1 INFO-VAX	Tue, 02 May 2006	Volume 2006 : Issue 242       Contents: Re: ACCOUNTNG.DAT  Re: ACCOUNTNG.DAT + Amount of free space in a bound volume set? / Re: Amount of free space in a bound volume set? / Re: Amount of free space in a bound volume set?  Baltimore area VMS Positions Re: Capturing console activity Re: Capturing console activity Re: Capturing console activity8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 RE: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix8 Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix Re: decnet vs decnet over IP) Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TL - Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TL - Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TL - Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TL - Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TL - Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TL - Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TL - Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TL > Re: HP TCPIP SMTP setup for Process PMAS, is it even possible?> Re: HP TCPIP SMTP setup for Process PMAS, is it even possible? Re: hypothetical question  Re: hypothetical question  Re: hypothetical question  Re: hypothetical question  Re: hypothetical question  Re: hypothetical question  Re: hypothetical question  Re: hypothetical question  Re: hypothetical question   My employer needs VMS programmer$ Re: My employer needs VMS programmer$ Re: My employer needs VMS programmer$ Re: My employer needs VMS programmer	 NEdit 5.5 ( Re: Need help with stalled printer queue( Re: Need help with stalled printer queue# Need rackmount  as1000 type chassis ' Re: Need rackmount  as1000 type chassis & Re: Need rackmount as1000 type chassis Re: OpenVMS fanclub in Orkut Re: OpenVMS fanclub in Orkut$ Re: Semi-OT: Changes coming at Intel This weeks Boot Camp Update  Re: TIMEPROMPTWAIT problem, Re: UC07 with BA350/RZ28 disk spinup problem, Re: UC07 with BA350/RZ28 disk spinup problem, Re: UC07 with BA350/RZ28 disk spinup problem& Web front-end for student registration* Re: Web front-end for student registration* Re: Web front-end for student registration  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 13:43:19 -0400 3 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <rgilbert88@comcast.net>  Subject: Re: ACCOUNTNG.DAT: Message-ID: <uMCdnQVjoIEl1cvZnZ2dnUVZ_vGdnZ2d@comcast.com>  / Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: J > My ACCOUNTNG.DAT file has grown quite large.  How can one generate a newI > ACCOUNTNG.DAT file?  (If I can generate a new one, then I can move the  2 > old one somewhere else where I have more space.) > J > Is it possible to move the active ACCOUNTNG.DAT file off the system diskA > (via a logical name such as one can do with, e.g., SYSUAF)?  If ! > possible, is this a good idea?   >    $ SET ACCOUNTING /NEW FILE  G One can do similar things with the SYS$MANAGER:SECURITY.AUDIT$JOURNAL,  G and OPERATOR.LOG.  It should be part of a regular monthly or quarterly  G cleanup.  The techniques differ for various files but a little digging  G should turn up the proper way to do it for each file that concerns you.    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 14:55:52 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>  Subject: Re: ACCOUNTNG.DAT, Message-ID: <445659B3.235F3C6C@teksavvy.com>  / Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote:  > J > My ACCOUNTNG.DAT file has grown quite large.  How can one generate a newH > ACCOUNTNG.DAT file?  (If I can generate a new one, then I can move the2 > old one somewhere else where I have more space.)   SET ACCOUNTING/NEW_FILE & rename accountng.dat;-1  new_file.name   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 13:48:01 -0700 , From: "rcyoung" <rcyoung@aliconsultants.com>4 Subject: Amount of free space in a bound volume set?C Message-ID: <1146516481.458807.182570@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   : Does anyone have a code example (DCL or C) for determining  $ 1) Is a disk a bound volume set? and< 2) What is the amount of free space on the bound volume set?  F I have pieces of the answer ( f$getdvi is used, and one has to do someA looping ) , but was hoping for a clearer example than what I have G on-hand (which is mainly a rough verbal description, and lacks detail).    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 18:48:47 -04007 From: "Tom Simpson" <thomas.simpson1@fubar.comcast.net> 8 Subject: Re: Amount of free space in a bound volume set?0 Message-ID: <Ov2dnSXfqcLPDcvZRVn-sw@comcast.com>  ? Check the DISK_REPORT.COM procedure on http://dcl.openvms.org/.  It works for bound volume sets.   / Essentially, if  F$GetDvI(nextdev,"NEXTDEVNAM") G contains a device name, you have a volume set.  Loop until the lexical   returns empty quotes.    Regards, Tom   8 "rcyoung" <rcyoung@aliconsultants.com> wrote in message = news:1146516481.458807.182570@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... < > Does anyone have a code example (DCL or C) for determining > & > 1) Is a disk a bound volume set? and> > 2) What is the amount of free space on the bound volume set? > H > I have pieces of the answer ( f$getdvi is used, and one has to do someC > looping ) , but was hoping for a clearer example than what I have I > on-hand (which is mainly a rough verbal description, and lacks detail).  >    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 23:41:28 GMT , From: Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com>8 Subject: Re: Amount of free space in a bound volume set?2 Message-ID: <I0x5g.7058$mh5.3233@news.cpqcorp.net>   rcyoung wrote:< > Does anyone have a code example (DCL or C) for determining > & > 1) Is a disk a bound volume set? and> > 2) What is the amount of free space on the bound volume set?    F    I almost always prefer to head the other way, and to move the data H along onto controller-based RAID or onto StorageWorks RAID (host-based) F striping or (more commonly possible for many of the bound-volume sets  I've seen) to larger disks.   I    What sorts of disk device(s) and controller(s) are involved here, and  , how much aggregate disk storage is required?  I    It's been my experience that a number of the sites now considering or  I still using bound-volume sets could usually replace the existing smaller  C (and usually very small) disk devices with a single and far larger   (used) disk device.   E    There are distinct limits around bound volume sets, as well, both  E operationally and around requirements specifically for data recovery.    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 02 May 2006 00:36:00 GMT & From: "Hal Kuff" <halkuff@verizon.net>% Subject: Baltimore area VMS Positions + Message-ID: <QPx5g.11319$Un3.6336@trnddc05>   F If you know of anyone looking for an OpenVMS position in the Baltimore: Maryland area we have three permanent full time positions.  >       Sorry, telecommuting is not feasible for these positions    > Referal fees to individuals are available if you know someone.    / OpenVMS Instance Owner/Mid Level System Manager H   * Superior DCL Skills, some decent knowledge of programming languages, RMS JournalingE   * Synergex DBL (DIBOL) Business Programmers.. multi-year project to @ convert existing DBL applications to Web Services; then you will& transition to an ERP or Java position.     Kuff at Tessco Dot Com 410-229-1589   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 13:50:54 -0500 @ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>' Subject: Re: Capturing console activity 6 Message-ID: <4456588E.A9E0D64F@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>   JF Mezei wrote:  >  > "David J. Dachtera" wrote:I > > Maybe what is needed is SYSDUMP.TXT containing all the text that also D > > appears on the console, with a "best effort" attempt only before4 > > abandoning and returning to the usual code path. > G > Perhaps an enhancement to the OPA0: driver so that it can log to file J > all output and input. And this would be great for autiding purposes too.  / Perhaps a bit too much for it to be doing, IMO.   F > Amd since EFI based systems have access to a file system even at theD > console level, perhaps they could have firmware that would log all1 > console activity to a file in an EFI partition.   7 ...and when that file fills up the EFI partition, ... ?    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 16:44:00 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> ' Subject: Re: Capturing console activity , Message-ID: <44567305.81DCEFEF@teksavvy.com>   "David J. Dachtera" wrote:H > > Amd since EFI based systems have access to a file system even at theF > > console level, perhaps they could have firmware that would log all3 > > console activity to a file in an EFI partition.  > 9 > ...and when that file fills up the EFI partition, ... ?   A The console becomes stalled, and you need to call an expensive HP G repairman to come in, zap your disk drive fully and recreate your whole  cluster from scractch :-)   B A slide at a recent presentation showed that the EFI partition wasE somewhere like 256,000 blocks. Shirley the VMS_LOADER.EFI files isn't 0 that big and there would be room for a log file.  H And if it is full, then perhaps it can just stop logging with a warning.F But since the EFI log file would only be actiove when the system is inE EFI mode, there wouldn't need to be much logging to be done. Consider F the value of logging the IP address of the telnet client who connectedC to the EFI console for instance, logging the usernames used to gain F access to the console etc, as well as the early booting messages until VMS takes over.    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 23:59:26 GMT + From: Jack Patteeuw <jjpatteeuw@nospam.net> ' Subject: Re: Capturing console activity > Message-ID: <yhx5g.64387$_S7.45524@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com>   glen.thompson@gmail.com wrote:* > System: OpenVMS 7.2 on a Vaxstation 4000 > I > Our system console is a Decwriter printing terminal because the log was I > required many years ago by our internal audit department.  We'd like to H > get rid of the Decwriter and replace it with one of our spare VTs.  IsF > there anyway to automatically capture all the activity on the systemI > console?  I'd like an electronic version of what is currently on paper, 7 > including both operator input and output displayed.    > 	 > Thanks,  > glen >     H Nothing better than the old Polycenter Console Manager !  We still have F it running at 3 different sites on some old Alpha workstation running G Tru64 (sigh, IMHO, the BEST Un*X ever! ; I still can't believe that HP   dropped porting AdvFS)  D I use SSH to log into the Console Manager box so I know its secure !   Jack   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 11:15:13 -0700 $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix B Message-ID: <1146507313.506028.98220@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups.com>   david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote: Y > In article <4452d96f@usenet01.boi.hp.com>, "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com> writes:  > > 5 > >"Rob Brown" <mylastname@gmcl.com> wrote in message B > >news:Pine.LNX.4.61.0604281211340.19111@localhost.localdomain... > > E > >> > Why include Unix?  In Unix, no filename (or extension) has any J > >> > implicit meaning.  Applications may impart meaning, but the OS just > >> > don't care. > >>1 > >> I think that the same is true in VMS or RSX.  > >> > >  > >    .DIR  > >  >  > $ dir test.dir# > %DIRECT-W-NOFILES, no files found  > $ edit test.dir  > aaaaaa > ctrl-Z >  > Directory DATA1:[000000] >  > TEST.DIR;1 >  > Total of 1 file. >  > $ typ test.dir > aaaaaa >  > $  > I > A VMS directory may have to have a .DIR extension but that doesn't mean 2 > every file with a .DIR extension is a directory.  @ True, but the converse doesn't hold: you can't have a functionalE directory that *doesn't* end in .DIR;1 . IOW, any file that functions ' as a directory *has* to end in .DIR;1 .   Q > As to no filename (or extension) in Unix having any implicit meaning what about A > the two "filenames" which exist in every directory  ie . and .. J > This is at least on a par with the VMS .DIR requirement for a directory.   Good point.    > David Webb [...]    AEF    ------------------------------    Date: 01 May 2006 14:18:02 -04003 From: Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix . Message-ID: <mdd3bftd2xx.fsf@panix5.panix.com>  = koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:   E >    Except, of course, that all the UNIX compilers have no idea what 5 >    thier input is without looking at the extension.    Oh, horseshit.   --  L Rich Alderson                                       | /"\ ASCII ribbon     |L news@alderson.users.panix.com                       | \ / campaign against |L "You get what anybody gets. You get a lifetime."    |  x  HTML mail and    |L                          --Death, of the Endless    | / \ postings         |   ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 14:26:36 -04001 From: "Farrell, Michael" <MFarrell@Voltdelta.com> A Subject: RE: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix L Message-ID: <085BCCCF596B684092B66310B1D3BA7D0240E0C0@NJ103EX1.EAST.VIS.COM>  B Check out the new "/wild" switch in Search re: your need to search "begins with" or "ends with".    Mike Farrell   -----Original Message-----H From: David J. Dachtera [mailto:djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net]=20' Sent: Saturday, April 29, 2006 10:53 PM  To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix    "Richard B. Gilbert" wrote:  >=20 > AEF wrote: > > Simon Clubley wrote: > > G > >>In article <1145989404.330424.164290@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,  bob@instantwhip.com writes:  > >>D > >>>why do users want convuluted unix commands like pipe grep slurp? > >>>gulp ... when they use common english makes sense commands  > >>>like COPY on vms? > >>>  > >>< > >>Pipe is a DCL command. Unix uses redirection characters. > >>@ > >>Those Unix commands are generally more powerful than the VMS
 equivalent= > >>and naming commands using English words only goes so far.  > >>C > >>For example, what English verbs and qualifiers would you use to  describeF > >>the functionality that ghostscript offers and by the time that you haveF > >>finished have you really gained anything over the current approach
 (as people2 > >>still have to learn what your qualifiers do) ? > >>+ > >>Two examples of more powerful commands: ? > >>      grep (the Unix version of search) can do full regular 
 expression > >>      pattern matching.  > >  > > C > > Can it do something like $ SEARCH FILE.TYP WORD1,WORD2,... with G > > /MATCH=3D(one of OR, NOR, AND, NAND, ...) Maybe it can ... I'm just ( > > asking but I think the answer is no. > >  >=208 > You are right about that.  But, OTOH, can SEARCH find:7 > 1. a record that "begins with" a string or a pattern? 5 > 2. a record that "ends with" a string or a pattern?   F For 1 & 2, see HELP SEARCH /KEY, with the caveat that "ends with" will# be limited to fixed-length records.   D > 3. find a record containing one or more spaces followed by exactly three G > decimal digits, then one upper case alphabetic character and then one  or > more spaces?????  . Convoluted, but possible though not practical.   --=20  David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 13:52:24 -0500 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix 3 Message-ID: <nv0Lm1TpP+TW@eisner.encompasserve.org>   W In article <4bmjnoF12ekovU1@individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:   L > Sorry, the compilers are not part of Unix, they are applications and whileJ > all I have at the moment is gcc, I expect your right about the behaviour, > but wrong about the source of the problem.  ?    UNIX without a C compiler is like a baguette without butter.    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 13:43:28 -0500 @ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix 6 Message-ID: <445656D0.A6669895@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>   david20@alpha2.mdx.ac.uk wrote:  > Y > In article <4452d96f@usenet01.boi.hp.com>, "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com> writes:  > > 5 > >"Rob Brown" <mylastname@gmcl.com> wrote in message B > >news:Pine.LNX.4.61.0604281211340.19111@localhost.localdomain... > > E > >> > Why include Unix?  In Unix, no filename (or extension) has any J > >> > implicit meaning.  Applications may impart meaning, but the OS just > >> > don't care. > >>1 > >> I think that the same is true in VMS or RSX.  > >> > >  > >    .DIR  > >  >  > $ dir test.dir# > %DIRECT-W-NOFILES, no files found  > $ edit test.dir  > aaaaaa > ctrl-Z >  > Directory DATA1:[000000] >  > TEST.DIR;1 >  > Total of 1 file. >  > $ typ test.dir > aaaaaa >  > $  > I > A VMS directory may have to have a .DIR extension but that doesn't mean 2 > every file with a .DIR extension is a directory.  ? However, a .DIR;1 file without the "is a directory" flag set is " generally considered a corruption.  Q > As to no filename (or extension) in Unix having any implicit meaning what about A > the two "filenames" which exist in every directory  ie . and .. J > This is at least on a par with the VMS .DIR requirement for a directory.  D Well, yes and no. IMHO, these equate more to the [000000] entry in aF rooted logical "directory" (as in SYS$SPECIFIC:[000000]) (".") and the5 backlink FID entry ("..") of a directory file itself.   G Using "." to indicate the current (position, default, etc.) is a common  convention.   B Remember also the "..." expression (parent directory of the parent directory).    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 13:54:13 -0500 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix 3 Message-ID: <mm5szi5aa3c8@eisner.encompasserve.org>   i In article <1146507313.506028.98220@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups.com>, "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> writes:  > B > True, but the converse doesn't hold: you can't have a functionalG > directory that *doesn't* end in .DIR;1 . IOW, any file that functions ) > as a directory *has* to end in .DIR;1 .   A    Most operations on an ODS-5 disk will succeed with .dir;1, but 0    analyze/disk_structure considers it an error.   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 13:58:01 -0500 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix 3 Message-ID: <LLYoxaZqgBDO@eisner.encompasserve.org>   d In article <mdd3bftd2xx.fsf@panix5.panix.com>, Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> writes:? > koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:  > F >>    Except, of course, that all the UNIX compilers have no idea what6 >>    thier input is without looking at the extension. >  > Oh, horseshit.      Slip slidin' away:    $ cat > a.a  #include <stdio.h> main ()  {     printf("Hello world\n");  }    $ cc a.a4 a.a: file not recognized: File format not recognized# collect2: ld returned 1 exit status    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 15:15:42 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix , Message-ID: <44565E58.47108399@teksavvy.com>   Bill Gunshannon wrote:L > Sorry, the compilers are not part of Unix, they are applications and whileJ > all I have at the moment is gcc, I expect your right about the behaviour, > but wrong about the source of the problem.  B File extension and compilers would be an OS issue if the operatingC system had a single "COMPILE" command which then looked at the file 0 extension to determine which compiler to invoke.  F As it stands UNIX and VMS do not have such a generic "COMPILE" commandB and each compiler is free to use a DEFAULT extension if you do notB provide it. It is the user who chooses which compiler to invoke by: issuing a command assocaiated with that specific compiler.    G On VMS, CC CHOCOLATE.CAKE is perfectly valid and will work fine if that E file contains valid C code. It will generate by default CHOCOLATE.OBJ & unless I specify another outpout file.  A Similalry, the linker uses a default .OBJ file type if one is not  supplied with the input files.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 15:25:09 -0400 # From: sol gongola <sol@adldata.com> A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix / Message-ID: <1146511526.73391@nntp.acecape.com>    Bob Koehler wrote:f > In article <mdd3bftd2xx.fsf@panix5.panix.com>, Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> writes:@ >> koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: >>G >>>    Except, of course, that all the UNIX compilers have no idea what 7 >>>    thier input is without looking at the extension.  >> Oh, horseshit.  >  >    Slip slidin' away:  > 
 > $ cat > a.a  > #include <stdio.h>	 > main ()  > {  >    printf("Hello world\n");  > }  > 
 > $ cc a.a6 > a.a: file not recognized: File format not recognized% > collect2: ld returned 1 exit status  > 6 The unix c compiler uses the extension to determine if1 it is a c source to compile or an object to link.   7 It may not be able to use the magic number in the first 9 line since a source filoe may have a comment looking like  a magic number.    ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 20:08:46 GMT ( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix , Message-ID: <4bn86eF11vuqpU1@individual.net>  3 In article <nv0Lm1TpP+TW@eisner.encompasserve.org>, > 	koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:Y > In article <4bmjnoF12ekovU1@individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:  > M >> Sorry, the compilers are not part of Unix, they are applications and while K >> all I have at the moment is gcc, I expect your right about the behaviour - >> but wrong about the source of the problem.  > A >    UNIX without a C compiler is like a baguette without butter.   H One of the most noticable changes when SunOS died and Solaris (aka SysV)F was foisted on the world was the lack of a C compiler.  Not surprisingE when you realize that the creators of SysV did not ship compilers, by E default, with any of their systems (3B2, 3B15, 3B20 and even the baby ; 3B1 aka UnixPC).  Compilers were separately priced options.      bill   --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 20:15:12 GMT ( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix , Message-ID: <4bn8igF11vuqpU2@individual.net>  3 In article <LLYoxaZqgBDO@eisner.encompasserve.org>, > 	koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:f > In article <mdd3bftd2xx.fsf@panix5.panix.com>, Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> writes:@ >> koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: >>  G >>>    Except, of course, that all the UNIX compilers have no idea what 7 >>>    thier input is without looking at the extension.  >>   >> Oh, horseshit.  >  >    Slip slidin' away:  > 
 > $ cat > a.a  > #include <stdio.h>	 > main ()  > {  >    printf("Hello world\n");  > }  > 
 > $ cc a.a6 > a.a: file not recognized: File format not recognized% > collect2: ld returned 1 exit status   F That's a GCCism.  It returns the same message on Windows under Cygwin.C If I have the chance I will try to see if I have anything available C at home that uses a compiler other than GCC.  But, again, that's an B application (the compiler) problem and has nothing to do with UnixF which has already stepped into the background by the time the file is J opened.  Unix, didn't care about the extension and happily passes anything to the compiler.   bill     --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 16:25:31 -0500 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix 3 Message-ID: <NVXZhCcG5FZb@eisner.encompasserve.org>   W In article <4bn8igF11vuqpU2@individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:   H > That's a GCCism.  It returns the same message on Windows under Cygwin.  C    Non-GNU compilers on UNIX have the same problem.  Only the error ?    text varies.  The CC command looks at .c, .i, .o, .s, ... to G    determine whether the input file is C source, preprocessed C source,     object, assembly, ...   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 16:23:30 -0500 ; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix 3 Message-ID: <IsU0rDc60Qkg@eisner.encompasserve.org>   U In article <1146511526.73391@nntp.acecape.com>, sol gongola <sol@adldata.com> writes:   8 > The unix c compiler uses the extension to determine if3 > it is a c source to compile or an object to link.       Hey, that's what I said.    ------------------------------  * Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 23:59:59 +0000 (UTC)1 From: legalize+jeeves@mail.xmission.com (Richard) A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix , Message-ID: <e367dv$br7$1@news.xmission.com>  / [Please do not mail me a copy of your followup]   ; koehler@eisner.aspm.encompasserve.org spake the secret code / <jKlDGOpHZJLV@eisner.encompasserve.org> thusly:   D >   Except, of course, that all the UNIX compilers have no idea what4 >   thier input is without looking at the extension.  
 Bzzt.  Sorry:        xmission 29> cat > a.a     #include <stdio.h>     int main()     {         printf("Hello, world!\n");       return 0;      }      xmission 30> gcc -x c a.a      xmission 31> ./a.out     Hello, world!      xmission 32>    > You just have to supply a command-line option to tell it which language its compiling.  --  E "The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline"-- code samples, sample chapter, FAQ: 3           <http://www.xmission.com/~legalize/book/> ( 	    Pilgrimage: Utah's annual demoparty,                <http://pilgrimage.scene.org>   ------------------------------  * Date: Tue, 2 May 2006 00:01:09 +0000 (UTC)1 From: legalize+jeeves@mail.xmission.com (Richard) A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix , Message-ID: <e367g5$br7$2@news.xmission.com>  / [Please do not mail me a copy of your followup]   & bill@cs.uofs.edu spake the secret code( <4bn86eF11vuqpU1@individual.net> thusly:  I >One of the most noticable changes when SunOS died and Solaris (aka SysV) = >was foisted on the world was the lack of a C compiler. [...]   I Wasn't the big irony here that this gave a huge kick in the pants to gcc?  --  E "The Direct3D Graphics Pipeline"-- code samples, sample chapter, FAQ: 3           <http://www.xmission.com/~legalize/book/> ( 	    Pilgrimage: Utah's annual demoparty,                <http://pilgrimage.scene.org>   ------------------------------   Date: 2 May 2006 00:59:53 GMT ( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)A Subject: Re: DCL versus Unix CLIs, was: Re: File output like Unix , Message-ID: <4bnp89F12871vU1@individual.net>  3 In article <NVXZhCcG5FZb@eisner.encompasserve.org>, > 	koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:Y > In article <4bn8igF11vuqpU2@individual.net>, bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon) writes:  > I >> That's a GCCism.  It returns the same message on Windows under Cygwin.  > E >    Non-GNU compilers on UNIX have the same problem.  Only the error A >    text varies.  The CC command looks at .c, .i, .o, .s, ... to I >    determine whether the input file is C source, preprocessed C source,  >    object, assembly, ...  J I just tried "cat hello.what |cc -" on Ultrix-11.  It made it all then wayH thru to the last phase even creating a (non-executable, obviously) a.outH before complaining about an unresolved "_main".  So at least some of the: phases didn't care about the total absence of a file name.  < Wish I had some others available, but at the moment I don't.   bill        --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 17:36:10 -0400 % From: Shugbear <shugbear@comcast.net> % Subject: Re: decnet vs decnet over IP , Message-ID: <4bnd9mF12i6p8U1@individual.net>   Richard Maher wrote: > Hi Javier, > : >> This emulates DECnet from the application point of view > M > Interesting. How transparent is it? Does it relace the _NET: driver on VMS? L > Is there some sort of socket library on Windows that mirrors the pathworks > one? >   > 	If DECnet is not running then the MultiNet NOTDRIVER replacesB the NETDRIVER.  If DECnet is running then it wedges itself between# the applications and the NETDRIVER.   < 	Here is a link to the documentation for "DECnet application@ services" which in the past was also called DECnot and Phase-IP:    = http://www.process.com/tcpip/mndocs51/MESSAGES/Ch06.htm#E29E7    regards  Mike     --  K +-------------------------------------------------------------------------+ D Michael Corbett                           Email: Corbett@process.comB Process Software                          Phone: 800 722-7770 x369B 959 Concord St.                                  508 879-6994 x369= Framingham MA 01701-4682                  FAX:   508 879-0042    ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 13:28:30 -0700  From: vmssysmgr@hotmail.com 2 Subject: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TLC Message-ID: <1146515310.777999.129960@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>   C We have quite a few DECserver 90TL's in house connected to external F devices. Right now all communication is done using LAT. We need to get@ LAT off our network so I am looking to switch to TCP/IP. All theE communications are done using QIO's in C code. Can anyone point me to ; documentation on setting up TCP/IP on a DECserver 90TL, and F specifically, the setup for each DECserver port. I've poked around but< the documentation for these old DECservers is pretty sparse.   Thanks Will   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 16:30:29 -0700  From: vmssysmgr@hotmail.com 6 Subject: Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TLB Message-ID: <1146526229.358197.11230@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups.com>  B Sorry for the second post...but I reread my original and figured I. should clarify what I am trying to accomplish.  G What I am hoping for is to be able to use reverse telnet the same way I E now use reverse LAT-- that is, I want to create TNA devices at system D boot that are the functional equivalent of LTA devices. For example,G now I have LTA608, which is port number 8 on decserver 6, via LAT. I am D hoping to be able to use the same software to connect to the new TNA- devices, less the LAT connect QIO, of course.   D So far, I have created one test port using these DECserver commands:  " change telnet listener 2010 port 8( change telnet listener connection enable  8 After doing this, I am able to talk to the device using: $ telnet <ip_address>/port=2010   & Anyone know how to set up TNA devices?   Thanks Will   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 16:56:03 -0700  From: vmssysmgr@hotmail.com 6 Subject: Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TLC Message-ID: <1146527763.258111.193020@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>   D Soon there will be a router between the VMS machines and some of the DECservers.    Will   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 23:52:13 GMT + From: Jack Patteeuw <jjpatteeuw@nospam.net> 6 Subject: Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TL> Message-ID: <Nax5g.64386$_S7.17809@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com>  
 Off topic but    vmssysmgr@hotmail.com wrote: > We need to get > LAT off our network    Why ?    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 19:59:21 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 6 Subject: Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TL, Message-ID: <4456A0C2.7DCC1E4B@teksavvy.com>   vmssysmgr@hotmail.com wrote:I > What I am hoping for is to be able to use reverse telnet the same way I G > now use reverse LAT-- that is, I want to create TNA devices at system 9 > boot that are the functional equivalent of LTA devices.    I am not sure this is possible.   ( But you can look into HELP telnet/create  G It can be used to create TNA devices. However, I believe that the TCPIP C link is established at that time, not at the time that you assign a F channel to it. So if you create the device at boot time, the decserverF prot may be stuck and allcated to "system". (and the TNA device may inA fact disapear when the startup process ends and all its allocated  devices are released).   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 21:34:12 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> 6 Subject: Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TL9 Message-ID: <jJKdnangXY_FK8vZnZ2dnUVZ_uudnZ2d@libcom.com>    vmssysmgr@hotmail.com wrote:F > Soon there will be a router between the VMS machines and some of the
 > DECservers.  >  > Will >   " You could look at a Bridge/Router.   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450> Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com DFE Ultralights, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 20:38:41 -0500 @ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>6 Subject: Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TL6 Message-ID: <4456B821.CCA28664@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>   vmssysmgr@hotmail.com wrote: > F > Soon there will be a router between the VMS machines and some of the
 > DECservers.   @ Any router worth the money will support transparent bridging andH protocol-specific prioritization. You'll have to press your net-guys for a better excuse than that.   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 20:44:20 -0500 @ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>6 Subject: Re: Help configuring telnet on DECserver 90TL6 Message-ID: <4456B974.9B9529C7@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>   vmssysmgr@hotmail.com wrote: > D > Sorry for the second post...but I reread my original and figured I0 > should clarify what I am trying to accomplish. > I > What I am hoping for is to be able to use reverse telnet the same way I G > now use reverse LAT-- that is, I want to create TNA devices at system F > boot that are the functional equivalent of LTA devices. For example,I > now I have LTA608, which is port number 8 on decserver 6, via LAT. I am F > hoping to be able to use the same software to connect to the new TNA/ > devices, less the LAT connect QIO, of course.  > F > So far, I have created one test port using these DECserver commands: > $ > change telnet listener 2010 port 8* > change telnet listener connection enable > : > After doing this, I am able to talk to the device using:! > $ telnet <ip_address>/port=2010  > ( > Anyone know how to set up TNA devices?  6 This will depend on which TCP/IP stack you're running:  % o TCP/IP Services for OpenVMS ("UCX") 
 o Multinet	 o TCPware   C What you end up with, ultimately, is known as a queue running via a $ "stream" or reverse-TELNET symbiont.  E The /ON string usually looks something like "10.10.10.10:9100" or, in E your case, "<ip_address>:2010" for UCX. There should be a print queue ( configuration utility. Check the doc.'s.  H Multinet uses the pseudo-device approach and the target address is found? as the translation of a related logical name. See HELP MULTINET  CONFIGURE /PRINT  = Not sure about TCPware. Boob? Can you provide something here?    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 16:35:12 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> G Subject: Re: HP TCPIP SMTP setup for Process PMAS, is it even possible? , Message-ID: <445670F5.2A508B8F@teksavvy.com>   Rich Jordan wrote:G >      The one time I seemed to get the service to only respond on port G > 2525 (both interfaces) and port 25 (secondary interface only) did not I > survive a reboot; if I can't free up port 25 for PMAS, then I can't run 4 > PMAS on the same system as the TCPIP Services MTA.     HELP SET CONF ENABLE_SERVICE  2 You might wish to SET CONF /NOENABLE SERVICE  SMTP   Then SET NOSERVICE SMTP   F Then look at TCPIP$SERVICE.DAT to ensure that the SMTP record has been	 removed.      G TCPIP$SERVICE.DAT in SYS$COMMON:[SYSEXE] has, as primary key, the first L 28 bytes of the record: This 28 byte key must be unique in the indexed file.   16 bytes -> Service name0 4  bytes -> unknown (seems to always be 0000100) 2 bytes  -> port number + 2 bytes  -> protocol  006 = TCPIP 011 = UDP ! 4 bytes  -> address to listen on.   C For BIND, you'll have two records, one for TCP and another for UDP.   E Note that the SERVICE.DAT database seemes to contain node-independant F information. So it appears it would be impossible in a cluster to haveG one node have "SMTP" listen to port 2025 on all addresses/interfaces on 4 that node, and another node listen to port 25 on allF addresses/interfaces on that node because enabling "SMTP" would enableB all services defined with  name "SMTP".  But by naming the service* differently, you would be able to do that.        A But that isn't all.  TCPIP$CONFIGURATION.DAT contains the list of E services that are enabled on that node. (I think that is what it is). E But it seems to contain only the service name. So I think that if you H enable BIND, it will enable all services named "BIND" (including the TCP' and UDP versions in the above example).   E I think that the main SMTP engine (the symbiont) is defined solely in J the TCPIP$CONFIGURATION.DAT file (hence defined solely with SET CONF SMTP)      G What you might also try is to have the SMTP receiver defined as "ZSMTP" G listening in port 25. Perhaps it will be started after the PMAS service G and thus won't be able to get port 25 if it insists on listening to it.   H So you can use DUMP/REC on the TCPIP$SERVICE.DAT file to ensure that youH no longer have a service defined to listen to port 25.  Then, define the& new PMAS service to listen on port 25.  E This should generate two different and distinct services that are not H related in any way and can be enabled separately. Both could then listen to any interface.   K And based on what I have seen, it should theoretically be possible to have:   & node1: addresses 10.0.0.1 and 10.0.0.2  3 SMTP:  /file=pmas_software/port=25/address=10.0.0.1 4 SMTP:  /file=tcpip$receiver/port=25/address=10.0.0.2  D This should create 2 records in the TCPIP$SERVICE file. And you then, enable service SMTP which would enable both.G The kernel would then only trigger tcpip$receiver when calls come in on  address 10.0.0.2  + this is all "should".... Haven't tested it.   G Note: /address=0.0.0.0  means that the service is enabled automatically E on all interfaces on that node, even interfaces that appear after the  service was started.  E And when using /ADDRESS, only one address can be included per record. D HOWEVER, I do not think that you can modify an existing record whereG there are multiple services of the same name, you need to delete it and  recreate it from scratch.    ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 21:09:50 -0700 ( From: "Rich Jordan" <jordan@ccs4vms.com>G Subject: Re: HP TCPIP SMTP setup for Process PMAS, is it even possible? C Message-ID: <1146542990.820464.237040@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>   I > TCPIP$SERVICE.DAT in SYS$COMMON:[SYSEXE] has, as primary key, the first N > 28 bytes of the record: This 28 byte key must be unique in the indexed file. >  > 16 bytes -> Service name2 > 4  bytes -> unknown (seems to always be 0000100) > 2 bytes  -> port number - > 2 bytes  -> protocol  006 = TCPIP 011 = UDP # > 4 bytes  -> address to listen on.   D I tried using PATCH to just change the port number over the weekend.D The service definition showed port 2525 when running but I still got, SMTP response on port 25 on both interfaces.  A I also tried completely deleting the service as you mentioned and A rebuilding it from scratch, re-enabling, etc.  In that case I did D finally get it responding on port 2525, but still on both interfacesF even though the service was set up to with only the secondary address.C However without the SMTP startup running, required logicals are not  present.  G If you run the SMTP startup after performing this work, the logicals do D get defined, but the queue won't run; I haven't found the error yet.? When I try to connect to port 2525, it connects and immediately D disconnects.  The TCPIP$SMTP_RECV_RUN.LOG file (once verification is turned on) shows:   , $     run SYS$SYSTEM:TCPIP$SMTP_RECEIVER.EXEF SMTP_RECV_INIT: smtp$get_config failed: status: %RMS-E-RNF, record not found B SMTP_RECV_MAIL: init failure: status: %RMS-E-RNF, record not found %RMS-E-RNF, record not found  C I assume its looking for the SMTP record in TCPIP$CONFIGURATION.DAT E file, which of course is gone.  There is a record for the new service  (SMTP2525).   F I have a feeling there may be too much hardcoding going on in there toE get this to work, but I'll keep pounding on it as I have time.  If so  thats a real shame.    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 13:35:39 -0500 @ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>" Subject: Re: hypothetical question6 Message-ID: <445654FB.6E4F7D01@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>   Bob Koehler wrote: > [snip]E >   I do recall the day I was able to install the VMS 3.6 update only G >   because BACKUP was a higher quality product than the cleanliness of  >   my TE16.  G I recall a time when I had a 9-track VMS distro. tape with edge damage, F and I was able to help BACKUP recover the content by removing the headG guard of a TU81 and using a pencil to hold the creased part of the tape E against the head just enough to allow backup to skip forward past the 6 bad spot and recover the data from a redundancy block.   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 22:15:49 +0200 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture.nospam@hispeed.ch> " Subject: Re: hypothetical question; Message-ID: <dc2c9$44566c76$50db5015$32574@news.hispeed.ch>    Bob Koehler wrote:   > J >   I'd not heard of that.  Maybe something in the handling of DLT III.  I >   don't have any.  > I >   It would not surprise me if BACKUP handles newer technology drives in - >   ways different from its 9-track heritage.  >   E It wouldn't surprise me either. I think I probably just got lucky in  ( what were admittedly last ditch efforts.    E >   I do recall the day I was able to install the VMS 3.6 update only G >   because BACKUP was a higher quality product than the cleanliness of  >   my TE16. >   H Yep. I remember banning our hardware engineers from using DSC after one H of them couldn't restore from tape. It was a lesson he didn't forget :-)   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 20:08:37 GMT , From: Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com>" Subject: Re: hypothetical question2 Message-ID: <9Vt5g.7036$ff5.5173@news.cpqcorp.net>   Fred Bach wrote:  @ >    1. Why couldn't you BACKUP an on-disk save-set to mag tape?      That would certainly work.   3    The Saveset Manager package is another approach.   = >    2. Re the COPY operation:  What would happen if you used D >       "COPY/READ/WRITE"  to double-check what was written to tape?E >       Would that even work, and how much would it slow down writing $ >       the backup save-set to tape?  H    When COPY hits a tape error (and tapes are wont to returning these), H it tends to punt the whole operation.  BACKUP tries to recover from the H typical tape errors.  BACKUP assumes tapes are involved, where most DCL H commands can and do assume a (rather more reliable) disk file system is 	 involved.   D    Now as to whether or not this implementation detail (or even the G BACKUP CRC and error recovery processing) really makes a difference on  7 any recent-generation tapes, that's another discussion.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 1 May 2006 17:18:49 -0400 From: norm.raphael@metso.com" Subject: Re: hypothetical questionQ Message-ID: <OF37E45E09.FF3DCA88-ON85257161.0074EC07-85257161.00751484@metso.com>   G Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> wrote on 05/01/2006 04:08:37 PM:    > Fred Bach wrote: > B > >    1. Why couldn't you BACKUP an on-disk save-set to mag tape? >  >    That would certainly work.  > 5 >    The Saveset Manager package is another approach.  > ? > >    2. Re the COPY operation:  What would happen if you used F > >       "COPY/READ/WRITE"  to double-check what was written to tape?G > >       Would that even work, and how much would it slow down writing & > >       the backup save-set to tape? > I >    When COPY hits a tape error (and tapes are wont to returning these), I > it tends to punt the whole operation.  BACKUP tries to recover from the I > typical tape errors.  BACKUP assumes tapes are involved, where most DCL I > commands can and do assume a (rather more reliable) disk file system is  > involved.  > E >    Now as to whether or not this implementation detail (or even the H > BACKUP CRC and error recovery processing) really makes a difference on9 > any recent-generation tapes, that's another discussion.    Hoff,   F Are you saying that on say, SDLT tape, BACKUP will not skip over "bad"E tape and write a full good block, or skip over the "bad" section on a @ read, or reconstruct unreadable blocks from the redundant block?   -Norm    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 23:48:52 GMT + From: Jack Patteeuw <jjpatteeuw@nospam.net> " Subject: Re: hypothetical question> Message-ID: <E7x5g.64385$_S7.54769@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com>   YES    Guy Peleg wrote:< > If I could make your BACKUP operations complete faster....= > 2-5 times faster....but restrict this feature for save-sets 9 > written to disks only (not to support it with save-sets 1 > written to tapes).....would you find it useful?  > # > I'm looking for yes/no answer....  > ) > Please do not ask for more details..... 3 > Please do not speculate.....it will be clear soon  > = > I'm unable to provide any further information at this point  > 
 > Thank you !  >  > Guy Peleg  > OpenVMS Engineering  > L > (Please do not re-post this in any other forum, I chose c.o.v. on purpose) >  >    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 23:34:36 GMT , From: Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com>" Subject: Re: hypothetical question1 Message-ID: <gWw5g.7057$Oo5.597@news.cpqcorp.net>    norm.raphael@metso.com wrote:   H > Are you saying that on say, SDLT tape, BACKUP will not skip over "bad"G > tape and write a full good block, or skip over the "bad" section on a B > read, or reconstruct unreadable blocks from the redundant block?  I    I was intending to communicate that many of the default settings used  I for BACKUP are basically unnecessary on newer tape devices, including on  H the DLT and SDLT series tape devices.  These newer tape devices provide E much of what BACKUP itself has forward and has brought along for use  ; with the older and (comparatively) unreliable tape devices.   G    Whether you trust the tape drive ECC/CRC implementation, or whether  G you want the added BACKUP CRC/XOR processing remains a local decision,  
 of course.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 20:12:41 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> " Subject: Re: hypothetical question, Message-ID: <4456A3E1.FD2C4882@teksavvy.com>  2 What if the Earth were  square instead of round ?   C Would VMS engineering support clusters that have nodes on different I faces of the square ? (doesn't terabit ethernet really dislike corners ?)    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 20:23:47 -0500 @ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>" Subject: Re: hypothetical question6 Message-ID: <4456B4A3.B330592C@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>   Fred Bach wrote: >  > Dave Froble wrote: > > JF Mezei wrote:  > > 2 > >> re: backup from disk to a disk based saveset. > >>G > >> One issue I have just thought of: so, you create the save set on a M > >> different disk REALLY FAST. But then, how do you savely copy the saveset  > >> to tape ? > >  > > H > > To copy the save set to tape, the COPY command is appropriate.  ThisG > > does have some ramafications.  BACKUP is set up to handle some tape 8 > > errors, while COPY will not do as well in this area. >  >    Two questions:  > A >     1. Why couldn't you BACKUP an on-disk save-set to mag tape? C >        After all it's just a disk file.  Sure, it would mean that D >        to get at the real data you would have to use backup twice,D >        sequentially, and the backed-up save set on tape would be a6 >        few percent longer than on disk, but so what?  E Well, the main reason is usually lack of disk space. Sometimes that's F why files are being saved in the first place: dearth of disk space. InD order to do disk->disk->tape->disk->disk you need to have twice - orH more - as much free disk space as will be required by the restore, or atD least as much free disk space as would be needed to hold the savesetG once copied/restored from tape, plus space for teh files to be restored D from that saveset (unless you are replacing files on disk with files from the saveset).   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 20:28:47 -0500 @ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>" Subject: Re: hypothetical question6 Message-ID: <4456B5CF.9ADB4EE5@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>   Hoff Hoffman wrote:  >  > norm.raphael@metso.com wrote:  > J > > Are you saying that on say, SDLT tape, BACKUP will not skip over "bad"I > > tape and write a full good block, or skip over the "bad" section on a D > > read, or reconstruct unreadable blocks from the redundant block? > J >    I was intending to communicate that many of the default settings usedJ > for BACKUP are basically unnecessary on newer tape devices, including onI > the DLT and SDLT series tape devices.  These newer tape devices provide F > much of what BACKUP itself has forward and has brought along for use= > with the older and (comparatively) unreliable tape devices.  > H >    Whether you trust the tape drive ECC/CRC implementation, or whetherH > you want the added BACKUP CRC/XOR processing remains a local decision, > of course.  C Remember also that DLT takes a somewhat different approach to error H handling. Many previously "recoverable" errors seen in 9-track media areC considered "fatal" on DLT. Hence, the HP firmware in the HP-branded D drives which provides a much more "perfect" medium to the applicatonF writing data to it, rather than simply raising an error indication andH expecting the host to handle it properly (it might not) as the "generic" firmware is wont to do.    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 15:54:14 -0700 0 From: "Tha Anonymous" <6qhnxzz02@sneakemail.com>) Subject: My employer needs VMS programmer C Message-ID: <1146524054.684983.181830@y43g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>   G I work in the Los Angeles area.  We program in Basic, a bit of COBOL, a C small bit of C and Macro.  Mostly Basic.  Also DCL.  My employer is D looking for another VMS resource.  Wouldn't hurt if you know Access,> VB, SQL Server as well.  I like it here.  We are a small shop.D Everyone gets along well.  Bosses are easy to talk to.  If you thinkC you might want to work here, check out our website.  www.icius.com. G There is a current job listings section.  It's out of date, but you can  submit your resume.    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 20:50:08 -0500 @ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>- Subject: Re: My employer needs VMS programmer 6 Message-ID: <4456BAD0.C23EC50D@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>   Tha Anonymous wrote: > I > I work in the Los Angeles area.  We program in Basic, a bit of COBOL, a E > small bit of C and Macro.  Mostly Basic.  Also DCL.  My employer is F > looking for another VMS resource.  Wouldn't hurt if you know Access,@ > VB, SQL Server as well.  I like it here.  We are a small shop.F > Everyone gets along well.  Bosses are easy to talk to.  If you thinkE > you might want to work here, check out our website.  www.icius.com. I > There is a current job listings section.  It's out of date, but you can  > submit your resume.   < Fire your website designers: kill the Flash, lose the music.  - Any opportunities for off-site telecommuters?   B "L.A.'s fine but it ain't home", from a song sung by Neil Diamond.   --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 19:31:34 -0700 ; From: "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> - Subject: Re: My employer needs VMS programmer C Message-ID: <1146537094.838062.138160@j33g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>    David J. Dachtera wrote:D > "L.A.'s fine but it ain't home", from a song sung by Neil Diamond.  C New York's home, but it ain't mine no more.  "I Am, I Said." - Neil  Diamond    ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 19:40:56 -0700 $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>- Subject: Re: My employer needs VMS programmer C Message-ID: <1146537656.614391.217280@u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com>    David J. Dachtera wrote: > Tha Anonymous wrote: > > K > > I work in the Los Angeles area.  We program in Basic, a bit of COBOL, a G > > small bit of C and Macro.  Mostly Basic.  Also DCL.  My employer is H > > looking for another VMS resource.  Wouldn't hurt if you know Access,B > > VB, SQL Server as well.  I like it here.  We are a small shop.H > > Everyone gets along well.  Bosses are easy to talk to.  If you thinkG > > you might want to work here, check out our website.  www.icius.com. K > > There is a current job listings section.  It's out of date, but you can  > > submit your resume.  > > > Fire your website designers: kill the Flash, lose the music.   I Strongly Agree. Also:   . Lose alert! Lose spelled correctly. Thumbs up.   > / > Any opportunities for off-site telecommuters?  > D > "L.A.'s fine but it ain't home", from a song sung by Neil Diamond. >  [...]    AEF    ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 12:25:05 -0700 # From: "Bobby" <colemanr7@yahoo.com>  Subject: NEdit 5.5B Message-ID: <1146511505.136471.68720@e56g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>  F In case anyone is interested, I recently compiled NEdit 5.5 with theirE latest source tree and have, thus far, found it to be stable.  If you E haven't ever used it, it is a very good programming editor for Motif. / I've posted the binary.exe for OpenVMS Alpha at 1 http://homer.ornl.gov/coleman/OpenVMS/Nedit.htm .   G I don't make any claims to the code... other than, after fits and false ' starts, I managed to "get it compiled".    Bobby    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 13:49:34 -0500 @ From: "David J. Dachtera" <djesys.nospam@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>1 Subject: Re: Need help with stalled printer queue 6 Message-ID: <4456583E.6D2DE1A3@NeOaSrPtAhMlNiOnWk.net>  
 AEF wrote: >  > AEF wrote: > > Hoff Hoffman wrote: ! > > > etmsreec@yahoo.co.uk wrote:  > > > L > > > > Has the addition of the printers to the active directory removed the3 > > > > LPR/LPD functionality from the printserver?  > > > I > > >    I've never seen Microsoft Active Directory (AD) get tangled with N > > > LPR/LPD.  (That's not to state such could not happen, just that I've notK > > > seen that particular train-wreck arise -- and we've certainly had our C > > > share of intentionally and unintentionally "creative" network % > > > configurations here inside HP.)  > > > J > > >    My first suspicion would be that TCPWARE_VMSLPRSMB is getting itsL > > > knickers in a twist, or is going toes-up; err, an unexpected conditionJ > > > is arising within the local symbiont's run-time environment, and theK > > > symbiont is accordingly demonstrating unspecified untoward behaviour. K > > > This could include the symbiont, or associated parts of the IP stack.  > > > L > > >    My secondary assumption would involve a potential problem somewhereN > > > within the OpenVMS VAX queue manager or related components, or somewhereM > > > within the network stack.  Accordingly, I'd look at the process and (if N > > > present) at the process state, and (if present) at any logs or debuggingI > > > mechanisms available for this symbiont, and I'd look for applicable M > > > updates from Process and at the application of the mandatory and of any 2 > > > queue-related ECOs from OpenVMS Engineering. > > ! > > (I'll do what I can of this.)  > > J > > Well, this has suddenly happened on two VAX systems, so I'd think thatG > > would mean some external (to VMS and TCPware) problem. Also, one of A > > them I had shut down for a week maybe and booted it up and it H > > immediately exhibited the same problem. It worked fine for months onI > > both systems until this week, though I can't remember exactly when it K > > last worked, it was probably early or mid April. So why would something A > > that's been working fine for months suddenly require a patch?  > > F > > One machine has all mandatory VMS patches and a QMAN patch but theG > > other doesn't, yet both exhibit the problem. I just started it on a I > > third VAX and it, too, exhibits the same problem. Hmmm, they all have  > > the same hosts. file.  > > G > > Also, I just found out that the printserver was added to active dir K > > domain back in December, well before this problem occurred. But I can't H > > think of any change that was made to either machine that could cause > > this problem.  > >  > >  > > > N > > >    I have had direct success with connections with LPR/LPD and DCPS (viaM > > > TCP/IP Services, however), and would tend to use DCPS for printing to a , > > > LaserJet 4200 or LaserJet 4300 series. > > > L > > >    You could eliminate DNS and DHCP use as a test, assuming you have aN > > > fixed address.  (I tend to not configure the printer to use DHCP.)  ThisI > > > would largely eliminate any potential involvement of AD, of course.  > > D > > There is no DHCP invovled AFAIK and I use hosts files on the VAXK > > systems. What change could affect all three systems (the 3rd is running 3 > > VMS v6.1 while the first two are running v6.2).  > >  > > Thanks for your help.  > >  > > AEF  >  > Here's the latest: > F > I tried configuring a new printer queue, and when TCPWARE:CNFNET.COMH > LPS asked for the remote host name, I specified the printer instead ofC > the printserver. Then it asked for the remote printer and I again H > specified the printer. THIS FIXED THE PROBLEM! Something happened thatE > won't let the VAX talk to the printserver. None of my fellow admins  > know what it could be. > D > Anyway, I'm back in business. Thanks to everyone here for all your > responses.  4 Perhaps this thread should have been cross-posted toB vmsnet.networks.tcp-ip.tcpware which is monitored and freqented byG Process Software folks who may be able to account for what was going on E there, and possibly open a ticket to get it resolved, if appropriate.    --   David J Dachtera dba DJE Systems  http://www.djesys.com/  & Unofficial OpenVMS Marketing Home Page! http://www.djesys.com/vms/market/   ( Unofficial Affordable OpenVMS Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/soho/   " Unofficial OpenVMS-IA32 Home Page: http://www.djesys.com/vms/ia32/   ) Unofficial OpenVMS Hobbyist Support Page: " http://www.djesys.com/vms/support/   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 17:08:26 -0700 $ From: "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com>1 Subject: Re: Need help with stalled printer queue B Message-ID: <1146528505.977531.29190@j73g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   David J. Dachtera wrote: > AEF wrote: > >  > > AEF wrote: > > > Hoff Hoffman wrote: # > > > > etmsreec@yahoo.co.uk wrote:  > > > > N > > > > > Has the addition of the printers to the active directory removed the5 > > > > > LPR/LPD functionality from the printserver?  > > > > K > > > >    I've never seen Microsoft Active Directory (AD) get tangled with P > > > > LPR/LPD.  (That's not to state such could not happen, just that I've notM > > > > seen that particular train-wreck arise -- and we've certainly had our E > > > > share of intentionally and unintentionally "creative" network ' > > > > configurations here inside HP.)  > > > > L > > > >    My first suspicion would be that TCPWARE_VMSLPRSMB is getting itsN > > > > knickers in a twist, or is going toes-up; err, an unexpected conditionL > > > > is arising within the local symbiont's run-time environment, and theM > > > > symbiont is accordingly demonstrating unspecified untoward behaviour. M > > > > This could include the symbiont, or associated parts of the IP stack.  > > > > N > > > >    My secondary assumption would involve a potential problem somewhereP > > > > within the OpenVMS VAX queue manager or related components, or somewhereO > > > > within the network stack.  Accordingly, I'd look at the process and (if P > > > > present) at the process state, and (if present) at any logs or debuggingK > > > > mechanisms available for this symbiont, and I'd look for applicable O > > > > updates from Process and at the application of the mandatory and of any 4 > > > > queue-related ECOs from OpenVMS Engineering. > > > # > > > (I'll do what I can of this.)  > > > L > > > Well, this has suddenly happened on two VAX systems, so I'd think thatI > > > would mean some external (to VMS and TCPware) problem. Also, one of C > > > them I had shut down for a week maybe and booted it up and it J > > > immediately exhibited the same problem. It worked fine for months onK > > > both systems until this week, though I can't remember exactly when it M > > > last worked, it was probably early or mid April. So why would something C > > > that's been working fine for months suddenly require a patch?  > > > H > > > One machine has all mandatory VMS patches and a QMAN patch but theI > > > other doesn't, yet both exhibit the problem. I just started it on a K > > > third VAX and it, too, exhibits the same problem. Hmmm, they all have  > > > the same hosts. file.  > > > I > > > Also, I just found out that the printserver was added to active dir M > > > domain back in December, well before this problem occurred. But I can't J > > > think of any change that was made to either machine that could cause > > > this problem.  > > >  > > >  > > > > P > > > >    I have had direct success with connections with LPR/LPD and DCPS (viaO > > > > TCP/IP Services, however), and would tend to use DCPS for printing to a . > > > > LaserJet 4200 or LaserJet 4300 series. > > > > N > > > >    You could eliminate DNS and DHCP use as a test, assuming you have aP > > > > fixed address.  (I tend to not configure the printer to use DHCP.)  ThisK > > > > would largely eliminate any potential involvement of AD, of course.  > > > F > > > There is no DHCP invovled AFAIK and I use hosts files on the VAXM > > > systems. What change could affect all three systems (the 3rd is running 5 > > > VMS v6.1 while the first two are running v6.2).  > > >  > > > Thanks for your help.  > > > 	 > > > AEF  > >  > > Here's the latest: > > H > > I tried configuring a new printer queue, and when TCPWARE:CNFNET.COMJ > > LPS asked for the remote host name, I specified the printer instead ofE > > the printserver. Then it asked for the remote printer and I again J > > specified the printer. THIS FIXED THE PROBLEM! Something happened thatG > > won't let the VAX talk to the printserver. None of my fellow admins  > > know what it could be. > > F > > Anyway, I'm back in business. Thanks to everyone here for all your > > responses. > 6 > Perhaps this thread should have been cross-posted toD > vmsnet.networks.tcp-ip.tcpware which is monitored and freqented byI > Process Software folks who may be able to account for what was going on G > there, and possibly open a ticket to get it resolved, if appropriate.   D Thanks for the tip! I'll do that next time. But I think in this caseG there's something screwy with our printserver. Anyway, I got it to work   by skipping the screwy hardware!   >  > -- > David J Dachtera > dba DJE Systems  > http://www.djesys.com/ >  [...]    ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 11:51:49 -0700 ' From: "syslost" <wm.reynolds@gmail.com> , Subject: Need rackmount  as1000 type chassisC Message-ID: <1146509509.632343.226430@e56g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>   @ I'm looking for a rackmount chassis for an as1000 or (equiv size8 server).  I have all the internals, I just need the box.   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 19:16:52 GMT , From: Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com>0 Subject: Re: Need rackmount  as1000 type chassis2 Message-ID: <E8t5g.7030$6f5.6924@news.cpqcorp.net>   syslost wrote:B > I'm looking for a rackmount chassis for an as1000 or (equiv size: > server).  I have all the internals, I just need the box.  I    When faced with these older boxes, OpenVMS Engineering tends to mount  G and load these systems onto shelves in the cabinets in the engineering  F labs.   We can and often do mount standard VAX and Alpha servers into  nineteen inch racks.  F    The two variants of the AlphaServer 1000 were the AlphaServer 1000 G and the AlphaServer 1000A, and IIRC, all of the internal bits were not  F entirely interchangeable between these two models.  (I'd also tend to 1 look for a faster Alpha box, but that's just me.)   H    Acquiring and mounting the right rails and/or sliders on an existing I (older) server is obviously specialized and often system-specific parts,  A and rather more work -- shelves are faster, and can obviously be  I re-used.   Switching to rails tends to be a two- or three-pass operation  ' spread over a couple of weeks, or more.   B    For those folks attending the bootcamp, there might well be an E engineering lab tour or two, and -- if so -- you'll be able to see a  F variety of older systems mounted into the shelves in the HP cabinetry.  H    The Systems and Options catalog (SOC) is accessible through the left F navigation at <http://www.hp.com/go/productbulletin/>, and likely has  details on the rails.    ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 13:49:25 -0700 ' From: "syslost" <wm.reynolds@gmail.com> / Subject: Re: Need rackmount as1000 type chassis C Message-ID: <1146516565.787221.187790@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   ? In the service manual for the as1000a it shows part numbers for , motherboards as 54-23499-01 and 54-23499-02.@ And processor boards as 54-24799-01 400mhz, 54-24799-02 333 mhz,A 54-24719-02 300 mhz, 54-23297-02 266 mhz, and 54-23297-03 233mhz.   A It doesn't say which processor board goes with which motherboard.   D Does anyone have a cross reference, or will the proc/mlb work in any configuration?   ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 13:49:20 -0700 ' From: "toby" <toby@telegraphics.com.au> % Subject: Re: OpenVMS fanclub in Orkut B Message-ID: <1146516560.290301.65640@e56g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>   singhal.rishi@gmail.com wrote:H > Thanks Toby for your suggestion. There are definitely some good pointsD > to be noted. Here are some key things which made us to start a new > group: > I > 1.There exists a community in Orkut for OpenVMS but as you have already   > pointed out its not in English  F It is, in fact, in English: It was started by an American in San Jose,= CA. http://www.orkut.com/Profile.aspx?uid=1327891064634137314   F Like many of the special interest groups, what has occurred is that itG has been spammed in other languages maybe due to an unfortunate acronym F 'VMS' also meaning something actually of interest to Orkut airheads (I@ have no desire to get to the bottom of that other acronym - some variant of SMS?)    > which most people in the worldF > understand. But as OpenVMS is trying to expand to new people and new6 > regions we need a language to communicate with them. > C > 2.Searching OpenVMS in orkut community does not give the link for G > http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=715 (lot of the people I know  > have tried).  C Worked for me. You might also be interested in the DEC VAX interest @ group, http://www.orkut.com/Community.aspx?cmm=348 (97 members)./ Interestingly there seems to be no Alpha group.    > I > 3. We are not in any contest here. Its we (you and me) who love OpenVMS G > who have to stand up and work to make people aware of it in different H > parts of the world.Its the younger generation(like me) who wants it to5 > be known by the whole world and appreciated for its  > stability,security....  B I am sure you are motivated to promote OpenVMS. But is starting anG Orkut community really effective? You will only ever reach a handful of F Orkut users. How big do you want it to be? On Orkut its growth is veryC strictly confined, as explained above. Maybe you can get up to 100. @ Then what? What are your GOALS for this community? If it is techD support, you're much better off posting here - it will be seen by at@ least 10-50x as many people, and they're going to be in a better5 position to answer your question (that's just logic).   C Anyway, if you're hell-bent on it, here's what I suggest. Since the D original OpenVMS community we've been discussing has been spammed toE death, why don't you contact the owner of that group (and post in the E group) to propose moving to a new community. You should be aware that B your new community may suffer the same spam fate. That seems to be common on Orkut.  B If everything goes well, you may instantly acquire pretty much theC entire possible Orkut interested audience in one sweep. If that bid F fails, you are faced with the task of growing your community at a slow@ rate by either stealing users from the other group, or trying to5 recruit new ones. On Orkut. I can only wish you luck.   F PS. This Usenet group already exists. It's large. It's busy. It's beenG here for decades. It's read by smart people. It's in English. It's open C to everyone, not just the 17 million Orkut users. (Orkut will never E replace Usenet, if that is your dream.) Do you understand what I mean C when I decribe all those tiny cliques on Orkut, Yahoo!, wherever as 6 'vanity groups'? Do you see the pointlessness of that?   > B > Hope we together can make this happen by making this communoty a
 > success. > 
 > Regards, > Rishi    ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 16:38:51 -0700 9 From: "singhal.rishi@gmail.com" <singhal.rishi@gmail.com> % Subject: Re: OpenVMS fanclub in Orkut A Message-ID: <1146526731.673989.9210@y43g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>   F yeah you are very right in most of the things but still I will give it a shot becauseB 1. My aim for this community is not for tech support but to createB awareness among other people in the world that a OS called OpenVMSC exists (and it is best because of its features) and if want to know = more about it we will try our level best to give the answers.   F 2. The young technical community (as per my seeing and believing) does, not use Usenet (sorry if this is offensive).C 3. There is a lot of personal attachment in orkut than in any other  groups (as per my feeling)  F And yes definitely I will contact the owner of the other group and tryG to make a single group thats dedicated only to OpenVMS and not some VMS 9 (thanks for the suggestion...they are definiely required)    Regards, Rishi    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 21:19:52 +0200 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture.nospam@hispeed.ch> - Subject: Re: Semi-OT: Changes coming at Intel ; Message-ID: <b0057$44565f59$50db5015$27396@news.hispeed.ch>    Colin Butcher wrote:L > Depends if the salary package is inherently linked to share price. If it'sB > heavily based on share price you get the behaviour you'd expect. >   G Some years ago I came across an interesting article which claimed that  C it was precisely those managers who complained about short termism  D making long term planning difficult who were the ones driving their 7 invesment managers for quick returns. Ironic, isn't it?    ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 12:50:48 -0700 ) From: "Sue" <susan_skonetski@hotmail.com> $ Subject: This weeks Boot Camp UpdateB Message-ID: <1146513048.664461.98130@j73g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>  6 Dear Internal and External Distribution lists (in bcc)  ? Here is this weeks OpenVMS Advanced technical Boot Camp Update.   G Please note: If you are planning on registering for this event you need A to do so quickly mainly because the hotel is running out of hotel  rooms.  8 If you have any questions please do not hesitate to ask.   Registration Goal 200  Seats Committed =  175
 % full =  88%  Seats available =  25  Registered = 173! % of new attendees =  37% (aprox) # % of repeat attendees = 63% (aprox)  Weeks until Boot Camp 3 ! Folks from out side the US =(45%)  Countries represented = 20 Germany  England  Netherlands  Switzerland 	 Singapore  Sweden Belgium  Canada Ireland  Austria  France	 Australia  Belgium  India  New Zealand  Spain  US China  Japan  Scotland    . http://h71000.www7.hp.com/symposium/index.html    @ Warm Regards as always and thank you for your continued support.   Sue    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 20:35:56 +0200 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture.nospam@hispeed.ch> # Subject: Re: TIMEPROMPTWAIT problem : Message-ID: <48d4$4456550d$50db5015$23885@news.hispeed.ch>   Bob Koehler wrote:b > In article <pFR3g.6885$HL.2916@news.cpqcorp.net>, Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> writes: > F >>   The VAX TOY clock is an offset from the year value stored in the H >>system image.  It doesn't really know about years.  It gets messed up H >>annually, when the number of days rolls over, if no SET TIME has been 0 >>performed within the first three months or so. >  > I >    IIRC the SET TIME in syshutdown.com is there to make sure the system H >    image is synched.  That has been done several times, in addition toD >    manual SET TIME commands, to no avail.  I'm fairly sure there'sF >    something odd about how our TOY clock comes up from power off and) >    we're not going to bother fixing it.  > H >    I'll be looking for the SETTIME system parameter next time I get to >    that site.  >   7 I'm pretty sure that SETTIME was there in the V3.n era.    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 15:08:04 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 5 Subject: Re: UC07 with BA350/RZ28 disk spinup problem , Message-ID: <44565C8E.1659482A@teksavvy.com>   Hoff Hoffman wrote: H >    This controller emulates an MSCP storage Q-bus controller, and thus, > these disks show as DU-class disk devices?  @ The SCSI Q-BUS controllers I have seen all emulate MSCP devices.F Remember that at that time, VMS did not have SCSI drivers (or its SCSI drivers were very limited).   G It is not clear if the Q-bus adaptor would tranmslate an MSCP "spin up" $ command to a SCSI "spin up" command.  ? Even from the >>> console, one does not have access to the SCSI H commands, even less on VMS. One must "boot" the controller to get accessB to the controller configuration, at which point you can issue SCSI$ command directly from the controler.  + > OpenVMS itself sends the spin-up command. J > up.  DIGITAL drives have provided staggered disk spin-up sequencing backG > as far as the DSA/RA series disks, and probably much further.  On the ? > DSA/RA series, it involved a daisy-chained sequencing cable.)   H Chicker-egg situation.  VMS needs access to a spun up disk before it can4 boot enough to send spin-up commands to the disk :-)  F  It would have likely been done by the KDA50 controller for instance.     H Also, in the case of those BA350 boxes, does the box itself send totallyH raw unedited SCSI commands to the disks in it ? Or is there some editingD done ? Since these boxes are able to force a SCSI ID on drives, what: else do they do between the host and the physical disks  ?  A  Is it possible that it is the box'es responsability to request a  disk-spin up ?   ------------------------------   Date: 2 May 2006 00:21:10 GMT  From: healyzh@aracnet.com 5 Subject: Re: UC07 with BA350/RZ28 disk spinup problem + Message-ID: <e368lm0ah7@enews2.newsguy.com>   1 vaxorcist <hoelscher-kirchbrak@freenet.de> wrote: @ > Just to be sure I tried the manual disk spin up by setting theF > appropriate jumper on the RZ28 - the disk is still being reported as > "offline" under VMS!!!  5 > Has anyone ever run RZ28s on a UC07 successfully??? $ > What am I to do to get it working?   ------------------------------   Date: 2 May 2006 00:22:54 GMT  From: healyzh@aracnet.com 5 Subject: Re: UC07 with BA350/RZ28 disk spinup problem + Message-ID: <e368ou1ah7@enews2.newsguy.com>   1 vaxorcist <hoelscher-kirchbrak@freenet.de> wrote: @ > Just to be sure I tried the manual disk spin up by setting theF > appropriate jumper on the RZ28 - the disk is still being reported as > "offline" under VMS!!!  L I don't have a UC07, but I do have Viking QDT's and a Viking UDT (Unibus) inJ my PDP-11's.  IIRC, had the exact same results trying to use a BA350 with  RZ28's on my PDP-11's.   		Zane   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 01 May 2006 17:20:46 -0400 2 From: "Stanley F. Quayle" <squayle@insight.rr.com>/ Subject: Web front-end for student registration ; Message-ID: <4456436E.5195.1069C1B5@squayle.insight.rr.com>   > A university I'm working with has a VAX (actually, CHARON-VAX ? [Shameless Plug Alert(tm]) system that interfaces with a voice- B response unit to process student registrations (add/drop classes).  C They would like to create a web front end to do this ASAP.  Please  D send me your middleware suggestions.  As you expect, they're really  price-sensitive.  F The data is in indexed files (they said "ISAM", but...) with programs ? (Cobol, probably) to do specific functions and return specific   results.  D Their CIO has asked me to find someone who has done this before, so F if you've actually coded this application already, you would have the  inside track.--Stan Quayle Quayle Consulting Inc.  
 ----------8 Stanley F. Quayle, P.E. N8SQ  Toll free: 1-888-I-LUV-VAX3 8572 North Spring Ct., Pickerington, OH  43147  USA < stan-at-stanq-dot-com   http://www.stanq.com/charon-vax.html) "OpenVMS, when downtime is not an option"    ------------------------------   Date: 1 May 2006 14:29:16 -0700  From: bob@instantwhip.com 3 Subject: Re: Web front-end for student registration C Message-ID: <1146518956.865674.203820@e56g2000cwe.googlegroups.com>   9 Purveyor web server using CGI DCL or DIBOL scripts ... :)    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 02 May 2006 00:44:19 GMT ; From: "Jeffrey H. Coffield" <jeffrey@digitalsynergyinc.com> 3 Subject: Re: Web front-end for student registration > Message-ID: <DXx5g.66307$F_3.46644@newssvr29.news.prodigy.net>   Stanley F. Quayle wrote:@ > A university I'm working with has a VAX (actually, CHARON-VAX A > [Shameless Plug Alert(tm]) system that interfaces with a voice- D > response unit to process student registrations (add/drop classes). > E > They would like to create a web front end to do this ASAP.  Please  F > send me your middleware suggestions.  As you expect, they're really  > price-sensitive. > H > The data is in indexed files (they said "ISAM", but...) with programs A > (Cobol, probably) to do specific functions and return specific  
 > results. > F > Their CIO has asked me to find someone who has done this before, so H > if you've actually coded this application already, you would have the  > inside track.--Stan Quayle > Quayle Consulting Inc. >  > ----------: > Stanley F. Quayle, P.E. N8SQ  Toll free: 1-888-I-LUV-VAX5 > 8572 North Spring Ct., Pickerington, OH  43147  USA > > stan-at-stanq-dot-com   http://www.stanq.com/charon-vax.html+ > "OpenVMS, when downtime is not an option"  >  > , FastCGI is what we use. See www.fastcgi.com.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2006.242 ************************