1 INFO-VAX	Tue, 18 Jul 2006	Volume 2006 : Issue 396       Contents:H A Historical Look at the VAX: DEC, NVAX, Alpha and Competitors [Part II] Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD)  Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD)  Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD)  Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD)  Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD)  Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD)  Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD) 4 File io while in exec mode with ast disabled - again8 Re: File io while in exec mode with ast disabled - again8 Re: File io while in exec mode with ast disabled - again Free Advertisement! C Re: Greenhorn question: XON/XOFF control chars (when in MicroEMACS) ! Re: Help w, DECHUB 90 PSU pin-out  Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?  Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?  Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?  Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?  Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?  Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?  Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?  Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?  Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?  Re: update SCSI to IDE bridge  Re: update SCSI to IDE bridge  Re: update SCSI to IDE bridge   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 20:26:54 -0400 ) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> Q Subject: A Historical Look at the VAX: DEC, NVAX, Alpha and Competitors [Part II] < Message-ID: <44bc2a0f$0$18499$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>  H A Historical Look at the VAX: DEC, NVAX, Alpha and Competitors [Part II] Published: 2006-06-20   ? http://www.realworldtech.com/page.cfm?ArticleID=RWT062006031650     + The above article is a followup to this one ? http://www.realworldtech.com/page.cfm?ArticleID=RWT012406203308  published 2006-01-24    
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,  Ontario, Canada.8 http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html9 http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/openvms_demos.html    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 15:20:08 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> $ Subject: Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD)9 Message-ID: <Q5ydnR1N8cXpfCbZnZ2dnUVZ_oSdnZ2d@libcom.com>    Tom Linden wrote: 3 > On Mon, 17 Jul 2006 07:56:00 -0700, Hoff Hoffman  " > <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> wrote: >  >> Tom Linden wrote:) >>> XP1000 running 8.3.  As an experiment B >>> I thought I would see if I could mount a commercial DVD movie. >> ...  >>> ODIN> mount/foreign $6$DQA0:, >>> %MOUNT-F-IVBUFLEN, invalid buffer length, >>> ODIN> mount/media=cdrom/over=id $6$DQA0:, >>> %MOUNT-F-IVBUFLEN, invalid buffer lengthK >>>  Is there a way to do it?  (shouldn't there be a /MEDIA=DVD qualifier?)  >>D >>    /MEDIA=CDROM is the selector for ISO-9660.  CDROM is a poorly . >> chosen keyword in the current context, yes. >>G >>    OpenVMS implements the ISO-9660 standard, but not the Rock Ridge  I >> nor Joliet extensions -- extensions which are typically used for long  H >> filenames and other such for Unix and for Microsoft Windows systems, G >> respectively -- nor for the more recent ISO-9660:1999 (mode 2 long)  K >> mechanisms.  These extensions are NOT used on the video disks I've seen.  >>I >>    The default format for movie disks is built on ISO-9660, and these  H >> disks can be mounted in my experience -- you'll then see the various = >> constructs of the DVD video contents stored as disk files.  >>I >>    Do determine if the particular movie disk you are working with has  B >> some form of copy protection -- I've mounted and looked at the H >> structures of unprotected disks, and -- if you should port or find a H >> port of MPLAYER and load it and its prerequisite pieces -- you might = >> even be able to play (unprotected) video disks on OpenVMS.  >>H >>    OpenVMS does not have support for nor integrated tools that allow J >> the operating system to play copy-protected video disks; you'd need to J >> find software which deals with decryption and other such requirements. I >> (There are various technical and legal discussions of this encryption  % >> and associated algorithms around.)  >>J > I am sure it is protected ("Matchpoint" )  What is it in the protection  > thatM > precludes mounting by OpenVMS? I don't have a DVD  on Tru64 but I wonder if 1 > dd could be used to look at the disk structure?  >   A I guess the question is, are the files encrypted, or is the disk  I structure protected?  I'd guess just the files.  From what Steve writes,   I'd infer the same.   E The commercial applications seem set up to detect the protection and  C refuse to work with such disks.  If a VMS based application didn't  I respect the protection, then the files are just data, and I'd think that  3 code could be written to read and display the data.   H I've never tried to mount a CD-ROM or DVD with /FOREIGN.  If you can do 7 so, you should be able to read whatever is on the disk.    --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450> Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com DFE Ultralights, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 20:01:00 GMT , From: Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com>$ Subject: Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD)0 Message-ID: <00Sug.622$Ir3.275@news.cpqcorp.net>   Tom Linden wrote:   A > but I wonder if dd could be used to look at the disk structure?   I    DUMP would be the obvious tool, or BACKUP/PHYSICAL, or the CDDVD/COPY  8 (undocumented) tool from SYS$ETC: to replicate the disk.  H    It's also possible that there's a bug in the EFT 8.3 code base, as I K hadn't noticed that in your original posting.  But that's far from certain.    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 20:04:11 GMT , From: Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com>$ Subject: Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD)0 Message-ID: <%2Sug.625$Ir3.560@news.cpqcorp.net>   Dave Froble wrote:  G > The commercial applications seem set up to detect the protection and  E > refuse to work with such disks.  If a VMS based application didn't  K > respect the protection, then the files are just data, and I'd think that  5 > code could be written to read and display the data.   E    OpenVMS doesn't care, one way or the other.  It's the drives that  E implement the copy protection, and the hosts and host tools -- where  H authorized and where configured for it -- that have a way to unlock the C copy protection sufficient to play the contents in the appropriate   circumstances.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 16:09:30 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> $ Subject: Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD)) Message-ID: <op.tcuvx4jezgicya@hyrrokkin>   I On Mon, 17 Jul 2006 13:01:00 -0700, Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.co=  m>  =    wrote:   > Tom Linden wrote:  > B >> but I wonder if dd could be used to look at the disk structure? > I >    DUMP would be the obvious tool, or BACKUP/PHYSICAL, or the CDDVD/CO=  PY  =   : > (undocumented) tool from SYS$ETC: to replicate the disk.  F But to use backup/physical you would need to mount the drive.  With  =  	 reference I to your other response to Dave, if I understood correctly, the firmware =  in  =    the I device itself precludes mounting protected DVD's.  Did I get that right?=     	 so should   % $ set command sys$etc:CDDVD$TOOLS.CLD    be put in systartup_vms.com?   > I >    It's also possible that there's a bug in the EFT 8.3 code base, as =  I  =  G > hadn't noticed that in your original posting.  But that's far from  =   
 > certain. >    ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 23:47:17 +0000 (UTC) . From: klewis@LUMINA.MITRE.ORG (Keith A. Lewis)$ Subject: Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD). Message-ID: <e9h7i5$9kb$1@newslocal.mitre.org>   Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> writes in article <00Sug.622$Ir3.275@news.cpqcorp.net> dated Mon, 17 Jul 2006 20:01:00 GMT: >Tom Linden wrote: > B >> but I wonder if dd could be used to look at the disk structure? > J >   DUMP would be the obvious tool, or BACKUP/PHYSICAL, or the CDDVD/COPY 9 >(undocumented) tool from SYS$ETC: to replicate the disk.   I CSS (Content Scrambling System) is built in to your DVD drive.  The drive 9 won't "read" a block until the OS sends it the right key.   L It is not strong encryption, but it is pretty much illegal (patent violationI or something) to go around it, so there's no way VMS would ship with it.  1 Windoze and MacOS will let you play but not copy.   5 Under Linux, the symptom I get is "block read error".    $ dir sys$etc:*cd*! %DIRECT-W-NOFILES, no files found   9 The tool you mention must be missing from my distro.  :^(   0 --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.org> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 16:54:56 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> $ Subject: Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD)) Message-ID: <op.tcux1u1mzgicya@hyrrokkin>   5 On Mon, 17 Jul 2006 16:47:17 -0700, Keith A. Lewis  =     <klewis@LUMINA.MITRE.ORG> wrote:  = > Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> writes in article  =   I > <00Sug.622$Ir3.275@news.cpqcorp.net> dated Mon, 17 Jul 2006 20:01:00 G=  MT:  >> Tom Linden wrote: >>C >>> but I wonder if dd could be used to look at the disk structure?  >>I >>   DUMP would be the obvious tool, or BACKUP/PHYSICAL, or the CDDVD/CO=  PY; >> (undocumented) tool from SYS$ETC: to replicate the disk.  > I > CSS (Content Scrambling System) is built in to your DVD drive.  The dr=  ive ; > won't "read" a block until the OS sends it the right key.   E So what is the key?  BTW, I was not able to play the DVD on a W2K box  > G > It is not strong encryption, but it is pretty much illegal (patent  =    > violation I > or something) to go around it, so there's no way VMS would ship with i=  t.3 > Windoze and MacOS will let you play but not copy.  > 7 > Under Linux, the symptom I get is "block read error".  >  > $ dir sys$etc:*cd*# > %DIRECT-W-NOFILES, no files found  > ; > The tool you mention must be missing from my distro.  :^(    It is on 8.2 and later > 2 > --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.org@ > The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 23:57:15 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> $ Subject: Re: DVD video (was Re: DVD)9 Message-ID: <56Kdnb-oQ-I7xyHZnZ2dnUVZ_rOdnZ2d@libcom.com>    Tom Linden wrote: 5 > On Mon, 17 Jul 2006 16:47:17 -0700, Keith A. Lewis  " > <klewis@LUMINA.MITRE.ORG> wrote: > < >> Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> writes in article L >> <00Sug.622$Ir3.275@news.cpqcorp.net> dated Mon, 17 Jul 2006 20:01:00 GMT: >>> Tom Linden wrote:  >>> D >>>> but I wonder if dd could be used to look at the disk structure? >>> K >>>   DUMP would be the obvious tool, or BACKUP/PHYSICAL, or the CDDVD/COPY < >>> (undocumented) tool from SYS$ETC: to replicate the disk. >>L >> CSS (Content Scrambling System) is built in to your DVD drive.  The drive< >> won't "read" a block until the OS sends it the right key. > G > So what is the key?  BTW, I was not able to play the DVD on a W2K box  >>F >> It is not strong encryption, but it is pretty much illegal (patent  >> violationK >> or something) to go around it, so there's no way VMS would ship with it. 4 >> Windoze and MacOS will let you play but not copy. >>8 >> Under Linux, the symptom I get is "block read error". >> >> $ dir sys$etc:*cd* $ >> %DIRECT-W-NOFILES, no files found >>< >> The tool you mention must be missing from my distro.  :^( >  > It is on 8.2 and later >>3 >> --Keith Lewis              klewis {at} mitre.org A >> The above may not (yet) represent the opinions of my employer.  >   E There is a piece of free software called DVD43.  What it does, you'd  C need to implement in a VMS environment.  Do watch out for the MPAA.    --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450> Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com DFE Ultralights, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jul 2006 13:08:03 -0700 From: fkburrie@yahoo.co.uk= Subject: File io while in exec mode with ast disabled - again B Message-ID: <1153166883.648984.216330@75g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>   Hello,  C Still struggling with the topic (topic of last week) to do file io, E from a pascal program, while in a condition handler in executive mode B and with asts disabled. Originally the standard pascal file io was? used, which of course will cause concurrency problems with RMS.  Now I am still struggling with: G a) is the implementation of sys$putmsg not using asynchronous code wich 5 might also conflict with disabled asts at this level? F b) can behaviour of sys$putmsg be altered in a way that "free strings" can be written? F c) to find a proper pascal example using qio which will function while in exec mode and asts disabled.    Thanks!    Frank Burrie   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 21:06:33 GMT , From: Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com>A Subject: Re: File io while in exec mode with ast disabled - again 0 Message-ID: <tZSug.637$Ir3.331@news.cpqcorp.net>   fkburrie@yahoo.co.uk wrote:  > E > Still struggling with the topic (topic of last week) to do file io, G > from a pascal program, while in a condition handler in executive mode  > and with asts disabled.   C    RMS operates in exec mode non-AST at its highest/innermost, and  C cannot reliably operate from exec mode with ASTs disabled, or from   kernel mode.  D    RTL and language calls can have their own issues with inner-mode G coding, as has been widely discussed in this newsgroup in recent times. E Inner-mode or RTL or other such keywords should make for easy search  5 targets within your preferred newsgroup search tool.)   , > Originally the standard pascal file io wasA > used, which of course will cause concurrency problems with RMS.   H    Exec mode requires considerations around what you can call, and what + mode the called code expects to operate in.   ! > Now I am still struggling with: I > a) is the implementation of sys$putmsg not using asynchronous code wich 7 > might also conflict with disabled asts at this level? H > b) can behaviour of sys$putmsg be altered in a way that "free strings" > can be written? H > c) to find a proper pascal example using qio which will function while! > in exec mode and asts disabled.   G    You can either drop to an outer mode (via an outer-mode AST, or via  F communications via mailbox, or via the driver broadcast interface, or D (obviously) rework the synchronization and then enable ASTs in exec F mode, and issue your RMS calls.  Or rework the code to avoid the need * for RMS when you're in exec AST or kernel.  E    There have been changes on recent OpenVMS releases around the RMS  D rundown processing, to better flush buffers and such.  Depending on A exactly what you are doing, an OpenVMS upgrade might be a way to  D accomplish your requirements here -- OpenVMS now better flushes and ? closes files, which could be the reason you're working on this  F sequencing here.  (Or if you're on a sufficiently recent release, you 5 might already have this -- this was added in V7.3-2.)    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2006 07:02:38 +0800 3 From: "Richard Maher" <maher_rj@hotspamnotmail.com> A Subject: Re: File io while in exec mode with ast disabled - again 1 Message-ID: <e9h4qc$g2t$1@news-02.connect.com.au>   	 Hi Frank,   G Let me get some advice out of the way first. I wouldn't use Pascal or a J Condition Handler and I wouldn't have disabled ASTs. Having said that, youL obviously are trying to debug something that used to work and has now fallen over, so: -   I > a) is the implementation of sys$putmsg not using asynchronous code wich 7 > might also conflict with disabled asts at this level? H > b) can behaviour of sys$putmsg be altered in a way that "free strings" > can be written?   F What happens if you give $putmsg the action routine and tell it not to5 output the message(s)? You can then $qio the strings.   J Or just FAO !XL the statii and $qio them. $qios to sys$output work fine in inner-mode.   H > c) to find a proper pascal example using qio which will function while! > in exec mode and asts disabled.   J If the synchronous version won't work for what you're doing then just giveL it a completion AST and know that it won't fire until you turn ASTs back on.   Regards Richard Maher   K PS. It would've been more useful if you'd've replied to the other threaded.   ' <fkburrie@yahoo.co.uk> wrote in message < news:1153166883.648984.216330@75g2000cwc.googlegroups.com... > Hello, > E > Still struggling with the topic (topic of last week) to do file io, G > from a pascal program, while in a condition handler in executive mode D > and with asts disabled. Originally the standard pascal file io wasA > used, which of course will cause concurrency problems with RMS. ! > Now I am still struggling with: I > a) is the implementation of sys$putmsg not using asynchronous code wich 7 > might also conflict with disabled asts at this level? H > b) can behaviour of sys$putmsg be altered in a way that "free strings" > can be written? H > c) to find a proper pascal example using qio which will function while! > in exec mode and asts disabled.  > 	 > Thanks!  >  > Frank Burrie >    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 21:15:22 GMT  From: Dan2837@gmail.com  Subject: Free Advertisement!7 Message-ID: <K5Tug.51730$e77.5715@tornado.texas.rr.com>    www.get-free-advertisement.com www.have-bad-credit.com    ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jul 2006 19:22:20 -04003 From: Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> L Subject: Re: Greenhorn question: XON/XOFF control chars (when in MicroEMACS). Message-ID: <mddodvn3jgz.fsf@panix5.panix.com>  = koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:   D > In article <1153059083.982684.77830@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, > sampsal@gmail.com writes:   E >> I just finished installing MicroEMACS 3.12 on my VMS box (7.3-1 if A >> relevant) and it works fine except for the fact that something J >> somewhere keeps grabbing the ^S chars sent, and the terminal connectionH >> then locks up until I hit ^Q. I assume this is to do with incorrectly# >> interpreted XON/XOFF characters.   G Terminal.app is eating them for you.  This can easily be changed in the  Preferences.  H >    The XON/XOFF characters are being correctly interpretted as controlH >    flow.  The use of these characters in emacs is a classic example ofK >    bad design.  The author of emacs insisted that only hardware should be I >    used as flow control and the world ignored his unique point of view.   O No, the world did not ignore his point of view, nor was it particularly unique.   G >    Folks using emacs with a system that does XON/XOFF as flow control I >    simply redefine the related functions to other keys.  Very few emacs G >    users ever use ^Q.  Generally they define some function key (emacs D >    knows they exist, but doesn't preassign much to them) to do the& >    iterative search forward routine.  L Odd.  I've been using EMACS (under Tops-20 and ITS), GNU Emacs (under 8 or 9J different versions of Unix, Tops-20, and 4 different versions of Windows),L microEmacs, Gosling Emacs, elle, and Fred, since 1978.  I frequently use ^Q,6 and I've never re-mapped incremental search off of ^S.  I But then, when it comes to EMACS, I probably know what I'm talking about.    Old .sig, still true:   O Rich Alderson                   Last LOTS Tops-20 Systems Programmer, 1984-1991 K                                 Current maintainer, MIT TECO EMACS (v. 170)  --  L Rich Alderson                                       | /"\ ASCII ribbon     |L news@alderson.users.panix.com                       | \ / campaign against |L "You get what anybody gets. You get a lifetime."    |  x  HTML mail and    |L                          --Death, of the Endless    | / \ postings         |   ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jul 2006 15:39:28 -07001 From: "nnc@eta.chalmers.se" <nnc@eta.chalmers.se> * Subject: Re: Help w, DECHUB 90 PSU pin-outB Message-ID: <1153175968.837568.217050@35g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>   More information found out: E Pin A4 looks like -12V after all (It comes from a LM7912 + decoupling  Cap.) F Pin A10 looks like +12V (it comes from a LM340T12, pin 3, plus Cap...)E This obviously leaves the rest of the A-row for +5V and C-row for GND  (se below).   G Both + and - 12V must be less than 1 Amp with these regulators, so from E the total 170W there should be like 145 W for 5V, ie 28 Amp rating... G (or less if 170W is total Input to the switched PSU) Lets guess some 20 & .=2E. 25 Amps is true designed rating.  E Tomorrow (local time here) I can tell if I was right, or what coulour 9 of smoke there is inside the components of a DECHUB   ;-)   D If anyone can tell I'm right on track, it would feel more plesant toD turn on, if Not, I will write to this group afterwards and tell what
 happended!   /G=C5    nnc@eta.chalmers.se wrote: > Help wanted;I > Just about going off for summer vaccations, the PSU of a DECHUB 90 with : > some 7 units plugged into the packplane also went off... > C > Can anyone help me with the pin-out of this 32-pin connector (1/2   > C-style eurocard(?) connector). > 16 pins (1-16) in row A and 16 Pins in row C > H > >From other articles, I find that some modules in this series operatesI > from +5.1V single supply, other require +5,1V and +12.1V. On the PCB of H > my PSU, I can (at the transformer) read about +5.1V, +12.1V and -12.1V! > (besides 12 *tack, rot and rot)  > C > In row A pins 1, 2, 3, 5, 7, 8, 9, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16 connect  > together. I guess they are U+ D > In row C pins 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 7, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16 connect! > together. I guess they are GND. ' > In both rows, pin 6 is Not Connected. I > In row C, pins 8, 9 are together connected to frame (like in protective 	 > ground) F > In row A, pin 4 is connected to the negative side of an electrolytic > capacitor... >=20 >  ...   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 15:13:30 -0400 & From: Thomas Wirt <twnews@kittles.com>( Subject: Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?E Message-ID: <33595$44bbe164$4367aba2$26313@msgid.meganewsservers.com>    Thomas Wirt wrote:   > Dave Froble wrote: >  >> Bob Gezelter wrote: >> >>> To all,  >>> K >>> I have heard back (and verified) that the site is once again reachable.  >>> D >>> Apparently, the problem was a network infrastructure involving a> >>> switch. The OpenVMS server was sitting there, unreachable. >>> ( >>> - Bob Gezelter, http://www.rlgsc.com >>>  >>H >> Switches must be rather fragile.  At least some of them.  Every time C >> there is a near-by lightening strike I end up replacing several  I >> switches.  There have been incidences when I'm rather sure that there  F >> was no physical contact.  I'm starting to wonder whether an EMP is $ >> enough to take out some switches. >>I > I have replaced many switches that went bad NEAR lightning strikes.  I  I > have been chalking these up to EMP/induced current for a long time.  I  K > figure that when you get a nearly vertical lightning strike near (within  I > a couple hundred feet) a large horizontal copper antenna (like a 250ft  I > CAT5 run), it should be pretty easy to get some combination of EMP and   > induced current. > H > We have started taking a fool me twice shame on me attitude.  When we I > have a switch port (or usually a group) go out in a storm, we add CAT5  I > lightning arrestors at each end of the CAT5 cable.  It is usually easy  G > to guess which line is the cause.  Just look for the long copper run  ) > that has a damaged device at BOTH ends.  > I Some people have asked me about the CAT5 lightning arrestors that I use.  F   The model I use is the APC PROTECTNET WITH GIGABIT PROTECTION Surge 0 Protection and Filtering, which can be found at:  G http://www.apc.com/resource/include/techspec_index.cfm?base_sku=PNET1GB   D These are grounded fuses, so when they are hit by a large surge the D connection is broken and they must be replaced (or removed from the G circuit).  I paid about $50 each for them, so they are not as cheap as  G cheap D-link (and other low end brand) switches.  I have seen them for  # under $20 on the Internet recently.   G The thing is that one surge on a CAT5 device usually ruins a device at  H each end of the cable and may pass through a switch (especially a cheap I one) and ruin the next device down wire.  Because of the cost I only use  I them where I have already seen a problem.  Remember you need one at each   end of the cable.   F After a storm has passed and I have had one blow it's fuse, I usually G just have someone one site remove it from the circuit until I can send  G them a replacement.  This causes fewer trip to remote sites for me and   they get going more quickly.   Hope that helps a few people.  --     Thomas Wirt  Operations Manager, IS Dept. Kittle's Home Furnishings  Indianapolis, IN   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 15:27:37 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> ( Subject: Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?9 Message-ID: <78udnQTi46eofibZnZ2dnUVZ_uudnZ2d@libcom.com>    Mark Daniel wrote: > Dave Froble wrote: >> Mark Daniel wrote:  >>C >>> For an environment touting it's availability it's always a bit  E >>> disconcerting/disappointing/discouraging when the primary portal  G >>> doesn't respond.  Second time in almost as many weeks I've gone to  . >>> check What's New and received no response. >>> # >>> KLAATU$ ping h71000.www7.hp.com : >>> PING openvms.compaq.com (161.114.65.60): 56 data bytes. >>> ----openvms.compaq.com PING Statistics----? >>> 4 packets transmitted, 0 packets received, 100% packet loss % >>> %SYSTEM-F-TIMEOUT, device timeout  >>> I >>> Not just my particular system or part of the Net either.  I've tried  / >>> it from four hosts across three continents.  >> >>G >> While not addressing the no response issue, perhaps the server does  F >> not have ping enabled?  I've run into more than a few mail and DNS 3 >> servers that are configured to not support ping.  >  > You were correct Dave.? > Even though my Web page is now populated it still won't ping.   F Like you, I use ping to determine connectivity.  I totally understand 4 why it's disabled, but it sure is a pain in the ass.   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450> Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com DFE Ultralights, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 20:02:09 GMT , From: Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com>( Subject: Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?0 Message-ID: <51Sug.624$Ir3.562@news.cpqcorp.net>   Bob Koehler wrote:  F >    While I'm not at all sure that HP still runs that site under VMS,  7    The OpenVMS external web site runs on OpenVMS Alpha.   I    I haven't checked recently to see if it's a single node or a cluster,  + just to determine if it was up and running.    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 20:45:00 GMT , From: "warren sander" <warren.sander@hp.com>( Subject: Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?0 Message-ID: <gFSug.629$lu3.344@news.cpqcorp.net>   Trying to handle everything   I 1) ping et al will not work for any hp.com type node cause the firewall's & block all that stuff. And you can only traceroute to the firewall.   K 2) the server is a DS20E 833 dual processor, 2GB memory running OpenVMS 7.3  and Apache 1.3. K It's running 7.3 because of access issues with updating the OS on 3 systems F at the same time (my development, mirror and deployment systems). If IJ upgrade I need to update a systems in 3 seperate facilities to the same OSK version before I mirror any content out on the off chance that a script etc I stops working (And a couple of my scripts think they know stuff about the L inside of VMS that they really shouldn't but were written before some of theE current interfaces were created and since they work they haven't been K re-written). I've been waiting for approval of Integrity systems to replace H the AlphaServer's so I can start anew but that's taking more time than I have wanted (3 years so far).   J 3) The problem is the switch that the externals server is connected to. ItK went out last month on a weekend also and didn't sound the alarm. They just K rebooted it last time as it was the first time. This time some more looking L around and scratching of heads leads them to not knowing why it didn't causeJ an alarm which would have gotten attention and the off-air would have onlyJ been about 20 minutes on a saturday morning. They are going to replace theL switch tomorrow AM (probably just move the cables someplace else) and figure out off-line the alarm issue.   K 4) I think I have one of only a couple of OpenVMS systems connected to HP's F external network (the testdrive systems are the only other ones I know about).   J 5) the original OpenVMS server was based on OSU in 1995 and was an illegalL cluster configuration of 2 AS200 4/233 (mustang) systems SCSI clustered to aH BA232 pizza box. One of the mustangs was donated to the Digital InternetK group as the original digital.com search engine running altavista software. I Not the altavista main server but just an search of the digital.com sites L (like search.hp.com is today). Anyway we broke up the cluster cause we neverL failed over in 2+ years decided that one system was ok and a site search wasI a better use of the resource. Then we got AS1000's to replace the mustang J and sometime in there we switched over to purveyor as the web server. WhenD they got CSWS done I was asked to switch over to apache which I did.J About 4 years ago the Tru64 UNIX AS1000 started having some memory issues.K And there were a number of DS20's scheduled to be crushed. Working with the I folks that host the servers we managed to save a couple of the DS20's and F use them for the Tru64 UNIX and OpenVMS servers. Which is where we are today.  B 6) JF the only logical conclusion that you can make is reliance onK technology to alert you to problems and not providing a method to 'ring the H alert yourself' is an issue that HP and many other companies are findingK themselves having with reduced staffing levels and higher needs for service 2 levels. This has been taken care of at this point.  I 7) the server has been up for 13 days (I had to restart it to add another H server to the system (Yes I run more that just he OpenVMS server on thisI hardware). The Alpha has been up for 132 days I don't remember why it was H rebooted. It was either patches or a power shutdown in the facility or a1 power failure. Before that it was up over a year.   G 8) back in 1995 we put together some pages that would let you execute a  couple of show commands:E http://h71000.www7.hp.com/cgi-bin/show-sys.exe/0 does a show cpu/full C http://h71000.www7.hp.com/cgi-bin/show-sys.exe/1 does a show system C http://h71000.www7.hp.com/cgi-bin/show-sys.exe/2 does a show memory D http://h71000.www7.hp.com/cgi-bin/show-sys.exe/3 does a show cluster9 or go to http://h71000.www7.hp.com/misc/about-server.html                       9 "Hoff Hoffman" <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> wrote in message * news:51Sug.624$Ir3.562@news.cpqcorp.net... > Bob Koehler wrote: > H > >    While I'm not at all sure that HP still runs that site under VMS, > 9 >    The OpenVMS external web site runs on OpenVMS Alpha.  > J >    I haven't checked recently to see if it's a single node or a cluster,- > just to determine if it was up and running.  >  >  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2006 06:06:31 +0930 * From: Mark Daniel <mark.daniel@vsm.com.au>( Subject: Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?0 Message-ID: <12bo0npto6u64a4@corp.supernews.com>   warren sander wrote: > Trying to handle everything  > K > 1) ping et al will not work for any hp.com type node cause the firewall's ( > block all that stuff. And you can only > traceroute to the firewall.   H That's pretty usual.  I should change my nightcap for a thinking cap at 
 that hour.  
 8< snip 8<L > 3) The problem is the switch that the externals server is connected to. ItM > went out last month on a weekend also and didn't sound the alarm. They just   F That would explain my referred-to previous outage.  I tend to do this G sort of browsing over weekends.  I was a bit miffed because I had gone  G to check What's New what seemed like two weekends in a row - I know it  G wasn't quite that short a period - and had not been able to.  I almost  ; commented the first time.  Couldn't help myself the second.   
 8< snip 8<L > 5) the original OpenVMS server was based on OSU in 1995 and was an illegalN > cluster configuration of 2 AS200 4/233 (mustang) systems SCSI clustered to a
 8< snip 8<  9 Thankyou for the potted history and other tidbits Warren.    Regards, Mark Daniel.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2006 01:08:56 +0200 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture.nospam@hispeed.ch> ( Subject: Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?; Message-ID: <85add$44bc1888$50db5015$20711@news.hispeed.ch>     Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote:f > In article <1153124005.176766.77560@35g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, "Ian Miller" <ijm@uk2.net> writes: >> itrc runs on hp-ux  > F > We're not talking about itrc. We're talking about openvms.compaq.com- > (and yes, you're right, itrc runs on PH-UX)  > G > http://toolbar.netcraft.com/site_report?url=http://openvms.compaq.com K > http://toolbar.netcraft.com/site_report?url=http://www.openvms.compaq.com  >   F I see from the options at the top of those pages that Netcraft have a  way to report phishing sites.    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 17 Jul 2006 21:46:21 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> ( Subject: Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?, Message-ID: <44BC3D6D.B4796919@teksavvy.com>   Dave Froble wrote:G > Like you, I use ping to determine connectivity.  I totally understand 6 > why it's disabled, but it sure is a pain in the ass.  G If HP's network were not "blocked", we would have been able to see that E traffic stopped before the VMS node and perhaps send an email to some E netowrk administrator that should be there 7/24. As it stands, we all $ tended to blame the VMS node itself.  E What it does show however is that no matter how disaster tolerant VMS C might be, if it is connected to the net by a single switch, then it % becomes quite vulnerable to downtime.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2006 00:12:16 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> ( Subject: Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?9 Message-ID: <xPOdnXD6zaqwwyHZnZ2dnUVZ_oednZ2d@libcom.com>    w_tom wrote:  I >   One poster in the 15xxx zip code may live where geology tends to make H > transient damage from every ground strike most destructive.  Damage isF > often defined by geology.  Some therefore must make the single pointE > building ground so large as to enclose the building inside either a G > halo or Ufer ground.  Again, protection is defined first and foremost F > by the quality of earthing.  Damage being a human failure.  No earthF > ground means no effective protection.  No way around technology that  > was standard even before WWII.  @ I seem to remember your apathy for the battery backup and surge  protection units.  :-)  H Still, one does what one can.  I have the units supplying power to most B electronics.  I use the RJ45 ports in the units for network lines.  H The problem is that I'm connecting 4 buildings via underground conduit. I   Not very far underground.  I think one is about 6 inches deep, another   maybe 12 inches.  F Electrical entrances are all properly grounded.  The phone lines have C the protection you mentioned.  Unless there is a direct contact, I  I should be protected.  I'm thinking that the several hundred feet in each  E conduit just might be picking up an EMP.  I never would have thought  H this would happen, but I can not find anywhere in the system that isn't 
 protected.  C One note, this last time the telco device must have taken a hit, I  G needed to call for repair.  I've noted your thought that the transient  0 may have hit this from inside, not from outside.   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450> Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com DFE Ultralights, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jul 2006 21:50:54 -0700 From: "w_tom" <w_tom1@usa.net>( Subject: Re: http://h71000.www7.hp.com/?C Message-ID: <1153198254.616750.171300@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>   B  Little difference whether a cable is overhead or underground.  AnF example.  Lightning strikes the other building.  Lightning seeks earthE that is some four miles distant from that building.  Your building is A in that path.  What is the shortest path, electrically, from that F building to earthborne charges four miles away?  Via that buried cableG and through electronics inside your building, then to earth, and onward D for four miles.  Your electronics are now in a destructive path that included buried cable.  E   EMP is so trivial that even an NE-2 neon glow lamp (a bulb rated in @ milliamps) will make such transients irrelevant.  If a transientF overwhelmed protection already inside appliances, this it was not EMP. It was a direct strike.   @   Every incoming wire in every cable that enters a building mustB connect to a common earthing electrode, either by direct (hardwire? connection) or via a protector.  In most buildings, only one AC G electric wire is grounded.  Other AC electric wires are ungrounded (due E to no 'whole house' protector) and therefore connect nearby lightning C directly into electronics.  With only one AC electric wire grounded E means AC electric is not sufficiently earthed.  Most all buildings do F not have sufficent earthing ('whole house' protectors) on AC electric.E No 'whole house' protector on AC electric means AC electric wires are  not properly earthed.   G   This figure from an industry professional demonstrates two structures B with single point ground.  Even a buried wire must connect to that$ earthing before entering a building.@    http://www.erico.com/public/library/fep/technotes/tncr002.pdf  G   Electronics already contain internal protection.  Protection that can D be overwhelmed if a destructive surge is not earthed before enteringG the building.  My apathy for adjacent protectors is because anything at E the electronics that will protect those electronics is already inside ? electronics.  Experience has demonstrated how adjacent (and not G earthed) protectors even contributed to damage of adjacent (and powered  off) electronics.   =   Many reasons why telco lines are not 'most often' struck by G lightning.  One is that AC electric lines are above telephone lines and G therefore protect those phone lines.  A most common source of damage to E telephone appliances are transients that enter on AC electric.  There B are exceptions.  But this typical example also demonstrates how toF identify those exceptions.  Bottom line - the analysis must answer howG lightning traveled to get to earth.  The solution must change that path @ so that the transient finds earth without entering the building.E Earthing is THE most critical protection component in a building wide 	 solution.      Dave Froble wrote:A > I seem to remember your apathy for the battery backup and surge  > protection units.  :-) > I > Still, one does what one can.  I have the units supplying power to most D > electronics.  I use the RJ45 ports in the units for network lines. > I > The problem is that I'm connecting 4 buildings via underground conduit. J >   Not very far underground.  I think one is about 6 inches deep, another > maybe 12 inches. > G > Electrical entrances are all properly grounded.  The phone lines have D > the protection you mentioned.  Unless there is a direct contact, IJ > should be protected.  I'm thinking that the several hundred feet in eachF > conduit just might be picking up an EMP.  I never would have thoughtI > this would happen, but I can not find anywhere in the system that isn't  > protected. > D > One note, this last time the telco device must have taken a hit, IH > needed to call for repair.  I've noted your thought that the transient2 > may have hit this from inside, not from outside.   ------------------------------   Date: 17 Jul 2006 17:26:47 GMT From: healyzh@aracnet.com & Subject: Re: update SCSI to IDE bridge, Message-ID: <e9gh8n025gr@enews1.newsguy.com>   tomarsin2015@comcast.net wrote: K > able to see the drive. No matter what bridge I used the VAXs will not see H > the drive. I was thinking of trying the bridges on a CMD 22X qbus scsiK > controller, but with the luck I am having with the VAX I may not even try K > it. I was really hoping they would work on the VAX. If anything does work # > on a VAX I will post the results.   J I for one would be really interested in knowing if the CMD controller willH see the drive.  Does the controller support the ability to hook a serial, terminal up to it and see what is connected?  K I'm more than a little suprised that you're unable to see the drives on the I VAXen.  Is this from the hardware prompt, or from VMS?  If from VMS, what  version?   	Zane    ------------------------------    Date: 17 Jul 2006 15:49:13 -07001 From: "nnc@eta.chalmers.se" <nnc@eta.chalmers.se> & Subject: Re: update SCSI to IDE bridgeB Message-ID: <1153176553.804488.69300@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com>  4 May I guess that this is a problem of sector size !?  D VAX:es usually requires 512 byte sectors on disc, as opposed to most< modern computers (PC:s etc.) that works on 256 byte sectors.  F Compare this problem to the very few CD brands that might be hooked onG the SCSI-bus of a Vax - and for these, a jumper has to be moved to tell # the drive to work in 512 Byte mode!   < Happy trying, and please reconfigure the bridge, if possble,( thereafter, tell the result to the list!   /G. I. =C5hling    healyzh@aracnet.com wrote:! > tomarsin2015@comcast.net wrote: L > > able to see the drive. No matter what bridge I used the VAXs will not s= eeJ > > the drive. I was thinking of trying the bridges on a CMD 22X qbus scsiL > > controller, but with the luck I am having with the VAX I may not even t= ryL > > it. I was really hoping they would work on the VAX. If anything does wo= rk% > > on a VAX I will post the results.  > L > I for one would be really interested in knowing if the CMD controller willJ > see the drive.  Does the controller support the ability to hook a serial. > terminal up to it and see what is connected? > L > I'm more than a little suprised that you're unable to see the drives on t= heK > VAXen.  Is this from the hardware prompt, or from VMS?  If from VMS, what 
 > version? >=20 > 	Zane    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2006 02:37:24 GMT % From: Roger Ivie <rivie@ridgenet.net> & Subject: Re: update SCSI to IDE bridge3 Message-ID: <slrneboib4.lhm.rivie@stench.no.domain>   ? On 2006-07-17, nnc@eta.chalmers.se <nnc@eta.chalmers.se> wrote: 6 > May I guess that this is a problem of sector size !? > F > VAX:es usually requires 512 byte sectors on disc, as opposed to most> > modern computers (PC:s etc.) that works on 256 byte sectors. > H > Compare this problem to the very few CD brands that might be hooked onI > the SCSI-bus of a Vax - and for these, a jumper has to be moved to tell % > the drive to work in 512 Byte mode!   B For hard disks, both VAX and PC (and everyone else) are 512 bytes.  ? For CD/DVD, VAX is 512 bytes and the rest of the world is 2048.  --  
 roger ivie rivie@ridgenet.net   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2006.396 ************************