1 INFO-VAX	Mon, 04 Sep 2006	Volume 2006 : Issue 485       Contents:9 Re: $analyze/audit. What does ILLEGAL mean as a username?  Re: Alpha remembrance day  Re: Alpha remembrance day  Re: Alpha remembrance day ) DECC$RTLLIB.TLB built locally or at DEC ? - Re: DECC$RTLLIB.TLB built locally or at DEC ? ( Re: Distributed Netbeans 5.0 field test? Re: Interesting SPAM I received  multinet / cluster questions  Re: multinet / cluster questions  Re: multinet / cluster questions( Re: OpenVMS 7.3-2 to 8.2 Upgrade Warning" Re: OpenVMS and Windows on Itanium" Re: OpenVMS and Windows on Itanium" Re: OpenVMS and Windows on Itanium" Re: OpenVMS and Windows on Itanium" RE: OpenVMS and Windows on Itanium Re: Problem during boot  Re: Problem during boot  Re: Problem during boot ) Re: problem with file creation time stamp ) Re: problem with file creation time stamp 7 Re[4]: Thoughts on the book: DEC is dead, long live DEC ; Re: Re[4]: Thoughts on the book: DEC is dead, long live DEC  Tape library The Mythical IT Shortage! The Real Reason Behind Offshoring 4 Re: Thoughts on the book: DEC is dead, long live DEC2 Re: VGA video adapter for Vaxstation 4000 model 60* VMS STARTUP documentation mis-leading V7.3. Re: VMS STARTUP documentation mis-leading V7.3. Re: VMS STARTUP documentation mis-leading V7.3. Re: VMS STARTUP documentation mis-leading V7.3. Re: VMS STARTUP documentation mis-leading V7.3 Re: WWENG2.SYS  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 4 Sep 2006 10:45:21 +0100* From: "Richard Brodie" <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk>B Subject: Re: $analyze/audit. What does ILLEGAL mean as a username?, Message-ID: <edgsjh$fr6$1@south.jnrs.ja.net>  ; "Volker Halle" <volker_halle@hotmail.com> wrote in message  = news:1157042915.903262.292150@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...   E > This looks like a network task access for an undefined network task I > object. You are probably running DECnet-IV software, so try MC NCP SHOW D > KNO OBJECT and you might see the TASK object having a user name of
 > ILLEGAL.  F Setting the username to an explicitly unused username is often used toD prevent anonymous access explicitly. The name "ILLEGAL" is customaryT from various security bulletins e.g.  http://www.ciac.org/ciac/bulletins/b-15.shtml    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2006 03:34:57 -0700 - From: "Andrew" <andrew_harrison@symantec.com> " Subject: Re: Alpha remembrance dayC Message-ID: <1157366097.662044.146260@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>    Hoff Hoffman wrote:  > Andrew wrote:  > F > > No you introduced VIRTUAL addressing. I was talking about PHYSICALB > > addressing. Although some of the limits that apply to PHYSICAL= > > addressing obviously apply to VIRTUAL addressing as well.  > R >    Eh?  You said there was no use for 64-bit addressing on Alpha.  That's 64-bit > VIRTUAL addressing.   E Of course, but the majority of the benefits are derived not from just E being able to support 64bit VIRTUAL addressing but also being able to $ PHYSICALLY address more than 32bits.  F And thats where you enter the what could you reasonably configure intoD your Alphaserver in terms of CPU's Memory and I/O and have a working system.   E Thats also where the whole early Alpha strategy fell flat on its arse G because you couldn't configure even reasonable numbers of CPU's in that ? same platform as enough memory to make being able to address it  usefull.   >  >   Specifically, here:  > J > > The biggest benefit is being able to address more than 4GB of RAM withI > > a single process. There are other benefits but they and being able to @ > > address more then 4GB may come with an expense tag attached. >  >    Specifically, here: > + > > The hype arround VLM created by Digital  > O >    Sun's currently hauling around cardboard cut-outs that cost them US$6K, if   > you want to discuss marketing. >   D I am not quite sure what the cut-outs of the HP founders campaign isD all about but interestingly I know about it you know about it and so1 probably do many of the people on this newsgroup.   Q >    As for VLM, DIGITAL and OpenVMS customers had slammed into a hard limit with R > VAX and its 32-bit virtual and 34-bit physical addressing, and Alpha removed it.M >    Finding discussions of the limits of fitting everything into S0/S1 space R > should not be difficult, as these were comparatively common.  Too many processesO > and too large working sets and too large virtual address space, and you reach N > limits of what an OpenVMS VAX box can fit into system space.  So as for realQ > uses for and real applications for 64-bit virtual addressing, OpenVMS customers  > hit those over a decade ago. > K > > I prefer the technical documentation which is clear, you are welcome to $ > > use pres s releases as a source. > 1 >    You never read the Sun NFS specs, then.  :-)   > No, having access to the source code did have some advantages.   Regards  Andrew Harrison    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2006 09:00:37 -0700 - From: "Andrew" <andrew_harrison@symantec.com> " Subject: Re: Alpha remembrance dayB Message-ID: <1157385637.828324.16170@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com>   Glenn Everhart wrote: G > I recall at the time every manufacturer (pretty much...there might be H > an exception that slips my mind) was claiming 64 bit addressing was ofI > no value. This however silenced once the point sunk in that a number of E > database operations were dramatically faster on 64 bit machines (in I > particular on Alpha) than any previous 32 bit ones. The most surprising H > example I recall was that 5 way joins (and yes, these do get used) ranA > something like 250 TIMES faster (25,000%) than on 32 bit boxes, G > regardless of the amount of tuning one tried. In those days (c. 1992) G > DBMS vendors would beat one another up over the usual 20% performance H > improvements, and the difference was large enough to make it very veryD > clear that simply claiming nobody had uses for the things would no > longer wash.  F This was because being able to physically address more than 4GB of RAMF allowed a larger SGA which improved the performance for complex joins.6 But this is also where reality and marketing collided.  D The Alphaserver benchmarks which showed this used minimal numbers ofD CPU's and were configured with the minimum amount of I/O in order toE allow the boxes to have enough memory to have a significant impact on < complex joins, this was the only option you had on the 8400.    There were two issues with this:  D 1.     The complex joins performed for the tests returned very smallE numbers of rows and while this may have been usefull for some queries ? the reality was that you were equalliy likely to need to return G millions of rows. This required more I/O bandwidth, something you could B have on the 8400 but only at the expense of reducing the amount ofE physical memory and in the process reducing the 64bit physical memory G benefit. One of the retailers in the UK had a complex query using joins C which could return as many as 300 million rows, a small fraction of F their POS transactions in a week but a very large amount of data. ThisF resulted in physical I/O throughput of 300 MB/s through the DBMS, much< higher than you could expect to configure an 8400 to handle.  B 2.     The 8400 CPU trade off ment that you could potentially showF considerable performance advantages over 32bit SMP boxes with the same> number of CPU's 2-4. However the 32bit systems from Sun and HPE supported many more CPU's and had much higher I/O throughput. So they G outperformed 8400's on simpler queries and often outperformed 8400's on G queries using multiple joins because they could exploit inter and intra C operator parallelism something the 8400 could not do because it had  very few CPU's and poor I/O.  G The reality is that the king of the hill in terms of systems being used E to support large DBMS's with queries using complex joins for the bulk F of the 90's was NCR with the 32bit Intel x86 based Teradata.  This was> followed by Sun and HP statistically tied for 2and place.  The< Terradata exploited high degrees of intra and inter operator! parellelism and advanced hashing.   E Now you could argue that something like a Sun E10000 or an HP T Class E would have delivered much higher DBMS throughput if Solaris and HP-UX B had been 64bit when they were introduced and that would be a valid point.  G This however does not really help the argument for 64bit on Alpha since G the reality is that both Sun and HP acheived true 64bit OS support with F the ability to actually configure usable systems with large amounts ofB memory, CPU's and I/O at least 2 years before what was now Compaq,< despite Digitals apparent lead at the beginning of the 90's.  ; You could argue that Sun and HP just spent their R&D budget E differently, on the HW platform first and then later on the OS rather ! than Digital who did the reverse.   F One also has to question how sucessfull Digital would have been in theA VLDB market had they come out with a more 64bit capable platform.   F Teradata were the incumbents and very good at it to. As late as 2001 IC know of one customer who was still buying very expensive Teradata's G instead of much cheaper and by then faster HP/Sun/IBM boxes not because G they were in any way convinced that it made price/performance sense but G because the vertical analytics packages they needed were only supported  on Teradata.   Regards  Andrew Harrison  > H > Nowadays of course, with J.Q. Public working with ever larger picturesJ > or sound files, the limitations of a 32 bit address space are obvious toG >   a much larger population. Still, even in 1992 many enterprises were I > acutely aware of the advantages of much faster databases. Had corporate J > inertia been less and perhaps had issues of brand loyalty not interferedG > (seeing by then the notion that VAX MIPs were very expensive compared I > with 68000 series or other MIPS had become widespread) Alpha might well E > have "taken over the world". I recall though being puzzled that DEC H > emphasized these figures so little at the time. The company was superbJ > technically, but never did market its offerings very well. Alas that its' > successors have had similar problems.  >  > Glenn Everhart >  >  > Andrew wrote:  > > Hoff Hoffman wrote:  > >> Andrew wrote: > >>K > >>> Again you are mistaken, Sun spent a great deal of time worrying about    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 22:39:19 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com " Subject: Re: Alpha remembrance day0 Message-ID: <87hcznlmqw.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>  * Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net> writes:  D > Not that there are all that many sound files that are gigabytes inB > size, unless you're talking 24-track studio-quality (which, once5 > again, is hardly the province of "John Q. Public").   A Not many? I have 5 on my Octane right now. The 32 bit limit bites A every time I want to normalise the levels of one. Image files are B getting close to where FAT32 is a limit due to file size. And withB image processing it is usual to have to have several to many image streams going at the same time.   E 10 years ago, it was just astronomy that banged against the wall, now = it is photos and home recordings as well. That people notice!    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 03:41:00 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 2 Subject: DECC$RTLLIB.TLB built locally or at DEC ?, Message-ID: <44FBD85B.98B9F85F@teksavvy.com>  F I have 2 versions of SYS$LIBRARY:DECCRTLLIB.TLB on 2 system disks that are both at VAX VMS  7.2.   C These system disks have different histories.  One dates back to the E Microvms 4.6 days with VAXC later upgraded to DECC, the other started   fresh at 7.2 with no VAX-C ever.  A The one on the older system is missing bits such as definition of B LIB$GET_LOGICAL in the LIB$ROUTINES module. The one on the younger system has it.    F The one in the older system seems to have been created in 1999 locallyS during a DECC installation/upgrtade (DECC060 temporary directory under sys$update).   E The one in the younger system was created earlier in 1998 on a system R probably at Digital (not my disk, not my directories). And it has LIB$GET_LOGICAL.    @ Both nodes have the same version of the DECC compiler (6.0-001 )  G So, how come on one system, the install procedure decided to create its F own incomplete modules, while on another system, the install procedure2 used a ready-made version that was more complete ?      E I am trying to normalise both systems to have the same software etc.  E When the compiler installation procedure on the old system decided to A build its own modules from SDI files, were those from the kit and G totally independant of my system, or did it look at what was already on F my system to determine what to include and what not to include in it ?  @ In other words, should I worry about my "old" system disk havingH improperly setup or missing bits that would have caused the installation1 procedure to generate incomplete include files ?    E Or is this just some isolated bug in the installation procedure and I G can just copy the 1998 version (built at Digital) over the 1999 version  (built here and missing bits) ?     G How come the version built here had definitions for LIB$SET_LOGICAL but A not LIB$GET_LOGICAL ? Would both have appeared at the same time ?    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 05:13:23 -0700 * From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos-remove.com>6 Subject: Re: DECC$RTLLIB.TLB built locally or at DEC ?) Message-ID: <op.tfcr8lgstte90l@hyrrokkin>   . On Mon, 04 Sep 2006 00:41:00 -0700, JF Mezei  % <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote:   H > I have 2 versions of SYS$LIBRARY:DECCRTLLIB.TLB on 2 system disks that > are both at VAX VMS  7.2.  > E > These system disks have different histories.  One dates back to the G > Microvms 4.6 days with VAXC later upgraded to DECC, the other started " > fresh at 7.2 with no VAX-C ever. > C > The one on the older system is missing bits such as definition of D > LIB$GET_LOGICAL in the LIB$ROUTINES module. The one on the younger > system has it. >  > H > The one in the older system seems to have been created in 1999 locallyJ > during a DECC installation/upgrtade (DECC060 temporary directory under   > sys$update). > G > The one in the younger system was created earlier in 1998 on a system E > probably at Digital (not my disk, not my directories). And it has    > LIB$GET_LOGICAL. >  > B > Both nodes have the same version of the DECC compiler (6.0-001 ) > I > So, how come on one system, the install procedure decided to create its H > own incomplete modules, while on another system, the install procedure4 > used a ready-made version that was more complete ? >  > . Are the starlet libs the same on both systems? > F > I am trying to normalise both systems to have the same software etc.G > When the compiler installation procedure on the old system decided to C > build its own modules from SDI files, were those from the kit and I > totally independant of my system, or did it look at what was already on H > my system to determine what to include and what not to include in it ? > B > In other words, should I worry about my "old" system disk havingJ > improperly setup or missing bits that would have caused the installation2 > procedure to generate incomplete include files ? > G > Or is this just some isolated bug in the installation procedure and I I > can just copy the 1998 version (built at Digital) over the 1999 version ! > (built here and missing bits) ?  >  > I > How come the version built here had definitions for LIB$SET_LOGICAL but C > not LIB$GET_LOGICAL ? Would both have appeared at the same time ?        --  E Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2006 04:41:31 -0700 5 From: "Robert Zoebinger" <Robert.Zoebinger@knapp.com> 1 Subject: Re: Distributed Netbeans 5.0 field test? B Message-ID: <1157370091.362899.10930@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com>   Hi!   G I have installed Netbeans 5.0 on my Windows XP-Desktop. I am using Java 
 SDK 1.4.2-12. . Then I installed "Distributed NetBeans Client"> (distnbopenvms50_t5010.nbm) with the "Netbeans Update Center".< After restarting Netbeans I got the following error message:  G [org.netbeans.core.modules] *********** Exception occurred ************  at 1:28 PM on Sep 4, 2006  java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: / org/netbeans/modules/project/ui/OpenProjectList  	at ] org.netbeans.modules.distributed.remotefs.MyURLMapperProxy.searchFS(MyURLMapperProxy.java:95)  	at ] org.netbeans.modules.distributed.remotefs.MyURLMapperProxy.mountFS(MyURLMapperProxy.java:164)  	at d org.netbeans.modules.distributed.remotefs.MyURLMapperProxy.getFileObjects(MyURLMapperProxy.java:241) 	at D org.openide.filesystems.URLMapper.findFileObject(URLMapper.java:190)D 	at org.openide.filesystems.FileUtil.toFileObject(FileUtil.java:428) 	at P org.netbeans.spi.project.support.ant.PropertyUtils$2.run(PropertyUtils.java:127)6 	at org.openide.util.Mutex.writeAccess(Mutex.java:350) 	at ^ org.netbeans.spi.project.support.ant.PropertyUtils.putGlobalProperties(PropertyUtils.java:123) 	at F org.netbeans.modules.apisupport.project.Install$1.run(Install.java:44)6 	at org.openide.util.Mutex.writeAccess(Mutex.java:314) 	at I org.netbeans.modules.apisupport.project.Install.restored(Install.java:35)  	at D org.netbeans.core.startup.NbInstaller.loadCode(NbInstaller.java:360)
 [catch] at@ org.netbeans.core.startup.NbInstaller.load(NbInstaller.java:276)= 	at org.netbeans.ModuleManager.enable(ModuleManager.java:898)  	at D org.netbeans.core.startup.ModuleList.installNew(ModuleList.java:377)E 	at org.netbeans.core.startup.ModuleList.trigger(ModuleList.java:311)  	at E org.netbeans.core.startup.ModuleSystem.restore(ModuleSystem.java:244) A 	at org.netbeans.core.startup.Main.getModuleSystem(Main.java:206) 7 	at org.netbeans.core.startup.Main.start(Main.java:377)  	at D org.netbeans.core.startup.TopThreadGroup.run(TopThreadGroup.java:90)) 	at java.lang.Thread.run(Thread.java:534) G [org.netbeans.core.modules] *********** Exception occurred ************  at 1:28 PM on Sep 4, 2006  java.lang.NoClassDefFoundError: / org/netbeans/modules/project/ui/OpenProjectList  	at ] org.netbeans.modules.distributed.remotefs.MyURLMapperProxy.searchFS(MyURLMapperProxy.java:95)  	at ] org.netbeans.modules.distributed.remotefs.MyURLMapperProxy.mountFS(MyURLMapperProxy.java:164)  	at d org.netbeans.modules.distributed.remotefs.MyURLMapperProxy.getFileObjects(MyURLMapperProxy.java:241) 	at D org.openide.filesystems.URLMapper.findFileObject(URLMapper.java:190) 	at Z org.netbeans.core.startup.layers.ArchiveURLMapper.getFileObjects(ArchiveURLMapper.java:88) 	at D org.openide.filesystems.URLMapper.findFileObject(URLMapper.java:190) 	at v org.netbeans.modules.java.j2seplatform.platformdefinition.DefaultPlatformImpl.getSources(DefaultPlatformImpl.java:120) 	at q org.netbeans.modules.java.j2seplatform.platformdefinition.DefaultPlatformImpl.create(DefaultPlatformImpl.java:56)  	at v org.netbeans.modules.java.j2seplatform.platformdefinition.PlatformConvertor.createPlatform(PlatformConvertor.java:170) 	at v org.netbeans.modules.java.j2seplatform.platformdefinition.PlatformConvertor.instanceCreate(PlatformConvertor.java:160) 	at y org.netbeans.modules.java.platform.DefaultJavaPlatformProvider.getInstalledPlatforms(DefaultJavaPlatformProvider.java:61)  	at v org.netbeans.modules.java.platform.DefaultJavaPlatformProvider.getDefaultPlatform(DefaultJavaPlatformProvider.java:91) 	at b org.netbeans.api.java.platform.JavaPlatformManager.getDefaultPlatform(JavaPlatformManager.java:76) 	at g org.netbeans.modules.java.j2seplatform.J2SEPlatformModule.updateSourceLevel(J2SEPlatformModule.java:59)  	at ` org.netbeans.modules.java.j2seplatform.J2SEPlatformModule.access$000(J2SEPlatformModule.java:31) 	at [ org.netbeans.modules.java.j2seplatform.J2SEPlatformModule$1.run(J2SEPlatformModule.java:46) 7 	at org.openide.util.Mutex.postRequest(Mutex.java:1113) ; 	at org.openide.util.Mutex.postWriteRequest(Mutex.java:483)  	at k org.netbeans.modules.java.j2seplatform.J2SEPlatformModule.updateBuildProperties(J2SEPlatformModule.java:41)  	at ^ org.netbeans.modules.java.j2seplatform.J2SEPlatformModule.restored(J2SEPlatformModule.java:36) 	at D org.netbeans.core.startup.NbInstaller.loadCode(NbInstaller.java:360)
 [catch] at@ org.netbeans.core.startup.NbInstaller.load(NbInstaller.java:276)= 	at org.netbeans.ModuleManager.enable(ModuleManager.java:898)  	at D org.netbeans.core.startup.ModuleList.installNew(ModuleList.java:377)E 	at org.netbeans.core.startup.ModuleList.trigger(ModuleList.java:311)  	at E org.netbeans.core.startup.ModuleSystem.restore(ModuleSystem.java:244) A 	at org.netbeans.core.startup.Main.getModuleSystem(Main.java:206) 7 	at org.netbeans.core.startup.Main.start(Main.java:377)  	at D org.netbeans.core.startup.TopThreadGroup.run(TopThreadGroup.java:90)) 	at java.lang.Thread.run(Thread.java:534)   # I suppose some classes are missing!   
 Kind regards,    Robert   ------------------------------  * Date: Mon, 4 Sep 2006 08:04:19 +0000 (UTC)< From: gartmann@nonsense.immunbio.mpg.de (Christoph Gartmann)( Subject: Re: Interesting SPAM I received) Message-ID: <edgmm3$jl9$1@news.BelWue.DE>   \ In article <44FB9150.5CFB0D13@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes: > C >I asked my ISP to remove all spam protection on my isp-based email F >address so that my POPTOMAIL could process much more email of variousH >difformities to better test/debug it.  So, I scan thorugh the long list6 >of subjects to try to spot the rare legitimate email. > D >Saw a topic: "Fiorina HP Hurd" which sounded legitimate consideringC >recent discussiuons on corporate leadership. Turns out it was just  >standard spam.  > I >Are spammers getting sophisticated enough to select subjects more likely G >to get someone attention based on which newsgroups he frequents, or is B >this just sheer luck where they send 2 million messages with thatI >subject hoping to catch perhaps 100 persons who actually open the email.  > J >Any comments ? have others also gotten such a message with that subject ?  M There is even spam that is related to viruses, these two things are sometimes K combined. Now think of a virus that scans an infected PCs e-mail folder and G uses the subjects and adresses found there to distribute the spam. Real 1 addresses, real subjects, you can't do better ;-)    Regards,    Christoph Gartmann    --  E  Max-Planck-Institut fuer      Phone   : +49-761-5108-464   Fax: -452   ImmunbiologieI  Postfach 1169                 Internet: gartmann@immunbio dot mpg dot de   D-79011  Freiburg, Germany 9                http://www.immunbio.mpg.de/home/menue.html    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 10:51:08 +0200  From: rejoc <rejoc@FREEfree.fr> % Subject: multinet / cluster questions 4 Message-ID: <44fbe8fc$0$31323$626a54ce@news.free.fr>  : Multinet 4.4 in a cluster where ip-cluster-aliases defined  B 1/ How can I know witch member of the cluster actually holds this H address ? (or if the node I'm currently logged in is the one responding  to the cluster@)  A 2/ For one specific outgoing service and on the node holding the  I cluster's address, I would like to have the cluster's IP address used as  * the outgoing IP@ (and not the interface @)   TiA    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 06:58:09 -0400 ' From: Rich Whalen <whalenr@process.com> ) Subject: Re: multinet / cluster questions 8 Message-ID: <221of2hkts5377o0gplveap5cjr6dm7ffc@4ax.com>  D On Mon, 04 Sep 2006 10:51:08 +0200, rejoc <rejoc@FREEfree.fr> wrote:  ; >Multinet 4.4 in a cluster where ip-cluster-aliases defined  > C >1/ How can I know witch member of the cluster actually holds this  I >address ? (or if the node I'm currently logged in is the one responding   >to the cluster@)  >  $ MULT NETCU CLUSTERALIAS SHOWB >2/ For one specific outgoing service and on the node holding the J >cluster's address, I would like to have the cluster's IP address used as + >the outgoing IP@ (and not the interface @)  >    Can't be done. >TiA   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 15:05:47 +0200  From: rejoc <rejoc@FREEfree.fr> ) Subject: Re: multinet / cluster questions 3 Message-ID: <44fc24ac$0$4739$626a54ce@news.free.fr>    Rich Whalen a crit : F > On Mon, 04 Sep 2006 10:51:08 +0200, rejoc <rejoc@FREEfree.fr> wrote: > = >> Multinet 4.4 in a cluster where ip-cluster-aliases defined  >>D >> 2/ For one specific outgoing service and on the node holding the L >> cluster's address, I would like to have the cluster's IP address used as - >> the outgoing IP@ (and not the interface @)  >> >  > Can't be done.$ Is a newer version able to do that ?  H Is it the same if I define a pseudo interface (pd0) and want to use its / address as the outgoing address for a service ?    >> TiA   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 15:19:39 +0200 + From: Martin Vorlaender <mv@pdv-systeme.de> 1 Subject: Re: OpenVMS 7.3-2 to 8.2 Upgrade Warning + Message-ID: <4m2nf5F47jc4U1@individual.net>    Neil Rieck wrote: M > In the past 24 hours I've updated two Alphas from OpenVMS-7.3-2 (Update 7)  L > to OpenVMS-8.2 and the existing TCPware-5.7-2 stack was rendered unusable  > both times. [...]  > N > If you're doing a similar upgrade and want to save some time, make sure you N > disable TCPware startup in "sys$manager:systartup_vms.com" before you start  > your upgrade.   D Not sure whether this message on the TCPware-Info list from Richard 5 Whalen of Process also applies to 8.2, but here goes:    <quote> " DRIVERS_V572P021 contains the fix.H It is necessary to install this kit after upgrading to VMS V8.3 because G the kit uses the version of VMS that it is running on to determine the  0 variant of the UCX$IPC_SHR image that is needed. </quote>   You can get the patch from7 ftp://ftp.process.com/support/57_2/drivers_v572p021.zip   E As this is a rank 1 patch ("Recommended; system crash possible"), you  should install it anyway...    cu, 	    Martin  --  D One OS to rule them all       | Martin Vorlaender  |  OpenVMS rules!7 One OS to find them           | work: mv@pdv-systeme.de H One OS to bring them all      | http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/> And in the Darkness bind them.| home: martin@radiogaga.harz.de   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 05:09:08 -0700 * From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos-remove.com>+ Subject: Re: OpenVMS and Windows on Itanium ) Message-ID: <op.tfcr1in6tte90l@hyrrokkin>   J On Sun, 03 Sep 2006 17:55:31 -0700, Main, Kerry <Kerry.Main@hp.com> wrote:   >  >  >> -----Original Message----- - >> From: Bart [mailto:bart.deboeck@gmail.com] # >> Sent: September 3, 2006 12:23 PM  >> To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com* >> Subject: OpenVMS and Windows on Itanium >> >> Hi, >>B >>   I'm an OpenVMS/Itanium newbie and trying to understand the HP >> virtualization solutions. >>H >>   Is it correct that only the future version of "HP Integrity VirtualG >> Machines" will allow to run OpenVMS and Windows simultaneously on an ! >> Itanium (HP Integrity server)?  >>I >>   Is it correct that there does not exist a virtual machine which runs ? >> on OpenVMS and supports Windows as a guest operating system?  >>( >>   All feedback is highly appreciated! >>
 >> Thanks, >> Bart  >> > H > With hard partitioning on some of the Integrity servers that currentlyG > support it, you can run OpenVMS, HP-UX, Windows and Linux on the same J > server today - even with OpenVMS V8.2. This is similar to what you couldF > do with Alpha servers that supported hard partitioning about 5 years > ago. > I > What is coming is a way (HPVM) to consolidate lower performance OpenVMS I > systems and run these in virtual partitions on an Integrity server that  > supports it. > H > Like all emulated environments, the performance will not be as good asG > native performance on the target system, but the emulation could very E > well be better than the current source server which is running on a ( > much, much slower server architecture.   This is progress?  > J > For those that understand other options out there like VMware, it is theG > same thing. These virtual instances are typically not meant for heavy < > CPU or heavy IO systems, but as a means to consolidate HW. > E > As an example, with HPVM, you could consolidate 3 or 4 lightly used F > OpenVMS systems with direct attached storage onto a single IntegrityJ > server on a SAN and share the IO FC adapters - hence, you do not need to1 > buy dual FC adapters for each system/partition.  > I > Keep in mind that OpenVMS has always supported Application stacking, so H > another option to consolidating OpenVMS servers is to simply move themJ > and run the app's on the same system. This has the advantage of reducingG > the number of OS instances as well as the HW (HPVM does not reduce OS 
 > instances).  > H > App stacking on Windows and some flavours of UNIX has been problematicH > for technical and cultural issues, but typically, this is not an issue > with OpenVMS.  >  >  > 	 > Regards  >  > Kerry Main > Senior Consultant  > HP Services Canada > Voice: 613-592-4660  > Fax: 613-591-4477  > kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom > (remove the DOT's and AT)  > 6 > OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works. >  >  >        --  E Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 4 Sep 2006 13:35:30 +0100* From: "Richard Brodie" <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk>+ Subject: Re: OpenVMS and Windows on Itanium , Message-ID: <edh7de$j6f$1@south.jnrs.ja.net>  Y "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos-remove.com> wrote in message news:op.tfcr1in6tte90l@hyrrokkin...   K >On Sun, 03 Sep 2006 17:55:31 -0700, Main, Kerry <Kerry.Main@hp.com> wrote: I >> Like all emulated environments, the performance will not be as good as H >> native performance on the target system, but the emulation could veryF >> well be better than the current source server which is running on a) >> much, much slower server architecture.  >  > This is progress?   H It's going mainstream, and falling in line with what Intel/AMD are doingO with virtualization, at least as far as I understand it. The emulation overhead > may be small on a system with hardware virtualization support.  A When every Windows and Linux server comes with virtualization out @ of the box, would you really want it only on big iron for VMS? IE admit it may be a technically superior solution at the high end but I  doubt the economics.     ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 06:15:06 -0700 * From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos-remove.com>+ Subject: Re: OpenVMS and Windows on Itanium ) Message-ID: <op.tfcu3gjttte90l@hyrrokkin>   H On Mon, 04 Sep 2006 05:35:30 -0700, Richard Brodie <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk>   wrote:   > 9 > "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos-remove.com> wrote in message   % > news:op.tfcr1in6tte90l@hyrrokkin...  > H >> On Sun, 03 Sep 2006 17:55:31 -0700, Main, Kerry <Kerry.Main@hp.com>  	 >> wrote: J >>> Like all emulated environments, the performance will not be as good asI >>> native performance on the target system, but the emulation could very G >>> well be better than the current source server which is running on a * >>> much, much slower server architecture. >> >> This is progress? > J > It's going mainstream, and falling in line with what Intel/AMD are doingJ > with virtualization, at least as far as I understand it. The emulation  
 > overhead@ > may be small on a system with hardware virtualization support. > C > When every Windows and Linux server comes with virtualization out B > of the box, would you really want it only on big iron for VMS? IG > admit it may be a technically superior solution at the high end but I  > doubt the economics. >  > I I think it is a flash in the pan and i doubt the economics of it.  If I    wantE both windows and Linux, I'll get two [ boxes | blades ]  VM370, for    example,? was mostly used in a development environment, not in production      --  E Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2006 08:46:18 -0700 < From: "Hein RMS van den Heuvel" <heinvandenheuvel@gmail.com>+ Subject: Re: OpenVMS and Windows on Itanium C Message-ID: <1157384778.353485.257940@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>    Bart wrote:  > Thanks for the reply!  > @ > So, it might be an option to run HP-UX natively and (modified)G > instances of OpenVMS and Windows as "processes" on HP-UX? Any idea of  > the impact on performance? > 
 > Regards, > Bart   Roughly.  ) The OpenVMS would NOT be modified (much). B The same version would run as a client or on its own, but supposed needs to be there.   Each CPU would be a thread. @ Yes you could have more virtual CPUs than physical CPUs over all clients.D The HP-UX host would (IMHO) only be used as a host, to keep it clean	 and safe. < If you also wanted HPUX on the box you'd run it as a client.  @ Recommended read: "The HP Virtual Server Environment: Making the8 Adaptive Enterprise Vision a Reality in Your Datacenter"  by Dan Herington & Bryan Jacquot6 http://www.hp.com/hpbooks/prentice/ptr_0131855220.html  B Because it is supposed to be unmodified, it unfortunately (for me) requires Montecito. A The current crop of Itanium chips does not have enough protection  layers to map VMS.  G Personally I would have been very happy and excited if OpenVMS had been C rebuild with reduced memory protection layers. The host runs in its  own, innermost, shell.  E Combining DCL (Super) and RMS (Exec)into a single layer (with RDB and G what have you not) would be just dandy by me. While you are at it, also E drop RMS's usage of UREW pages. If DCL or RMS were to behave badly it G should crash the process (and optionally the system). No need (IMHO) to C protect them from each other, but the this is not at all an area of  expertise for me.   F I would love to be backup to run a HPUX host on my dual CPU rx2620 andD guests for HPUX and multiple OpenVMS instances all at the same time.D As a developer/consultant this would allow me to do CLUSTER testing,E Mixed-environment Oracle client/server testing, and so on, all from a & single box (single heat/noise source).  - I can understand the Engineering perspective. C The existing Itanium base is just small stuff, relatively speaking. ' Montecito will be the volume real soon.    Hein.  HvdH Performance Consulting   G (UREW page protection is used by RMS to support LOCATE mode, a marginal ? (best I can tell !?) performance option notably used by Fortran F applications for simply sequential file unshared read, with a required) fallback with move mode already in place. E No application woule break, some would run slower, most would benefit E from better memory usage by RMS no longer fragmenting its memory with 5 all the page rounding and such that comes with that).    ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 4 Sep 2006 11:48:52 -0400' From: "Main, Kerry" <Kerry.Main@hp.com> + Subject: RE: OpenVMS and Windows on Itanium T Message-ID: <FA60F2C4B72A584DBFC6091F6A2B8684019BCB57@tayexc19.americas.cpqcorp.net>   > -----Original Message-----4 > From: Tom Linden [mailto:tom@kednos-remove.com]=20! > Sent: September 4, 2006 9:15 AM  > To: Info-VAX@Mvb.Saic.Com - > Subject: Re: OpenVMS and Windows on Itanium  >=207 > On Mon, 04 Sep 2006 05:35:30 -0700, Richard Brodie=20  > <R.Brodie@rl.ac.uk> =20  > wrote: >=20  	 [snip ..]    > > B > I think it is a flash in the pan and i doubt the economics of=20 > it.  If I =20  > wantI > both windows and Linux, I'll get two [ boxes | blades ]  VM370, for =20 
 > example,A > was mostly used in a development environment, not in production  >=20 >=20  D The challenge with this philosophy is the gross under-utilization of? servers that almost all med-large companies face today. Average B Windows/Linux server utilization in *prime* time is less than 15%.H Average UNIX server utilization in prime time is a bit better, but still less than 25%.  C Btw, one of the reasons why CIO's are not impressed with speeds and G feeds associated with new servers - they know they have a gross glut of ; server cycles and they do not want to make this glut worse.   = And with each new server refresh done on a one-one basis, the F utilization becomes even less due to the higher performance of the newH 1U/2U/blade servers. In addition, the heat consumption is also going up.  G Keep in mind the HW is close to the smallest cost of the overall server  TCO.  G If that blade has SW like Oracle or other middleware/DB on it, then the D cost of the hardware is a small component of the overall server TCO.  > The server still needs to be licensed (including ISV SW/OS's),D monitored, managed, upgraded, patched (especially with Windows/LinuxE security patches every month) and consumes power, produces heat (HVAC C increase). The heat issue is especially challenging with blades and D other new CPU technologies (although Intel/AMD are now getting a tad better at this).   Regards   
 Kerry Main Senior Consultant  HP Services Canada Voice: 613-592-4660  Fax: 613-591-4477  kerryDOTmainAThpDOTcom (remove the DOT's and AT)=20  4 OpenVMS - the secure, multi-site OS that just works.   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2006 00:13:53 -0700 ! From: "alok" <alok.net@gmail.com>   Subject: Re: Problem during bootC Message-ID: <1157354033.418621.305800@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>   5 Yes you are right.  But there is no limit on version.  Let me explain it little bit.   G ESS$LAST_STARTUP.COM  creates ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP file. but it deletes  this Temp file before exit.    And the calling sequence is: SYSTARTUP_V5.COM   -> LAD_STARTUP.COMF     -> ESS$LAST_STARTUP.COM  -> create and delete ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP
   -> PCFS.COM E     -> ESS$LAST_STARTUP.COM -> create and delete ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP      JF Mezei wrote: 
 > alok wrote: D > > % delete - W- file not deleted. It was indicating that the file:G > > SYS$SYSROOT:[SYS$STARTUP]ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP could not be deleted.  > >  > > Also > > K > > DCL-E_OPENIN, error opening SYS$SYSROOT : [SYSMGR]ESS$LAST_STARTUP.LOG;  > > as	 > > input  > > 6 > > -RMS-E-FLK, file currently locked by another user. >  > I > Your startup procedure may be running this twice (or more). You need to F > check the number of versions allowed for this file/directory. If youI > only allow one version, then the second isntance of a job, in trying to I > create its own log file or temporary file, will be forced to delete the F > previous version of the file and if the later is still in use by theR > other instance of the job, it will fail. So it isn't just about file protection.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 03:53:10 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com>   Subject: Re: Problem during boot, Message-ID: <44FBDB35.34E265B9@teksavvy.com>   alok wrote:  > And the calling sequence is: > SYSTARTUP_V5.COM >   -> LAD_STARTUP.COMH >     -> ESS$LAST_STARTUP.COM  -> create and delete ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP >   -> PCFS.COM G >     -> ESS$LAST_STARTUP.COM -> create and delete ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP   F Is it possible that LAD_STARTUP.COM (and PCFS.COM) at some point spawnC some subprocess or detached processes ? If so, control would return A quickly to SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM which would then proceed to the next A statement and execute PCFS.COM before the previous one has really  completed its task ?  C Have you tried putting a WAIT 00:01:00 statement between the two to H ensure the first one can comple in the background before the second one E begins ?  If this solves the problem, it would mean that one of these E procedures continues its processing in the background.  While this is A processing, do you see any messages such as "spawned" or "process 
 created" ?- (either from a SPAWN/NOWAIT or a RUN/PROC ) ?   ; Another thing you could do is a small look between the two:    $LOOP1: G $	IF F$SEARCH("SYS$SYSROOT:[SYS$STARTUP]ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP") .eqs. ""  then GOTO ENDLOOP1 $	WAIT 00:00:15 8 $	DELETE SYS$SYSROOT:[SYS$STARTUP]ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP;* $	ON ERROR THEN GOTO LOOP1
 $ENDLOOP1:      - I.E. if the file doesn't exist, you continue.   G If the file exists, you wait a few seconds, try to delete it and if the ? delete fails it goes back to the top of the loop. If the delete  succeeds, it continues.   F (i.e. as long as the file exists and remains opened (can't delete it),	 you wait.    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2006 05:37:13 -0700 ! From: "alok" <alok.net@gmail.com>   Subject: Re: Problem during bootC Message-ID: <1157373433.366264.180990@m79g2000cwm.googlegroups.com>   A If that was the case then the error on deletion should be like -> & File currently locked by another user.
 but we got -> @ % delete - W- file not deleted. It was indicating that the file:C SYS$SYSROOT:[SYS$STARTUP]ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP could not be deleted.   2 To resolve the problem I checked the protection ofC ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP that was  (RWED,RWED,RE,RE) , So I changed the 5 protection to (RWED,RWED,RWED,RWED)  and that worked. 2 So this is causing me the concern why it happened?     JF Mezei wrote: 
 > alok wrote:   > > And the calling sequence is: > > SYSTARTUP_V5.COM > >   -> LAD_STARTUP.COMJ > >     -> ESS$LAST_STARTUP.COM  -> create and delete ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP > >   -> PCFS.COM I > >     -> ESS$LAST_STARTUP.COM -> create and delete ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP  > H > Is it possible that LAD_STARTUP.COM (and PCFS.COM) at some point spawnE > some subprocess or detached processes ? If so, control would return C > quickly to SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM which would then proceed to the next C > statement and execute PCFS.COM before the previous one has really  > completed its task ? > E > Have you tried putting a WAIT 00:01:00 statement between the two to I > ensure the first one can comple in the background before the second one G > begins ?  If this solves the problem, it would mean that one of these G > procedures continues its processing in the background.  While this is C > processing, do you see any messages such as "spawned" or "process  > created" ?/ > (either from a SPAWN/NOWAIT or a RUN/PROC ) ?  > = > Another thing you could do is a small look between the two:  > 	 > $LOOP1: I > $	IF F$SEARCH("SYS$SYSROOT:[SYS$STARTUP]ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP") .eqs. ""  > then GOTO ENDLOOP1 > $	WAIT 00:00:15 : > $	DELETE SYS$SYSROOT:[SYS$STARTUP]ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP;* > $	ON ERROR THEN GOTO LOOP1 > $ENDLOOP1: >  >  > / > I.E. if the file doesn't exist, you continue.  > I > If the file exists, you wait a few seconds, try to delete it and if the A > delete fails it goes back to the top of the loop. If the delete  > succeeds, it continues.  > H > (i.e. as long as the file exists and remains opened (can't delete it), > you wait.    ------------------------------   Date: 3 Sep 2006 23:15:09 -0700 ! From: "alok" <alok.net@gmail.com> 2 Subject: Re: problem with file creation time stampC Message-ID: <1157350509.403973.209760@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com>   E Actually I have installed PCSA on my VAX system that creates log file - ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP which I m talking about. E I have seen the command file in PCSA & found that those command files E first tries to search the log file, if it finds out then messages are ' appended otherwise new file is created.   C I have installed it at log time in 1994 & since then every thing is @ fine ( messages are appended) but recently i faced this problem.   Hoff Hoffman wrote: 
 > alok wrote:  > G > > is it possible in VAX VMS that only the file creation time stamp is ( > > changed but not the content of file. > O >    On any system and on any media using any storage media other than hardware P > write-once media, yes.  Data is data and writable storage is writable storage,. > and data on writable storage can be changed. > G > > Suppose a Log file is created on year 1995 by a command file. Since H > > then command file loggs some messages in that log file . but today iK > > noticed that the File creation time stamp has changed to today's date & 9 > > still the content of file is there . Is it possible ?  > C >    Yes.  But I'd not expect it to happen under normal operations.  > Q >    Changing the creation date is feasible via various tools, but I'd not expect O > there to be a particular reason to change the creation date on this log file. R > Well, it's certainly quite possible that somebody hacked into the system and wasR > looking to cover some tracks that had been present in the old version of the logR > file.  (This depends on what sort of information is in the log file, obviously.) > N >    It's also possible that certain user or system management operations willR > create a new version of the file (or a new copy), and the existing contents willP > be replicated and will remain present within the file.  This can mimic changes' > to the file creation date, obviously.    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 02:38:16 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 2 Subject: Re: problem with file creation time stamp, Message-ID: <44FBC9AC.5FBE49D2@teksavvy.com>   alok wrote: E > I have installed it at log time in 1994 & since then every thing is B > fine ( messages are appended) but recently i faced this problem.  ) Take any text file on your system and try   . APPEND/LOG mytextfile.txt ESS$LAST_STARTUP.TMP  E This would test if the file can be grown (extended) to accomodate the ? new text. If you do a DIR/SIZE=ALL on the file, how big is it ? - Thousands of blocks ? Hundreds of thousands ?   F Also, what is its version number ? If it is above/near 32768, then you need to:   PURGE/LOG filename RENAME/LOG filename ;1    E This ensures there is only one copy of the file, and then renames the G file to have a version number of 1 which ensure that new version can be  created when needed.   ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 4 Sep 2006 11:36:28 +05004 From: Valentin Likoum <valentin.likoum@ncc.volga.ru>@ Subject: Re[4]: Thoughts on the book: DEC is dead, long live DEC3 Message-ID: <911352736.20060904113628@ncc.volga.ru>   4 On 03/09/06 Neil Rieck <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> wrote:    D > "Valentin Likoum" <valentin.likoum@ncc.volga.ru> wrote in message / > news:975987375.20060903203706@ncc.volga.ru... 7 >> On 03/09/06 Neil Rieck <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> wrote:  >>I >>> To your point, I remember hearing DEC people talking about cloned VAX I >>> hardware showing up in Russia as one of the reasons for licence PAKs.  >>F >> If it's true then it didn't help much. I worked on the VAX hardwareD >> clone with the VMS clone (4.?) with the RDB and DECForms and manyC >> other software pieces I can't recall. And I can't remeber I ever   >> bothered with the PAKs there. >>L > I don't remember using the $LIC command on VMS 4.x but seem to remember itM > appearing during VMS 5.x. Maybe someone else in this newsgroup can remember  > the exact release.  N > As for cloning VAXs, people at DEC should consider this the greatest form of > flattery.   E   OS/360 and IBM hardware was cloned before, IIRC. So DEC was not the  first.   --  
 Best regards, #  Valentin                           (  valentin.likoum at ncc dot volga dot ru   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2006 15:32:20 GMT ( From: bill@cs.uofs.edu (Bill Gunshannon)D Subject: Re: Re[4]: Thoughts on the book: DEC is dead, long live DEC+ Message-ID: <4m2v84F49srrU1@individual.net>   3 In article <911352736.20060904113628@ncc.volga.ru>, 7 	Valentin Likoum <valentin.likoum@ncc.volga.ru> writes: 6 > On 03/09/06 Neil Rieck <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> wrote: > O >> As for cloning VAXs, people at DEC should consider this the greatest form of  >> flattery. > G >   OS/360 and IBM hardware was cloned before, IIRC. So DEC was not the  > first.  F I can't imagine why Russia would have bothered trying to clone the VAXJ as even with the technology sanctions in place they had no problem gettingL the real thing.  I even remember a company that posted a long explanation ofK how they got around the sanctions by having their Swiss branch buy the VAX, K making an intra-company transfer to India (who had not signed the agreement I sanctioning high-tech products headed for the USSR) and then selling them G as used computer gear to the Russians,  They were rather proud of their  closed market.  I And, with Unix making the trip in diplomatic pouches (I always thought it H rather humorous that our allies could  not have the version of Unix withG DES but after the fall of the Iron Curtain we learned that the Russians . had it for years.) I would imagine so did VMS.   bill      --  J Bill Gunshannon          |  de-moc-ra-cy (di mok' ra see) n.  Three wolvesD bill@cs.scranton.edu     |  and a sheep voting on what's for dinner. University of Scranton   |A Scranton, Pennsylvania   |         #include <std.disclaimer.h>       ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2006 06:26:14 -0700 - From: "mb301@hotmail.com" <mb301@hotmail.com>  Subject: Tape library B Message-ID: <1157376374.907604.48610@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>  @ Does anyone know if a MSL 5026 tape library with a 100Gb tape is supported on OpenVMS 7.2-1 ??   # Can anyone recommend anything else?    Mark   ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 4 Sep 2006 08:31:12 -0400) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> ! Subject: The Mythical IT Shortage < Message-ID: <44fc1b1d$0$24180$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>   The Mythical IT Shortage9 http://logikal.blog-city.com/the_mythical_it_shortage.htm I I think this was posted by Roland Hughes (OpenVMS advocate and publisher)     
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,  Ontario, Canada.8 http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html   ------------------------------  $ Date: Mon, 4 Sep 2006 08:40:53 -0400) From: "Neil Rieck" <n.rieck@sympatico.ca> * Subject: The Real Reason Behind Offshoring< Message-ID: <44fc1d62$0$24177$9a6e19ea@news.newshosting.com>  ! The Real Reason Behind Offshoring D http://logikal.blog-city.com/the_real_reason_behind_offshoring_1.htmI I think this was posted by Roland Hughes (OpenVMS advocate and publisher)     
 Neil Rieck Kitchener/Waterloo/Cambridge,  Ontario, Canada.8 http://www3.sympatico.ca/n.rieck/links/cool_openvms.html   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 10:33:14 +0200 ( From: Michael Kraemer <M.Kraemer@gsi.de>= Subject: Re: Thoughts on the book: DEC is dead, long live DEC / Message-ID: <edgobc$d78$02$1@news.t-online.com>    Bill Gunshannon schrieb:   > Tell me again why PAKs are > a bad idea?  :-) >   2 The mechanism itself isn't necessarily a bad idea.4 The fact that DEC used it for every little component9 of the OS is. In particular for hobbyists it doesn't make 
 sense at all.    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 22:42:12 +0800  From: prep@prep.synonet.com ; Subject: Re: VGA video adapter for Vaxstation 4000 model 60 0 Message-ID: <87d5ablmm3.fsf@k9.prep.synonet.com>  5 "Richard B. Gilbert" <rgilbert88@comcast.net> writes:   F > Hmmmm!  I have this dusty antique labeled "PMAGD-AA" which I believeD > is a turbo-channel video card which might work in your VAXstation.@ > It has a weird video connector; three coax type "pins" in a DB > shell.  E That is a 3W3. Almost as standard as it gets in video. (ie, not very, 	 and many)    --  < Paul Repacholi                               1 Crescent Rd.,7 +61 (08) 9257-1001                           Kalamunda. @                                              West Australia 6076* comp.os.vms,- The Older, Grumpier Slashdot. Raw, Cooked or Well-done, it's all half baked.F EPIC, The Architecture of the future, always has been, always will be.? ------------ And now a word from our sponsor ------------------ > Want to have instant messaging, and chat rooms, and discussion: groups for your local users or business, you need dbabble!? --  See http://netwinsite.com/sponsor/sponsor_dbabble.htm  ----    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 06:33:05 -0500 + From: brandon@dalsemi.com (BRANDON, JOHN M) 3 Subject: VMS STARTUP documentation mis-leading V7.3 1 Message-ID: <06090406330520@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>   N I was double checking the boot process for VMS and found mis-leading or should" I say conflicting documentation...   In this page (web reference)  ; http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/73final/4477/4477pro_007.html    (quote) L Reference: See also the OpenVMS System Manager's Manual for more information! about startup command procedures.   5.6.1 OpenVMS Startup Procedures (quote)   7 The table has the startup process listed in this order:    SYS$MANAGER:SYPAGSWPFILES.COM  SYS$MANAGER:SYCONFIG.COM SYS$MANAGER:SYSECURITY.COM SYS$MANAGER:SYLOGICALS.COM SYS$MANAGER:SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM   
 However...   In this page (web reference)  ; http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/73final/6017/6017pro_012.html    (quote) J Table 5-1 lists and describes the site-specific startup command proceduresL provided by Compaq, in the order in which they execute. These procedures areB located in the system directory with the logical name SYS$STARTUP. (quote)   7 The table has the startup process listed in this order:    SYCONFIG.COM SYLOGICALS.COM SYPAGSWPFILES.COM  SYSECURITY.COM SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM    Which is correct.          John "REBOOT" Brandon  VMS Systems Administrator * firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com   ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2006 08:19:56 -0700 / From: "Volker Halle" <volker_halle@hotmail.com> 7 Subject: Re: VMS STARTUP documentation mis-leading V7.3 C Message-ID: <1157383196.784790.283010@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com>    John,   2 in DEVICES phase (see SYS$STARTUP:VMS$PHASES.DAT):    VMS$DEVICE_STARTUP.COM calls    SYCONFIG:COM   SYLOGICALS.COM   SYPAGSWPFILES.COM    in CONFIG phase:  "  VMS$CONFIG-050_AUDIT_SERVER calls   SYSECURITY.COM   in LPBEGIN phase:     VMS$LPBEGIN-050_STARTUP calls    SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM  E As found in OpenVMS Alpha V8.2. You can check on your own system, all # the above files are in SYS$STARTUP:    --- , Volker Halle, Invenate GmbH, OpenVMS Support  # An OpenVMS crashdump analysis a day $ makes the Windows headaches go away.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 10:31:34 -0500 + From: brandon@dalsemi.com (BRANDON, JOHN M) 7 Subject: Re: VMS STARTUP documentation mis-leading V7.3 1 Message-ID: <06090410313402@dscis6-0.dalsemi.com>    Volker writes: > John,  > 4 > in DEVICES phase (see SYS$STARTUP:VMS$PHASES.DAT): >  >  VMS$DEVICE_STARTUP.COM calls  >   SYCONFIG:COM >   SYLOGICALS.COM >   SYPAGSWPFILES.COM  >  > in CONFIG phase: > $ >  VMS$CONFIG-050_AUDIT_SERVER calls >   SYSECURITY.COM >  > in LPBEGIN phase:  >   >  VMS$LPBEGIN-050_STARTUP calls >    SYSTARTUP_VMS.COM > G > As found in OpenVMS Alpha V8.2. You can check on your own system, all % > the above files are in SYS$STARTUP:  >  > --- . > Volker Halle, Invenate GmbH, OpenVMS Support  < That I understand - however the listed order of execution is   See this reference: ; http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/73final/6017/6017pro_012.html    SYCONFIG:COM SYLOGICALS.COM SYPAGSWPFILES.COM  SYSECURITY.COM SYSECURITY.COM  E However the sources of documenation (for V7.3) conflicts with itself.  See this reference:   ; http://h71000.www7.hp.com/doc/73final/4477/4477pro_007.html   J The above link is not clear and (I think) should be corrected.  I have not checked V8.2 or V8.3       John "REBOOT" Brandon  VMS Systems Administrator * firstname.lastname.spam.me.not@dalsemi.com   ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 16:15:06 GMT % From: "Safir" <axica_nopub@yahoo.com> 7 Subject: Re: VMS STARTUP documentation mis-leading V7.3 . Message-ID: <eiYKg.128$a34.4@news.cpqcorp.net>   Hi,   F You can check the flow of startup by creating a "non-execute" copy of  startup.com   D (it doesn't start anything) by setting (see below) stdrv$execute to  stdrv$false and    stdrv$verbose to stdrv$true :       < Welcome to OpenVMS (TM) Alpha Operating System, Version V8.2  ; $ search startup_noexec.com stdrv$false,stdrv$execut /ma=an    $stdrv$execut = stdrv$false   ; $ sear startup_noexec.com stdrv$true,stdrv$verbose /ma=an $    stdrv$verbose = stdrv$true       $ @startup_noexec "FULL" " "  C %STDRV-W-NOTSYSTEM, STARTUP is not running from the SYSTEM account.   . -STDRV-W-UNPREDICT, Results are unpredictable.  . %STDRV-D-DEBUGMODE, Running in **DEBUG** mode.  A %STDRV-I-OPENCOMP, opening component file 0, STARTUP$STARTUP_VMS  E %STDRV-I-OPENCOMP, opening component file 1, STARTUP$STARTUP_LAYERED  D %STDRV-I-STRTPHAS, starting phase INITIAL at 4-SEP-2006 18:02:28.60 ; %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 0 %STDRV-I-DIRECT,  $ @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$INITIAL-050_VMS.COM  5 %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$INITIAL-050_LIB.COM   I %STDRV-I-CALLED, ignoring VMS$INITIAL-050_CONFIGURE.COM %STDRV-I-DIRECT,  # @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$CONFIG-050_CSP.COM   > %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$CONFIG-050_SHADOW_SERVER.COM  K %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 1 %STDRV-I-DIRECT, stdrv$foreign !  I Execute DECRAM$RECOVER.EXE %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:SERVE_DISKS.COM  G %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:0A.COM %STDRV-I-STRTPHAS, starting phase  L DEVICES at 4-SEP-2006 18:02:28.64 %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 0 4 %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$DEVICE_STARTUP.COM  K %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 1 %STDRV-I-EMTYPHAS, phase DEVICES   has no entries in file 1.   F %STDRV-I-STRTPHAS, starting phase PRECONFIG at 4-SEP-2006 18:02:28.64 ; %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 0 %STDRV-I-DIRECT,  G @SYS$STARTUP:IPC$STARTUP.COM %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 1  < %STDRV-I-EMTYPHAS, phase PRECONFIG has no entries in file 1.  C %STDRV-I-STRTPHAS, starting phase CONFIG at 4-SEP-2006 18:02:28.65  ; %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 0 %STDRV-I-DIRECT,  # @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$CONFIG-050_VMS.COM   7 %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$CONFIG-050_ERRFMT.COM   = %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$CONFIG-050_CACHE_SERVER.COM   6 %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$CONFIG-050_OPCOM.COM  = %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$CONFIG-050_AUDIT_SERVER.COM   7 %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$CONFIG-050_JOBCTL.COM   4 %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$CONFIG-050_LMF.COM  @ %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$CONFIG-050_SECURITY_SERVER.COM  < %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$CONFIG-050_ACME_SERVER.COM  J %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 1 %STDRV-I-EMTYPHAS, phase CONFIG  has no entries in file 1.   H %STDRV-I-STRTPHAS, starting phase BASEENVIRON at 4-SEP-2006 18:02:28.69 ; %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 0 %STDRV-I-DIRECT,  ( @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$BASEENVIRON-050_VMS.COM  ? %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$BASEENVIRON-050_SMISERVER.COM   9 %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$BASEENVIRON-050_LIB.COM   B %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:DECDTM$STARTUP.COM %STDRV-I-DIRECT, ; stdrv$foreign ! Execute LICENSE_CHECK.EXE %STDRV-I-DIRECT,  2 @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$BASEENVIRON-050_INDICT_SERVER.COM  C %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 1 %STDRV-I-EMTYPHAS, phase  % BASEENVIRON has no entries in file 1.   D %STDRV-I-STRTPHAS, starting phase LPBEGIN at 4-SEP-2006 18:02:28.72 ; %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 0 %STDRV-I-DIRECT,  ( @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$LPBEGIN-050_STARTUP.COM  ; %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$LPBEGIN-050_SMHANDLER.COM   K %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 1 %STDRV-I-EMTYPHAS, phase LPBEGIN   has no entries in file 1.   C %STDRV-I-STRTPHAS, starting phase LPMAIN at 4-SEP-2006 18:02:28.73  J %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 0 %STDRV-I-EMTYPHAS, phase LPMAIN  has no entries in file 0.   ; %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 1 %STDRV-I-DIRECT,  3 @SYS$STARTUP:WCCPROXY$STARTUP.COM %STDRV-I-DIRECT,  K @SYS$STARTUP:DESTA$STARTUP.COM %STDRV-I-STRTPHAS, starting phase LPBETA at  A 4-SEP-2006 18:02:28.75 %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 0  9 %STDRV-I-EMTYPHAS, phase LPBETA has no entries in file 0.   D %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 1 %STDRV-E-NOSUCHFILE, File 2 SYS$STARTUP:DEBUG$STARTUP_V72X.COM does not exist.  ? %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:MOUNT_DISKS.COM %STDRV-I-DIRECT,  M @SYS$STARTUP:LAT$STARTUP.COM %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:TCPIP$STARTUP.COM  @ %STDRV-I-STRTPHAS, starting phase END at 4-SEP-2006 18:02:28.78 ; %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 0 %STDRV-I-DIRECT,  ( @SYS$STARTUP:VMS$END-050_COORDINATED.COM  : %STDRV-I-INDXFILE, using component file 1 %STDRV-I-SPAWN, E SPAWN/NOWAIT/NOKEYPAD @SYS$STARTUP:NOTES$STARTUP.COM %STDRV-I-SPAWN,  D SPAWN/NOWAIT/NOKEYPAD @SYS$STARTUP:DECC$STARTUP.COM %STDRV-I-SPAWN, D SPAWN/NOWAIT/NOKEYPAD @SYS$STARTUP:FORT$STARTUP.COM %STDRV-I-SPAWN, G SPAWN/NOWAIT/NOKEYPAD @SYS$STARTUP:PASCAL$STARTUP.COM %STDRV-I-DIRECT,  L @SYS$STARTUP:PWRK$STARTUP.COM %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:ECP$STARTUP.COM > %STDRV-I-DIRECT, @SYS$STARTUP:LD$STARTUP.COM %STDRV-I-DIRECT, H @SYS$STARTUP:DECEVENT$STARTUP.COM %STDRV-I-SPAWN, SPAWN/NOWAIT/NOKEYPAD M @SYS$STARTUP:DFG$STARTUP.COM %STDRV-I-DRVEND, startup finished at 4-SEP-2006   18:02:28.86    ------------------------------   Date: 4 Sep 2006 09:50:32 -0700 / From: "Volker Halle" <volker_halle@hotmail.com> 7 Subject: Re: VMS STARTUP documentation mis-leading V7.3 C Message-ID: <1157388632.624491.188820@p79g2000cwp.googlegroups.com>    John,   A I've listed the files in the order being executed during startup.   E Please note that the first manual referenced (Table 5-1 Site-Specific F Startup Command Procedures) explicitly claims, that it shows the files in the order executed.  F You second reference (5.6.1 OpenVMS Startup Procedures) does not claimC the order of execution, but just gives a list command files invoked A during startup. Those files seem not to be listed in any specific 5 order, neither aplhabetically nor in execution order.    --- , Volker Halle, Invenate GmbH, OpenVMS Support  # An OpenVMS crashdump analysis a day $ makes the Windows headaches go away.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 04 Sep 2006 15:01:27 +0200 + From: Martin Vorlaender <mv@pdv-systeme.de>  Subject: Re: WWENG2.SYS + Message-ID: <4m2md0F48dm6U1@individual.net>    Chris Scheers wrote: > Martin Vorlaender wrote:K >> On disk 5 of the June '94 VAX ConDist is [NA7013] which also appeared on . >> disk 1 of the March '95 VAX SPL Supplement. >  > Thanx for the info.  > K > Unfortunately, these seem to be among the few VAX CONDISTs I am missing.  	 >  <sigh>  > B > I have all 12 disks of the June '95 VAX SPL, but I don't have a H > Supplement disk.  Actually, I don't remember ever seeing a Supplement  > disk.  What are those?  A The label says "OpenVMS VAX Software Product Library Supplement", 3 Disk 1 of 1, March 1995, Volume Label VAXSUPMAR951.   D I can't really say what makes them different from "regular" SPL CDs.D They appeared for some time (I have Mar 95, Jun 95 (!), Dec 95 - I'm> missing the Sep 95 SPL). It *could* be that they came with theD documentation kit, as those were thrown together with the SPLs here.   cu, 	    Martin  --  D One OS to rule them all       | Martin Vorlaender  |  OpenVMS rules!7 One OS to find them           | work: mv@pdv-systeme.de J One OS to bring them all      |   http://www.pdv-systeme.de/users/martinv/> And in the Darkness bind them.| home: martin@radiogaga.harz.de   ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2006.485 ************************                                                                                                                                                  /freetype-2_1_4.	 <<< PWDMV >>> 257 "/disk$misc/decus/freewarev70/freetype/freetype-2_1_4" is current directory.J <<< CWD /disk$misc/decus/freewarev70/freetype/freetype-2_1_4/src/raster/W >>> 250 Connected to /disk$misc/decus/freewarev70/freetype/freetype-2_1_4/src/raster.n <<< TYPE I >>> 200 Type I ok.
 <<< PASVA >>> 227 Entering passive mode; use PORT (198,151,12,104,18,178)d <<< SIZE ftrend1.h >>> 213 2250 <<< RETR ftrend1.h{ >>> 150 IMAGE retrieve of /disk$misc/decus/freewarev70/freetype/freetype-2_1_4/src/raster/ftrend1.h (2250 bytes) started.r: >>> 226 Transfer completed.  1846 (8) bytes transferred.? <<< CWD /disk$misc/decus/freewarev70/freetype/freetype-2_1_4/>L >>> 250 Connected to /disk$misc/decus/freewarev70/freetype/freetype-2_1_4.
 <<< noop >>> 200 No-operation OK.? <<< CWD /disk$misc/decus/freewarev70/freetype/freetype-2_1_4/1L >>> 250 Connected to /disk$misc/decus/freewarev70/freetype/freetype-2_1_4.	 <<< PWDMV >>> 257 "/disk$misc/decus/freewarev7