1 INFO-VAX	Tue, 26 Sep 2006	Volume 2006 : Issue 528       Contents:# Re: All is not well at the HP board # Re: All is not well at the HP board : Re: Can a satellite survive the reboot of its boot server?' Re: Can a VAX MSCP-serve an ODS5 disk ? ' Re: Can a VAX MSCP-serve an ODS5 disk ? ' Re: Can a VAX MSCP-serve an ODS5 disk ? ' Re: Can a VAX MSCP-serve an ODS5 disk ?  DEC RAIDArray310 user manual? ! Re: DEC RAIDArray310 user manual? ! Re: DEC RAIDArray310 user manual? ! Re: DEC RAIDArray310 user manual? , Re: DSPP: Delete Successful Product Programs, Re: DSPP: Delete Successful Product Programs ES40s for sale Re: ES40s for sale Re: Graphic options for DS10L & Re: HP announces new Integrity servers& Re: HP announces new Integrity servers& Re: HP announces new Integrity servers& Re: HP announces new Integrity servers4 RAID LICENSE - any one using and having fun with it? Strange diagnose error  V3.4  Re: Strange diagnose error  V3.4  Re: Strange diagnose error  V3.4  Re: Strange diagnose error  V3.4 Re: Tool for calculating SHA1  Re: Tool for calculating SHA1  Re: Tool for calculating SHA1 , Re: Vaxstation or Alpha for learning OpenVMS, Re: Vaxstation or Alpha for learning OpenVMS, Re: Vaxstation or Alpha for learning OpenVMS  F ----------------------------------------------------------------------    Date: 25 Sep 2006 15:30:58 -0500% From: frey@encompasserve.org (Sharon) , Subject: Re: All is not well at the HP board3 Message-ID: <Wb0j2rNMyUOG@eisner.encompasserve.org>   g In article <1158983988.882050.19780@m7g2000cwm.googlegroups.com>, tariq.1.rahim@spamgourmet.com writes: F >  HP has descended into the depths of evil. I predict the corporationF > winds up like Enron within 6 months, liquidated, its workers jobless/ > and homeless and bereft of their investments.   E 	Sadly, I've been wondering the same thing.  One thing's for sure, I  N really feel bad for Sue and Hoff and all the other hard-working and excellent A people in VMS engineering who definitely don't deserve this crap.     	  - Sharon " "Gravity...  is a harsh mistress!"   ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 01:27:54 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> , Subject: Re: All is not well at the HP board, Message-ID: <4518BA47.1577AAFE@teksavvy.com>  
 Sharon wrote: M >         Sadly, I've been wondering the same thing.  One thing's for sure, I O > really feel bad for Sue and Hoff and all the other hard-working and excellent C > people in VMS engineering who definitely don't deserve this crap.     E I don't think for a minute that this soap opera will really impact HP D financials, except perhaps HP might have to increase its advertisingB budget to rebuild its image after this episode of "as the HP board turns" is over.   H In terms of Sue and others, the real danger here is that the corporationF might put such a high degree of fear about leaks that no employee willC ever again wish to have a dialogue with customers for fear of being ' caught revealing corporate information.   E Contrary to what Hurd has said, the CNET articles about HP's strategy @ actually helped HP because it allowed customers to see what HP'sD strategy was. Otherwise, customers remain in the dark and don't knowD what HP is up to. And while this may be fine for a consumer productsH firm, it isn't for enterprise computing firm where the relationship withC the customer HAS to be different, unless yo start selling commodity G based stuff where future directions are not something customers have to  worry about.  G And by ensuring the strategy becomes public, it prevents the board from + making decisions that will screw customers.    ------------------------------  + Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 20:32:46 +0000 (UTC) P From: helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply)C Subject: Re: Can a satellite survive the reboot of its boot server? $ Message-ID: <ef9ede$6m1$1@online.de>  3 In article <z5FXpQCHDeok@eisner.encompasserve.org>, > koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:   y > In article <ef5j4f$700$2@online.de>, helbig@astro.multiCLOTHESvax.de (Phillip Helbig---remove CLOTHES to reply) writes: G > > Imagine a 3-node cluster with each node having 1 vote.  Then boot a K > > 0-vote satellite into the cluster from one of the nodes.  What happens  1 > > to this satellite if its boot server reboots?  > > D >    During the reboot, any operations which causes the satellite toH >    access any served diskwill cause the system to appear to hang untilD >    the services becomes available.  A lot of operations will causeF >    access to the system disk, which means almost anything you do can >    get you into that state.   F I was assuming that operations to a disk served by the rebooting node F would cause a freeze, but I didn't think there would be that many.  A G log time ago, before I had a shadowed system disk, the disk physically  G died with a squeal (yes, I had a recent backup and restored from that)  H and several processes continued chugging away for several minutes after > that.  This didn't involve a satellite or served disk, though.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 11:07:04 -0400 , From: Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com>0 Subject: Re: Can a VAX MSCP-serve an ODS5 disk ?* Message-ID: <4517f096@usenet01.boi.hp.com>   Bob Koehler wrote:^ > In article <451624C2.3B3C45E5@teksavvy.com>, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:K >> If I have a disk attached to a VAX, could an Alpha system intialise that / >> disk as an ODS-5 drive without any problem ?  > F >   No.  The disk must have a physical connection to an Alpha or IA64.F >   VAX can only mount MSCP served OSD-5 disks from Alpha (or probably >   IA64) nodes.  G    INITIALIZE?  I'd expect an OpenVMS Alpha system to be fully able to  O initialize a served disk in whatever format it wanted, regardless of what MSCP  O server is serving the bits.  MSCP is a block-oriented disk protocol, after all.   Q    Things get a little interesting here if we are discussing the installation of  I OpenVMS itself onto the disk, as that is restricted to same-architecture  O operations as a result of how the OpenVMS installation processing operates, at  O least for the installation itself.  But once installed, the system disk can be   served across architectures.    I >> (this is VAX VMS 7.2, and the ALPHA might be 8.2 if I am lucky, or 8.3  >> if very lucky). >>I >> Or is MSCP serving so low level that it absolutely does not care about  >> volume format at all ?  >  >   No.   ,    MSCP can serve foreign-format disks, too.  O    For those pieces of an ODS-5 disk that stay inside ODS-2 file and directory  L rules, you should be able to have the OpenVMS VAX node access the files and H directories.  (Some parts of ODS-5 *are* present on OpenVMS VAX -- it's N documented that OpenVMS VAX systems can MOUNT ODS-5 disks -- but the extended F filename processing and other pieces are not among these.)  See below.    I >> I take it that VAX-VMS backup would be unable to work on this disk and I >> that any backups would have to be MSCP served from the VAX hosted disk  >> to the VAX hosted tape ?  > F >   Even if MSCP served from an Alpha, the VAX will mung the non-OSD-26 >   file names so using it to do BACKUP is a bad idea.  N    OpenVMS VAX applications can and would have troubles with ODS-5 filenames, M yes.  But if the disk is served, you can use OpenVMS Alpha and its tools, so  1 long as the host serving the disk is offering it.      ----  # 29.3.2.2 Mixed-Architecture Support   Q Current ODS-2 volume and file management functions remain the same on VAX, Alpha  P Version 7.2 and greater systems, and I64 systems; however, extended file naming - and parsing are not available on VAX systems.   O The following sections describe support on OpenVMS VAX, Alpha, and I64 systems    in a mixed-architecture cluster.  @ Limited Extended File Specifications Capabilities on VAX Systems  P In mixed-architecture OpenVMS Version 7.2 and greater clusters, OpenVMS Version G 7.2 and greater VAX systems are limited to the following Extended File   Specifications functionality:   '      * Ability to mount an ODS-5 volume K      * Ability to write and manage ODS-2-compliant files on an ODS-5 volume P      * See pseudonames ( \pISO_LATIN\.??? or \pUNICODE\.??? ) when accessing an  ODS-5 file specification   BACKUP Limitations  O  From a VAX system, users cannot successfully create or restore an ODS-5 image  L saveset. However, these users can successfully restore ODS-2-compliant file  names from an ODS-5 saveset.   ------------------------------    Date: 25 Sep 2006 12:33:04 -0500. From: brooks@cuebid.zko.hp.nospam (Rob Brooks)0 Subject: Re: Can a VAX MSCP-serve an ODS5 disk ?, Message-ID: <xO+AbtdZXknX@cuebid.zko.hp.com>   (Bob Koehler) writes: ; > moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) writes: 2 >> JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> writes:  K >>>If I have a disk attached to a VAX, could an Alpha system intialise that / >>>disk as an ODS-5 drive without any problem ?  >>  M >> Yes.  The VAX won't know what to do with it if you try to mount it there,  
 >> of course.  > F >    No. 	The VAX can't serve a disk that isn't mounted on the VAX andI >    can't mount an ODS-5 local disk.  You can't INITIALIZE the disk from $ >    the Alpha while its not served.   Of course, Mike is right . . .    I >>>Or is MSCP serving so low level that it absolutely does not care about  >>>volume format at all ?  >>  K >> Exactly.  Blocks is blocks to it.  The MSCP Server is driver level code.  > E >    No.  MSCP does not serve disk blocks (that was done on Tru64 for 4 >    TruClusters, but that's not VMSCluster's MSCP).  H While Bob's replies are usually accurate, he is badly off the mark here.  ( SISKO Alpha> init $20$dka400/struc=5 zzz1 SISKO Alpha> mount/sys/noass/nounl $20$dka400 zzz 5 %MOUNT-I-MOUNTED, ZZZ mounted on _$20$DKA400: (BOOLA) # SISKO Alpha> sho dev/ful $20$dka400   J Disk $20$DKA400: (BOOLA), device type DEC RZ26N, is online, mounted, file-O     oriented device, shareable, available to cluster, error logging is enabled.   O     Error count                    0    Operations completed                207 O     Owner process                 ""    Owner UIC                      [SYSTEM] O     Owner process ID        00000000    Dev Prot            S:RWPL,O:RWPL,G:R,W O     Reference count                1    Default buffer size                 512 O     Current preferred CPU Id       0    Fastpath                              1 O     Total blocks             2050860    Sectors per track                    83 O     Total cylinders             3089    Tracks per cylinder                   8 O     Logical Volume Size      2050860    Expansion Size Limit            3080192 O     Host name                "BOOLA"    Host type, avail     VAX 4000-108A, yes $     Allocation class              20  O     Volume label               "ZZZ"    Relative volume number                0 O     Cluster size                  16    Transaction count                     1 O     Free blocks              2050672    Maximum files allowed             60319 O     Extend quantity                5    Mount count                           1 O     Mount status              System    Cache name         "_$1$DGA13:XQPCACHE" O     Extent cache size             64    Maximum blocks in extent cache   205067 O     File ID cache size            64    Blocks in extent cache                0 O     Quota cache size               0    Maximum buffers in FCP cache       2890 O     Volume owner UIC        [BROOKS]    Vol Prot    S:RWCD,O:RWCD,G:RWCD,W:RWCD   H   Volume Status:  ODS-5, subject to mount verification, do not unload onD       dismount, file high-water marking, write-back caching enabled.   --    H Rob Brooks    VMS Engineering -- Exec Group     brooks!cuebid.zko.hp.com   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 22:04:35 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 0 Subject: Re: Can a VAX MSCP-serve an ODS5 disk ?, Message-ID: <45188AAC.E63D0EEF@teksavvy.com>   Bob Koehler wrote:F >    No.  The VAX can't serve a disk that isn't mounted on the VAX and& >    can't mount an ODS-5 local disk.   E Just tried. VAX2 was able to mount a disk physically attached to VAX1  but not mounted on VAX1.   ------------------------------  + Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 03:44:27 +0000 (UTC) 7 From: moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) 0 Subject: Re: Can a VAX MSCP-serve an ODS5 disk ?( Message-ID: <efa7mq$gon$1@pcls4.std.com>  = koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:   c >In article <ef5u2k$t0t$1@pcls4.std.com>, moroney@world.std.spaamtrap.com (Michael Moroney) writes: K >>>If I have a disk attached to a VAX, could an Alpha system intialise that / >>>disk as an ODS-5 drive without any problem ?  >>  M >> Yes.  The VAX won't know what to do with it if you try to mount it there,  
 >> of course.   E >   No. 	The VAX can't serve a disk that isn't mounted on the VAX and H >   can't mount an ODS-5 local disk.  You can't INITIALIZE the disk from# >   the Alpha while its not served.   F Not true at all.  You most certainly can serve drives mounted /foreignG whether there's a filesystem on them or not.  With the right privileges H (LOG_IO) you can issue QIOs directly to a drive without it being mountedC at all, as long as the first one is a packack.  (that's exactly how  INITIALIZE works)   I >>>Or is MSCP serving so low level that it absolutely does not care about  >>>volume format at all ?  >>  K >> Exactly.  Blocks is blocks to it.  The MSCP Server is driver level code.   D >   No.  MSCP does not serve disk blocks (that was done on Tru64 for3 >   TruClusters, but that's not VMSCluster's MSCP).   G The MSCP Server most certainly serves disk blocks.  It has no knowledge  of any filesystem whatsoever.   E I think I know what I am talking about.  I maintained the MSCP Server C for the VMS group for several years and made several changes to it.   H Tru64 clustering took a lot from VMS clusters.  I'm not sure if the mscp+ server was one of them, sounds like it was.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 09:39:55 +0930 % From: Jeremy Begg <nospam@vsm.com.au> & Subject: DEC RAIDArray310 user manual?) Message-ID: <45186FD3.3000506@vsm.com.au>    Hi,   K I have recently acquired a DEC RAIDArray 310.  (It's an external SCSI RAID  H controller with seven drives in a pedestal cabinet, about 10 years old.)  C Does anyone have a copy of the user's manual or reference guide or  I equivalent?  The online help is adequate for configuring it, but I would  L like some guidance on how it handles drive failues -- and the procedure for $ physically replacing a failed drive.  J (Cross-posted to comp.os.vms & comp.sys.dec, please reply to me via email B address below OR to the newsgroup in which you read this message.)   Thanks,    	Jeremy Begg 	jeremy AT vsm DOT com DOT au        ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 21:11:39 -0400 3 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <rgilbert88@comcast.net> * Subject: Re: DEC RAIDArray310 user manual?: Message-ID: <nK-dnQCFqJfS44XYnZ2dnUVZ_s-dnZ2d@comcast.com>   Jeremy Begg wrote:   > Hi,  > H > I have recently acquired a DEC RAIDArray 310.  (It's an external SCSI J > RAID controller with seven drives in a pedestal cabinet, about 10 years  > old.)  > E > Does anyone have a copy of the user's manual or reference guide or  K > equivalent?  The online help is adequate for configuring it, but I would  J > like some guidance on how it handles drive failues -- and the procedure * > for physically replacing a failed drive. > F > (Cross-posted to comp.os.vms & comp.sys.dec, please reply to me via J > email address below OR to the newsgroup in which you read this message.) > 	 > Thanks,  >  >     Jeremy Begg " >     jeremy AT vsm DOT com DOT au >  >   >   I Is that dual HSZ50 based with, ISTR, four shelves?  I had one at my last  H job.  Don't have the docs for the whole thing but I do have, at least I ! think I have, docs for the HSZ50.   H You want "Digital StorageWorks HSZ50 Array Controller HSOF V5.x Service C Manual.  (Mine is V5.1) Part Number EK-HSZ50-SV.C01.  To replace a  I drive: ensure that the drive is not in use; e.g. remove it from any RAID  I set it was a member of or dismount it if it was a JBOD.  Grasp the drive  F by the squeeze tabs and pull.  As soon as the drive comes free of the F rear connector, pause to let the drive spin down.  Pull the drive the E rest of the way out of the slot.  Insert replacement drive.  Add the  8 drive to the RAID set or just mount it if it was a JBOD.  I A failed drive is indicated by an amber light on the front of the drive;  ; the same one that turns on when you use a "Locate" command.    ------------------------------    Date: 25 Sep 2006 20:23:42 -0700; From: "johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com" <johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com> * Subject: Re: DEC RAIDArray310 user manual?C Message-ID: <1159241022.904416.159780@b28g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>    Richard B. Gilbert wrote:  > Jeremy Begg wrote: >  > > Hi,  > > I > > I have recently acquired a DEC RAIDArray 310.  (It's an external SCSI K > > RAID controller with seven drives in a pedestal cabinet, about 10 years 	 > > old.)  > > F > > Does anyone have a copy of the user's manual or reference guide orL > > equivalent?  The online help is adequate for configuring it, but I wouldK > > like some guidance on how it handles drive failues -- and the procedure , > > for physically replacing a failed drive. > > G > > (Cross-posted to comp.os.vms & comp.sys.dec, please reply to me via L > > email address below OR to the newsgroup in which you read this message.) > >  > > Thanks,  > >  > >     Jeremy Begg $ > >     jeremy AT vsm DOT com DOT au > >  > >   > >  > J > Is that dual HSZ50 based with, ISTR, four shelves?  I had one at my lastI > job.  Don't have the docs for the whole thing but I do have, at least I # > think I have, docs for the HSZ50.  > I > You want "Digital StorageWorks HSZ50 Array Controller HSOF V5.x Service D > Manual.  (Mine is V5.1) Part Number EK-HSZ50-SV.C01.  To replace aJ > drive: ensure that the drive is not in use; e.g. remove it from any RAIDJ > set it was a member of or dismount it if it was a JBOD.  Grasp the driveG > by the squeeze tabs and pull.  As soon as the drive comes free of the G > rear connector, pause to let the drive spin down.  Pull the drive the F > rest of the way out of the slot.  Insert replacement drive.  Add the: > drive to the RAID set or just mount it if it was a JBOD. > J > A failed drive is indicated by an amber light on the front of the drive;= > the same one that turns on when you use a "Locate" command.   E IIRC the RAIDArray 310 used the HSZ20 controller.  You can find a bit 2 of information out about it in the SOC archives atF http://h18006.www1.hp.com/products/quickspecs/SOC/QB00MSPF.PDF  So farE in Googling, I haven't found any online copies of any manuals but try C combinations of HSZ20, HSZ22, RA310, SWXRA-ZX and maybe you'll have  better luck than I did.    ------------------------------  % Date: Tue, 26 Sep 2006 00:50:13 -0400 3 From: "Richard B. Gilbert" <rgilbert88@comcast.net> * Subject: Re: DEC RAIDArray310 user manual?: Message-ID: <AcSdnc-BRr4XLIXYnZ2dnUVZ_rOdnZ2d@comcast.com>   johnhreinhardt@yahoo.com wrote:  > Richard B. Gilbert wrote:  >  >>Jeremy Begg wrote: >> >> >>>Hi, >>> H >>>I have recently acquired a DEC RAIDArray 310.  (It's an external SCSIJ >>>RAID controller with seven drives in a pedestal cabinet, about 10 years >>>old.) >>> E >>>Does anyone have a copy of the user's manual or reference guide or K >>>equivalent?  The online help is adequate for configuring it, but I would J >>>like some guidance on how it handles drive failues -- and the procedure+ >>>for physically replacing a failed drive.  >>> F >>>(Cross-posted to comp.os.vms & comp.sys.dec, please reply to me viaK >>>email address below OR to the newsgroup in which you read this message.)  >>> 
 >>>Thanks, >>>  >>>    Jeremy Begg# >>>    jeremy AT vsm DOT com DOT au  >>>  >>> >>>  >>J >>Is that dual HSZ50 based with, ISTR, four shelves?  I had one at my lastI >>job.  Don't have the docs for the whole thing but I do have, at least I # >>think I have, docs for the HSZ50.  >>I >>You want "Digital StorageWorks HSZ50 Array Controller HSOF V5.x Service D >>Manual.  (Mine is V5.1) Part Number EK-HSZ50-SV.C01.  To replace aJ >>drive: ensure that the drive is not in use; e.g. remove it from any RAIDJ >>set it was a member of or dismount it if it was a JBOD.  Grasp the driveG >>by the squeeze tabs and pull.  As soon as the drive comes free of the G >>rear connector, pause to let the drive spin down.  Pull the drive the F >>rest of the way out of the slot.  Insert replacement drive.  Add the: >>drive to the RAID set or just mount it if it was a JBOD. >>J >>A failed drive is indicated by an amber light on the front of the drive;= >>the same one that turns on when you use a "Locate" command.  >  > G > IIRC the RAIDArray 310 used the HSZ20 controller.  You can find a bit 4 > of information out about it in the SOC archives atH > http://h18006.www1.hp.com/products/quickspecs/SOC/QB00MSPF.PDF  So farG > in Googling, I haven't found any online copies of any manuals but try E > combinations of HSZ20, HSZ22, RA310, SWXRA-ZX and maybe you'll have  > better luck than I did.  >   E A good link!   The hardware I was thinking of is the RAID Array 450!  ' The 310 is something a lot more modest.    ------------------------------  # Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 18:38:01 GMT " From:   VAXman-  @SendSpamHere.ORG5 Subject: Re: DSPP: Delete Successful Product Programs 0 Message-ID: <00A5C438.AA78CE6A@SendSpamHere.ORG>  s In article <1159203822.563298.257270@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "Doug Phillips" <dphill46@netscape.net> writes:  >  >   >VAXman-@SendSpamHere.ORG wrote: >>H >> Try calling the 800 number for DSPP ordering and mention you that youI >> want purchase VMS anything.  Let me know how many times you are handed I >> off to another phone/dept. and forwarded to sales reps in distribution ! >> channels that can't spell VMS.  >> > = >Been there, done that. If I ever feel the need for that much A >frustration again, I'll just jump into another disagreement with  >(name-withheld) here, instead.   J I am not alone.  I suppose Hopelessly Pathetic believe in the misery loves company cliche. ;)      A >At least now we know why HP hasn't had time to worry about minor E >business matters; like customer service training and all those other G >little things that would distract them for playing corporate politics.   I The OpenVMS V8.3 IA64 kit that I ordered off of the DSPP web site arrived 	 today. :)   J Also, aided by an individual within HP/OpenVMS who read of my plight here,, I've received an OpenVMS V8.3 Alpha kit too.  L I am greatful for this person's assistance but that does not change/fix the K problems within HP/DSPP.  Will I be going through the same hair pulling ex- J ercise (and I'm verty fond of my 2+ feet of hair) with the next release if these issues are not addressed?    --  K VAXman- A Bored Certified VMS Kernel Mode Hacker   VAXman(at)TMESIS(dot)COM              5   "Well my son, life is like a beanstalk, isn't it?"     ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 18:37:46 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> 5 Subject: Re: DSPP: Delete Successful Product Programs 9 Message-ID: <mMKdndG2Q8PzxYXYnZ2dnUVZ_qydnZ2d@libcom.com>     VAXman- @SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:u > In article <1159203822.563298.257270@i42g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>, "Doug Phillips" <dphill46@netscape.net> writes:  >>" >> VAXman-@SendSpamHere.ORG wrote:I >>> Try calling the 800 number for DSPP ordering and mention you that you J >>> want purchase VMS anything.  Let me know how many times you are handedJ >>> off to another phone/dept. and forwarded to sales reps in distribution" >>> channels that can't spell VMS. >>> ? >> Been there, done that. If I ever feel the need for that much C >> frustration again, I'll just jump into another disagreement with ! >> (name-withheld) here, instead.  > L > I am not alone.  I suppose Hopelessly Pathetic believe in the misery loves > company cliche. ;) >  >  > C >> At least now we know why HP hasn't had time to worry about minor G >> business matters; like customer service training and all those other I >> little things that would distract them for playing corporate politics.  > K > The OpenVMS V8.3 IA64 kit that I ordered off of the DSPP web site arrived  > today. :)   G It makes one wonder if there is an attitude that wants to force people  F into using new products, and actually denies support for old products.  L > Also, aided by an individual within HP/OpenVMS who read of my plight here,. > I've received an OpenVMS V8.3 Alpha kit too.   As I'd expected would occur.  N > I am greatful for this person's assistance but that does not change/fix the M > problems within HP/DSPP.  Will I be going through the same hair pulling ex- L > ercise (and I'm verty fond of my 2+ feet of hair) with the next release if! > these issues are not addressed?   C Entirely correct.  The lack of a 'supported' channel for people to  G procure VMS products is a major problem for VMS users.  Larry recently  ? posted about the DEC store.  Gotta agree with him on that also.    --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450> Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com DFE Ultralights, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 14:36:09 -0700 * From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos-remove.com> Subject: ES40s for sale ) Message-ID: <op.tggeajiytte90l@hyrrokkin>   > I have a couple I may get rid of 500MHz mod 1 4cpu's 4GB 4-way? interleave. Make me a good offer, and I won't put them on ebay. < I'll give it a week, let's say Tues 30-OCT-2006 by 18:00 PDT3 Don't know how much shipping will be.  They measure @ 14" x 18" x 30" and they're pretty heavy, probably over 100 lbs,I although I was able (with some effort) lift them myself, probably need t=  o  =   be8 crated, don't think cardboard would work.   Here are theG specs.  The each have two power supplies and there is room for a third. I I currently have each supply on a different phase.  There are 4 18GB dri=  ves C with room for 4 more.  These are hot swap.  Firmware is latest  The  FC HBA's not included.  !   SROM V2.0 CPU # 00 @  0500  MHz  SROM program starting  Reloading SROM  $   SROM V2.22-G CPU # 00 @  0500  MHz SROM program starting  Starting secondary on CPU #1 Starting secondary on CPU #2 Starting secondary on CPU #3 Bcache data tests in progress  Bcache address test in progress ( CPU parity and ECC detection in progress! Bcache ECC data tests in progress " Bcache TAG lines tests in progress Memory sizing in progress   Memory configuration in progress Memory data test in progress Memory address test in progress  Memory pattern test in progress ! Memory thrashing test in progress  Memory initialization  Loading console * Code execution complete (transfer control)    3 OpenVMS PALcode V1.98-4, Tru64 UNIX PALcode V1.92-5    starting console on CPU 0  initialized idle PCB initializing semaphores  initializing heap  initial heap 240c01 memory low limit =3D 1b0000 heap =3D 240c0, 17fc0  initializing driver structures initializing idle process PID  initializing file system initializing hardware " initializing timer data structures lowering IPL CPU 0 speed is 500 MHz create dead_eater  create poll  create timer create powerup access NVRAM Memory size 2048 MB  testing memory ...  probe I/O subsystem  probing hose 1, PCI " bus 0, slot 4 -- pka -- NCR 53C895" bus 0, slot 5 -- pkb -- NCR 53C895 probing hose 0, PCI   probing PCI-to-ISA bridge, bus 1 bus 0, slot 1 -- pga -- KGPSA-C  bus 0, slot 2 -- pgb -- KGPSA-C 3 bus 0, slot 3 -- ewa -- DE500-BA Network Controller - bus 0, slot 15 -- dqa -- Acer Labs M1543C IDE - bus 0, slot 15 -- dqb -- Acer Labs M1543C IDE  starting drivers entering idle loop starting console on CPU 1  initialized idle PCB initializing idle process PID  lowering IPL CPU 1 speed is 500 MHz create powerup starting console on CPU 2  initialized idle PCB initializing idle process PID  lowering IPL CPU 2 speed is 500 MHz create powerup starting console on CPU 3  initialized idle PCB initializing idle process PID  lowering IPL CPU 3 speed is 500 MHz create powerup4 Partition 0, Memory base: 000000000, size: 080000000 initializing GCT/FRU at 1d6000 Initializing pka pkb ewa2 ewa0: link up : Negotiated  100BaseTX: full duplex dqa dqb pga pgb ' Memory Testing and Configuration Status 4    Array       Size       Base Address    Intlv Mode3 ---------  ----------  ----------------  ---------- 1      0        512Mb     0000000000000000    4-Way 1      1        512Mb     0000000020000000    4-Way 1      2        512Mb     0000000040000000    4-Way 1      3        512Mb     0000000060000000    4-Way          2048 MB of System Memory Testing the System Testing the Disks (read only)  Testing the Network A AlphaServer ES40 Console V7.1-1, built on Dec  7 2005 at 15:16:14 
 P00>>>sho dev D dka0.0.0.4.1               DKA0              COMPAQ BD0186459A  B010D dka100.1.0.4.1             DKA100                     RZ2ED-LS  0306D dkb0.0.0.5.1               DKB0                       RZ2ED-LS  0306D dkb100.1.0.5.1             DKB100                     RZ2ED-LS  0306D dqa0.0.0.15.0              DQA0                COMPAQ CDR-8435  0013 dva0.0.0.1000.0            DVA0 > ewa0.0.0.3.0               EWA0              08-00-2B-C3-BD-1A> pga0.0.0.1.0               PGA0        WWN 1000-0000-c921-f6ee> pgb0.0.0.2.0               PGB0        WWN 1000-0000-c921-6597> pka0.7.0.4.1               PKA0                  SCSI Bus ID 7> pkb0.7.0.5.1               PKB0                  SCSI Bus ID 7 P00>>>sho config/                             hp AlphaServer ES40    Firmware SRM Console:    V7.1-1 ARC Console:    v5.71 C PALcode:        OpenVMS PALcode V1.98-4, Tru64 UNIX PALcode V1.92-5  Serial ROM:     V2.22-G  RMC ROM:        V1.0 RMC Flash ROM:  V2.7  
 Processors6 CPU 0           Alpha EV6 pass 2.5 500 MHz  4MB Bcache6 CPU 1           Alpha EV6 pass 2.5 500 MHz  4MB Bcache6 CPU 2           Alpha EV6 pass 2.5 500 MHz  4MB Bcache6 CPU 3           Alpha EV6 pass 2.5 500 MHz  4MB Bcache  
 Core Logic* Cchip           DECchip 21272-CA Rev 9(C4)& Dchip           DECchip 21272-DA Rev 2& Pchip 0         DECchip 21272-EA Rev 2& Pchip 1         DECchip 21272-EA Rev 2 TIG             Rev 10   Memory4    Array       Size       Base Address    Intlv Mode3 ---------  ----------  ----------------  ---------- 1      0        512Mb     0000000000000000    4-Way 1      1        512Mb     0000000020000000    4-Way 1      2        512Mb     0000000040000000    4-Way 1      3        512Mb     0000000060000000    4-Way          2048 MB of System Memory  3   Slot   Option                  Hose 0, Bus 0, PCI ?     1    KGPSA-C                 pga0.0.0.1.0            WWN  =    1000-0000-c921-f6ee ?     2    KGPSA-C                 pgb0.0.0.2.0            WWN  =    1000-0000-c921-6597 I     3    DE500-BA Network Con    ewa0.0.0.3.0            08-00-2B-C3-BD-=  1AI     7    Acer Labs M1543C                                Bridge to Bus 1=  ,  =   ISA -    15    Acer Labs M1543C IDE    dqa.0.0.15.0 -                                  dqb.0.1.15.0 I                                  dqa0.0.0.15.0           COMPAQ CDR-8435=       19    Acer Labs M1543C USB   3          Option                  Hose 0, Bus 1, ISA 0          Floppy                  dva0.0.0.1000.0  3   Slot   Option                  Hose 1, Bus 0, PCI F     4    NCR 53C895              pka0.7.0.4.1            SCSI Bus ID 7I                                  dka0.0.0.4.1            COMPAQ BD018645=  9AA                                  dka100.1.0.4.1          RZ2ED-LS F     5    NCR 53C895              pkb0.7.0.5.1            SCSI Bus ID 7A                                  dkb0.0.0.5.1            RZ2ED-LS A                                  dkb100.1.0.5.1          RZ2ED-LS 
 P00>>>boot (boot dka0.0.0.4.1 -flags 0,0)- block 0 of dka0.0.0.4.1 is a valid boot block # reading 19 blocks from dka0.0.0.4.1  bootstrap code read in> base =3D 200000, image_start =3D 0, image_bytes =3D 2600(9728) initializing HWRPB at 2000# initializing page table at 3ff54000  initializing machine state# setting affinity to the primary CPU  jumping to bootstrap code   % UNIX boot - Wednesday August 01, 2001    Loading vmunix ... Loading at 0xfffffc0000230000    Sizes: text =3D  6493632  data =3D  1235680  bss  =3D  1745136  Starting at 0xfffffc0000241320  / Loading vmunix symbol table ... [1611440 bytes] 9 Alpha boot: available memory from 0x36cc000 to 0x7fffc000 A Compaq Tru64 UNIX V5.1A (Rev. 1885); Tue May  7 18:37:42 PDT 2002 & physical memory =3D 2048.00 megabytes.' available memory =3D 1992.50 megabytes. 7 using 7814 buffers containing 61.04 megabytes of memory  Master cpu at slot 0 Starting secondary cpu 1 Starting secondary cpu 2 Starting secondary cpu 3 Firmware revision: 7.1-1 PALcode: UNIX version 1.92-5 AlphaServer ES40 pci1 (primary bus:1) at nexus  itpsa0 at pci1 slot 4 $ IntraServer ROM Version V2.0 (c)1998 scsi0 at itpsa0 slot 0 rad 0 itpsa1 at pci1 slot 5 $ IntraServer ROM Version V2.0 (c)1998 scsi1 at itpsa1 slot 0 rad 0 pci0 (primary bus:0) at nexus ! tu0: DECchip 21143: Revision: 3.0 $ tu0: auto negotiation capable device tu0 at pci0 slot 3@ tu0: DEC TULIP (10/100) Ethernet Interface, hardware address:  =   08-00-2B-C3-BD-1A I tu0: auto negotiation on: will advertise 100BaseTX (UTP) port: full dupl=  ex isa0 at pci0 gpc0 at isa0 gpc1 not probed 8 Baud 0 is unsupported; setting console port to 9600 baud ace0 at isa0 ace1 at isa0 lp0 at isa0  fdi0 at isa0 fd0 at fdi0 unit 0 ata0 at pci0 slot 15 ata0: ACER M1543C  scsi2 at ata0 slot 0 rad 0 scsi3 at ata0 slot 1 rad 0 usb0 at pci0 slot 19) Created FRU table binary error log packet  kernel console: ace0 dli: configured  NetRAIN configured. / ATM Subsystem configured with 4 restart threads  ATMUNI: configured' ATMSIG: 3.x (module=3Duni3x) configured $ ILMI: 3.x (module=3Dilmi) configured ATM IP: configured ATM LANE: configured.  ATM IFMP: configured2 vm_swap_init: swap is set to eager allocation mode   INIT: SINGLE-USER MODE # ^D INIT: New run level: 3 Checking device naming:       Passed. Checking local filesystems Mounting / (root)  user_cfg_pt: reconfigured  root_mounted_rw: reconfigured  user_cfg_pt: reconfigured  root_mounted_rw: reconfigured  user_cfg_pt: reconfigured 7 dsfmgr: NOTE: updating kernel basenames for system at / F      scp kevm tty00 tty01 lp0 dmapi dsk0 dsk1 dsk2 dsk3 floppy0 cdrom0 Mounting local filesystems5 exec: /sbin/mount_advfs -F 0x14000 root_domain#root / % root_domain#root on / type advfs (rw)  /proc on /proc type procfs (rw) 5 exec: /sbin/mount_advfs -F 0x4000 usr_domain#usr /usr & usr_domain#usr on /usr type advfs (rw)5 exec: /sbin/mount_advfs -F 0x4000 var_domain#var /var & var_domain#var on /var type advfs (rw)4 exec: /sbin/mount_advfs -F 0x4000 tiger#local /local% tiger#local on /local type advfs (rw) ? Sep 25 14:04:49 esmd: Essential Services Monitor daemon started 4 Driver_support: Module emx failed to load. status:224 Driver_support: Module emx failed to load. status:223 Subsystem hwautoconfig was successfully configured.  Sep 25 14:04:50 update: started   " Checking for Installation Tasks...   Executing Installation Tasks... ' The system is coming up. Please wait...  Checking for crash dumps Initializing paging space  Mounting Memory filesystems  evmstart: Daemon started7 Sep 25 14:04:54 esmd: Started monitoring the EVM daemon - security configuration set to default (BASE). / File /etc/sia/matrix.conf updated successfully.  Successful SIA initialization   G /usr/sbin/autopush: Can't push requested modules on STREAM for entry 36 4 /usr/sbin/autopush: Device (6,-1) already configured Streams autopushes configured  Configuring network  hostname: tiger I /sbin/rc3.d/S00inet: ifconfig failed - ifconfig: ioctl (SIOCGIFFLAGS): n=  o  =   such i nterface: alt0 Loading LMF licensesI Combine OSF-BASE ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-741 with OSF-BASE ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-740=   I Combine OSF-BASE ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-741 with OSF-BASE ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-739=   I Combine OSF-BASE ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-741 with OSF-BASE ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-735=   I Combine OSF-USR ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-732 with OSF-USR UNIX-SERVER-IMPLICIT-U=  SER  System error logger started  Binary error logger started B binlogd: failed to initialize remote logging. Please make sure the4 network is set up properly and then restart binlogd.1 writing to routing socket: Network is unreachable 5 add net default: gateway 172.16.0.1: ioctl returns 51  Network is unreachable  Setting kernel timezone variable. Setting the current time and date with ntpdate Ntpdate failed.  ONC portmap service started ! NIS domain name set to FosterCity / ypbind: Secure mode sunos 3.x servers rejected.  ypbind daemon started  NFS mount daemon started NFS export service started NFS IO service started NFS Locking:    rpc.statd started    rpc.lockd started AutoFS: autofsd started  Mounting NFS filesystemsD mapfile_getline: yp_first +auto.master: RPC failure on NIS operation* Unable to start AutoFS autofsmount service Preserving editor files  Clearing temporary files Unlocking ptys SMTP Mail Service started. Network Time Service started. Environmental Monitoring Subsystem Configured." Using snmp service entry port 161.$ Extensible SNMP master agent started Base O/S subagent started  Server System subagent started" Server Management subagent started CIM SNMP subagent started ' Performance Management subagent started " Web Based Management Agent started& ConfigReport Management Module started  SysMan Management Module started% Threshold Management Subagent started ( Environmental Monitoring Daemon started. AdvFS daemon (advfsd) started. Internet services provided.  Cron service startedG SuperLAT. Copyright 1994 Meridian Technology Corp. All rights reserved.  LAT started. Printer service started / tu0: link up: negotiated 100BaseTX: full duplex & System not configured for Big Brother! The system is ready.      3 Compaq Tru64 UNIX V5.1A (Rev. 1885) (tiger) console    login:   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 19:13:04 -0700 * From: "Tom Linden" <tom@kednos-remove.com> Subject: Re: ES40s for sale ) Message-ID: <op.tggq32lztte90l@hyrrokkin>   I On Mon, 25 Sep 2006 14:36:09 -0700, Tom Linden <tom@kednos-remove.com>  =    wrote:   > @ > I have a couple I may get rid of 500MHz mod 1 4cpu's 4GB 4-wayA > interleave. Make me a good offer, and I won't put them on ebay. > > I'll give it a week, let's say Tues 30-OCT-2006 by 18:00 PDT  @ TYPO  03-OCT-2006, and I am near Monterey CA for those with SUVs  5 > Don't know how much shipping will be.  They measure B > 14" x 18" x 30" and they're pretty heavy, probably over 100 lbs,I > although I was able (with some effort) lift them myself, probably need=    =    > to be : > crated, don't think cardboard would work.   Here are theI > specs.  The each have two power supplies and there is room for a third=  . I > I currently have each supply on a different phase.  There are 4 18GB  =    > drivesE > with room for 4 more.  These are hot swap.  Firmware is latest  The  > FC HBA's not included. > # >   SROM V2.0 CPU # 00 @  0500  MHz  > SROM program starting  > Reloading SROM > & >   SROM V2.22-G CPU # 00 @  0500  MHz > SROM program starting  > Starting secondary on CPU #1 > Starting secondary on CPU #2 > Starting secondary on CPU #3 > Bcache data tests in progress ! > Bcache address test in progress * > CPU parity and ECC detection in progress# > Bcache ECC data tests in progress $ > Bcache TAG lines tests in progress > Memory sizing in progress " > Memory configuration in progress > Memory data test in progress! > Memory address test in progress ! > Memory pattern test in progress # > Memory thrashing test in progress  > Memory initialization  > Loading console , > Code execution complete (transfer control) >  > 5 > OpenVMS PALcode V1.98-4, Tru64 UNIX PALcode V1.92-5  >  > starting console on CPU 0  > initialized idle PCB > initializing semaphores  > initializing heap  > initial heap 240c03 > memory low limit =3D 1b0000 heap =3D 240c0, 17fc0   > initializing driver structures > initializing idle process PID  > initializing file system > initializing hardware $ > initializing timer data structures > lowering IPL > CPU 0 speed is 500 MHz > create dead_eater 
 > create poll  > create timer > create powerup > access NVRAM > Memory size 2048 MB  > testing memory > ...  > probe I/O subsystem  > probing hose 1, PCI $ > bus 0, slot 4 -- pka -- NCR 53C895$ > bus 0, slot 5 -- pkb -- NCR 53C895 > probing hose 0, PCI " > probing PCI-to-ISA bridge, bus 1! > bus 0, slot 1 -- pga -- KGPSA-C ! > bus 0, slot 2 -- pgb -- KGPSA-C 5 > bus 0, slot 3 -- ewa -- DE500-BA Network Controller / > bus 0, slot 15 -- dqa -- Acer Labs M1543C IDE / > bus 0, slot 15 -- dqb -- Acer Labs M1543C IDE  > starting drivers > entering idle loop > starting console on CPU 1  > initialized idle PCB > initializing idle process PID  > lowering IPL > CPU 1 speed is 500 MHz > create powerup > starting console on CPU 2  > initialized idle PCB > initializing idle process PID  > lowering IPL > CPU 2 speed is 500 MHz > create powerup > starting console on CPU 3  > initialized idle PCB > initializing idle process PID  > lowering IPL > CPU 3 speed is 500 MHz > create powerup6 > Partition 0, Memory base: 000000000, size: 080000000  > initializing GCT/FRU at 1d6000 > Initializing pka pkb ewa4 > ewa0: link up : Negotiated  100BaseTX: full duplex > dqa dqb pga pgb ) > Memory Testing and Configuration Status 6 >    Array       Size       Base Address    Intlv Mode5 > ---------  ----------  ----------------  ---------- 3 >      0        512Mb     0000000000000000    4-Way 3 >      1        512Mb     0000000020000000    4-Way 3 >      2        512Mb     0000000040000000    4-Way 3 >      3        512Mb     0000000060000000    4-Way  >   >       2048 MB of System Memory > Testing the System > Testing the Disks (read only)  > Testing the Network C > AlphaServer ES40 Console V7.1-1, built on Dec  7 2005 at 15:16:14  > P00>>>sho dev F > dka0.0.0.4.1               DKA0              COMPAQ BD0186459A  B010F > dka100.1.0.4.1             DKA100                     RZ2ED-LS  0306F > dkb0.0.0.5.1               DKB0                       RZ2ED-LS  0306F > dkb100.1.0.5.1             DKB100                     RZ2ED-LS  0306F > dqa0.0.0.15.0              DQA0                COMPAQ CDR-8435  0013! > dva0.0.0.1000.0            DVA0 @ > ewa0.0.0.3.0               EWA0              08-00-2B-C3-BD-1A@ > pga0.0.0.1.0               PGA0        WWN 1000-0000-c921-f6ee@ > pgb0.0.0.2.0               PGB0        WWN 1000-0000-c921-6597@ > pka0.7.0.4.1               PKA0                  SCSI Bus ID 7@ > pkb0.7.0.5.1               PKB0                  SCSI Bus ID 7 > P00>>>sho config1 >                             hp AlphaServer ES40  > 
 > Firmware > SRM Console:    V7.1-1 > ARC Console:    v5.71 E > PALcode:        OpenVMS PALcode V1.98-4, Tru64 UNIX PALcode V1.92-5  > Serial ROM:     V2.22-G  > RMC ROM:        V1.0 > RMC Flash ROM:  V2.7 >  > Processors8 > CPU 0           Alpha EV6 pass 2.5 500 MHz  4MB Bcache8 > CPU 1           Alpha EV6 pass 2.5 500 MHz  4MB Bcache8 > CPU 2           Alpha EV6 pass 2.5 500 MHz  4MB Bcache8 > CPU 3           Alpha EV6 pass 2.5 500 MHz  4MB Bcache >  > Core Logic, > Cchip           DECchip 21272-CA Rev 9(C4)( > Dchip           DECchip 21272-DA Rev 2( > Pchip 0         DECchip 21272-EA Rev 2( > Pchip 1         DECchip 21272-EA Rev 2 > TIG             Rev 10 >  > Memory6 >    Array       Size       Base Address    Intlv Mode5 > ---------  ----------  ----------------  ---------- 3 >      0        512Mb     0000000000000000    4-Way 3 >      1        512Mb     0000000020000000    4-Way 3 >      2        512Mb     0000000040000000    4-Way 3 >      3        512Mb     0000000060000000    4-Way  >   >       2048 MB of System Memory > 5 >   Slot   Option                  Hose 0, Bus 0, PCI A >     1    KGPSA-C                 pga0.0.0.1.0            WWN  =    > 1000-0000-c921-f6ee A >     2    KGPSA-C                 pgb0.0.0.2.0            WWN  =    > 1000-0000-c921-6597 = >     3    DE500-BA Network Con    ewa0.0.0.3.0             =    > 08-00-2B-C3-BD-1A I >     7    Acer Labs M1543C                                Bridge to Bus=    =    > 1, ISA/ >    15    Acer Labs M1543C IDE    dqa.0.0.15.0 / >                                  dqb.0.1.15.0 I >                                  dqa0.0.0.15.0           COMPAQ CDR-84=  35 >    19    Acer Labs M1543C USB  > 5 >          Option                  Hose 0, Bus 1, ISA 2 >          Floppy                  dva0.0.0.1000.0 > 5 >   Slot   Option                  Hose 1, Bus 0, PCI I >     4    NCR 53C895              pka0.7.0.4.1            SCSI Bus ID 7=   D >                                  dka0.0.0.4.1            COMPAQ  =   > BD0186459AC >                                  dka100.1.0.4.1          RZ2ED-LS I >     5    NCR 53C895              pkb0.7.0.5.1            SCSI Bus ID 7=   C >                                  dkb0.0.0.5.1            RZ2ED-LS C >                                  dkb100.1.0.5.1          RZ2ED-LS  > P00>>>boot  > (boot dka0.0.0.4.1 -flags 0,0)/ > block 0 of dka0.0.0.4.1 is a valid boot block % > reading 19 blocks from dka0.0.0.4.1  > bootstrap code read in@ > base =3D 200000, image_start =3D 0, image_bytes =3D 2600(9728) > initializing HWRPB at 2000% > initializing page table at 3ff54000  > initializing machine state% > setting affinity to the primary CPU  > jumping to bootstrap code  > ' > UNIX boot - Wednesday August 01, 2001  >  > Loading vmunix ... > Loading at 0xfffffc0000230000  >  > Sizes: > text =3D  6493632  > data =3D  1235680  > bss  =3D  1745136   > Starting at 0xfffffc0000241320 > 1 > Loading vmunix symbol table ... [1611440 bytes] ; > Alpha boot: available memory from 0x36cc000 to 0x7fffc000 C > Compaq Tru64 UNIX V5.1A (Rev. 1885); Tue May  7 18:37:42 PDT 2002 ( > physical memory =3D 2048.00 megabytes.) > available memory =3D 1992.50 megabytes. 9 > using 7814 buffers containing 61.04 megabytes of memory  > Master cpu at slot 0 > Starting secondary cpu 1 > Starting secondary cpu 2 > Starting secondary cpu 3 > Firmware revision: 7.1-1 > PALcode: UNIX version 1.92-5 > AlphaServer ES40 > pci1 (primary bus:1) at nexus  > itpsa0 at pci1 slot 4 & > IntraServer ROM Version V2.0 (c)1998 > scsi0 at itpsa0 slot 0 rad 0 > itpsa1 at pci1 slot 5 & > IntraServer ROM Version V2.0 (c)1998 > scsi1 at itpsa1 slot 0 rad 0 > pci0 (primary bus:0) at nexus # > tu0: DECchip 21143: Revision: 3.0 & > tu0: auto negotiation capable device > tu0 at pci0 slot 3B > tu0: DEC TULIP (10/100) Ethernet Interface, hardware address:  =   > 08-00-2B-C3-BD-1A H > tu0: auto negotiation on: will advertise 100BaseTX (UTP) port: full  =   > duplex > isa0 at pci0 > gpc0 at isa0 > gpc1 not probed : > Baud 0 is unsupported; setting console port to 9600 baud > ace0 at isa0 > ace1 at isa0
 > lp0 at isa0  > fdi0 at isa0 > fd0 at fdi0 unit 0 > ata0 at pci0 slot 15 > ata0: ACER M1543C  > scsi2 at ata0 slot 0 rad 0 > scsi3 at ata0 slot 1 rad 0 > usb0 at pci0 slot 19+ > Created FRU table binary error log packet  > kernel console: ace0 > dli: configured  > NetRAIN configured. 1 > ATM Subsystem configured with 4 restart threads  > ATMUNI: configured) > ATMSIG: 3.x (module=3Duni3x) configured & > ILMI: 3.x (module=3Dilmi) configured > ATM IP: configured > ATM LANE: configured.  > ATM IFMP: configured4 > vm_swap_init: swap is set to eager allocation mode >  > INIT: SINGLE-USER MODE > # ^D > INIT: New run level: 3 > Checking device naming:  >      Passed. > Checking local filesystems > Mounting / (root)  > user_cfg_pt: reconfigured  > root_mounted_rw: reconfigured  > user_cfg_pt: reconfigured  > root_mounted_rw: reconfigured  > user_cfg_pt: reconfigured 9 > dsfmgr: NOTE: updating kernel basenames for system at / I >      scp kevm tty00 tty01 lp0 dmapi dsk0 dsk1 dsk2 dsk3 floppy0 cdrom0=    > Mounting local filesystems7 > exec: /sbin/mount_advfs -F 0x14000 root_domain#root / ' > root_domain#root on / type advfs (rw) ! > /proc on /proc type procfs (rw) 7 > exec: /sbin/mount_advfs -F 0x4000 usr_domain#usr /usr ( > usr_domain#usr on /usr type advfs (rw)7 > exec: /sbin/mount_advfs -F 0x4000 var_domain#var /var ( > var_domain#var on /var type advfs (rw)6 > exec: /sbin/mount_advfs -F 0x4000 tiger#local /local' > tiger#local on /local type advfs (rw) A > Sep 25 14:04:49 esmd: Essential Services Monitor daemon started 6 > Driver_support: Module emx failed to load. status:226 > Driver_support: Module emx failed to load. status:225 > Subsystem hwautoconfig was successfully configured. ! > Sep 25 14:04:50 update: started  > $ > Checking for Installation Tasks... > ! > Executing Installation Tasks... ) > The system is coming up. Please wait...  > Checking for crash dumps > Initializing paging space  > Mounting Memory filesystems  > evmstart: Daemon started9 > Sep 25 14:04:54 esmd: Started monitoring the EVM daemon / > security configuration set to default (BASE). 1 > File /etc/sia/matrix.conf updated successfully.  > Successful SIA initialization  > I > /usr/sbin/autopush: Can't push requested modules on STREAM for entry 3=  6 6 > /usr/sbin/autopush: Device (6,-1) already configured > Streams autopushes configured  > Configuring network  > hostname: tiger I > /sbin/rc3.d/S00inet: ifconfig failed - ifconfig: ioctl (SIOCGIFFLAGS):=    =    > no such i  > nterface: alt0 > Loading LMF licensesI > Combine OSF-BASE ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-741 with OSF-BASE ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-7=  40I > Combine OSF-BASE ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-741 with OSF-BASE ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-7=  39I > Combine OSF-BASE ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-741 with OSF-BASE ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-7=  356 > Combine OSF-USR ALS-NQ-2000FEB23-732 with OSF-USR  =   > UNIX-SERVER-IMPLICIT-USER  > System error logger started  > Binary error logger started D > binlogd: failed to initialize remote logging. Please make sure the6 > network is set up properly and then restart binlogd.3 > writing to routing socket: Network is unreachable 7 > add net default: gateway 172.16.0.1: ioctl returns 51  > Network is unreachable" > Setting kernel timezone variable0 > Setting the current time and date with ntpdate > Ntpdate failed.  > ONC portmap service started # > NIS domain name set to FosterCity 1 > ypbind: Secure mode sunos 3.x servers rejected.  > ypbind daemon started  > NFS mount daemon started > NFS export service started > NFS IO service started > NFS Locking: >    rpc.statd started >    rpc.lockd started > AutoFS: autofsd started  > Mounting NFS filesystemsF > mapfile_getline: yp_first +auto.master: RPC failure on NIS operation, > Unable to start AutoFS autofsmount service > Preserving editor files  > Clearing temporary files > Unlocking ptys > SMTP Mail Service started. > Network Time Service started0 > Environmental Monitoring Subsystem Configured.$ > Using snmp service entry port 161.& > Extensible SNMP master agent started > Base O/S subagent started   > Server System subagent started$ > Server Management subagent started > CIM SNMP subagent started ) > Performance Management subagent started $ > Web Based Management Agent started( > ConfigReport Management Module started" > SysMan Management Module started' > Threshold Management Subagent started * > Environmental Monitoring Daemon started.  > AdvFS daemon (advfsd) started. > Internet services provided.  > Cron service startedI > SuperLAT. Copyright 1994 Meridian Technology Corp. All rights reserved=  .  > LAT started. > Printer service started 1 > tu0: link up: negotiated 100BaseTX: full duplex ( > System not configured for Big Brother! > The system is ready. >  >  > 5 > Compaq Tru64 UNIX V5.1A (Rev. 1885) (tiger) console  >  > login:       -- =  E Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/mail/    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 09:01:18 -0400 * From: "FredK" <fred.nospam@nospam.dec.com>& Subject: Re: Graphic options for DS10L, Message-ID: <4517d31f$1@usenet01.boi.hp.com>  : "JF Mezei" <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> wrote in message& news:4514DA4C.BB7C244F@teksavvy.com... > FredK wrote: > G > When a machine powers up and displays stuff on the console, surely it G > means that there is some code that is pretty standard in the graphics E > cards tro allow basic text display in a standard way ? This is well  > before X11 starts. >   ) The console has a rudimary BIOS emulator.     I > When a new card comes out and you guys decide to support it on VMS, are G > you saying that all of the work is done exclusively in the X11 server  > code ? >   L The software engineering is to write a driver (very small, but has to handleK initialization, interrupts and time-sensitive items) and an X11 DDX (Device K Dependent X) shareable image - plus a command file and device configuration  record.   I > Would there also be a need to have the colsole code be given ability to B > duisplay text onto that card (during booting process, prior to X
 > starting) ?  >   L The console code generally is a BIOS emulator that initializes the card that0 is used as the VGA console into a VGA text mode.  J > Also, in terms of the actual communications between X11 software and theG > graphics card, wouldn't there be a need for a driver to exist ? Is it I > fair to state that each graphgics card has its onw driver ? Or is there J > a generic class driver and it is X11 that has all the card specific code	 > in it ?  >   L Each device (except in cases where cards are nearly identical) have a driver & DDX pair.   G > Or does X11 bypass the driver  concept (which I assume would involved J > lots and lots of $QIOs) and manage to talk directly to the card via someI > PCI interface ? (and how does an application talk to a PCI interface ?)  >   K The DDX does 95% of all drawing operations for performance reasons.  It PFN I maps the hardware and accesses it from user mode to read/write registers. J On DMA devices, some use a QIO interface to the driver (the Oxygen VX1 forJ example) and some actually initiate the DMA from user mode (the Radeon for	 example).   G Applications, except in the case of direct rendering for 3D do not talk J directly to the hardware.  They talk to the X11 server, which talks to theF hardware.  For 3D direct rendering, a privledged image talks through aJ specific mechanism to the hardware while synchronizing access with the X11 server.   K > > If it were a matter of "depositing a couple of values in a register and I > > making an interrupt so that the graphics cards turns on the DVI port"  thenF > > we would have done it.  Programming of the DVI (and initialization itself) 5 > > is highly card dependent - and poorly documented.  > C > Your message gives me the impression that when you guys choose to ? > support card XYZ, the vendor of card XYZ doesn't give you any H > support/documentation and that you guys have to reverse engineer based> > on what others have done. Is that a correct interpretation ? >     Ding.  Ding.  Ding.  You got it.  G > I would have hoped/expected that the card vendor would have given you : > all the specs and programming standards for their cards. >   L Vendors sell millions of cards for PC's running Windows.  They write all theG code for the card.  They tend to keep the specs and code close to their I vest - for them it is their crown jewels that they do not want exposed to B their competetors.  For 2D and low end stuff, there is often specsD available - and they have varied wildly from great to terrible.  ForI high-end it is the same, but you need to get it under NDA - and even then H they may not give you everything.  One vendor (who since then sold theirK graphics stuff off) once wanted $2million in NRE (Non Recurring Engineering * cost) to give us access to specs and code.   >  > > Why?  Linux and UNIX tend K > > to use a BIOS emulator to do it... which is something we are working on  for  > > Itanium. > I > Isn't BIOS on its way out to be replaced by EFI even on wintel machines H > ?  And if you are going to build an emulated BIOS is there a technicalI > reason why it would be limited to IA64 and not Alpha too ? (since it is  > a shared code base) ?  >   J Yes/No.  Even EFI runs the card init.  What will eventually change is thatI the cards will contain and EFI byte code (in addition to) x86 binary ROM. K Making the job of executing it easier.  However, there is no runtime access K to the EFI code that does the BIOS emulation, or which will execute the EFI 
 byte code.  I As to a technical limitation on Alpha - no there is none.  However, as we L are not doing new cards for the Alpha - it makes no sense to retrofit a BIOSG emulator.  Since the Radeon is where we will try to integrate this - it K "may" find it's way into Alpha to keep the code stream from diverging - but : that is a big if - since it also means a lot of retesting.  I VMS currently needs to know how to hand init every card.  Windows drivers J also need to do this (we just never see *that* code) because Microsoft hasF dictated that secondary cards will never be initilialized by the BIOS.H Linux and UNIX in recent years incorporated a BIOS emulator done for the1 xFree86 project.  That is what we are working on.    > L > > you unhappy.  Hint:  No interrupts needed - oh, wait - you think this is a  > > PC with an Int10.  >    > C > > Imagine your X11 application has started running, it opened the 	 display - I > > found out that it had a 24-bit TrueColor pixel - but in the middle of  yourI > > application running - the pixel format changes to 8-bit pseudo color.  >  > J > I realise X11 is quite different, but the MAC, designed in 1984, is ableJ > to handle this. (colour support was put in before colour displays becameI > available for MACs). So it si a bit strange that X11, which is younger, = > would have been architected to much more primitive support.  >   L Again.  It all depends on what is exposed to the application.  Take VWS - itL exposed only a Pseudo-Color/Bitonal interface to the user.  So it is easy to- implement that on top of nearly any hardware.   E X11 was at the same time more sophisticated, and more primitive.  The L original intent was that applications would never be exposed to the X11/XlibJ interface.  Higher-level library abstractions would be used (believe it orJ not, the intent was to get Microsoft to license the Windows interface withF X11 being a network transparent primitive interface).  But that didn'tI happen, and application developers needed to program to Xlib for drawing. J Ever notice that some applications don't work in 24-bit mode?  Or in 8-bit@ mode?  Or that GTK V2.0 applications *require* a 24-bit display?  K Some applications don't care - because they just allocate a "color" and use J it.  Some applications assume things like a 24-bit image format (in 32-bitK pixels) *and* a specific order of the RGB values.  Applications like XV for H example have logic to permute the color order based on what the hardwareE supports - because X11 does not specify a specific order.  It doesn't H specify te pixel size either - we once had a server that would do 12-bit pixels.   L So - the X11 spec itself is wide open and offers sophisticated options - butJ lacks a common abstraction for many things - including images - unless theF application (or library) interface provides it's own abstraction.  TheF standard layering is what was missing.  Motif gave it a user interface: abstraction.  But at the drawing level - there is nothing.  J The XRENDER extension on xFree86 is/was an attempt to do it... however, atI this point it seems anti-aliased fonts seem to be the only thing that has  been embraced.   >  > F > > Or let's say the resolution is changed on the fly - and instead ofL > > 1920x1200 - you are now at 800x600 - and none of your windows fit on the > > screen any more  > H > MAC handles this. It moves the window title pane to within the smallerE > screen area if it would have been completely out fo it. (so you can ; > still click it). Windows that are bigger are not resized.  > F > Obviously, if you have a window manager rule/setting that forces allI > windows to fit within the screen area, this causes a problem, but can't G > the Xserver simply send resize events to each window that needs to be 
 > shrunk ? >   D As I said (but you cropped) changing the X/Y pixeles and refresh areA probably the easiest to tackle using conventional X11 techniques.   ? > > Graphics cards *are* part engineering and part vodoo magic.  >  > H > There is a mention thats ome cards have some 8086 architecture code inI > their rom that they expect the host computer to execute. Is that really H > the case ? Since these cards have their own processors and own memory,F > wouldn't it be a case of just transfering data to/from the card with? > some PCI signal to tell the card to accept the data/command ?  >   C Every option card has a BIOS ROM (code and tables that are used for I initialization and thnigs like Int10 on PCs).  Some cards have FORTH byte L code (for Apple - derived from OpenBoot from SUN).  Some cards will have EFIJ byte code (similar to the OpenBOOT/Forth idea).  The CARD does not executeI this code.  The firmware/BIOS executes this code by reading it out of ROM H into memory, and executing it.  It does this during initialization.  ForL PC's, the In10 interface allows drivers to do things like change resolution,G pixel format, and obtain information like the optimal resolution of the K monitor it is connected to.  Again, this it code executed on the computer -  NOT in the card.  $ > Does PCI allow for DMA transfers ?  
 Of course.   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 18:56:22 -0400 ( From: Bill Todd <billtodd@metrocast.net>/ Subject: Re: HP announces new Integrity servers G Message-ID: <cb2dnbGImv0Kw4XYnZ2dnUVZ_qWdnZ2d@metrocastcablevision.com>    Main, Kerry wrote: >> -----Original Message----- 3 >> From: Bill Todd [mailto:billtodd@metrocast.net]    + [yet more repetitious Kerry-drivel snipped]   % >>   With the Wintel on any platform, D >>> you have many FTE`s maintaining many OS instances, so even with H >>> consolidation using VMware or Virtual Server, you still have a very : >>> high FTE counts - the biggest sclice of the IT budget.H >> So what?  That's not a difference between the Itanic platform and the@ >> x86-64 platform, that's a difference between running Windows  >> (whether onF >> x86-64 or on Itanic) and running some more competent OS (whether on >> x86-64 or on Itanic). >>A >> *So it's no difference between x86-64 and Itanic at all*, and  0 >> you've tried to dodge the question yet again. >> > G > See ealier response - I am not talking about low level HW stuff. I am G > talking about the HW + OS + culture + security + stacking + stability H > environment as a package. If they choose x86 whatever, their only realJ > options are Linux or Windows and the one-app one server culture. Yes BSDH > is available, but for whatever reason, that just does not come up much > in a business environment.  H Aha!  Finally, when sufficiently pressed, you've come up with something = new:  despite the fact that an enterprise-level OS (Solaris)  I indisputably exists and is supported on x86 hardware that scales up well  G into the high end, that really doesn't count - because (wait for it)...    > H > Yes, Solaris is also available, but as I stated earlier, every SolarisA > Customer I have talked to has stated that if they were changing D > platforms, it was moving Solaris to Linux. If they were staying onJ > Solaris to consolidate, they were staying with higher end SPARC servers.  I ... *existing* Solaris customers (most of whom are currently using SPARC  ? platforms) are inclined to continue using the same platform to   consolidate with!   I Quelle surprise!  When people have the option to continue using the same  H platform to consolidate, by George, that's what they do!  And, somehow, A this supposedly proves that Solaris isn't a real option on x86...   H When, of course, the question isn't about that at all:  it's about what D choices users looking to consolidate their 'one app server culture' I Windows and (according to you) Linux systems will choose, because that's  F where all those wonderful OS instances that you've been saying really  benefit from consolidation are.   G And what hardware are they using today?  Overwhelmingly, x86.  So what  E hardware will they be inclined to use for consolidation (just as you  E noted for existing SPARC users)?  Well, x86, by George!  And if they  E can't manage to continue to use Windows or Linux after consolidating  / there, Solaris is ready and able to serve them.   F Why in hell would they even *think* of moving to HP-UX on Itanic, let I alone VMS on Itanic, when Solaris on good old familiar x86 will fill the  B bill if they can't use Windows or Linux to do so (an increasingly C questionable premise in its own right:  both Windows and Linux are  F rapidly improving their multi-application stability, and any customer E who's willing to toss over the 'one app server culture' can do so at  F least as readily still using their familiar Windows or Linux platform K when that will do the job as they could by jumping to a completely new OS)?   F You keep beating on the idea of moving *off* single-app Windows (and, H you claim, Linux) platforms and trying to imply that somehow this leads < directly to an enterprise-level Itanic OS rather than to an G equally-enterprise-level x86-64 OS - with no basis whatsoever for that  E presumed Itanic bias on the part of the customer:  not features, not  D price, not 'industry-standardness' (all of which favor x86 instead).   No sale, Kerry:  try again.    - bill   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 21:33:09 -0400 / From: "William Webb" <william.w.webb@gmail.com> / Subject: Re: HP announces new Integrity servers I Message-ID: <8660a3a10609251833l23c45668r9ef5e07f5c3f4cc2@mail.gmail.com>   ) ------=_Part_38784_10676442.1159234389473 ; Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed  Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit  Content-Disposition: inline   4 On 9/20/06, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote: >  > Tom Linden wrote: I > > On Tue, 19 Sep 2006 08:26:44 -0700, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> 
 > > wrote: > >  > >> Larry Kilgallen wrote: K > >>> In article <4uydndYmRbla9ZLYnZ2dnUVZ_sCdnZ2d@libcom.com>, Dave Froble # > >>> <davef@tsoft-inc.com> writes:  > >>> E > >>>> Tell me again why Alpha was dropped in favor of this 'industry  > >>>> standard'= > >>>  Because Intel paid enough money to make it profitable.  > >>4 > >> And what about when Intel gets tired of paying? > >>J > >> It's like repelling down the side of a cliff, without having measured: > >> the cliff and rope to insure the rope is long enough. > >>
 > > rappel > I > I wondered whether I had the spelling correct.  Guess not.  Regardless, @ > if the rope is too short, no matter how you spell it you got a > problem.  :-)  >  > --6 > David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450@ > Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com > DFE Ultralights, Inc.  > 170 Grimplin Road  > Vanderbilt, PA  15486  >   G One usually ties a large enough knot in the end to catch your hardware.    WWWebb,   @ who used to rock climb in those periods of time when it *wasn't* fashionable.     --   Ajilon Consulting  Site resident at Quest Diagnostics = first.x.last@f$edit(contents of previous line,"COMPRESS").com   ) ------=_Part_38784_10676442.1159234389473 + Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1  Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit  Content-Disposition: inline   2<br><br><div><span class="gmail_quote">On 9/20/06, <b class="gmail_sendername">Dave Froble</b> &lt;<a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">davef@tsoft-inc.com</a>&gt; wrote:</span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"> Tom Linden wrote:<br>&gt; On Tue, 19 Sep 2006 08:26:44 -0700, Dave Froble &lt;<a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">davef@tsoft-inc.com</a>&gt;<br>&gt; wrote:<br>&gt;<br>&gt;&gt; Larry Kilgallen wrote:<br>&gt;&gt;&gt; In article &lt; <a href="mailto:4uydndYmRbla9ZLYnZ2dnUVZ_sCdnZ2d@libcom.com">4uydndYmRbla9ZLYnZ2dnUVZ_sCdnZ2d@libcom.com</a>&gt;, Dave Froble<br>&gt;&gt;&gt; &lt;<a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">davef@tsoft-inc.com</a>&gt; writes:<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Tell me again why Alpha was dropped in favor of this 'industry<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; standard'<br>&gt;&gt;&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;Because Intel paid enough money to make it profitable.<br>&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt; And what about when Intel gets tired of paying? <br>&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&gt; It's like repelling down the side of a cliff, without having measured<br>&gt;&gt; the cliff and rope to insure the rope is long enough.<br>&gt;&gt;<br>&gt; rappel<br><br>I wondered whether I had the spelling correct.&nbsp;&nbsp;Guess not.&nbsp;&nbsp;Regardless,|<br>if the rope is too short, no matter how you spell it you got a problem.&nbsp;&nbsp;:-)<br><br>--<br>David Froble&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Tel: 724-529-0450<br>Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;E-Mail: <a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">/davef@tsoft-inc.com</a><br>DFE Ultralights, Inc.<br>170 Grimplin Road<br>Vanderbilt, PA&nbsp;&nbsp;15486<br></blockquote></div><br>One usually ties a large enough knot in the end to catch your hardware.<br><br>WWWebb, <br><br>who used to rock climb in those periods of time when it *wasn't* fashionable.  <br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Ajilon Consulting<br>Site resident at <br>Quest Diagnostics<br>first.x.last@f$edit(contents of previous line,&quot;COMPRESS&quot;).com   + ------=_Part_38784_10676442.1159234389473--    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 23:11:01 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> / Subject: Re: HP announces new Integrity servers 9 Message-ID: <4-Kdne4Uyq7eBYXYnZ2dnUVZ_vCdnZ2d@libcom.com>    William Webb wrote:  >  > 1 > On 9/20/06, *Dave Froble* <davef@tsoft-inc.com  & > <mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com>> wrote: >  >     Tom Linden wrote: 8 >      > On Tue, 19 Sep 2006 08:26:44 -0700, Dave Froble8 >     <davef@tsoft-inc.com <mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com>> >      > wrote:  >      >  >      >> Larry Kilgallen wrote:C >      >>> In article < 4uydndYmRbla9ZLYnZ2dnUVZ_sCdnZ2d@libcom.com H >     <mailto:4uydndYmRbla9ZLYnZ2dnUVZ_sCdnZ2d@libcom.com>>, Dave FrobleE >      >>> <davef@tsoft-inc.com <mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com>> writes: 
 >      >>>J >      >>>> Tell me again why Alpha was dropped in favor of this 'industry >      >>>> standard' B >      >>>  Because Intel paid enough money to make it profitable.	 >      >> 9 >      >> And what about when Intel gets tired of paying? 	 >      >> F >      >> It's like repelling down the side of a cliff, without having >     measured? >      >> the cliff and rope to insure the rope is long enough. 	 >      >>  >      > rappel  > M >     I wondered whether I had the spelling correct.  Guess not.  Regardless, D >     if the rope is too short, no matter how you spell it you got a >     problem.  :-)  >  >     --: >     David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450D >     Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com" >     <mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com> >     DFE Ultralights, Inc.  >     170 Grimplin Road  >     Vanderbilt, PA  15486  >  > I > One usually ties a large enough knot in the end to catch your hardware.  > 	 > WWWebb,  > C > who used to rock climb in those periods of time when it *wasn't*   > fashionable.   Just cannot resist.  :-)  3 Yeah, but you didn't burn your rope above you.  :-)    --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450> Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com DFE Ultralights, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 23:31:10 -0400 / From: "William Webb" <william.w.webb@gmail.com> / Subject: Re: HP announces new Integrity servers I Message-ID: <8660a3a10609252031w203afc4ck7c0dd3795c6998c3@mail.gmail.com>   ( ------=_Part_40492_5746581.1159241470944; Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed  Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit  Content-Disposition: inline   4 On 9/25/06, Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote: >  > William Webb wrote:  > >  > > 2 > > On 9/20/06, *Dave Froble* <davef@tsoft-inc.com( > > <mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com>> wrote: > >  > >     Tom Linden wrote: : > >      > On Tue, 19 Sep 2006 08:26:44 -0700, Dave Froble: > >     <davef@tsoft-inc.com <mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com>> > >      > wrote: 
 > >      >" > >      >> Larry Kilgallen wrote:E > >      >>> In article < 4uydndYmRbla9ZLYnZ2dnUVZ_sCdnZ2d@libcom.com J > >     <mailto:4uydndYmRbla9ZLYnZ2dnUVZ_sCdnZ2d@libcom.com>>, Dave FrobleG > >      >>> <davef@tsoft-inc.com <mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com>> writes:  > >      >>>L > >      >>>> Tell me again why Alpha was dropped in favor of this 'industry > >      >>>> standard' D > >      >>>  Because Intel paid enough money to make it profitable. > >      >> ; > >      >> And what about when Intel gets tired of paying?  > >      >> H > >      >> It's like repelling down the side of a cliff, without having > >     measuredA > >      >> the cliff and rope to insure the rope is long enough.  > >      >>  > >      > rappel  > > = > >     I wondered whether I had the spelling correct.  Guess  > not.  Regardless, F > >     if the rope is too short, no matter how you spell it you got a > >     problem.  :-)  > > 
 > >     --< > >     David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450F > >     Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com$ > >     <mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com> > >     DFE Ultralights, Inc.  > >     170 Grimplin Road  > >     Vanderbilt, PA  15486  > >  > > K > > One usually ties a large enough knot in the end to catch your hardware.  > >  > > WWWebb,  > > D > > who used to rock climb in those periods of time when it *wasn't* > > fashionable. >  > Just cannot resist.  :-) > 5 > Yeah, but you didn't burn your rope above you.  :-)  >  > --6 > David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450@ > Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com > DFE Ultralights, Inc.  > 170 Grimplin Road  > Vanderbilt, PA  15486  >   7 The fact that I'm posting this answers *that* question.    : - )    --   Ajilon Consulting  Site resident at Quest Diagnostics = first.x.last@f$edit(contents of previous line,"COMPRESS").com   ( ------=_Part_40492_5746581.1159241470944+ Content-Type: text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1  Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit  Content-Disposition: inline   2<br><br><div><span class="gmail_quote">On 9/25/06, <b class="gmail_sendername">Dave Froble</b> &lt;<a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">davef@tsoft-inc.com</a>&gt; wrote:</span><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;"> William Webb wrote:<br>&gt;<br>&gt;<br>&gt; On 9/20/06, *Dave Froble* &lt;<a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">davef@tsoft-inc.com</a><br>&gt; &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">davef@tsoft-inc.com</a>&gt;&gt; wrote: ,<br>&gt;<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Tom Linden wrote:<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt; On Tue, 19 Sep 2006 08:26:44 -0700, Dave Froble<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;<a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">davef@tsoft-inc.com</a> &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">Wdavef@tsoft-inc.com</a>&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt; wrote:<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;&gt; Larry Kilgallen wrote:<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;&gt;&gt; In article &lt; <a href="mailto:4uydndYmRbla9ZLYnZ2dnUVZ_sCdnZ2d@libcom.com"> 4uydndYmRbla9ZLYnZ2dnUVZ_sCdnZ2d@libcom.com</a><br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:4uydndYmRbla9ZLYnZ2dnUVZ_sCdnZ2d@libcom.com">4uydndYmRbla9ZLYnZ2dnUVZ_sCdnZ2d@libcom.com</a>&gt;&gt;, Dave Froble<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;&gt;&gt; &lt; G<a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">davef@tsoft-inc.com</a> &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">davef@tsoft-inc.com</a>&gt;&gt; writes:<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; Tell me again why Alpha was dropped in favor of this 'industry <br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt; standard'<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;&gt;&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;Because Intel paid enough money to make it profitable.<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;&gt; And what about when Intel gets tired of paying?<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;&gt;o<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;&gt; It's like repelling down the side of a cliff, without having<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; measured<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;&gt; the cliff and rope to insure the rope is long enough.<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt;&gt;<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&gt; rappel  <br>&gt;<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; I wondered whether I had the spelling correct.&nbsp;&nbsp;Guess not.&nbsp;&nbsp;Regardless,<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; if the rope is too short, no matter how you spell it you got a<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; problem.&nbsp;&nbsp;:-)<br>&gt;<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; --<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; David Froble&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Tel: 724	 -529-0450 H<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;E-Mail: <a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">davef@tsoft-inc.com</a><br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; &lt;mailto:<a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">davef@tsoft-inc.com</a>&gt;<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; DFE Ultralights, Inc.;<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; 170 Grimplin Road<br>&gt;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Vanderbilt, PA&nbsp;&nbsp;15486<br>&gt;<br>&gt;<br>&gt; One usually ties a large enough knot in the end to catch your hardware.<br>&gt;<br>&gt; WWWebb,<br>&gt;<br>&gt; who used to rock climb in those periods of time when it *wasn't* <br>&gt; fashionable.<br><br>Just cannot resist.&nbsp;&nbsp;:-)<br><br>Yeah, but you didn't burn your rope above you.&nbsp;&nbsp;:-)<br><br>--<br>David Froble&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; Tel: 724-529-0450<br>Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;E-Mail:   <a href="mailto:davef@tsoft-inc.com">davef@tsoft-inc.com</a><br>DFE Ultralights, Inc.<br>170 Grimplin Road<br>Vanderbilt, PA&nbsp;&nbsp;15486<br></blockquote></div><br>The fact that I'm posting this answers *that* question.<br><br>  : - )<br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Ajilon Consulting<br>Site resident at <br>Quest Diagnostics<br>first.x.last@f$edit(contents of previous line,&quot;COMPRESS&quot;).com  * ------=_Part_40492_5746581.1159241470944--   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 21:19:48 -0500 ! From: John <norad869@comcast.net> = Subject: RAID LICENSE - any one using and having fun with it? * Message-ID: <45188E44.1050502@comcast.net>  F By fun I mean... is it performing miracles?  ... or it is a nightmare?  - And I am talking about the following product:   I StorageWorks[R] RAID Software for OpenVMS[R] is a software product that   E uses RAID technology to manage groups of disk drives as arrays. The   G product supports RAID Level 0 arrays (Disk striping) for enhanced I/O   E performance and RAID Level 5 arrays (Disk striping with parity) for   E enhanced data availability on both VAX[R] and Alpha platforms. RAID   H Software also allows partitioning or segmentation of a RAID Array into   multiple virtual devices.     + A couple of questions if you do not mind...   C 1) CPU utiliziation - does the software increase the amount of CPU  $ usage?  I suspect some but not much.  C 2) I/O impact - obviously with the more disks the better the I/O -  C assuming that the disks are not in contention with one another and  A spread accross multiple controllers.  Depending on the number of  7 controllers, could I match the speed of the EVA series?    3) Any problems encountered?  H I am running VMS V7.2-1 on a three node cluster (ALPHA).  The disks are  on the HSG80 controller set.   TIA    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 11:42:59 -0600 # From: Jim Mehlhop <jim@mehlhop.org> % Subject: Strange diagnose error  V3.4 6 Message-ID: <45181523$0$10304$815e3792@news.qwest.net>   We had a system get    $ dia   
 DECevent V3.4 I _DIAGNOSE-FAT:  Automatic analysis is still running. Please shutdown and   reissue 
   command. %SYSTEM-F-ABORT, abort     This was after doing   $@sys$startup:decevent$startup  @ To define the dia logicals that had not been created at startup.    ! Any idea what caused this error??    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 12:50:18 -0600 # From: Jim Mehlhop <jim@mehlhop.org> ) Subject: Re: Strange diagnose error  V3.4 * Message-ID: <451824EA.3040000@mehlhop.org>    Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote:^ > In article <45181523$0$10304$815e3792@news.qwest.net>, Jim Mehlhop <jim@mehlhop.org> writes: >  >>We had a system get  >> >>$ dia  >> >>DECevent V3.4 K >>_DIAGNOSE-FAT:  Automatic analysis is still running. Please shutdown and  	 >>reissue  >> command.  >>%SYSTEM-F-ABORT, abort >> >> >>This was after doing >>  >>$@sys$startup:decevent$startup >>B >>To define the dia logicals that had not been created at startup. >># >>Any idea what caused this error??  >  > : > Yup. It tells you: "Automatic analysis is still running"E > Do a $ DIA SHUT node (or run SYS$STARTUP:DECEVENT$SHUTDOWN.COM) and F > then you are able to manually translate/analyze the error log again. >  > btw: Did you mean a DIA/INT ?  >  > -EPLAN > E I just did a $ diag  with no qualifiers which I just found out in an  , interactive default when I wanted translate.   Thanks   Jim    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 12:57:10 -0600 # From: Jim Mehlhop <jim@mehlhop.org> ) Subject: Re: Strange diagnose error  V3.4 * Message-ID: <45182686.9020704@mehlhop.org>   Jim Mehlhop wrote:" > Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote: > F >> In article <45181523$0$10304$815e3792@news.qwest.net>, Jim Mehlhop  >> <jim@mehlhop.org> writes: >> >>> We had a system get  >>> 	 >>> $ dia  >>>  >>> DECevent V3.4 I >>> _DIAGNOSE-FAT:  Automatic analysis is still running. Please shutdown   >>> and reissue  >>> command. >>> %SYSTEM-F-ABORT, abort >>>  >>>  >>> This was after doing >>> " >>> $@sys$startup:decevent$startup >>> D >>> To define the dia logicals that had not been created at startup. >>> % >>> Any idea what caused this error??  >> >> >>; >> Yup. It tells you: "Automatic analysis is still running" F >> Do a $ DIA SHUT node (or run SYS$STARTUP:DECEVENT$SHUTDOWN.COM) andG >> then you are able to manually translate/analyze the error log again.  >>  >> btw: Did you mean a DIA/INT ? >>	 >> -EPLAN  >>G > I just did a $ diag  with no qualifiers which I just found out in an  . > interactive default when I wanted translate. >  > Thanks >  > Jim H Let me clarify.  It is SUPPOSED to default to /TRANSLATE but either the G customer had a symbol for Dia or there is a problem where it sometimes   defaults to /interactive?   7 I was not able to log on the system myself to see this.    Jim    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 16:19:40 -0600 # From: Jim Mehlhop <jim@mehlhop.org> ) Subject: Re: Strange diagnose error  V3.4 * Message-ID: <451855FC.9080509@mehlhop.org>    Peter 'EPLAN' LANGSTOEGER wrote:^ > In article <45181523$0$10304$815e3792@news.qwest.net>, Jim Mehlhop <jim@mehlhop.org> writes: >  >>We had a system get  >> >>$ dia  >> >>DECevent V3.4 K >>_DIAGNOSE-FAT:  Automatic analysis is still running. Please shutdown and  	 >>reissue  >> command.  >>%SYSTEM-F-ABORT, abort >> >> >>This was after doing >>  >>$@sys$startup:decevent$startup >>B >>To define the dia logicals that had not been created at startup. >># >>Any idea what caused this error??  >  > : > Yup. It tells you: "Automatic analysis is still running"E > Do a $ DIA SHUT node (or run SYS$STARTUP:DECEVENT$SHUTDOWN.COM) and F > then you are able to manually translate/analyze the error log again. >  > btw: Did you mean a DIA/INT ?  >  > -EPLAN > ' still fails after the decevent$shutdown     $ @sys$manager:DECEVENT$SHUTDOWN  
 DECevent V3.4   & Shutting down DECevent on node TSTAXP. Shutdown request completed.    $ diag/translate/since  
 DECevent V3.4 I _DIAGNOSE-FAT:  Automatic analysis is still running. Please shutdown and   reissue 
   command. %SYSTEM-F-ABORT, abort $    ------------------------------    Date: 25 Sep 2006 12:54:48 -0500- From: Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) & Subject: Re: Tool for calculating SHA13 Message-ID: <gGu3JCPDQnBw@eisner.encompasserve.org>   q In article <U8zONFCwSZOZ@eisner.encompasserve.org>, koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: e > In article <x6ic7XVwTEu8@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes:  >>  A >> If you want them to be identical, make them identical with the E >> conversion techniques outlined.  So long as they are not identical   >> the checksums will not match. > B >    I'm wondering how the original file transfer was done.  If itD >    was FTP as ASCII, then CONVERTed from VAR to STM, the resulting4 >    data should allow one to get the same checksum.  C My reading of the original post is that the file was created on VMS F as a variable length record text file and then transferred to Windows,A presumably being converted to stream-format by the transfer tool.   N In article <1159181762.150357.115280@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, "lotti" <h( h erman.kotte@staatsloterij.com> writes:  G > We are concerned in securing our datatransmission from a VMS platform  > to a Windows platform.  q In article <U8zONFCwSZOZ@eisner.encompasserve.org>, koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:   C >    If the file was first transfered in binary, then fixed-up, the D >    extra 0's at the tail of the first block may cause the checksum9 >    to alter, depending on what the algorithm really is.   C Based on my understanding of the original post, conversion prior to D checksum on the VMS system would be required, but the originator has= rejected those suggestions and requested "other suggestions".  --  N ==============================================================================0 DoD Instruction 8500.2 field test sites wanted -- 	http://www.LJK.com/LJK/8500_2_fieldtest.html N ==============================================================================   ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 10:05:32 -0400 , From: Hoff Hoffman <hoff-remove-this@hp.com>& Subject: Re: Tool for calculating SHA1* Message-ID: <4517e228@usenet01.boi.hp.com>   lotti wrote:H > Conversions of datafiles into 'format stream' result in identical SHA1	 > values. I > One file created under VMS and one created under windows containing the  > character 'a'.G > Looking to these files using UltraEdit / hex edit shows an additional B > '0D' and '0A' for the VMS created file. Also the converted filesE > contain these extra '0D' and '0A' . When adding an empty line, this 4 > extra line is translated in hex as '0D' and '0A' . > D > So, yes it obvious is related to the linefeed. And it isn't solved > using the convert. > More suggestions are welcome.       CONVERT solves this.   O    You need to CONVERT to and/or use a format -- Stream or StreamLF -- that is  P the same on both platforms and THEN transfer the file over, or you need to have N a SHA1 tool (on OpenVMS) that is coded correctly to allow it to deal with the < file byte streams correctly when calculating its SHA1 value.  P    Low-level file byte streams are not entirely and directly portable, you have N to look at the record-level format before you can determine that.  Stream and P StreamLF are the two most portable sequential file formats on OpenVMS.  Hauling O VFC files over to other platforms, for instance, doesn't work.  To make things  N even more interesting here, some FTP tools can get "helpful" and can silently  convert byte streams around.  M    One other potential approach here is to zip the files (zip "-V" being the  Q portable generic OpenVMS file and record format protection solution), SHA1 that,  ! and then transfer the zip around.    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 18:49:11 -0400 ' From: Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> & Subject: Re: Tool for calculating SHA19 Message-ID: <E5-dnf68wf6GxoXYnZ2dnUVZ_q-dnZ2d@libcom.com>    Larry Kilgallen wrote:s > In article <U8zONFCwSZOZ@eisner.encompasserve.org>, koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes: f >> In article <x6ic7XVwTEu8@eisner.encompasserve.org>, Kilgallen@SpamCop.net (Larry Kilgallen) writes:B >>> If you want them to be identical, make them identical with theF >>> conversion techniques outlined.  So long as they are not identical! >>> the checksums will not match. C >>    I'm wondering how the original file transfer was done.  If it E >>    was FTP as ASCII, then CONVERTed from VAR to STM, the resulting 5 >>    data should allow one to get the same checksum.  > E > My reading of the original post is that the file was created on VMS H > as a variable length record text file and then transferred to Windows,C > presumably being converted to stream-format by the transfer tool.  > P > In article <1159181762.150357.115280@h48g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>, "lotti" <h* > h erman.kotte@staatsloterij.com> writes: > H >> We are concerned in securing our datatransmission from a VMS platform >> to a Windows platform.  > s > In article <U8zONFCwSZOZ@eisner.encompasserve.org>, koehler@eisner.nospam.encompasserve.org (Bob Koehler) writes:  > D >>    If the file was first transfered in binary, then fixed-up, theE >>    extra 0's at the tail of the first block may cause the checksum : >>    to alter, depending on what the algorithm really is. > E > Based on my understanding of the original post, conversion prior to F > checksum on the VMS system would be required, but the originator has? > rejected those suggestions and requested "other suggestions".   D What's bothering me is that the OP claims the VMS file has an extra F <CR><LF>.  Windows text files also have the <CR><LF> terminating each D line.  If I'm understanding the problem presentation correctly, I'm B wondering why these don't show up in the windows data?  Could the D program that does the work on windows be stripping out the <CR><LF>?   --  4 David Froble                       Tel: 724-529-0450> Dave Froble Enterprises, Inc.      E-Mail: davef@tsoft-inc.com DFE Ultralights, Inc.  170 Grimplin Road  Vanderbilt, PA  15486    ------------------------------   Date: 25 Sep 2006 18:56:48 GMT From: healyzh@aracnet.com 5 Subject: Re: Vaxstation or Alpha for learning OpenVMS , Message-ID: <ef98pg02ier@enews4.newsguy.com>  L Patrick MOREAU, CENA Athis, Tel: 01.69.57.68.40 <pmoreau@ath.cena.fr> wrote:J > In article <ef1ld501urq@enews2.newsguy.com>, healyzh@aracnet.com writes:F > > Avoid the AlphaStation 500's like the plague unless they come withE > > plenty of RAM.  Even now the RAM tends to cost more than a better J > > computer.  Personally based on the prices I see on eBay, I'd recommendJ > > getting either a PWS -au Series workstation, or an XP1000 off of eBay,4 > > or getting a DS10L from http://www.islandco.com/ > > G > > Not sure I agree with the the AlphaStation 500 or better machine, a I > > nicely equiped AlphaStation 200 4/233 would still make a nice starter H > > system, and a second better box later will allow the OP to play with > > clustering.   F > But if you can find a real DS10 (not DS10L), it's better to hold PCIK > cards. Mine have an Elsa Synergy vido card, a sound card and 2 SCSI cards G > (a single port and a dual port with Ethernet). And you can put 3 SCSI I > disks inside (9, 18 or 36 Gb) plus CDROM and floppy. A nice workstation  > ...   K > The Elsa card is a bit slow in 24 bits but fine in 16 bits. A Radeon 7500 < > is now a better choice but I've no problems with the Elsa.  K There is only one problem with the DS10, and that's the price.  I'd love to G have one, but for someone looking to do it on the cheap, they aren't an K option unless you get *very* lucky.  I got the impression the OP was trying  to do this on the cheap.  H BTW, I personally prefer to have the disks external.  I currently have aH TLZ06 4mm DAT and a CD-ROM internal, then there are 6 HD's and a DLT7000K external on my XP1000.  Having all the hard drives external makes it easier ? to move to newer hardware (or as I've occasionally done older).    		Zane   ------------------------------   Date: 25 Sep 2006 20:54:58 GMT From: healyzh@aracnet.com 5 Subject: Re: Vaxstation or Alpha for learning OpenVMS , Message-ID: <ef9fn202rhj@enews2.newsguy.com>  ( Dave Froble <davef@tsoft-inc.com> wrote:D > One final thing.  Lots of stuff on E-Bay.  Some of it won't work. K > Definitely some unscrupulous sellers.  Some of them don't even know what  0 > they're selling.  Must be searching dumpsters.  K You can say that again, I've only purchased 2 of my Alpha's off of eBay (my J last two).  I bought the second one because the first appeared to be DOA. K It appeared to be dead because it had a 500Mhz CPU on a XP1000 set to run a H 667Mhz CPU.  Once someone here suggested checking the settings, it worksI great.  The second is a 667Mhz that appears to have been roughly treated, J but it's running OK.  The worst part was the packing on the second system,J it was just thrown in a box full of styrofoam pellets, and it took a *lot*F of work to clean it up.  As I got very good deals on both systems, I'mJ happy, and even if the first hadn't worked I'd have been happy, because of the cards that were in it.   			Zane    ------------------------------  % Date: Mon, 25 Sep 2006 22:09:19 -0400 - From: JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@teksavvy.com> 5 Subject: Re: Vaxstation or Alpha for learning OpenVMS , Message-ID: <45188BC7.A85A072E@teksavvy.com>  ' alexandre.laguejacques@gmail.com wrote: B > You're from Qubec right?  (I don't see many people from Calgary( > looking for French-Canadian keyboards!  % Guilty as charged. Montral actually.    ------------------------------   End of INFO-VAX 2006.528 ************************                                                                                                          P1YǇn  xn  PRˏ?RP3Rn  7n  `jPdhdRdBiSP W  PSSZdhdRdBiU
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