1 INFO-VAX	Wed, 24 May 2006	Volume 2006 : Issue 286       Contents: Re: Alpha last order dates Re: Alpha last order dates Re: An obscure bug in DIRECTORY  Re: An obscure bug in DIRECTORY  Re: An obscure bug in DIRECTORY ' Re: Bad-Clients: definitely not working  DN-11 ! Re: Educating potential VMS users / Re: GFloat Rounding issue in DEC Basic V1.2-000 % How to do automated email proccessing ) Re: How to do automated email proccessing ) Re: How to do automated email proccessing ) Re: How to do automated email proccessing ) Re: How to do automated email proccessing J Re: How to restore one BACKUP/IMAGE from tape with mutliple BACKUP/IMAGEs?A Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000? A Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000? A Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000? A Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000? A Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000? A Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000? A Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000? A Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000? - Re: MOSAIC / MOTIF bug (long pull down menus)  RE: Performance and Disk Size  RE: Results of my straw poll. 0 Re: speeding up LAVC with switch instead of hub?0 Re: speeding up LAVC with switch instead of hub?0 Re: speeding up LAVC with switch instead of hub? Re: XP1000 POST codes  Re: XP1000 POST codes   F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 20:35:12 GMT , From: Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com># Subject: Re: Alpha last order dates 0 Message-ID: <4mKcg.964$IT6.772@news.cpqcorp.net>   prep@prep.synonet.com wrote:0 > Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> writes: > @ >>    As for alternatives, the AlphaServer DS, ES, and GS series< >> servers are available (new systems can be ordered through >> 27-Oct-2006,  > C > Since the New itanics are now not out till 08, are the last dates B > for the Alphas being pushed back as well, or are people going to# > be left with a hole in the plans?   H    There are approximately ten models of Integrity servers that can now = or that are planned to be able to boot OpenVMS I64 available.   F    If you wish to purchase a new Alpha system, the last order date is  October.  D    I'm not in a position to discuss any unannounced future products 4 and/or specific product schedules within this forum.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 19:23:42 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> # Subject: Re: Alpha last order dates , Message-ID: <44739971.A564B1F3@teksavvy.com>   Hoff Hoffman wrote: E >    I'm not in a position to discuss any unannounced future products 6 > and/or specific product schedules within this forum.  G If we were to send you a book of positions, could you find one position G you could assume and then be able to discuss the port to the 8086 ? :-)  :-) :-) :-) :-) :-)    ------------------------------    Date: 23 May 2006 15:52:30 -0500; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) ( Subject: Re: An obscure bug in DIRECTORY3 Message-ID: <M5gOHzCavXkK@eisner.encompasserve.org>   w In article <e4vco2$did$2@online.de>, helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) writes: I > In article <1148397716.029346.54880@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, "Big 3 > John" <john.powers@airwidesolutions.com> writes:   > > >> I have discovered a bug in the DIRECTORY command!  - surely> >> one of the oldest, most stable commands in the DCL lexicon.G >> This was brought to me by a colleague who tried the bizarre command: 5 >> DIRECTORY /SELECT=FILE=(NONAME,NOTYPE,NODIR,NOVER) 5 >> (You really don't want to know what he was up to). ? >> And this accvio's (on version 7.3-2) as demonstrated below..       Used to work.  +    Works on VAX 6.1, accvio on Alpha 7.2-1.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 17:24:09 -0400  From: norm.raphael@metso.com( Subject: Re: An obscure bug in DIRECTORYQ Message-ID: <OFADE846D4.D3203D56-ON85257177.00757CF3-85257177.007589A3@metso.com>   I koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) wrote on 05/23/2006  04:52:30 PM:  F > In article <e4vco2$did$2@online.de>, helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de4 > (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) writes:K > > In article <1148397716.029346.54880@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, "Big 4 > > John" <john.powers@airwidesolutions.com> writes: > > @ > >> I have discovered a bug in the DIRECTORY command!  - surely@ > >> one of the oldest, most stable commands in the DCL lexicon.I > >> This was brought to me by a colleague who tried the bizarre command: 7 > >> DIRECTORY /SELECT=FILE=(NONAME,NOTYPE,NODIR,NOVER) 7 > >> (You really don't want to know what he was up to). A > >> And this accvio's (on version 7.3-2) as demonstrated below..  >  >    Used to work. > - >    Works on VAX 6.1, accvio on Alpha 7.2-1.  > # Not that I care, accvio on VAX 7.2.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 17:46:37 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> ( Subject: Re: An obscure bug in DIRECTORY, Message-ID: <447382B7.B2AE5CD8@teksavvy.com>   Big John wrote: B > BONNIE->directory sys$login/sel=file=(noname,notype,nodir,nover) > Directory INS_ROOT:[000000] = > %SYSTEM-F-ACCVIO, access violation, reason mask=00, virtual   E On VAX 7.2, the command issues the "Directory" line, then hangs for a H long time (during which very little CPU is consumed and no IO happening) and then finally crashes.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 18:00:01 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 0 Subject: Re: Bad-Clients: definitely not working, Message-ID: <447385D9.EA1972DC@teksavvy.com>  / Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: J > However, most folks probably have NORELAY.  And most folks probably wantG > to use Bad-Clients to stop known spammers.  Requiring Good-Clients is 9 > requiring too much, especially if it is not documented.   E The way I see it, having NORELAY disables much of the spam processing  logic.    H > I really, really don't want to misconfigure anything such that I am an
 > open relay.   H If you really do not wish to configure the good clients and relay-zones,B then perhaops you should forget about smtp.config and focus on SETF SERVCE SMTP commands (/REJECT will work similarly to the bad-clients).  = > Yes, but how many machines actually need to do SMTP relay?    F If you havbe one SMTP server in a lan, you want that SMTP server to beF able to relay. For instance, when I send from my MAC, the mac connects= to my vax and my vax then relays the message to the internet.    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 23:34:16 GMT + From: "Villy Madsen" <Villy.Madsen@shaw.ca>  Subject: DN-11. Message-ID: <YZMcg.183824$P01.137122@pd7tw3no>   Just curious  1 Was there ever a DN-11 driver released for VMS ??    Villy    Villy.Madsen@shaw.ca   ------------------------------   Date: 23 May 2006 18:40:30 GMT From: healyzh@aracnet.com * Subject: Re: Educating potential VMS users, Message-ID: <e4vkuu01v91@enews3.newsguy.com>  ) Bill Gunshannon <bill@cs.uofs.edu> wrote: ? > I'm not offering anything.  Well, except for ideas to try and > > kickstart what's left of VMS.  Why does it seem like I'm the= > only one left who even cares?  And I am not even one of the 0 > VMS fanatics.  Maybe I'm just wasting my time.  L I think the point is, why reinvent the wheel.  The *COMPLETE* VMS Doc Set isJ available online.  It's excellent, and all anyone really needs.  There areL several good 3rd party books available for new users.  While most are dated, they're still usable.   H Personally what I would like to see is the next VMS Doc Set have a "BaseI Base" Doc Set.  I'm not sure about the current set of paper doc's, but in K the V7.2 time, the "Base" set was the better part of a shelf, and IIRC cost K me $300.  I'd love to see the equivalent of the V5 base set, as I still use H the main two books from V5 occasionally, even though I'm running V7.3-2.   		Zane   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 03:55:41 GMT   From: John Santos <john@egh.com>8 Subject: Re: GFloat Rounding issue in DEC Basic V1.2-000( Message-ID: <1PQcg.8793$kR6.85@trnddc05>   Tom Linden wrote: 7 > On Tue, 23 May 2006 05:52:26 -0700, Michael D. Ober   ' > <obermd.@.alum.mit.edu.nospam> wrote:  > C >> As for using GFloat for currency, my preference would be to use   >> Decimal,  butE >> when this code was originally written, Decimal wasn't an option.    >> Also,  whenI >> you're doing interest computations, you need a floating point or the   
 >> resultsJ >> are inaccurate.  Take a look at your credit card statements - the dailyG >> interest rate is always shown as an extended decimal for that very   
 >> reason. > H > Your credit card statement are done by First Data on an IBM mainframe 
 > and  theD > code is PL/I, which supports scaled fixed decimal.  No float used.I > As an aside, First Data is the only company in the US to have its own   	 > private 1 > zip code, owing to the ~ 10**8 montly mailings.  >   A Totally off-topic, but the first computer I ever used was a First 7 Data PDP-10.  (They used to sell timesharing services.)      --   John Santos  Evans Griffiths & Hart, Inc. 781-861-0670 ext 539   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 13:53:21 -0400 & From: Thomas Wirt <twnews@kittles.com>. Subject: How to do automated email proccessingD Message-ID: <75b42$44734c1d$4367aba2$3195@msgid.meganewsservers.com>  D I am looking to take form emails that were sent from a web page and I process them automatically with a program as they come in.  Ultimately I  G want to use our home grown applications to process the data from these  I email forms, to populate fields in our database.  We have never done any  - automated processing of inbound email before.   F I seem to remember something in COV about a utility to read these and D get them into a text form that is easier to work with.  I know that I there is a mail API, but I am hoping for a simple way to process inbound  F email in real or near real time without learning any new and possibly G complicated API.  I have seen the MBU freeware, but I am not sure from  + the very brief readme if it is what I need.   I I am very interested in how other VMS users are automatically processing  H inbound email.  I know that there are other ways to get data from a web H form, but for this project, it would be a big win for VMS if I can find G a simple, free solution that allows us to take a form email and get it  9 to a VMS .com or Basic program ready data format quickly.    TIA  --     Thomas Wirt  Operations Manager, IS Dept. Kittle's Home Furnishings  Indianapolis, IN   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 18:20:13 +0000 (UTC) P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)2 Subject: Re: How to do automated email proccessing$ Message-ID: <e4vjot$tfs$1@online.de>  D In article <75b42$44734c1d$4367aba2$3195@msgid.meganewsservers.com>,) Thomas Wirt <twnews@kittles.com> writes:    F > I am looking to take form emails that were sent from a web page and K > process them automatically with a program as they come in.  Ultimately I  I > want to use our home grown applications to process the data from these  K > email forms, to populate fields in our database.  We have never done any  / > automated processing of inbound email before.   # Presumably, the email is just text.   H For moderating a news group, I parse emailed posts in DCL.  Good enough  for me.    You might want to do  '    TCPIP> SET CONF SMTP/OPTIONS=HEADERS   H This will put all the non--VMS-MAIL headers at the bottom.  If you don'tD need these, you can stop parsing here.  If you do, you could turn on? header parsing here.  (I had the headers at the bottom from the D beginning, since usually the VMS-MAIL headers tell me what I need toF know and it is easier to page through emails, since I see a lot of the? body on the first screen; otherwise I would see only headers.)    G Basically, you can use MAIL> EXTRACT to generate text files, and parse  F them any way you want.  With EXTRACT/ALL (after an appropriate SELECT 5 statement), each message is separated by a form feed.   C If there are a lot of emails coming in, use COMPRESS regularly, or  3 consult Hein for advanced RMS tuning of MAIL files.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 16:26:23 -0400 # From: sol gongola <sol@adldata.com> 2 Subject: Re: How to do automated email proccessing0 Message-ID: <1148416016.657840@nntp.acecape.com>   Thomas Wirt wrote:F > I am looking to take form emails that were sent from a web page and K > process them automatically with a program as they come in.  Ultimately I  I > want to use our home grown applications to process the data from these  K > email forms, to populate fields in our database.  We have never done any  / > automated processing of inbound email before.  > H > I seem to remember something in COV about a utility to read these and F > get them into a text form that is easier to work with.  I know that K > there is a mail API, but I am hoping for a simple way to process inbound  H > email in real or near real time without learning any new and possibly I > complicated API.  I have seen the MBU freeware, but I am not sure from  - > the very brief readme if it is what I need.  > K > I am very interested in how other VMS users are automatically processing  J > inbound email.  I know that there are other ways to get data from a web J > form, but for this project, it would be a big win for VMS if I can find I > a simple, free solution that allows us to take a form email and get it  ; > to a VMS .com or Basic program ready data format quickly.  >  > TIA   I The MBU is not about email mailboxes. It is a facility to allow processes 8 to communicate and exchange information with each other.  H You should look at a VMS freeware package called DELIVER. You can get it? at http://vms.process.com/scripts/fileserv/fileserv.com?DELIVER    ------------------------------    Date: 23 May 2006 15:54:47 -0500; From: koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) 2 Subject: Re: How to do automated email proccessing3 Message-ID: <D$n7PHlTQ6M0@eisner.encompasserve.org>   m In article <75b42$44734c1d$4367aba2$3195@msgid.meganewsservers.com>, Thomas Wirt <twnews@kittles.com> writes:   K > I am very interested in how other VMS users are automatically processing   > inbound email.  G    What processing I do, I do with MAIL$ routines.  It's the documented     API.    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 21:16:18 GMT , From: Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com>2 Subject: Re: How to do automated email proccessing/ Message-ID: <CYKcg.969$uT6.91@news.cpqcorp.net>    Thomas Wirt wrote:  F > I am looking to take form emails that were sent from a web page and K > process them automatically with a program as they come in.  Ultimately I  I > want to use our home grown applications to process the data from these  K > email forms, to populate fields in our database.  We have never done any  / > automated processing of inbound email before.   H    The classic brute-force message-processing tool for MAIL is DELIVER. H   It's on the Freeware, and specifically on a relatively older Freeware 
 distro, IIRC.   H    Brute-force DCL isn't that much more difficult than DELIVER, however B -- probably a dozen or two DCL commands in a batch procedure, for B instance, and involving a SELECT NEWMAIL and an EXTRACT/ALL, in a I periodic polling loop, for instance, can deal with most situations.  (As  I ugly a general solution as I usually find polling, polling every five or  8 fifteen minutes generally has negligible system impact.)  I    In practice, that the arriving messages are even MAIL messages is not  I particularly relevant here -- it doesn't really matter how the data gets  A to the system, it's the format and the processing of the arrived  I "datagram."  (Would this programming problem be a similar concern to you  I if you were provided with a text file "datagram" to parse, for instance?)   H > I seem to remember something in COV about a utility to read these and F > get them into a text form that is easier to work with.  I know that K > there is a mail API, but I am hoping for a simple way to process inbound  H > email in real or near real time without learning any new and possibly I > complicated API.  I have seen the MBU freeware, but I am not sure from  - > the very brief readme if it is what I need.   H    The APIs for callable MAIL are not complicated, and they're arguably A the least of your worries here -- there are numerous examples of  H callable MAIL available, as well.  But again, fetching mail is probably F a day's coding work using a programmer's preferred language, assuming H that the programmer is not familiar with the API and has no examples of F the API to work from written in that programmer's preferred language. A (There are gazillions of examples at the Natural Language Search  A Assistant; an HP web tool that is referenced in the OpenVMS FAQ.)   K > I am very interested in how other VMS users are automatically processing  J > inbound email.  I know that there are other ways to get data from a web J > form, but for this project, it would be a big win for VMS if I can find I > a simple, free solution that allows us to take a form email and get it  ; > to a VMS .com or Basic program ready data format quickly.   F    Free-form in-bound email -- free-formatted datagrams -- can be and A usually is comparatively difficult for an application to process.   E    Having done this processing more times than I care to admit, it's  E almost always the format of the messages -- detecting and recovering  H from the inevitable format errors in the inbound free-form datagrams -- I that is the crux of the problem with processing inbound datagrams.  (And  G these in-bound datagrams can be text files, or mail messages, or stuff  C arriving up a network pipe, or inbound data arriving via a digital  I packet radio link, of course.)  The last time I was processing free-form  E human-generated datagrams -- yes, these were arriving in the form of  F mail messages -- I ended up with discrete logic and a fairly detailed  lib$table_parse parsing table.  C    If humans are sending the mail, you can have some serious "fun"  G dealing with what they send you -- seldom do all humans exactly follow  D formatting directions, and seldom do standard formatting directions I account for everything that a human might way to generate and include in  I the message datagram.  And then there's also the usual spam that arrives  I in most mailboxes, sooner or later.  And even application-generated mail  H messages can have some difficulties, given you that can eventually have G multiple versions of clients generating the messages over the lifetime   of the application.   H    If you can manage it, formatting the datagram messages using XML can I greatly simplify the parsing problems involved -- parsing, cross-version  G compatibility, detection of formatting errors, etc.  Humans won't send  G you XML, of course -- but client tools can collect the human input and  I can correctly format it, and can then send the datagram to you.  There's  = a port of libxml2 available at the OpenVMS Freeware web site.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 19:53:07 -0700  From: Z <Z@ids.net> S Subject: Re: How to restore one BACKUP/IMAGE from tape with mutliple BACKUP/IMAGEs? ( Message-ID: <lUPcg.537$Cy1.443@fe02.lga>   Jeff Cameron wrote: > > 1. Mount the target disk device with the /FOREIGN qualifier: >    $MOUNT/FOREIGN $1$DKA100: > 0 > 2. Mount the tape with the /FOREIGN Qualifier. >    $MOUNT/FOREIGN $4$MKB200: >  > 3. Do the restore 5 >    $BACKUP/IMAGE $4$MKB200:DATA.BCK/SAVE $1$DKA100:   B I forgot the /SAVE but the restore worked perfectly. Thank you, I ' appreciate the *specific* instructions.   D I can never remember if it's $MOUNT or $MOUNT/FOREIGN, or even if I E should just let BACKUP mount it. With this old 4100 and a TZ89 and a  G DLT4 pretty much full to the EOT marker, if I make a subtle mistake, I  < find out 7 hours later after it runs through the whole tape.   Anyway, the disk is restored.    You guys are priceless.   
 Thanks again.    ------------------------------  # Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 18:16:03 GMT , From: Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com>J Subject: Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000?0 Message-ID: <DjIcg.951$6O6.198@news.cpqcorp.net>  , Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote:I > I was just gifted with a stack of ZX2000s that a friend's workplace was 
 > offloading.       I'll take one.      I'll pay reasonable shipping.B    I think I've got a Radeon 7500-class PCI card around somewhere.)    Read into that whatever you like.  :-)    ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 18:23:59 +0000 (UTC) P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)J Subject: Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000?$ Message-ID: <e4vjvv$tfs$2@online.de>  = In article <DjIcg.951$6O6.198@news.cpqcorp.net>, Hoff Hoffman " <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> writes:   . > Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote:K > > I was just gifted with a stack of ZX2000s that a friend's workplace was  > > offloading.   ! What would shipping to Europe be?    ------------------------------   Date: 23 May 2006 18:58:12 GMT From: healyzh@aracnet.com J Subject: Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000?, Message-ID: <e4vm0411v91@enews3.newsguy.com>  M Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing <winston@ssrl.slac.stanford.edu> wrote:  > What I'm wondering is   L > (a) whether VMS 8.2 has any checks in it to prevent it booting on a ZX2000  L > (b) whether anybody out there has it _running_ on a ZX2000 and if so, what >     their experience is like.   9 > (c) whether Itanium licenses are available to hobbyists   H Actually this brings up an interesting question, while Hobbyist LicensesJ aren't currently available, they are supposed to be being worked on.  As aK result it would be nice to know what systems people should be keeping their H eye out for as prospective Hobbyist Systems?  It would be nice to have aJ list of this that included info on their performance, power usage, and how much noise they generate :^)   		Zane   ------------------------------    Date: 23 May 2006 12:14:26 -0700; From: "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> J Subject: Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000?B Message-ID: <1148411665.965559.184220@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>  / Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: ? > In article <DjIcg.951$6O6.198@news.cpqcorp.net>, Hoff Hoffman # > <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> writes:  > 0 > > Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote:M > > > I was just gifted with a stack of ZX2000s that a friend's workplace was  > > > offloading.  > # > What would shipping to Europe be?   E I didn't think Alan was looking for a new home for these systems, but 4 just in case... Oooh! Oooh!  Mr. Kot-teeeeer!!!  ;-)   ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 00:04:26 GMT L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing)J Subject: Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000?6 Message-ID: <00A56213.68FF2FDD@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  _ In article <DjIcg.951$6O6.198@news.cpqcorp.net>, Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> writes: - >Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote: J >> I was just gifted with a stack of ZX2000s that a friend's workplace was >> offloading. >  >   I'll take one.! >   I'll pay reasonable shipping. C >   I think I've got a Radeon 7500-class PCI card around somewhere. * >   Read into that whatever you like.  :-)  N My workplace has first crack at these, and some of the relevant people for theK decision won't be around until after Memorial Day.  After that, if what I'd > like to read into this is correct, we may have an arrangement.   -- Alan    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 00:05:59 GMT L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing)J Subject: Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000?6 Message-ID: <00A56213.A05452DD@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>   In article <1148411665.965559.184220@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> writes: > 0 >Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote:@ >> In article <DjIcg.951$6O6.198@news.cpqcorp.net>, Hoff Hoffman$ >> <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> writes: >>1 >> > Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote: N >> > > I was just gifted with a stack of ZX2000s that a friend's workplace was >> > > offloading. >>$ >> What would shipping to Europe be? > F >I didn't think Alan was looking for a new home for these systems, but5 >just in case... Oooh! Oooh!  Mr. Kot-teeeeer!!!  ;-)    Yes, Horschack?   L So, yeah, I don't want to keep all six of them, but SSRL gets first crack atN any we can actually use, and I might want one or two at home, and after that - well, we'll see.   -- Alan    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 17:48:03 -0700 # From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> J Subject: Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000?) Message-ID: <op.s905udhnzgicya@hyrrokkin>   K On Tue, 23 May 2006 17:04:26 -0700, Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing   ' <winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> wrote:   A > In article <DjIcg.951$6O6.198@news.cpqcorp.net>, Hoff Hoffman   # > <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> writes: / >> Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote: K >>> I was just gifted with a stack of ZX2000s that a friend's workplace was  >>> offloading.  >> >>   I'll take one. " >>   I'll pay reasonable shipping.D >>   I think I've got a Radeon 7500-class PCI card around somewhere.+ >>   Read into that whatever you like.  :-)  > J > My workplace has first crack at these, and some of the relevant people  	 > for the K > decision won't be around until after Memorial Day.  After that, if what    > I'd @ > like to read into this is correct, we may have an arrangement. > 	 > -- Alan  > 8 Alan, Are these at SLAC?  Put my name in the hat please? Tom    ------------------------------  # Date: Wed, 24 May 2006 01:07:48 GMT L From: winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU (Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing)J Subject: Re: I knows it's unsupported, but does current VMS run on ZX2000?6 Message-ID: <00A5621C.4364D818@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU>  O In article <op.s905udhnzgicya@hyrrokkin>, "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos.com> writes: L >On Tue, 23 May 2006 17:04:26 -0700, Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing  ( ><winston@SSRL.SLAC.STANFORD.EDU> wrote: > B >> In article <DjIcg.951$6O6.198@news.cpqcorp.net>, Hoff Hoffman  $ >> <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> writes:0 >>> Alan Winston - SSRL Central Computing wrote:L >>>> I was just gifted with a stack of ZX2000s that a friend's workplace was >>>> offloading. >>>  >>>   I'll take one.# >>>   I'll pay reasonable shipping. E >>>   I think I've got a Radeon 7500-class PCI card around somewhere. , >>>   Read into that whatever you like.  :-) >>K >> My workplace has first crack at these, and some of the relevant people   
 >> for theL >> decision won't be around until after Memorial Day.  After that, if what   >> I'dA >> like to read into this is correct, we may have an arrangement.  >>
 >> -- Alan >> >Alan, Are these at SLAC?     J Actually, they're in my living room at the moment.  But if other SSRL/SLACB people have work-related uses for them, they'll get first crack.       >Put my name in the hat please?   K I will have no more than four to dispose of altogether, and maybe none.  [I O have six; I'll want to keep 1 or 2.]  Sweeteners (like trades of the additional K equipment to run VMS on them, money, arguments that this will help get PL/I F ported) will be appetizing.  I'm not about to throw them up on eBAY; IH certainly want them to go to good homes, and preferably VMS-related uses: (although they haven't been running VMS up to this point).  L I wasn't initially planning to give them away myself, but I'm making note of these requests, in case.   -- Alan    ------------------------------   Date: 23 May 06 16:37:58 EDT) From: cook@wvnvms.wvnet.edu (George Cook) 6 Subject: Re: MOSAIC / MOTIF bug (long pull down menus)! Message-ID: <KI+SQ95a1Epw@wvnvms>   \ In article <4472C409.F52897EB@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes: > If you go to :0 > HTTP://www.canadianisp.com/cgi-bin/isprate.cgiH > and then open the "Select the ISP you wish to rate" pulldown menu, theD > pulldown menu expands to fill the screen, but this isn't enough toH > display all options and there is no real way to scroll to the right to > access te full list.   > E > You can blindly use the arrow kesy to navigate past the display and Q > select options that are not visible, but that isn't exactly very user-friendly.  > E > Most other HUIs handle large pulldown lists gracefully. But the VMS J > version of Motif doesn't.  Do modern versions of Motif handle large pull > donw lists more gracefully ?  B Unless there is some trick I am missing, Motif 1.2 doesn't have anF automatic way to handle large pulldowns.  I have thought about variousE hacks over the years, like using a smaller font and/or truncating the C options to fit more on the screen.  The only other option is to use  a scrolled window.     George Cook  WVNET    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 18:28:04 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> & Subject: RE: Performance and Disk SizeT Message-ID: <FA60F2C4B72A584DBFC6091F6A2B86840145F4BB@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message------ > From: Dan Moore [mailto:dmoore@sosu.edu]=20  > Sent: May 18, 2006 4:34 PM > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com $ > Subject: Performance and Disk Size >=20 > Greetings, >=20 >=20 >=20B >    We are moving from 18GB (Ultra 320 15K) disks to something=20 > larger (36,=20F > 72, or 144). Assuming nothing else changes, I'm interested in the=20C > performance impact that could result by increasing the disk size.  >=20 >=20 >=20
 > Other info:  >=20) >     We have minimal file fragmentation.  >=20E >     OpenVMS 7.3-1 on Alpha w/ internal SCSI (no need for SAN, yet).  >=20? >     The disks exist in 2 member shadow sets served by MSCP=20  > via GB Ethernet. >=20? >     This is a four node cluster, with two nodes having one=20  > shadow set member=20& > each (both nodes use internal SCSI). >=20 >     No hardware RAID arrays. >=20( >     Most of our IO is read operations. >=20 >=20 >=20 > Any thoughts?  >=20 >=20 >=20	 > Thanks,  >=20 >=20 >=20 > Dan  >=20   Dan,  = Something to keep in mind is that a number of Customers saw a G significant increase in performance in upgrading from VMS V7.3-1 to VMS H V7.3-2 (as I recall, copy operations especially). Since VMS V7.3-1 is noB longer supported, getting to V7.3-2 would likely be a good move to! consider before the disk upgrade.   G Note that unless you can do a lot of testing prior, doing both upgrades D at once is likely not a good idea as it complicates the post upgrade troubleshooting.   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 18:28:06 -0400 ' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> & Subject: RE: Results of my straw poll.T Message-ID: <FA60F2C4B72A584DBFC6091F6A2B86840145F4BC@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----$ > From: bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu=20A > [mailto:bill@triangle.cs.uofs.edu] On Behalf Of Bill Gunshannon  > Sent: May 22, 2006 12:52 AM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com ( > Subject: Re: Results of my straw poll. >=20* > In article <L5Sbg.753$oA6.198@trnddc06>,% > 	John Santos <john@egh.com> writes:  > > Bill Gunshannon wrote:1 > >> In article <e4jo6k01hvj@enews1.newsguy.com>, ! > >> 	healyzh@aracnet.com writes:  > >>=20 ' > >>>Tom Linden <tom@kednos.com> wrote:  > >>> < > >>>>On Thu, 18 May 2006 18:48:41 -0700, Bill Gunshannon=20 > <bill@cs.uofs.edu> =20 > >>>> > >>>>> > >>>>>What did any of that have to do with the fact that I=20 > don't have theA > >>>>>hardware to waste (and wouldn't waste it if I did) on a=20  > piddling task @ > >>>>>like serving up documentation?  When you spend as much=20
 > effort as I H > >>>>>have to doing so much with so little you tend to get very frugal. > >>> ? > >>>I sort of agree in this case (even though I do serve up=20  > multiple sets of the> > >>>doc's on my VMS server).  At the same time, other than=20 > disk space would it B > >>>really be a problem, it wouldn't put much of a load on the=20 > server, and it=20   > >>>would save electricity. =20 > >>=20  > >>=20 > > >> Do you really thin the 70-100 watts the PC draws would=20 > even be a blip on B > >> the radar in a computer room with VAX 7000 and PDP-11.44's=20
 > in it?  Not 5 > >> to mention the rest of the stuff here on campus.  > >>=20  > >=20H > > Any Alpha (except maybe a fully loaded GS128 or Alpha 7000) is goingB > > to use less electricity than your VAX 7000 or PDP-11/44's. =20 > Much less. >=20A > Of course it would, but, once again, I have PC's to spare, I=20  > don't have	 > Alphas.  >=20 > >=20 > >>=20 @ > >>>                        The real advantage to serving it=20 > up on VMS is you=20 * > >>>can serve up Bookreader format doc's. > >>=20  > >>=20 B > >> The last Docset I got had two sets. One was bookreader and=20 > the other was B > >> HTML.  My students can read the HTML with any web browser.=20 > The bookreaderB > >> format would only be accessible from a (very) small subset=20
 > of machines  > >> here on campus  > >=20: > > This small subset consisting of all Macs, all Linux=20 > systems, probably H > > all other Unixy systems (i.e. anything that comes with an X server),@ > > and any Windows PC with an X server, which I think but am=20
 > not certain B > > there are freeware versions available.  Just run bookreader=20 > on the VMS= > > (client) system and direct the display to their X server.  >=20D > And, how is that easier than just having them point heir webrowserE > at the server with the docs on it?   Their going to have to to read ( > any of the other documentation anyway. >=20 > >=20; > > Plus, remember my saying I was going to put 7 CD drives B > >> on the box?  It's not just VMS documentation I need to serve. > >>=20  > >=207 > > Who says you need 7 CD drives for the VMS docs? =20  >=20E > I didn't say 7 for VMS.  The VMS docs are on two.  But I have other F > docs to serve as well.  And I certainly don't want to have to put up+ > more than one machine to do the same job.  >=20   Bill,   E With web interfaces, the location of the data does not matter. If you B want the simplest, cheapest answer, then simply set up a link on aE common internal web site that points to the VMS docs online at the HP C web site. The end users would not even know whether it was local or & remote and they likely would not care.  B In addition, it saves you the hassles of keeping doc's up to date.  E As to the earlier comment about what happens if the Internet is down, F then my simple comment would be that the school has much bigger issues* than not being able to serve online doc's.   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 20:14:28 +0200 & From: "H Vlems" <nospam@what.ever.com>9 Subject: Re: speeding up LAVC with switch instead of hub? < Message-ID: <81b90$44735188$513b818b$5518@news.versatel.net>  L "Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply" <helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de>1 schreef in bericht news:e4f2js$m11$1@online.de... I > I'm looking to speed up communication in my LAN.  I have a cluster with I > all communication on the LAN (SCS, TCPIP, LAT etc; shadow copies/merges J > go across the network as well).  Now, everything is connected via a hub. > I > If I understand things correctly, a switch gives me two advantages with H > regard to speed: ethernet controllers can operate in full-duplex mode,  > and collisions are eliminated. > E > Full duplex would double the bandwidth, whereas avoiding collisions E > would only increase bandwidth if collisions are reducing it, right?  > G > Normally, collisions aren't a problem and there are many of them only " > during shadow copies and merges. > H > To benefit from full duplex, the ethernet controllers would have to beJ > capable of full duplex.  Would that be the case for any of the following3 > machines (which have the "stock" ethernet cards)?  >  >    o  VAXstation 4000/90 >  >    o  VAX 4000/105A  >  >    o  DEC 3000/600 >  >    o  DEC 3000/300LX > 2 >    o  ALPHAserver 1200 (aka Digital Server 5305) >   
 Hi Phillip  J The VAX systems and the DEC 3000 systems all use 10 Mb/s ethernet which isI half duplex, even if you put a UTP transceiver on the AUI ports. The 5305 ' came with a 100 Mb/s FD interface IIRC. L A bridge is better than a repeater, err, a switch is preferable to a hub ;-)K The best solution would be to buy a managed 100/10 switch and hard code the $ desired configuration for each port.C BTW my 5305 runs at 100 Mb/s in HD mode. That way performance, read E throughput, (especially noticable with DECnet) is much better between  Alpha's.   Hans   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 18:28:28 +0000 (UTC) P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)9 Subject: Re: speeding up LAVC with switch instead of hub? $ Message-ID: <e4vk8c$tfs$3@online.de>  F In article <81b90$44735188$513b818b$5518@news.versatel.net>, "H Vlems" <nospam@what.ever.com> writes:    M > The best solution would be to buy a managed 100/10 switch and hard code the & > desired configuration for each port.E > BTW my 5305 runs at 100 Mb/s in HD mode. That way performance, read G > throughput, (especially noticable with DECnet) is much better between 
 > Alpha's.  F The network is full when shadow copies take place or complex web pagesG are viewed, otherwise there is not much activity.  However, with 5 Mb/s B SCSI on the VAXes, that will be the bottleneck for shadow copies.   F I only fire up the 5305 for Mozilla.  I COULD use more bandwidth then,C between it and the internet (I have 6 Mb/s DSL, so 10 Mb/s would be < enough, but if it is split, then the hub might be decreasingC performance).  However, I have a free port on the switch in my DSL  G router, so I could plug the 5305 into that instead of the hub which is  & connected to the switch via an uplink.   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 23 May 2006 21:55:06 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> 9 Subject: Re: speeding up LAVC with switch instead of hub? 9 Message-ID: <zYqdnagnf6yOIe7ZnZ2dneKdnZydnZ2d@libcom.com>   / Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: H > In article <81b90$44735188$513b818b$5518@news.versatel.net>, "H Vlems"! > <nospam@what.ever.com> writes:   > N >> The best solution would be to buy a managed 100/10 switch and hard code the' >> desired configuration for each port. F >> BTW my 5305 runs at 100 Mb/s in HD mode. That way performance, readH >> throughput, (especially noticable with DECnet) is much better between >> Alpha's.  > H > The network is full when shadow copies take place or complex web pagesI > are viewed, otherwise there is not much activity.  However, with 5 Mb/s D > SCSI on the VAXes, that will be the bottleneck for shadow copies.  > H > I only fire up the 5305 for Mozilla.  I COULD use more bandwidth then,E > between it and the internet (I have 6 Mb/s DSL, so 10 Mb/s would be > > enough, but if it is split, then the hub might be decreasingE > performance).  However, I have a free port on the switch in my DSL  I > router, so I could plug the 5305 into that instead of the hub which is  ( > connected to the switch via an uplink. >   6 What you have is adequate.  You explain it well above.  I However, switches are newer technology, will avoid data going where it's  E not needed, and several other things.  One thing I liked, and I made  E sure my purchases had the feature, is autosensing ports which didn't  H care if the cable was straight through, or crossover.  No more need for H a crossover cable when the 'upload' port option wasn't available.  Note @ that connecting to any of the older DEC equipment required such.  9 The switches are cheap, and easier to use, more flexible.   H There is one bad thing I've experienced.  Not saying the HUB won't have G the same issue.  Get a close by lightning strike, doesn't need to make  8 contact, and you could lose ports on the cheap switches.  F The cheap D-Link 5-port switches I use have a long/lifetime warranty, @ and I've gotten more than a few replaced.  Keep all sales info,  receipts, etc.   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450> Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com DFE Ultralights, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------    Date: 23 May 2006 12:12:21 -0700; From: "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com>  Subject: Re: XP1000 POST codesB Message-ID: <1148411541.172994.175290@38g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>   Hoff Hoffman wrote: ! > johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com wrote:  > G > > Does anyone know if you can put the CPU daughterboard from a 667MHz E > > XP1000 in the chassis of a 500MHz XP1000  and vice versa?  I have K > > another XP that's the newer 667MHz that I could try parts swapping with  > > if they are compatible.  > J >    I'd probably swap the parts from the existing AlphaStation XP1000 500J > MHz box over into the AlphaStation XP1000 667 MHz box, as there are someI > advantages to the motherboard in the latter variant -- I'd tend to swap 4 > (or augment) the giblets in the other direction...  A I was actually just thinking for testing purposes... Swap the CPU B daughterboards between the two and see where the crashing occurs -? hopefully it will follow the CPU, they are a bit easier to find C replacements.  Mostly I was wondering if there were any clock speed = related differences that might shoot me down on a quick swap.   E Interestingly, the ailing system seems to work just fine if you don't E log into the CDA desktop.  Once it boots it will stay up quite a long F time until you log in.  Then it will machine check sooner than later -A even if the system is idle otherwise.  I guess it introduces just % enough stress to cause it to trip up.    ------------------------------    Date: 23 May 2006 20:16:27 -0700; From: "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com>  Subject: Re: XP1000 POST codesC Message-ID: <1148440587.708506.203890@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>    Dave Froble wrote:! > johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com wrote:  > > Hoff Hoffman wrote: $ > >> johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com wrote: > >>I > >>> Does anyone know if you can put the CPU daughterboard from a 667MHz G > >>> XP1000 in the chassis of a 500MHz XP1000  and vice versa?  I have M > >>> another XP that's the newer 667MHz that I could try parts swapping with  > >>> if they are compatible. M > >>    I'd probably swap the parts from the existing AlphaStation XP1000 500 M > >> MHz box over into the AlphaStation XP1000 667 MHz box, as there are some L > >> advantages to the motherboard in the latter variant -- I'd tend to swap7 > >> (or augment) the giblets in the other direction...  > > E > > I was actually just thinking for testing purposes... Swap the CPU F > > daughterboards between the two and see where the crashing occurs -C > > hopefully it will follow the CPU, they are a bit easier to find G > > replacements.  Mostly I was wondering if there were any clock speed A > > related differences that might shoot me down on a quick swap.  > > I > > Interestingly, the ailing system seems to work just fine if you don't I > > log into the CDA desktop.  Once it boots it will stay up quite a long J > > time until you log in.  Then it will machine check sooner than later -E > > even if the system is idle otherwise.  I guess it introduces just ) > > enough stress to cause it to trip up.  > >  > 4 > Uses a bit more memory.  Got to the bad part.  :-) >  > --  E That's what I was thinking innitially.  Hence the memory replacement. G Unfortunately it's still machine checking after the memory was replaced F and about 95% of the time it won't boot and gives the 1-2 beep and theF 1110 1100 diagnostic LED display.  I'm almost sure its a thermal issueE on the CPU board since when it was giving those errors I sprayed some F canned air on the hottest chips on the board and it started working or4 a minute or so before reverting to the beeping, etc.   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2006.286 ************************                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                            disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout.l
 <<< PASVA >>> 227 Entering passive mode; use PORT (198,151,12,104,12,164)e <<< RETR expt.cppVp >>> 150 IMAGE retrieve of /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout/expt.cpp (4507 bytes) started.: >>> 226 Transfer completed.  3685 (8) bytes transferred.? <<< CWD /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout0M >>> 250 Connected to /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout.l
 <<< PASVA >>> 227 Entering passive mode; use PORT (198,151,12,104,12,165)e <<< RETR fload.xbmq >>> 150 IMAGE retrieve of /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout/fload.xbm (1355 bytes) started.e9 >>> 226 Transfer completed.  693 (8) bytes transferred.x? <<< CWD /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout M >>> 250 Connected to /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout.s
 <<< PASVA >>> 227 Entering passive mode; use PORT (198,151,12,104,12,166)/ <<< RETR layout.cpps >>> 150 IMAGE retrieve of /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout/layout.cpp (11831 bytes) started.d; >>> 226 Transfer completed.  11721 (8) bytes transferred. ? <<< CWD /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layouttM >>> 250 Connected to /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout.u
 <<< PASVA >>> 227 Entering passive mode; use PORT (198,151,12,104,12,167)t <<< RETR layout.def2q >>> 150 IMAGE retrieve of /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout/layout.def (806 bytes) started.s9 >>> 226 Transfer completed.  218 (8) bytes transferred.p? <<< CWD /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout)M >>> 250 Connected to /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout.l
 <<< PASVA >>> 227 Entering passive mode; use PORT (198,151,12,104,12,168)a <<< RETR layout.hp >>> 150 IMAGE retrieve of /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout/layout.h (2076 bytes) started.: >>> 226 Transfer completed.  2020 (8) bytes transferred.? <<< CWD /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout8M >>> 250 Connected to /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout.l
 <<< PASVA >>> 227 Entering passive mode; use PORT (198,151,12,104,12,169)e <<< RETR layout.rcp >>> 150 IMAGE retrieve of /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout/layout.rc (978 bytes) started.8 >>> 226 Transfer completed.  46 (8) bytes transferred.? <<< CWD /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout2M >>> 250 Connected to /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout.m
 <<< PASVA >>> 227 Entering passive mode; use PORT (198,151,12,104,12,170)p <<< RETR makefile.b32 t >>> 150 IMAGE retrieve of /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout/makefile.b32 (1854 bytes) started.: >>> 226 Transfer completed.  1218 (8) bytes transferred.? <<< CWD /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layoutyM >>> 250 Connected to /disk$misc/decus/freewarev40/wxwindows/samples/layout.u
 <<< PASVA >>> 227 Entering passive mod