they want to be able to sell their implementation, they need to2 > distinguish it in some fashion, such as quality. > G > What price are you willing to pay for such a quality implementation ? ? > I am sure that will affect whether people jump into the fray.   G The various versions of ZIP for VMS are, to the best I know, basically  @ free.  A service to the VMS community.  To ask an entity who is H providing a free service to the VMS community to pay for providing such ( a service is, ah, less than appropriate.  C To put it into perspective, would you pay me for the priviledge of   coming here and working for me?   E Back to the issue.  I'm thinking that 1) HP is the #1 beneficiary of  H such VMS freeware, because it supports an HP product, and 2) VMS BACKUP ; and probably other utilities already have all the required  B functionality, that it sure would be appropriate for some form of I colaboration including VMS engineering.  Perhaps an inquiry on the issue   could be made?   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 07:18:24 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) + Subject: Re: File spec wildcard match test? 3 Message-ID: <CaMRl6lbGfYT@eisner.encompasserve.org>    In article <1131688025.159006.120660@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>, "Hein RMS van den Heuvel" <heinvandenheuvel@gmail.com> writes: >  > Larry Kilgallen wrote:b >> In article <05111019182678_202AC911@antinode.org>, sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) writes:2 >> > From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) >> >L >> >> To find all files in a directory tree properly, one needs to call RMS. >> >+ >> >    Which is not what I'm trying to do.  >>D >> I did not notice an English language description of what you were# >> trying to do.  Please elaborate.  > < > Hmmm, odd... the base topic seems to consist of just that.F > I thought is was an imminently readable description of a non trivial
 > problem.  H It was not in the post to which I responded, and ANUNEWS has no backward
 threading.   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 07:20:05 -0600; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) + Subject: Re: File spec wildcard match test? 3 Message-ID: <nDEgR9RbLZRX@eisner.encompasserve.org>   [ In article <43742829.855FCC3@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:  > "Steven M. Schweda" wrote:H >> >    wild_match( "[.a.b.c]fred.dat", "[...b...]fred.*")  /* (true) */I >> >    wild_match( "[.a.b.c]fred.dat", "[...b]fred.*")     /* (false) */  >  > 3 > If you did a quick parse of the string to replace  > 		"[..." with "[*."  > and 		"...]" with ".*]"  > 2 >  then the str$match_wild would work as you wish.    (      Until some user enters <... or <* .   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 07:21:01 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) + Subject: Re: File spec wildcard match test? 3 Message-ID: <YLNGdoP1taRc@eisner.encompasserve.org>   _ In article <05111023591499_202AAB19@antinode.org>, sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) writes: / > From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>  > J >> > >    wild_match( "[.a.b.c]fred.dat", "[...b...]fred.*")  /* (true) */K >> > >    wild_match( "[.a.b.c]fred.dat", "[...b]fred.*")     /* (false) */  >>  4 >> If you did a quick parse of the string to replace >> 		"[..." with "[*."   >> and 		"...]" with ".*]"   >>  3 >>  then the str$match_wild would work as you wish.  > H >    And "[*.m]" would match "[a.b.c.d.e.f.g.h.i.j.k.l.m]" as well as it > would "[a.m]".  4 In normal VMS usage [...m] will match both of those.  4 > My idea of "as I wish" and yours appear to differ.  = I think you need to describe the matching semantics you want.    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 07:24:41 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) + Subject: Re: File spec wildcard match test? 3 Message-ID: <ZcF8ed0f5cFl@eisner.encompasserve.org>   Z In article <11n8p36khac9ib4@corp.supernews.com>, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes: > Larry Kilgallen wrote:  H >> What price are you willing to pay for such a quality implementation ?@ >> I am sure that will affect whether people jump into the fray. > I > The various versions of ZIP for VMS are, to the best I know, basically  B > free.  A service to the VMS community.  To ask an entity who is J > providing a free service to the VMS community to pay for providing such * > a service is, ah, less than appropriate. > E > To put it into perspective, would you pay me for the priviledge of  ! > coming here and working for me?  > G > Back to the issue.  I'm thinking that 1) HP is the #1 beneficiary of  J > such VMS freeware, because it supports an HP product, and 2) VMS BACKUP = > and probably other utilities already have all the required  D > functionality, that it sure would be appropriate for some form of ) > colaboration including VMS engineering.   E And that is the nub of the problem.  I believe HP's efforts should be B concentrated on supported software.  If people wanted a BACKUP/ZIPD capability that certainly has been delayed by presence of the "free"B version (that is "free" only for those who value their own time at zero).   ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 08:47:06 -0600 (CST) * From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)+ Subject: Re: File spec wildcard match test? 2 Message-ID: <05111108470671_202AAB19@antinode.org>  < From: "Hein RMS van den Heuvel" <heinvandenheuvel@gmail.com>  ? > As par as that base problem goes, I think that SYS$PARSE with G > NAM$V_SYNCHK is as close as you are going to get with system services 9 > to help you normalize & parse a user provided filespec.   9    I'm starting to lean that way.  More thought required.   B > While dabling in this space, maybe you spot some ''easy' regularA > expression code allowing your end user more elaborate selection  > criteria?   H    Maybe not.  Just trying to match the current non-VMS functionality inE Zip with normal VMS user expectations (mine).  The ODS5 extended file F name escape syntax ("^") causes trouble for the existing code, too, asE it tends to think one character at a time.  Everything's complicated.     - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>   H > For each file, you might be able to build some sys$parse that uses theJ > $SEARCH result and the /exclude with proper use of defeault, related andC > actual specs to test if the $SEARCH result would result in $PARSE < > finding the file (hence telling you to exclude that file).  D    I don't want to do a $SEARCH here, just check an already searchedD name.  The goal is to make it work better, not to re-write the whole program.  $ > Again, this is just brainstorming.      Call off the cloud seeding.    - From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)   J > >    And "[*.m]" would match "[a.b.c.d.e.f.g.h.i.j.k.l.m]" as well as it > > would "[a.m]". > 6 > In normal VMS usage [...m] will match both of those.  C    And "[*.m]" wouldn't.  I think that that was my point.  Or did I  misunderstand me?   ? > I think you need to describe the matching semantics you want.   H    I think "[n]ormal VMS usage" covers it pretty well.  Which news group is this?  Am I lost?  H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 11:43:20 -0500 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> + Subject: Re: File spec wildcard match test? 0 Message-ID: <11n9igsta294nc3@corp.supernews.com>   Larry Kilgallen wrote:\ > In article <11n8p36khac9ib4@corp.supernews.com>, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes: >  >>Larry Kilgallen wrote: >  > H >>>What price are you willing to pay for such a quality implementation ?@ >>>I am sure that will affect whether people jump into the fray. >>I >>The various versions of ZIP for VMS are, to the best I know, basically  B >>free.  A service to the VMS community.  To ask an entity who is J >>providing a free service to the VMS community to pay for providing such * >>a service is, ah, less than appropriate. >>E >>To put it into perspective, would you pay me for the priviledge of  ! >>coming here and working for me?  >>G >>Back to the issue.  I'm thinking that 1) HP is the #1 beneficiary of  J >>such VMS freeware, because it supports an HP product, and 2) VMS BACKUP = >>and probably other utilities already have all the required  D >>functionality, that it sure would be appropriate for some form of ) >>colaboration including VMS engineering.  >  > ' > And that is the nub of the problem.     ( Ok, I'm going to try to understand this.  " > I believe HP's efforts should be& > concentrated on supported software.   G For the most part, yes.  However, to totally ignore all other activity  - will at times not be good customer relations.    > If people wanted a BACKUP/ZIP F > capability that certainly has been delayed by presence of the "free"
 > version   I I don't think that's what's being discussed, nor have I personally heard  ' any requests for BACKUP to be involved.    ZIP does two things.   1) it compresses data.F 2) it encapsulates data inside a structure with known characteristics.  D The 'archive' can be treated as binary data and transmitted as such H while retaining the capability of successfully extracting the data once  it reaches it's destination.  G While BACKUP does a similar task, it depends upon file characteristics  H outside the 'container', thus rendering it more complex to move outside  VMS environments.   F Therefore ZIP does offer a useful capability to VMS users.  I've read D that 'official' 'supported' ECOs are moved over the internet in ZIP 	 archives.   < > (that is "free" only for those who value their own time at > zero).  ' Here's where understanding breaks down.   & There are not charges for the product.  D As for obtaining the product, installing the product, and using the E product, what difference is there between the 'free' product and any  G 'official' 'supported' product from HP for which you will incur a cost  # above that of the freeware product?   E If the issue you're raising is that an entity will produce a product  D without compensation, well, there may be many valid reasons such is A done, but that has no bearing upon anyone else using the product.   F If the issue is that you cannot 'trust' the product without reviewing F the sources and building executables from reviewed sources, well then H consider that the cost of the product.  Note that 'trust' isn't a given  with 'supported' software.  ) Still not sure I've understood the issue.    --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 12:19:32 -0600- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) + Subject: Re: File spec wildcard match test? 3 Message-ID: <qR3pk5gzTJM4@eisner.encompasserve.org>   Z In article <11n9igsta294nc3@corp.supernews.com>, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes: > Larry Kilgallen wrote:  # >> I believe HP's efforts should be ' >> concentrated on supported software.   > I > For the most part, yes.  However, to totally ignore all other activity  / > will at times not be good customer relations.   C They should not ignore other activities.  They should consider what D features drive people to use unsupported software and consider doing% the equivalent in supported software.     >> If people wanted a BACKUP/ZIPG >> capability that certainly has been delayed by presence of the "free"  >> version   > K > I don't think that's what's being discussed, nor have I personally heard  ) > any requests for BACKUP to be involved.  >  > ZIP does two things. >  > 1) it compresses data.    * That is what Backup currently does not do.  H > 2) it encapsulates data inside a structure with known characteristics. > F > The 'archive' can be treated as binary data and transmitted as such J > while retaining the capability of successfully extracting the data once  > it reaches it's destination.   That is what Backup does.   I > While BACKUP does a similar task, it depends upon file characteristics  J > outside the 'container', thus rendering it more complex to move outside  > VMS environments.   A If you use a transmission method that destroys the metadata, then A of course things will fail.  There have been command sequences to 9 work around such errors ever since there has been Backup.   = >> (that is "free" only for those who value their own time at 	 >> zero).  > ) > Here's where understanding breaks down.  > ( > There are not charges for the product.  > And there is no support, so you end up supporting it yourself.> Thus it is not "free" unless you value your own labor at zero.  F > As for obtaining the product, installing the product, and using the G > product, what difference is there between the 'free' product and any  I > 'official' 'supported' product from HP for which you will incur a cost  % > above that of the freeware product?   9 Submit a trouble report to HP on the unsupported product.  Let us know when they fix it.   D Or let us know when you figure out how to fix it without any effort.( (But the figuring out counts as effort.)   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 05:04:40 -0800( From: "pbritto" <britto.paulo@gmail.com>L Subject: Re: Files in a Windows machine recorded on CD to be read on OpenVMSC Message-ID: <1131714280.347869.318580@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>   B Thanks you all it's working as you said if I save it in ISO9660 itD works and as one fo you guys told me I can't unzip it on Windows, so2 when I unzipped it on OpenVMS it worked just fine!    Thanks alot Steven M. Schweda escreveu:   8 > From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER) > 3 > > You can find UNZIP at eg. the VMS freeware site M > > http://www.openvms.digital.com/freeware/freeware70/000tools/alpha_images/  > F >    Or, you could get the current/faster/better version 5.52 from the > primary source.  For example:  >   >       http://www.info-zip.org/* >       http://www.info-zip.org/UnZip.html/ >       ftp://ftp.info-zip.org/pub/infozip/VMS/  > J > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > 6 >    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98185 >    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org  >    Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 04:42:12 -0500 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> 7 Subject: Re: FW: OT: Microsoft drop more Itanic support 0 Message-ID: <11n8pr5e5cgis75@corp.supernews.com>   Main, Kerry wrote: >>-----Original Message-----7 >>From: JF Mezei [mailto:jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com]  ! >>Sent: November 10, 2005 7:02 AM  >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 9 >>Subject: Re: FW: OT: Microsoft drop more Itanic support  >> >>"Main, Kerry" wrote: >>; >>>IBM (Power), MIPS and Compaq (Alpha) dropped Windows as   >> >>they did all the >> >>>more painful OS porting work  >>> >>Politics. Fact is that Windows NT was available on MIPS and 
 >>PowerPC and G >>support was widthdranw. You say it was SGI for MIPS and IBM for Power H >>(why not Apple ?), I say it is Microsoft. It doesn't really matter whoF >>really made the decision and who made the announcement, fact is that; >>support was widthdrawn, partly because it was never high   >>enough volume. >> >  > G > Volume was only part of the reason. OS license issues was another big G > issue. When a company like IBM or Compaq has to invest in facilities, E > people, developers and tools, but get zero OS license or OS support H > revenue i.e. HW only, you have to expect that eventually there will be
 > issues.    Damn right!   J > Especially since back then, a significant part of the Windows kernel wasI > x86 macro code stuff, so porting to another platform was no easy feat.   > @ > IBM got out early - perhaps they saw the writing on the wall.  >  > G >>MS isn't about to support and pay for continued support on a platform 4 >>that isn't growing and expanding its market niche. >> >  > F > Mmm... What support costs did they have other than a few of their BOG > products like Exchange, SQL Server etc.? IBM, Compaq etc paid for all F > the facilities, people, tools, packaging, marketing for creating andG > supporting Windows on their specific platforms. All Microsoft did was 6 > collect the OS license revenue. Not much risk there. > E > And keep in mind that Microsoft really likes to promote their OS as F > "multi-platform", so they do have that aspect to lose. Certainly theH > Linux camp makes a really big deal about this when they are beating up
 > Windows. >  > ; >>>As far as I know (but wiling to be corrected), IA64 and   >> >>x86-64 are the >>@ >>>first 64bit platforms where Microsoft is doing the Windows OS >>>down-n-dirty porting work.  >>H >>Maybe. Maybe not. When you consider the type of sweet deals Intel gaveF >>Digital/compaq to kill Alpha and port VMS to that IA64 thing, do youH >>reall think that Hp/Intel didn't give MS some sweat deal to contribute) >>to porting Windows to that IA64 thing ?  >> >  > J > Wow, the black helicopters are out in force now .. You really are giving< > Microsoft way to much credit in terms of their influence.   : Not really.  Microsoft support could be quite influencial.  E However, I don't think MS ever does anything to benefit anyone other   than themselves.   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 04:46:46 -0500 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> 7 Subject: Re: FW: OT: Microsoft drop more Itanic support 0 Message-ID: <11n8q3n38pjm367@corp.supernews.com>   Main, Kerry wrote: >>-----Original Message-----1 >>From: Dave Froble [mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com]    >>Sent: November 9, 2005 9:39 PM >>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 9 >>Subject: Re: FW: OT: Microsoft drop more Itanic support  >> >  >  > [snip ...] >  > F >>But, while IBM has reasons to produce Power, and Sun has reasons to D >>produce/use SPARC (x86 not being an part of this issue), list the 8 >>reasons, and volumes, for Intel to produce the itanic. >> >  > H > Intel knows x86 will not soon have much influence on the market servedG > by Power5 and SPARC. X86 and x86-64 sweet spot is still very much 2-4 H > cpu systems. That is also limited by applications on Windows and LinuxG > to scale reliably above 5+ cpu's (yes, there are some app's that do a : > bit better, but not many). Good example is MS Exchange.  > J > Hence, Intel needs a higher end offering to compete against those Power5 > and SPARC platforms.   Why?  E What percentage of the total market requires more than 4-way systems?   I I'm thinking that Intel could forget about more than 4-way, and continue  H to dominate the total computer market, just as they have been doing for  lo these many years.  , And then there is HORUS, and perhaps others.   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 11:40:47 +0000 (UTC) < From: gartmann@non.immunbio.mpg.de.sens (Christoph Gartmann) Subject: Parity Errors on Disk) Message-ID: <dl1vvv$1kv$1@news.BelWue.DE>    Hello,  O in the logfile of a backup from disk to tape I discovered a parity error with a J single and large file. The parity error was with the disk and not with theO tape. Next, I did a "ANALYZE/DISK/REPAIR/READ" on the disk in question. Again I O got the parity error with this file. I assume the disk is bad. Is this correct? K Or are there other reasons that cause such an error. The affected file is a D backup saveset that has not been modified since more than two years.   Regards,    Christoph Gartmann    --  E  Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452   ImmunbiologieI  Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de   D-79011  Freiburg, Germany 9                http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 12:22:28 +0000  From: Roy Omond <Roy@Omond.net> " Subject: Re: Parity Errors on Disk4 Message-ID: <dl22e5$cui$1$8302bc10@news.demon.co.uk>   Christoph Gartmann wrote:  > Hello, > Q > in the logfile of a backup from disk to tape I discovered a parity error with a L > single and large file. The parity error was with the disk and not with theQ > tape. Next, I did a "ANALYZE/DISK/REPAIR/READ" on the disk in question. Again I Q > got the parity error with this file. I assume the disk is bad. Is this correct? M > Or are there other reasons that cause such an error. The affected file is a F > backup saveset that has not been modified since more than two years.  5 Your disk has indeed developed a bad block (or more).   F Copy the file in question elsewhere, delete the original whereupon VMS> will allocate the bad block to the bad block file in [000000].  ? The backup saveset file copy will still be marked as having bad A block(s), but unless you specified /NOCRC/GROUP=0 on the original E backup command to produce the saveset, Backup will be able to recover  the original data.  D You might also consider taking an image backup of the disk, and thenB reformatting it (use sys$etc:rztools_alpha.exe), and restoring it.   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 07:33:55 -0600; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) " Subject: Re: Parity Errors on Disk3 Message-ID: <sgQ+abbe7sS7@eisner.encompasserve.org>   h In article <dl1vvv$1kv$1@news.BelWue.DE>, gartmann@non.immunbio.mpg.de.sens (Christoph Gartmann) writes: > Hello, > Q > in the logfile of a backup from disk to tape I discovered a parity error with a L > single and large file. The parity error was with the disk and not with theQ > tape. Next, I did a "ANALYZE/DISK/REPAIR/READ" on the disk in question. Again I Q > got the parity error with this file. I assume the disk is bad. Is this correct? M > Or are there other reasons that cause such an error. The affected file is a F > backup saveset that has not been modified since more than two years. > 
 > Regards, >    Christoph Gartmann   D    You most likely have a bad block on the disk.  The disk may have F    revectored the block the first time it was read, but it looks like     it didn't recover the data.  G    It's also possible that there's a weak circuit somewhere in the data H    path that is only tripped up by data patterns this file has.  TestingD    I/O with intentionally stressful data patterns might expose this.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 09:14:50 +0000 0 From: Chris Sharman <chris.sharman@sorry.nospam>6 Subject: Re: Request for feedback - BACKUP enhancement4 Message-ID: <dl1nec$14u$1$8302bc10@news.demon.co.uk>  @ I can see the value, although personally I wouldn't need either.  > What I'd like is functionality to write to exactly ONE tape ;)E We've a single drive, and do unattended backup. All's well, until it  H overflows, and then instead of a nice mail message saying what tapes to F feed today, and the results of last night's backups, the backup hangs I requesting tape2 - here no-one's listening, there's no second tape, we'd  I just like it to finish. (the backup procedure works out which disks need  H doing first, so failure to finish everything in one night is acceptable)I I wrote nightwatchman (it's on freeware somewhere) to handle replying to  1 these requests, but it's a nasty clunky solution. D Backup has a noassist qualifier which stops it asking for the first + tape, but it will still ask for the second. 6 How about a non-default /NOASSIST=ALWAYS or something.   Chris    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 01:55:53 -0800 From: google@van-ruitenbeek.nl6 Subject: Re: Request for feedback - BACKUP enhancementB Message-ID: <1131702953.455239.58440@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   Antoniov wrote:  > Hi, H > I think both features may be interesting for VMS users. But in my mindH > it's more important backup should make a sort of snapshot before start > it. D > Any system administrator 24x7 would like to backup while system is? > running and everyone knows how dangerous is /IGNORE=INTERLOCK B > qualifier. I even heard, next OpenVMS version don't support this > qualifier. >   	 Antoniov, F The snapshot can be avoid if you are using shadow-sets ! Make sure youC have 1 extra disk in the shadowset for backup. So if you are on two G sites, make sure you have 3 disks per shadow-set. Disks are inexpensive @ nowadays. Before starting the backup, dismount one member of all0 shadow-sets and backup these dismounted devices.C After backup (per disk for performance) mount the disk back in with  /MINICOPY !   G This works fine. Do not relay on snapshot or other 'beautiful' tools in A SAN's. YOU DO NOT HAVE ANY CONTROL OVER IT. (Most of the time the  SAN-manager eather).   AvR    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 01:58:04 -0800 From: google@van-ruitenbeek.nl6 Subject: Re: Request for feedback - BACKUP enhancementB Message-ID: <1131703084.412694.51380@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   Bart,   F If I'm right this won't work for one saveset over more then one tapes,	 does it ?    AvR    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 07:30:36 -0600; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) 6 Subject: Re: Request for feedback - BACKUP enhancement3 Message-ID: <xxj$hh2ayt$U@eisner.encompasserve.org>   g In article <dl1nec$14u$1$8302bc10@news.demon.co.uk>, Chris Sharman <chris.sharman@sorry.nospam> writes:  > B > I can see the value, although personally I wouldn't need either. > @ > What I'd like is functionality to write to exactly ONE tape ;)  E    Gee, what you're asking for sounds like exactly the problem I had  B    with UNIX, it wouldn't run dump in the background and give me aE    way to change tapes in the morning.  dump wanted to do an explicit F    open on /dev/tty to discuss changing tapes.  If opened stdin/stdout/    I could have set up a pipe to emulate OPCOM.   E    What you want is exactly what I don't want.  The current behaviour D    lets me start backups overnight, change tapes in the morning, and5    rest assured that ALL my data is safely backed up.   D    Meanwhile, one simple "reply/abort" and you can actually get what    you're looking for.      OPCOM is a great friend.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 09:01:51 -0500 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 6 Subject: Re: Request for feedback - BACKUP enhancement, Message-ID: <4374A40F.466A19E6@teksavvy.com>   google@van-ruitenbeek.nl wrote: ; > The snapshot can be avoid if you are using shadow-sets !      H One issue to consider in this however is $$$$$. Can you justify spendingF the big bucks for disk shadowing licence only so you can do a backup ?   ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 18:27:34 +0000 (UTC) P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)6 Subject: Re: Request for feedback - BACKUP enhancement$ Message-ID: <dl2nqm$h28$2@online.de>  B In article <1131702953.455239.58440@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,! google@van-ruitenbeek.nl writes:    ; > The snapshot can be avoid if you are using shadow-sets !    G However, it can be done so cleanly only if no files are open for write.    ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 08:41:02 -0500 * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com>F Subject: Re: Video card Digital PCI ZLXp-L1 compatibility with OpenVMS, Message-ID: <43749f6f$1@usenet01.boi.hp.com>  3 "pbritto" <britto.paulo@gmail.com> wrote in message < news:1131715216.781358.69080@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... > Hi, F >  I've got this card Digital PCI ZLXp-L1 and I always get the messageE > "no graphic device found". Is this video card compatible to OpenVMS ' > 7.1, so I have no DECWindow going on!  > 
 >  Thanks, >   6 You need the Open3D Layered Product kit for this card.  B **NOTE** the Open3D Layered Product has been retired.  It will notH install (or work properly) when installed on anything later than V7.3-1.   ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 06:22:41 -0800 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> F Subject: Re: Video card Digital PCI ZLXp-L1 compatibility with OpenVMS( Message-ID: <opsz2x73u4zgicya@hyrrokkin>  H On Fri, 11 Nov 2005 08:41:02 -0500, FredK <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com>   wrote:  5 > "pbritto" <britto.paulo@gmail.com> wrote in message > > news:1131715216.781358.69080@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... >> Hi,G >>  I've got this card Digital PCI ZLXp-L1 and I always get the message F >> "no graphic device found". Is this video card compatible to OpenVMS( >> 7.1, so I have no DECWindow going on! >> >>  Thanks,  >> > 8 > You need the Open3D Layered Product kit for this card. > D > **NOTE** the Open3D Layered Product has been retired.  It will notJ > install (or work properly) when installed on anything later than V7.3-1. >  >  > E Fred, It would be nice if you could add a VMS column to the following & http://www.kednos.com/hw/graphics.html Tom    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 08:28:48 -0800( From: "pbritto" <britto.paulo@gmail.com>F Subject: Re: Video card Digital PCI ZLXp-L1 compatibility with OpenVMSC Message-ID: <1131726528.765982.267100@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   A I think I've got Open3D licensed, but I still get the message "no G graphics device found", once someone told me to SET WINDOW_STATE = 1, I = did but still the DECWindow not starting. Any clue of what is F happening, it's a fresh OpenVMS installation, I have just installed soD it's a standard installation (flags and config startup files are all	 default).    Michael Kraemer escreveu:   R > In article <4374ada3$1@news.langstoeger.at>, peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' > LANGSTOEGER) writes: > Q > > IIRC, the ZLXp-L1 is a 3D card (which required Open3D - product and license). I > > Now as Open3D is discontinued (just as the ZLXp-L1) you have only the J > > option of using an old version of OpenVMS/DWMOTIF/OPEN3D (I don't knowL > > if V7.1 is old enough, but I really think so - V7.3-2/V8.* is definitely' > > too new) or replacing your ZLXp-L1.  >  > what about the ZLXp-L2 ?   ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 06:02:35 -0800, From: "rcyoung" <rcyoung@aliconsultants.com>D Subject: Where to locate ECU diskette for 2100 & 2100A Alphaservers?B Message-ID: <1131717755.002062.52160@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>  F I may need to modify a couple of older Alpha servers we have, but I amB not sure the ECU  (EISA Configuration Utility) diskettes I locatedE will work with them.  We have a very old 2000axp server which is what B the 1.10 and 1.11A ECU diskettes I found  came with originally...I think.  E However we also have a 2100 4/233 and 2100a 5/250 that came later. It E is these I may have to do some config changes to.  I have been unable @ to locate the ECU diskettes that came with them (too many people- through the area over the years I am afraid).   6 Can the earlier ECUs work with the 2100/2100a systems?  G Does anyone know where one can locate a disk image of the "most recent"  ECU for the 2100/2100a systems?   F I don't suppose it could be as simple as pulling off a disk image fromD one of the numerous CDs we have filed away over the last 8-10 yrs by any chance?    ------------------------------    Date: 11 Nov 2005 09:02:57 -0800; From: "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> H Subject: Re: Where to locate ECU diskette for 2100 & 2100A Alphaservers?B Message-ID: <1131728577.531775.63260@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   rcyoung wrote:H > I may need to modify a couple of older Alpha servers we have, but I amD > not sure the ECU  (EISA Configuration Utility) diskettes I locatedG > will work with them.  We have a very old 2000axp server which is what D > the 1.10 and 1.11A ECU diskettes I found  came with originally...I > think. > G > However we also have a 2100 4/233 and 2100a 5/250 that came later. It G > is these I may have to do some config changes to.  I have been unable B > to locate the ECU diskettes that came with them (too many people/ > through the area over the years I am afraid).  > 8 > Can the earlier ECUs work with the 2100/2100a systems? > I > Does anyone know where one can locate a disk image of the "most recent" ! > ECU for the 2100/2100a systems?  > H > I don't suppose it could be as simple as pulling off a disk image fromF > one of the numerous CDs we have filed away over the last 8-10 yrs by
 > any chance?   F ECU disk V1.11a is the latest and greatest and last version avaliable.F It's licensed sofware and not generally available on the net though anG HP person did post a ftp link for a brief time to help us all out.  But G if you have a 1.11a disk then you're set to go.  Just guard it closely.  Back it up often. ;-)      John H. Reinhardt    ------------------------------  + Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 12:54:22 +0000 (UTC) ( From: m.kraemer@gsi.de (Michael Kraemer)B Subject: Re: Will Digital's abandonned software ever go "public" ?5 Message-ID: <dl249u$qo0$1@lnx107.hrz.tu-darmstadt.de>   C In article <1131688383.361011.141240@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,  phil@rephil.org writes:  > F > Incidentally, I think that coding this tight is one thing that makesH > for the reliability of RSX and VMS, and my personal bias is to suggestB > that just becuase memory's cheap doesn't mean that coding shouldB > necessariy be approached any differently -- but that's just (my) > armchair philosophy.  ; OTOH, this "art" of tight coding may conserve memory space, H but wastes a lot of human resources. Not only man-hours (-days ?) of theD actual coder, but even more so the expensive working time of his/herB followers, trying to understand the tricks of the original author.G Also, I don't see why such coding practices would increase reliability,  the contrary seems to be true.     ------------------------------   Date: 11 Nov 2005 14:18:25 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)B Subject: Re: Will Digital's abandonned software ever go "public" ?+ Message-ID: <3tjnhhFtdrqpU1@individual.net>   C In article <1131688383.361011.141240@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,  	phil@rephil.org writes: > Bill Gunshannon wrote:L >> In article <890539d90511031104m64b98fd8t190fe4bae9b47414@mail.gmail.com>,2 >> 	Carl Friedberg <frida.fried@gmail.com> writes:E >> > I seem to remember this was where I first heard the term "Cutler I >> > coding". It referred (to DNC, of course) to Dave's abhorrence of any E >> > wasted locations -- he would dig around for an instruction which 0 >> > had the right value to use as a constant... >>E >> This was more common than you might think, especially in the early ? >> microcomputer days (remember, 28K Words is not much memory).  >  > <SNIP> > = >> JMPing into the middle of the address saved the programmer  >> one byte of memory. > D > I'm a day late and a dollar short, but while it was certainly moreC > common, Cutler was absolutely brutal about it.  He came over from I > DuPont to do RSX-11M, the small memory version of RSX, and he inspected H > *every* line of code in the system.  If he could write it smaller, youH > got it returned.  (He had a stamp that said, "Size is the Goal," but IG > wouldn't be surprised if the slightly more risque version -- that his * > stamp said "Size Matters" -- were true.) > H > My father, who wrote the -11M error-logging subsystem, is really proudF > (to this day!) about the fact that he was able to successfully argueI > his case when he wanted to use two *BITS* that Cutler didn't think were & > needed, until he heard the proposal. > H > No; there is not a lot of unnecessary repetition in RSX-11M!  (perhaps > -11D, probably -11A) > F > Incidentally, I think that coding this tight is one thing that makesH > for the reliability of RSX and VMS, and my personal bias is to suggestB > that just becuase memory's cheap doesn't mean that coding shouldB > necessariy be approached any differently -- but that's just (my) > armchair philosophy.  F I am not arguing for bloatware.  Quite the contrary.  I frequently getC involved in "discussions" with the faculty over wether or not it is G still important to teach efficiency as well as other facets of computer D programming.  I just wanted to point out that when space was limitedE everyone learned how to write dirty tricks that would later make life E miserable for the people who had to maintain the code.  (I have other  scary examples.)   bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  % Date: Fri, 11 Nov 2005 12:05:56 -0500 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> B Subject: Re: Will Digital's abandonned software ever go "public" ?0 Message-ID: <11n9jr4a5brod4a@corp.supernews.com>   Michael Kraemer wrote:E > In article <1131688383.361011.141240@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,  > phil@rephil.org writes:  > F >>Incidentally, I think that coding this tight is one thing that makesH >>for the reliability of RSX and VMS, and my personal bias is to suggestB >>that just becuase memory's cheap doesn't mean that coding shouldB >>necessariy be approached any differently -- but that's just (my) >>armchair philosophy. >  > = > OTOH, this "art" of tight coding may conserve memory space, J > but wastes a lot of human resources. Not only man-hours (-days ?) of theF > actual coder, but even more so the expensive working time of his/herD > followers, trying to understand the tricks of the original author.I > Also, I don't see why such coding practices would increase reliability, ! > the contrary seems to be true.    I When a programmer spends the time to fully test and understand the code,  D then there are far fewer chances of errors.  A single look can miss H things.  Going through something multiple times, in detail, will expose  things.    --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------   Date: 11 Nov 2005 17:55:02 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)B Subject: Re: Will Digital's abandonned software ever go "public" ?+ Message-ID: <3tk47mFt888oU1@individual.net>   5 In article <dl249u$qo0$1@lnx107.hrz.tu-darmstadt.de>, + 	m.kraemer@gsi.de (Michael Kraemer) writes: E > In article <1131688383.361011.141240@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>,  > phil@rephil.org writes:  >>  G >> Incidentally, I think that coding this tight is one thing that makes I >> for the reliability of RSX and VMS, and my personal bias is to suggest C >> that just becuase memory's cheap doesn't mean that coding should C >> necessariy be approached any differently -- but that's just (my)  >> armchair philosophy.  > = > OTOH, this "art" of tight coding may conserve memory space,   > It does more than that.  It gets more efficient use out of the> CPU as well.  And, it makes the programmer actually care about what the program is doing.  ' > but wastes a lot of human resources.    = Matter of opinion.  Some people might think the time was well  spent writing better programs.  K >                                       Not only man-hours (-days ?) of the F > actual coder, but even more so the expensive working time of his/herD > followers, trying to understand the tricks of the original author.  = That's what documentation is for.  But then, many people also = think the time spent writing documentation is wasted as well.   I > Also, I don't see why such coding practices would increase reliability, ! > the contrary seems to be true.    > See comment above.  In order to hand optimize the code one has; to get really intimate with the machine as well as the code ' itself.  That results in better code.      bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2005.630 ************************