1 INFO-VAX	Wed, 05 Oct 2005	Volume 2005 : Issue 555       Contents:# =??Q?Re:_INFO-VAX_gone_berserk=3F?= # =??Q?Re:_INFO-VAX_gone_berserk=3F?= D Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1?D Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1?D Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1?D Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1?@ Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1?D Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1?D Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1?D Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1?D Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1?D Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1?P Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? V1.3-1?V1.3% Re: books for an OS design enthusiast . BZIP2 (1.0.3) v. VMS -- yet another adaptation Re: CREATE file 0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? Re: Drawlib not loaded4 Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs4 Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs4 Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs4 Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs4 Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs4 Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs	 Re: GCC ? 	 Re: GCC ? 9 Re: Getting Management attention for operations integrity + Re: How to make a DLT firmware update tape? + HP : Massive strike and protest march today / Re: HP : Massive strike and protest march today / Re: HP : Massive strike and protest march today / Re: HP : Massive strike and protest march today / Re: HP : Massive strike and protest march today / Re: HP : Massive strike and protest march today / Re: HP : Massive strike and protest march today  HP : Moving forward ) Re: HP may diminish the number of layoffs H Re: HP will have to give back 1.25 M EUR help that it got to createjobs.H Re: HP will have to give back 1.25 M EUR help that it got to createjobs. HP's strategy explained :  Re: HP's strategy explained :  Re: HP's strategy explained :  Re: HP's strategy explained :  Re: HP's strategy explained :  Re: HP's strategy explained :  Re: HP's strategy explained :  Re: HP's strategy explained :  Re: HP's strategy explained :  INFO-VAX gone berserk? INFO-VAX gone berserk? Re: Install a Printer on VMS Q Re: Jump to console ?  Re: Kea and VMS ' Match-Maker wanted - Oz positions on go  Multiple X servers?  Re: Multiple X servers?  Re: Multiple X servers?  Re: Multiple X servers?  Re: Multiple X servers?  Re: Multiple X servers? D Re: New SWB (Mozilla) browser version 1.7.11, spam filtering problem2 Re: ODS-5 directory and header definitions, where?P ODS-5 directory and header definitions, where? Was: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 w, Re: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs!( OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs!, Re: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs!  Re: OpenVMS Hobby Licence Issues6 Re: OpenVMS on rx2600 (was Re: Time to produce EV79s!)6 Re: OpenVMS on rx2600 (was Re: Time to produce EV79s!)6 Re: OpenVMS on rx2600 (was Re: Time to produce EV79s!)6 Re: OpenVMS on rx2600 (was Re: Time to produce EV79s!)+ Re: OT : Is HP still socially responsible ?  Re: Pipe & MySQL Re: Pipe & MySQL# Problems downloading Apache from HP ' Re: Problems downloading Apache from HP ' Re: Problems downloading Apache from HP ' Re: Problems downloading Apache from HP  Process accounting status  Re: Process accounting status  Re: Process accounting status 8 Re: Question: ATX Powersupply For AlphaPC164 Motherboard Re: Quotation marks  Re: Quotation marks  Re: SC008/Star Couplers. Re: SC008/Star Couplers. see anybody you know?  Re: see anybody you know?  Re: see anybody you know?  Re: see anybody you know?  Re: see anybody you know?  Re: SIMH and device access.  SWXCR RAID Configuration TCPWare 5.7 & libpcap C Re: Tentative DCL suggestion: string return value from .COM (Hello, ( Re: Thought you would enjoy this posting( Re: Thought you would enjoy this posting( Re: Thought you would enjoy this posting Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! RE: Time to produce EV79s! RE: Time to produce EV79s! RE: Time to produce EV79s! RE: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Turn $6 into $6.000 > Re: UAF-W-IDOUTRNG, identifier value is not within legal range Re: Vamp Hacked! Re: Vamp Hacked! Re: Vamp Hacked! Re: Vamp Hacked! Re: Vamp Hacked! Re: Vamp Hacked! Re: Vamp Hacked!- VAX 8350/8200 - Lights on, but nobody home... 1 Re: VAX 8350/8200 - Lights on, but nobody home... 1 Re: VAX 8350/8200 - Lights on, but nobody home...  Re: Vax Needed...  Re: Vax Needed...  Re: Vax Needed... / VAX8350 Power Supply (H7251/H7253) problems.... 3 Re: VAX8350 Power Supply (H7251/H7253) problems.... 3 Re: VAX8350 Power Supply (H7251/H7253) problems.... ! VMS 4.6/4.7 Local Area VAXcluster 1 Re: VMS compatible terminal emulator for Mac OS X - VMS compatible terminal emulator for Mac OS X  Re: VMS on the |nquirer  VMS on the |nquirer , Re: What is holding up linux on wall street?, Re: What is holding up linux on wall street?, Re: What is holding up linux on wall street?( What is holding up linux on wall street?, RE: What is holding up linux on wall street?, RE: What is holding up linux on wall street?6 Re: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce?2 Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce?6 Re: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce?6 Re: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce?6 Re: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce?6 Re: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce?1 RE: Will "COM for OpenVMS" be ported to Itanium ? / Re: [F$GETQUI] How to find all execution queues  Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 22:51:06 -0500( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com>, Subject: =??Q?Re:_INFO-VAX_gone_berserk=3F?=B Message-ID: <1128484290.e543d66355d5cf35ed1e1cb04880f8ee@teranews>  B On 10/04/2005 22:21:52 sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) wrote:  L > I just got about a hundred old postings, including a few "Rejected postingH > to INFO-VAX@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU" messages related to duplicates of my ownB > postings.  If this continues, someone might wish to take a look.    H Yeah, I got a bunch of those duplicates too.  If my last couple of postsK hadn't been via an actual newsreader and news server, those would probably   have been dupes too.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 04:21:24 GMT ( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com>, Subject: =??Q?Re:_INFO-VAX_gone_berserk=3F?=< Message-ID: <8xI0f.664$R62.410@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  B On 10/04/2005 22:21:52 sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) wrote:  L > I just got about a hundred old postings, including a few "Rejected postingH > to INFO-VAX@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU" messages related to duplicates of my ownB > postings.  If this continues, someone might wish to take a look.    H Yeah, I got a bunch of those duplicates too.  If my last couple of postsK hadn't been via an actual newsreader and news server, those would probably   have been dupes too.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 15:39:11 -0600 + From: Mark Berryman <mark@theberrymans.com> M Subject: Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? % Message-ID: <43429411$1@mvb.saic.com>    Steven M. Schweda wrote:   [text deleted]  H >    So, I'll return to my almost original question: Is there any chanceH > of getting a serious power-save mode?  (Having a user interface like aI > check-box (or two) in the Screen control would be nice, too, instead of F > having to edit a file and hope that it doesn't get overwritten whileI > you're not looking.)  On the bright side, the only cards I have are the G > 3Dlabs Oxygen, the ELSA GLoria, and the PBXGA, so that should lighten 3 > the workload some (as no one else seems to care).   I I care.  However, I am using a Radeon 7500 and that does put the monitor  8   to sleep so that makes me think it is driver specific.  H >    On the _actual_ original complaint, after all the fooling around, IJ > haven't caught it again reverting to mystery settings.  But I still haveC > my eye on it.  (I want to make that clear in case it's reading my 
 > e-mail.)  I MPlayer has some code that turns off the screensaver.  Wanna bet that is  
 your culprit?   
 Mark Berryman    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 22:22:12 GMT * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com>M Subject: Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? 3 Message-ID: <ogD0f.13857$td7.6668@news.cpqcorp.net>   8 "Mark Berryman" <mark@theberrymans.com> wrote in message news:43429411$1@mvb.saic.com...  > Steven M. Schweda wrote: >  > [text deleted] > J > >    So, I'll return to my almost original question: Is there any chanceJ > > of getting a serious power-save mode?  (Having a user interface like aK > > check-box (or two) in the Screen control would be nice, too, instead of H > > having to edit a file and hope that it doesn't get overwritten whileK > > you're not looking.)  On the bright side, the only cards I have are the I > > 3Dlabs Oxygen, the ELSA GLoria, and the PBXGA, so that should lighten 5 > > the workload some (as no one else seems to care).  > J > I care.  However, I am using a Radeon 7500 and that does put the monitor: >   to sleep so that makes me think it is driver specific. >   E Yes.  The screen disable code is driver dependent.  Originally on the  Vaxstation1 J with the monochrome FB, the code turned off output entirely - which led toL complaints about the slow startup time and screen flash (this was before theI days of monitors with power modes).  By the time that monitors came along F with power down modes, nobody wanted to go back and try and change allK the various drivers.  Today, what state the monitor is placed in depends on  who 8 wrote the driver for it - and who complained about what.   ------------------------------  * Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 18:09:48 -0500 (CDT)* From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)M Subject: Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? 2 Message-ID: <05100418094825_20200274@antinode.org>  + From: Mark Berryman <mark@theberrymans.com>   K > I care.  However, I am using a Radeon 7500 and that does put the monitor  : >   to sleep so that makes me think it is driver specific.      That's an interesting datum.   J > >    On the _actual_ original complaint, after all the fooling around, IL > > haven't caught it again reverting to mystery settings.  But I still haveE > > my eye on it.  (I want to make that clear in case it's reading my  > > e-mail.) > K > MPlayer has some code that turns off the screensaver.  Wanna bet that is   > your culprit?   ?    I've run MPlayer and then checked the Style Manager - Screen E settings, and seen no change.  I wouldn't rule it out, but it doesn't H seem to do it reliably.  When I've seen the Screen Waster disfunctional,4 the settings show it (and the Screen Lock) as "Off".  H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:50 GMT * From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)M Subject: Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? < Message-ID: <_4G0f.530$R62.107@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  & From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@decus.ch>  F > I can't say that I've seen this behaviour, but I do know that after I > changing screen saver settings, unless you log off, saving the current  G > session, a system crash (or shutdown without logging out of DWMOTIF)   > will lose the changes.  ?    Yes.  It sure would be nice to have a "Save Settings" button 
 somewhere.  H > Has SYSTEM logged off meanwhile, resaving the original settings? From E > the date of CURRENT.DIR below (28-SEP-2005), this is a possibility.   E    SYSTEM has logged off, in an attempt to save the changed settings,  and he (I) just did it again.   K > I suggest you change the settings as desired, then log out from DWMOTIF,  C > saving Current as you go. Painful I know if you have a gazillion  F > connections to other systems, but it's the only way I found to make  > things stick.   H    Done (again).  So far, the screen waster settings have persisted, but* having "Dtsession*PreferBlank:  1" in both9 SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSMGR.DT.SESSIONS.CURRENT]DT.SETTINGS;2 and G SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSMGR.DT.SESSIONS.CURRENT_OLD]DT.SETTINGS;2 does not seem D to have had the desired effect.  When I came back after a sufficientE wait, the power LED on the HP P1110 display was still green and there  was still a dim raster.   H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:44 GMT * From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)I Subject: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? < Message-ID: <U4G0f.528$R62.321@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  H    I've recently noticed that the screen saver/lock on my ("new") XP1000G seems to be disabling itself from time to time.  I set the times in the C Style Manager - Screen dialog in the New Desktop (30 minutes and 60 D minutes), and enable both.  If I re-open the dialog immediately, theH settings appear as I set them.  Then I remain logged in for some hours. F Eventually, I notice that the screen isn't saved and/or locked when itE should be, and if I re-open the Screen dialog I see that it's back to B Screen Saver Off, 10 minutes (grayed), Screen Lock Off, 60 minutesB (grayed).  Am I alone, or is this a common problem?  Any known (or suspected) reason?  E    The hardware is an XP1000 (500MHz) with a 3Dlabs Oxygen VX1 with a ? system disk which came from an AlpSta 200 4/233 with a PBXGA-BA D (ZXLp-E2).  I believe that the patches are pretty close to current. 3 PRODUCT SHOW PRODUCT /FULL mentions (among others):   . VMS V7.3-2                      DWMOTIF V1.3-14 VMS732_GRAPHICS V4.0            DWMOTIF_ECO02 V1.3-1 VMS732_SYS V8.0  VMS732_UPDATE V4.0 VMS732_VMSMUP V1.0  G    And speaking of "screen savers" which are actually "screen wasters", H I know that there's no significant VMS workstation market any more, but H is there any hope of ever seeing a true screen saver, that is, one whichG shuts off the video signal and lets the ("ENERGY STAR") CRT really save ; itself ("sleep mode", "http://www.energystar.gov/index.cfm? G fuseaction=find_a_product.showProductGroup&pgw_code=MO")?  And then, if  it could just stay engaged ...  H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:47 GMT * From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)M Subject: Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? < Message-ID: <X4G0f.529$R62.284@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com>  , > A co-worker is sneaking in an changing it?  8    SYSTEM and I are the only users, and I'm SYSTEM, too.   >   A program is altering it?   E    I don't know of any clever enough to do that, but I'll keep an eye  open.    >   You G > have a home session defined (and no current session - or perhaps when F > you moved the system disk you screwed up file ownership protections), > and somehow it is overriding the settings?  G    Startup says "Resume current session", but I'm not logging out, just G walking away.  Does BACKUP /IMAGE screw up file ownership protections?  H (I had planned simply to move the disk, but when I heard it at power-up,D for the first time in a couple of years, I decided that a fresh disk would be safer.)    >   In any case, I've never seen > this behavior.  +    I always like to be on the cutting edge.   * Directory SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSMGR.DT.SESSIONS]  I CURRENT.DIR;1               1  28-SEP-2005 16:24:50.44  (RWED,RWED,RE,RE) I CURRENT_FONT.DIR;1          1  30-MAY-1999 20:18:11.17  (RWED,RWED,RE,RE) I CURRENT_OLD.DIR;1           1   2-SEP-2005 21:34:23.71  (RWED,RWED,RE,RE) G DTWMFP.SESSION;1            1  28-SEP-2005 16:24:51.27  (RWED,RWED,RE,)    Total of 4 files, 4 blocks.     F > The "blank" screen setting by default on the Oxygen VX1 should causeF > the device driver to put the screen into power-saver mode.  The onlyD > way this won't happen is if something (or someone) has changed the( > setting of "prefer blanking" to false.  E    I don't recall ever setting (or seeing) a "prefer blanking" thing. F but now I see that SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSMGR.DT.SESSIONS.CURRENT]DT.SETTINGSF does say "Dtsession*PreferBlank:  0", so I'll see if I can change that? manually.  (It's also zero in the [...CURRENT_OLD]DT.SETTINGS.)   M > I would look at the contents of the resource files in [.dt...] as the first G > likely suspect.  I would then look for something that is running XSET A > (from DECW$UTILS) to change the screen saver settings.  If none J > of those are at fault, then I would look at the system resource files in@ > CDE$SYSTEM_COMMON:[*...] to see if they have been altered.  IfM > not I would then suspect an application is doing it.  If not - then I would ! > look for ghosts in the machine.   F    I know of nothing which runs XSET.  The usual applications are justB Web browsers, DECterms, the occasional MPlayer -- nothing exotic. E Nothing in CDE$SYSTEM_COMMON:[*...] seems to be newer than 1-SEP-2003 " (and most things are a lot older).  H    I'll watch it for a while to see if I can spot something.  Otherwise,( I'll start shopping around for a medium.  +    In any case, thanks for the suggestions.   H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:54 GMT * From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)M Subject: Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? < Message-ID: <25G0f.531$R62.265@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com>  = > Well, you have something screwed up.  Just don't know what.   E    Wouldn't amaze me, but I didn't think I did anything very exotic.  1 The DECW$PRIVATE_SERVER_SETUP.COM includes these:   # $    decw$xsize_in_pixels == "1280" # $    decw$ysize_in_pixels == "1024" ; $ define /system /executive_mode decw$server_pixel_depth 24  and for an ELSA:< $ define /system /executive_mode decw$server_refresh_rate 75# and a bunch of process quota stuff.   H    The screen waster's residual raster does look funny -- only about 3/4F of normal width, with a bit of foldover at the edges, as I recall, butD there definitely is something there, and it keeps the display awake.  D > If you let a unlogged on screen set for 12 minutes or so until theA > screen saver blanks it - does the monitor go into screen saver?   E    I have less primary XP1000 with a fairly fresh installation of VMS F V8.2 (and friends) and an ELSA GLoria Synergy card.  I haven't checkedH its screen saver/waster operation yet, but playing with it would be lessE bothersome than with the primary XP1000.  Should the GZ (ELSA) driver > have the same power-save capability as the GF (3Dlabs) driver?  H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:58 GMT * From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)M Subject: Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? < Message-ID: <65G0f.532$R62.442@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com>  I > >    I have less primary XP1000 with a fairly fresh installation of VMS J > > V8.2 (and friends) and an ELSA GLoria Synergy card.  I haven't checkedL > > its screen saver/waster operation yet, but playing with it would be lessI > > bothersome than with the primary XP1000.  Should the GZ (ELSA) driver B > > have the same power-save capability as the GF (3Dlabs) driver? > M > Completely different drivers, but I think that the GZ driver also turns off 6 > the appropriate signals to put the monitor to sleep.  D    I'm starting to think that you're making the whole thing up.  The> secondary XP1000 (500 MHz) with the ELSA (GZ) card has a cleanH installation of OPENVMS V8.2, DWMOTIF V1.5, and not a whole lot more.  I" added the node-specific changes toH SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSMGR]DECW$PRIVATE_SERVER_SETUP.COM to match the same fileA on the primary system, with these obvious results (from "SHOW LOG  DECW*"):  "   "DECW$SERVER_PIXEL_DEPTH" = "24"#   "DECW$SERVER_REFRESH_RATE" = "75"   G    It seems to work the same as the primary system with the 3Dlabs (GF) F card, that is, no true display sleep mode.  The display on this systemE is some Dell/Sony thing with a power LED which turns yellow when it's E attached to a Mac and the Mac goes into Energy Save mode.  On the VMS D system, the screen goes dark but the LED stays green (and there's noG click from what I assume is some relay inside the thing, either).  (The A LEDs on the LK450-AA flash in an entertaining sequence, however.)   H    Aside from a brief flash/click between logout and the appearance of aF new "Welcome to LOCAL:.ALP2" login window, I never see any evidence ofF anything like a sleepy display mode, just a dark screen.  This is trueF for a logged-in session and for the login window.  Waiting long enough; to engage the screen lock also seems to make no difference.   
    Initially:   A ALP2 $ type SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSMGR.dt.sessions.current]dt.settings;1  Dtsession*AllowExp:     1  Dtsession*Interval:     600  Dtsession*ShutDownMode: 4 ! Dtsession*ShutDownState:        1  Dtsession*PreferBlank:  0  Dtsession*Timeout:      120   ?    After manual editing and a couple of login-logout and reboot  operations:   @ ALP2 $ type SYS$SYSROOT:[SYSMGR.dt.sessions.current]dt.settings; Dtsession*AllowExp:     1  Dtsession*Interval:     600  Dtsession*ShutDownMode: 4 ! Dtsession*ShutDownState:        1  Dtsession*PreferBlank:  1  Dtsession*Timeout:      120   D    If it would be useful, I could probably find enough connectors toF create a break-out display cable and scope the wires of your choice toA see better exactly what it _is_ doing, but it's pretty clear that ? whatever it is, it's not persuading any of the displays I have.   6    Any other suggestions would be gratefully received.  H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode.org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:35:05 GMT * From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)M Subject: Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? < Message-ID: <d5G0f.534$R62.436@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com>  K > Hmmm.  Taking a look at it, it seems that it is setup for a "light sleep"  > mode. F > IIRC we force VSYNC active high, and HSYNC active low - which is oneE > of the power saver modes.  IIRC there are several power down modes, J > each takes a different amount of time to power various monitors up from.L > Without actually looking closer into it, my guess is that it isn't putting > the 4 > monitor into sleep mode - to allow faster on time.  D    Having no handy power measuring instrument, I can't say much with@ authority, but it sure seems unlikely to me that leaving the CRTG filament on, the HV on, and the sweep operating is actually saving much D power.  I thought that the whole idea was to let the user suffer for6 twenty seconds if he left the room for an hour or two.  F    So, I'll return to my almost original question: Is there any chanceF of getting a serious power-save mode?  (Having a user interface like aG check-box (or two) in the Screen control would be nice, too, instead of D having to edit a file and hope that it doesn't get overwritten whileG you're not looking.)  On the bright side, the only cards I have are the E 3Dlabs Oxygen, the ELSA GLoria, and the PBXGA, so that should lighten 1 the workload some (as no one else seems to care).   F    On the _actual_ original complaint, after all the fooling around, IH haven't caught it again reverting to mystery settings.  But I still haveA my eye on it.  (I want to make that clear in case it's reading my  e-mail.)  H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:35:08 GMT * From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)M Subject: Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? < Message-ID: <g5G0f.535$R62.172@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  + From: Mark Berryman <mark@theberrymans.com>   K > I care.  However, I am using a Radeon 7500 and that does put the monitor  : >   to sleep so that makes me think it is driver specific.      That's an interesting datum.   J > >    On the _actual_ original complaint, after all the fooling around, IL > > haven't caught it again reverting to mystery settings.  But I still haveE > > my eye on it.  (I want to make that clear in case it's reading my  > > e-mail.) > K > MPlayer has some code that turns off the screensaver.  Wanna bet that is   > your culprit?   ?    I've run MPlayer and then checked the Style Manager - Screen E settings, and seen no change.  I wouldn't rule it out, but it doesn't H seem to do it reliably.  When I've seen the Screen Waster disfunctional,4 the settings show it (and the Screen Lock) as "Off".  H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 23:51:40 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com Y Subject: Re: Auto-disabling screen saver on Alpha VMS V7.3-2, DWMOTIF V1.3-1? V1.3-1?V1.3 - Message-ID: <873bnhz3eb.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   , sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) writes:  ( > From: Paul Sture <paul.sture@decus.ch>  F >> I can't say that I've seen this behaviour, but I do know that afterA >> changing screen saver settings, unless you log off, saving the F >> current session, a system crash (or shutdown without logging out of" >> DWMOTIF) will lose the changes.  A >    Yes.  It sure would be nice to have a "Save Settings" button  > somewhere.  C Having stayed well away from VUE regurgitated ;) After you make the A changes, if you log in with a saved session, you need to save the  current setting.   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:37:24 GMT  From: jordan@ccs4vms.com. Subject: Re: books for an OS design enthusiast< Message-ID: <o7G0f.572$R62.226@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  F Its been a while since I had time or need to review this stuff, sadly.* Work has gone in far different directions.  A I was impressed with "VAX/VMS Operating System Concepts" by David E Donald Miller; it was designed as a textbook and for me it did a very 	 good job.   F Also "Computer Programming and Architecture: The VAX" by Henry M. LevyD and Richard H. Eckhouse Jr.  While this is mostly a programming book? (assembler, aka Macro-32) it includes several chapters covering F operating system support and structures that provide good information.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:41 GMT * From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)7 Subject: BZIP2 (1.0.3) v. VMS -- yet another adaptation < Message-ID: <R4G0f.527$R62.498@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  B    I recently wanted to unpack some bit of freeware which had beenG compressed using the increasingly popular "bzip2" program, and, like an H idiot, I started looking at the bzip2 code when I should have been doing- something useful.  (It _says_ it's portable.)   D    I'm not thrilled with the result, but it should have the same I/OH speed improvements as the recent Info-ZIP [Un]Zip programs, along with a? few other potentially useful changes.  As it seems to be pretty F CPU-intense, you might not notice much of a change on a slow machine. G To be honest, the I/O code is so simple that I didn't notice any effect H when I enabled the optional large-file support (non-VAX, of course), butF I can't guarantee that it doesn't make some difference in some case or( other.  It seems to be harmless, anyway.  A    Anyone who's (or, as this is comp.os.vms, perhaps I should say E "whose" or "whoose") desperate for amusement might wish to look into:   $       http://antinode.org/ftp/bzip2/       ftp://antinode.org/bzip2/   D The Zip (-V) archive there is source-only, not well tested, and withE changes only minimally documented, and it comes with no more warranty ? than the original code kit (which is less than any).  As usual, A complaints are welcome, as are odious comparisons with some other - (slap-dash) VMS adaptation of the same stuff.   H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:40:39 GMT - From: "Doug Phillips" <dphill46@netscape.net>  Subject: Re: CREATE file< Message-ID: <raG0f.626$R62.490@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  
 AEF wrote: > Tom Linden wrote: : > > Occasionally we will receive a code fragment by email,7 > > which is read on a W2K box.  It would be convenient ; > > to cut and paste into a window running Putty and logged  > > in to a VMS box. > > 9 > > Now, I can cut and paste from the same window or from ; > > another PuTTY window logged into anothe VMS without any 8 > > problems, but if I try to do so it causes a problem. >  > H > I think you just contradicted yourself here. Oh, your copying the code1 > snippet from a Windows email client window? OK.  >  > : > > For example, if I cut and paste the first paragraph to- > > a PuTTY window logged in to VMS via SSH :  > >  > >  > > HAFNER> create scratch: > > Occasionally we will receive a code fragment by email,7 > > which is read on a W2K box.  It would be convenient  > > to cut and paste into a wi1 > > %CREATE-E-READERR, error reading SYS$INPUT:.;  > > -RMS-F-RER, file read error & > > -SYSTEM-W-DATAOVERUN, data overrun > >  > > 6 > > which means that it is expecting 132 char records? > > 6 > > I tried $ SET TERM/WIDTH=511/WRAP  but same result > >  > > What to do?  >  > & > I'd open a new file with EVE, paste,    D Pasting into an editor has always worked for me and I've never had a
 data overrun.   # > exit EVE. (This works better than  > EDT with hostsync set.) B > Then I'd open the file again with EDT and clean it up if needed. >   % Or, just stay in EVE and clean it up.   F > I can see at least one potential problem: Windows windows often haveC > very long lines of text that if you're lucky are actually wrapped H > properly by the app. You may have to manually cut up such lines on theA > VMS side. I'm all ears if someone has a better way to deal with 3 > too-long lines copied from Windows to a VMS file!   C If you've $SET TERM tt:/NOWRAP and EVE is SET NOWRAP, then the only G cleanup to do will be on the lines that were cobbled in the source doc.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:17 GMT # From: "H Vlems" <hvlems@freenet.de> 9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? ; Message-ID: <d8G0f.588$R62.35@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   C This kind of up/down pattern is what you got when heartbeat was not B enabled on a transceiver when it was needed (or vice versa). SVA-0A indicates a microVAX or VAXstation 3100 kind of system. It wasn't E fitted with an external transceiver, was it? These older systems have D AUI and thinwire, no support for UTP; an external transceiver solvesG that problem but the heartbeat switch (or SEQ or squelch) may be in the  wrong position.    Two other possibilities:D - the system is on an ethernet segment with a *lot* of traffic (LAVc/ clusters, lots of ethertalk or netbeui clients) G - the system was accidentally converted from an endnode to a router and - does not have the appropriate DECnet license.    Hans   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:31 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? < Message-ID: <r8G0f.592$R62.154@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Hoff Hoffman wrote: l > In article <1127938795.354636.197410@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> writes: > < > :How can a node drop itself? See below. What does it mean? >  >   No answers.  Sorry.  >  >   Some questions, however... > / >   What is connected onto the SVA-0 port here?   ; Other MicroVAX 3100's, mostly model 80's, but 3 model 95's.    NODE_F model 95  NODE_X model 80  NODE_Y model 80     C >   Is this box an end-node, a level one router, or an area router?    NODE_X is a router NODE_Y is an end node  NODE_F is a router   We have no area routers.  " >   What is your network topology?   These are on a VLAN in London.  F We have 2 DNIP tunnels, one from NYC to London and another from NYC to9 Hong Kong. NODE_X is one end of the NYC to London tunnel.    > > >   Does this box have more than one network connection to the0 >   same or to the same bridged network segment? > E >   What versions of DECnet and OpenVMS (and ECOs) are involved here?    NODE_F: VMS 6.1  NODE_X: VMS 6.2  NODE_Y: VMS 6.1    All have  6 Identification           = DECnet for OpenVMS VAX V6.1! Management version       = V4.0.0  Incoming timer           = 45  Outgoing timer           = 60 " Incoming Proxy           = Enabled" Outgoing Proxy           = Enabled! NSP version              = V4.1.0  Maximum links            = 256 Delay factor             = 80  Delay weight             = 5 Inactivity timer         = 60  Retransmit factor        = 10 ! Routing version          = V2.0.0      >   One guess: > B >   Network cabling problems (cable shorts, too little or too muchC >   termination on ThinWire or thick wire, etc) and controller (and C >   the transceiver, for those NICs that use one) hardware problems ' >   can cause DECnet circuits to yo-yo.     E Well, most of the time things are fine. I was curious, however, how a E node can drop itself?! There may be some off-hours work being done in E our London data center (I'm located in NYC) as they are preparing for % relocation to another site in London.   , Please let me know if you require more info.   Thanks!    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:35 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? < Message-ID: <v8G0f.593$R62.476@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   H Vlems wrote:E > This kind of up/down pattern is what you got when heartbeat was not D > enabled on a transceiver when it was needed (or vice versa). SVA-0C > indicates a microVAX or VAXstation 3100 kind of system. It wasn't G > fitted with an external transceiver, was it? These older systems have   8 Yes. All my MicroVAX systems have external transceivers.  F > AUI and thinwire, no support for UTP; an external transceiver solvesI > that problem but the heartbeat switch (or SEQ or squelch) may be in the  > wrong position.  >  > Two other possibilities:F > - the system is on an ethernet segment with a *lot* of traffic (LAVc1 > clusters, lots of ethertalk or netbeui clients)   " It was off hours, so probably not.  I > - the system was accidentally converted from an endnode to a router and / > does not have the appropriate DECnet license.   D Licenses are okay. This is the first time I've ever seen a node that+ dropped itself! How can a node drop itself?    Thanks.  >  > Hans   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:38 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? ; Message-ID: <y8G0f.594$R62.52@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>    Chris Moore wrote:J > Is there a PhaseIV router on the network at all?  If everybody is an EndD > Node , adjacencies can get mucked up big-time, if they work at all  * Nope. NODE_F and NODE_X are routing nodes.  2 Also, most of the time everything is running fine.   >  > 1 > "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> wrote in message ? > news:1127938795.354636.197410@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... 
 > > Hello, > > = > > How can a node drop itself? See below. What does it mean?  > > < > > %%%%%%%%%%%  OPCOM  25-SEP-2005 19:12:12.76  %%%%%%%%%%%& > > Message from user DECNET on NODE_X% > > DECnet event 4.18, adjacency down 6 > > >From node 1.218 (NODE_X), 25-SEP-2005 19:12:12.72K > > Circuit SVA-0, Dropped by adjacent node, Adjacent node = 1.218 (NODE_X)  > > < > > %%%%%%%%%%%  OPCOM  25-SEP-2005 19:12:12.76  %%%%%%%%%%%& > > Message from user DECNET on NODE_X# > > DECnet event 4.15, adjacency up 6 > > >From node 1.218 (NODE_X), 25-SEP-2005 19:12:12.731 > > Circuit SVA-0, Adjacent node = 1.218 (NODE_X)  > >  [...]    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:39:16 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? < Message-ID: <89G0f.603$R62.342@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Colin Butcher wrote:L > Have you got a copy of that node's system disc restored to another box andE > inadvertently they're on the same network? If so then you'll have a    No.   L > duplicate MAC address (and DECnet Phase IV address). It's conceivable thatH > there are odd timing effects within your VLAN (or extended VLAN acrossL > multiple sites) that have somehow allowed them both to come up at the same > time.   B It works fine most of the time. I was mostly interested in what itF means for a node to drop itself (as that doesn't make any sense to me)! and why a node would be rejected.    Thanks for your help.    >  > -- >  > Hope this helps, Colin. + > colin DOT butcher AT xdelta DOT co DOT uk G > It's not mine, but I like this definition: Legacy = stuff that works.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:39:22 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? ; Message-ID: <e9G0f.605$R62.76@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   
 AEF wrote: > Hoff Hoffman wrote: n > > In article <1128004369.768012.272660@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> writes: > > :Hoff Hoffman wrote:q > > :> In article <1127938795.354636.197410@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> writes:  [...] J > > :>   What versions of DECnet and OpenVMS (and ECOs) are involved here? > > :  > > :NODE_F: VMS 6.1 > > :NODE_X: VMS 6.2 > > :NODE_Y: VMS 6.1 > > = > >   Old, obviously.  No hope of upgrades or ECOs, I assume.  > H > Well, yes and no. I am planning to upgrade the 6.1 systems to 6.2, butH > I want to assemble a fully patched system disk and test our app on it.E > The existing 6.2 systems are running with zero or very few patches. B > When they were set up I was told to not put patches on them. TheG > problem with upgrades is that I have 34 systems on line. That's a lot ) > of work! And most of them are overseas.   3 Sorry to reply to myself, but I must clear this up:   @ The current VMS 6.2 nodes (no or few ECO's!) are all running theD applications "update node" software, which is very small compared toE the "market node" software. (These update nodes are "satellite nodes" B as far as the app is concerned. The front end software connects toG these update nodes.) We tested it and it works fine. But to upgrade the C market nodes (all of which are currently running VMS 6.1) I want to F create a fully-patched system disk. I have not yet finished this task.E Once I finish it, I will try to run the app on it and see if anything E breaks. I think it will be fine, actually, but I know the app doesn't 5 run on VMS 5.5-2, for example. So there could be some E yet-to-be-discovered dependencies, but I think the app uses something = that VMS 5.5-2 doesn't have. Anyway, I want to test it first.    [...]    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:39:19 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? < Message-ID: <b9G0f.604$R62.312@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Hoff Hoffman wrote: l > In article <1128004369.768012.272660@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> writes: > :Hoff Hoffman wrote:o > :> In article <1127938795.354636.197410@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> writes:  > ..2 > :>   What is connected onto the SVA-0 port here? > : > > :Other MicroVAX 3100's, mostly model 80's, but 3 model 95's. > ? >   You're using the integrated NIC on the MicroVAX 3100, then. = >   (There are various pieces of hardware that use the DECnet  >   SVA interface.)  > B >   As for the question, I was refering to the controller hardwareD >   and the hardware immediately hanging off the controller, as wellA >   as any bridges, switches, hubs, repeaters or terminators that  >   might be in use here.   F We have a 10 Base - T transceiver (IEEE 802.3) attached to the networkF port on the back of the MicroVAX. Some of them have redundancy. That'sE here in NYC. I assume it's pretty much the same in London (I've never C been there and no one is there right now to help me answer any such  questions.)   E The cable in the transceiver goes to a Cisco switch. This is true for  both NYC and London systems.  D I hope this answers your questions. Sorry, but this is my weak area.  F > :>   Is this box an end-node, a level one router, or an area router? > :  > :NODE_X is a router  > = >   Is there more than one circuit connection on these hosts? ? >   (On a MicroVAX 3100 series box, that would be comparatively 1 >   unusual -- but there are ways to achieve it.)   D Multiple physical circuits? Only with the redundancy transceivers inA which case there are there two cables going to separate switches.    $ NCP SHOW KNOWN CIRC     9 Known Circuit Volatile Summary as of 29-SEP-2005 18:44:41   A    Circuit          State                   Loopback     Adjacent D                                               Name      Routing Node  C   DNIP-0-0          on                                1.aaa (XXXX5) D   SVA-0             on                                1.bbb (NODE_F)D   SVA-0                                               1.ccc (xxxxx7)D   SVA-0                                               1.ddd (xxxxx8)    D Node 1.aaa is in NYC. The others are all in London on the same VLAN.  ! > :These are on a VLAN in London.  > F >   So there is some comparatively unusual hardware within the network4 >   here -- these systems are not locally connected.  B They are probably all connected to the same pair of Cisco switchesD (assuming they have the redundancy transceivers). I login in to them= via telnet from NYC. All of the affected nodes are in London.   I > :We have 2 DNIP tunnels, one from NYC to London and another from NYC to < > :Hong Kong. NODE_X is one end of the NYC to London tunnel. > D >   So there could easily be a problem within the connection between >   the hosts.  C The DNIP tunnels are needed *only* for DECnet connectivity from one F city to another (overseas, actually -- the cities are NYC, London, andD Hong Kong). All the affected systems are in London and in no way use8 DNIP to send and receive DECnet packets from each other.   > E >   Are the VLAN devices (bridges or routers, I assume) reporting any  >   connectivity errors?  0 I'm waiting to hear back from the network group.  D But suppose there were connectivity errors. Could that have caused aE node to drop itself? What does it mean for a node to drop itself? And 4 why would a node reject another (garbled password?)?   > A > :>   Does this box have more than one network connection to the 3 > :>   same or to the same bridged network segment?  > D >   I'll repeat: does this box have more than one network connection? >   to the same or to the same bridged network segment?  DECnet D >   Phase IV does not like that, and will generate errors -- usuallyC >   IVADDR invalid media address errors IIRC, but things can and do / >   get strange when the node can "see" itself.   B I don't think so. The only case of more than one is the redundancyC transceivers. NOTE: This system works fine the vast majority of the A time. I was mostly interested in what it means for a node to drop ? itself. How can a node drop itself? And the same for rejection.    > H > :>   What versions of DECnet and OpenVMS (and ECOs) are involved here? > :  > :NODE_F: VMS 6.1 > :NODE_X: VMS 6.2 > :NODE_Y: VMS 6.1 > ; >   Old, obviously.  No hope of upgrades or ECOs, I assume.   F Well, yes and no. I am planning to upgrade the 6.1 systems to 6.2, butF I want to assemble a fully patched system disk and test our app on it.C The existing 6.2 systems are running with zero or very few patches. @ When they were set up I was told to not put patches on them. TheE problem with upgrades is that I have 34 systems on line. That's a lot ' of work! And most of them are overseas.    > F > ::>   Network cabling problems (cable shorts, too little or too muchG > ::>   termination on ThinWire or thick wire, etc) and controller (and G > ::>   the transceiver, for those NICs that use one) hardware problems + > ::>   can cause DECnet circuits to yo-yo.  > :: > ::I > ::Well, most of the time things are fine. I was curious, however, how a I > ::node can drop itself?! There may be some off-hours work being done in I > ::our London data center (I'm located in NYC) as they are preparing for ) > ::relocation to another site in London.  > E >   When the network connection becomes unstable due to faults within D >   the cabling, the VLAN (in this case), or a hardware problem, the$ >   host can and will report errors. > C >   Messing about within a network can most certainly trigger these E >   errors -- this is why I have been asking about connectivity here.     ! So it could be a bad transceiver?   - Thanks again for your help and your patience.    Bonus question:   F I was asked if I could have 2 NIC cards on the MicroVAX. This would be? in case we decide to chuck the tape drives (well, save them for D restores) and do backups via NetBackup over the network. They want aB primary network connected and the backup network connected to eachE MicroVAX that needs to be backed up. But we might try it even if it's B not possible, as the backups are relatively small (compared to our other non-VAX systems).   
 Thanks again.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:39:35 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? < Message-ID: <r9G0f.609$R62.434@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   H Vlems wrote:3 > "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> schreef in bericht ? > news:1128004522.682818.200010@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...  > >  > > H Vlems wrote:I > > > This kind of up/down pattern is what you got when heartbeat was not H > > > enabled on a transceiver when it was needed (or vice versa). SVA-0G > > > indicates a microVAX or VAXstation 3100 kind of system. It wasn't K > > > fitted with an external transceiver, was it? These older systems have  > > < > > Yes. All my MicroVAX systems have external transceivers. > > J > > > AUI and thinwire, no support for UTP; an external transceiver solvesM > > > that problem but the heartbeat switch (or SEQ or squelch) may be in the  > > > wrong position.  > > >  > > > Two other possibilities:J > > > - the system is on an ethernet segment with a *lot* of traffic (LAVc5 > > > clusters, lots of ethertalk or netbeui clients)  > > & > > It was off hours, so probably not. > > M > > > - the system was accidentally converted from an endnode to a router and 3 > > > does not have the appropriate DECnet license.  > > H > > Licenses are okay. This is the first time I've ever seen a node that/ > > dropped itself! How can a node drop itself?  > > > Well, the most common is a license mismatch, like it or not.J > Why don't you post the output of this command, executed on the node that > drops - > itself and one of the others that are fine:  >  > $ MC NCP SHO EXEC CHAR  D All are working "fine" 99% of the time. We are now entering a periodG where problems are cropping up, so I don't see what licenses have to do E with it. I tried the above command on a few nodes and it always comes C out the same except some say non-routing and some say routing. I'll  post a few tomorrow.   > M > You did mention that your systems have external transceivers. I assume that  > you've checked the8 > heartbeat switch and found it in the correct position.   What heartbeat switch?  N > Second assumption: these UTP transceivers run in one mode only: 10 Mb/s half	 > duplex. K > What kind of network device do they connect to and is that network device  > configured for > 10 Mb/s hd operation?   D They connect to a Cisco Switch. 10Mb/s? I'll have to check tomorrow.  4 If it is set to autonegotiate then you might want to > override that. >    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:39:39 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? < Message-ID: <v9G0f.610$R62.524@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Colin Butcher wrote:M > When you talk of "redundancy transceivers" - what make are they? How do the   < I'll check tomorrow. I'm at home and can't look at them now.  K > transceivers make a decision to flip over which path they talk over - and K > back again? How are the switches the transceivers connect to connected to   
 I don't know.    > the rest of the network?  % They are plugged into Cisco switches.    > Are they interconnected?  E There are two jacks on one side of the transceiver. A cable from each @ of these two jacks goes to a jack on each of two Cisco switches.   Do they have any special( > attributes to handle the path changes?   I'm not aware of any.     Have you made any changes to theI > DECnet timers etc. to accommodate the lower layer doing path switching?   C No. AFAICT we are running with default DECnet values except for the 6 maximum no. of links which we set to 256 on all nodes.    What L > else has changed in the network that may have introduced additional delays/ > and latency to that path switch-over process?   D London is preparing for a move to a new data center. We haven't been/ kept totally up to date on what they are doing.   N > Chipcom Online used to make such transceivers which work in conjunction withN > a special central pair of repeaters (usually star-wired  to the transceivers > and inter-linked). > M > You've read the DECnet Phase IV functional specifications to help determine 2 > exactly what the errors you're seeing relate to?  6 Nope. I'm not an expert on the network side of things.  G Please keep in mind that these systems are currently working fine. This E was only a problem for about 1 minute on a recent Sunday evening (see B original post, times are UTC (GMT)). There are no end users on the system then.  D Mostly I just wanted to know what it means that a node drops itself.E How can it do that? What does it mean independent of the structure of G my network? In particular, could it mean that the transceiver itself is E going bad? If that's a possiblity, I need to replace it -- especially F since this node (NODE_X) is one end of the DNIP tunnel to our New York City VAX systems.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:40:32 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? < Message-ID: <kaG0f.624$R62.438@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   H Vlems wrote:3 > "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> schreef in bericht ? > news:1128004522.682818.200010@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...  > >  > > H Vlems wrote:I > > > This kind of up/down pattern is what you got when heartbeat was not H > > > enabled on a transceiver when it was needed (or vice versa). SVA-0G > > > indicates a microVAX or VAXstation 3100 kind of system. It wasn't K > > > fitted with an external transceiver, was it? These older systems have  > > < > > Yes. All my MicroVAX systems have external transceivers. > > J > > > AUI and thinwire, no support for UTP; an external transceiver solvesM > > > that problem but the heartbeat switch (or SEQ or squelch) may be in the  > > > wrong position.  > > >  > > > Two other possibilities:J > > > - the system is on an ethernet segment with a *lot* of traffic (LAVc5 > > > clusters, lots of ethertalk or netbeui clients)  > > & > > It was off hours, so probably not. > > M > > > - the system was accidentally converted from an endnode to a router and 3 > > > does not have the appropriate DECnet license.  > > H > > Licenses are okay. This is the first time I've ever seen a node that/ > > dropped itself! How can a node drop itself?  > > > Well, the most common is a license mismatch, like it or not.J > Why don't you post the output of this command, executed on the node that > drops - > itself and one of the others that are fine:  >  > $ MC NCP SHO EXEC CHAR     >From the bad node:   8 Node Volatile Characteristics as of 30-SEP-2005 19:02:24   Executor node = 1.xxx (NODE_X)  6 Identification           = DECnet for OpenVMS VAX V6.1! Management version       = V4.0.0  Incoming timer           = 45  Outgoing timer           = 60 " Incoming Proxy           = Enabled" Outgoing Proxy           = Enabled! NSP version              = V4.1.0  Maximum links            = 256 Delay factor             = 80  Delay weight             = 5 Inactivity timer         = 60  Retransmit factor        = 10 ! Routing version          = V2.0.0 % Type                     = routing IV  Routing timer            = 600 Broadcast routing timer  = 180 Maximum address          = 1023  Maximum circuits         = 16  Maximum cost             = 1022  Maximum hops             = 30  Maximum visits           = 63  Maximum area             = 63  Max broadcast nonrouters = 64  Max broadcast routers    = 32  Maximum path splits      = 1 Area maximum cost        = 1022  Area maximum hops        = 30  Maximum buffers          = 100 Buffer size              = 576! Nonprivileged user id    = DECNET 0 Default access           = incoming and outgoing Pipeline quota           = 4032  Alias maximum links      = 32 ! Path split policy        = Normal  Maximum Declared Objects = 31      >From a good node:   $ NCP SHOW EXEC CHAR    8 Node Volatile Characteristics as of 30-SEP-2005 19:03:21   Executor node = 1.XXX (XXXXX)   6 Identification           = DECnet for OpenVMS VAX V6.1! Management version       = V4.0.0  Incoming timer           = 45  Outgoing timer           = 60 " Incoming Proxy           = Enabled" Outgoing Proxy           = Enabled! NSP version              = V4.1.0  Maximum links            = 256 Delay factor             = 80  Delay weight             = 5 Inactivity timer         = 60  Retransmit factor        = 10 ! Routing version          = V2.0.0 % Type                     = routing IV  Routing timer            = 600 Broadcast routing timer  = 180 Maximum address          = 1023  Maximum circuits         = 16  Maximum cost             = 1022  Maximum hops             = 30  Maximum visits           = 63  Maximum area             = 63  Max broadcast nonrouters = 64  Max broadcast routers    = 32  Maximum path splits      = 1 Area maximum cost        = 1022  Area maximum hops        = 30  Maximum buffers          = 100 Buffer size              = 576! Nonprivileged user id    = DECNET 0 Default access           = incoming and outgoing Pipeline quota           = 4032  Alias maximum links      = 32 ! Path split policy        = Normal  Maximum Declared Objects = 31      No difference.   > M > You did mention that your systems have external transceivers. I assume that  > you've checked the8 > heartbeat switch and found it in the correct position.N > Second assumption: these UTP transceivers run in one mode only: 10 Mb/s half	 > duplex. K > What kind of network device do they connect to and is that network device  > configured forL > 10 Mb/s hd operation? If it is set to autonegotiate then you might want to > override that.  
 10 Mb/s hd   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:40:36 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? ; Message-ID: <oaG0f.625$R62.84@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   
 AEF wrote: > Colin Butcher wrote:O > > When you talk of "redundancy transceivers" - what make are they? How do the  > > > I'll check tomorrow. I'm at home and can't look at them now.    # OK. Here in NYC we have two brands:   ( CenterCOM 210T twisted pair transceivers   and   ( Madge LE 46T transceiver with redundancy    E It's probably the same in London. They guy I need to talk to there is ; on vacation, and I will soon be on vacation. So stay tuned.     M > > transceivers make a decision to flip over which path they talk over - and M > > back again? How are the switches the transceivers connect to connected to  >  > I don't know.  >  > > the rest of the network? > ' > They are plugged into Cisco switches.   F Oops. Wrong answer. I don't know. We have lots of systems in each dataA center. In London, where the problem is, there are Windows, Unix, D Linux, Stratus, and VMS boxes all connected to the network. The full@ answer to this question would be pretty involved and perhaps not appropriate for public posting.      [...]    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 22:09:07 GMT * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com> Subject: Re: Drawlib not loaded 3 Message-ID: <74D0f.13854$ar7.3079@news.cpqcorp.net>   C "Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER" <peter@langstoeger.at> wrote in message & news:4342c637$1@news.langstoeger.at...= > In article <qtx0f.13773$m97.2373@news.cpqcorp.net>, "FredK" $ <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com> writes:L > >"Christoph Gartmann" <gartmann@non.immunbio.mpg.de.sens> wrote in message& > >news:dhtv53$e94$1@news.BelWue.DE...E > >> >Just so you are not suprised later.  The Open3D layered product 1 > >> >won't install on V8.* and is being retired.  > >>2 > >> Should it then be removed before the upgrade? > >  > >Yes.  > G > Will you supply a removal procedure (as it is a VMSINSTALlable kit) ?  >   I I will add it as a work item.  In general, there are two types of issues.  One K is more severe - some 3D graphics cards (especially on antique Turbochannel I systems) were *only* supported via Open3D - and will simply stop working. E Some cards, such as the 4D20 (TGA2) were supported both for 2D in the C base kit, and 3D in the Open3D kit.  In this case, you will lose 3D  functionality,K but 2D will continue to work.  However, certain files need to be removed to , prevent the Open3D code from trying to work.  G The Open3D functionality was put into the base OS for the PS300/350 and + Radeon 7500 cards - which are not affected.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:33:32 GMT ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>= Subject: Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs < Message-ID: <M3G0f.506$R62.465@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  - David Turner, Island Computers US Corp wrote:  > Bill >  > I am English - not American   I Thank God for small favors:  we have far too many jingoistic ignoramuses   like you as it is.  J > But I have several members of Family in UK and in the US by marriage who" > died fighting Germany in France.  = As I already observed, the American GIs in that lot died not  G 'protecting' France (they were sent *long* after France had been taken  G and not as a result of that occupation but rather as a result of Japan  F bombing Pearl Harbor and then Germany declaring war on us) but during F the general effort to prevent Germany and its allies from taking over I the *rest* of the world (and/or to prevent the Russians from doing so if  E we didn't help take some of it back ourselves:  the Russians were of  4 course well on the way back West long before D-Day).   > Enough said.  9 Apparently not, since you're still laboring under severe   misapprehensions about history.   >   Granted Japan was a decider but remember those Liberty ships- > carrying all kinds of equipment to Britain.   C No "GI's lives were taken protecting France" on those ships either.    > Or did I just imagine that?   H No, you just imagined that it somehow supported your previous drivel in 
 this area.   - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:35:12 GMT ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>= Subject: Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs < Message-ID: <k5G0f.536$R62.129@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Michael Johnson, PE wrote: > Bill Todd wrote: >  >> Michael Johnson, PE wrote:  >> >> ... >>J >>> Personally, I prefer an economic system where hard work and ingenuity I >>> is rewarded and not one where mediocrity and stagnation are the norm.  >> >>I >> I guess that pretty much rules out the U.S. these days - but it would  G >> be nice to think that such an environment survives somewhere in the  	 >> world.  >  > E > I see it every day here in the USA and experience it personally. ;)   A You just keep living in that happy little imaginary bubble until  D something bursts it beyond your ability to ignore the fact, Michael.  / Hey, "Who knew the levies would break?", right?    - bill   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:36:39 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>= Subject: Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs < Message-ID: <H6G0f.559$R62.127@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Z wrote: > JF Mezei wrote: E > > No. Properly formulated Kyoto implementations will result in most G > > corporations actually saving money because they will be more energy  > > efficient. > D > If that were true, then we'd be seeing most corporations in the USL > voluntarily enforcing their own version of Kyoto as a cost-saving measure. >  > Has that happened?  F The problem with this argument is that companies don't always minimize? costs as best they can (except, apparently, by firing people!).   E I know an accountant whose company had an inexpensive, but very good, E tax software for its employees to use. The employees really liked it. @ Then they replaced it with much more expensive software that the' employees thought was worse. Go figure.   E Also, banks were originally very opposed to the gov't mandating a $50 F liability limit for credit card users who lost their credit cards. ButE it was this very limit that made people feel free to use credit cards ' resulting in a very lucrative industry!   . Does HP know what's best when it comes to VMS?  < Businesses buy SAP and stuff from CA. They also buy from MS!  ? I keep hearing in this newsgroup that VMS has the best TCO. Are ! companies flocking to HP for VMS?   B I've seen more than one landlord make what I thought were somewhatC less-than-optimal decisions about long-term costs. They always seem , obsessed with the up-front short-term costs.   [...]    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:36:59 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>= Subject: Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs ; Message-ID: <%6G0f.565$R62.30@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>    Z wrote: > AEF wrote:F > >>>No. Properly formulated Kyoto implementations will result in mostH > >>>corporations actually saving money because they will be more energy > >>>efficient.  > F > >>If that were true, then we'd be seeing most corporations in the USN > >>voluntarily enforcing their own version of Kyoto as a cost-saving measure. > >>Has that happened? > J > > The problem with this argument is that companies don't always minimizeC > > costs as best they can (except, apparently, by firing people!).  > I > Ok, I can believe that some, maybe even HALF of the companies out their C > are simply too ignorant or stupid to take advantage of this great I > cost-cutting measure ... so, have half of them taken advantage of this?   
 I don't know.    > J > No? How about 25? 20%? 15%? 10%?! How can so many companies be so stupid > and JF be so smart?!  E Well, if you haven't read it yet, check out my response to JF's post.    > F > What about the mega-companies that have integrated cost-cutting intoI > their basic, fundamental operating philosophy, like Wal*Mart? Gee, they 2 > missed this great opportunity, too, didn't they? > E > Or maybe the original claim is baloney. I think that's more likely.   F There are some that are very good at cutting waste. But many aren't. ID just meant to say that just because companies are don't do somethingG guarantees that that something would not be in their benefit. Still, on B further thought, it could well be that companies don't do all thisF emission reduction because it's not worth it to them. So I backtrack a little. OK.   > It seems to me that the best way to reduce CO2 emissions is toG institute a carbon tax. This way you don't waste billions of dollars to E get a very slight incremental improvement and you don't have to worry > about problems with shell game credits. If the results are notD satisfactory, you adjust the tax accordingly. You also don't have toC worry about stupidities like subsidies for hybrids that aren't very G efficient (and some aren't). Also, the revenues from the carbon tax can C either add to the general funds or be used for research into better F energy sources. This is a good use for market incentives, and price is an excellent incentive.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:37:14 GMT - From: "Doug Phillips" <dphill46@netscape.net> = Subject: Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs ; Message-ID: <e7G0f.569$R62.95@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   
 AEF wrote: > JF Mezei wrote: H > > same as those of a truck (SUV). Once car manufacturers start to pushL > > fuel efficient cars through their marketing machines, americans will buyI > > what the marketing tells them to buy. And the USA will have instantly  > . > Such magic marketing only works for Windows. > K > > become far more fuel efficient since cars are such an important part of   > > fuel consumption in the USA. > >   = Cars are a necessity in most of the US because there is *not* F sufficient public transporation. Anyone who has spent much time seeingF this country understands why that is. Europeans who have never been to@ the US, or who've only been to major-metro areas, probably don't understand.   G > > In fact, americans would save money by buying smaller cars (cost of F > > purchase) as well as much lower fuel expenses for the smaller cars' > > compared to Hummers and other SUVs.  >  > Duh. >   E People buy what they need if they can afford it. If you live where it C snows a lot in winter; you have kids to haul around; you own a home E that always has something that needs repair (and what home doesn't?), F then a 4WD Carry-All (aka SUV) is a very practicle vehicle to own. YouA pay for the extra cost of fuel by cutting back on something else.   F Or, If you can afford the insurance, you could have a 4WD mini-van for@ Mom, a smaller fuel-efficient car for Dad to drive to work and a. pick-up truck for doing your homeowner chores.  F BTW, seeing a Hummer on the road is still a rare sight in the places IE drive. I keep reading "Hummers and other SUV's" like there's a Hummer E at every intersection. Maybe where you live, but I only see a few and A not too often. I definitely see more Toyota and Ford hybrids than A Hummers. Whenever someone builds a fuel efficient vehicle that is > reasonably priced and does the job people need, people buy it.  K > > In terms of Co2 trading: consider a large country. You have a polluting A > > power plant in one area and you have pristine areas where the " > > electricity is being consumed. > > K > > The pristine area generate far less CO2 than the target, so it can sell K > > its CO2 credits to the power plant which essentially averages the total K > > output. The revenus the community gets from selling its CO2 credits are K > > used to compensate for the higher electricity rates for since the power D > > company has to bill customers for the CO2 credits it has to buy. > E > This is why I favor a simple carbon tax. This avoids the shell-game E > shenanigans while minimizing the wasting of effort (money). You let G > everyone pollute as much as they want, but they have to pay a tax per E > unit of carbon emitted. Then, efficient plants pay little or no tax D > whilst inefficient plants have incentive to clean up. It works outG > great! Each company calculates the amount of pollution they emit that F > minimizes the costs. If the results are not satisfactory, you adjust
 > the tax. >   = The carbon tax is maybe a good idea. It would need to be done F zero-based on each individual plant rather than on a minimum allowable= average for the provider, and that might have trouble getting  legislated.    > [...]  > > G > > Consider what happens to the USA economy when the rest of the world G > > decides not to trade with countries that do not sign Kyoto.  Russia  > % > This looks like Doomsday FUD to me.     D Looks just plain silly to me. How likely is it that "the rest of the& world" would ever agree on *anything*?  L > > ratified pretty quickly when it was told it needed to do so if it wanted > > to export to Europe. > > > And when Russia reneges on its promise, what will Europe do?  E Indeed. Wait, is Europe united again? I haven't read tomorrow's paper  yet:-))    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 02:29:24 GMT % From: "Barry" <barryg@highstream.net> = Subject: Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs ; Message-ID: <8UG0f.650$R62.59@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   % <mark_hpq@yahoo.com> wrote in message 6 news:A5G0f.538$R62.230@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp... >  > Lurker wrote:  > = > > Vaxes? Alpha? Tru64? VMS? Are you seriously claiming that 9 > > HP was at the origin of those brilliant technologies?  >  > * > Of course don't you known that HP is the" > result of the buyout or merge of > + > HP + APollo + Digital + Tandem + Compaq ?  >  > I wonder who is serious here >  > J I think anyone who has owned HP, is aware of this.  They are also aware of the spinoff of A.    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 18:18:02 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)  Subject: Re: GCC ?4 Message-ID: <uHz0f.13803$Sg7.13569@news.cpqcorp.net>  M In article <4342BC47.236E55A5@mist.com>, GreyCloud <cumulus@mist.com> writes:  :Hoff Hoffman wrote: :>  Z :> In article <slrndk4mnm.ngn.i_left@winnie.sbor.net>, i_left@rambler.ru (I. Left) writes:7 :> :Where can one find the GNU C compiler for ia64 VMS?  :>  G :>   You might get a generic Itanium gcc to work or it might serve as a & :>   jumping-off point for new work... : U :http://gcc.gnu.org/onlinedocs/gcc-4.0.2/gcc/IA_002d64-Options.html#IA_002d64-Options  : % :Is this one relevant to your search?   A   That certainly appears to be the cited generic gcc for Itanium.   H   You might well get this to work with OpenVMS, or not -- I don't know.   G   As stated, there were changes to the IA-64 calling standard, and I do E   not know if the compiler reflects these, nor if you can get the gcc B   elf objects to build using the OpenVMS linker and related tools.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Oct 2005 12:44:37 -0500 B From: clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP (Simon Clubley) Subject: Re: GCC ?3 Message-ID: <TPUvY+dvyYyJ@eisner.encompasserve.org>   M In article <4342BC47.236E55A5@mist.com>, GreyCloud <cumulus@mist.com> writes:  > V > http://gcc.gnu.org/onlinedocs/gcc-4.0.2/gcc/IA_002d64-Options.html#IA_002d64-Options > & > Is this one relevant to your search?  J And your next job is to get this working on _VMS_ using publicly available kits.    Good luck. :-)   Simon.   --  B Simon Clubley, clubley@remove_me.eisner.decus.org-Earth.UFP       7 Microsoft: The Standard Oil Company of the 21st century    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 00:05:15 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com B Subject: Re: Getting Management attention for operations integrity- Message-ID: <87y859xo78.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   ( Paul Sture <paul.sture@decus.ch> writes:   > Larry Kilgallen wrote:   > <snip>  A >>    passwords from being displayed when entered; (iii) enforces = >>    password minimum and maximum lifetime restrictions; and  >                ^^^^^^^  @ > I have never understood the logic of minimum password lifetime/ > restrictions, so am surprised to see it here.   ! > Can anyone enlighten me please?   B On industry standard BDS, when you hit max age, you have to changeE your password.  The happy luzers took about 3 usec to figure out that = a second change back to the old favorite `fixed' the problem.   F For more fun, ask why the max limit exists, and consider what failures and factors are independant.   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:37 GMT * From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)4 Subject: Re: How to make a DLT firmware update tape?< Message-ID: <N4G0f.526$R62.513@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>  = > > ALP $ copy ALP$DKA0:[SMS.DLT]V151D4_1_4K.IMG _ALP$MKB400: F > > %COPY-E-READERR, error reading ALP$DKA0:[SMS.DLT]V151D4_1_4K.IMG;1< > > -RMS-W-RTB, 4096 byte record too large for user's bufferO > > %COPY-W-NOTCMPLT, ALP$DKA0:[SMS.DLT]V151D4_1_4K.IMG;1 not completely copied   * > Puzzling. Just tried this here (V7.2-2): > 4 > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ copy nla0: test.dat/alloc=20480H > %COPY-S-COPIED, NLA0: copied to DKA0:[DDACHTERA]TEST.DAT;2 (0 records)* > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ set file/end test.dat> > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ set file/attr=(rfm=fix,lrl=4096) test.dat( > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ copy test.dat nla0:K > %COPY-S-COPIED, DKA0:[DDACHTERA]TEST.DAT;2 copied to NLA0: (2560 records)  > DJAS01::DDACHTERA$   > 
 > Dunno...  !    More accurate would have been:   % alp $ copy nla0: test.dat /alloc=1152 K alp $ set file /attr = (ebk: 1153, rat: none, rfm: fix, lrl: 4096) test.dat   = so that DIRE /FULL looks the same, which all works here, too.    alp $ copy /log test.dat nla0:J %COPY-S-COPIED, ALP$DKA0:[SMS.DLT]TEST.DAT;1 copied to NLA0: (144 records)  G    Of course, using the actual file instead of this all-zero file still  fails.  H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Oct 2005 11:54:38 -0700  From: mark_hpq@yahoo.com4 Subject: HP : Massive strike and protest march todayB Message-ID: <1128452078.055248.99630@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   Photos and articles :    http://cftchp.blogspot.com/   ? http://www.cnn.com/2005/BUSINESS/10/04/france.strike/index.html    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 13:21:52 -0600  From: Dan Notov <d9nn0@hp.com>8 Subject: Re: HP : Massive strike and protest march today, Message-ID: <4342d650$1@usenet01.boi.hp.com>   mark_hpq@yahoo.com wrote:  > Photos and articles :  >  > http://cftchp.blogspot.com/  > A > http://www.cnn.com/2005/BUSINESS/10/04/france.strike/index.html  > B My wife visited France in 2000. Most of the museums in Paris were  shuttered due to a strike.  I We visited France in 2001, travelling to Monaco via Paris & Nice. Due to  G a wildcat strike at CDG, our luggage did not make it to Nice until the  	 next day.    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Oct 2005 19:32:34 GMT ( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)8 Subject: Re: HP : Massive strike and protest march today+ Message-ID: <3qg3mhFeqhn9U1@individual.net>   , In article <4342d650$1@usenet01.boi.hp.com>,! 	Dan Notov <d9nn0@hp.com> writes:  > mark_hpq@yahoo.com wrote:  >> Photos and articles : >>   >> http://cftchp.blogspot.com/ >>  B >> http://www.cnn.com/2005/BUSINESS/10/04/france.strike/index.html >>  D > My wife visited France in 2000. Most of the museums in Paris were  > shuttered due to a strike. > K > We visited France in 2001, travelling to Monaco via Paris & Nice. Due to  I > a wildcat strike at CDG, our luggage did not make it to Nice until the   > next day.   J The wonders of socialism.  If you don't have something, don't work for it, just whine louder.   bill      --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 18:48:01 -0400) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> 8 Subject: Re: HP : Massive strike and protest march today8 Message-ID: <nED0f.2136$R4.282439@news20.bellglobal.com>  6 "Bill Gunshannon" <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote in message % news:3qg3mhFeqhn9U1@individual.net...  >>K >> We visited France in 2001, travelling to Monaco via Paris & Nice. Due to I >> a wildcat strike at CDG, our luggage did not make it to Nice until the  >> next day. > L > The wonders of socialism.  If you don't have something, don't work for it, > just whine louder. > M That's your extremist view but others may see it this way: "if employees are  J being screwed over by CEOs and/or politicians you stick together to cover # each other's asses". God bless 'em.   
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,  Ontario, Canada.8 http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 21:03:22 -04009 From: "Skippy" <paynoattentionto@themanbehindthe.curtain> 8 Subject: Re: HP : Massive strike and protest march today8 Message-ID: <vDF0f.2290$R4.301338@news20.bellglobal.com>  4 "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> wrote in message2 news:nED0f.2136$R4.282439@news20.bellglobal.com...7 > "Bill Gunshannon" <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote in message ' > news:3qg3mhFeqhn9U1@individual.net...  > >>J > >> We visited France in 2001, travelling to Monaco via Paris & Nice. Due toK > >> a wildcat strike at CDG, our luggage did not make it to Nice until the  > >> next day. > > J > > The wonders of socialism.  If you don't have something, don't work for it,  > > just whine louder. > > J > That's your extremist view but others may see it this way: "if employees are K > being screwed over by CEOs and/or politicians you stick together to cover % > each other's asses". God bless 'em.  >  > Neil Rieck > Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,  > Ontario, Canada.: > http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html >  >    Well said Neil !  H Sometimes you just have to say "I'm as mad as hell, and I'm not going to1 take this anymore" (Howard Beale - Network, 1976)    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 21:29:17 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 8 Subject: Re: HP : Massive strike and protest march today, Message-ID: <43432C6B.A7DF605D@teksavvy.com>   Bill Gunshannon wrote:L > The wonders of socialism.  If you don't have something, don't work for it, > just whine louder.    D The wonders of democracy and citizens getting involved to tell their= politcians what is wrong and needs to be fixed to serve THEM.   N Remember that politicians are there to serve people, not the other way around.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:33 GMT & From: Elliott Roper <nospam@yrl.co.uk>8 Subject: Re: HP : Massive strike and protest march today< Message-ID: <J4G0f.525$R62.277@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  ; In article <3qg3mhFeqhn9U1@individual.net>, Bill Gunshannon  <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote:   . > In article <4342d650$1@usenet01.boi.hp.com>,# >  Dan Notov <d9nn0@hp.com> writes:  > > mark_hpq@yahoo.com wrote:  > >> Photos and articles : > >>    > >> http://cftchp.blogspot.com/ > >>  D > >> http://www.cnn.com/2005/BUSINESS/10/04/france.strike/index.html > >>  F > > My wife visited France in 2000. Most of the museums in Paris were  > > shuttered due to a strike. > > M > > We visited France in 2001, travelling to Monaco via Paris & Nice. Due to  K > > a wildcat strike at CDG, our luggage did not make it to Nice until the  
 > > next day.  > L > The wonders of socialism.  If you don't have something, don't work for it, > just whine louder.  A I just got back from a quick holiday in France. Everything worked C properly, the whole place was clean, the people great fun, the food > terrific and cheap, the wine even more so. If that's caused by socialist whining, bring it on.    --  1 To de-mung my e-mail address:- fsnospam$elliott$$ C PGP Fingerprint: 1A96 3CF7 637F 896B C810  E199 7E5C A9E4 8E59 E248    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:39:12 GMT  From: mark_hpq@yahoo.com Subject: HP : Moving forward< Message-ID: <49G0f.602$R62.139@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   HP : Moving forward   > The world's economic, social and environmental problems are soE extensive that challenges will undoubtedly remain for the foreseeable E future. HP's objective is to continually increase our positive impact G through our global citizenship work, while responding to changing needs @ and seeking areas where our investment is most effective. We are? focused on three challenges for the coming three to five years: D addressing electronic waste, raising standards in HP's global supply@ chain and increasing access to information technology. These areE critical issues facing our industry, and we are committed to making a E positive contribution. Although we are pleased with progress to date,  much remains to be done.  3 Please send comments to hp.globalcitizenship@hp.com    Complete document : K http://www.hp.com/hpinfo/globalcitizenship/gcreport/pdf/gcr_abridged_05.pdf    ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 19:01:37 -0400) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> 2 Subject: Re: HP may diminish the number of layoffs8 Message-ID: <7RD0f.2141$R4.284951@news20.bellglobal.com>  D "Adam Russell" <adamrussell@sbcglobal.net.invalid> wrote in message % news:3pb4e0F9h9tiU1@individual.net...  > ( > <mark_hpq@yahoo.com> wrote in message ? > news:1127237752.114318.203400@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com... B >> According to the Mayor of grenoble who met HP's vice-presidents >> in California.  > J > Makes sense that if you have an agreement to lighten up on the taxes in K > order to get jobs that there may be some leverage to not lay people off.  J > Maybe they threatened to collect on past taxes not paid due to backroom 
 > handshakes. M I'm not up on all the stuff going on in Europe, but I do know that a year or  M so back the French Government convinced big business to adopt a 32 hour work  I week but employees would still get 40 hours of pay. Also, the government  K expected those businesses to hire more people to cover the now vacant time  H slots. In order to do this fairly the government did make corporate tax K concessions. (From the point of view of the government, it made more sense  J to keep a bigger chunk of the population employed which means more income  taxes)  J Germany has had a national 4-day work-week for years now but I don't know ? whether there were corporate tax concessions made to enable it.   I I guess I don't need to mention that 60 hour work weeks were the norm 80  	 years ago   
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,  Ontario, Canada.9 http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html     ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:35:31 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>Q Subject: Re: HP will have to give back 1.25 M EUR help that it got to createjobs. < Message-ID: <D5G0f.539$R62.528@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Dave Froble wrote: > David J Dachtera wrote:  > F > > So, by that logic, all the increased security measures we see as aE > > result of 9/11 are unneeded because that event was a case of "the & > > exception doesn't prove the rule". > >  > > Yes? No? > >  > B > 'All' the 'security measures' are a kneejerk reflexive action byL > politicians who want to be see as 'doing something'.  And what did we get? > 2 > Curtailing of freedom on an unprecedented scale. >  > National identity 'papers'.  > G > Fucking cowards who will choose security over freedom.  A slap in the G > face to all those in the past that valued freedom enough to fight and B > die for it.  All so the cowards could squander their sacrifices. > H > It's been quoted many times, but the quantity in no way diminishes theJ > validity of Ben Franklin's statement, "those who would sacriface freedom  > for security deserve neither".     That's not quite right. From. <http://news.com.com/2010-1028-5150325.html> :  F Ben Franklin once said: "Those who would give up essential liberty forF temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Since the eventsD of Sept. 11 Americans have squandered an enormous amount of liberty,6 and we didn't even get any temporary safety in return.  = Those extra qualifiers "essential" and "temporary" make a big ( difference to this oft-misquoted saying.   [...]    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:35:38 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>Q Subject: Re: HP will have to give back 1.25 M EUR help that it got to createjobs. < Message-ID: <K5G0f.541$R62.493@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   JF Mezei wrote:  > AEF wrote:J > > Ben Franklin once said: "Those who would give up essential liberty forJ > > temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety." Since the eventsH > > of Sept. 11 Americans have squandered an enormous amount of liberty,: > > and we didn't even get any temporary safety in return.    B There you go again with your selective quotes! I did not write theD above. I QUOTED it from cnet -- the mention of which you omitted. MyC post was primarily to show how so many people misquote Ben Franklin B (which I am REALLY tired of). I should have snipped off the second	 sentence.   E Again, those words "essential" and "temporary" often get dropped from D Ben Franklin's quote above and that makes a big change in its scope. OK?    [...]    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:22:48 GMT  From: mark_hpq@yahoo.com" Subject: HP's strategy explained :< Message-ID: <IVF0f.349$R62.321@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  R http://www.marketwatch.com/tools/quotes/insiders.asp?symb=hpq&sid=2385&siteid=mktw   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:33:51 GMT L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing)& Subject: Re: HP's strategy explained :< Message-ID: <34G0f.512$R62.429@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  V In article <3q25muFcs3ilU2@individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:: >In article <YtJ_e.7026$cq2.778690@news20.bellglobal.com>,- >	"Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> writes:  >>  6 >> "Dan O'Reilly" <dano@process.com> wrote in message > >> news:6.1.2.0.2.20050928180257.07caca08@raptor.psccos.com..., >>> At 05:10 PM 9/28/2005, Neil Rieck wrote: >> [...snip...]  >>> O >>> I remember in the late 80's: the Japanese were going to own America.  They  M >>> made everything cheaper, they had all the money, they *gasp* were buying  H >>> American real estate and American companies.  Where is the Japanese ? >>> economy today?  Pretty much still in the tank.  As are the  I >>> heavily-socialized and government-subsidized economies of France and  M >>> Germany (and to a lesser extent, the UK).  Where's the US economy?  Near  F >>> record growth.  Near record unemployment.  With a better-educated  >>> workforce than ever before.  >>>  >>   >> ##### >>  L >> While the value of the yen has dropped by a factor of 4 from the 80's to M >> now, they have a very high standard of living (which is probably the only  N >> economic indicator that human beings should pay any attention to) and they @ >> have no where near the unemployment figures seen in the USA.  >  >Excuse me?? > 6 >              2005             2004              20036 >US            4.9%             5.4%              6.4%6 >JAPAN         4.5%             4.7%              5.3% > H >Difference seems rather insignificant, especially considering they haveI >half the population the US has and virtually no immigration (immigration I >playing a role in this as it tends to be the un-educated, un-trained and  >un-skilled who emigrate).  L Last I looked, the vast majority of low-skill (and often illegal) immigrantsH came in for off-the-books work, often below minimum wage.  The illegals L probably aren't showing up in unemployment figures, and if they were, they'd be showing up as employed.   -- Alan        >  >  >bill  >  >-- K >Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolves E >bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner.  >University of Scranton   | B >Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>      ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:03 GMT L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing)& Subject: Re: HP's strategy explained :< Message-ID: <f4G0f.516$R62.316@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  T In article <3q5hknFdadjnU1@individual.net>, Paul Sture <paul.sture@decus.ch> writes:- >Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote:  >>   >>  O >> Last I looked, the vast majority of low-skill (and often illegal) immigrants K >> came in for off-the-books work, often below minimum wage.  The illegals  O >> probably aren't showing up in unemployment figures, and if they were, they'd  >> be showing up as employed.  >>  H >But surely there will be a reflection in the unemployment figures from < >those who would have otherwise done that work on-the-books.  J I don't really think so, at that low end.  Sweatshop owners, etc, probablyI wouldn't be hiring illegals if they could get legal workers at the rates  A they're willing to pay - or they'd be hiring fewer legals.  (You  1 have to pay legal workers at least minimum wage.)    -- Alan    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:36:26 GMT  From: mark_hpq@yahoo.com& Subject: Re: HP's strategy explained :< Message-ID: <u6G0f.555$R62.255@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Larry Kilgallen wrote:  0 > Once again, please do not post unadorned URLs. > K > I looked at that page and there was just some statistics, no explanation.  > H > If you think the statistics (in many different areas) prove something,H > by all means post your belief in the newsgroup, rather than making allG > of us waste our time looking at your URL because of your false belief 1 > that we will see the statistics the way you do.   * Well these statistics seems pretty clear :  R http://www.marketwatch.com/tools/quotes/insiders.asp?symb=hpq&sid=2385&siteid=mktw     04/01/2005 MARK V HURD2 Chief Executive Officer 400,000 HPQ Award of Stock <---------------------- **** *** Undefined Type ***         06/16/2005 LAWRENCE T BABBIO$ Director 94,875 HPQ Open Market Sale proceeds of $2,272,256.25    06/16/2005 LAWRENCE T BABBIO- Director 94,875 HPQ Exercise of Stock Options  at cost of $1,452,536.25   06/16/2005 LAWRENCE T BABBIO, Director 94,875 HPQ Proposed Sale (Form 144)# estimated proceeds of $2,267,512.50    06/14/2005 RICHARD TODD BRADLEY " Officer 100,000 HPQ Award of Stock *** Undefined Type ***  $ 05/19/2005 KOMISAR DUNN FAMILY TRUST+ Trustee 18,750 HPQ Proposed Sale (Form 144) ! estimated proceeds of $422,062.50    05/18/2005 MICHAEL ENGLANDER. Shareholder 8,000 HPQ Proposed Sale (Form 144)! estimated proceeds of $180,400.00    03/17/2005 ANN M LIVERMORE" Officer 150,000 HPQ Award of Stock *** Undefined Type ***   03/17/2005 SHANE V ROBISON" Officer 150,000 HPQ Award of Stock *** Undefined Type ***   03/17/2005 VYOMESH JOSHI" Officer 150,000 HPQ Award of Stock *** Undefined Type ***   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:37:33 GMT  From: mark_hpq@yahoo.com& Subject: Re: HP's strategy explained :< Message-ID: <x7G0f.575$R62.263@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  B You can't claim to be an ethical company, make profits, distribute millions to some executives C in salary and stocks, buy your own stocks (7 millions $) and at the 	 same time  lay off your employees.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:37:37 GMT  From: mark_hpq@yahoo.com& Subject: Re: HP's strategy explained :< Message-ID: <B7G0f.576$R62.479@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  A >If HP has employees that are surplus to what it needs to conduct @ >business, there should not be an external requirement to retain >them.  E Do you really think that all the engineering people recently fired in  the US were a surplus ?  E Don't you think that a company like HP which includes Tandem, Digital @  deserves a CEO with a higher vision than just buying its stocks and outsourcing ?    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:37:49 GMT  From: mark_hpq@yahoo.com& Subject: Re: HP's strategy explained :; Message-ID: <N7G0f.580$R62.97@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>    Dan O'Reilly wrote:  > why?   Left to you as an exercise.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:37:54 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>& Subject: Re: HP's strategy explained :< Message-ID: <S7G0f.581$R62.206@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Dan O'Reilly wrote:  > why?    G What would it take to make it unethical? Would they have to shoot their  surplus employees in the head?     > 2 > At 01:54 PM 9/28/2005, mark_hpq@yahoo.com wrote:E > >You can't claim to be an ethical company, make profits, distribute  > >millions to some executivesF > >in salary and stocks, buy your own stocks (7 millions $) and at the > >same time > >lay off your employees. >  > ------L > +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+L > | Dan O'Reilly                  |  "There are 10 types of people in this |L > | Principal Engineer            |   world: those who understand binary   |L > | Process Software              |   and those who don't."                |L > | http://www.process.com        |                                        |L > +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:37:57 GMT - From: "Doug Phillips" <dphill46@netscape.net> & Subject: Re: HP's strategy explained :< Message-ID: <V7G0f.582$R62.477@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  
 AEF wrote: > Dan O'Reilly wrote:  > > why? >  > I > What would it take to make it unethical? Would they have to shoot their   > surplus employees in the head? >  >   D I think if they did that they would really be shooting themselves in	 the foot!    :-)))   ================================   > > 4 > > At 01:54 PM 9/28/2005, mark_hpq@yahoo.com wrote:G > > >You can't claim to be an ethical company, make profits, distribute   > > >millions to some executivesH > > >in salary and stocks, buy your own stocks (7 millions $) and at the > > >same time > > >lay off your employees. > > 
 > > ------N > > +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+N > > | Dan O'Reilly                  |  "There are 10 types of people in this |N > > | Principal Engineer            |   world: those who understand binary   |N > > | Process Software              |   and those who don't."                |N > > | http://www.process.com        |                                        |N > > +-------------------------------+----------------------------------------+   ------------------------------  * Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 22:06:22 -0500 (CDT)* From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) Subject: INFO-VAX gone berserk? 2 Message-ID: <05100422062249_20200278@antinode.org>  E    I just got about a hundred old postings, including a few "Rejected G posting to INFO-VAX@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU" messages related to duplicates of G my own postings.  If this continues, someone might wish to take a look.   H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode.org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 03:21:52 GMT * From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) Subject: INFO-VAX gone berserk? < Message-ID: <kFH0f.661$R62.420@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  E    I just got about a hundred old postings, including a few "Rejected G posting to INFO-VAX@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU" messages related to duplicates of G my own postings.  If this continues, someone might wish to take a look.   H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode.org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:41:44 GMT , From: "Richard Tomkins" <tomkinsr@istop.com>' Subject: Re: Install a Printer on VMS Q < Message-ID: <sbG0f.643$R62.437@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  C Actually I find that protection of knowledge thing to be offensive.   , We all generally share our knowledge openly.  I The thing is, your question quickly exposed your lack of familiarity with  the actual process.   L Because you asked the question, the way you did, you set off the Alarm bellsI that said someone with light knowledge was going to change the system and J they should first have the sanction of their management to do this, on the- understanding that the activity was going on.   A Most OpenVMS systems in active use today are in high availability L situations, banks, traders, process control, telephony and the like. MessingK up something could mean a real bad situation for more than just the system.     ) "John" <john@yahoooo.co> wrote in message * news:c%30f.16569$R5.1169@news.indigo.ie...L > David, thanks for your considered reply. Don't have to defer to managementG > because I am Management. Thats one thing about IT people they like to G > protect knowledge, seemingly I presume in case they are then the ones  chosenK > by "management" for downsizing, I guess protectionism is still bouyont in  > Information Technology > A > "David J Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> wrote in message ' > news:4340A2EC.252177D8@comcast.net...  > > John wrote:  > >>I > >> How can I install a printer using VMS on an Alpha server. I have the J > >> following code which I notepaded from the last time one was installed and K > >> have changed the relevany name of printer and its IP address to what I 
 > >> want.L > >> Name of Printer = OKI , IP Address = 10.1.1.250. Which is a Dot Matrix. > >>L > >> If I carry out the instructions below will it work or will I cock up myI > >> whole server?? Do I have to add a Print Queue etc .I'm not in IT but  want > >> to J > >> learn something which should be learanable. I can get to the $ prompt etc  > >> > > 	 > > John,  > > B > > No offense, but if you're not in IT, I'd have to defer to yourL > > management to give you the privileges that would be required by what youB > > want to do. In many shops, it would not be security compliant. > > H > > That said, the examples in the on-line documentation may be helpful. > > Start from here: > > $ > > http://www.hp.com/go/openvms/doc > >  > > --   > > David J Dachtera > > dba DJE Systems  > > http://www.djesys.com/ > > - > > Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: & > > http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/ > > , > > Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page:# > > http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/  > > & > > Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page:# > > http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/  > >  > > Coming soon:* > > Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page >  >       O ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- S http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups K ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:37:17 GMT & From: "Mister Q" <pquodling@gmail.com> Subject: Re: Jump to console ?< Message-ID: <h7G0f.570$R62.255@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  D This typically means that your SRM Firmware has been corrupted.  you7 will need to reload it, probably from failsafe mode...     Peter Q    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:36:16 GMT - From: "Doug Phillips" <dphill46@netscape.net>  Subject: Re: Kea and VMS< Message-ID: <k6G0f.552$R62.263@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   contracer11@gmail.com wrote: > Jack Peacock wrote: C > > "David J Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> wrote in message ) > > news:433352D7.9DF9CA99@comcast.net... " > > > contracer11@gmail.com wrote: > > >>K > > >> I'm using Kea for VAX emulator to access our VAX/VMS system. Can you E > > >> tell me how ( in a procedure) can I get default background and L > > >> foreground color ? I need create a procedure to get default FG and BG > > >> KEA's color.  > > > L > > > Not quite sure what you're up to there since screen colors in terminalH > > > programs tend to be a matter of personal preference, due mostly to& > > > biological and ergonomic issues. > > > M > > I assume the original poster is looking for an ESC sequence to return the M > > current color settings.  I just checked the KEA VT420 (v5.10) ESC strings G > > for Terminal Reports, doesn't appear to be one that retrieves color P > > settings.  Since the VT420 didn't support color I wouldn't expect a terminalG > > reports for it.   Was there a VT240/340 terminal reports string for  > > retrieving colors? > >   Jack Peacock >  > C > Exactly, I need KEA sequence to get current color settings, but I  > didn't > find it in KEA manuals...  > Thanks to all...    B IIRC, the "colors" in KEA!420 are assigned locally to various ANSI@ attributes, i.e. text & background for bold, reverse, underline, reverse-bold, blink, etc.   E It's been awhile since I've used KEA, but I never found an escape-seq + query that returned this color information.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:14 GMT  From: maher_rj@hotmail.com0 Subject: Match-Maker wanted - Oz positions on go< Message-ID: <a8G0f.587$R62.234@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Hi,   G If you remember me then please help, if you don't then please help also  :-)   G There are (at least) two VMS positions going in Australia at the moment  -   @ 1) VMS Pascal/Real-time/ foreign exchange Possibly Melbourne NAB  @ 2) Pascal/VMS Senior software engineer in gaming industry Shared+ Memory/Gaming industry/Central CBD (Sydney)   A I don't know Pascal (but how hard can it be) and I do know 64-bit  shared memory on VMS.   4 Who are these VMS clients screaming out for support?  2 If we are on the same team then please play cupid.   Regards Richard Maher    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:45 GMT ) From: "Joe Sewell" <ultrajoe@spamcop.net>  Subject: Multiple X servers?< Message-ID: <F8G0f.596$R62.198@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  D My site recently got in several dual-head Alpha workstations runningF OpenVMS, DECwindows/Motif 1.3-1.  (Our software is currently not ratedD for VMS V8.2 & DW/M 1.5.)  I've got one set up for multiple screens,E but what I'd like to do is have multiple *displays* (i.e., multiple X ? servers), so if I happen to set a breakpoint in the routine for D bringing up a popup menu (for example), I can regain control withoutD going to another machine & killing the process.  The machines have a single keyboard & mouse.  C Is this even possible?  What's the "right" way to set this up?  I'm % assuming Xinerama wouldn't help here.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:56 GMT # From: sol gongola <sol@adldata.com>   Subject: Re: Multiple X servers?; Message-ID: <Q8G0f.599$R62.10@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>    Joe Sewell wrote: F > My site recently got in several dual-head Alpha workstations runningH > OpenVMS, DECwindows/Motif 1.3-1.  (Our software is currently not ratedF > for VMS V8.2 & DW/M 1.5.)  I've got one set up for multiple screens,G > but what I'd like to do is have multiple *displays* (i.e., multiple X A > servers), so if I happen to set a breakpoint in the routine for F > bringing up a popup menu (for example), I can regain control withoutF > going to another machine & killing the process.  The machines have a > single keyboard & mouse. > E > Is this even possible?  What's the "right" way to set this up?  I'm ' > assuming Xinerama wouldn't help here.  >    As I understand it: ? Even with only a single display, you can have multiple sessions = so that if one session hangs, you should be able to switch to B another session on the same display to accomplish what you intend.   VMS help gives you:    $help set display /screen    SET   
    DISPLAY        /SCREEN               /SCREEN=screen-number  H         Defines the screen to be associated with this display device. InG         some hardware configurations, the system supports more than one F         screen. In such a configuration, you can specify the screen to*         which the application is directed.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:39:26 GMT ) From: "Joe Sewell" <ultrajoe@spamcop.net>   Subject: Re: Multiple X servers?< Message-ID: <i9G0f.606$R62.575@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   sol gongola wrote: > Joe Sewell wrote: H > > My site recently got in several dual-head Alpha workstations runningJ > > OpenVMS, DECwindows/Motif 1.3-1.  (Our software is currently not ratedH > > for VMS V8.2 & DW/M 1.5.)  I've got one set up for multiple screens,I > > but what I'd like to do is have multiple *displays* (i.e., multiple X C > > servers), so if I happen to set a breakpoint in the routine for H > > bringing up a popup menu (for example), I can regain control withoutH > > going to another machine & killing the process.  The machines have a > > single keyboard & mouse. > > G > > Is this even possible?  What's the "right" way to set this up?  I'm ) > > assuming Xinerama wouldn't help here.  > >  >  > As I understand it: A > Even with only a single display, you can have multiple sessions ? > so that if one session hangs, you should be able to switch to D > another session on the same display to accomplish what you intend. >  > VMS help gives you:  >  > $help set display /screen  >  > SET  >  >    DISPLAY >  >      /SCREEN > " >            /SCREEN=screen-number > J >         Defines the screen to be associated with this display device. InI >         some hardware configurations, the system supports more than one H >         screen. In such a configuration, you can specify the screen to, >         which the application is directed.  B What you're saying is correct, but it misses my point.  Sorry if IE wasn't clear.  I'm not talking about a "session" (whatever that means E -- I'm assuming you mean a program with one or more windows) hanging. A I'm talking about a client grabbing the X server and the debugger - hitting a breakpoint before it gets released.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:39:29 GMT % From: nojunk@gate.cpmet.ufpel.tche.br   Subject: Re: Multiple X servers?< Message-ID: <l9G0f.607$R62.471@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  - Xnest can provide the functionality you want.    --- Casantos   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:39:50 GMT  From: stuie_norris@yahoo.com.au   Subject: Re: Multiple X servers?< Message-ID: <G9G0f.613$R62.379@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  
 Hi Joe Sewell   B What is the model number of the 5-port belkin PCI USB card you areC using on your DS10?  Do any of the other single or dual port boards  work?   A What devices do they appear as under VMS and what version are you  using?   I am using a DS10L.      Thanks   Stuart   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:40:59 GMT % From: nojunk@gate.cpmet.ufpel.tche.br   Subject: Re: Multiple X servers?< Message-ID: <LaG0f.632$R62.573@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  B Xnest allows you to run "virtual" X servers as clients of "true" X servers. ForE example, supposing your display is ":0", you can provide display ":1"  with       Xnest :1  @ After that you can start your application, redirecting it to the virtual X server:        my_program -display :1  G If you want to debug your program, set the DISPLAY environment variable B to ":1" before starting the debugger. With GUI-based debuger (like DDD), C however, it is better to pass "-display :1" a command-line argument  from inside the debugger.  G I hope you can use the examples above. I'm sorry but can't remember the D correct command-line syntax for OpenVMS. I used to know these things ten  years ago, but time goes by...  G If you don't have Xnest for OpenVMS you can try to compile it, but that  can B become a hard and tedious task. The source code is included in the X.Org & reference implementation, available at  B     ftp://ftp.x.org/pub/X11R6.8.2/src-single/X11R6.8.2-src.tar.bz2  : After extracting it, go to xc/programs/Xserver/hw/xnest/ .   --- Casantos   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:35:45 GMT  From: jordan@ccs4vms.comM Subject: Re: New SWB (Mozilla) browser version 1.7.11, spam filtering problem < Message-ID: <R5G0f.543$R62.340@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Vance Haemmerle wrote: > jordan@ccs4vms.com wrote: A > > http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/products/ips/cswb/cswb.html  > > B > > Alpha and I64.  Appears to be mostly security related updates. > >  > F >    I guess HP isn't contributing non-branded versions to mozilla.orgA > anymore.  The last was 1.7.  They've only had CSWB versions for  > 1.7.8 and 1.7.11.  >  > -- > Vance Haemmerle   D It also appears that 1.7-11 has done something to the spam filteringG code again; when I upgraded to Mozilla 1.7, spam filtering continued to G work but you could no longer train the filters, or change the status of < a message to/from junk.  That continued with V1.7-8, but wasF correctable by blowing away the training database and another file andG starting over with training.  Now that 1.7-11 is installed, the problem ? has returned.   Inbound messages are checked and marked against E existing training data, but I can't do anything spam related with the $ messages once they've been received.  G No time to do the file deletions and retrain so far, I hope that method F still works with this new version.  Files involved were TRAINING.DAT;*5 and PANACEA.DAT in the top level profile subdirectory E (DDCU:[USER._MOZILLA.DEFAULT.XYZYXYZ9_ZYX], profile directory changed  to protect the innocent).    Rich   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 23:04:30 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) ; Subject: Re: ODS-5 directory and header definitions, where? 3 Message-ID: <2UD0f.13862$Ds7.6855@news.cpqcorp.net>   N In article <87psqlxnla.fsf_-_@prep.synonet.com>, prep@prep.synonet.com writes: : I :Anyone know where the details of ODS-5 and version numbering is defined?  :I've not spotted it as yet.  I   The most literal answer is "in FI5DEF" and in related definition files. I   The salient difference between ODS-2 and ODS-5 structures -- as written I   out on the disk -- is FI2DEF vs FI5DEF, and a constant that is set to a "   different value over in the SCB.  G   If you are parsing filenames yourself, you can get yourself into some H   deep sneakers here -- it is very easy to get this stuff wrong, and theG   corner cases inside filename parsing can be truely weird.  (And there G   are some second-level bits of "fun", like processing embedded periods F   within an ODS-5 name, and the classic 5-characters-long vs the value-   ;32767 version lurking within the parsing.)   H   Some background on the particular problem(s) you seek to resolve here,	   please?   H   There are tools to look for big version numbers -- DFU has this -- andH   there are some tips for renaming files to lower version numbers in theG   FAQ.  Current OpenVMS versions also have the DIRECTORY/SELECT=VERSION G   command, too, and the command can list files with ranges of versions.    	--   C   For obvious reasons, I'd tend to discourage going directly at the C   ODS-2 or ODS-5 on-disk structures, and I'd tend to discourage any D   attempts to create your own filename-parsing routines.  (There are-   typically system routines for these tasks.)       N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 00:18:25 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com Y Subject: ODS-5 directory and header definitions, where? Was: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 w 0 Message-ID: <87psqlxnla.fsf_-_@prep.synonet.com>  H Anyone know where the details of ODS-5 and version numbering is defined? I've not spotted it as yet.    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 00:11:41 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com 5 Subject: Re: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs! - Message-ID: <87u0fxxnwi.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   ) "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> writes:   E > Granted, we planned this for 4-5 months, but in the end, the 2 4100 F > systems started coming down at 12:00 noon (interesting that this wasB > time they chose for the one hour - they viewed lunch time as theD > slowest time for them) and at 1:10 pm the systems were all back upD > again in production. There were a few misc application issues with5 > some logicals etc, but these were all fixed online.   > It is much nicer to discover it has dropped in the pot at 1:10= with everyone on deck than to be  dragged out of the local at  11:30 Friday night!    Steel works, rather than a FAB.    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:41:08 GMT  From: bob@instantwhip.com 1 Subject: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs! < Message-ID: <UaG0f.634$R62.139@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  ) http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=26614    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:41:53 GMT , From: "Richard Tomkins" <tomkinsr@istop.com>5 Subject: Re: OpenVMS & alpha still drive Intels fabs! ; Message-ID: <BbG0f.646$R62.31@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>     Maintenance is ongoing and live.  I Most process control systems are off the main network and the software is K not continuously undergoing patching for security or even for applications. 1 The entire complex runs in a fixed configuration.   K At Canada Post, the mail sorting machinery runs on MicroVAX II systems that G run VMS 5.2 from what I remember. They run at this fixed configuration, I sorting mail all the day and night. Systems do net get tuned, never have. I Parameters were set at install time for a specific performance window and . that is how they have been running ever since.  L I am aware of a VAX cluster in Sweden that ran for 8 years non-stop. It even4 got moved 25 kilometres without a complete shutdown.    5 "Bill Gunshannon" <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote in message % news:3qchnhFe1a6uU1@individual.net...  > In articleG <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB70C017@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>, + > "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> writes:  > >  > > G > > Interesting thing about fabs in general .. Since they are typically K > > 24x7x364 days a year, any downtime means that is production output lost 8 > > for the year - there is no time to "make up for it". > > ? > > I know of one well known telecom company that also had semi J > > manufacturing and used OpenVMS in their primary cluster. They measuredI > > downtime in the order of CAD $750K/hour since that is how much wafers K > > etc were lost in that one hour. And they were no where near the size of  > > Intel..  > > L > > Now imagine what these production types would say when there was monthlyI > > downtime to do security patches as is required by Windows/Linux - and J > > these folks definitely test everything before it goes into production,- > > so think about the added QA/test times ..  > F > When you know that is a requirement of your operation you include itG > in the planning and it doesn't result in any lost time or production. H > Pretty much every manufacturing system has scheduled downtime. NothingF > can be run indefinitely with no maintenance.  Other parts of the FABG > have to have scheduled maintenance and even with VMS in the back room J > the whole saystem would not be operational 24/7/365 with no maintenance. > 9 > Now, unscheduled downtime, thast is another thing.  :-)  >  > ! > Tell me, do IBM's FABs run VMS?  >  > bill >  > --  L > Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesF > bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. > University of Scranton   |@ > Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>      O ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- S http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups K ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----    ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:29:02 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> ) Subject: Re: OpenVMS Hobby Licence Issues 0 Message-ID: <11k6op585ejak59@corp.supernews.com>  ) John.Martin_At_Home@BTInternet.com wrote:  > Some basic advise please...  > H > I have a MicoVAX3100-40 running OpenVMS7.3. My licence came along with > my purchase of the Vax.    I'd keep the base license.  I > I want to add extra software TCP/IP, C etc. I have purchased my OpenVMS I > Hobby CD (v7.3) and joined UK HPUG and got my licence, in the form of a I > command file. I have not yet tried installing this command file over my & > current VMS, or a fresh VMS install. >  > Questions. > E > 1. My current licence is open ended time wise. The Hobbyist licence G > expires after 1 year, am I right in assuming you just request another I > licence and run the provided command file? Presumably VMS lets you into < > the system to do this even if the old licence has expired?  - As written above, use the perpetual licenses.   H > 2. Does the single hobby licence act as a licence for add on kits likeG > C? I have tried running VMSInstal to instal the C kit and it does not I > find a valid licence for it, no surprise I guess. It also fails because I > there are not some 5000 contiguous blocks available, do I need a SysGen I > change to cure the later? (My system disk is 2GB with only VMS and some  > 20MB of user files on it!) > I > 3. Can I just run the OpenVMS Licence command file to cure all ills and  > then install the addon kits? > I > I appreciate these questions probably pretty basic, so basic that noone F > seems to have bothered to leave answers lying around. Thanks for any > help.   B There are 2 hobby licenses, if I remember correctly.  The layered I products command file has all the licenses.  My preference is to cut and   paste just the licenses needed.    --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 18:16:47 GMT % From: Rick Jones <rick.jones2@hp.com> ? Subject: Re: OpenVMS on rx2600 (was Re: Time to produce EV79s!) 3 Message-ID: <jGz0f.13802$Ug7.5425@news.cpqcorp.net>   3 > Yes.  It has 1.3Ghz CPUs which would be Madisons.   C McKinley was 900 MHz and 1.0 GHz.  Madison was different - I cannot < recall how many frequencies there were/are of "Madison" CPUs  
 rick jones --  G oxymoron n, commuter in a gas-guzzling luxury SUV with an American flag F these opinions are mine, all mine; HP might not want them anyway... :)D feel free to post, OR email to rick.jones2 in hp.com but NOT BOTH...   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Oct 2005 20:19:46 -0200 6 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)? Subject: Re: OpenVMS on rx2600 (was Re: Time to produce EV79s!) , Message-ID: <4342e3e2$1@news.langstoeger.at>  [ In article <jGz0f.13802$Ug7.5425@news.cpqcorp.net>, Rick Jones <rick.jones2@hp.com> writes: 4 >> Yes.  It has 1.3Ghz CPUs which would be Madisons. > D >McKinley was 900 MHz and 1.0 GHz.  Madison was different - I cannot= >recall how many frequencies there were/are of "Madison" CPUs   H So, at 1.0GHz there are Madisons and McKinleys. How easy to remember ;-)D SPD lists 1.0, 1.1, 1.3, 1.4, 1.5 and 1.6Ghz (Madisons) as supported   --   Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialist  E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 18:50:05 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG? Subject: Re: OpenVMS on rx2600 (was Re: Time to produce EV79s!) 0 Message-ID: <00A4AC7B.5EF552B3@SendSpamHere.ORG>  e In article <4342e3e2$1@news.langstoeger.at>, peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER) writes: \ >In article <jGz0f.13802$Ug7.5425@news.cpqcorp.net>, Rick Jones <rick.jones2@hp.com> writes:5 >>> Yes.  It has 1.3Ghz CPUs which would be Madisons.  >>E >>McKinley was 900 MHz and 1.0 GHz.  Madison was different - I cannot > >>recall how many frequencies there were/are of "Madison" CPUs > I >So, at 1.0GHz there are Madisons and McKinleys. How easy to remember ;-) E >SPD lists 1.0, 1.1, 1.3, 1.4, 1.5 and 1.6Ghz (Madisons) as supported   E They could be a trillion GHz Madisons... as long as that brainfucked  D management console won't let you boot the beasts, it a useless $2000( boat anchor looping in the stupid shell.   --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 20:02:53 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) ? Subject: Re: OpenVMS on rx2600 (was Re: Time to produce EV79s!) 2 Message-ID: <NdB0f.13819$Zi7.866@news.cpqcorp.net>  S In article <00A4AC7B.5EF552B3@SendSpamHere.ORG>, VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG writes:   F :They could be a trillion GHz Madisons... as long as that brainfucked E :management console won't let you boot the beasts, it a useless $2000 ) :boat anchor looping in the stupid shell.   D   If you haven't yet gotten this matter sorted out, do please let meD   know via email -- I recall seeing something similar you had postedC   a couple of months back, but thought that had been resolved.  If  C   this is still open, I will obviously be looking for some firmware D   and software versions, and related materials on the configuration.  D   I'm connected into an rx2600 via the management console right now,D   and have been regularly rebooting the box as part of some on-going:   device driver development work.  It's booting right now.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 21:12:00 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 4 Subject: Re: OT : Is HP still socially responsible ?, Message-ID: <4343285E.943B833B@teksavvy.com>   mark_hpq@yahoo.com wrote:  > * > Seen in "La Tribune" of October 3 2005 :    A BBC reported the huge one day strike in France. They mentioned HP < specifically when discussing job cuts as an example of large corporations cutting jobs.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 19:31:00 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> Subject: Re: Pipe & MySQL + Message-ID: <43431EC4.9C9AED4D@comcast.net>    Bart Zorn wrote: > < > Inside a pipe segment SYS$PIPE is equivalent to SYS$INPUT,  
 Not always...   $ DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ pipe sho log/proc   (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)      "CDLD" = "LDA6:"   "DFU$NOSMG" = "X" ,   "DTR$STARTUP" = "USER$COM:DTR$STARTUP.COM"#   "EDTINI" = "SYS$LOGIN:EDTINI.EDT" "   "SYS$COMMAND" = "_DJAS01$NTY46:"   "SYS$DISK" [super] = "DKA0:"   "SYS$DISK" [exec] = "DKA0:"     "SYS$ERROR" = "_DJAS01$NTY46:"    "SYS$INPUT" = "_DJAS01$NTY46:")   "SYS$OUTPUT" [super] = "_DJAS01$NTY46:" (   "SYS$OUTPUT" [exec] = "_DJAS01$NTY46:"   "TESTFILTER" = ""23-002-1""    "TOOLS" = "USER$EXE:"    "TT" = "_NTY46:"&   "VAXLINK2" = "USER$EXE:ALPHALK2.EXE"  5 DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ pipe show time | show logical/proc    (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)      "CDLD" = "LDA6:"   "DFU$NOSMG" = "X" ,   "DTR$STARTUP" = "USER$COM:DTR$STARTUP.COM"#   "EDTINI" = "SYS$LOGIN:EDTINI.EDT" *   "SYS$COMMAND" [super] = "_DJAS01$NTY46:"(   "SYS$COMMAND" [exec] = "_DJAS01$MPA7:"   "SYS$DISK" [super] = "DKA0:"   "SYS$DISK" [exec] = "DKA0:"     "SYS$ERROR" = "_DJAS01$NTY46:"   "SYS$INPUT" = "_DJAS01$MPA7:" )   "SYS$OUTPUT" [super] = "_DJAS01$NTY46:" (   "SYS$OUTPUT" [exec] = "_DJAS01$NTY46:"   "SYS$PIPE" = "_DJAS01$MPA7:"   "TESTFILTER" = ""23-002-1""    "TOOLS" = "USER$EXE:"    "TT" = "_MPA7:" &   "VAXLINK2" = "USER$EXE:ALPHALK2.EXE"  ( DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ ty show_pipe_lnms.com  $ pipe show time | show log/proc $ exit& DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ @show_pipe_lnms.com   (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)      "CDLD" = "LDA6:"   "DFU$NOSMG" = "X" ,   "DTR$STARTUP" = "USER$COM:DTR$STARTUP.COM"#   "EDTINI" = "SYS$LOGIN:EDTINI.EDT" *   "SYS$COMMAND" [super] = "_DJAS01$NTY46:"(   "SYS$COMMAND" [exec] = "_DJAS01$MPA8:"   "SYS$DISK" [super] = "DKA0:"   "SYS$DISK" [exec] = "DKA0:"     "SYS$ERROR" = "_DJAS01$NTY46:"   "SYS$INPUT" = "_DJAS01$MPA8:" )   "SYS$OUTPUT" [super] = "_DJAS01$NTY46:" (   "SYS$OUTPUT" [exec] = "_DJAS01$NTY46:"   "SYS$PIPE" = "_DJAS01$MPA8:"   "TESTFILTER" = ""23-002-1""    "TOOLS" = "USER$EXE:"    "TT" = "_MPA8:" &   "VAXLINK2" = "USER$EXE:ALPHALK2.EXE" DJAS01::DDACHTERA$    
 > so the <E > SYS$PIPE is redundant, if not in error. Apperently, it IS an error.    ...in that case.  G In a DCL proc, SEARCHing SYS$INPUT in a PIPE can produce some, shall we  say, "interesting" results.    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 19:33:22 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> Subject: Re: Pipe & MySQL + Message-ID: <43431F51.82BA42DC@comcast.net>    issinoho wrote:  > E > "Jean-Franois Pironne" <jf.pieronne@laposte.net> wrote in message 3 > news:434222ee$0$17246$8fcfb975@news.wanadoo.fr...  > >  > >> Here's a challenge... > >>K > >> When loading a database schema into MySQL on platforms such as Linux & J > >> Windows, the usual format is to redirect a SQL text file to the MySQL > >> interpreter as follows, > >>1 > >>     mysql -u username -p database < file.sql  > >>M > >> at which point it challenges the user for their password, and if correct  > >> the SQL file is processed.  > >>N > >> I am trying to do this on VMS but with no luck. I've tried the following, > >>8 > >>     $ pipe mysql -u username -p database < file.sql > >>M > >> Both on the command line and in a DCL file with the password on the next 
 > >> line. > >>I > >> So far I've been defeated; the password challenge seems to throw the M > >> piping process. This is a really useful technique - can anyone help with 
 > >> this. > >> > >> Thanks. > >  > > N > > Sorry for this late reply, I was out of my office during the last 2 weeks. > >  > > " > > you can connect to mysql using" > > mysql -umyacc -pmypwd database > > or1 > > mysql --user=myacc --password==mypwd database  > > N > > If you need to execute a file within sql you can use the "source" command: > > mysql> source file.sql > >  > > Hope this can help you.  > > C > > You can also write a small Python or Perl script to do the job.  > >  > >  > >  > > JF > + > Thanks, Jean-Francois - that's nailed it.  > 8 > $ pipe mysql -uusername -ppassword database < file.sql >  > Thanks, all.  ? What's interesting here is this bit from my reply to Bart Zorn:   $ DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ pipe sho log/proc   (LNM$PROCESS_TABLE)      "CDLD" = "LDA6:"   "DFU$NOSMG" = "X" ,   "DTR$STARTUP" = "USER$COM:DTR$STARTUP.COM"#   "EDTINI" = "SYS$LOGIN:EDTINI.EDT" "   "SYS$COMMAND" = "_DJAS01$NTY46:"   "SYS$DISK" [super] = "DKA0:"   "SYS$DISK" [exec] = "DKA0:"     "SYS$ERROR" = "_DJAS01$NTY46:"    "SYS$INPUT" = "_DJAS01$NTY46:")   "SYS$OUTPUT" [super] = "_DJAS01$NTY46:" (   "SYS$OUTPUT" [exec] = "_DJAS01$NTY46:"   "TESTFILTER" = ""23-002-1""    "TOOLS" = "USER$EXE:"    "TT" = "_NTY46:"&   "VAXLINK2" = "USER$EXE:ALPHALK2.EXE"  D Notice the absence of SYS$PIPE. That's why the redirection is legal.   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Oct 2005 11:25:33 -0700  From: tomarsin2015@comcast.net, Subject: Problems downloading Apache from HPA Message-ID: <1128450333.019006.9960@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    Hello F I been trying for days to download the Apache 2.X from the HP website,G but keep getting an Internal Server Error. Is there another location to ) download the software or can I order a cd  from HP directly?? thanks phillip    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 22:12:54 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) 0 Subject: Re: Problems downloading Apache from HP3 Message-ID: <G7D0f.13855$gr7.9463@news.cpqcorp.net>   b In article <1128450333.019006.9960@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, tomarsin2015@comcast.net writes:  G :I been trying for days to download the Apache 2.X from the HP website, + :but keep getting an Internal Server Error.   D   Odd.  I forwarded this report along, and the OpenVMS webmaster hasC   tried the Apache download from various web browsers, and has seen *   no problems with the download operation.  E   I've tried a download with Mozilla/SWB 1.7.11 on OpenVMS Alpha just    now, and it worked.   A   Is there any additional text included with the "internal server    error" message?   .   Which web browser and which client platform?  B   Is it possible that there's a proxy server in the way somewhere?    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Oct 2005 15:42:44 -0700  From: tomarsin2015@comcast.net0 Subject: Re: Problems downloading Apache from HPB Message-ID: <1128465764.092159.58780@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>   Hello : I just tried it again at 16:38 on a Win2k system with IE 6 and get the same error   Internal Server Error D The server encountered an internal error or misconfiguration and was  unable to complete your request.G Please contact the server administrator, openvms-info@hp.com and inform E them of the time the error occurred, and anything you might have done  that may have caused the error.   F More information about this error may be available in the server error log.P --------------------------------------------------------------------------------2 Apache/1.3.26 Server at h71000.www7.hp.com Port 80  D There is no prox server and I have beable to download patches for my( Proliant servers and other software from9 the HP site with no problem. I even tried downloading the 5 software on another Win2k box and get the same error.    thanks for the help  phillip    ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 17:57:24 -0500( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com>0 Subject: Re: Problems downloading Apache from HPB Message-ID: <1128466668.e37eab2ff87af028bfb37bbdc1e14a9a@teranews>  ; On 10/04/2005 17:12:54 hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) wrote:   C > In article <1128450333.019006.9960@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, " > tomarsin2015@comcast.net writes:  I >> I been trying for days to download the Apache 2.X from the HP website, - >> but keep getting an Internal Server Error.   J > Odd.  I forwarded this report along, and the OpenVMS webmaster has triedI > the Apache download from various web browsers, and has seen no problems  > with the download operation.  J > I've tried a download with Mozilla/SWB 1.7.11 on OpenVMS Alpha just now, > and it worked.  H > Is there any additional text included with the "internal server error"
 > message?  . > Which web browser and which client platform?  B > Is it possible that there's a proxy server in the way somewhere?    N I downloaded apache recently as well, plus php and several other packages.  No problems encountered.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 17:34:53 -04009 From: "Skippy" <paynoattentionto@themanbehindthe.curtain> " Subject: Process accounting status8 Message-ID: <1AC0f.2102$R4.275565@news20.bellglobal.com>  G Have recently seen a couple of instances of Interactive processes being A terminated, and the resulting status message shown in ACCOUNT is:   #         %RMS-F-RER, file read error   F Would this indicate something like a line error, dropping the session?  F (VAX 7.1, Alpha 8.2, DECnet-IV and DECnet-Plus, UCX and TCPware, so no8 common denominator other than the users and the network)   Thanks   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 22:31:43 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) & Subject: Re: Process accounting status3 Message-ID: <jpD0f.13858$Wp7.8622@news.cpqcorp.net>   t In article <1AC0f.2102$R4.275565@news20.bellglobal.com>, "Skippy" <paynoattentionto@themanbehindthe.curtain> writes:H :Have recently seen a couple of instances of Interactive processes beingB :terminated, and the resulting status message shown in ACCOUNT is: : $ :        %RMS-F-RER, file read error : G :Would this indicate something like a line error, dropping the session?   6   It's typically an input file error -- a problem with:   a batch job, for instance -- or an input terminal error.  %   Any secondary error code with this?   6   Anything relevent over in the security auditing log?  8   If you have interactive sessions dropping, do consider6   enabling and using virtual terminals.  (General info5   on virtual terminals for OpenVMS and -- if required 6   -- some steps for enabling virtual terminals within 5   the TCP/IP Services IP stack -- are referenced over    in the OpenVMS FAQ.)    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 20:33:14 -04009 From: "Skippy" <paynoattentionto@themanbehindthe.curtain> & Subject: Re: Process accounting status8 Message-ID: <fbF0f.2284$R4.297365@news20.bellglobal.com>    Thanks for the response Stephen.  H Biggest concern is that it is INTERACTIVE sessions in each case, where II wouldn't expect a file read error to actually terminate the process.  Not K much else I can add, I'm afraid.  No matching AUDIT records as far as I can H see.  No device errors logged.  In this one case, I believe the user wasK coming in from a Reflection session on a laptop, possibly via Internet VPN. L If the Windoze box went into 'Hibernate' and the VPN client dropped (which IG know does happen), might this give this type of symptom?  (in the other H cases, I think it was a Reflection session to a (don't laugh) RSX system6 which had then SET HOSTed to a VAX - so it was an RTA)  D Here's the full ACCOUNT record (OpenVMS v8.2 - UCX v5.5) if it gives anything more:     INTERACTIVE Process Termination    -------------------------------   J Username:          *******           UIC:               [xxxxx,xxxxxxxxxx]  C Account:           USERS             Finish time:        3-OCT-2005  17:59:00.59   C Process ID:        26811A66          Start time:         3-OCT-2005  10:21:17.60   C Owner ID:                            Elapsed time:                0  07:37:42.99   C Terminal name:     TNA248:           Processor time:              0  00:00:14.24   9 Remote node addr:                    Priority:          4   @ Remote node name:                    Privilege <31-00>: FFFFFFFF  @ Remote ID:         TELNET_AC1A4679   Privilege <63-32>: FFFFFFFF  + Remote full name:  aaaaaa.bbbbbb.cccccc.ddd   G Posix UID:         -2                Posix GID:         -2 (%XFFFFFFFE)   @ Queue entry:                         Final status code: 0001C0F4   Queue name:   	 Job name:   . Final status text: %RMS-F-RER, file read error  B Page faults:             1362        Direct IO:              41826  B Page fault reads:         197        Buffered IO:            84371  B Peak working set:        4432        Volumes mounted:            0  B Peak page file:        199136        Images executed:           20            0 "Hoff Hoffman" <hoff@hp.nospam> wrote in message- news:jpD0f.13858$Wp7.8622@news.cpqcorp.net... C > In article <1AC0f.2102$R4.275565@news20.bellglobal.com>, "Skippy" 2 <paynoattentionto@themanbehindthe.curtain> writes:J > :Have recently seen a couple of instances of Interactive processes beingD > :terminated, and the resulting status message shown in ACCOUNT is: > : & > :        %RMS-F-RER, file read error > : I > :Would this indicate something like a line error, dropping the session?  > 8 >   It's typically an input file error -- a problem with< >   a batch job, for instance -- or an input terminal error. > ' >   Any secondary error code with this?  > 8 >   Anything relevent over in the security auditing log? > : >   If you have interactive sessions dropping, do consider8 >   enabling and using virtual terminals.  (General info7 >   on virtual terminals for OpenVMS and -- if required 7 >   -- some steps for enabling virtual terminals within 7 >   the TCP/IP Services IP stack -- are referenced over  >   in the OpenVMS FAQ.) >  > ( >  ---------------------------- #include' <rtfaq.h> ----------------------------- 4 >     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ --  www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq , >  --------------------------- pure personal# opinion --------------------------- G >         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com  >    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:35:01 GMT * From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)A Subject: Re: Question: ATX Powersupply For AlphaPC164 Motherboard < Message-ID: <95G0f.533$R62.351@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   From: jordan@ccs4vms.com  H >      most current ATX cases use soft power controls instead of the oldG > hard switches.  There's a pin on the large connector that needs to be G > grounded to power the supply up; I don't remember which one.  Even if I > the supply has a built in switch, the soft power has to be grounded for  > it to turn on.  F    The pin in question should be "PS_ON#", pin 14, green.  If you needG pictures, and if you can't do better elsewhere, I have a PDF file of an D "ATX / ATX12V Power Supply Design Guide" "Version 1.1",  "(Copyright6 2000 Intel Corporation)", which I could put somewhere.      If that _is_ the problem.  H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:40:46 GMT " From: nathanbloomfield@hotmail.com Subject: Re: Quotation marks< Message-ID: <yaG0f.628$R62.610@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  A Thankyou all for your replies, I will be testing these approaches 	 tomorrow.   B >What's the particular goal here -- getting quotes into the string; >translation of the logical name itself, or something else?   C Yes, I need to include the quotes in the translation of the logical G name.  The logical is being used in a Xentis report.  If the variable I A am passing is numerical then I do not need to include the quotes, C however if the variable is a string I need to include the quotation  marks in the logical.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:40:56 GMT " From: nathanbloomfield@hotmail.com Subject: Re: Quotation marks< Message-ID: <IaG0f.631$R62.283@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  C I've got it working using Albrecht's suggestion below.  Thankyou to D everyone for your assistance, I know I would have never figured thisF one out on my own.  I'm sure theres going to be situations where I can@ utilise each of the various approaches suggested in this thread.   Regards, Nathan  D >use one (") to delimit the string and two ("") to represent one (")A >within the string (and ''RFILTER' instead of 'RFILTER within the 	 >string):  >  >$ RFILTER = "23-002-1" ) >$ DEFINE/JOB TESTFILTER """''RFILTER'"""  >$ SHOW LOGICAL TESTFILTER2 >   "TESTFILTER" = ""23-002-1"" (LNM$JOB_8176F2C0)   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:02 GMT  From: sean@obanion.us ! Subject: Re: SC008/Star Couplers. ; Message-ID: <_7G0f.583$R62.12@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>    Keith,  & Are you sure you mean "piezoelectric"?  ; >From http://www.mse.cornell.edu/courses/engri111/piezo.htm   C "[A] permanently-polarized material such as quartz (SiO2) or barium B titanate (BaTiO3) will produce an electric field when the materialD changes dimensions as a result of an imposed mechanical force. These@ materials are piezoelectric, and this phenomenon is known as the piezoelectric effect.   ? Conversely, an applied electric field can cause a piezoelectric : material to change dimensions. This phenomenon is known as7 electrostriction, or the reverse piezoelectric effect."   9 I always thought of the coupler as a multi-coil inductor.      Sean   Keith Parris wrote:  > Leigh wrote: > > I want to add two K > > StorageWorks arrays with shelves and a few disks inside (very few). One J > > array has one a HSJ40 inside and the other has a HSJ40C. The connectorH > > for this appears like a D long D shape like a shrunken parallel portI > > with four "teeth". These look like miniture co-ax connectors although . > > I'd sort of assumed they were fibre based. > H > Nope. Coax. Transmit and receive pairs, and there are two CI ports perE > HSJ controller, for folks who want to connect the controller to two ( > separate star couplers for redundancy. > K > > Does the coupler have to have any special additional parts to work with ) > > the HSJ's or is just a special cable?  > J > There's a special cable which breaks out those D-style connectors into 4D > separate coaxial cables with connectors on the end. From those youC > typically run blue coax cables to the star coupler. Cables can be C > "thick" or "thin" (where "thin" is about the diameter of RG-58 or I > Ethernet thinwire cable, and the older "thick" cables are close to half C > an inch in diameter, IIRC, but can be up to 45 meters in length).  > H > > Does the Coupler attach an ID to the items or is it merely what's at > > the end of a port? > I > The Star Coupler is a piezoelectric RF transformer and acts merely as a E > hub (with attenuation to avoid overdriving the receiver). The ID is I > assigned with DIP switches at a VMS system's CI adapter, or via console % > commands at the HSJ controller end.  > I > > The coupler can have 8 "devices" attached. Do the HSJ's appear as one  > > or two devices each? > J > And Star Coupler panels can be connected together with modularity cablesJ > (using those connectors at the center of the panel) to make 16-port starK > couplers. But you need not care, as you don't need that many connections.  > I > A typical HSJ has two CI ports. It will appear as the number of devices H > you connect cables for -- one or two. If you connect both HSJ ports to: > the same Star Coupler, you must give them different IDs. > G > Note that HSJ controllers often come in dual-redundant pairs, sharing # > the same SCSI busses behind them.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:27 GMT 1 From: "Leigh" <LGBowden@bowdenfamily.fsnet.co.uk> ! Subject: Re: SC008/Star Couplers. < Message-ID: <n8G0f.591$R62.466@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  G This particular arrangement has one HSJ40 per array not dual configured @ although I can see a big slot underneath both where it would go.  B These HSJ's are a 40 and a 40C but they only appear to have one CID connector comprising four "pins". I've found the breakout cables youG speak of and they're marked up as A/B TX/RX which accounts for the four A pins/cables. I take it O-> and ->O are TX and RX respectively and - should be connected to the same on the SC008.   C Looking through some old docs I've found issues like the HSJ's have F MAX_NODES (8,16,32) and MAX_HOSTS (number of CIPCA/CIXCD) cards on theC cluster. Also the host cards should be low numbers and the HSJ high F numbers. As I'm sort of replacing them into a similar configuration soF I've assumed these will be the same and I intend putting them in theirG original 7 and 8 slots. Are there any HSJ docs showing teh full command  set so I can check this.  @ Does the VAX/CIXCD or the HSC90 have a similar process where theE numbers of nodes is defined manually or will it poll the star coupler  at start up?   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:33:38 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG Subject: see anybody you know?< Message-ID: <S3G0f.508$R62.340@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   http://www.ianhaig.net/web  ) Check out the "Men of the Internet, 2004"    --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:33:44 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG" Subject: Re: see anybody you know?< Message-ID: <Y3G0f.510$R62.216@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  c In article <jBohg51M$6O5@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes:  >Why no, as a matter of fact.  > V >In article <00A4A7BC.C93D9919@SendSpamHere.ORG>,   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG writes: >> http://www.ianhaig.net/web  > C >I get a JPEG image 60x39 pixels that seems to say "web" in cursive  >characters.  + OK... try the link to the actual picture...   % http://www.ianhaig.net/men/index.html    --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:33:47 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG" Subject: Re: see anybody you know?; Message-ID: <%3G0f.511$R62.58@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   ] In article <VXT_e.13455$o12.11333@news.cpqcorp.net>, John Reagan <john.reagan@hp.com> writes: ! >VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:  >> http://www.ianhaig.net/web  >>  , >> Check out the "Men of the Internet, 2004" >>   >  >Then go check out > , >http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/killerquiz/  E I've seen this before.  When your picture came up I wasn't quite sure @ if I could answer computer language creator or serial killer! :)   --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:37:43 GMT - From: "Doug Phillips" <dphill46@netscape.net> " Subject: Re: see anybody you know?; Message-ID: <H7G0f.578$R62.93@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   ! VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: e > In article <_N6dnWLaQsk5e6feRVn-3Q@comcast.com>, BRAD <bMradAhamPiltSon-at-coMmcAast.nPeSt> writes: # > >VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:  > >> http://www.ianhaig.net/web  > >>. > >> Check out the "Men of the Internet, 2004" > >> > > 8 > >Is that Hunter Goatley, top row, third from the left? >  > Yup... >  > ; > >I don't see you there (at least not a recent picture)...  >  > Not in any of those pictures!  > F > Albeit I may be a geek in real life, I wear my disguise of the meek,E > mild-mannered handsome me unbefitting a picture with that group. :)  >   F I couldn't find Al Gore's picture there either, but there's still some open space on page 8. ;-)   E A walk around the sites under the "Web Devolution" link might explain @ why such a high percentage of geeks wear eye-glasses! Youch! 8^0   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:08 GMT  From: goathunter@goatley.com" Subject: Re: see anybody you know?< Message-ID: <48G0f.585$R62.161@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   BRAD wrote: " > VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > > http://www.ianhaig.net/web > > - > > Check out the "Men of the Internet, 2004"  > >  > 7 > Is that Hunter Goatley, top row, third from the left?  > C That's funny.  For what it's worth, I wear smaller glasses now. ;-)    Hunter ------9 Hunter Goatley, Process Software, http://www.process.com/ 9 goathunter@goatley.com    http://wwww.goatley.com/hunter/    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 23:46:48 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com $ Subject: Re: SIMH and device access.- Message-ID: <877jctz3mf.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   * Alan Greig <greigaln@netscape.net> writes:   > prep@prep.synonet.com wrote:  D >> I have been using SIMH in anger to run RT-11, and wanted to writeE >> some 5 1/4 floppies. RX-33, no problem thinks I.... Well, it seems E >> that attaching a device rather than a file loses somewhere. Anyone $ >> any clues as to what it could be?  E > What OS are you running simh under? Attaching real devices has only @ > very limited supported under Linux (not supported at all underD > Windows or VMS as far as I know) Guessing it should be easy to addF > VMS support because all Linux does is open the device in block mode.  
 VMS on Alpha.   E > Also how about just writing the file to disk and then image copying  > that to the floppy?   C That should work. Seems to be a problem writing to block zero, plus & a pile of bugs in the RT-11 DU driver.   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:35:42 GMT / From: "Shahin Yaz" <Shahinyaz@blueyonder.co.uk> ! Subject: SWXCR RAID Configuration < Message-ID: <O5G0f.542$R62.355@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  D I have an Alpha 2100 with a SWXCR RAID controller, but have not beenB able to find any documentation on how to use the config utlity. IsF there any useful documentation / notes out there ? What is the process? for changing a failing disk ? Is it just a matter of physically D replacing it with a working one while the system is on-line ? and noF other soft steps ?  Is it possible to have a spare disk installed thatF the system will switch to automatically in the event of failure on one of the working set ?  ' Thanks in advance for any help on this.    Regards    Shahin   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:41:24 GMT % From: "issinoho" <issinoho@gmail.com>  Subject: TCPWare 5.7 & libpcap< Message-ID: <8bG0f.638$R62.233@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  G I notice the process website now has TCPWare 5.7-2 advertised. Any word 1 yet when this will become available to hobbyists?   G Also, HP TCP/IP 5.5 is now advertising libpcap API support, which makes A interacting with 3rd party tools more open. Any word from Process A whether either TCPWare or MultiNet will have (has?) this feature.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:36:04 GMT - From: "Doug Phillips" <dphill46@netscape.net> L Subject: Re: Tentative DCL suggestion: string return value from .COM (Hello,< Message-ID: <86G0f.549$R62.334@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   David J Dachtera wrote:  > Doug Phillips wrote: > >  > > David J Dachtera wrote:  > > > J > > > I'm still trying to figure out how get the value of both $STATUS and: > > > $STATUS_STRING without changing either value. Maybe: > > >  > > > $ set noon
 > > > $ @proc 1 > > > $ stats = "''$status'""''$status_string'"""  > > > E > > > ...to get them both at once, and then parse out he result using  > > > F$ELEMENT(). > > > . > > > Again, to me, seems the long way around. > > E > > I read the OP to mean that $status_string is only to be set by an H > > *explicit* $EXIT and, unlike $status, wouldn't change until the next# > > $EXIT. I can see uses for that.  > 6 > ...as can I; however, that creates an inconsistency,    F I see what you're saying. Still, once it's documented it would then be4 consistent (as so many here are quick to point out).   > and the value ofG > $STATUS_STRING would never be reliable: was it's current value set by I > the previous proc.? ... or did that that one bomb out and leave a value  > from a prior proc.?  >   E I guess you'd have to clear $STATUS_STRING prior to calling the proc, G and clear it after saving it's value --- just to be sure. Hmmmm. Sounds B like how I use logicals or global symbols now for this, so the new1 $EXIT parameter would only save one line of code.   C If, as someone else mentioned, the value would pass through a PIPE, : then that might make the implementation effort worthwhile.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:00 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG1 Subject: Re: Thought you would enjoy this posting < Message-ID: <c4G0f.515$R62.240@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  v In article <Sm0%e.7020$q1.4543@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net>, "William Hymen" <t18_pilot@hotmail.spam.com> writes:- >I found this posting on a Windoze newsgroup. 0 >(should I have just told him to switch to VMS?)  # You read Weendoze newsgroups?  Why?  --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:40:06 GMT , From: Alan <Usenet02_REMOVE@Flying-Disk.com>1 Subject: Re: Thought you would enjoy this posting ; Message-ID: <W9G0f.618$R62.29@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>    William Hymen wrote:  5 > Well, I work in Change Control for a huge bank, and , > we own every platform ever built. Our data > centers look like CompUSA!  6 Complete with all the dumb-as-a-brick employees?   :-)   Alan   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:40:53 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>1 Subject: Re: Thought you would enjoy this posting < Message-ID: <FaG0f.630$R62.524@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Z wrote: > William Hymen wrote:0 > > I found this posting on a Windoze newsgroup.3 > > (should I have just told him to switch to VMS?)  > 4 > No; he'll be screwed as soon as he gets to ;32767. > I > Most 3rd party apps for Unix/Windows system don't have that limitation.     A Well, Windows would probably blue screen long before reaching the  32767th version!  ; Having multiple versions of files is a mixed blessing, IMO.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 21:20:41 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! , Message-ID: <43432A67.8A63D3D5@teksavvy.com>   FredK wrote:F > OK.  If you want a cheap box with sound, we have many PC's with both" > Windows or Linux to choose from.     VMS had sound support on Alpha. 2 VMS doesn't have sound support on that IA64 thing.   Not an upwards compatible move.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:33:54 GMT L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing)# Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! ; Message-ID: <64G0f.513$R62.37@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   _ In article <1127997743.746414.315550@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>, bob@instantwhip.com writes:   G >Bill Gates and oracle are the ones trying to keep vms off the x86 boat ? >anchor because they know the day that happens, they are toast!   J Why does Larry Ellison care whether VMS runs on X86?  If VMS became big onJ x86 boxes, he'd happily sell Oracle (and Rdb) on those boxes, and be happy' not to have to compete with SQL/Server.   O Meantime, the day VMS is released on x86, with no Office or Office-equivalents, B is the day Microsoft doesn't even notice a blip in their earnings.  J (Coordinate an up-to-date VMS port of OpenOffice with the release and thenM VMS-on-PC begins to approach being the same kind of threat xBSD is to Windows N on the desktop - barely noticeable.  But without that, plus an easy-to-run andI up-to-date version on Samba, VMS-on-x86 is only interesting in the server  space.)    -- Alan    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:33:57 GMT L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing)# Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! < Message-ID: <94G0f.514$R62.469@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  \ In article <433C98A5.5F9A29F5@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:- >Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote: R >> Meantime, the day VMS is released on x86, with no Office or Office-equivalents,E >> is the day Microsoft doesn't even notice a blip in their earnings.  > F >Apple is also a just a tiny blip on Microsoft,s books, but it doesn't1 >prevent Apple from growing and being profitable.   K (Through amazing personal productivity software, and, incidentally, through 5 having a port of MS Office so they can interoperate.)    > G >It doesn't matter that VMS would be just a small blip. It matters that G >VMS on the 8086 would have far greater potential for sales/growth than J >on a sinking IA64 brick with no market momentum and terrible media image.  F I'm not arguing with _you_.  I'm arguing with Bob's insane claim that H Oracle and Microsoft pay off Digital/Compaq/HP execs not to port VMS to  x86.     -- Alan    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:06 GMT L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing)# Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! < Message-ID: <i4G0f.517$R62.360@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  _ In article <433DE1D2.76FDF0D@comcast.net>, David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> writes: - >Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote:  >>  _ >> In article <433C98A5.5F9A29F5@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes: 	 >> [snip]  >> >J >> >It doesn't matter that VMS would be just a small blip. It matters thatJ >> >VMS on the 8086 would have far greater potential for sales/growth thanM >> >on a sinking IA64 brick with no market momentum and terrible media image.  >>  H >> I'm not arguing with _you_.  I'm arguing with Bob's insane claim thatJ >> Oracle and Microsoft pay off Digital/Compaq/HP execs not to port VMS to >> x86.  > G >Perhaps "pay off" is the wrong term. To extend a metaphor from another H >thread, it may be more accurate to say that they decline to intimidate,D >impede or hinder those who staunchly refuse to port VMS to the most$ >ubiquitous processor on the planet.  K I think it's irrelevant to Bill and Larry.  Oracle gets its license fees on L whatever platform it runs on, and active-active VMS clustering may result inJ fewer licenses than having to have fully-licensed multiple backup systems.  O MS has little reason to care whether VMS runs on x86?  Their cash cow is in the ? desktop space, which gets their foot in the door for servers.     5 >There's certainly no logical business reason for it.   N On Digital/Compaq/HPs part, yeah.  But we shouldn't blame Oracle and Microsoft; for it.  (There's plenty of other stuff to blame them for.)    -- Alan    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:37:40 GMT  From: bob@instantwhip.com  Subject: Time to produce EV79s! < Message-ID: <E7G0f.577$R62.290@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  ? ok Sue and everyone else at HP ... after reading this, itaniums ? future doesn't look bright, and it is now time to make IBM live 7 up to its legal obligations and start making EV79s NOW!   > The chip improvement timeline looks like a disaster since they' removed the alpha team from itanium ...   ? Do it now or lose vms customers to IBM!  Why can't IBM have not > had NIH syndrome and bought vms for power????????  FOOLS!!!!!!    ) http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=26519    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:05 GMT  From: bob@instantwhip.com # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! < Message-ID: <18G0f.584$R62.490@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  / being your usual fool Bill, you forgot that our . good friend Robert Palmer offered both vms and/ alpha to everyone, but no takers ... I posted a / letter here in the spring or last year from IBM 1 that said IBM views vms as outdated and obsolete!   / now either IBM has NIH syndrome or they are the 2 dummest company on the planet ... which one is it?   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:21 GMT  From: bob@instantwhip.com # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! ; Message-ID: <h8G0f.589$R62.64@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   F Bill Gates and oracle are the ones trying to keep vms off the x86 boat> anchor because they know the day that happens, they are toast!  < How much are they paying and who at HP is receiving payoffs?9 I say Palmer did at DEC and Capellas at Q, now who at HP?    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:48 GMT  From: bob@instantwhip.com # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! < Message-ID: <I8G0f.597$R62.324@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  A time to answer the question that why would anyone with a superior B operating system and a superior cpu cancel one for an inferior cpu> and not position and market its superior os to achieve maximumD market share and profit?  Name calling just reinforces the fact that: you can not or will not address the question logically ...   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:52 GMT  From: bob@instantwhip.com # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! < Message-ID: <M8G0f.598$R62.415@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  @ Intel wanted alpha dead so itanium could occupy the high end ...= unfortunately, itanium turned out to be the dud DEC engineers < wrote it would be and IBM continued where alpha left off and now control it w/power ...  C if intel had any brains at all, they would dump itanium and produce A alpha ... even windows 2000 runs on it already ... but that would A be too simple and make too much sense financially ... can't admit > that DEC technology was and still is superior to their own ...  = give me vms and alpha and I would destroy the x86 boat anchor ( market plus power and dominate all ends!   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:41:36 GMT  From: bob@instantwhip.com # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! < Message-ID: <kbG0f.641$R62.548@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  ? we know all about synergex, but the real question is what small ? itanium boxes will be available in the future?  What comes next > after the rx1600 developers boxes are outdated?  I see nothing: in the 1P space to replace them?  We are not just going to= migrate to them and then have no inexpensive boxes after that D in the pipeline!  If intel and HP thinks that only the high end runs< vms, then they are wrong and are driving away customers that; they evidently don't care about losing to other vendors ...    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 02:49:13 GMT * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com># Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! 4 Message-ID: <JaH0f.13882$Zt7.12402@news.cpqcorp.net>  L This is really strange.  I got like 100+ messages that look like they are at least a   day old who up in my newsreader.  K In any case, Alpha "had" sound support.  It didn't have it once PCI went to  V2.2C and 3V power.  Marvel/EV7 systems do not have sound - of any kind - 	 including  a system bell.  I It's a matter of demand.  We did a bunch of work to keep sound, and while  there G are a few vocal people who want it - not many who wanted to pay for it.   J Tell you what.  I'll publish the QIO interface for MMOV's interface to the sound # card - feel free to write a driver.     : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote in message& news:43432A67.8A63D3D5@teksavvy.com... > FredK wrote:H > > OK.  If you want a cheap box with sound, we have many PC's with both$ > > Windows or Linux to choose from. >  > ! > VMS had sound support on Alpha. 4 > VMS doesn't have sound support on that IA64 thing. > ! > Not an upwards compatible move.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 02:51:20 GMT * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com># Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! 4 Message-ID: <IcH0f.13883$az7.12282@news.cpqcorp.net>  E Don't know your source of information, but it is rubbish.  I know for D a *fact* about several attempts to buy VMS... none of which was IBM.    & <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in message6 news:18G0f.584$R62.490@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp...1 > being your usual fool Bill, you forgot that our 0 > good friend Robert Palmer offered both vms and1 > alpha to everyone, but no takers ... I posted a 1 > letter here in the spring or last year from IBM 3 > that said IBM views vms as outdated and obsolete!  > 1 > now either IBM has NIH syndrome or they are the 4 > dummest company on the planet ... which one is it? >  >    ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 00:41:09 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> # Subject: RE: Time to produce EV79s! R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB70C0CD@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----; > From: bob@instantwhip.com [mailto:bob@instantwhip.com]=20  > Sent: October 4, 2005 9:38 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com % > Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s!  >=201 > being your usual fool Bill, you forgot that our 0 > good friend Robert Palmer offered both vms and1 > alpha to everyone, but no takers ... I posted a 1 > letter here in the spring or last year from IBM 3 > that said IBM views vms as outdated and obsolete!  >=201 > now either IBM has NIH syndrome or they are the 4 > dummest company on the planet ... which one is it? >=20     Bob,  G IBM is certainly a very credible competitor, but lets look at this from  another point of view ...   D If I was a senior HP exec and a AIX (Solaris) fan who was upset withE IBM's (Sun) current directions sent me an email asking why HP did not @ buy AIX (Solaris), I would respond in a nice way "Thanks for theH suggestion, but HP views AIX (Solaris) as basically good technology, butA a bit dated and that HP's Customers were more interested in newer  technology."  H They will initially find something nice to say, but then drop the fud asC that is the way the game is played when Sales and exec's talk about F competitors systems in front of Customers. Heck, all vendors do it.=20  4 What did you expect a competitor of HP to state? =20  H Perhaps that IBM person should have said they thought OpenVMS was really% cool and wished they could buy it?=20   D How many minutes do you think that exec would be at IBM if they sent that reply?    :-)   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 00:45:59 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> # Subject: RE: Time to produce EV79s! R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB70C0CE@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----; > From: bob@instantwhip.com [mailto:bob@instantwhip.com]=20  > Sent: October 4, 2005 9:38 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ! > Subject: Time to produce EV79s!  >=20A > ok Sue and everyone else at HP ... after reading this, itaniums A > future doesn't look bright, and it is now time to make IBM live 9 > up to its legal obligations and start making EV79s NOW!  >=20@ > The chip improvement timeline looks like a disaster since they) > removed the alpha team from itanium ...  >=20A > Do it now or lose vms customers to IBM!  Why can't IBM have not @ > had NIH syndrome and bought vms for power????????  FOOLS!!!!!! >=20 >=20- > http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=3D26519  >=20 >=20    G Bob, the day after that article was printed, the following article also 	 appeared:   + http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=3D26552 % IBM's Power 5+ to launch at 2.1GHz=20 . Disappointing for IBM, cheering news for Intel7 By Charlie Demerjian: Thursday 29 September 2005, 08:06    Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 05:21:18 GMT ' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> # Subject: RE: Time to produce EV79s! < Message-ID: <ipJ0f.669$R62.414@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   > -----Original Message-----; > From: bob@instantwhip.com [mailto:bob@instantwhip.com]=20  > Sent: October 4, 2005 9:38 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com % > Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s!  >=201 > being your usual fool Bill, you forgot that our 0 > good friend Robert Palmer offered both vms and1 > alpha to everyone, but no takers ... I posted a 1 > letter here in the spring or last year from IBM 3 > that said IBM views vms as outdated and obsolete!  >=201 > now either IBM has NIH syndrome or they are the 4 > dummest company on the planet ... which one is it? >=20     Bob,  G IBM is certainly a very credible competitor, but lets look at this from  another point of view ...   D If I was a senior HP exec and a AIX (Solaris) fan who was upset withE IBM's (Sun) current directions sent me an email asking why HP did not @ buy AIX (Solaris), I would respond in a nice way "Thanks for theH suggestion, but HP views AIX (Solaris) as basically good technology, butA a bit dated and that HP's Customers were more interested in newer  technology."  H They will initially find something nice to say, but then drop the fud asC that is the way the game is played when Sales and exec's talk about F competitors systems in front of Customers. Heck, all vendors do it.=20  4 What did you expect a competitor of HP to state? =20  H Perhaps that IBM person should have said they thought OpenVMS was really% cool and wished they could buy it?=20   D How many minutes do you think that exec would be at IBM if they sent that reply?    :-)   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 05:21:22 GMT ' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> # Subject: RE: Time to produce EV79s! < Message-ID: <mpJ0f.670$R62.621@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   > -----Original Message-----; > From: bob@instantwhip.com [mailto:bob@instantwhip.com]=20  > Sent: October 4, 2005 9:38 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ! > Subject: Time to produce EV79s!  >=20A > ok Sue and everyone else at HP ... after reading this, itaniums A > future doesn't look bright, and it is now time to make IBM live 9 > up to its legal obligations and start making EV79s NOW!  >=20@ > The chip improvement timeline looks like a disaster since they) > removed the alpha team from itanium ...  >=20A > Do it now or lose vms customers to IBM!  Why can't IBM have not @ > had NIH syndrome and bought vms for power????????  FOOLS!!!!!! >=20 >=20- > http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=3D26519  >=20 >=20    G Bob, the day after that article was printed, the following article also 	 appeared:   + http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=3D26552 % IBM's Power 5+ to launch at 2.1GHz=20 . Disappointing for IBM, cheering news for Intel7 By Charlie Demerjian: Thursday 29 September 2005, 08:06    Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:39:25 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! 0 Message-ID: <11k6pcgr95ine1f@corp.supernews.com>   bob@instantwhip.com wrote:A > ok Sue and everyone else at HP ... after reading this, itaniums A > future doesn't look bright, and it is now time to make IBM live 9 > up to its legal obligations and start making EV79s NOW!   F boob, when will you get it through your thick skull, if you even have A anything above your shoulders, that IBM has NO LEGAL OBLIGATIONS!   I If anything, you're thinking about Intel.  And you can see where they're   going.  D IBM is only the source of the copper chips, which are currently the I fastest Alphas available.  For a price, they'll probably continue making  8 chips.  That's the business IBM Micro-electronics is in.   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-04504 Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      Fax: 724-529-0596> DFE Ultralights, Inc.              E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com 170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Oct 2005 18:46:24 -0700 ( From: "Ville" <guilespellbook@gmail.com> Subject: Turn $6 into $6.000C Message-ID: <1128476784.745128.106400@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>   G HOW TO TURN 6 BUCKS INTO 6 THOUSAND! (WORLD WIDE) WARNING: READING THIS    WILL CHANGE YOUR LIFE!F I found this on a Bulletin board and decided to try it. A little whileC back, I was browsing through newsgroups, just like you are now, and ? came across an article similar to this that said you could make D thousands of dollars within weeks with only an initial investment ofE $6.00! So I thought, "Yeah right, this must be a scam", but like most E of us, I was curious, so I kept reading.Anyway, it said that you send E $1.00 to each of the 6 names and addresses stated in the article. You E then place your own name and address in the bottom of the list at #6, F and post the article in at least 200 newsgroups. (There are thousands)F No catch, that was it. So after thinking it over, and talking to a fewG people first, I thought about trying it. I figured: "what have I got to   B lose except 6 stamps and $6.00, right?" Then I invested the measly $6.00.G Well GUESS WHAT!! Within 7 days, I started getting money in the mail! I   A was shocked! I figured it would end soon, but the money just kept C coming in. In my first week, I made about $25.00. By the end of the E second week I had made a total of over $1,000.00! In the third week I F had over $10,000.00 and it's still growing. This is now my fourth weekE and I have made a total of just over $42,000.00 and it's still coming G in rapidly. It's certainly worth $6.00, and 6 stamps, I have spent more   B than that on the lottery!! Let me tell you how this works and mostC importantly, why it works. Also, make sure you print a copy of this F article NOW, so you can get the information off of it, as you need it.F I promise you that if you follow the directions exactly, that you willG start making more money than you thought possible by doing something so   F easy! Suggestion: Read this entire message carefully! (Print it out orG download it.) Follow the simple directions and watch the money come in!   G It's easy. It's legal, and your investment is only $6.00 (Plus postage)   ? IMPORTANT: This is not a rip-off; it is not indecent; it is not E illegal; and it is virtually no risk because it really works!!!If all F of the following instructions are adhered to exactly, you will receiveD extraordinary dividends. PLEASE NOTE: Please follow these directions@ EXACTLY, and $50,000 or more can be yours in 20 to 60 days. ThisF program remains successful because of the honesty and integrity of theF participants. Please continue its success by carefully adhering to theE instructions. You will now become part of the Mail Order business. In E this business your product is not solid and tangible, it's a service. ? You are in the business of developing Mailing Lists. Many large G corporations are happy to pay big bucks for quality lists. However, the   E money made from the mailing lists is secondary to the income which is D made from people like you and me asking to be included in that list.F Here are the 4 easy steps to success: STEP 1: Get 6 separate pieces ofF paper and write the following on each piece of paper "PLEASE PUT ME ONF YOUR MAILING LIST!" Now get 6 US $1.00 bills and place ONE inside EACHA of the 6 pieces of paper so the bill will not be seen through the F envelope (to prevent thievery). Next, place one paper in each of the 6E envelopes and seal them. You should now have 6 sealed envelopes, each F with a piece of paper stating the above phrase, your name and address,C and a $1.00 bill. What you are doing is creating a service. THIS IS E ABSOLUTELY LEGAL! You are requesting a legitimate service and you are D paying for it! Like most of us I was a little skeptical and a littleG worried about the legal aspects of it all. So I checked it out with the   F U.S. Post Office (1-800-725-2161) and they confirmed that it is indeedG legal. Mail the 6 envelopes to the following addresses: Note: Make sure   D you put the correct amount of postage stamps on your envelopes.OtherC countries my need more stamps so be correct on how many you put.And G remember your business will be running Throughout the world so when you   G start posting messages or emails to people this will bring in thousands   G of dollars from all over the world. So now, you have money flowing \ in   B from countries!That's how I became so successful in this business.0 Mail the 6 envelopes to the following addresses: #1)     Tom Zimmerman IV 193 Yard St  Nesquehoning, PA. 18240  #2)   B. Pratt 5535 E 100 N Knox, IN 46534 #3)     Michele Tyska 
 PO Box 765 Northport, NY 11768  #4)     David Weir
 PO Box 144 Schooleys Mt., NJ 07870  #5)     S. Nagirnyak 14139 Pine Forest Drive  #208 North Royalton, OH 44133& #6)     Guillermo Oscar Sanchez Mallea  Madero 225 Vicente Lopez CP:1638 Buenos Aires - ArgentinaE STEP 2:Now take the #1 name off the list that you see above, move the F other names up (6 becomes 5, 5 becomes 4, etc...) and add YOUR NAME asD number 6 on the list.STEP 3: Change anything you need to, but try toB keep this article as close to original as possible. Now, post yourG amended article to at least 200 newsgroups. (I think there are close to   C 24,000 groups) All you need is 200, but remember, the more that you G post, the more money you make! This is perfectly legal! If you have any   F doubts, refer to Title 18 Sec. 1302 & 1341 of the Postal lottery laws.E Keep a copy of these steps for yourself and, whenever you need money, B you can use it again, and again. PLEASE REMEMBER that this program> remains successful because of the honesty and integrity of theG participants and by their carefully adhering to the directions. Look at   ? it this way, if you are a person of integrity, the program will G continue and the money that so many others have received will come your   E way. NOTE: You may want to retain every name and address sent to you, E either on a computer or hard copy and keep the notes people send you. E This VERIFIES that you are truly providing a service. (Also, it might F be a good idea to wrap the $1 bill in dark paper to reduce the risk of> mail theft.) So, as each post is downloaded and the directions< carefully followed, six members will be reimbursed for theirF participation as a List Developer with one dollar each. Your name willD move up the list geometrically so that when your name reaches the #1F position you will be receiving thousands of dollars in CASH!!! What anB opportunity for only $6.00 ($1.00 for each of the first six peopleF listed above) Send it now, add your own name to the list and you're in business!!! D DIRECTIONS FOR HOW TO POST TO NEWSGROUPS: STEP 1: You do not need toB re-type this entire letter to do your own posting. Simply put yourB cursor at the beginning of this letter and drag your cursor to theE bottom of this document, and select ''copy'' from the edit menu. This G will copy the entire letter into the computer''s memory. STEP 2: Open a   D blank ''notepad'' file and place your cursor at the top of the blankE page. From the ''edit'' menu select ''paste''. This will paste a copy E of the letter into notepad so that you can add your name to the list. D STEP 3: Save your new notepad file as a text file. If you want to doE your postings in different settings, you''ll always have this file to G go back to. STEP 4: Use Netscape or Internet explorer and try searching   C for various newsgroups (on-line forums, message boards, chat sites, F discussions.) STEP 5: Visit these message boards and post this articleF as a new message by highlighting the text of this letter and selectingF paste from the edit menu. Fill in the Subject, this will be the headerC that everyone sees as they scroll through the list of postings in a G particular group, click the post message button. You''re done with your   F first one! Congratulations...THAT''S IT! All you have to do is jump toD different newsgroups and post away, after you get the hang of it, itC will take about 30 seconds for each newsgroup! **REMEMBER, THE MORE F NEWSGROUPS YOU POST IN, THE MORE MONEY YOU WILL MAKE!! BUT YOU HAVE TOG POST A MINIMUM OF 200** that''s it! You will begin receiving money from   D around the World within days! You may eventually want to rent a P.O.F Box Due to the large amounts coming to you!P.S. It's only 6 bucks what u got to lose? So check it out!    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:35:24 GMT . From: huber@NOBODY-mppmu.mpg.de (Joseph Huber)G Subject: Re: UAF-W-IDOUTRNG, identifier value is not within legal range < Message-ID: <w5G0f.537$R62.374@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  G In article <4339325b$1@news1.ethz.ch>, S <soterroatyahoodotcom> writes: ) > This is Alpha VMS 7.3-2 and I try this:  > . > UAF> grant/iden VMS$MEM_RESIDENT_USER MEUSERE > %UAF-I-GRANTMSG, identifier VMS$MEM_RESIDENT_USER granted to MEUSER / > UAF> revo/iden VMS$MEM_RESIDENT_USER TEST1148 = > %UAF-W-IDOUTRNG, identifier value is not within legal range  > 	 > I have: 2 > MEUSER                           [000012,000032]- > VMS$MEM_RESIDENT_USER            %X80000009  > F > How come all in a sudden VMS$MEM_RESIDENT_USER is not good anymore? K > According to the docs, it IS indeed outside legal range, but hey it came  K > like that with the system and GRANT accepted it happily. And this is not  H > the only identifier like this, I see there a heap of system ones like 9 > BATCH, DECWINDOWS... are they not to be used by humans?  > H > Same thing for older VMS, same thing on VAX, I have no VMS 8.x to try.   See ITRC thread at URLK http://forums1.itrc.hp.com/service/forums/questionanswer.do?threadId=957014 4 Maybe a coming patch will solve this (or maybe not).   --  @    Joseph Huber , Muenchen,Germany:  http://www.huber-joseph.de/   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Oct 2005 22:14:54 GMT  From: healyzh@aracnet.com  Subject: Re: Vamp Hacked! , Message-ID: <dhuusu01tb6@enews2.newsguy.com>  ) Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote: D > Go back and look at the origins of PHP.  Like PERL it was intendedD > to short-circuit the Software Engineering process amking quick and > dirty programs a norm.    J What is your problem with Perl?  It depends on the person writing the codeE as to if it's good or bad, but the same can be said of just about any  language out there.     L It is definitely possible to write Perl code that is bullet-proof, with tons of error checking.  G Show me another language that is as widely available, and is as good at  working with strings.    		Zane   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:09 GMT ( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com> Subject: Re: Vamp Hacked! < Message-ID: <l4G0f.518$R62.272@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  3 >NNTP-Posting-Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 21:39:26 -0500 , >Message-ID: <433CA591.64CC91EB@comcast.net>& >Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 21:40:17 -05003 >From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> & >Reply-To: djesysno@spam.earthlink.net >Organization: DJE Systems0 >X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.77 [en] (Windows NT 5.0; U) >X-Accept-Language: en >MIME-Version: 1.0 >X-Newsgroups: comp.os.vms >Subject: Re: Vamp Hacked!   >Larry Kilgallen wrote:  >>  c >> In article <433C99E8.DE91FB83@comcast.net>, David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> writes:  >>  H >> > I guess the lesson here is that even the most unhackable o.s. can't4 >> > prevent applications from having weak security. >>  D >> Whereas I would say the lesson is to avoid importing applications6 >> that are "good enough" for other operating systems. >   >...and the alternative is ... ? >     M Yes, good question.  I am not aware of any native-vms bulletin board, picture J gallery, chat, or bugtracking systems, which are the PHP applications I amK using.  Sure, the applications can get trashed, but the hackers can't break K through to the containing OS.  With regular backups, I am not worried about   these non-critical applications.O =============================================================================== N Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738   wayne@tachysoft.com; http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html    O =============================================================================== P Jake Blues:"You traded the Caddy for a microphone? ...... Okay, I can buy that."   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:12 GMT ( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com> Subject: Re: Vamp Hacked! ; Message-ID: <o4G0f.519$R62.61@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   . >From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) >X-Newsgroups: comp.os.vms >Subject: Re: Vamp Hacked!  >Date: 1 Oct 2005 06:34:31 -0500  8 >> Yes, good question.  I am not aware of any native-vms >> bulletin board, >   >DECnotes (as used on DECUServe) >   L I should have qualified this as: bulletin board, accessible by anyone with a; web browser on any type of system anywhere on the internet.   L The last time I used decnotes, you had to directly log into a vms system andN issue dcl commands.  The people using my bulletin board are not vms users, norH do I want anyone directly logging into my system, with or without privs.   >> chat, > : >PHONE (unless you mean something else by the word "chat") >   N Is phone accessible via the internet by anyone with a web browser?  Again, the: people chatting are not vms users, and not at my location.     >> or bugtracking systems, > D >PTR (not yet released to freeware, but contact Steve Hoffman if you >     have a serious need) >   G Accessible via a web browser from anywhere on the internet?  The people O involved in the bug tracking are at locations several thousand miles apart, not N necessarily running on vms systems for web browsing, and there is no decnet or  cluster connection between them.   Wayne O =============================================================================== N Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738   wayne@tachysoft.com; http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html    O =============================================================================== P Jake Blues:"You traded the Caddy for a microphone? ...... Okay, I can buy that."   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:20 GMT ( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com> Subject: Re: Vamp Hacked! < Message-ID: <w4G0f.521$R62.507@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   >X-Newsgroups: comp.os.vms >Subject: Re: Vamp Hacked!% >From: "Doc." <Doc@openvms-rocks.com> ! >Organization: Indexed Sequential 8 >Message-ID: <Xns96E2E4CAAB996DCovmsrox@212.100.160.126> >User-Agent: Xnews/5.04.25 >Date: 01 Oct 2005 20:29:22 GMT    > , >Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com> wrote in) >news:00A4A9E5.AA2FE8E5.1@tachysoft.com:   > H >> I should have qualified this as: bulletin board, accessible by anyoneE >> with a web browser on any type of system anywhere on the internet.  >>  D >> The last time I used decnotes, you had to directly log into a vmsI >> system and issue dcl commands.  The people using my bulletin board are G >> not vms users, nor do I want anyone directly logging into my system,  >> with or without privs.  > I >Well, thanks to a certain Mr Graham Burley, and the Notes API, there is  C >now a web interface to Notes - HTNotes.  This is available on the  D >Deathrow Cluster at http://gein.vistech.net/notes/ (if you have an E >account), and works with VMS authentication and authorization quite  I >nicely.  Yes, if you know the right magic incantations you can log into  F >our system's HTNotes interface and work with conferences on multiple H >systems.  For obvious (trolling) reasons I won't post the specifics of  >that here.  > G >From my lurking on Eisner, I suspect it will end up in use there too,  D >plus it has the advantage that those who prefer the character cell K >interface can work with that, and those who want to work in a browser can   >do so.  > E >Anyways, as Graham has demonstrated, the design of Notes allows for  E >expansion in ways never even dreamt of by the original implementors.  >   H Is the interface available for use elsewhere?  If so, can it be used forK commercial customer support bulletin boards if the systems involved are not # running under the hobbyist license? O =============================================================================== N Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738   wayne@tachysoft.com; http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html    O =============================================================================== P Jake Blues:"You traded the Caddy for a microphone? ...... Okay, I can buy that."   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:23 GMT ( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com> Subject: Re: Vamp Hacked! < Message-ID: <z4G0f.522$R62.468@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  . >From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) >X-Newsgroups: comp.os.vms >Subject: Re: Vamp Hacked!  >Date: 2 Oct 2005 00:23:37 -0500 >Organization: LJK Software 
 >Lines: 32  [ >In article <00A4A9E5.AA2FE8E5.1@tachysoft.com>, Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com> writes: 0 >>>From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) >>   >>>> or bugtracking systems, >>> F >>>PTR (not yet released to freeware, but contact Steve Hoffman if you >>>     have a serious need) >>>  >>  J >> Accessible via a web browser from anywhere on the internet?  The people > ? >Accessible via a web browser via HTTP.  Or by Mail, or by DCL. G >What you allow is up to you.  "Anywhere on the Internet" is up to you.   P Okay.  However, packages that are not available are not relevant.  I do not knowO the qualifications for "serious need".  Surely anyone developing software to be M distributed to others, whether commercial or free, has a "serious need" for a  bugtracking system.     J I was just happy to find a multi-site bugtracker that could run on vms, asL opposed to a eunuchs machine (bugzilla) or a never-to-be-sufficiently-damnedM billybox.  If I can replace it with this native-vms PTR, I will.  If I can't, ) there is no point in even mentioning PTR.   O If there were more vms software vendors, it would be worthwhile to develop such M a system for sale, or at least as shareware.  However, with the current state 
 of things ...    Wayne O =============================================================================== N Wayne Sewell, Tachyon Software Consulting  (281)812-0738   wayne@tachysoft.com; http://www.tachysoft.com/www/tachyon.html and wayne.html    O =============================================================================== P Jake Blues:"You traded the Caddy for a microphone? ...... Okay, I can buy that."   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Oct 2005 22:43:34 -0500 - From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)  Subject: Re: Vamp Hacked! 3 Message-ID: <xdmFWaOjobmA@eisner.encompasserve.org>   H In article <dhuusu01tb6@enews2.newsguy.com>, healyzh@aracnet.com writes:  + > Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote: E >> Go back and look at the origins of PHP.  Like PERL it was intended E >> to short-circuit the Software Engineering process amking quick and  >> dirty programs a norm.  > L > What is your problem with Perl?  It depends on the person writing the codeG > as to if it's good or bad, but the same can be said of just about any  > language out there.     K If that is your impression, you have not been learning the right languages. F Ada is _strongly_ biased to make certain programming errors difficult.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 04:21:37 GMT - From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)  Subject: Re: Vamp Hacked! < Message-ID: <lxI0f.666$R62.350@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  H In article <dhuusu01tb6@enews2.newsguy.com>, healyzh@aracnet.com writes:  + > Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote: E >> Go back and look at the origins of PHP.  Like PERL it was intended E >> to short-circuit the Software Engineering process amking quick and  >> dirty programs a norm.  > L > What is your problem with Perl?  It depends on the person writing the codeG > as to if it's good or bad, but the same can be said of just about any  > language out there.     K If that is your impression, you have not been learning the right languages. F Ada is _strongly_ biased to make certain programming errors difficult.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:36:08 GMT  From: bob@jfcl.com6 Subject: VAX 8350/8200 - Lights on, but nobody home...< Message-ID: <c6G0f.550$R62.286@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  G I received a VAX8350 in "junk" condition - this machine was stripped by E a DEC reseller for parts before I got it, so it is missing a few bits B and pieces here and there..  Still, it's one of the smallest VAXBIG machines made, and an SMP machine at that, so it's worth some effort to 
 resurrect it.   B I've got it to where it'll at least power up now and turn on a fewD LEDs, but it's still pretty unresponsive.  With the upper key set toB "STANDBY" and the lower key set to "HALT", the STANDBY (RED), HALTC (YELLOW) and FAULT (RED) LEDs are on.  Under the top cover, the ILV F (GREEN - what's "ILV" mean, anyway?), H7251 (RED) and H7253 (RED) LEDs are on.   D According to the operator's manual (which is all I have) the "FAULT"C LED only goes off after the diagnostics complete, so it's not clear 1 whether that indicates a problem in standby mode.   B Taking a deep breath and switching to "ENABLE" makes the H7251 andD H7253 LEDs go off; the RED LED on the CPU card turns on, but not theC yellow.  The yellow LEDs on all the memory cards are ON, and on the @ front panel the STANDBY LED goes off and the ENABLE LED goes on.  @ Other than some LEDs, though, there's no sign of life.  It neverF attempts to access the RX50, and it never says anything on the console' terminal.  At least there's no smoke...   G   I'm assuming that the CFE (console front end board) should at minimum > wake up and do something now, even if nothing else is working.  F   Is there any recommended place to probe the power supply voltages toF see if that's OK?  It's not obvious, since the darned thing won't evenD run with the cover off (the airflow sensor shuts it down).  Or is my	 CFE dead?   4   Anybody got any maintenance prints for this thing?  G   BTW, I call it an 8350/8200 because the reseller stripped all the CPU D cards before I got it.  I managed to find a KA820 card and installedG that, which should in theory make it an 8200.  This might cause me some @ problems down the road, but I'm assuming it's not the issue now.   Thanks, 
 Bob Armstrong    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:36:19 GMT  From: bob@jfcl.com: Subject: Re: VAX 8350/8200 - Lights on, but nobody home...< Message-ID: <n6G0f.553$R62.533@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  I >there is a small chance that I'm able to recover an 8350 operator manual   @   Thanks for the offer, but I have a PDF of the "VAX 8000 SeriesA Operators Manual" - if that's what you have then I don't need it. G Unfortunately it's a little skimpy on anything that involves taking the  machine apart!  F   The machine's in a 19" rack cabinet.  The chassis itself is the same0 size as a BA11 UNIBUS box or a VAX-11/730 CPU.     Bob    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:36:23 GMT  From: bob@jfcl.com: Subject: Re: VAX 8350/8200 - Lights on, but nobody home...< Message-ID: <r6G0f.554$R62.226@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  I >there is a small chance that I'm able to recover an 8350 operator manual   @   Thanks for the offer, but I have a PDF of the "VAX 8000 SeriesA Operators Manual" - if that's what you have then I don't need it. G Unfortunately it's a little skimpy on anything that involves taking the  machine apart!  F   The machine's in a 19" rack cabinet.  The chassis itself is the same0 size as a BA11 UNIBUS box or a VAX-11/730 CPU.     Bob    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:36:42 GMT  From: dooleys@snowy.net.au Subject: Re: Vax Needed...< Message-ID: <K6G0f.560$R62.128@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   neox.qua...@gmail.com wrote:C > Hi, i'm trying to learn VAX assembly language, but I don't have a C > system. I was wondering where perhaps I would be able to obtain a I > MicroVax or similar. Anything smaller than a washing machine is fine by # > me. I live in Australia though... 3 There are a couple on http://computers.ebay.com.au/ ( at the moment - in the "vintage" section a vaxstation and a vax4000 Phil   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:36:45 GMT  From: mb301@hotmail.com  Subject: Re: Vax Needed...: Message-ID: <N6G0f.561$R62.2@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  ; Why not get a charon-vax, runs on any Micro$oft Windows PC.   % http://www.softresint.com/charon-vax/    Mark   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:37:03 GMT ' From: "toby" <toby@telegraphics.com.au>  Subject: Re: Vax Needed...< Message-ID: <37G0f.566$R62.559@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  - David Turner, Island Computers US Corp wrote:  > I might have a 3100-80 >  > Give me a call and we'll talk  > , > No warranty means no charge for the systemK > I would like to get it out of here via Fedex instead of Waster Management    David   E Assuming neox can't take that machine, what does the system comprise? " Do you have the patience for ebay?   regards  Toby   >  > DT >  > -- >  > David B Turner > Island Computers US Corp > 2700 Gregory St, Suite 180 > Savannah GA 31404  > Tel: 912 447 6622 X201 > Cell: 912 447 6622 X252  > Fax: 912 201 0402  > Email: dbturner@icusc.com  > Web: http://www.islandco.com' > ===================================== > > All orders are subject to the following terms and conditions0 > of sale. These should be read before ordering.' > http://www.islandco.com/warranty.html  > * > <neox.quasar@gmail.com> wrote in message? > news:1127782943.795799.150990@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... E > > Hi, i'm trying to learn VAX assembly language, but I don't have a E > > system. I was wondering where perhaps I would be able to obtain a K > > MicroVax or similar. Anything smaller than a washing machine is fine by % > > me. I live in Australia though...  > >    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:35:35 GMT  From: bob@jfcl.com8 Subject: VAX8350 Power Supply (H7251/H7253) problems....< Message-ID: <H5G0f.540$R62.205@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  C   I've got a VAX8350 (yes!) but when I power it up in standby mode, D it'll run for 30-45 seconds and then trip the breaker on the back ofA the 8350 box.  We're not talking about tripping the 30A 877 power C controller breaker; this is the breaker on the back of the 8350 box # itself, right above the power cord.   F   Measuring the AC current with a clamp on ammeter shows only about 2AD - hardly anything to get excited about.  Needless to say, there's no0 smoke, fire, or other obvious signs of distress.  ?   I can't help but notice that the breaker in question has some D suspicious extra wires on it; is this some kind of electromechanicalA trip that's intended to trip the breaker in case of ... Overtemp? & Airflow failure?  Something like that?  F   And I also notice that for the short time it is running that the fanF speed keeps changing; fast, slow, fast, slow, etc....  Is this normal?  G   Anybody got any maintenance prints for this baby?  Bitsavers has zip, 6 and all I can find on the web is an operator's manual!   Thanks, 
 Bob Armstrong    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:35:58 GMT  From: bob@jfcl.com< Subject: Re: VAX8350 Power Supply (H7251/H7253) problems....: Message-ID: <26G0f.547$R62.7@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   >You DO have the top cover on?  E   Ummmm.... No - is that important??  Just kidding - obviously it is. G I should mention that this machine was stripped by a DEC "reseller" for F parts before I got it, so it is missing a few bits and pieces here andD there..  Still, it's one of the smallest VAXBI machines made, and an? SMP machine at that, so it's worth some effort to resurrect it.   @   Fortunately I did get the top cover, although it had no screwsC holding it on.  Scrounging up some hardware and attaching the cover C does indeed make it stay powered up.  Thanks for the tip - I should  have thought of that!   E   Sadly, although it'll power up and some LEDs come on, it appears to D be otherwise dead.  I've started another thread on this topic, since" it's a somewhat different problem.  /   Thanks again, to all the people who answered.    Bob    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:36:01 GMT  From: bob@jfcl.com< Subject: Re: VAX8350 Power Supply (H7251/H7253) problems....< Message-ID: <56G0f.548$R62.353@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  5 >An 8350, sigh, you're running VMS V5.0 on it, right?   D   Ha - I wish!  I didn't get any disks with it, although I do have aD KDB50 so if I can coax some life out of the machine there exists theD possibility that I might someday be able to install VMS.  I've got a3 few RA8x drives around, so that won't be a problem.   E   If I do I'll probably use some flavor of VMS 5.x.  Do you recommend  something else?    Bob    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:36:12 GMT 2 From: "vaxorcist" <hoelscher-kirchbrak@freenet.de>* Subject: VMS 4.6/4.7 Local Area VAXcluster< Message-ID: <g6G0f.551$R62.249@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  ? I intend to build a VMS V4.6/4.7 Local Area VAXcluster for pure  Hobbyist reasons.   G I've got VMS V4.6 and V4.7 and the DECnet F/F License Key, but the LAVC A License Key (or was it called 'Cluster License Key'?) is missing.   # Anyone out there who has got one???   E Another possiblity would be if someone had a Backup of a V4.6 or V4.7 C LAVC VMS System. As far as I know all I would need from that is the F file: SYS$SYSTEM:PEDRIVER.EXE (Systems without the LAVC license key do& only have SYS$SYSTEM:PEDRIVER.MSKEXE).  B Thank in advance to anyone who can help or knows someone else that might help.    Ulli (The 'VAXorcist')    P.S.D To those who never saw a VMS V4.x system: There's no such thing as aE LMF License Facilty, but some important file are patched or encrypted  for reduced functionalty.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:34:29 GMT & From: Elliott Roper <nospam@yrl.co.uk>: Subject: Re: VMS compatible terminal emulator for Mac OS X< Message-ID: <F4G0f.524$R62.339@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  = In article <BF666B05.14E58%roktsci@comcast.net>, Jeff Cameron  <roktsci@comcast.net> wrote:  ! > On 10/3/05 12:52 AM, in article 8 > 1128325944.828962.105210@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com,@ > "stuie_norris@yahoo.com.au" <stuie_norris@yahoo.com.au> wrote: > 
 > > Hi Group,  > > I > > I have just install a wireless network and I would like to be able to J > > connect to my DS10L running VMS 7.3-2 from my powerbook G4 running Mac > > OSX 10.3.x.  > > G > > I have tried terminal which is pretty poor.  Could not even get the H > > ctrl-z to work correctly.  Also tried powerterm - but this is not asH > > nice as I had hoped - plus pretty pricy.  Virtual keyboard and fonts > > were pretty poor.  > > I > > Any other suggestions.  Does WRQ still market a terminal emulator for  > > Mac OSX? > > C > > Main use is to run EVE (edit / tpu) for editoring source files.  > > 
 > > Thanks > > 
 > > Stuart > > L > I would have preferred the WRQ Reflections, but it is so OLD and only runsL > under OS9. I settled with PowerTerm, and I have the same opinion as you do
 > with it. >  > Jeff > E Hmm, I use terminal on a Powerbook G4 on OS X 10.4.2 and it is almost D perfect after a few tweaks in system preferences->keyboard and mouseA 1. check use f1-f12 to control software features (also in 10.3.x)   G 2. fiddle the modifier keys to put the ctrl key where god intended (use  caps lock key) Tiger only.F You still need to type out the escape sequences for insert and remove,A but that is the penalty you pay for using a girly editor like eve E instead of teco. However, once you upgrade to 10.4.x, terminal allows % you to map the keyboard how you like.   F If you must remap your keyboard in 10.3.x use xterm that comes bundled
 with OS X.G You could even go crazy with a set display and run a proper DECterm. (I E tried it and thought it was too ugly for words) With X11, be prepared = for the usual perpetual fiddling with xinitrc. subscribing to + x11-users@lists.apple.com might be helpful.   ; If you choose Monaco font, you even get the cute little DEC F supplemental characters for cr lf newline and so on. (-1,3:w$$ in teco( aka seeall mode - as if you give a damn)  9 ps. Mac OS X and VMS TCPIP do a good job of ssh together. G pps. it all works fine over wireless, although you should be aware that C the wireless interface on the Mac wants a different IP address (EN1 1 settings for wireless and EN0 for wired ethernet)    --  1 To de-mung my e-mail address:- fsnospam$elliott$$ C PGP Fingerprint: 1A96 3CF7 637F 896B C810  E199 7E5C A9E4 8E59 E248    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:41:20 GMT  From: stuie_norris@yahoo.com.au 6 Subject: VMS compatible terminal emulator for Mac OS X< Message-ID: <4bG0f.637$R62.627@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  	 Hi Group,   E I have just install a wireless network and I would like to be able to F connect to my DS10L running VMS 7.3-2 from my powerbook G4 running Mac OSX 10.3.x.   C I have tried terminal which is pretty poor.  Could not even get the D ctrl-z to work correctly.  Also tried powerterm - but this is not asD nice as I had hoped - plus pretty pricy.  Virtual keyboard and fonts were pretty poor.   E Any other suggestions.  Does WRQ still market a terminal emulator for  Mac OSX?  ? Main use is to run EVE (edit / tpu) for editoring source files.    Thanks   Stuart   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:40:29 GMT  From: bob@instantwhip.com   Subject: Re: VMS on the |nquirer< Message-ID: <haG0f.623$R62.416@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  G I got levitte.org and it says itanium is still in announcement mode ...  :(   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:40:02 GMT * From: "Alan Greig" <greigaln@netscape.net> Subject: VMS on the |nquirer; Message-ID: <S9G0f.617$R62.30@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   G Worth a look at www.theinquirer.net right now. Note the Intel VMS story A and the clickable "If VMS is your god" pic(top left) from Digital  India.   --  
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Oct 2005 18:17:20 GMT ( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)5 Subject: Re: What is holding up linux on wall street? + Message-ID: <3qfv9fFera5fU1@individual.net>   B In article <1128443154.988136.12740@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,0 	"Doug Phillips" <dphill46@netscape.net> writes: > bob@instantwhip.com wrote:@ >> I'll tell you what ... security and reliability and a million? >> lawyers waiting to sue if anything happens to someones money @ >> such as a failed orders taking place because the latest patchA >> of the day had not been installed ... OpenVMS CERT counts when C >> compared with linux tells you why, not to mention it is the gold > >> standard in clustering ... only 9/11 systems to stand where? >> OpenVMS systems ... and no trading company or stock exchange > >> in its right mind would risk massive law suits just to look
 >> trendy ...  >>9 >> http://www.linuxplanet.com/linuxplanet/reports/6027/1/  >  > G > There might soon be a whole generation of people who grew up on linux  > rather than m$.  > I > If you haven't heard about One Laptop Per Child (OLPC) and the The $100  > Laptop project, read this: >  > http://laptop.media.mit.edu/  > I agree with the concept 100%.  Personally, I think that while: building schools and hospitals in Iraq and Afghanistan are= admirable projects, building ubiquitous INTERNET access would < go a lot further towards bringing peace to the region.  Just> like it helped topple the iron-curtain the knowledge spread by? the INTERNET would go a long ways in eliminating the ingnorance > that allows the fanatics to maintain their stranglehold on the people.    bill    --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------   Date: 4 Oct 2005 11:52:57 -0700 - From: "Doug Phillips" <dphill46@netscape.net> 5 Subject: Re: What is holding up linux on wall street? C Message-ID: <1128451977.781906.206430@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   
 -Andy- wrote: 8 > "Doug Phillips" <dphill46@netscape.net> enlightened us > with:  > 8 > > There might soon be a whole generation of people who$ > > grew up on linux rather than m$. > < > That won't necessarily make things any better for the rest
 > of us... > : > > If you haven't heard about One Laptop Per Child (OLPC)/ > > and the The $100 Laptop project, read this:  > >   > > http://laptop.media.mit.edu/ > = > The idea isn't new. For an Indian version see the Simputer:  > # > http://www.simputer.org/simputer/  > 0 > They've been working on it for a couple years. > < > They apparently have actual hardware today (Sure, it looks< > like a PDA but is probably a lot more durable than the MIT% > thing would be). And it runs Linux.     D The kids in the picture are not holding $100LTs. There are some jpegC pictures of the real thing in the link in the left-hand frame. It's D designed to be very rugged and it works like a laptop, not a PDA, so@ children will move easily onto a "real" computer; and they'll be accustomed to Linux.  G I think this project is exciting and if you look at who's behind it now E --- AMD, Brightstar, Google, News Corporation, Red Hat and MIT --- it  just might have a chance.   D I'm not sure how the Chinese plan worked out, but I vaguely remember reading about it.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 18:25:32 -0400) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> 5 Subject: Re: What is holding up linux on wall street? 8 Message-ID: <ijD0f.2124$R4.279890@news20.bellglobal.com>  ' <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in message  = news:1128350972.463035.231450@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com... ? > I'll tell you what ... security and reliability and a million > > lawyers waiting to sue if anything happens to someones money? > such as a failed orders taking place because the latest patch @ > of the day had not been installed ... OpenVMS CERT counts whenB > compared with linux tells you why, not to mention it is the gold= > standard in clustering ... only 9/11 systems to stand where > > OpenVMS systems ... and no trading company or stock exchange= > in its right mind would risk massive law suits just to look  > trendy ... > 8 > http://www.linuxplanet.com/linuxplanet/reports/6027/1/ > J I can't argue with any of your points but would like to add that whatever H security and reliability problems may exist with LINUX, they don't come 3 close to those compared with Windows-based systems.   G On a related note, last month I attended an IEEE tour of a large North  L American RADAR manufacturer and was surprised to see Solaris/SunUltra boxes L built-in to each cabinet. One of the students asked the tour guide why they M used Sun boxes instead of Wintel; the response given was "these are business  G systems needing to be up 24/365 without exposure to other wintel-based  K net-noise like "adware, viruses and worms". The same thing crosses my mind  M every time I see pictures from the JPL mission control room and only see Sun  	 monitors.   I IMHO the OpenVMS marketing people need to do more to promote the OpenVMS  H "UNIX API" from the point of view that "OpenVMS can do UNIX better than K UNIX". They should also educate the business world that "LINUX is only the  K kernel" and everything associated with it is just BSD (see following link). 8 http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,3973,555398,00.aspM Lower initial license costs (traditional "cluster" and "galaxy" licenses are  J still expensive) would help to get OpenVMS back into the corporate world. M I've turned up a few OpenVMS systems for my employer in the past 5 years and  G the IS/IT rank and file were surprised at the lower on-going operating  ? costs; but they are still scared off by the initial s/w prices.   I (to be fair; HP has given my department generous reductions off the list  L price; but most corporate pin-heads still think that LINUX is free and then K so should everything else be; what's weird about this is they don't have a  $ problem shelling out millions to MS)  
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,  Ontario, Canada.8 http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:41:47 GMT  From: bob@instantwhip.com 1 Subject: What is holding up linux on wall street? < Message-ID: <vbG0f.644$R62.400@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  = I'll tell you what ... security and reliability and a million < lawyers waiting to sue if anything happens to someones money= such as a failed orders taking place because the latest patch > of the day had not been installed ... OpenVMS CERT counts when@ compared with linux tells you why, not to mention it is the gold; standard in clustering ... only 9/11 systems to stand where < OpenVMS systems ... and no trading company or stock exchange; in its right mind would risk massive law suits just to look 
 trendy ...  6 http://www.linuxplanet.com/linuxplanet/reports/6027/1/   ------------------------------  $ Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 01:06:06 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> 5 Subject: RE: What is holding up linux on wall street? R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB70C0CF@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----3 > From: Neil Rieck [mailto:n.rieck@sympatico.ca]=20  > Sent: October 4, 2005 6:26 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 7 > Subject: Re: What is holding up linux on wall street?  >=20 >=20+ > <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in message=20 ? > news:1128350972.463035.231450@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com... A > > I'll tell you what ... security and reliability and a million @ > > lawyers waiting to sue if anything happens to someones moneyA > > such as a failed orders taking place because the latest patch B > > of the day had not been installed ... OpenVMS CERT counts whenD > > compared with linux tells you why, not to mention it is the gold? > > standard in clustering ... only 9/11 systems to stand where @ > > OpenVMS systems ... and no trading company or stock exchange? > > in its right mind would risk massive law suits just to look  > > trendy ... > > : > > http://www.linuxplanet.com/linuxplanet/reports/6027/1/ > > @ > I can't argue with any of your points but would like to add=20 > that whatever=20A > security and reliability problems may exist with LINUX, they=20  > don't come=20 5 > close to those compared with Windows-based systems.  >=20	 [snip ..]    Neil,=20  @ Imho, while Windows certainly does have its challenges (I am notG defending in any way) wrt to security, viruses, ad-ware, trojans etc, I ? would not put Linux to much higher on any pedestal. It also has F challenges e.g. 238 *security* (not maint) patches released by Red Hat' since Jan 2005 i.e. this year alone.=20   
 Reference:G https://www.redhat.com/archives/enterprise-watch-list/ (click on thread * for each month and count them up yourself)  F The real scary scenario is I wonder how many Linux devotees were aware( that all these security patches existed?  ? And again, while the roll-out and reboot times can certainly be G expensive, the real challenge is the time and efforts $'s of QA/Testing 5 these patches before they are rolled into production.   B HP supports both Windows and Linux platforms, but one does need to+ recognize the challenges of both platforms.    Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 05:21:26 GMT ' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> 5 Subject: RE: What is holding up linux on wall street? < Message-ID: <qpJ0f.671$R62.574@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   > -----Original Message-----3 > From: Neil Rieck [mailto:n.rieck@sympatico.ca]=20  > Sent: October 4, 2005 6:26 PM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com 7 > Subject: Re: What is holding up linux on wall street?  >=20 >=20+ > <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in message=20 ? > news:1128350972.463035.231450@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com... A > > I'll tell you what ... security and reliability and a million @ > > lawyers waiting to sue if anything happens to someones moneyA > > such as a failed orders taking place because the latest patch B > > of the day had not been installed ... OpenVMS CERT counts whenD > > compared with linux tells you why, not to mention it is the gold? > > standard in clustering ... only 9/11 systems to stand where @ > > OpenVMS systems ... and no trading company or stock exchange? > > in its right mind would risk massive law suits just to look  > > trendy ... > > : > > http://www.linuxplanet.com/linuxplanet/reports/6027/1/ > > @ > I can't argue with any of your points but would like to add=20 > that whatever=20A > security and reliability problems may exist with LINUX, they=20  > don't come=20 5 > close to those compared with Windows-based systems.  >=20	 [snip ..]    Neil,=20  @ Imho, while Windows certainly does have its challenges (I am notG defending in any way) wrt to security, viruses, ad-ware, trojans etc, I ? would not put Linux to much higher on any pedestal. It also has F challenges e.g. 238 *security* (not maint) patches released by Red Hat' since Jan 2005 i.e. this year alone.=20   
 Reference:G https://www.redhat.com/archives/enterprise-watch-list/ (click on thread * for each month and count them up yourself)  F The real scary scenario is I wonder how many Linux devotees were aware( that all these security patches existed?  ? And again, while the roll-out and reboot times can certainly be G expensive, the real challenge is the time and efforts $'s of QA/Testing 5 these patches before they are rolled into production.   B HP supports both Windows and Linux platforms, but one does need to+ recognize the challenges of both platforms.    Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:39:01 GMT  From: bob@instantwhip.com ? Subject: Re: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce? < Message-ID: <V8G0f.600$R62.284@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  E "Although it would be nice, Itanium does not need to be the leader in E latest speeds-n-feeds in order to be successful.  It just needs to be 
 competitive."   4 this is sun logic ... can't compete on the technical3 merits so we will just throw together an 80,000 cpu - box with a million megs of cache and make our / machine competitive ... that is how you help IT 1 progress to new levels ... that is the x86 bandid 5 theory ... only, eventually, you run out of bandaids!    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:38:24 GMT  From: bob@instantwhip.com ; Subject: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce? < Message-ID: <k8G0f.590$R62.584@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  A We all read about all these big vms users so excited that vms was @ moving to an "industry standard" platform ... they all knew thatA itanium wasn't even close to alpha and never will be according to F DEC engineering reports, but they persisted in their idiocy regardless	 .... why?   @ And more importantly, know that they see itanium as the farce it3 is, why are they not demanding alpha startup again?    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:39:08 GMT  From: bob@instantwhip.com ? Subject: Re: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce? < Message-ID: <09G0f.601$R62.466@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  0 and also, that kind of talk sounds like you have- given up ... you have now become what sun and ' IBM and others where when alpha was the 3 leader ... no company with that attitude will never  succeed ... never!   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:39:32 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>? Subject: Re: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce? < Message-ID: <o9G0f.608$R62.215@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   bob@instantwhip.com wrote:G > "Although it would be nice, Itanium does not need to be the leader in G > latest speeds-n-feeds in order to be successful.  It just needs to be  > competitive."  > 6 > this is sun logic ... can't compete on the technical5 > merits so we will just throw together an 80,000 cpu / > box with a million megs of cache and make our 1 > machine competitive ... that is how you help IT 3 > progress to new levels ... that is the x86 bandid 7 > theory ... only, eventually, you run out of bandaids!   D Well, x86 has been "running on bandaids" for years. So I would thinkB that -- based on this reasoning -- this bodes very well indeed for@ Itanium, since Itanium has just pulled out of the starting gate.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:40:43 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>? Subject: Re: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce? < Message-ID: <vaG0f.627$R62.521@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Bill Todd wrote: > AEF wrote: > > Bill Todd wrote: > >  > >>Main, Kerry wrote: > >>  > >>>>-----Original Message-----: > >>>>From: JF Mezei [mailto:jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com]& > >>>>Sent: September 29, 2005 3:03 PM > >>>>To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com E > >>>>Subject: Re: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce?  > >>>> > >>>>"Main, Kerry" wrote: > >>>> > >>>>@ > >>>>>1. Although it would be nice, Itanium does not need to be > >>>> > >>>>the leader in  > >>>> > >>>>@ > >>>>>latest speeds-n-feeds in order to be successful.  It just > >>>> > >>>>needs to be  > >>>> > >>>>K > >>>>>competitive. Heck, Sun has proven that over the years and as slow as  > >>>>>SPARC was,     = OK Bill. Here we have Kerry saying that SPARC was successful.    > >>>> > >>>>J > >>>>There is a big difference here. SPARC was succesfull, considered the    F Here we have JF saying that there is a big difference here, that SPARCB was successful. But that's exactly the same thing that Kerry said.  8 SO HOW CAN THE SAME THING BE DIFFERENT FROM ITSELF? A=A.    ? > >>>>"industry standard" for Unix and was widely regarded as a  > >>>>safe platform. > >>>>L > >>>>IA64 has none of those attributes. It doesn't have an established userJ > >>>>base, it is new and already talk of killing it because it just isn'tK > >>>>what it promised it would be. And more importantly, HP and Intel have G > >>>>already started to cannabalise it by limiting its market niche to K > >>>>supercomputers, and then there is the writing on the wall with the 64 > > >>>>bit 8086 which Intel swore woudl never happen, coming to > >>>>further reduce > >>>>IA64's remaining niche.  > >>>> > >>>  > >>> 1 > >>>Wow, where have you been getting this stuff?  > >>L > >>I'll answer that question just to keep you honest, Kerry - though that's > >>always a difficult task. > >>J > >>"There is a big difference here" indeed, and he goes on to explain it, > >>point by point:  > >>   *****   K > >>"SPARC was successful" - very much so, to the point that it established E > >>a loyal user base large enough to have weathered years of sub-par G > >>performance and still remain the largest single Unix customer base.    *****   C AHA! Here you are agreeing with Kerry. Kerry said it was successful G despite being slow. So how is that different when you are agreeing with  him?????   > >  > > 2 > > Uh, Kerry also said that SPARC was successful. > J > Don't try so hard to be obtuse.  Kerry tried to claim that because SPARCI > was successful despite sub-par performance Itanic could be as well.  JF   D Woah, skip the Itanic part. I just showed above that your own quote,G the one between the *****'s -- WHICH SAYS NOTHING ABOUT ITANIC -- is in B complete agreement with Kerry. Yet both you and JF say it is a bigC difference. Forget the rest. I'm not talking about the Itanic part. A Yes, that part is different. But: BOTH YOU AND JF CLAIM THAT YOUR G AGREEMENT WITH KERRY THAT SUN HAD A SUCCESSFUL PLATFORM, SPARC, DESPITE ? THE FACT THAT SPARC WAS NOT A GREAT PERFORMER, IS SOMEHOW A BIG  DIFFERENCE.   @ And even better, I pointed out in another post how JF's argument becomes anti-circular.    E IOW: Kerry says A, JF says there is a big difference including A. You F reinforce JF's statement that A is different. But A=A! I can't make it any plainer than that.  B I think it's ironic and funny. Maybe you should get IDG's new bookE "Humor for Dummies". You're so angry that you've completely lost your  sense of humor.   B > observed that the situations were totally different:  being veryI > successful (based in part on a history of very competitive performance)   < Ah, finally we see something useful about the SPARC success.  H > is what *allows* a platform to ride through even an extended period ofD > inferiority, and has nothing to do with whether an *unestablished* > platform can do the same.   F So Itanium can't be successful until it's successful. Got it! (Note to Bill: I'm kidding.) :-)   > The bottom line, of course, is: nothing succeeds like success.   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:40:50 GMT $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>? Subject: Re: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce? < Message-ID: <CaG0f.629$R62.549@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>   Bill Todd wrote: > AEF wrote: > H > Nothing worth responding to:  I guess you really are a moron, not just* > someone who occasionally looks like one. >  > - bill    ) Guess what you like. No one really cares.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 22:10:01 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> : Subject: RE: Will "COM for OpenVMS" be ported to Itanium ?R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB70C0C5@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>    -----Original Message----- < > From: Stanley F. Quayle [mailto:squayle@insight.rr.com]=20  > Sent: October 4, 2005 10:32 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com < > Subject: RE: Will "COM for OpenVMS" be ported to Itanium ? >=20+ > On 4 Oct 2005 at 9:15, Main, Kerry wrote: ; > > My understanding (hence, not official) is that since=20  > Microsoft COM isH > > ancient history i.e. legacy, (Microsoft statement), it does not make6 > > much sense to port those legacy pieces to Itanium. >=20C > Ohhh.  This is not good news for a project I've just started. =20 I > There's a control system interface standard call OPC that depends on=20 
 > COM (DCOM).  >=20F > HP's own Basestar OPC product depends on COM.  Did anyone tell them? >=20? > It was on the roadmap a while back -- when did it disappear??  > --Stan Quayle  > Quayle Consulting Inc. >=20  H See Hoff's previous reply on person to contact within HP about using the
 old COM code.    Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 19:44:13 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>8 Subject: Re: [F$GETQUI] How to find all execution queues+ Message-ID: <434321DC.1DD9C0A5@comcast.net>     Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote: > b > In article <4341E649.46E1F68E@comcast.net>, David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> writes:# > >Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote: O > >> I saw a keyword "GENERIC" to F$GETQUI to get a list of all generic queues. N > >> But I don't saw a keyword "EXECUTION" or similar to get all other queues.N > >> Do I have to loop over all queues, check if it's GENERIC and if yes, thenO > >> jump over, or is there a better way (like a keyword I overlooked so far) ?  > > 4 > >Try "PRINTER" or "TERMINAL" instead of "GENERIC". > A > Doesn't meet the requirement as it also shows generic queues...  > J > >                                                   "SYMBIONT" will pickD > >up all execution queues except batch queues, but including server
 > >queues. > J > Yes, "SYMBIONT" is equivalent to "PRINTER,SERVER,TERMINAL" as documented > (and wanted here). >  > No cigar (yet)  ' Huh??? WHat are you looking for then???   G What kinds of execution queues are there other than PRINTER, SERVER and 	 TERMINAL?    From the on-line help...  % DJAS01::DDACHTERA$ help show que /dev    SHOW     QUEUE        /DEVICE   "           /DEVICE[=(keyword-list)]  B        Displays a particular type of queue and jobs in that queue.  ?        Specify the type of device queue with one or more of the         following keywords:  :        PRINTER       Requests the display of print queues.;        SERVER        Requests the display of server queues. =        TERMINAL      Requests the display of terminal queues.   E        You can specify more than one keyword. If you do not specify a E        keyword with the /DEVICE qualifier, all printer, terminal, and #        server queues are displayed.        @ Notice that SYMBIONT is not a valid keyword for /DEVICE=keyword.  D ...or is it that you want a keyword that specifies not only symbiont- queues, but non-generic batch queues as well?    What's wrong with:   $ DSP_QUE := DISPLAY_QUEUE $ QUE_GEN := QUEUE_GENERIC $ FRX_CTX := FREEZE_CONTEXT  	. 	. 	.5 $ GEN_QUE = F$GETQ( DSP_QUE, QUE_GEN, QNAM, FRZ_CTX ) E $ IF GEN_QUE THEN go get the next one	! Skip the non-execution queues    ...?   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 23:29:17 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com ' Subject: Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 - Message-ID: <87fyrhz4fm.fsf@prep.synonet.com>    Z <Z@no.spam> writes:   B > It would be nice if the 3rd party developers of software for VMS> > system took VMS file versions into consideration but few do.   They have, but not as you wish.   F > Or even if VMS's /VERSION_LIMIT=1 meant that a new ;1 would still beE > ;1, not ;2. That would be a clean, simple fix (from my POV, anyway)   I Consider editing a file. Open ;1 for read, open ;2... opps, delete/remove H the currently open ;1, open the NEW ;1. Do you see a small problem here?   If you abort the edit?  H A limit of 3 is probably the smallest reasonable value. 2 works, but has no error margin.   --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 23:32:07 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com ' Subject: Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 - Message-ID: <87br25z4aw.fsf@prep.synonet.com>   4 David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> writes:  C > To continue that, given /VERSION_LIMIT=5, for example, you'd only @ > ever have no more than ;1 through ;5, even if the lastest gets > replaced every day or so.   F Nope, you get ;1, ;2, ;3, ;4, ;5, ;6 stomp on ;1... You only ever haveC a max of 5 files with the version nos `walking' up to the 32K death  limit.     --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 19:22:32 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>' Subject: Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 + Message-ID: <43431CC8.ED1230BB@comcast.net>    prep@prep.synonet.com wrote: > 6 > David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> writes: > E > > To continue that, given /VERSION_LIMIT=5, for example, you'd only B > > ever have no more than ;1 through ;5, even if the lastest gets > > replaced every day or so.  > H > Nope, you get ;1, ;2, ;3, ;4, ;5, ;6 stomp on ;1... You only ever haveE > a max of 5 files with the version nos `walking' up to the 32K death  > limit.  H ...which is why I proposed the new functionality (every time you replaceF the lastes version, the lower versions are automagically renumbered so they always start at ;1).    Where did I lose you?    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 04 Oct 2005 19:24:49 -0500 2 From: David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net>' Subject: Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 + Message-ID: <43431D51.BE9894BD@comcast.net>    prep@prep.synonet.com wrote: >  > Z <Z@no.spam> writes:  > D > > It would be nice if the 3rd party developers of software for VMS@ > > system took VMS file versions into consideration but few do. > ! > They have, but not as you wish.  > H > > Or even if VMS's /VERSION_LIMIT=1 meant that a new ;1 would still beG > > ;1, not ;2. That would be a clean, simple fix (from my POV, anyway)  > K > Consider editing a file. Open ;1 for read, open ;2... opps, delete/remove J > the currently open ;1, open the NEW ;1. Do you see a small problem here?   Not yet.   > If you abort the edit?  H ...you usually leave the original version plus a .JOU file for EDT, or I5 think its a .JNL file for TPU-based editors like EVE.   ( ...unless you're using something else...  J > A limit of 3 is probably the smallest reasonable value. 2 works, but has > no error margin.   It depends.    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/  ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/    Coming soon:& Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page   ------------------------------  $ Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 20:32:21 -0500( From: Wayne Sewell <wayne@tachysoft.com>' Subject: Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 B Message-ID: <1128475969.daf20ead5a01b341af1204bd3ff92421@teranews>  J On 10/04/2005 19:24:49 David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> wrote:    K > ....you usually leave the original version plus a .JOU file for EDT, or I 7 > think its a .JNL file for TPU-based editors like EVE.    .tpu$journal  N And there's a separate one for each file you edit, not just one for the entire session.  M There's also a file called tpu$work.tpu$work, though I am not sure what it is 	 used for.    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:41:39 GMT , From: "Richard Tomkins" <tomkinsr@istop.com>' Subject: Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 < Message-ID: <nbG0f.642$R62.429@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  J On systems that I used to manage at Digital I used to run a batch job thatK walked through various directories during low cpu usage and paired back the ; number of file versions, this on our manufacturing systems.   E On all of our corporate computer systems worldwide, shortly after the J Mitnick incident, we set a corporate standard that set all systems to veryH specific settings for all kinds of things. This was automatically set byL DECInspect and enforced also by the DECInspect tool. As auditing for all theL various settings was turned on, if you changed something that was controlledI without getting prior approval by committee, you usually got a phone call I within the hour asking you what you thought you were doing. Non-compliant I systems, no matter how important they were they could be removed from the H network quite quickly. For file versions, I seem to remember that we set that to 3 maximum.  L Now before you all go big brother on me, we, the System Management communityL in Digital decided that this was the best way to handle the issue of 10's ofH thousands of systems worldwide all being used and managed by people withI extensive skills and others with almost no skills. By setting a Corporate L Standard that defined the base security configuration of all systems, we hadH a vehicle that we could use to set up, manage and modify in a structuredL manner. I came to love the setup, as the standard also identified the actualJ responsible manager that owned each and every system as well as the actualG system manager for each and every system, which made it easy to contact + folks about issues involving their systems.   E FWIW, I remember the cleanup after Mitnick took about 3 days. His DCL J command procedure was poorly writtern and just clogged the network copyingJ useless stuff from system to system, hundreds of times per machine. What a	 dickhead.    rtt     7 "Richard Tomkins" <tomkinsr@istop.com> wrote in message 2 news:1128302982_39851@spool6-east.superfeed.net...C > It will live on around the world forever, even if just in backups 
 somewhere. > H > Once you hit send, the news group posting lands on hundreds of servers. > within seconds and thousands within minutes. > ! > You cannot delete the internet.  >  > : > "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network> wrote in message- > news:55SdnXL-S64Wt93eRVn-3Q@adelphia.com...  > > Alan Greig wrote:  > > > K > > > Drat, I just sent a public reply that was meant to be a reply/sender. L > > > Please pretend you didn't see it if you are on the mailing list or see' > > > it before I cancel it in news :-)  > > G > > As a casualty of pranksters running cancelbots canceling legitimate 4 > > posts, many new servers no longer honor cancels. > > K > > comp.os.vms appears also to be privately archived in many places, and I = > > am not sure how to find all of them for private removals.  > > K > > Apparently if you fill out some web form on google they will remove the . > > copy of your post that they have archived. > > 	 > > -John  > > wb8tyw@qsl.network > > Personal Opinion Only  > >  >  >  > F > ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet
 News==----J > http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+
 NewsgroupsG > ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption  =----       O ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- S http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups K ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 01:41:12 GMT , From: "Richard Tomkins" <tomkinsr@istop.com>' Subject: Re: [OT] - dealing with ;32767 < Message-ID: <YaG0f.635$R62.504@news-virt.s-kddi1.home.ne.jp>  L It will live on around the world forever, even if just in backups somewhere.  F Once you hit send, the news group posting lands on hundreds of servers, within seconds and thousands within minutes.   You cannot delete the internet.     8 "John E. Malmberg" <wb8tyw@qsl.network> wrote in message+ news:55SdnXL-S64Wt93eRVn-3Q@adelphia.com...  > Alan Greig wrote:  > > I > > Drat, I just sent a public reply that was meant to be a reply/sender. J > > Please pretend you didn't see it if you are on the mailing list or see% > > it before I cancel it in news :-)  > E > As a casualty of pranksters running cancelbots canceling legitimate 2 > posts, many new servers no longer honor cancels. > I > comp.os.vms appears also to be privately archived in many places, and I ; > am not sure how to find all of them for private removals.  > I > Apparently if you fill out some web form on google they will remove the , > copy of your post that they have archived. >  > -John  > wb8tyw@qsl.network > Personal Opinion Only  >       O ----== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com - Unlimited-Uncensored-Secure Usenet News==---- S http://www.newsfeeds.com The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! 120,000+ Newsgroups K ----= East and West-Coast Server Farms - Total Privacy via Encryption =----    ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2005.555 ************************