1 INFO-VAX	Mon, 03 Oct 2005	Volume 2005 : Issue 551       Contents:D Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? Re: Drawlib not loadedF Re: Getting Management attention for operations integrity (was ;32767) Re: HP : Moving forward  Re: HP : Moving forward  Re: Install a Printer on VMS Q( OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs!, Re: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs!, RE: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs!, Re: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs!, Re: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs! Re: Pipe & MySQL( Re: Thought you would enjoy this posting Re: Time to produce EV79s! RE: Time to produce EV79s! RE: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  * Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 15:30:18 -0500 (CDT)* From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)M Subject: Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? 2 Message-ID: <05100215301865_20216D9F@antinode.org>  & From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@decus.ch>  F > I can't say that I've seen this behaviour, but I do know that after I > changing screen saver settings, unless you log off, saving the current  G > session, a system crash (or shutdown without logging out of DWMOTIF)   > will lose the changes.  ?    Yes.  It sure would be nice to have a "Save Settings" button 
 somewhere.  H > Has SYSTEM logged off meanwhile, resaving the original settings? From E > the date of CURRENT.DIR below (28-SEP-2005), this is a possibility.   E    SYSTEM has logged off, in an attempt to save the changed settings,  and he (I) just did it again.   K > I suggest you change the settings as desired, then log out from DWMOTIF,  C > saving Current as you go. Painful I know if you have a gazillion  F > connections to other systems, but it's the only way I found to make  > things stick.   H    Done (again).  So far, the screen waster settings have persisted, but* having "Dtsession*PreferBlank:  1" in both9 SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSMGR.DT.SESSIONS.CURRENT]DT.SETTINGS;2 and G SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSMGR.DT.SESSIONS.CURRENT_OLD]DT.SETTINGS;2 does not seem D to have had the desired effect.  When I came back after a sufficientE wait, the power LED on the HP P1110 display was still green and there  was still a dim raster.   H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  * Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 17:49:02 +0000 (UTC)< From: gartmann@non.immunbio.mpg.de.sens (Christoph Gartmann) Subject: Re: Drawlib not loaded ) Message-ID: <dhp6ie$fqr$1@news.BelWue.DE>   ` In article <1gS%e.13628$JS5.7201@news.cpqcorp.net>, "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com> writes: > @ >DECW$DEVICE_CONFIG_G*.COM (don't recall offhand the device nameJ >for the 4D20).  It looks at the logical, and if it's not there it appends >and >redefines it.  L I see, it is DECW$DEVICE_CONFIG_GY.COM, would it be safe to modify this one?L But things are even more bizarre. On an AlphaStation 600 5/333 with the sameM card and using the same system disk in the very same cluster there is no such K error, although the logical DECW$SERVER_EXTENSIONS contains "X3D-PEX", too.  The log here looks like this:   4 ffbvmsScreenInit: Call the Default Colormap Creation- ffbvmsScreenInit: Exit from init with success % N_InitLGI : MHEAD_LGI flag is enabled  N_InitLGI : Init SFBPLUS5 shared library DECW$SERVER_DDX_GY sucessfully loaded.  SFBPLUS : N_InitMicrocode > OptionTable Contents (file: SYS$MANAGER:DECW$XSERVER_O3D.CONF)- Export24BitDoubleBufferVisualOnZLXE = "False"  GL Extension initialized Build Date and Source Tree: B DEC:PKO:O3D:3.3.0:x11r6:2.6.0:11:15:95:OSF1:V4.0.214:CC:3.11:OPT:: Tue Mar 25 23:43:46 EST 1997    # Whereas on the node with the error:   4 ffbvmsScreenInit: Call the Default Colormap Creation- ffbvmsScreenInit: Exit from init with success # tm_device_init: Drawlib not loaded. ' PexExtensionInit: DD_DEVICE_INIT failed ! glScreenInit: Drawlib not loaded. $ GLExtensionInit: glScreenInit failed    M In DECW$PRIVATE_SERVER_SETUP.COM both nodes are configured equally. Somehow I 1 cannot figure out what is causing the difference?    Regards,    Christoph Gartmann    --  E  Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452   ImmunbiologieI  Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de   D-79011  Freiburg, Germany 9                http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html    ------------------------------   Date: 2 Oct 2005 15:11:11 -0500 - From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) O Subject: Re: Getting Management attention for operations integrity (was ;32767) 3 Message-ID: <snIQLNj7Y1xE@eisner.encompasserve.org>   h In article <bpW%e.42138$VI6.14627@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk>, Alan Greig <greigaln@netscape.net> writes: >  >  > Paul Sture wrote:  > @ >    passwords from being displayed when entered; (iii) enforces> >>>    password minimum and maximum lifetime restrictions; and >>              ^^^^^^^ B >> I have never understood the logic of minimum password lifetime 0 >> restrictions, so am surprised to see it here. > G > I read it as password minimum length but I agree that is not what it   > actually says.  % 		For password minimum length issues, ! 		IA-2 refers to other standards:   + IA-2 USER IDENTIFICATION AND AUTHENTICATION   7 Control: The information system uniquely identifies and @    authenticates users (or processes acting on behalf of users).  ; Supplemental Guidance: Authentication of user identities is A    accomplished through the use of passwords, tokens, biometrics, A    or in the case of multifactor authentication, some combination ?    therein. FIPS 201 and Special Publications 800-73 and 800-76 @    specify a personal identity verification (PIV) card token forA    use in the unique identification and authentication of federal =    employees and contractors. NIST Special Publication 800-63 =    provides guidance on remote electronic authentication. For 8    other than remote situations, when users identify and8    authenticate to information systems within a specific=    security perimeter which is considered to offer sufficient >    protection, NIST Special Publication 800-63 guidance shouldA    be applied as follows: (i) for low-impact information systems, D    tokens that meet Level 1, 2, 3, or 4 requirements are acceptable;A    (ii) for moderate-impact information systems, tokens that meet >    Level 2, 3, or 4 requirements are acceptable; and (iii) for?    high-impact information systems, tokens that meet Level 3 or @    4 requirements are acceptable. In addition to identifying and8    authenticating users at the information system level,<    identification and authentication mechanisms are employedA    at the application level, when necessary, to provide increased -    information security for the organization.    Control Enhancements:   A    (1) The information system employs multifactor authentication.    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 23:18:59 GMT  From: kashe@sonic.net   Subject: Re: HP : Moving forward8 Message-ID: <geq0k1l9aalijohnu298lif7vmas6k0kto@4ax.com>  4 On Fri, 30 Sep 2005 20:52:19 -0500, David J Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> wrote:   >kashe@sonic.net wrote:  >>  7 >> On Thu, 29 Sep 2005 21:11:13 -0500, David J Dachtera % >> <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> wrote:  >>  " >> >... (is that HIPAA compliant?) >>  = >>         It's my understanding that Windows was known to be G >> non-compliant, but the basic MS argument was, "Do you really want to I >> try to get the majority of hospitals and doctors change to another OS?  > H >Hospitals and doctors don't care about o.s.-es. As long as it has a GUIC >that everyone can understand and the database servers have uptimes : >measured with someone beyond an hourglass, they're happy.  : 	I agree with your migration plan, but there is no way theE government is going to be able to tell hospitals their IT depearments F have to get off a fundamentally insecure OS and migrate to a secure OS? as you suggest. It's already too late -- they're already set up D (except for mainframe components) in a Windows environment. It wouldE be nice, but I can already hear the hospials screaming rape about the  added burden of doing it right.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 21:57:23 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>  Subject: Re: HP : Moving forward+ Message-ID: <43409E13.55B71930@comcast.net>    kashe@sonic.net wrote: > 6 > On Fri, 30 Sep 2005 20:52:19 -0500, David J Dachtera$ > <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> wrote: >  > >kashe@sonic.net wrote:  > >>9 > >> On Thu, 29 Sep 2005 21:11:13 -0500, David J Dachtera ' > >> <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> wrote:  > >>$ > >> >... (is that HIPAA compliant?) > >>? > >>         It's my understanding that Windows was known to be I > >> non-compliant, but the basic MS argument was, "Do you really want to K > >> try to get the majority of hospitals and doctors change to another OS?  > > J > >Hospitals and doctors don't care about o.s.-es. As long as it has a GUIE > >that everyone can understand and the database servers have uptimes < > >measured with someone beyond an hourglass, they're happy. > C >         I agree with your migration plan, but there is no way the G > government is going to be able to tell hospitals their IT depearments H > have to get off a fundamentally insecure OS and migrate to a secure OSA > as you suggest. It's already too late -- they're already set up F > (except for mainframe components) in a Windows environment. It wouldG > be nice, but I can already hear the hospials screaming rape about the ! > added burden of doing it right.   H Well, the government doesn't tell anyone what to use. All they'll say isF that (x) is non-compliant for whatever reason. You then spend the rest@ of your career playing trial-and-error until you find a suitable combination.  H ...and don't worry about "hospials screaming rape about the added burdenH of doing it right". You and I will be the ones who get "raped" when they pass the costs on to us.   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 22:18:04 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>' Subject: Re: Install a Printer on VMS Q + Message-ID: <4340A2EC.252177D8@comcast.net>    John wrote:  > F > How can I install a printer using VMS on an Alpha server. I have theK > following code which I notepaded from the last time one was installed and N > have changed the relevany name of printer and its IP address to what I want.I > Name of Printer = OKI , IP Address = 10.1.1.250. Which is a Dot Matrix.  > I > If I carry out the instructions below will it work or will I cock up my N > whole server?? Do I have to add a Print Queue etc .I'm not in IT but want toK > learn something which should be learanable. I can get to the $ prompt etc  >    John,   > No offense, but if you're not in IT, I'd have to defer to yourH management to give you the privileges that would be required by what you> want to do. In many shops, it would not be security compliant.  D That said, the examples in the on-line documentation may be helpful. Start from here:    http://www.hp.com/go/openvms/doc   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------   Date: 2 Oct 2005 11:50:43 -0700  From: bob@instantwhip.com 1 Subject: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs! C Message-ID: <1128279043.097218.263880@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   ) http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=26614    ------------------------------  # Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 19:37:26 GMT # From: Beach Runner <bob@nospam.com> 5 Subject: Re: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs! < Message-ID: <WFW%e.119354$4i6.13088@tornado.tampabay.rr.com>   bob@instantwhip.com wrote:  + > http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=26614  >  Intel can't afford downtime.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 20:29:03 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> 5 Subject: RE: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs! R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB70C017@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----/ > From: Beach Runner [mailto:bob@nospam.com]=20  > Sent: October 2, 2005 3:37 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 7 > Subject: Re: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs!  >=20 >=20 >=20 > bob@instantwhip.com wrote: >=20/ > > http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=3D26614  > >=20 > Intel can't afford downtime. >=20  C Interesting thing about fabs in general .. Since they are typically G 24x7x364 days a year, any downtime means that is production output lost 4 for the year - there is no time to "make up for it".  ; I know of one well known telecom company that also had semi F manufacturing and used OpenVMS in their primary cluster. They measuredE downtime in the order of CAD $750K/hour since that is how much wafers G etc were lost in that one hour. And they were no where near the size of  Intel..   H Now imagine what these production types would say when there was monthlyE downtime to do security patches as is required by Windows/Linux - and F these folks definitely test everything before it goes into production,) so think about the added QA/test times ..   D As to why they never considered anything but OpenVMS, here is a good example why:  D They were growing extremely fast and their workloads were constantly- pushing the limits of their existing systems.    We had project with them to:# - upgrade OS + apply latest patches = - move to two larger GS60 Alpha systems from two Alpha 4100's " - replace fddi with 100Mb EthernetE - move from CI HSJ40/50 controller to HSJ80 controller disks for main 
 prod disks  D Now, in their own words, something major like this would require 2-3G days downtime on any other platform. Remember the $750K / hour charges?   E With OpenVMS, we did it in only 1 hour of cluster downtime by working  online in the cluster:C - build new version OS in cluster with new disks and new systems to  build specific roots we needed. , - boot new systems in cluster dynamically=20< - design, build and test new HSJ80 based HW raid strategy=20B - used 100Mb Ethernet devices in new systems to check out TCPIP=20C - used host based volume shadowing to replicate disks online to new  controllers./ - used logicals to switch to new disk locations   C Granted, we planned this for 4-5 months, but in the end, the 2 4100 D systems started coming down at 12:00 noon (interesting that this wasH time they chose for the one hour - they viewed lunch time as the slowestC time for them) and at 1:10 pm the systems were all back up again in G production. There were a few misc application issues with some logicals ( etc, but these were all fixed online.=20  H We kidded with the Customer that we actually made our one hour timeframeG as they were slow in bringing down the systems and they were not turned D over to us until 12:10... Needless to say, the Cust (and their Mgmt)D were extremely happy as the old systems performance was hurting them; badly and the new ones gave them some much needed headroom.   E Note - if it were not for some application components not being fully C cluster aware, we could have done all of this with zero application  availability impact.  C So yes, there are some very good reasons why OpenVMS is very much a + preferred OS for semi chip environments.=20   E Ahh its to bad I could not divulge what major semi-chip manufacturing D environments use OpenVMS. I suspect the answer would really surprise
 most folks ..    :-)    Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 21:46:28 -0400, From: "Richard Tomkins" <tomkinsr@istop.com>5 Subject: Re: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs! 8 Message-ID: <1128304148_39873@spool6-east.superfeed.net>  L Of course the other thing to remember, making a chip like an Intel processorK is not a single day affair. Making  a chip is a multi-step, multi-day, week K or monthly affair and downtime means production gets interrupted at a point I in the process where it cannot be accommodated. Manufacturing a chip is a L continuous process once started and must run to completion to be successful.L From what I have read in the past, the full cycle time to make a Pentium wasJ 90 workdays or so, at 24 hours a day. Today's Pentium 4's probably require more time than that.  > We used to be the ones making the process equipment for making? semiconductors, so of course, it's all OpenVMS based worldwide.    rtt       2 "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> wrote in messageL news:FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB70C017@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net... > -----Original Message-----, > From: Beach Runner [mailto:bob@nospam.com] > Sent: October 2, 2005 3:37 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 7 > Subject: Re: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs!  >  >  >  > bob@instantwhip.com wrote: > - > > http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=26614  > >  > Intel can't afford downtime. >   C Interesting thing about fabs in general .. Since they are typically G 24x7x364 days a year, any downtime means that is production output lost 4 for the year - there is no time to "make up for it".  ; I know of one well known telecom company that also had semi F manufacturing and used OpenVMS in their primary cluster. They measuredE downtime in the order of CAD $750K/hour since that is how much wafers G etc were lost in that one hour. And they were no where near the size of  Intel..   H Now imagine what these production types would say when there was monthlyE downtime to do security patches as is required by Windows/Linux - and F these folks definitely test everything before it goes into production,) so think about the added QA/test times ..   D As to why they never considered anything but OpenVMS, here is a good example why:  D They were growing extremely fast and their workloads were constantly- pushing the limits of their existing systems.    We had project with them to:# - upgrade OS + apply latest patches = - move to two larger GS60 Alpha systems from two Alpha 4100's " - replace fddi with 100Mb EthernetE - move from CI HSJ40/50 controller to HSJ80 controller disks for main 
 prod disks  D Now, in their own words, something major like this would require 2-3G days downtime on any other platform. Remember the $750K / hour charges?   E With OpenVMS, we did it in only 1 hour of cluster downtime by working  online in the cluster:C - build new version OS in cluster with new disks and new systems to  build specific roots we needed. ) - boot new systems in cluster dynamically 9 - design, build and test new HSJ80 based HW raid strategy ? - used 100Mb Ethernet devices in new systems to check out TCPIP C - used host based volume shadowing to replicate disks online to new  controllers./ - used logicals to switch to new disk locations   C Granted, we planned this for 4-5 months, but in the end, the 2 4100 D systems started coming down at 12:00 noon (interesting that this wasH time they chose for the one hour - they viewed lunch time as the slowestC time for them) and at 1:10 pm the systems were all back up again in G production. There were a few misc application issues with some logicals % etc, but these were all fixed online.   H We kidded with the Customer that we actually made our one hour timeframeG as they were slow in bringing down the systems and they were not turned D over to us until 12:10... Needless to say, the Cust (and their Mgmt)D were extremely happy as the old systems performance was hurting them; badly and the new ones gave them some much needed headroom.   E Note - if it were not for some application components not being fully C cluster aware, we could have done all of this with zero application  availability impact.  C So yes, there are some very good reasons why OpenVMS is very much a ( preferred OS for semi chip environments.  E Ahh its to bad I could not divulge what major semi-chip manufacturing D environments use OpenVMS. I suspect the answer would really surprise
 most folks ..    :-)    Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)   4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.              O ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- S http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups K ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2005 17:33:58 +1300$ From: "Lurker" <nowhere@nothing.com>5 Subject: Re: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs! 5 Message-ID: <Fv20f.15731$iM2.1281725@news.xtra.co.nz>   2 "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> wrote in messageL news:FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB70C017@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net...  C Interesting thing about fabs in general .. Since they are typically  24x7x364 days a year  3 That's enormous number of days in a year, isn't it? / Roughly speaking about 168 years worth of them.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 22:12:53 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> Subject: Re: Pipe & MySQL + Message-ID: <4340A1B5.1B95C26F@comcast.net>    issinoho wrote:  >  > Mark Berryman wrote: > > issinoho wrote:  > >  > >> Here's a challenge... > >>K > >> When loading a database schema into MySQL on platforms such as Linux & J > >> Windows, the usual format is to redirect a SQL text file to the MySQL > >> interpreter as follows, > >>1 > >>     mysql -u username -p database < file.sql  > >>E > >> at which point it challenges the user for their password, and if ' > >> correct the SQL file is processed.  > >>N > >> I am trying to do this on VMS but with no luck. I've tried the following, > >>8 > >>     $ pipe mysql -u username -p database < file.sql > >>H > >> Both on the command line and in a DCL file with the password on the > >> next line.  > >>I > >> So far I've been defeated; the password challenge seems to throw the H > >> piping process. This is a really useful technique - can anyone help > >> with this.  > >  > > F > > If its okay to put the password on the command line, the following > > syntax works:  > > D > > $ pipe mysql -u username --password=password database < file.sql > > L > > If you must prompt for the password, I have found the following to work: > > 8 > > $ mysql -u username -p -e "source file.sql" database > >  > > Mark Berryman  >  > Thank-you. That *does* work. > F > Shame though that the pipe redirection has problems not evidenced on > other platforms.  G I don't think PIPE is the issue there. Seems to me you're trying to mix 3 incompatible uses of the stdin (SYS$INPUT) stream.     Try a construct like this:   $ SAY := WRITE SYS$OUTPUT  $ pipe -# 	(SAY password ; TYPE file.sql) | - * 	mysql -u username -p database < SYS$PIPE:  E ...and see if that works. It might not, but it's another way to "skin E the cat" if it does, on top of Mike's suggestion which obviously does  work, as you reported.   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 22:01:48 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>1 Subject: Re: Thought you would enjoy this posting + Message-ID: <43409F1B.89EF97AA@comcast.net>    Z wrote: >  > AEF wrote:1 > >>>I found this posting on a Windoze newsgroup. 4 > >>>(should I have just told him to switch to VMS?) > 6 > >>No; he'll be screwed as soon as he gets to ;32767.K > >>Most 3rd party apps for Unix/Windows system don't have that limitation.  > E > > Well, Windows would probably blue screen long before reaching the  > > 32767th version!? > > Having multiple versions of files is a mixed blessing, IMO.  > C > Ok, now THAT I agree with! Too many people think the VMS way with I > multiple versions is always the best. "Mixed blessing" is closer to the 
 > truth, IMO.   & As with most everything, "it depends".  A One of the many wish-list items is an enhancement to PURGE to add G something akin to a /FIX_VERSIONS qualifier such the remaining versions F will be renumbered starting at ;1 or /FIX_VERSIONS=x where renumberingA would start at ;x (not sure what the value of that would be, but, H there's a lot of stuff that means more to others than it does to someone6 else). (Huh? I had a sentence going, but I lost it...)   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------   Date: 2 Oct 2005 11:47:05 -0700  From: bob@instantwhip.com # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! B Message-ID: <1128278825.902269.54770@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>  - can't move to something that isn't there!  We , need replacements for PWS500au's and DS10L's- and Intel doesn't seem to care about that ... . We don't need a superdome for a small 2-4 user
 office ...   ------------------------------  $ Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 20:37:19 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> # Subject: RE: Time to produce EV79s! R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB70C018@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----; > From: bob@instantwhip.com [mailto:bob@instantwhip.com]=20  > Sent: October 2, 2005 2:47 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com % > Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s!  >=20/ > can't move to something that isn't there!  We . > need replacements for PWS500au's and DS10L's/ > and Intel doesn't seem to care about that ... 0 > We don't need a superdome for a small 2-4 user > office ... >=20 >=20  D Now, assuming your applications have paths to Itanium, what is wrong@ with migrating to OpenVMS on low end Integrity servers? They areH certainly designed for small 2-4 user office upgrades from OpenVMS DS10L class systems.=20   ( What is that you are missing with these?D http://www.hp.com/products1/servers/integrity/entry_level/index.html   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 20:55:42 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> # Subject: RE: Time to produce EV79s! R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB70C01A@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message----- > From: Main, Kerry=20 > Sent: October 2, 2005 8:37 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com % > Subject: RE: Time to produce EV79s!  >=20 >=20 >=20 > > -----Original Message-----= > > From: bob@instantwhip.com [mailto:bob@instantwhip.com]=20 ! > > Sent: October 2, 2005 2:47 PM  > > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ' > > Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s!  > >=201 > > can't move to something that isn't there!  We 0 > > need replacements for PWS500au's and DS10L's1 > > and Intel doesn't seem to care about that ... 2 > > We don't need a superdome for a small 2-4 user > > office ... > >=20 > >=20 >=20F > Now, assuming your applications have paths to Itanium, what is wrongB > with migrating to OpenVMS on low end Integrity servers? They are? > certainly designed for small 2-4 user office upgrades from=20  > OpenVMS DS10L  > class systems.=20  >=20* > What is that you are missing with these?F > http://www.hp.com/products1/servers/integrity/entry_level/index.html >=20  E Bob - also, I believe I remember you stating awhile ago that you used  Synergex in your environment.    If so, check out: 2 http://www.synergex.com/solutions/synergy/openVMS/   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 23:42:29 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! , Message-ID: <4340A896.80E020D6@teksavvy.com>   "Main, Kerry" wrote:F > Now, assuming your applications have paths to Itanium, what is wrong9 > with migrating to OpenVMS on low end Integrity servers?     H Because if you're on Alpha, it is much easier and less costly to stay on= alpha. Any migration is costly to customers (time and money).   E Also, how long before HP stops selling low/mid-range IA64 servers and , has just one low end server for developers ?  H Once Intel announced that IA64 was for high end, any product not in thatE niche are in danger of extinction. HP quickly widthdrew workstations. 
 What's next ?   E Would you really understake a massive migration project using servers E that are outside teh declared market niche for IA64 knowing that such 0 servers may be widthdraw anytime in the future ?  F This is why the 8086 is such a good platform for VMS. You know that itD will not be restricted to any niche and that it will remain the mostE scalable architecture from handheld to data centre, thus giving VMS a  wide range of possible markets.   G I have nothing against VMS running on that IA64 thing. But I am against G it running ONLY on that achitecture whose future is already clouded and / present target market very limited to high end.   6 Do you see HP marketing IA64 small end servers on TV ?  A Had HP markted low end IA64 things on TV, it might have given the E architectrure more credibility in the open market. But HP didn't. And C IA64 is relegated to niche market only by people who know about it. " Growth potential is very limited.   G IA64 will only get a certain percentage of installed base of HP-UX, VMS 8 and Tandem. It won't grow significantly outside of that.   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 14:44:25 -0400 - From: "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network> ' Subject: Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 1 Message-ID: <55SdnXL-S64Wt93eRVn-3Q@adelphia.com>    Alan Greig wrote:  > H > Drat, I just sent a public reply that was meant to be a reply/sender. I > Please pretend you didn't see it if you are on the mailing list or see  # > it before I cancel it in news :-)   D As a casualty of pranksters running cancelbots canceling legitimate 0 posts, many new servers no longer honor cancels.  H comp.os.vms appears also to be privately archived in many places, and I 9 am not sure how to find all of them for private removals.   H Apparently if you fill out some web form on google they will remove the * copy of your post that they have archived.   -John  wb8tyw@qsl.network Personal Opinion Only    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 21:11:56 +0200 & From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@decus.ch>' Subject: Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 + Message-ID: <3qapnvFe35pqU1@individual.net>    John E. Malmberg wrote:  > Alan Greig wrote:  >  >>I >> Drat, I just sent a public reply that was meant to be a reply/sender.  J >> Please pretend you didn't see it if you are on the mailing list or see $ >> it before I cancel it in news :-) >  > F > As a casualty of pranksters running cancelbots canceling legitimate 2 > posts, many new servers no longer honor cancels. > J > comp.os.vms appears also to be privately archived in many places, and I ; > am not sure how to find all of them for private removals.  > J > Apparently if you fill out some web form on google they will remove the , > copy of your post that they have archived. >   4 I stashed the Google url to do this a long time ago:   Subject: Google url removal.  E You need to register with your email address as a username first - I  > assume that they use that as a basic confirmation of identity.  5 http://services.google.com:8882/urlconsole/controller         That is correct. here's the url:  5 http://services.google.com:8882/urlconsole/controller      > -John  > wb8tyw@qsl.network > Personal Opinion Only    ------------------------------  $ Date: Sun, 2 Oct 2005 21:27:05 -0400, From: "Richard Tomkins" <tomkinsr@istop.com>' Subject: Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 8 Message-ID: <1128302982_39851@spool6-east.superfeed.net>  L It will live on around the world forever, even if just in backups somewhere.  F Once you hit send, the news group posting lands on hundreds of servers, within seconds and thousands within minutes.   You cannot delete the internet.     8 "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network> wrote in message+ news:55SdnXL-S64Wt93eRVn-3Q@adelphia.com...  > Alan Greig wrote:  > > I > > Drat, I just sent a public reply that was meant to be a reply/sender. J > > Please pretend you didn't see it if you are on the mailing list or see% > > it before I cancel it in news :-)  > E > As a casualty of pranksters running cancelbots canceling legitimate 2 > posts, many new servers no longer honor cancels. > I > comp.os.vms appears also to be privately archived in many places, and I ; > am not sure how to find all of them for private removals.  > I > Apparently if you fill out some web form on google they will remove the , > copy of your post that they have archived. >  > -John  > wb8tyw@qsl.network > Personal Opinion Only  >       O ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- S http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups K ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 18:47:05 -0700  From: Z <Z@no.spam> ' Subject: Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 + Message-ID: <r400f.14714$uD2.1171@fe05.lga>    BRAD wrote: 6 >>> No; he'll be screwed as soon as he gets to ;32767.  H > BTW - <http://dcl.openvms.org> has a command procedure posted to deal F > with these kind of problems.  I'm sure many of us have written such 
 > procedures.   E And many of us work on 24/7/365 systems that have the currently open  G versions of files locked. You can argue that it's poor software design  F to not build in version pruning (and I'd agree), but the fact remains 2 that no such problem exists on Unix/Linux/Windows.    C > All too true - while there are many of us with the knowledge and  H > experience to deal with simple problems like this, too many of us are J > unemployed, while third-party "experts" pull down the "big bucks".  Sad.  E Just because it's simple to write a DCL procedure or issue a few DCL  F commands to prune versions, that doesn't necessarily make the problem  simple.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 22:05:21 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>' Subject: Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 + Message-ID: <43409FF1.4BF26E5C@comcast.net>    Z wrote: > 
 > BRAD wrote: 8 > >>> No; he'll be screwed as soon as he gets to ;32767. > I > > BTW - <http://dcl.openvms.org> has a command procedure posted to deal G > > with these kind of problems.  I'm sure many of us have written such  > > procedures.  > F > And many of us work on 24/7/365 systems that have the currently openH > versions of files locked. You can argue that it's poor software designG > to not build in version pruning (and I'd agree), but the fact remains 4 > that no such problem exists on Unix/Linux/Windows. > D > > All too true - while there are many of us with the knowledge andI > > experience to deal with simple problems like this, too many of us are L > > unemployed, while third-party "experts" pull down the "big bucks".  Sad. > F > Just because it's simple to write a DCL procedure or issue a few DCLG > commands to prune versions, that doesn't necessarily make the problem 	 > simple.   C True. There's a lot of places where fully-qualified filespec.'s are F stored, including the version. Go and changed those, you'd have rather an issue to deal with.  B Also, not quite sure what the reference to "version pruning" trulyH indicates. PURGE and version limits seems to do quite nicely, other than the ;32767 thing.    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 02 Oct 2005 21:39:52 -0700  From: Z <Z@no.spam> ' Subject: Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 ( Message-ID: <pC20f.442$JQ1.227@fe02.lga>   David J Dachtera wrote: F >>Just because it's simple to write a DCL procedure or issue a few DCLG >>commands to prune versions, that doesn't necessarily make the problem 	 >>simple.   E > True. There's a lot of places where fully-qualified filespec.'s are H > stored, including the version. Go and changed those, you'd have rather > an issue to deal with. > D > Also, not quite sure what the reference to "version pruning" trulyJ > indicates. PURGE and version limits seems to do quite nicely, other than > the ;32767 thing.   G Sorry "version pruning," as I use the term, is some way to address the  D ;32767 issue. If could be using N minutes of scheduled down time to H purge/rename or embed a date/time into filenames or directories created F so that there's only a ;1 version or even building a transaction that 7 closes/opens files so that files can be purged/renamed.   H It would be nice if the 3rd party developers of software for VMS system 5 took VMS file versions into consideration but few do.   I Or even if VMS's /VERSION_LIMIT=1 meant that a new ;1 would still be ;1,  ? not ;2. That would be a clean, simple fix (from my POV, anyway)    ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2005.551 ************************