1 INFO-VAX	Thu, 29 Sep 2005	Volume 2005 : Issue 544       Contents:& Re: Alpha DB9 to DECserver RJ45 cable?& Re: Alpha DB9 to DECserver RJ45 cable?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?0 Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How?) Re: DISCONNECT a process other than mine? ) Re: DISCONNECT a process other than mine?  Re: HP's strategy explained :  Re: HP's strategy explained :  Re: HP's strategy explained :  Re: HP's strategy explained :  Re: Jump to console ? 6 Re: Layoffs at HP : MH needs your suggestions or ideas' Match-Maker wanted - Oz positions on go  Multiple X servers?  Re: Multiple X servers?  Re: SC008/Star Couplers. Re: SC008/Star Couplers. Re: see anybody you know?  Re: see anybody you know?  Re: see anybody you know?  Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! RE: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Re: Time to produce EV79s! Vamp Hacked! Re: Vamp Hacked! Re: Vamp Hacked!2 Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce?6 RE: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce?6 Re: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce?A [OpenVMS V7.3-2] SYSGEN> SHOW EXPECTED_VOTES vs SDA> SHOW CLUSTER E Re: [OpenVMS V7.3-2] SYSGEN> SHOW EXPECTED_VOTES vs SDA> SHOW CLUSTER   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------    Date: 28 Sep 2005 23:25:31 -0700& From: "Bart Zorn" <bartzorn@yahoo.com>/ Subject: Re: Alpha DB9 to DECserver RJ45 cable? C Message-ID: <1127975131.660218.168140@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>   G I am using H8585-AA adapters and standard RJ45 cables for that purpose.    HTH,  	 Bart Zorn    ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 12:26:49 -05002 From: kaplow_r@encompasserve.org.mars (Bob Kaplow)/ Subject: Re: Alpha DB9 to DECserver RJ45 cable? 3 Message-ID: <Oo1qH6KEjzus@eisner.encompasserve.org>   Z In article <S0D_e.13394$RG1.12310@news.cpqcorp.net>, hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) writes:E > :Is there an appropriate adapter that will work with a standard (or B > :crossover) network cable? Is the H8584-AC what I'm looking for? > F >   All DECconnect wires are the same, AFAIK.  The necessary wiring isE >   all located within the adapters at each end of the BC16E cabling.   G Whoops, typo. What I meant to ask about is the H8585-AA which is DB9 to  RJ45, not MMJ.   --  O   Bob Kaplow   NAR # 18L   >>> To reply, there's no internet on Mars (yet)! <<< E Kaplow Klips & Baffle:	http://nira-rocketry.org/Document/MayJun00.pdf L     www.encompasserve.org/~kaplow_r/    www.nira-rocketry.org    www.nar.org  @         You [should] not examine legislation in the light of theD         benefits it will convey if properly administered, but in theF         light of the wrongs it would do and the harm it would cause ifF         improperly administered -- Lyndon Johnson, former President of         the U.S.   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 05:09:42 -0700# From: "H Vlems" <hvlems@freenet.de> 9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? B Message-ID: <1127995782.636162.22470@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>  C This kind of up/down pattern is what you got when heartbeat was not B enabled on a transceiver when it was needed (or vice versa). SVA-0A indicates a microVAX or VAXstation 3100 kind of system. It wasn't E fitted with an external transceiver, was it? These older systems have D AUI and thinwire, no support for UTP; an external transceiver solvesG that problem but the heartbeat switch (or SEQ or squelch) may be in the  wrong position.    Two other possibilities:D - the system is on an ethernet segment with a *lot* of traffic (LAVc/ clusters, lots of ethertalk or netbeui clients) G - the system was accidentally converted from an endnode to a router and - does not have the appropriate DECnet license.    Hans   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 07:32:49 -0700$ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? C Message-ID: <1128004369.768012.272660@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    Hoff Hoffman wrote: l > In article <1127938795.354636.197410@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> writes: > < > :How can a node drop itself? See below. What does it mean? >  >   No answers.  Sorry.  >  >   Some questions, however... > / >   What is connected onto the SVA-0 port here?   ; Other MicroVAX 3100's, mostly model 80's, but 3 model 95's.    NODE_F model 95  NODE_X model 80  NODE_Y model 80     C >   Is this box an end-node, a level one router, or an area router?    NODE_X is a router NODE_Y is an end node  NODE_F is a router   We have no area routers.  " >   What is your network topology?   These are on a VLAN in London.  F We have 2 DNIP tunnels, one from NYC to London and another from NYC to9 Hong Kong. NODE_X is one end of the NYC to London tunnel.    > > >   Does this box have more than one network connection to the0 >   same or to the same bridged network segment? > E >   What versions of DECnet and OpenVMS (and ECOs) are involved here?    NODE_F: VMS 6.1  NODE_X: VMS 6.2  NODE_Y: VMS 6.1    All have  6 Identification           = DECnet for OpenVMS VAX V6.1! Management version       = V4.0.0  Incoming timer           = 45  Outgoing timer           = 60 " Incoming Proxy           = Enabled" Outgoing Proxy           = Enabled! NSP version              = V4.1.0  Maximum links            = 256 Delay factor             = 80  Delay weight             = 5 Inactivity timer         = 60  Retransmit factor        = 10 ! Routing version          = V2.0.0      >   One guess: > B >   Network cabling problems (cable shorts, too little or too muchC >   termination on ThinWire or thick wire, etc) and controller (and C >   the transceiver, for those NICs that use one) hardware problems ' >   can cause DECnet circuits to yo-yo.     E Well, most of the time things are fine. I was curious, however, how a E node can drop itself?! There may be some off-hours work being done in E our London data center (I'm located in NYC) as they are preparing for % relocation to another site in London.   , Please let me know if you require more info.   Thanks!    ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 07:35:22 -0700$ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? C Message-ID: <1128004522.682818.200010@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    H Vlems wrote:E > This kind of up/down pattern is what you got when heartbeat was not D > enabled on a transceiver when it was needed (or vice versa). SVA-0C > indicates a microVAX or VAXstation 3100 kind of system. It wasn't G > fitted with an external transceiver, was it? These older systems have   8 Yes. All my MicroVAX systems have external transceivers.  F > AUI and thinwire, no support for UTP; an external transceiver solvesI > that problem but the heartbeat switch (or SEQ or squelch) may be in the  > wrong position.  >  > Two other possibilities:F > - the system is on an ethernet segment with a *lot* of traffic (LAVc1 > clusters, lots of ethertalk or netbeui clients)   " It was off hours, so probably not.  I > - the system was accidentally converted from an endnode to a router and / > does not have the appropriate DECnet license.   D Licenses are okay. This is the first time I've ever seen a node that+ dropped itself! How can a node drop itself?    Thanks.  >  > Hans   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 07:36:47 -0700$ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? C Message-ID: <1128004607.702558.166440@g47g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    Chris Moore wrote:J > Is there a PhaseIV router on the network at all?  If everybody is an EndD > Node , adjacencies can get mucked up big-time, if they work at all  * Nope. NODE_F and NODE_X are routing nodes.  2 Also, most of the time everything is running fine.   >  > 1 > "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> wrote in message ? > news:1127938795.354636.197410@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... 
 > > Hello, > > = > > How can a node drop itself? See below. What does it mean?  > > < > > %%%%%%%%%%%  OPCOM  25-SEP-2005 19:12:12.76  %%%%%%%%%%%& > > Message from user DECNET on NODE_X% > > DECnet event 4.18, adjacency down 6 > > >From node 1.218 (NODE_X), 25-SEP-2005 19:12:12.72K > > Circuit SVA-0, Dropped by adjacent node, Adjacent node = 1.218 (NODE_X)  > > < > > %%%%%%%%%%%  OPCOM  25-SEP-2005 19:12:12.76  %%%%%%%%%%%& > > Message from user DECNET on NODE_X# > > DECnet event 4.15, adjacency up 6 > > >From node 1.218 (NODE_X), 25-SEP-2005 19:12:12.731 > > Circuit SVA-0, Adjacent node = 1.218 (NODE_X)  > >  [...]    ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 08:01:24 -0700$ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? C Message-ID: <1128006084.122250.195400@g49g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   
 AEF wrote: > Hoff Hoffman wrote: n > > In article <1127938795.354636.197410@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> writes: > > > > > :How can a node drop itself? See below. What does it mean? > >  > >   No answers.  Sorry.  > >   > >   Some questions, however... > >  [...] G > >   What versions of DECnet and OpenVMS (and ECOs) are involved here?  >  > NODE_F: VMS 6.1  > NODE_X: VMS 6.2  > NODE_Y: VMS 6.1   E Oops! I forgot the ECO kits. On the 6.1 systems we have applied (long  ago)  
 VAXNETA02_061   ! We applied this to get rid of the   ;     Phase IV node exists in the absence of bilingual router   % messages we started getting one day.     [...]    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 16:37:48 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman) 9 Subject: Re: DECnet phase IV node drops itself. Why? How? 4 Message-ID: <wLU_e.13463$Vf2.11453@news.cpqcorp.net>  j In article <1128004369.768012.272660@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> writes: :Hoff Hoffman wrote:m :> In article <1127938795.354636.197410@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> writes:  ..0 :>   What is connected onto the SVA-0 port here? : < :Other MicroVAX 3100's, mostly model 80's, but 3 model 95's.  =   You're using the integrated NIC on the MicroVAX 3100, then. ;   (There are various pieces of hardware that use the DECnet    SVA interface.)   @   As for the question, I was refering to the controller hardwareB   and the hardware immediately hanging off the controller, as well?   as any bridges, switches, hubs, repeaters or terminators that    might be in use here.     D :>   Is this box an end-node, a level one router, or an area router? :  :NODE_X is a router   ;   Is there more than one circuit connection on these hosts? =   (On a MicroVAX 3100 series box, that would be comparatively /   unusual -- but there are ways to achieve it.)    :These are on a VLAN in London.   D   So there is some comparatively unusual hardware within the network2   here -- these systems are not locally connected.  G :We have 2 DNIP tunnels, one from NYC to London and another from NYC to : :Hong Kong. NODE_X is one end of the NYC to London tunnel.  B   So there could easily be a problem within the connection between   the hosts.  C   Are the VLAN devices (bridges or routers, I assume) reporting any    connectivity errors?    ? :>   Does this box have more than one network connection to the 1 :>   same or to the same bridged network segment?   B   I'll repeat: does this box have more than one network connection=   to the same or to the same bridged network segment?  DECnet B   Phase IV does not like that, and will generate errors -- usuallyA   IVADDR invalid media address errors IIRC, but things can and do -   get strange when the node can "see" itself.   F :>   What versions of DECnet and OpenVMS (and ECOs) are involved here? :  :NODE_F: VMS 6.1 :NODE_X: VMS 6.2 :NODE_Y: VMS 6.1  9   Old, obviously.  No hope of upgrades or ECOs, I assume.   D ::>   Network cabling problems (cable shorts, too little or too muchE ::>   termination on ThinWire or thick wire, etc) and controller (and E ::>   the transceiver, for those NICs that use one) hardware problems ) ::>   can cause DECnet circuits to yo-yo.  :: ::G ::Well, most of the time things are fine. I was curious, however, how a G ::node can drop itself?! There may be some off-hours work being done in G ::our London data center (I'm located in NYC) as they are preparing for ' ::relocation to another site in London.   C   When the network connection becomes unstable due to faults within B   the cabling, the VLAN (in this case), or a hardware problem, the"   host can and will report errors.  A   Messing about within a network can most certainly trigger these C   errors -- this is why I have been asking about connectivity here.       N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 11:17:12 +0200 3 From: "Gorazd Kikelj" <gorazd.kikelj@nospam.hp.com> 2 Subject: Re: DISCONNECT a process other than mine?, Message-ID: <433bb119$1@usenet01.boi.hp.com>  % With keepalive settings in TCP stack?   
 Best, Gorazd     ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 12:36:07 -05002 From: kaplow_r@encompasserve.org.mars (Bob Kaplow)2 Subject: Re: DISCONNECT a process other than mine?3 Message-ID: <tZ0ZBwyBR0Kz@eisner.encompasserve.org>   m In article <SsE_e.13408$DN1.7198@news.cpqcorp.net>, John Malmberg <malmberg@dskwld.zko.dec.compaq.hp> writes: K > The Telnet sessions seem to notice that a connection is broken when they  J > have characters send to the now non-existent connection, and are unable 1 > to complete the sending in some timeout period.  > J > Causing a broadcast message to go to the hung terminal session seems to > > eventually work on Encompasserve to speed the process along.  F I'm aware of that, but in this case, the link wasn't broken. The usersJ screen saver locked the session, and they blew their password enough timesI to get locked out. No one was around at the time with enough LAN privs to 	 fix this.   E > Since I do not have any privileges on that machine, I use Phone to  " > generate the broadcast messages.  L I'll keep that in mind, as encompasserve is one of the places I've needed to9 force a broken link to disconnect so I could get it back.    --  O   Bob Kaplow   NAR # 18L   >>> To reply, there's no internet on Mars (yet)! <<< E Kaplow Klips & Baffle:	http://nira-rocketry.org/Document/MayJun00.pdf L     www.encompasserve.org/~kaplow_r/    www.nira-rocketry.org    www.nar.org  @         You [should] not examine legislation in the light of theD         benefits it will convey if properly administered, but in theF         light of the wrongs it would do and the harm it would cause ifF         improperly administered -- Lyndon Johnson, former President of         the U.S.   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Sep 2005 12:31:38 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)& Subject: Re: HP's strategy explained :+ Message-ID: <3q255aFcs3ilU1@individual.net>   + In article <433B3C3E.304352A6@comcast.net>, 5 	David J Dachtera <djesys.nospam@comcast.net> writes:  > N >>                   Where's the US economy?  Near record growth.  Near record >  > ...high... >  >> unemployment.    G You're the second one in two days to bring up unemployment as a measure & of economy.  Let's look at some facts.  5               2005             2004              2003 5 US            4.9%             5.4%              6.4% 5 CANADA        6.8%             7.1%              7.2% 5 GERMANY      11.4%            10.5%              9.8% 5 FRANCE       10.2%            10.0%              9.8% 5 UK            4.7%             4.7%              5.1% 5 JAPAN         4.5%             4.7%              5.3%   C Looks like Japan and the UK are the only ones who actually beat the A US and that by rather insignificant numbers.  Especially when you B consider the difference in the size of the population and the fact> that the US still has a high and constant influx of uneducated? third-world refugees (both legal and illegal) who help to swell  the ranks of the unemployed.   OK, next red herring!    bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------   Date: 29 Sep 2005 12:41:02 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)& Subject: Re: HP's strategy explained :+ Message-ID: <3q25muFcs3ilU2@individual.net>   9 In article <YtJ_e.7026$cq2.778690@news20.bellglobal.com>, , 	"Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> writes: > 5 > "Dan O'Reilly" <dano@process.com> wrote in message  = > news:6.1.2.0.2.20050928180257.07caca08@raptor.psccos.com... + >> At 05:10 PM 9/28/2005, Neil Rieck wrote:  > [...snip...] >>N >> I remember in the late 80's: the Japanese were going to own America.  They L >> made everything cheaper, they had all the money, they *gasp* were buying G >> American real estate and American companies.  Where is the Japanese  > >> economy today?  Pretty much still in the tank.  As are the H >> heavily-socialized and government-subsidized economies of France and L >> Germany (and to a lesser extent, the UK).  Where's the US economy?  Near E >> record growth.  Near record unemployment.  With a better-educated   >> workforce than ever before. >> >  > #####  > K > While the value of the yen has dropped by a factor of 4 from the 80's to  L > now, they have a very high standard of living (which is probably the only M > economic indicator that human beings should pay any attention to) and they  ? > have no where near the unemployment figures seen in the USA.     Excuse me??   5               2005             2004              2003 5 US            4.9%             5.4%              6.4% 5 JAPAN         4.5%             4.7%              5.3%   G Difference seems rather insignificant, especially considering they have H half the population the US has and virtually no immigration (immigrationH playing a role in this as it tends to be the un-educated, un-trained and un-skilled who emigrate).      bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 16:15:55 GMT # From: Beach Runner <bob@nospam.com> & Subject: Re: HP's strategy explained :< Message-ID: <%qU_e.152822$p_1.63615@tornado.tampabay.rr.com>   Bill Gunshannon wrote:    I There were some comments on unions.  Wallmart meat cutters unionized, so   they got rid of all of them.  9 A Wallmart in Canada unionized, so they closed the store.   I Unions have their good and bad, but clearly they have improved the lives  , for the majority of American working people.   ------------------------------   Date: 29 Sep 2005 17:10:22 GMT( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)& Subject: Re: HP's strategy explained :+ Message-ID: <3q2lfuFcjlr4U2@individual.net>   < In article <%qU_e.152822$p_1.63615@tornado.tampabay.rr.com>,& 	Beach Runner <bob@nospam.com> writes: >  >  > Bill Gunshannon wrote: >  > K > There were some comments on unions.  Wallmart meat cutters unionized, so   > they got rid of all of them. > ; > A Wallmart in Canada unionized, so they closed the store.  > K > Unions have their good and bad, but clearly they have improved the lives  . > for the majority of American working people. >   M I wrote no such thing.  I did not write nor do I agree with any of the above.    bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 16:00:23 GMT # From: hoff@hp.nospam (Hoff Hoffman)  Subject: Re: Jump to console ?3 Message-ID: <rcU_e.13459$Vf2.5761@news.cpqcorp.net>   l In article <1127890959.200632.138260@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>, "Mister Q" <pquodling@gmail.com> writes:E :This typically means that your SRM Firmware has been corrupted.  you 8 :will need to reload it, probably from failsafe mode...   E   Not the only potential cause, but -- if it is an isolated corrupted E   SRM console image -- the Failsafe Loader can potentially be an easy F   fix for it.  (There can sometimes be a beep (diagnostic) code with aG   hardware error, too -- does/did the box make any noise?)   As for the D   Failsafe Loader, jumper J22 across pins 2 and 3 on the AlphaServerF   ES40 system motherboard to enable the Failsafe Loader, and use it toH   reload the firmware.   General directions on the use of the loader areH   referenced in the FAQ and particularly in the AlphaServer ES40 owner's2   manual and/or at the Alpha SRM firmware website.    N  ---------------------------- #include <rtfaq.h> -----------------------------K     For additional, please see the OpenVMS FAQ -- www.hp.com/go/openvms/faq N  --------------------------- pure personal opinion ---------------------------E         Hoff (Stephen) Hoffman   OpenVMS Engineering   hoff[at]hp.com    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 10:01:54 -0700  From: Lyck <lyck@muc.net> ? Subject: Re: Layoffs at HP : MH needs your suggestions or ideas 0 Message-ID: <9tydnQpUyd1ugKHeRVn-jQ@comcast.com>    On 26-Sep-05 15:50, Peter wrote:e > <mark_hpq@yahoo.com> wrote in message news:1127757507.390460.133070@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...  > H >>you have any ideas or suggestions on how Hewlett-Packard can serve you	 >>better,  > $ > You can start by divesting Compaq.  ; And re-integrating Agilent. I know of a few people there in = sales force, who are now working hard of convincing customers  that "they are the HP"...    > = > And then you can rehire the 20,000 Americans who had put in A > an average of 20 years of service with your company, only to be " > discarded like unwanted garbage.  C This is as American as America can be. Not that I defend or endorse < such policy, not at all.  It is my observation that American@ people have the best consumer protection there is, but regarding@ the jobs this society keeps to its bare bones historically grownC social order, not capable or not willing to implement improvements.   > As an European living in US, probably for the rest of my life,; I have a point of view based on experience on both sides of 7 the "Great Lake." I sure see many magnificent traits in @ Americans and their society, however, the labor law is a horror.; Let me summarize how I see it, in the following list, which  might be shocking to Europeans:   ; 1) Employment is "at will," meaning you can be laid off for >     no reason at all and at any time. California Supreme Court>     ruled so in one specific case of a worker who was about to>     retire after 20 years with his company and get his company;     pension. He was laid off days before that date and lost      pension.9     Judges ruled that "at will" overrules even an obvious :     arbitrary callus act targeting taking away the pension     promise!;     Both sisters of my wife were laid off in last 12 months >     in Texas by Travelocity. The one _2 days_ before she would=     have earned her "Travel Agent Certificate," and the other ?     sister after she collected many award points and mentioning ?     giving her an award cruise from Travelocity, which she thus      also lost.8 2) Americans have rudimental vacations and are afraid to9     go away for a longer period of time. The job might be      gone upon return... 8 3) Regular salary raise to adjust for inflation does not;     exist. Management can however raise its own stock stake 4     almost arbitrary. Recent eTrade news reported of1     Safra Catz of Oracle raised salary by 240%... 6 4) Nobody observes contract and work time agreed upon.6     The 50 hours which we pull down regularly does not8     count toward extra leave and vacation, or extra pay.8 5) Nobody protects American jobs for Americans. I see an2     unspeakable flood of Indians pouring into this8     country, and many American veterans of the High-Tech:     revolution getting out of their jobs and are forced to>     move out of California. Ethnic people have no reservations;     to hire and promote only each other. In Bangalore or in 4     Sunnyvale, you see endless rows of Indian names.  : Considering such "laws" I do not wonder that Americans are; scared, yes scared, in the daily life. There is no identity ; with the company, or with the product, its the fear driving ; the behavior at work. I see even best educated people being 6 so tired by the 55-60h week, that they tumble and make8 mistakes. Later they spend a sizable part of the day for fixing them.  6 This society needs a change... Swinging the banner and9 watching army blowing away a weak opponent in an uprising / of patriotism is not a substitute for progress.    > ? > Start with those two, and then claim some kind of concern for  > your customers.  > 
 > ASSHOLE. >    ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 04:55:53 -0700 From: maher_rj@hotmail.com0 Subject: Match-Maker wanted - Oz positions on goC Message-ID: <1127994953.346243.275400@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>    Hi,   G If you remember me then please help, if you don't then please help also  :-)   G There are (at least) two VMS positions going in Australia at the moment  -   @ 1) VMS Pascal/Real-time/ foreign exchange Possibly Melbourne NAB  @ 2) Pascal/VMS Senior software engineer in gaming industry Shared+ Memory/Gaming industry/Central CBD (Sydney)   A I don't know Pascal (but how hard can it be) and I do know 64-bit  shared memory on VMS.   4 Who are these VMS clients screaming out for support?  2 If we are on the same team then please play cupid.   Regards Richard Maher    ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 08:04:51 -0700) From: "Joe Sewell" <ultrajoe@spamcop.net>  Subject: Multiple X servers?C Message-ID: <1128006291.697282.122170@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   D My site recently got in several dual-head Alpha workstations runningF OpenVMS, DECwindows/Motif 1.3-1.  (Our software is currently not ratedD for VMS V8.2 & DW/M 1.5.)  I've got one set up for multiple screens,E but what I'd like to do is have multiple *displays* (i.e., multiple X ? servers), so if I happen to set a breakpoint in the routine for D bringing up a popup menu (for example), I can regain control withoutD going to another machine & killing the process.  The machines have a single keyboard & mouse.  C Is this even possible?  What's the "right" way to set this up?  I'm % assuming Xinerama wouldn't help here.    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 13:25:48 -0400 # From: sol gongola <sol@adldata.com>   Subject: Re: Multiple X servers?0 Message-ID: <1128014565.847026@nntp.acecape.com>   Joe Sewell wrote: F > My site recently got in several dual-head Alpha workstations runningH > OpenVMS, DECwindows/Motif 1.3-1.  (Our software is currently not ratedF > for VMS V8.2 & DW/M 1.5.)  I've got one set up for multiple screens,G > but what I'd like to do is have multiple *displays* (i.e., multiple X A > servers), so if I happen to set a breakpoint in the routine for F > bringing up a popup menu (for example), I can regain control withoutF > going to another machine & killing the process.  The machines have a > single keyboard & mouse. > E > Is this even possible?  What's the "right" way to set this up?  I'm ' > assuming Xinerama wouldn't help here.  >    As I understand it: ? Even with only a single display, you can have multiple sessions = so that if one session hangs, you should be able to switch to B another session on the same display to accomplish what you intend.   VMS help gives you:    $help set display /screen    SET   
    DISPLAY        /SCREEN               /SCREEN=screen-number  H         Defines the screen to be associated with this display device. InG         some hardware configurations, the system supports more than one F         screen. In such a configuration, you can specify the screen to*         which the application is directed.   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 06:00:48 -07001 From: "Leigh" <LGBowden@bowdenfamily.fsnet.co.uk> ! Subject: Re: SC008/Star Couplers. A Message-ID: <1127998848.433945.4010@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   G This particular arrangement has one HSJ40 per array not dual configured @ although I can see a big slot underneath both where it would go.  B These HSJ's are a 40 and a 40C but they only appear to have one CID connector comprising four "pins". I've found the breakout cables youG speak of and they're marked up as A/B TX/RX which accounts for the four A pins/cables. I take it O-> and ->O are TX and RX respectively and - should be connected to the same on the SC008.   C Looking through some old docs I've found issues like the HSJ's have F MAX_NODES (8,16,32) and MAX_HOSTS (number of CIPCA/CIXCD) cards on theC cluster. Also the host cards should be low numbers and the HSJ high F numbers. As I'm sort of replacing them into a similar configuration soF I've assumed these will be the same and I intend putting them in theirG original 7 and 8 slots. Are there any HSJ docs showing teh full command  set so I can check this.  @ Does the VAX/CIXCD or the HSC90 have a similar process where theE numbers of nodes is defined manually or will it poll the star coupler  at start up?   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 17:07:45 GMT 1 From: Keith Parris <keithparris_NOSPAM@yahoo.com> ! Subject: Re: SC008/Star Couplers. 3 Message-ID: <BbV_e.13469$ck2.3632@news.cpqcorp.net>    Leigh wrote:D > These HSJ's are a 40 and a 40C but they only appear to have one CI# > connector comprising four "pins".   I Sorry. I was thinking of the later HSJ80 model, which has 2 CI ports per  : controller, and was the model I worked with most recently.  E > Looking through some old docs I've found issues like the HSJ's have H > MAX_NODES (8,16,32) and MAX_HOSTS (number of CIPCA/CIXCD) cards on the > cluster.    G The settings for maximum number of CI IDs on a star coupler should all  F match on both the VMS and controller sides. This affects arbitration. = It's OK if both are set to 16 even on an 8-node star coupler.   E There is a VMS SYSGEN parameter PAMAXPOLL which is the highest CI ID  F number which VMS will poll for (and thus discover). The default value E for this parameter on VMS is 32, actually one more than it should be  H since 31 is the maximum possible CI ID number (and to do that takes two F of the rare-as-hen's teeth CISCE (CI Star Coupler Extension) modules).  E > Also the host cards should be low numbers and the HSJ high numbers.   D Advice on this varied over time. While I was doing this in the late H '90s, the counsel was to put HSJs at low IDs and hosts at high IDs. For B your small configuration, at low load levels, it shouldn't matter.  B > Does the VAX/CIXCD or the HSC90 have a similar process where theG > numbers of nodes is defined manually or will it poll the star coupler  > at start up?  H CI adapters typically had DIP switches setting the maximum number of CI I nodes on the star coupler at either 16 or 32 nodes. I don't remember how   this was set on the HSC series.    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 15:42:45 GMT & From: John Reagan <john.reagan@hp.com>" Subject: Re: see anybody you know?4 Message-ID: <VXT_e.13455$o12.11333@news.cpqcorp.net>    VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: > http://www.ianhaig.net/web > + > Check out the "Men of the Internet, 2004"  >    Then go check out   + http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/killerquiz/    --   John Reagan / HP Pascal/{A|I}MACRO for OpenVMS Project Leader  Hewlett-Packard Company    ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 15:39:34 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG" Subject: Re: see anybody you know?0 Message-ID: <00A4A872.ED65C7CC@SendSpamHere.ORG>  ] In article <VXT_e.13455$o12.11333@news.cpqcorp.net>, John Reagan <john.reagan@hp.com> writes: ! >VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:  >> http://www.ianhaig.net/web  >>  , >> Check out the "Men of the Internet, 2004" >>   >  >Then go check out > , >http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/killerquiz/  E I've seen this before.  When your picture came up I wasn't quite sure @ if I could answer computer language creator or serial killer! :)   --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 12:26:15 -0400 0 From: BRAD <bMradAhamPiltSon-at-coMmcAast.nPeSt>" Subject: Re: see anybody you know?0 Message-ID: <pYudnU6i58A1iKHeRVn-qA@comcast.com>   John Reagan wrote:" > VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: >  >> http://www.ianhaig.net/web  >>, >> Check out the "Men of the Internet, 2004" >> >  > Then go check out  > - > http://www.malevole.com/mv/misc/killerquiz/  >   H I see a black, blank page, using CSWB on my Alpha.  Talk about killer...   --  . Bradford J. Hamilton "All opinions are my own"@                       "Lose the MAPS, and replace '-at-' with @"   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 07:46:19 GMT ( From: Alan Greig <greigaln@netscape.net># Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! : Message-ID: <fZM_e.8623$VI6.189@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk>   David J Dachtera wrote:   B > In case you haven't noticed, that on-line publication carries no, > credibility with anyone who matters at HP. > C > ....and case you haven't noticed Keith and Rob reflecting all the F > "sunshine that's being blown up their skirts", HP thinks life on theF > Good Ship Itanic is just ducky. (That Leo DeCaprio movie has been on  C Yet I just watched an HP advert for blade servers that said "Using  G Intel's best performing microprocessor the Intel Xeon". Now ads on CNN  G are aimed at top level management. Wonder how easy it is for HP to try  G and sell an Itanium when the HP ads on tv clearly say that the Xeon is   better performing.   --  
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 04:16:23 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! , Message-ID: <433BA2B7.AB36C968@teksavvy.com>   Alan Greig wrote: H > Intel's best performing microprocessor the Intel Xeon". Now ads on CNNH > are aimed at top level management. Wonder how easy it is for HP to tryH > and sell an Itanium when the HP ads on tv clearly say that the Xeon is > better performing.    + Perhaps it is part of the overall strategy.   G You have products that are politically impossible to kill. But you know E the platform is going nowehere and will be overtaken and made totally D irrelevant by the 8086, so leave your non strategic products on thatF platform and let the media do the dirty work of killing those productsG are a pace you can control with limited announcements such as that IA64 G alliance thing and constant denials that IA64 is not going anywhere but  nothing more than that.   B If HP were in business to make money, it would ports its operatingG systems to the most popular platform which would allow products such as - VMS to greatly expand their market potential.   E Instead, HP is in business to support Intel and Microsoft. It doesn't G want its own products to compete against Windows, so it limites them to 5 some niche market proprietary chip that nobody wants.     G Alpha was murdered and VMS moved to that IA64 thing not to allow VMS to < grow, but rather to help support that struggling IA64 thing.    F VMS management must stop using VMS  to help justify IA64. They need toG focus on finding the platform which will allow VMS to grow, succeed and  expand its horizons.    D Of all of the proprietary OS', VMS is the best placed to move to theE 8086 ASAP. Its clustering superiority allows VMS to exist on multiple G smaller servers and provide orders of magnitude better service than any F competing OS on the same servers. And the knowledge that the 8086 willA scale up to the same systems as IA64 in a couple of years totally ( eliminates the need for that IA64 thing.    E VMS is respected. But it is conidered an unavailable operating system G running on some obscrure platform with no future and restricted to only E very large cororation. It isn't on the mainstream train at all.  Move @ VMS to the 8086, and all that changes and all of the sudden, theF respected OS becomes mainstream and easy to get/justify. And by movingE it to the 8086, it sends a VERY strong signal that VMS' life isn't in C question. Limiting VMS to that IA64 thing keeps the rumours of VMS'  demise along with IA64 going.     H Of all the big supercomputer sites that make the big "top 10" lists, how many run VMS ?  E If VMS isn't used on those few configs where IA64 may still have some C advantage, then that advantage is not worth anything to VMS because G those large supercomputers use Linux or HP-UX. (And don't generate much G profit for HP since the system are highly subsidized and they don't buy  the OS from HP).    G If you sell cute lamps that run on 3 phase 347 volts, they may be great D in office buildings, but you are limited to such buildings.  And youE can't sell those lamps in smaller towns which don't have large office . buildings that have 3 phase 347 volt systems.   H Move your lamps to 110 volts single phase, and all of a sudden, you have' a HUGE market potential for your lamps.     A So question to the HP apologists: Is it more important for you to H justify the decision to move to IA64, or is it more important for you to) find the best possible path for VMS ?????    ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 06:18:20 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! 3 Message-ID: <vwedXf7iRoOj@eisner.encompasserve.org>   \ In article <433B3CEA.2C85C7E4@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:  J > In terms of Alpha, I think this first step would be for HP to revoke itsI > order to prematurely end Alpha sales and commit to making Alpha systems F > available until at least 2007. During this time, they may admit that: > Alpha's speed can be boosted some with a process shrink.  A And will you indemnify them against anything they might owe Intel 6 for reneging on their agreement to switch to Itanium ?   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 05:42:23 -0700 From: bob@instantwhip.com # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! C Message-ID: <1127997743.746414.315550@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com>   F Bill Gates and oracle are the ones trying to keep vms off the x86 boat> anchor because they know the day that happens, they are toast!  < How much are they paying and who at HP is receiving payoffs?9 I say Palmer did at DEC and Capellas at Q, now who at HP?    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 09:10:34 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> # Subject: RE: Time to produce EV79s! R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB70BF56@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----4 > From: Alan Greig [mailto:greigaln@netscape.net]=20" > Sent: September 29, 2005 3:46 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com % > Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s!  >=20 >=20 >=20 > David J Dachtera wrote:  >=20D > > In case you haven't noticed, that on-line publication carries no. > > credibility with anyone who matters at HP. > >=20E > > ....and case you haven't noticed Keith and Rob reflecting all the H > > "sunshine that's being blown up their skirts", HP thinks life on theH > > Good Ship Itanic is just ducky. (That Leo DeCaprio movie has been on >=20G > Yet I just watched an HP advert for blade servers that said "Using=20 @ > Intel's best performing microprocessor the Intel Xeon". Now=20 > ads on CNN=20 A > are aimed at top level management. Wonder how easy it is for=20  > HP to try=20? > and sell an Itanium when the HP ads on tv clearly say that=20  > the Xeon is=20 > better performing. >=20 > --=20  > Alan Greig >=20  = Alan, "top level management" really could not care less about  microprocessor hardware.=20   C They know their current servers are grossly under utilized (Windows ; 10-25%, UNIX 15-30%) and so selling them something based on H "bits-n-bytes and feeds-n-speeds" is not going to get their attention or any time on their schedule.=20  A And all these servers that are so grossly under utilized were all E originally purchased using "better performance/$" type justifications  from all the various vendors.   B "Top level management" are concerned about reducing overall costs,H improving their service levels and increasing their adaptability to meet' rapidly changing business requirements.   D Any HW ad like you mentioned would not even be mildly interesting to* them and they would flip to the next page.   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 13:47:48 GMT * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com># Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! 3 Message-ID: <8gS_e.13446$D62.8361@news.cpqcorp.net>   & <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in message= news:1127997743.746414.315550@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com... H > Bill Gates and oracle are the ones trying to keep vms off the x86 boat@ > anchor because they know the day that happens, they are toast! > > > How much are they paying and who at HP is receiving payoffs?; > I say Palmer did at DEC and Capellas at Q, now who at HP?  >   L Time to adjust your meds, the voices in your head seem to be out of control.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 13:38:10 +0000 - From: David B Sneddon <dbsneddon@bigpond.com> # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! * Message-ID: <433BEE42.2070809@bigpond.com>   FredK was overheard to say: ( > <bob@instantwhip.com> wrote in message? > news:1127997743.746414.315550@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...  > H >>Bill Gates and oracle are the ones trying to keep vms off the x86 boat@ >>anchor because they know the day that happens, they are toast! >>> >>How much are they paying and who at HP is receiving payoffs?; >>I say Palmer did at DEC and Capellas at Q, now who at HP?  >> >  > N > Time to adjust your meds, the voices in your head seem to be out of control.  A Interesting that Boob's address <bob@instantwhip.com> seems to be @ invalid (I tried replying directly to him, rather than fill this< forum with more shite, about another post and got an inavlid address message). @ If the Junk Mail stuff in Secure Web Browser was working I would% not have have seen his other message. 7 Surely it is time to stop feeding this moronic troll...    Regards, Dave.  --  D David B Sneddon (dbs)  VMS Systems Programmer  dbsneddon@bigpond.comD Sneddo's quick guide ...     http://www.users.bigpond.com/dbsneddon/D DBS freeware     http://www.users.bigpond.com/dbsneddon/software.htm   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 10:14:47 -0700 From: bob@instantwhip.com # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! B Message-ID: <1128014087.925872.95360@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>  A time to answer the question that why would anyone with a superior B operating system and a superior cpu cancel one for an inferior cpu> and not position and market its superior os to achieve maximumD market share and profit?  Name calling just reinforces the fact that: you can not or will not address the question logically ...   ------------------------------  # Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 17:07:29 GMT ( From: Alan Greig <greigaln@netscape.net># Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! < Message-ID: <lbV_e.10477$VI6.6245@fe1.news.blueyonder.co.uk>   Main, Kerry wrote:  F > Any HW ad like you mentioned would not even be mildly interesting to, > them and they would flip to the next page.  G In general I might agree but this particular HP ad aired in the middle  C of "World Business Report" on CNN International and is of the type  A firmly aimed at high level decision makers. It wasn't a print ad.    --  
 Alan Greig   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 10:21:19 -0700 From: bob@instantwhip.com # Subject: Re: Time to produce EV79s! C Message-ID: <1128014479.636545.210550@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   @ Intel wanted alpha dead so itanium could occupy the high end ...= unfortunately, itanium turned out to be the dud DEC engineers < wrote it would be and IBM continued where alpha left off and now control it w/power ...  C if intel had any brains at all, they would dump itanium and produce A alpha ... even windows 2000 runs on it already ... but that would A be too simple and make too much sense financially ... can't admit > that DEC technology was and still is superior to their own ...  = give me vms and alpha and I would destroy the x86 boat anchor ( market plus power and dominate all ends!   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 13:00:24 +0100 % From: "issinoho" <issinoho@gmail.com>  Subject: Vamp Hacked! 0 Message-ID: <11jnlqpcd9j2l79@corp.supernews.com>  L My OpenVMS hosted website (http://www.issinoho.com:8080/phpbb2/) was hacked E on Tuesday and the posts were all deleted and replaced by a hacker's  
 signature.  J I've spent most of the time since, (a) restoring the data - mostly there, K still looking to see if I can recover the rest from my nightly backup, and  . (b) trying to find out what the hell happened.  M As to the latter, a combination of MySQL and Apache logs revealed a scripted  J attack at 19:33 on the 27th which exploited a vulnerability in phpBB (the K bulletin board system the site is using) to gain Admin access. The version  M of phpBB being used by VAMP (2.0.11) was a little aged and I had been lax in  . keeping it patched so maybe I had this coming!  ; For the full skinny on the attack method take a look here,  = http://www.frsirt.com/english/advisories/2005/0212 and here,  : http://www.frsirt.com/exploits/20050314.phpbbexp.cpp.php .  I I've now (obviously) patched phpBB to the latest version and VAMP is now  J back up & running again. Apologies if you've lost posts or your account - ( I'm still working on getting these back.  J A scan of all relevant accounting and event logs has satisfied me that no F compromise was made at an Operating System level - not that I had any  doubts.   K So, a word of warning if you are running phpBB (on any system) - make sure  ' you're running at least version 2.0.13     ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 07:14:51 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen)  Subject: Re: Vamp Hacked! 3 Message-ID: <RNxkCKGwj88x@eisner.encompasserve.org>   X In article <11jnlqpcd9j2l79@corp.supernews.com>, "issinoho" <issinoho@gmail.com> writes:  O > As to the latter, a combination of MySQL and Apache logs revealed a scripted  L > attack at 19:33 on the 27th which exploited a vulnerability in phpBB (the M > bulletin board system the site is using) to gain Admin access. The version  O > of phpBB being used by VAMP (2.0.11) was a little aged and I had been lax in  0 > keeping it patched so maybe I had this coming!  B Hindsight is wonderful, but it is better to rely on authenticationD mechanisms within (or mediated by) VMS rather than applications thatE roll their own.  On current Alpha versions (not VAX) your application = can call the $ACM system service for authentication purposes.   @ If you need services not native to VMS, like smart card support,@ you can attach those to the other end of the VMS ACME mechanism.C Doing this is harder to program that simply slapping authentication B into an application because there is less flexibility.  That meansD better security through a disciplined interface that has seen review" and includes breakin evasion, etc.   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 13:24:35 +0100 % From: "issinoho" <issinoho@gmail.com>  Subject: Re: Vamp Hacked! 0 Message-ID: <11jnn8dbv114pdc@corp.supernews.com>  ; "Larry Kilgallen" <Kilgallen@SpamCop.net> wrote in message  - news:RNxkCKGwj88x@eisner.encompasserve.org... > > In article <11jnlqpcd9j2l79@corp.supernews.com>, "issinoho"  > <issinoho@gmail.com> writes: > G >> As to the latter, a combination of MySQL and Apache logs revealed a   >> scripted L >> attack at 19:33 on the 27th which exploited a vulnerability in phpBB (theF >> bulletin board system the site is using) to gain Admin access. The 
 >> versionM >> of phpBB being used by VAMP (2.0.11) was a little aged and I had been lax   >> in 1 >> keeping it patched so maybe I had this coming!  > D > Hindsight is wonderful, but it is better to rely on authenticationF > mechanisms within (or mediated by) VMS rather than applications thatG > roll their own.  On current Alpha versions (not VAX) your application ? > can call the $ACM system service for authentication purposes.  > B > If you need services not native to VMS, like smart card support,B > you can attach those to the other end of the VMS ACME mechanism.E > Doing this is harder to program that simply slapping authentication D > into an application because there is less flexibility.  That meansF > better security through a disciplined interface that has seen review$ > and includes breakin evasion, etc.  K All noted. Although as this is by definition an anonymous public resource,  ? it makes nailing things down like you suggest somewhat tricky.     ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 05:45:42 -0700 From: bob@instantwhip.com ; Subject: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce? C Message-ID: <1127997942.208024.216130@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>   A We all read about all these big vms users so excited that vms was @ moving to an "industry standard" platform ... they all knew thatA itanium wasn't even close to alpha and never will be according to F DEC engineering reports, but they persisted in their idiocy regardless ... why?  @ And more importantly, know that they see itanium as the farce it3 is, why are they not demanding alpha startup again?    ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 10:05:58 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> ? Subject: RE: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce? R Message-ID: <FD827B33AB0D9C4E92EACEEFEE2BA2FB70BF59@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----; > From: bob@instantwhip.com [mailto:bob@instantwhip.com]=20 " > Sent: September 29, 2005 8:46 AM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com = > Subject: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce?  >=20C > We all read about all these big vms users so excited that vms was B > moving to an "industry standard" platform ... they all knew thatC > itanium wasn't even close to alpha and never will be according to H > DEC engineering reports, but they persisted in their idiocy regardless
 > ... why? >=20B > And more importantly, know that they see itanium as the farce it5 > is, why are they not demanding alpha startup again?  >=20     Bob -=20   A few misc to consider-   G 1. Although it would be nice, Itanium does not need to be the leader in E latest speeds-n-feeds in order to be successful.  It just needs to be D competitive. Heck, Sun has proven that over the years and as slow asE SPARC was, they only have one OS that runs on it. Now where is Andrew / when we need a good rebuttal to that statement?    :-)   B 2. Most Business Exec's primary focus these days is reducing theirD costs, improving service levels etc. The low level HW discussions isD primarily the realm of HW/SW vendors, IT folks, media "analysts" and@ newsgroups. As long as their current applications are available,B supported, and have relatively easy migration paths, most BusinessA Exec's would rather focus on other more pressing business issues.   G 3. Most organizations have grossly under utilized servers, so trying to A sell them on a one-for-one server replacement based on latest and B greatest Mhz or TPS rates is not going to work. That is why server< consolidation and virtualization is so white hot these days.  F 4. And while certainly not the NY Times in terms of credibility, since@ so many here in the newsgroup like to post from this source with5 negative Intel news, check out the latest on Power5+: + http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=3D26552 & "IBM's Power 5+ to launch at 2.1GHz=20. Disappointing for IBM, cheering news for Intel   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 10:33:55 -0700 From: bob@instantwhip.com ? Subject: Re: Why did VMS users go along with the itanium farce? C Message-ID: <1128015235.405166.200240@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   0 and also, that kind of talk sounds like you have- given up ... you have now become what sun and ' IBM and others where when alpha was the 3 leader ... no company with that attitude will never  succeed ... never!   ------------------------------    Date: 29 Sep 2005 12:01:43 -02006 From: peter@langstoeger.at (Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER)J Subject: [OpenVMS V7.3-2] SYSGEN> SHOW EXPECTED_VOTES vs SDA> SHOW CLUSTER* Message-ID: <433bd7a7@news.langstoeger.at>  4 I just noted a situation which I can't explain, yet.  F Showing the SYSGEN (active, nondynamic) parameter EXPECTED_VOTES gives, me another value than SDA SHOW CLUSTER does.  G Why ? I thought they both show the same memory location. Obviously not. J I know SYSGEN current is different (because ALPHAVMSSYS.PAR file, not mem). but the active ? What is the background here ?    3 NodeB$ WRITE SYS$OUTPUT F$GETSYI ("EXPECTED_VOTES")  9   % NodeB$ MCR SYSGEN SHOW EXPECTED_VOTES P Parameter Name           Current    Default     Min.      Max.     Unit  DynamicP --------------           -------    -------    -------   -------   ----  -------G EXPECTED_VOTES                  9          1         1        127 Votes    NodeB$ ANALYZE/SYSTEM    OpenVMS (TM) system analyzer   SDA> SHOW CLUSTER  VMScluster data structures ---------------------------                    --- VMScluster Summary ---   <          Quorum   Votes   Quorum Disk Votes   Status Summary<          ------   -----   -----------------   --------------G             5       9            2            qf_dynvote,qf_vote,quorum   (                         --- CSB list ---  = Address   Node    CSID      ExpVotes Votes   State     Status = -------   ----    ----      -------- -----   -----     ------   P 83054080  NodeA   00010004      9      4     open    member,qf_same,qf_watcher,q f_activeP 82DC40C0  NodeB   00010003      5      3     local   member,qf_same,qf_watcher,q f_active   TIA    -EPLAN  P PS: Please, don't discuss if the votes (4,3,2) or expected votes makes sense ;-) --   Peter "EPLAN" LANGSTOEGER % Network and OpenVMS system specialist  E-mail  peter@langstoeger.atF A-1030 VIENNA  AUSTRIA              I'm not a pessimist, I'm a realist   ------------------------------  % Date: Thu, 29 Sep 2005 14:07:41 +0200 3 From: "Gorazd Kikelj" <gorazd.kikelj@nospam.hp.com> N Subject: Re: [OpenVMS V7.3-2] SYSGEN> SHOW EXPECTED_VOTES vs SDA> SHOW CLUSTER, Message-ID: <433bd90f$1@usenet01.boi.hp.com>  G EXPECTED_VOTES sysgen parameter is a safeguard when creating a cluster  J (first node boots). This cell tell the connection manager, how many votes M should be present when cluster have all vote members present. EXPECTED_VOTES  K on the running cluster is the number of votes currently in the cluster and  > is adjusted by removing or adding voting nodes in the cluster.  
 Best, Gorazd     ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2005.544 ************************