1 INFO-VAX	Wed, 28 Sep 2005	Volume 2005 : Issue 541       Contents:. BZIP2 (1.0.3) v. VMS -- yet another adaptation4 Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs4 Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs4 Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobsH Re: HP will have to give back 1.25 M EUR help that it got to createjobs. Jump to console ?  Re: My DS20e Memory Upgrade / Re: OT: Military killer dolphins on the loose ! > Re: UAF-W-IDOUTRNG, identifier value is not within legal range> Re: UAF-W-IDOUTRNG, identifier value is not within legal range( Re: Upgrade path AS500/333 to AS500/500?( Re: Upgrade path AS500/333 to AS500/500?3 Re: VAX8350 Power Supply (H7251/H7253) problems.... % Re: VMS 4.6/4.7 Local Area VAXcluster  Why won't HP send me VMS 8.2? ! Re: Why won't HP send me VMS 8.2?   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 21:48:50 -0500 (CDT) * From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)7 Subject: BZIP2 (1.0.3) v. VMS -- yet another adaptation 2 Message-ID: <05092721485030_20248F02@antinode.org>  B    I recently wanted to unpack some bit of freeware which had beenG compressed using the increasingly popular "bzip2" program, and, like an H idiot, I started looking at the bzip2 code when I should have been doing- something useful.  (It _says_ it's portable.)   D    I'm not thrilled with the result, but it should have the same I/OH speed improvements as the recent Info-ZIP [Un]Zip programs, along with a? few other potentially useful changes.  As it seems to be pretty F CPU-intense, you might not notice much of a change on a slow machine. G To be honest, the I/O code is so simple that I didn't notice any effect H when I enabled the optional large-file support (non-VAX, of course), butF I can't guarantee that it doesn't make some difference in some case or( other.  It seems to be harmless, anyway.  A    Anyone who's (or, as this is comp.os.vms, perhaps I should say E "whose" or "whoose") desperate for amusement might wish to look into:   $       http://antinode.org/ftp/bzip2/       ftp://antinode.org/bzip2/   D The Zip (-V) archive there is source-only, not well tested, and withE changes only minimally documented, and it comes with no more warranty ? than the original code kit (which is less than any).  As usual, A complaints are welcome, as are odious comparisons with some other - (slap-dash) VMS adaptation of the same stuff.   H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  4    Steven M. Schweda               (+1) 651-699-98183    382 South Warwick Street        sms@antinode-org     Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 19:18:56 GMT % From: The Michael <MikeL@ibehere.not> = Subject: Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs 9 Message-ID: <Xns96DE91A043111rdpleitduina@207.115.63.158>   F On Sat 24 Sep 2005 05:48:52p, Frank wrote in news:lJkZe.13323$GQ4.7903 @fed1read05: > What's an "idot"?  > Frank   ? Must be a bureaucrat.  (Illinois Department of Transportation)         --   Mike   ------------------------------    Date: 27 Sep 2005 14:13:09 -0700- From: "Doug Phillips" <dphill46@netscape.net> = Subject: Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs C Message-ID: <1127855589.362320.257290@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   
 AEF wrote: > JF Mezei wrote: H > > same as those of a truck (SUV). Once car manufacturers start to pushL > > fuel efficient cars through their marketing machines, americans will buyI > > what the marketing tells them to buy. And the USA will have instantly  > . > Such magic marketing only works for Windows. > K > > become far more fuel efficient since cars are such an important part of   > > fuel consumption in the USA. > >   = Cars are a necessity in most of the US because there is *not* F sufficient public transporation. Anyone who has spent much time seeingF this country understands why that is. Europeans who have never been to@ the US, or who've only been to major-metro areas, probably don't understand.   G > > In fact, americans would save money by buying smaller cars (cost of F > > purchase) as well as much lower fuel expenses for the smaller cars' > > compared to Hummers and other SUVs.  >  > Duh. >   E People buy what they need if they can afford it. If you live where it C snows a lot in winter; you have kids to haul around; you own a home E that always has something that needs repair (and what home doesn't?), F then a 4WD Carry-All (aka SUV) is a very practicle vehicle to own. YouA pay for the extra cost of fuel by cutting back on something else.   F Or, If you can afford the insurance, you could have a 4WD mini-van for@ Mom, a smaller fuel-efficient car for Dad to drive to work and a. pick-up truck for doing your homeowner chores.  F BTW, seeing a Hummer on the road is still a rare sight in the places IE drive. I keep reading "Hummers and other SUV's" like there's a Hummer E at every intersection. Maybe where you live, but I only see a few and A not too often. I definitely see more Toyota and Ford hybrids than A Hummers. Whenever someone builds a fuel efficient vehicle that is > reasonably priced and does the job people need, people buy it.  K > > In terms of Co2 trading: consider a large country. You have a polluting A > > power plant in one area and you have pristine areas where the " > > electricity is being consumed. > > K > > The pristine area generate far less CO2 than the target, so it can sell K > > its CO2 credits to the power plant which essentially averages the total K > > output. The revenus the community gets from selling its CO2 credits are K > > used to compensate for the higher electricity rates for since the power D > > company has to bill customers for the CO2 credits it has to buy. > E > This is why I favor a simple carbon tax. This avoids the shell-game E > shenanigans while minimizing the wasting of effort (money). You let G > everyone pollute as much as they want, but they have to pay a tax per E > unit of carbon emitted. Then, efficient plants pay little or no tax D > whilst inefficient plants have incentive to clean up. It works outG > great! Each company calculates the amount of pollution they emit that F > minimizes the costs. If the results are not satisfactory, you adjust
 > the tax. >   = The carbon tax is maybe a good idea. It would need to be done F zero-based on each individual plant rather than on a minimum allowable= average for the provider, and that might have trouble getting  legislated.    > [...]  > > G > > Consider what happens to the USA economy when the rest of the world G > > decides not to trade with countries that do not sign Kyoto.  Russia  > % > This looks like Doomsday FUD to me.     D Looks just plain silly to me. How likely is it that "the rest of the& world" would ever agree on *anything*?  L > > ratified pretty quickly when it was told it needed to do so if it wanted > > to export to Europe. > > > And when Russia reneges on its promise, what will Europe do?  E Indeed. Wait, is Europe united again? I haven't read tomorrow's paper  yet:-))    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 03:11:13 GMT  From: kashe@sonic.net = Subject: Re: France keeps up pressure on Hewlett-Packard jobs 8 Message-ID: <ed2kj1tvgscuj3iub5bdqsns83df80fp3p@4ax.com>  F On Mon, 26 Sep 2005 15:29:49 -0400, Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> wrote:  . >David Turner, Island Computers US Corp wrote: >> Bill  >>   >> I am English - not American > J >Thank God for small favors:  we have far too many jingoistic ignoramuses  >like you as it is.  > K >> But I have several members of Family in UK and in the US by marriage who # >> died fighting Germany in France.  > > >As I already observed, the American GIs in that lot died not H >'protecting' France (they were sent *long* after France had been taken   - 	But without them, it would have been "kept".   H >and not as a result of that occupation but rather as a result of Japan G >bombing Pearl Harbor and then Germany declaring war on us) but during  G >the general effort to prevent Germany and its allies from taking over  J >the *rest* of the world (and/or to prevent the Russians from doing so if F >we didn't help take some of it back ourselves:  the Russians were of 5 >course well on the way back West long before D-Day).  >  >> Enough said.  > : >Apparently not, since you're still laboring under severe   >misapprehensions about history. > ? >  Granted Japan was a decider but remember those Liberty ships . >> carrying all kinds of equipment to Britain. > D >No "GI's lives were taken protecting France" on those ships either. >  >> Or did I just imagine that? > I >No, you just imagined that it somehow supported your previous drivel in   >this area.  >  >- bill    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 21:15:13 -0400 ) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> Q Subject: Re: HP will have to give back 1.25 M EUR help that it got to createjobs. 9 Message-ID: <s8m_e.5722$cq2.561080@news20.bellglobal.com>   E "Z" <Z@no.spam> wrote in message news:MroZe.7958$845.2024@fe03.lga...  > Bill Todd wrote:L >>>> Non capisco. Are you saying that business in the U.S. *CAN* be trusted?+ >>>> Ever heard of "Enron"? ..."Tyco"? ...?  > 5 >>> Ever hear "the exception doesn't prove the rule?"  > K >> What specific evidence (as distinct from personal bias) makes you think  F >> that these constituted exceptions rather than merely slightly more M >> egregious examples of regrettably common corporate behavior and attitudes   >> these days? >  > The quantity, obviously. > I > Yes, Tyco and Enron are egregious examples of corporate crime, but its  I > wrong for you to tar the whole of Corporate America with no supporting   > evidence at all. >  > That's just not fair, Bill.  >  > L >> It's going to be a pretty close race between politicians and CEOs to see K >> which can take us to the bottom first.  But in both cases the fact that  I >> we (as voters or customers/stockholders) have a great deal of control  D >> over the situation means that we'll have only ourselves to blame. > J > Yes, yes, I know ... the whole nation is going to Hell in a handbasket, M > the sky is falling and the end of the world is near. You'll have to excuse  4 > me if I don't drink from that pitcher of Kool Aid.   So who is the mysterious Z ?  I Rush Limbaugh? Bill O'Reilly? Karl Rove? Chopper owner in "Pulp Fiction"?    Neil   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 21:14:01 -0700  From: Z <Z@no.spam>  Subject: Jump to console ?) Message-ID: <dMo_e.2443$hw2.726@fe02.lga>   G After power down/power up, our ES40 shows "jump to console" on the LED   display.   What does this mean?   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 20:50:24 -0400 ) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> $ Subject: Re: My DS20e Memory Upgrade9 Message-ID: <bNl_e.5709$cq2.555023@news20.bellglobal.com>   5 "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> wrote in message  2 news:3LWZe.746$l03.156874@news20.bellglobal.com...J > They always tell you to do the east stuff first so that's what I did; I M > convinced my boss to spend less than C$1k on a 1 GB memory upgrade and now  L > our AlphaServer DS20e. We average ~ 80 interactive sessions (green screen F > apps via WRQ-Reflection), ~ 10 batch jobs, ~ 10 web sessions all on 1 > OpenVMS 7.3-1 and the now the system is FLYING!  > L > p.s. We only had 1 GB before but now we seem to have that much sitting in 	 > the XFC  >  > Neil Rieck > Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,  > Ontario, Canada.: > http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html > L It looks like SYSGEN has set up the XFC to have a maximum size of 1 GB (one L half of our 2 GB main memory). The cache read hit rate is almost always 99% K for most of the day until 13:00 when the OS and our apps take back some of  J this memory. About 30 minutes after that, the system settles down and the  XFC grows back to 1 GB.   1 This is really neat.Kudos to OpenVMS Engineering.   
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,  Ontario, Canada.8 http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 19:19:56 +0000 (UTC) . From: klewis@LUMINA.MITRE.ORG (Keith A. Lewis)8 Subject: Re: OT: Military killer dolphins on the loose !. Message-ID: <dhc60s$hb5$1@newslocal.mitre.org>   JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes in article <43389AF3.5D969B32@teksavvy.com> dated Mon, 26 Sep 2005 21:06:24 -0400: J >http://observer.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,6903,1577753,00.html > A >Katrina allegedly set loose some military dolphins equipped with I >weapons. They are allegedly roaming in the Gulf of mexico and trained to 3 >hunt down humans in wet suits. Surfers beware !!!!   H JF, don't you have better newsgroups to troll with these speculations?    L This is comp.os.vms, a tech newsgroup.  If you post something about Opteron,J use OT.  But if you come across a story about killer kangaroos or a reallyL good joke, maybe you should consider putting it in rec.humor instead.  We're7 computer experts here, we know how to use the Internet.   0 --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.org> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 18:52:28 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) G Subject: Re: UAF-W-IDOUTRNG, identifier value is not within legal range 2 Message-ID: <Mxg_e.13294$kY.1040@news.cpqcorp.net>  G In article <43394e2f$1@news1.ethz.ch>, S <soterroatyahoodotcom> writes: H :I wonder what is that HP new AUTHORIZE.EXE doing: allows REVOKE revoke @ :the thing (and maybe forces the standard integer range only to I :identifier ADD) or forbids GRANT to grant it (and breaks the use of all  3 :those existing identifiers). I bet on the first...   I   There are and always have been reserved ranges of identifiers, and this E   one is within said range, and there is (obviously) an inconsistency E   within how the various tools enforce the reserved identifier range.   C   The AUTHORIZE engineer is aware of this (or a very similar) case.   I   There is a second-level administrative matter that the original problem =   report surfaced that are under some investigation, as well.   G   I don't know the plans nor the schedule for an ECO, if any, off-hand.   N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------    Date: 27 Sep 2005 16:03:55 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) G Subject: Re: UAF-W-IDOUTRNG, identifier value is not within legal range 3 Message-ID: <iznM03zIBEEE@eisner.encompasserve.org>   X In article <Mxg_e.13294$kY.1040@news.cpqcorp.net>, hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) writes:I > In article <43394e2f$1@news1.ethz.ch>, S <soterroatyahoodotcom> writes: J > :I wonder what is that HP new AUTHORIZE.EXE doing: allows REVOKE revoke B > :the thing (and maybe forces the standard integer range only to K > :identifier ADD) or forbids GRANT to grant it (and breaks the use of all  5 > :those existing identifiers). I bet on the first...  > K >   There are and always have been reserved ranges of identifiers, and this G >   one is within said range, and there is (obviously) an inconsistency G >   within how the various tools enforce the reserved identifier range.  > E >   The AUTHORIZE engineer is aware of this (or a very similar) case.  > K >   There is a second-level administrative matter that the original problem ? >   report surfaced that are under some investigation, as well.  > I >   I don't know the plans nor the schedule for an ECO, if any, off-hand.   > But since this is enforced in AUTHORIZE, one can write a local program to do the same thing.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 20:47:32 +0200 & From: "H Vlems" <nospam@what.ever.com>1 Subject: Re: Upgrade path AS500/333 to AS500/500? < Message-ID: <a0a98$43399480$513b9a2c$26449@news.versatel.nl>  9 "Mark Daniel" <mark.daniel@vsm.com.au> schreef in bericht ) news:43397ca3$1@duster.adelaide.on.net... + > I'll stick my neck out .. is it possible?  > 8 > Presuming I have the 500Mhz CPUs - 21-43918-44 / 21164 >  > Currently: >  > Digital AlphaStation 500/333   [snip]   >  > As always, TIA.  > H > +--------------------------------------------------------------------+G >   Mark Daniel                         http://wasd.vsm.com.au/adelaide H >   mailto:Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au (Mark.Daniel@dsto.defence.gov.au)= >   A pox on the houses of all SPAMers.  Make that two poxes. H > +--------------------------------------------------------------------+ >    Mark,   H Not sure what you want to do, replace the cpu module (board) or just the chip. L If you have the appropriate CPU board it is certainly possible. I upgraded aL Digital Server 3300 5/400 to an Alpha Server 800 5/500 that way. If you planH to upgrade the processor only then you very likely need to have hardware/ documentation. If it is possible to start with.    Hans   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 06:28:41 +0930 * From: Mark Daniel <mark.daniel@vsm.com.au>1 Subject: Re: Upgrade path AS500/333 to AS500/500? / Message-ID: <4339b2a3$1@duster.adelaide.on.net>     Unfortunately just the CPU chip.   H Vlems wrote:; > "Mark Daniel" <mark.daniel@vsm.com.au> schreef in bericht + > news:43397ca3$1@duster.adelaide.on.net...  > + >>I'll stick my neck out .. is it possible?  >>8 >>Presuming I have the 500Mhz CPUs - 21-43918-44 / 21164 >> >>Currently: >> >>Digital AlphaStation 500/333 >  >  > [snip] >  >  >>As always, TIA.  >>H >>+--------------------------------------------------------------------+G >>  Mark Daniel                         http://wasd.vsm.com.au/adelaide H >>  mailto:Mark.Daniel@wasd.vsm.com.au (Mark.Daniel@dsto.defence.gov.au)= >>  A pox on the houses of all SPAMers.  Make that two poxes. H >>+--------------------------------------------------------------------+ >> >  >  > Mark,  > J > Not sure what you want to do, replace the cpu module (board) or just the > chip. N > If you have the appropriate CPU board it is certainly possible. I upgraded aN > Digital Server 3300 5/400 to an Alpha Server 800 5/500 that way. If you planJ > to upgrade the processor only then you very likely need to have hardware1 > documentation. If it is possible to start with.  >  > Hans   ------------------------------  % Date: Wed, 28 Sep 2005 02:34:37 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com < Subject: Re: VAX8350 Power Supply (H7251/H7253) problems....- Message-ID: <87d5muz7eq.fsf@prep.synonet.com>    bob@jfcl.com writes:  6 >>An 8350, sigh, you're running VMS V5.0 on it, right?  F >   Ha - I wish!  I didn't get any disks with it, although I do have aF > KDB50 so if I can coax some life out of the machine there exists theF > possibility that I might someday be able to install VMS.  I've got a5 > few RA8x drives around, so that won't be a problem.   = >   If I do I'll probably use some flavor of VMS 5.x.  Do you  > recommend something else?   ? 5.5-2 plus a patch pile would be good, but it still had the SCS  problem I think...     --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 19:22:23 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) . Subject: Re: VMS 4.6/4.7 Local Area VAXcluster2 Message-ID: <PZg_e.13298$kY.6108@news.cpqcorp.net>  x In article <1127835778.897259.214170@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "vaxorcist" <hoelscher-kirchbrak@freenet.de> writes:J :> Generally, a VMS 4.x era "license key" is a tape containing some bit of& :> software that is otherwise missing. : = :Yes, there was a kind of crude license mangement in VMS 4.x:  :  :- Software missing 9 :- Software patched to reduce functionality (e.g. DECnet)  :- Software in encrypted form ? :  (e.g. Cluster driver or Multi-processor support for VAX8xxx)  : A :So, anyone with old LAVC-VMS 4.x backup tapes out there, please?  :Or the genuine 'License Kit'?  C   FWIW, I received clearance to distribute the old V4.* DECnet keys A   via the Freeware a while back, for those folks that are looking    for them.   C   IIRC, most folks that used the first Local Area VAXcluster (LAVc) B   configurations here tended to use (as it was then known) VAX/VMS?   V4.7A -- and not V4.7 nor V4.6, whether VMS or MicroVMS -- as 4   VAX/VMS V4.7A had all the necessary bits built-in.  C   I've not asked for permission to distribute other old keys -- the B   LAVc key might even have been version-dependent, too.  (That theD   old DECnet key was not was even mildly interesting -- very mildly,   I might add -- to me.)  N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------    Date: 27 Sep 2005 14:00:47 -07001 From: nothome@spammers.are.scum (Malcolm Dunnett) & Subject: Why won't HP send me VMS 8.2?, Message-ID: <SxRRRQ4M0bW2@malvm9.mala.bc.ca>  4  Up until last March I subscribed to the QL-MT3AA-H81 (OVMS Alpha+VAX Bin+OL Doc CD) service and always ) received VMS updates in a timely fashion. / In April of this year I switched to part number 4 QA-5FX8A-A8 (OpenVMS Alpha Software Layered Products4 and Operating System Library) since I no longer have1 any VAX systems and it was cheaper to get the O/S - and layered products in the same kit. Or so I  thought ...   + I continue to receive the quarterly layered / product distributions but I've never received a , copy of VMS 8.2 ( which was released after I, changed part numbers ). When I questioned HP. about this they indicated I wasn't entitled to4 O/S distributions under this new part number ( which. seems to fly in the face of the description of. the part number which says "complete Operating- System kit". I pointed out this inconsistancy 0 to them a week ago but have heard nothing since.  3 I guess what I'm asking for is a reality check, can 0 someone out there confirm that they subscribe to1 QA-5FX8A-A8 and that they have received a VMS 8.2 0 distribution ( the approximate date you received3 it would be helpful too ). Or, have I misunderstood + the phrase "Complete Operating system kit"?    Thanks in advance.        ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 27 Sep 2005 21:03:37 -0400 ) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> * Subject: Re: Why won't HP send me VMS 8.2?9 Message-ID: <AZl_e.5715$cq2.558495@news20.bellglobal.com>   ? "Malcolm Dunnett" <nothome@spammers.are.scum> wrote in message  & news:SxRRRQ4M0bW2@malvm9.mala.bc.ca... > 5 > Up until last March I subscribed to the QL-MT3AA-H8 3 > (OVMS Alpha+VAX Bin+OL Doc CD) service and always + > received VMS updates in a timely fashion. 1 > In April of this year I switched to part number 6 > QA-5FX8A-A8 (OpenVMS Alpha Software Layered Products6 > and Operating System Library) since I no longer have3 > any VAX systems and it was cheaper to get the O/S / > and layered products in the same kit. Or so I 
 > thought ...  > - > I continue to receive the quarterly layered 1 > product distributions but I've never received a . > copy of VMS 8.2 ( which was released after I. > changed part numbers ). When I questioned HP0 > about this they indicated I wasn't entitled to6 > O/S distributions under this new part number ( which0 > seems to fly in the face of the description of0 > the part number which says "complete Operating/ > System kit". I pointed out this inconsistancy 2 > to them a week ago but have heard nothing since. > 5 > I guess what I'm asking for is a reality check, can 2 > someone out there confirm that they subscribe to3 > QA-5FX8A-A8 and that they have received a VMS 8.2 2 > distribution ( the approximate date you received5 > it would be helpful too ). Or, have I misunderstood - > the phrase "Complete Operating system kit"?  >  > Thanks in advance. > < I currently receive 8.2 and subscribe to this kit "QA-5G98A"  4 http://h71000.www7.hp.com/openvms/os/swroll/spl.html  & http://www1.sqp.com/SPLofferings.shtml  
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,  Ontario, Canada.8 http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2005.541 ************************