1 INFO-VAX	Mon, 02 Oct 2006	Volume 2006 : Issue 540       Contents: A conga line of suckholes  Baltimore OpenVMS PositionB Re: Can a switch give me more speed (long and detailed questions)?B Re: Can a switch give me more speed (long and detailed questions)?B Re: Can a switch give me more speed (long and detailed questions)?B Re: Can a switch give me more speed (long and detailed questions)?B Re: Can a switch give me more speed (long and detailed questions)?B Re: Can a switch give me more speed (long and detailed questions)?$ Re: Converting VAX licences to Alpha Damning with faint praise? Re: Damning with faint praise? Re: Damning with faint praise?$ Re: IDE (DQ) devices served to VAX ?$ Re: IDE (DQ) devices served to VAX ?$ Re: IDE (DQ) devices served to VAX ? Outsourcing of VMS ?( SYSMAN suggestion (SET ENV/ARCHITECTURE), Re: SYSMAN suggestion (SET ENV/ARCHITECTURE)< Re: Where will the FAQ be, and what about the Freeware CD's?< Re: Where will the FAQ be, and what about the Freeware CD's?< Re: Where will the FAQ be, and what about the Freeware CD's?< Re: Where will the FAQ be, and what about the Freeware CD's?  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2006 09:19:40 +08003 From: "Richard Maher" <maher_rj@hotspamnotmail.com> " Subject: A conga line of suckholes1 Message-ID: <efpp8o$9vb$1@news-02.connect.com.au>    Hi,   C Did noone else see the irony in this post pointing to the following " paragraphs on Hoff's contact page?3 --------------------------------------------------- H HoffmanLabs does not accept unsolicited commercial email (UCE, and oftenL better known as spam) for any reason, and HoffmanLabs can and variously doesJ report UCE to appropriate legal authorities and/or to the spam blacklists.  F To the fullest extent of US CAN-SPAM and other applicable national andG international legislation, all HoffmanLabs users explicitly decline and = explicitly opt-out of any and all unsolicited email messages. 4 ----------------------------------------------------  H I'm sure Charles King still wants to know ". . .where did the shame come in?"  G But I'm not here to talk about SPAM (although I am grateful to Hoff and L others for having raised the bar to such a level of tolerance that I will noJ longer feel guilty in posting just about anything to COV) What I'd like toB know is where all you sychophantic, bleeding-heart, Princess DianaG worshipers were over the last 15 years when engineer after engineer was I being cut from the Digital, Compaq, HP workforce? Why is it only now that B the sky is falling? Were all the others complete rubbish? Did they' contribute nothing to VMS's well being?   K Yes children, plenty of VMS engineers have come and gone over the years and H the reason that you may not have heard of them is that they have not allJ felt the need to make grandiose speeches or spam newsgroups about it. Now,J if you are suffering from Natasha Kampusch syndrome and are unable to copeK after your Master's demise then, with therapy, we can bring you back to the F real world. (Or you can go with him and drink the cordial in HoffstownF Guyana) but whatever you do, don't stand up here an tell everyone thatL suddenly VMS is going to die just because a few more people have left. (Even1 if they have been the subject of your adoration.)    Long live VMS!   Regards Richard Maher   H PS. I think I'll always remember exactly where I was when The Hoff left!  9 "Hoff Hoffman" <hoff-remove-this@hp.com> wrote in message $ news:45192e4a@usenet01.boi.hp.com... > J > Effective 23-Oct-2006, I expect to be directly available for OpenVMS and related - > professional services, support and related.  > 0 > Additional general information is available at <http://www.hoffmanlabs.org/>,K > and I would ask that inquiries be referred to/via the contact information 8 > available over there, and not to the HP email address. > + > And yes, HP and I are "parting amicably".  > @ > Now if y'all will excuse me, I have some (more) writing to do. >    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2006 00:25:31 GMT & From: "Hal Kuff" <HalKuff@Verizon.Net># Subject: Baltimore OpenVMS Position ) Message-ID: <%%YTg.1411$pS3.441@trnddc01>   J I have a need for a JR OpenVMS admin a bit north of Baltimore... full timeL permanent... if you are very good w/Hardware and want to learn Linux/WindowsH in a great environment..... also looking for programmer with 3GL OpenvmsJ experience... very generous finders fee if you can send on a lead for good DBL programmer...    Hal Kuff VP Technology Services Kuff at tessco.com   ------------------------------  $ Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2006 20:00:47 +0200# From: "H Vlems" <hvlems@freenet.de> K Subject: Re: Can a switch give me more speed (long and detailed questions)? 5 Message-ID: <efovk5$11jk$1@registered.motzarella.org>   3 "Allan B." <hp.bowman@gmail.com> schreef in bericht = news:1159724956.228336.288840@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com... D > Phil - Based on my past experience, changing a hub to a switch MAYH > increase the speed from any given system to the outside world, but mayA > actually DECREASE the speed between systems on the same switch.  > A > We had a number of customer systems that consisted of a pair of D > MicroVAX 3185's and a number of Proliant servers running Linux andC > Unix.  When we changed from our 10mb hubs to 10/100 switches, the E > traffic between the Proliant servers improved (only because we were @ > able to change their NICs to operate at 100mb), but large dataH > transfers between the VAXes (still at 10mb) slowed down slightly.  TheA > same behavior occurred on both managed and unmanaged switches - F > changing duplex settings also made no difference.  We spent a lot of; > time trying to resolve this issue but never got anywhere.  > I > I don't know if the same decrease would have occurred if everything was   > initially at 100mb on a hub... >  > Allan  > < Could autonegotiation have been part of the speed reduction?@ Most switches have that feature, which is quite foreign to older 10baseT/10base2 gear.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 01 Oct 2006 14:44:34 -0400 3 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <rgilbert88@comcast.net> K Subject: Re: Can a switch give me more speed (long and detailed questions)? : Message-ID: <ZrWdnfL0KNcIkb3YnZ2dnUVZ_rqdnZ2d@comcast.com>   Allan B. wrote:   D > Phil - Based on my past experience, changing a hub to a switch MAYH > increase the speed from any given system to the outside world, but mayA > actually DECREASE the speed between systems on the same switch.  > A > We had a number of customer systems that consisted of a pair of D > MicroVAX 3185's and a number of Proliant servers running Linux andC > Unix.  When we changed from our 10mb hubs to 10/100 switches, the E > traffic between the Proliant servers improved (only because we were @ > able to change their NICs to operate at 100mb), but large dataH > transfers between the VAXes (still at 10mb) slowed down slightly.  TheA > same behavior occurred on both managed and unmanaged switches - F > changing duplex settings also made no difference.  We spent a lot of; > time trying to resolve this issue but never got anywhere.  > I > I don't know if the same decrease would have occurred if everything was   > initially at 100mb on a hub... >  > Allan  >   F Think about how hubs and switches have to work.  On the hub, only one A node at a time can talk; everyone else must listen.  On a switch  E everybody can talk at once and the switch buffers things in internal  H memory.  I don't believe you can do full duplex on a hub but you can on F a switch.  I suspect that the size of the memory buffer in the switch 7 might have limited the transfer rate between the VAXen.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 01 Oct 2006 15:52:20 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> K Subject: Re: Can a switch give me more speed (long and detailed questions)? , Message-ID: <45201C70.8D985A41@teksavvy.com>   Mr remove-clothes-to-reply:   7 You haven't mentioned which machines uses the internet.   H If the laptop is the main user/abuser of the internet, then by all meansG put it on your router/switch. The laptop then gets direct access to the 9 internet without any collisions from the cluster traffic.   B When your VMS boxes are sending information TO the internet, it isB usually at a very slow speed because residential internet services? usually provide some ridiculously slow upload bandwidth. So the % bottleneck will be the internet link.     C One thing to consider with shadow set copies is whether the data is E flowing continuously, or whether there are gaps between packets (node H waiting for an ack for instance). If there are gaps, then those gaps canQ be used by another application to access the internet without much of a slowdown.   H if a switch is used, where this could make a difference is if machines 1C and 2 are doing shadown copies, and amchine 3 is accessing the net.   E With a switch, traffic between 1 and 2 won't affect traffic between 3 C and the router. And what this might allow you to do is to raise the F speed of the shadow copies (usually restricted so that they don't slow7 down the applicatiosn running on that system too much).   E The big advantage here is that your could run your alphas at 100 mbps F and the vax at 10. So the alphas can do a shadow copy at 100mbps whileF the vax is accessing the net at 10mbps.  The amount of traffic between9 the alphas would have probably overwhelmed a 10mbps link.    ------------------------------  * Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2006 21:36:24 +0000 (UTC)P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)K Subject: Re: Can a switch give me more speed (long and detailed questions)? $ Message-ID: <efpccn$57i$2@online.de>  F In article <ZrWdnfL0KNcIkb3YnZ2dnUVZ_rqdnZ2d@comcast.com>, "Richard B.* Gilbert" <rgilbert88@comcast.net> writes:   H > Think about how hubs and switches have to work.  On the hub, only one C > node at a time can talk; everyone else must listen.  On a switch  G > everybody can talk at once and the switch buffers things in internal  J > memory.  I don't believe you can do full duplex on a hub but you can on H > a switch.  I suspect that the size of the memory buffer in the switch 9 > might have limited the transfer rate between the VAXen.   G Makes sense.  In that case, what sort of specs should I be looking for   when buying a switch?    ------------------------------  * Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2006 21:40:07 +0000 (UTC)P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)K Subject: Re: Can a switch give me more speed (long and detailed questions)? $ Message-ID: <efpcjn$57i$3@online.de>  5 In article <45201C70.8D985A41@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei ' <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:     > Mr remove-clothes-to-reply:  > 9 > You haven't mentioned which machines uses the internet.   G Incoming stuff: it all goes to the cluster alias.  Outgoing stuff: all  G VMS machines use it.  I don't think that internet traffic is playing a   role, here, though.   J > If the laptop is the main user/abuser of the internet, then by all meansI > put it on your router/switch. The laptop then gets direct access to the ; > internet without any collisions from the cluster traffic.   H I only mentioned the laptop (which is normally switched off and when it I is switched on it dials out over ISDN and doesn't use the LAN at all) to  G demonstrate that very modern hardware can get the advertised 6000 kb/s   even on the hub.  D > When your VMS boxes are sending information TO the internet, it isD > usually at a very slow speed because residential internet servicesA > usually provide some ridiculously slow upload bandwidth. So the ' > bottleneck will be the internet link.   ! Yes, see my post with FTP speeds.   E > One thing to consider with shadow set copies is whether the data is G > flowing continuously, or whether there are gaps between packets (node J > waiting for an ack for instance). If there are gaps, then those gaps canS > be used by another application to access the internet without much of a slowdown.  > J > if a switch is used, where this could make a difference is if machines 1E > and 2 are doing shadown copies, and amchine 3 is accessing the net.   F Actually, that would be the case.  I try to keep the cluster alias on E the ALPHA (to make use of anti-spam features in TCPIP 5.4), and as I  1 mentioned the big disk is connected to the VAXes.    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 01 Oct 2006 21:27:57 -0400 3 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <rgilbert88@comcast.net> K Subject: Re: Can a switch give me more speed (long and detailed questions)? : Message-ID: <eoednf_uF9aC9r3YnZ2dnUVZ_vednZ2d@comcast.com>  / Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply wrote: H > In article <ZrWdnfL0KNcIkb3YnZ2dnUVZ_rqdnZ2d@comcast.com>, "Richard B., > Gilbert" <rgilbert88@comcast.net> writes:  >  > H >>Think about how hubs and switches have to work.  On the hub, only one C >>node at a time can talk; everyone else must listen.  On a switch  G >>everybody can talk at once and the switch buffers things in internal  J >>memory.  I don't believe you can do full duplex on a hub but you can on H >>a switch.  I suspect that the size of the memory buffer in the switch 9 >>might have limited the transfer rate between the VAXen.  >  > I > Makes sense.  In that case, what sort of specs should I be looking for   > when buying a switch?  >   H Sorry, I've never bought a switch in that class.  The ones I have are a F LinkSys 8 port switch and a low end Cisco (1548M) that I picked up on H e-Bay.  I would expect the high end Cisco switches (6500???) to provide H much higher backplane speeds and more buffer memory.  If you can afford D that sort of hardware you might give Cisco a call.  We used several B 6500s at my last job. One served as the core switch for the whole F company, lived in the data center, and connected all the servers, the H "first floor switch" the "second floor switch", the "warehouse switch", G etc.  As I recall, the first and second floor switches were also Cisco  J 6500s.  Altogether we had something like 400 devices connected to the net.   ------------------------------   Date: 1 Oct 2006 21:54:06 -0700 ' From: "bclaremont" <msi1@earthlink.net> - Subject: Re: Converting VAX licences to Alpha B Message-ID: <1159764846.660420.51690@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>  G Install the CHARON-VAX for Alpha hobbiest kit on you Alpha and rock on.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2006 08:31:03 +08003 From: "Richard Maher" <maher_rj@hotspamnotmail.com> # Subject: Damning with faint praise? 1 Message-ID: <efpmdn$689$1@news-02.connect.com.au>    Hi Guy,    Guy Peleg gushed: - , "John Gillings is one of the best VMS people on planet earth."    Gilley retorted: -1 "Look at Guy Peleg! He was only with HP for what, 4 6 years? He's younger than my oldest child, and look4 what he's achieved. In effect, he's been replaced by- maybe SEVEN people just like him 6 years ago. 1 Even if each of them is only HALF as good as Guy, ' that's still a huge long term benefit."   F Is it just me, or is there a certain lack of symmetry here? Trouble in	 paradise?   J Recent posts in cov had led me to believe that Brudden had scored the No.1I draft pick for the season, but surely the above description could equally K apply to a snotty-nosed kid in short pants who's still wet behind the ears? E I'm confused. (If only a HP Moderator's Brown-Shirt gave one the same G book-burning rights in COV (as it does in ITRC) then we could sort this  whole mess out!)  B Anyway Guy, keep going mate. I'm sure you'll get there in the end.   Regards Richard Maher   F "Guy Peleg" <guy.peleg@remove_this_header@bruden.com> wrote in message3 news:451bd350$0$19703$88260bb3@free.teranews.com...  > - > <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> wrote in message ? > news:1159451895.040566.233710@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com... J > > There is a parallel (although shorter) thread on ITRC about Hoff's andH > > others leaving OpenVMS Engineering.  For those that don't visit overH > > there I'm cross-posting one particularly interesting part (hopefullyG > > the OP will forgive me) which puts an positive spin on events.  The J > > clip follows, it is in answer to the question if the particular person- > > was still at OVE (OpenVMS Engineering)...  > > K > >  "Well, since you asked... yes and no. For now, yes, but I've also been J > > selected in the latest round of Work Force Reduction (WFR). <..snip..> > > G > > I am also "parting amicably" from HP, and that's NOT intended to be C > > sarcastic. Mr Hurd is following a strategy of reducing costs by J > > restructuring the workforce. I'm not sure how or why management selectI > > particular individuals, that's not really relevant. The same thing is K > > happening in most large corporations, and there's not a lot of point in C > > complaining about it. Just accept what's happening and move on.  > > C > > In the long term this should really be seen as a GOOD thing for E > > OpenVMS. Consider that most of us in engineering and services are H > > getting fairly old! Where are the young replacements for the future?J > > Although it's called "WFR" it really isn't, as every person who leavesI > > from Nashua or Sydney is replaced by *several* people in the new call H > > centres and engineering hubs. These are young, keen graduates, readyI > > and able to take on the maintenance and development OpenVMS products.  > > G > > Thus the population of OpenVMS service and development engineers is H > > actually INCREASING, and the average age is coming down. This is theF > > future. Granted they don't (yet) have the experience that Hoff andK > > myself have gathered over the decades, but they won't take very long to G > > get up to speed. Look at Guy Peleg! He was only with HP for what, 6 J > > years? He's younger than my oldest child, and look what he's achieved.G > > In effect, he's been replaced by maybe SEVEN people just like him 6 G > > years ago. Even if each of them is only HALF as good as Guy, that's # > > still a huge long term benefit.  > @ > When I joined engineering I had 7 years of experience with VMS >  > > I > > The corporation sees that they get more "bang for the buck" by hiring K > > several new graduates than retaining one of us old guys. The last thing I > > you, as customers want to see is for OpenVMS engineering to stagnate, H > > and 5-10 years from now be completely vacated when everyone retires.J > > This way it's far more likely there will be engineers into the future. > > E > > What YOU can do as customers is support the product by purchasing F > > service contracts. Without revenue, the product WILL die. That's aH > > simple economic fact. So, USE your contract. Log cases to ask adviceF > > and report issues. More cases mean more engineers needed to handleG > > them. You should also feed back any complaints or criticisms of the K > > quality of products or service you receive, but, MORE IMPORTANTLY, also C > > feed back any positives or praise for individuals who give good  > > service. > > F > > The biggest threat to OpenVMS is silence from customers. Make your > > voices and opinions heard."  > >  > > J > > There are some good points made, especially about breaking the silenceH > > and making yourself heard.  At lot of us here are just hobbyists nowI > > though so I'm not sure how much we can do.  Those of you lucky enough G > > still to be using VMS in your job and that do have contract support E > > should follow the above advice to the fullest.  Make your support H > > calls, ask your questions, be heard, be the squeaky wheel.  Don't be > > part of the silence. > >  > >  > >   John H. Reinhardt  > >  >  >  >  > --  ? > Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 01 Oct 2006 21:05:17 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> ' Subject: Re: Damning with faint praise? , Message-ID: <452065B4.5869A9B5@teksavvy.com>   Richard Maher wrote:L > Recent posts in cov had led me to believe that Brudden had scored the No.1K > draft pick for the season, but surely the above description could equally M > apply to a snotty-nosed kid in short pants who's still wet behind the ears?     G Guido is a hero because he was able to add visible features to VMS such G as adding stuff in DCL, lexicals and to Backup as well, while the other H engineers worked under the hgood to modify stuff that is less visible toE users. Being able to visibly respond to customer suggestions gave him  lots of brownie points.   G Does this mean he is better than some engineer tasked to work under the E hood to fix some hidden kernel issue ? Not necessarily. But engineers G who do partake in discussions with users tend to get a good reputation.    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2006 03:10:36 +0200 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture.nospam@hispeed.ch> ' Subject: Re: Damning with faint praise? J Message-ID: <paul.sture.nospam-785F50.03103602102006@mac.sture.homeip.net>  1 In article <efpmdn$689$1@news-02.connect.com.au>, 5  "Richard Maher" <maher_rj@hotspamnotmail.com> wrote:   	 > Hi Guy,  >  > Guy Peleg gushed: - . > "John Gillings is one of the best VMS people > on planet earth."   = Sorry. I didn't quite follow your attributions there, but ...   G by the wonders of a decent newsreader, and without having to resort to  G Google, I can take you straight to this piece posted by John Reinhardt.    --- start quote ----  < "From: "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> Newsgroups: comp.os.vms 7 Subject: More on the transitions at OpenVMS Engineering   Date: 28 Sep 2006 06:58:15 -0700  F There is a parallel (although shorter) thread on ITRC about Hoff's andD others leaving OpenVMS Engineering.  For those that don't visit overD there I'm cross-posting one particularly interesting part (hopefullyC the OP will forgive me) which puts an positive spin on events.  The F clip follows, it is in answer to the question if the particular person) was still at OVE (OpenVMS Engineering)...   G  "Well, since you asked... yes and no. For now, yes, but I've also been F selected in the latest round of Work Force Reduction (WFR). <..snip..>  C I am also "parting amicably" from HP, and that's NOT intended to be ? sarcastic. Mr Hurd is following a strategy of reducing costs by F restructuring the workforce. I'm not sure how or why management selectE particular individuals, that's not really relevant. The same thing is G happening in most large corporations, and there's not a lot of point in ? complaining about it. Just accept what's happening and move on.   ? In the long term this should really be seen as a GOOD thing for A OpenVMS. Consider that most of us in engineering and services are D getting fairly old! Where are the young replacements for the future?F Although it's called "WFR" it really isn't, as every person who leavesE from Nashua or Sydney is replaced by *several* people in the new call D centres and engineering hubs. These are young, keen graduates, readyE and able to take on the maintenance and development OpenVMS products.   C Thus the population of OpenVMS service and development engineers is D actually INCREASING, and the average age is coming down. This is theB future. Granted they don't (yet) have the experience that Hoff andG myself have gathered over the decades, but they won't take very long to C get up to speed. Look at Guy Peleg! He was only with HP for what, 6 F years? He's younger than my oldest child, and look what he's achieved.C In effect, he's been replaced by maybe SEVEN people just like him 6 C years ago. Even if each of them is only HALF as good as Guy, that's  still a huge long term benefit.   E The corporation sees that they get more "bang for the buck" by hiring G several new graduates than retaining one of us old guys. The last thing E you, as customers want to see is for OpenVMS engineering to stagnate, D and 5-10 years from now be completely vacated when everyone retires.F This way it's far more likely there will be engineers into the future.  A What YOU can do as customers is support the product by purchasing B service contracts. Without revenue, the product WILL die. That's aD simple economic fact. So, USE your contract. Log cases to ask adviceB and report issues. More cases mean more engineers needed to handleC them. You should also feed back any complaints or criticisms of the G quality of products or service you receive, but, MORE IMPORTANTLY, also ? feed back any positives or praise for individuals who give good  service.  B The biggest threat to OpenVMS is silence from customers. Make your voices and opinions heard."     F There are some good points made, especially about breaking the silenceD and making yourself heard.  At lot of us here are just hobbyists nowE though so I'm not sure how much we can do.  Those of you lucky enough C still to be using VMS in your job and that do have contract support A should follow the above advice to the fullest.  Make your support D calls, ask your questions, be heard, be the squeaky wheel.  Don't be part of the silence.       John H. Reinhardt    --- end quote ...    --  
 Paul Sture   ------------------------------  * Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2006 15:57:56 -0500 (CDT)* From: sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda)- Subject: Re: IDE (DQ) devices served to VAX ? 2 Message-ID: <06100115575674_2020028F@antinode.org>  - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>   H > >    Not that it matters here, but why the non-zero allocation class?   F > Every nodes in my cluster gets its own allocation class for its own K > locally served disks. So when I get 2 or 3 DS10Ls, each node's DQA0 will   > be unique within the cluster.   G    You're working too hard.  A non-zero allocation class is needed only H for disks which are accessible directly from multiple nodes.  (RF-seriesD DSSI disks are considered so, even if they are connected to only one system.)  G    For example, on two Alpha systems, ALP and ALP2, each of which has a  DKA0:    ALP $ sysman SYSMAN> set envi /clus+ %SYSMAN-I-ENV, current command environment: $         Clusterwide on local cluster<         Username SYSTEM       will be used on nonlocal nodes  $ SYSMAN> do mcr sysgen show alloclass/ %SYSMAN-I-OUTPUT, command execution on node ALP L ALLOCLASS                       0          0         0        255 Pure-numbe0 %SYSMAN-I-OUTPUT, command execution on node ALP2L ALLOCLASS                       0          0         0        255 Pure-numbe   ALP $ show devi dka0  P Device                  Device           Error    Volume         Free  Trans MntP  Name                   Status           Count     Label        Blocks Count CntP ALP$DKA0:               Mounted              8  VMS073ALP      4995165  1313   2P ALP2$DKA0:              Mounted              0  VMS082ALP2     9803440     1   2    F    Personally, I find it easier to remember that ALP$DKA0 is served byD ALP, and ALP2$DKA0 is served by ALP2, than I would to remember which) node has which non-zero allocation class.   :    I believe that the clustering manual explains all this.  H ------------------------------------------------------------------------  3    Steven M. Schweda               sms@antinode-org 4    382 South Warwick Street        (+1) 651-699-9818    Saint Paul  MN  55105-2547    ------------------------------  * Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2006 21:48:38 +0000 (UTC)P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)- Subject: Re: IDE (DQ) devices served to VAX ? $ Message-ID: <efpd3l$57i$5@online.de>  C In article <06100115575674_2020028F@antinode.org>, sms@antinode.org  (Steven M. Schweda) writes:   / > From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>  > J > > >    Not that it matters here, but why the non-zero allocation class?  > H > > Every nodes in my cluster gets its own allocation class for its own M > > locally served disks. So when I get 2 or 3 DS10Ls, each node's DQA0 will  ! > > be unique within the cluster.  > I >    You're working too hard.  A non-zero allocation class is needed only J > for disks which are accessible directly from multiple nodes.  (RF-seriesF > DSSI disks are considered so, even if they are connected to only one
 > system.)  G What you say is true, of course.  However, even if no disk is connected @ to more than one node directly (as on my cluster), one DOES needF non-zero allocation classes for HBVS.  Since ONE reason for HBVS is toF provide connectivity to a disk through more than one node, making THISH reason for dual-ported disks less important, it really surprised me whenF I first read this.  It turns out that the reason is that the $n$ namesC are short enough to fit into the SCB and the node$ddcu names are to  long.   I >    For example, on two Alpha systems, ALP and ALP2, each of which has a  > DKA0:  >  > ALP $ sysman > SYSMAN> set envi /clus- > %SYSMAN-I-ENV, current command environment: & >         Clusterwide on local cluster> >         Username SYSTEM       will be used on nonlocal nodes > & > SYSMAN> do mcr sysgen show alloclass1 > %SYSMAN-I-OUTPUT, command execution on node ALP N > ALLOCLASS                       0          0         0        255 Pure-numbe2 > %SYSMAN-I-OUTPUT, command execution on node ALP2N > ALLOCLASS                       0          0         0        255 Pure-numbe >  > ALP $ show devi dka0 > R > Device                  Device           Error    Volume         Free  Trans MntR >  Name                   Status           Count     Label        Blocks Count CntR > ALP$DKA0:               Mounted              8  VMS073ALP      4995165  1313   2R > ALP2$DKA0:              Mounted              0  VMS082ALP2     9803440     1   2 >  > H >    Personally, I find it easier to remember that ALP$DKA0 is served byF > ALP, and ALP2$DKA0 is served by ALP2, than I would to remember which+ > node has which non-zero allocation class.   H True.  This is one reason why I choose a number for each system and use G the same number in as many contexts as possible.  This makes it easier  F to associate an allocation class with a node (i.e. if the same number 3 shows up in SCSNODE, IP-address, volume label etc).    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2006 03:56:35 +0200 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture.nospam@hispeed.ch> - Subject: Re: IDE (DQ) devices served to VAX ? J Message-ID: <paul.sture.nospam-F3D47A.03563502102006@mac.sture.homeip.net>  2 In article <06100115575674_2020028F@antinode.org>,,  sms@antinode.org (Steven M. Schweda) wrote:  , > A non-zero allocation class is needed only> > for disks which are accessible directly from multiple nodes.  ' Not strictly correct. From the VMS FAQ:   '           _____________________________ G           15.6.8.1  Does volume shadowing require a non-zero allocation                      classes?  C                    Yes, use of host-based Volume Shadowing requires H                    that the disk(s) involved be configured in a non-zero$                    allocation class.   --  
 Paul Sture   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 01 Oct 2006 23:30:29 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>  Subject: Outsourcing of VMS ? , Message-ID: <452087B3.2D1C32E1@teksavvy.com>  M Not long ago, there was this inquirer rumor of VMS being outsourced to India.   F Is it possible that engineers are all going out on their own and would2 bid against some indian firm to win the contract ?    A If so, is there anything we, the users/customers could do to help F convince Hp to pay a bit more to get an outsourcing contract with real9 engineers instead of some inexperienced drones in india ?    ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 01 Oct 2006 16:11:18 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 1 Subject: SYSMAN suggestion (SET ENV/ARCHITECTURE) , Message-ID: <452020E0.FD4842D7@teksavvy.com>   Suggestion for SYSMAN:  $ SYSMAN>  SET ENV/ARCHITECTURE=xxxxxx  G This would automatically set the environment to only the nodes matching " that architecture on the cluster.   D In environments where not all nodes are always available, this wouldE provide a neat/clean way to affect only the nodes that are present at E the moment without having to prefix the SYSMAN commands with some DCL 5 loop to draw the list of nodes for each architecture.    ------------------------------  * Date: Sun, 1 Oct 2006 21:44:05 +0000 (UTC)P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)5 Subject: Re: SYSMAN suggestion (SET ENV/ARCHITECTURE) $ Message-ID: <efpcr5$57i$4@online.de>  5 In article <452020E0.FD4842D7@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei ' <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:     > Suggestion for SYSMAN: > & > SYSMAN>  SET ENV/ARCHITECTURE=xxxxxx > I > This would automatically set the environment to only the nodes matching $ > that architecture on the cluster.    Interesting idea.   F > In environments where not all nodes are always available, this wouldG > provide a neat/clean way to affect only the nodes that are present at G > the moment without having to prefix the SYSMAN commands with some DCL 7 > loop to draw the list of nodes for each architecture.   E I think the overhead in the code I posted is negligible.  Many folks  @ have a symbol for "MC SYSMAN" anyway; just replace it with this:  ) $  @ CLUSTER_MANAGER:DEFINE_NODE_LIST.COM $ $  DEFINE/USER SYS$INPUT SYS$COMMAND
 $  MCR SYSMAN  $  EXIT   C where CLUSTER_MANAGER:DEFINE_NODE_LIST.COM is the code I posted in   another post today.   F Note that the code can be easily expanded to create other node lists, A rather than just the three (all, VAX and ALPHA) in the example.      ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 01 Oct 2006 16:05:57 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> E Subject: Re: Where will the FAQ be, and what about the Freeware CD's? , Message-ID: <45201FA0.913F4F12@teksavvy.com>  
 AEF wrote:< > So where will we find future editions of the OpenVMS FAQ?  > H > And what about the OpenVMS Freeware CD's? Will there be more editions?    G Stay tuned for the next episode of "As the VMS world turns" for answers $ to these and other questions :-) :-)    G If HP does not wish to allocate resources for those 2 projects, I could E see HP agreeing to have them move to openvms.org and put links on the G VMS web site to the openvms.org pages that provide the FAQ and freware. F I believe that there are already precedents of the VMS web site having links to openvms.org.   ? If HoffmanLabs becomes a "competitor" to HP in terms of support F contracts, then it may be more politically difficult for the HP sit to link to hoffmanlabs.  E Now, if it is hosted by openvms.org, then there is nothing preventing  Hoff from doing that work.      C Note that in the good old days, the "freeware" was called the DECUS B Library and was handled by DECUS volunteers, back when there was a3 worldwide coherent user group that catererd to VMS.    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 2 Oct 2006 09:30:41 +08003 From: "Richard Maher" <maher_rj@hotspamnotmail.com> E Subject: Re: Where will the FAQ be, and what about the Freeware CD's? 1 Message-ID: <efppte$aqv$1@news-02.connect.com.au>    Hi AEF,   ; > So where will we find future editions of the OpenVMS FAQ?   D There is a post here somewhere from Hoff that roughly said it was anI out-of-hours project that is out of HP IP rights and he was gonna try and K squirrel it away in his brief case on the way ou the door. I only looked at L it for the first time the other day and it wouldn't bother me one way or theI other but they'd at least need to be a link to it from HP's OpenVMS site, H and it might look a bit dodgy to have the FAQ for their operating system somewhere else.   K Still, must be good for a few thousand free hits per year so if you can get  away with it, why not?   Regards Richard Maher   7 PS. How hard can it be to maintain? HP-UX FAQ? NSK FAQ?   / "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> wrote in message < news:1159715491.420854.63850@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com... > Hoff,  > + > [Aplogies if I missed it somehow, but...]  > D > So where will we find future editions of the OpenVMS FAQ? Will youE > still be allowed to post it on the hp Web site? What will happen to I > that HP page if you won't? OK, I suppose it will be at the Hoffman Labs  > site.  > H > And what about the OpenVMS Freeware CD's? Will there be more editions? >  > AEF  >    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2006 03:22:13 +0200 / From: Paul Sture <paul.sture.nospam@hispeed.ch> E Subject: Re: Where will the FAQ be, and what about the Freeware CD's? J Message-ID: <paul.sture.nospam-028C4F.03221302102006@mac.sture.homeip.net>  B In article <1159715491.420854.63850@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,&  "AEF" <spamsink2001@yahoo.com> wrote:    H > And what about the OpenVMS Freeware CD's? Will there be more editions? >   D Bzzt. Unless you want to cheat and disobey the robots.txt lurking at  $ http://h71000.www7.hp.com/robots.txt  . you won't be able to search the freeware site.   Here it is:    # Robot Exclusion Standard
 User-agent: * ! Disallow: /misc/about-server.html  Disallow: /cgi-bin/textit.exe  Disallow: /cgi-bin/wwwwais.exe Disallow: /cgi-bin/vmshelp.com Disallow: /cd/ Disallow: /freeware/   --  
 Paul Sture   ------------------------------  % Date: Sun, 01 Oct 2006 23:24:11 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> E Subject: Re: Where will the FAQ be, and what about the Freeware CD's? , Message-ID: <45208639.D8DADB8B@teksavvy.com>   Richard Maher wrote:M > squirrel it away in his brief case on the way ou the door. I only looked at N > it for the first time the other day and it wouldn't bother me one way or the > other     A The FAQ and ASK  THE WIZZARD are of great use to many people. ATW B contains a lot fo information for advanced users too. In fact, itsG documentation for SFF facility (send from file for SMTP) is better than ' what eventually made it to the manuals.    ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2006.540 ************************